[PD-dev] the future of [declare] and canvas_savedeclarationsto()
Miller Puckette
mpuckett at imusic1.ucsd.edu
Fri May 23 21:23:31 CEST 2008
So... I'm sure this is a dead end, but is there some way [import]
could be written to invoke realpath() so Pd doesn't have to?
cheers
M
On Fri, May 23, 2008 at 02:07:58AM +0200, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:
>
> If you really want to get into realpath():
>
> https://www.securecoding.cert.org/confluence/display/seccode/FIO02-A.
> +Canonicalize+path+names+originating+from+untrusted+sources
>
> .hc
>
> >On May 22, 2008, at 10:06 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:
> >
> >>
> >>To quote the whole text:
> >>
> >> Avoid using this function. It is broken by design since (unless
> >>using the non-
> >> standard resolved_path == NULL feature) it is impossible to
> >>determine a suitable
> >> size for the output buffer, resolved_path. According to POSIX a
> >>buffer of size
> >> PATH_MAX suffices, but PATH_MAX need not be a defined constant,
> >>and may have to
> >> be obtained using pathconf(). And asking pathconf() does not
> >>really help, since
> >> on the one hand POSIX warns that the result of pathconf()
> >>may be huge and
> >> unsuitable for mallocing memory. And on the other hand pathconf
> >>() may return -1
> >> to signify that PATH_MAX is not bounded.
> >>
> >>I think whoever wrote that man page is really splitting hairs
> >>there, the FreeBSD/Mac OS X man page has no complaints about it.
> >>They are complaining that PATH_MAX _might_ not be defined. But on
> >>GNU/Linux, MinGW, and FreeBSD/Mac OS X, FILENAME_MAX _is_
> >>defined. So just use FILENAME_MAX to allocate the buffer that
> >>realpath() uses (which was already happening anyway in s_main.c,
> >>but with MAXPDSTRING instead). It's a widely implemented POSIX
> >>function, how much more standard do you want? ;)
> >>
> >>I think that Pd should give reliable information in the publically
> >>defined API (ok, s_stuff.h, but still). For example, it makes
> >>life easier in a lot of ways if you can count on sys_libdir being
> >>an absolute path, rather than making every other bit of code that
> >>might every use a path that is based on sys_libdir check to make
> >>sure that it is indeed absolute. The vast majority of the time,
> >>sys_libdir is an absolute path, and AFAIK, on Windows it is always
> >>an absolute path.
> >>
> >>.hc
> >>
> >>
> >>On May 22, 2008, at 9:44 PM, Miller Puckette wrote:
> >>
> >>>I finally realized realpath() is a pre-existing function. (I
> >>>imagined
> >>>it was sitting in another source file that didn't make it to the
> >>>patch)
> >>>
> >>>but.. "man realpath" says "Avoid using this function. It is
> >>>broken by design..."
> >>>so I'm sceptical of the idea. Anyway, why can't [import] just
> >>>make the
> >>>call if it needs it?
> >>>
> >>>cheers
> >>>M
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>On Thu, May 22, 2008 at 09:33:14PM +0200, Hans-Christoph Steiner
> >>>wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>The only real change to s_main.c in that path is the addition of
> >>>>realpath(). It seems that the function there is just copying the
> >>>>strings back and forth between sbuf and sbuf2, so I just added one
> >>>>more iteration of that back and forth for realpath().
> >>>>
> >>>>.hc
> >>>>
> >>>>On May 22, 2008, at 9:25 PM, Miller Puckette wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>>I might have missed it, but I didn't see that realpath() itself
> >>>>>made it into
> >>>>>the patch... ?
> >>>>>
> >>>>>M
> >>>>>
> >>>>>On Thu, May 22, 2008 at 09:22:12PM +0200, Hans-Christoph Steiner
> >>>>>wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>The realpath() is definitely related. If you start Pd using a
> >>>>>>relative path, like I do when doing dev work (e.g. make && ../
> >>>>>>bin/
> >>>>>>pd), then sys_libdir will be a relative path. That means it is
> >>>>>>impossible to make absolute paths using sys_libdir, which is
> >>>>>>what I
> >>>>>>need to do to make [import] work, or loading libdirs with
> >>>>>>[declare -
> >>>>>>lib] and the libdir loader.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>I can't see any problems that realpath() might cause.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>.hc
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>On May 22, 2008, at 8:45 PM, Miller Puckette wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>OK, I took most of the patch (not the "realpath()" call which
> >>>>>>>seems
> >>>>>>>unrelated) and uploaded to SVN, unless I'm mistaken.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>cheers
> >>>>>>>Miller
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>On Wed, May 21, 2008 at 08:22:23PM +0200, Hans-Christoph Steiner
> >>>>>>>wrote:
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>I was looking into this a bit more, and from what I can
> >>>>>>>>tell, the
> >>>>>>>>canvas-local path (ce_path) is always relative to the path
> >>>>>>>>of the
> >>>>>>>>parent patch. Here's the commit for pd-extended that adds
> >>>>>>>>support
> >>>>>>>>for absolute paths:
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>http://pure-data.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/pure-data?
> >>>>>>>>view=rev&revision=9862
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>Also, I submitted a patch:
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>http://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?
> >>>>>>>>func=detail&aid=1917574&group_id=55736&atid=478072
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>.hc
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>On May 19, 2008, at 9:42 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>I think I fixed the full paths bug, here's the commit:
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>http://pure-data.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/pure-data?
> >>>>>>>>>view=rev&revision=9856
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>.hc
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>On May 19, 2008, at 8:03 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>I think this issue is pretty clear, and the languages that
> >>>>>>>>>>I know
> >>>>>>>>>>would fall along the lines of "each patch/abstraction has
> >>>>>>>>>>its own
> >>>>>>>>>>namespace" or in other words "#include only affects the
> >>>>>>>>>>one .c
> >>>>>>>>>>file", "import only affects the one .py file", etc. So I
> >>>>>>>>>>agree
> >>>>>>>>>>with Frank. Global settings are global, and canvas-local
> >>>>>>>>>>settings
> >>>>>>>>>>are local to the original file.
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>The "semi-functional" part is the full paths that Marius
> >>>>>>>>>>mentioned.
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>Then the other question is how to use something like "#X
> >>>>>>>>>>declare"/
> >>>>>>>>>>canvas_savedeclarationsto() in externals. I'd like to
> >>>>>>>>>>create an
> >>>>>>>>>>[import] modelled after Python's import does, so I'd like
> >>>>>>>>>>to use
> >>>>>>>>>>"#X declare"/canvas_savedeclarationsto() with it.
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>.hc
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>On May 19, 2008, at 6:33 PM, Miller Puckette wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>Hi all,
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>I use 'declare' all the time.. don't think it's
> >>>>>>>>>>>semifunctional at
> >>>>>>>>>>>all.
> >>>>>>>>>>>I think the questions about how declares should act inside
> >>>>>>>>>>>abstractions
> >>>>>>>>>>>are hard to resolve; in my own usage (and in the way I
> >>>>>>>>>>>suggest
> >>>>>>>>>>>others might
> >>>>>>>>>>>want to use declare) it's always in the main patch, as a
> >>>>>>>>>>>way to
> >>>>>>>>>>>show the
> >>>>>>>>>>>patch what libraries, etc, it needs.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>cheers
> >>>>>>>>>>>Miller
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>On Mon, May 19, 2008 at 06:28:31PM +0200, Hans-Christoph
> >>>>>>>>>>>Steiner
> >>>>>>>>>>>wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>Hey,
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>So I am diving into the whole canvas-local namespace and
> >>>>>>>>>>>>[declare]
> >>>>>>>>>>>>issue these days. I like the new "#X declare"/
> >>>>>>>>>>>>canvas_savedeclarationsto() functionality, I think it
> >>>>>>>>>>>>could be
> >>>>>>>>>>>>useful
> >>>>>>>>>>>>for a lot of things. I was thinking of making an API to
> >>>>>>>>>>>>use
> >>>>>>>>>>>>it in
> >>>>>>>>>>>>externals, something like sys_register_loader(). I have
> >>>>>>>>>>>>two
> >>>>>>>>>>>>questions, first, how entrenched is the current behavior of
> >>>>>>>>>>>>[declare]? It currently is only semi-functional, and I
> >>>>>>>>>>>>think few
> >>>>>>>>>>>>people use it.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>The second is how to structure this for general use. I
> >>>>>>>>>>>>have
> >>>>>>>>>>>>thought
> >>>>>>>>>>>>of two ways:
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>- make "declare" the key word and allow other
> >>>>>>>>>>>>objectclasses to
> >>>>>>>>>>>>have
> >>>>>>>>>>>>their own custom "#X declare" data.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>- allow objectclasses to register their own declaration key
> >>>>>>>>>>>>words,
> >>>>>>>>>>>>like [import] could have "#X import".
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>The first would mean changing the behavior of [declare],
> >>>>>>>>>>>>the
> >>>>>>>>>>>>second
> >>>>>>>>>>>>could lead to a big mess...
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>.hc
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>-----------------------------------------------------------
> >>>>>>>>>>>>----
> >>>>>>>>>>>>--
> >>>>>>>>>>>>--
> >>>>>>>>>>>>-----
> >>>>>>>>>>>>----
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>Man has survived hitherto because he was too ignorant to
> >>>>>>>>>>>>know
> >>>>>>>>>>>>how to
> >>>>>>>>>>>>realize his wishes. Now that he can realize them, he must
> >>>>>>>>>>>>either
> >>>>>>>>>>>>change them, or perish. -William Carlos Williams
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
> >>>>>>>>>>>>PD-dev mailing list
> >>>>>>>>>>>>PD-dev at iem.at
> >>>>>>>>>>>>http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-dev
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>-------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>>>>>>>>----
> >>>>>>>>>>--
> >>>>>>>>>>--
> >>>>>>>>>>-------
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>News is what people want to keep hidden and everything
> >>>>>>>>>>else is
> >>>>>>>>>>publicity. - Bill Moyers
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>--------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>>>>>>>----
> >>>>>>>>>--
> >>>>>>>>>--
> >>>>>>>>>------
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>You can't steal a gift. Bird gave the world his music, and
> >>>>>>>>>if you
> >>>>>>>>>can hear it, you can have it. - Dizzy Gillespie
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>---------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>>>>>>----
> >>>>>>>>--
> >>>>>>>>---
> >>>>>>>>----
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>News is what people want to keep hidden and everything else is
> >>>>>>>>publicity. - Bill Moyers
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>_______________________________________________
> >>>>>>>>PD-dev mailing list
> >>>>>>>>PD-dev at iem.at
> >>>>>>>>http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-dev
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>-----------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>>>>----
> >>>>>>---
> >>>>>>----
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>News is what people want to keep hidden and everything else is
> >>>>>>publicity. - Bill Moyers
> >>>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>-------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>>-----
> >>>>----
> >>>>
> >>>>"It is convenient to imagine a power beyond us because that
> >>>>means we
> >>>>don't have to examine our own lives.", from "The Idols of
> >>>>Environmentalism", by Curtis White
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>-------
> >>
> >>If you are not part of the solution, you are part of the problem.
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> ----
>
> You can't steal a gift. Bird gave the world his music, and if you can
> hear it, you can have it. - Dizzy Gillespie
>
>
>
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