From david.doukhan at gmail.com Sun Mar 1 03:25:50 2009 From: david.doukhan at gmail.com (David Doukhan) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 03:25:50 +0100 Subject: [PD] fractional delay for PD Message-ID: Hi all, I'm trying to use a variable fractional delay in one of my patch. I've tried to use vd~ , but was not really convinced by the results I obtained. It seems I need a better method. Does anyone knows other PD external that could implement fractional delay with variable delay length? By the way: I'm tring to have a look at the litterature related to that subject... I don't even know what method have been used in vd~ ... The only thing I've read in the corresponding help patch, is that the interpolation method used by that component does an interpolation over 4 values. Does anyone know the name of the method used by that component? It would allow me get better clues on its theoretical efficiency, and to know if spending some time to program/test some alternative method would be usefull... Any help would be appreciated. Thanks! -- David Doukhan From hans at eds.org Sun Mar 1 06:56:28 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 00:56:28 -0500 Subject: [PD] Google Summer of Code 2009! In-Reply-To: <49A93F25.2070407@mur.at> References: <49A59F84.30702@mur.at> <49A5AFA0.20202@netpd.org> <518BE637-5CF6-4FCF-8E70-EF4FF4424DA5@eds.org> <49A93F25.2070407@mur.at> Message-ID: <3B84CCAA-6C1C-472B-92E4-7530A17376DB@eds.org> I think your idea sounds good, I think you should just start the page, and then we can fill it in as each of us finds the time. .hc On Feb 28, 2009, at 8:41 AM, Georg Holzmann wrote: > Hallo Hans ! > > Do you have or other have any comments on my last mail ? > I don't want to start a new wiki page if there is no agreement about > the procedure ... > > LG > Georg > > Hans-Christoph Steiner schrieb: >> On Feb 25, 2009, at 3:52 PM, Enrique Erne wrote: >>> wow these project are really nice. >>> >>> i hope deeply PdLib would make it with or without soc. imo that is >>> soooo missing in pd-extended. i'd love to help but i don't even >>> know how to help to get the help-files in running in pd-ext. >>> http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/PdLib/ >>> >>> LibPd would be also a huge addition. >>> http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/LibPd/ >>> >>> only negative point i have is the name: PdLib and LibPd is kind of >>> confusing. >>> >>> but as already stated, all projects are great and would be >>> wonderful. >> If you want to starting on standard libs for Pd, I say just do it. >> Pick a topic and start making a library. For example, I really >> should finish 'tkwidgets', which is a library that aims to directly >> expose the standard Tk widgets for use in Pd. I did manage to >> finish 'apple' which is a library of Apple-specific functions like >> accelerometer, light level sensors, brightness controls, etc. The >> Thinkpad has lots of example code for all this stuff to, so it >> would be great to have a 'thinkpad' library. >> .hc >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- kill >> your television ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Looking at things from a more basic level, you can come up with a more direct solution... It may sound small in theory, but it in practice, it can change entire economies. - Amy Smith From hans at eds.org Sun Mar 1 07:00:51 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 01:00:51 -0500 Subject: [PD] [PD-dev] pd-ext documentation [was something else] In-Reply-To: <20090228072241.GB8098@fliwatut.scifi> References: <49A728E6.2020703@gmail.com> <20090227071658.GB29689@fliwatut.scifi> <6159E107-C2F3-4DF8-BFFE-B19176BB06DE@eds.org> <20090228072241.GB8098@fliwatut.scifi> Message-ID: <637F2B23-7F3E-4372-B036-FAA71EEB3F3A@eds.org> On Feb 28, 2009, at 2:22 AM, Frank Barknecht wrote: > Hallo, > Hans-Christoph Steiner hat gesagt: // Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > >> Sounds like a useful thing. How about sticking this info into a >> subpatch in the help patch? They could easily be parsed with >> textfile >> and route. Then there is only one file per object to maintain. > > The [pd META] approach, yes. But there is no vanilla way to get a > directory listing. I think Miller uses grep, does that count as vanilla? ;) On Mac OS X, the spotlight searching stuff would bring up the patches based on keyword. It would be great to have the GNOME searching stuff work on Pd help patches too, it might already. I guess the Windows file system indexing would work the same way. .hc > > > Ciao > -- > Frank Barknecht Do You RjDj.me? _ > ______footils.org__ > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-dev mailing list > Pd-dev at iem.at > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-dev ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Man has survived hitherto because he was too ignorant to know how to realize his wishes. Now that he can realize them, he must either change them, or perish. -William Carlos Williams From czhenry at gmail.com Sun Mar 1 07:25:14 2009 From: czhenry at gmail.com (Charles Henry) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 00:25:14 -0600 Subject: [PD] fractional delay for PD In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <518fe7b20902282225l3b275b58u598e05faa53ccf9d@mail.gmail.com> On Sat, Feb 28, 2009 at 8:25 PM, David Doukhan wrote: > I don't even know what method have been used in vd~ ... > The only thing I've read in the corresponding help patch, is that the > interpolation method used by that component does an interpolation over > 4 values. > Does anyone know the name of the method used by that component? It > would allow me get better clues on its theoretical efficiency, and to > know if spending some time to program/test some alternative method > would be usefull... vd~ appears to use the same 4-point interpolation method as tabread4~, which is just a cubic polynomial fit through 4 points. Other methods of finding interpolation polynomials for improved response were discussed a few months ago in the thread on different tabread4's. Let me know if you need anything. Chuck http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/2008-06/062878.html http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/2008-06/063256.html http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/2008-06/063303.html I did a lot of analysis on the functions, involved. big math lecture is here: http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/2008-07/063601.html tables and transforms: http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/2008-07/063489.html Algorithm is here in d_delay.c: 262 while (n--) 263 { 264 t_sample delsamps = x->x_sr * *in++ - zerodel, frac; 265 int idelsamps; 266 t_sample a, b, c, d, cminusb; 267 if (delsamps < 1.00001f) delsamps = 1.00001f; 268 if (delsamps > limit) delsamps = limit; 269 delsamps += fn; 270 fn = fn - 1.0f; 271 idelsamps = delsamps; 272 frac = delsamps - (t_sample)idelsamps; 273 bp = wp - idelsamps; 274 if (bp < vp + 4) bp += nsamps; 275 d = bp[-3]; 276 c = bp[-2]; 277 b = bp[-1]; 278 a = bp[0]; 279 cminusb = c-b; 280 *out++ = b + frac * ( 281 cminusb - 0.1666667f * (1.-frac) * ( 282 (d - a - 3.0f * cminusb) * frac + (d + 2.0f*a - 3.0f*b) 283 ) 284 ); 285 } From zmoelnig at iem.at Sun Mar 1 10:20:42 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Sun, 01 Mar 2009 10:20:42 +0100 Subject: [PD] call for help: help patch fixing In-Reply-To: <20090228103125.QGL2M.169260.imail@eastrmwml46> References: <20090228103125.QGL2M.169260.imail@eastrmwml46> Message-ID: <49AA536A.4060703@iem.at> bigswift at cox.net wrote: > Hans this may be off topic, but speaking of help patches. What is up with the Gem/Examples/Basic/Model.pd file? hmm, i really don't understand why hans is bothered with this. if it is a bug in Gem, please try to confirm so and post a bug-report at http://pd-gem.sf.net i think the Gem splash-screen (which you get when loading Gem) is pretty clear about this. cheers fgmasdr IOhannes From zmoelnig at iem.at Sun Mar 1 10:23:38 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Sun, 01 Mar 2009 10:23:38 +0100 Subject: [PD] string2any in arduino.pd is now broken In-Reply-To: <875B01B4-DC88-4A60-9B47-AE846AED434C@eds.org> References: <20090212094209.GA21964@fliwatut.scifi> <4993F20A.7040507@ling.uni-potsdam.de> <875B01B4-DC88-4A60-9B47-AE846AED434C@eds.org> Message-ID: <49AA541A.1080005@iem.at> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > Windows doesn't have symlinks, so that's why this doesn't work on > Windows. I think MinGW's "ln -s" is supposed to make a copy, cygwin's > "ln -s" will make a Windows "Shortcut" but they only act like symlinks > when in Cygwin. But it sounds likely that there is something amiss > with this symlinking stuff. and you forgot: svn creates a copy from symlinks as well (that is: if a symlink was checked into the repository, and you check it out on w32, you will get 2 copies of the same file, changing (and committing) one, will have an effect on both; all in all: symlinks ought to be transparent) fgmad IOhannes From fbar at footils.org Sun Mar 1 11:24:42 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 11:24:42 +0100 Subject: [PD] fractional delay for PD In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20090301102442.GA17150@fliwatut.scifi> Hallo, David Doukhan hat gesagt: // David Doukhan wrote: > I'm trying to use a variable fractional delay in one of my patch. > I've tried to use vd~ , but was not really convinced by the results I > obtained. It seems I need a better method. > > Does anyone knows other PD external that could implement fractional > delay with variable delay length? > > By the way: I'm tring to have a look at the litterature related to > that subject... > I don't even know what method have been used in vd~ ... > The only thing I've read in the corresponding help patch, is that the > interpolation method used by that component does an interpolation over > 4 values. There are some more details in Miller's book: http://crca.ucsd.edu/~msp/techniques/latest/book-html/node113.html A classic document is Jon Datorro's "Effect Design Part II: Delay-Line Modulation and Chorus" available here: http://www.stanford.edu/~dattorro/research.html Ciao -- Frank Barknecht Do You RjDj.me? _ ______footils.org__ From reduzierer at yahoo.de Sun Mar 1 12:05:22 2009 From: reduzierer at yahoo.de (Roman Haefeli) Date: Sun, 01 Mar 2009 12:05:22 +0100 Subject: [PD] pd and tcp: what to do against crashes? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1235905522.7557.39.camel@yoyo2> On Tue, 2009-02-24 at 21:15 +0000, Martin Peach wrote: > Roman Haefeli wrote: > >--- Martin Peach schrieb am Di, 24.2.2009: > > > Roman Haefeli wrote: > > > >>> On Mon, 2009-02-23 at 21:03 +0000, Martin > > > Peach wrote: > > > Yes, I agree. I think a status outlet on the [tcpserver] > > > could be extended later to have more messages. Some of the > > > stuff that gets printed to the Pd window could go there and > > > then it could be handled by the patch instead of the > > > 'operator'. I don't want to keep adding more > > > outlets, so it would output lists with a selector, like > > > [comport]. > > > >i totally agree, that instead of adding more outlets it would be better to > >provide additional information on the same outlet with appropriate > >selector. > > > > OK it's done for now, in svn. Each time something is sent, you get a "sent" > message from the status outlet that gives the number of bytes that were > actually sent and the client number. Also a [client( message with no data > lists the connections using a "client" selector. > The send function doesn't wait any more. If the number of bytes sent is > zero, you have to try again. > It all needs to be tested... thank you for implementing those changes. i finally had a chance (and time) to have a closer look and it turned out, that the additional information is actually no gain and this still doesn't allow to programm a non-blocking server. it seems, that the 'sent' message is output, when something was _added_ to the 'send' buffer. actually, we would need this message to appear when something was _removed_ from the buffer, which is when a message actually was sent. with the current implementation, the buffer still overruns without having the chance to know this beforehand. whenever i send a message to client, i get _immediately_ a 'sent 1 7' message, which i use to trigger the next message, etc. so buffer keeps filling and filling. when the buffer is full, [tcpserver] blocks pd. so, currently the situation is not different from the one before i have started this thread. i don't know, how much control you have at c level over what is happening at tcp level. in order to solve the current issues at pd-level, information about either the current buffer size or amount of sent bytes (number of bytes removed from the buffer) would be required. i don't know how and if this is possible at all. i would be interested to read about the c functions providing tcp capabilities. may i ask where you got your knowledge about those? roman ___________________________________________________________ Der fr?he Vogel f?ngt den Wurm. Hier gelangen Sie zum neuen Yahoo! Mail: http://mail.yahoo.de From david.doukhan at gmail.com Sun Mar 1 14:58:46 2009 From: david.doukhan at gmail.com (David Doukhan) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 14:58:46 +0100 Subject: [PD] fractional delay for PD In-Reply-To: <20090301102442.GA17150@fliwatut.scifi> References: <20090301102442.GA17150@fliwatut.scifi> Message-ID: thanks for these answers... i'll investiguate those points!!! 2009/3/1 Frank Barknecht : > Hallo, > David Doukhan hat gesagt: // David Doukhan wrote: > >> I'm trying to use a variable fractional delay in one of my patch. >> I've tried to use vd~ , but was not really convinced by the results I >> obtained. It seems I need a better method. >> >> Does anyone knows other PD external that could implement fractional >> delay with variable delay length? >> >> By the way: I'm tring to have a look at the litterature related to >> that subject... >> I don't even know what method have been used in vd~ ... >> The only thing I've read in the corresponding help patch, is that the >> interpolation method used by that component does an interpolation over >> 4 values. > > There are some more details in Miller's book: > http://crca.ucsd.edu/~msp/techniques/latest/book-html/node113.html > > A classic document is Jon Datorro's "Effect Design Part II: > Delay-Line Modulation and Chorus" available here: > http://www.stanford.edu/~dattorro/research.html > > Ciao > -- > ?Frank Barknecht ? ? ? ? ? ?Do You RjDj.me? ? ? ? ? ?_ ______footils.org__ > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -- David Doukhan From grh at mur.at Sun Mar 1 16:54:10 2009 From: grh at mur.at (Georg Holzmann) Date: Sun, 01 Mar 2009 16:54:10 +0100 Subject: [PD] Google Summer of Code 2009! In-Reply-To: <3B84CCAA-6C1C-472B-92E4-7530A17376DB@eds.org> References: <49A59F84.30702@mur.at> <49A5AFA0.20202@netpd.org> <518BE637-5CF6-4FCF-8E70-EF4FF4424DA5@eds.org> <49A93F25.2070407@mur.at> <3B84CCAA-6C1C-472B-92E4-7530A17376DB@eds.org> Message-ID: <49AAAFA2.3030707@mur.at> OK, I started the WIKI page here: http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/GoogleSummerOfCodeIdeas2009 I will add some projects in the evening, which can be used as templates for other mentors ... LG Georg Hans-Christoph Steiner schrieb: > > I think your idea sounds good, I think you should just start the page, > and then we can fill it in as each of us finds the time. > > .hc > > On Feb 28, 2009, at 8:41 AM, Georg Holzmann wrote: > >> Hallo Hans ! >> >> Do you have or other have any comments on my last mail ? >> I don't want to start a new wiki page if there is no agreement about >> the procedure ... >> >> LG >> Georg >> >> Hans-Christoph Steiner schrieb: >>> On Feb 25, 2009, at 3:52 PM, Enrique Erne wrote: >>>> wow these project are really nice. >>>> >>>> i hope deeply PdLib would make it with or without soc. imo that is >>>> soooo missing in pd-extended. i'd love to help but i don't even know >>>> how to help to get the help-files in running in pd-ext. >>>> http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/PdLib/ >>>> >>>> LibPd would be also a huge addition. >>>> http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/LibPd/ >>>> >>>> only negative point i have is the name: PdLib and LibPd is kind of >>>> confusing. >>>> >>>> but as already stated, all projects are great and would be wonderful. >>> If you want to starting on standard libs for Pd, I say just do it. >>> Pick a topic and start making a library. For example, I really >>> should finish 'tkwidgets', which is a library that aims to directly >>> expose the standard Tk widgets for use in Pd. I did manage to finish >>> 'apple' which is a library of Apple-specific functions like >>> accelerometer, light level sensors, brightness controls, etc. The >>> Thinkpad has lots of example code for all this stuff to, so it would >>> be great to have a 'thinkpad' library. >>> .hc >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> kill your television > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > Looking at things from a more basic level, you can come up with a more > direct solution... It may sound small in theory, but it in practice, it > can change entire economies. - Amy Smith > > From mgrimm at syr.edu Sun Mar 1 17:17:52 2009 From: mgrimm at syr.edu (mark edward grimm) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 08:17:52 -0800 (PST) Subject: [PD] streaming audio and video in Linux In-Reply-To: <616283880902272324j6e8160fg273607ee6bc49fad@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <598100.25393.qm@web32406.mail.mud.yahoo.com> yeah i will take a look at this... might you have an example shell script + pd patch for piping stream from mencoder to pdp_rawin? i saw this thread but i am not sure if issue ever were resolved: http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/2008-04/061727.html thanks! m ? --- On Sat, 2/28/09, Jaime Oliver wrote: > From: Jaime Oliver > Subject: Re: [PD] streaming audio and video in Linux > To: mgrimm at syr.edu > Cc: "ydegoyon at gmail.com" , "pd-list" , "John Harrison" > Date: Saturday, February 28, 2009, 2:24 AM > MEncoder maybe? > > On Fri, Feb 27, 2009 at 7:50 AM, mark edward grimm > wrote: > > > > > > no, pdp_icedthe~ can receive a stream > > > > ah thats right thanks! > > > > > we will not try to support an .asx/proprietary > format, > > > > understandable.... yeah i want to "hijack" > someone else's stream - it just > > happens to be in .asx!!! > > > > i wonder if there is a method for real-time > transcoding....? from asx to > > ogg? > > > > ____________________ > > mark edward grimm | m.f.a | ed.m > > syracuse u. | vpa foundations | timearts > > adjunct | new media consultant > > megrimm.net | socialmedia.org/GROUP & LLC > > mgrimm at syr.edu | 315.378.2136 > > ________________________________________ > > > > > > > > > > --- On Fri, 2/27/09, ydegoyon at gmail.com > wrote: > > > > > From: ydegoyon at gmail.com > > > > Subject: Re: [PD] streaming audio and video in > Linux > > > To: mgrimm at syr.edu > > > Cc: "pd-list" , > "John Harrison" < > > johnharrisonwsu at gmail.com> > > > Date: Friday, February 27, 2009, 10:39 AM > > > mark edward grimm wrote: > > > > hmmm... yeah sorry for changing the subject > on this. > > > > > > > > I was actually wondering the opposite of the > original > > > poster, how to get a stream 'into' pd.... > > > > > > > > For example i have access to a stream > > > (http://someone-elses-website/live12.asx) that is > not my > > > own.... > > > > > > > > This stream I can open in VLC player for > example.... > > > > > > > > How can I utilize this stream in pd? > directly or > > > indirectly (through vlc player?)..... to do > motion tracking > > > on the stream for example. > > > > > > > > the pdp_theora stuff is just for streaming > out FROM pd > > > correct? > > > > > > > > > > > no, pdp_icedthe~ can receive a stream > > > but only in ogg/theora format, > > > we will not try to support an .asx/proprietary > format, > > > well not me. > > > > > > sevy > > > > m > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > > -- > Jaime E Oliver LR > > joliverl at ucsd.edu > www.realidadvisual.org/jaimeoliver > www-crca.ucsd.edu/ > www.realidadvisual.org > > 858 202 1522 > 9168 Regents Rd. Apt. G > La Jolla, CA 92037 > USA From dafydd61 at gmail.com Sun Mar 1 17:37:45 2009 From: dafydd61 at gmail.com (Dafydd Hughes) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 11:37:45 -0500 Subject: [PD] OT Internet in the south of France Message-ID: Hi folks Can I pick the brains of my European friends? We're spending the month of May in Six-Fours in southern France (not far from Marseille I think). Just found out that I may need to keep working while we're there and I'm trying to find out what my options are re: internet access. I believe the house we're staying in doesn't have a phone, so definitely no internet. Can anybody suggest a solution? Is there a wireless or mobile internet option? Am I best to just get a hotspot subscription? (sorry this is so OT) cheers dafydd -- www.sideshowmedia.ca skype: chickeninthegrass From crinimal at gmx.net Sun Mar 1 18:01:38 2009 From: crinimal at gmx.net (Martin Schied) Date: Sun, 01 Mar 2009 18:01:38 +0100 Subject: [PD] Model.pd helppatch [was: call for help: help patch fixing] In-Reply-To: <49AA536A.4060703@iem.at> References: <20090228103125.QGL2M.169260.imail@eastrmwml46> <49AA536A.4060703@iem.at> Message-ID: <49AABF72.5090007@gmx.net> hi, IOhannes m zmoelnig schrieb: > bigswift at cox.net wrote: > >> Hans this may be off topic, but speaking of help patches. What is up with the Gem/Examples/Basic/Model.pd file? >> > > hmm, i really don't understand why hans is bothered with this. > > > if it is a bug in Gem, please try to confirm so and post a bug-report at > http://pd-gem.sf.net > > i think the Gem splash-screen (which you get when loading Gem) is pretty > clear about this. > > I already posted this bug and got reply from Cyrille Henry, it seemed not to occur for recent cvs version, view link below. at least for pd-extended from otherside intrepid repository a workaround is creating gemwin before loading patches containing [model object.obj] or before loading '.obj' files bugreport was: [ pure-data-Bugs-2630421 ] [model foobar.obj] crashes when no gemwin is created before: https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?func=detail&atid=478070&aid=2630421&group_id=55736 cheers, Martin From jaime.oliver2 at gmail.com Sun Mar 1 18:50:59 2009 From: jaime.oliver2 at gmail.com (Jaime Oliver) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 09:50:59 -0800 Subject: [PD] streaming audio and video in Linux In-Reply-To: <598100.25393.qm@web32406.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <616283880902272324j6e8160fg273607ee6bc49fad@mail.gmail.com> <598100.25393.qm@web32406.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <616283880903010950h751f428fi1488ed68d6fba3e4@mail.gmail.com> Well, I haven't done it myself, I just know you can...there is a mencoder list: "MEncoder usage discussions" , and documentation somewhere. best, Jaime On Sun, Mar 1, 2009 at 8:17 AM, mark edward grimm wrote: > > yeah i will take a look at this... > > might you have an example shell script + pd patch for piping stream from > mencoder to pdp_rawin? > > i saw this thread but i am not sure if issue ever were resolved: > > http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/2008-04/061727.html > > > thanks! > m > > > > --- On Sat, 2/28/09, Jaime Oliver wrote: > > > From: Jaime Oliver > > Subject: Re: [PD] streaming audio and video in Linux > > To: mgrimm at syr.edu > > Cc: "ydegoyon at gmail.com" , "pd-list" , > "John Harrison" > > Date: Saturday, February 28, 2009, 2:24 AM > > MEncoder maybe? > > > > On Fri, Feb 27, 2009 at 7:50 AM, mark edward grimm > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > no, pdp_icedthe~ can receive a stream > > > > > > ah thats right thanks! > > > > > > > we will not try to support an .asx/proprietary > > format, > > > > > > understandable.... yeah i want to "hijack" > > someone else's stream - it just > > > happens to be in .asx!!! > > > > > > i wonder if there is a method for real-time > > transcoding....? from asx to > > > ogg? > > > > > > ____________________ > > > mark edward grimm | m.f.a | ed.m > > > syracuse u. | vpa foundations | timearts > > > adjunct | new media consultant > > > megrimm.net | socialmedia.org/GROUP & LLC > > > mgrimm at syr.edu | 315.378.2136 > > > ________________________________________ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- On Fri, 2/27/09, ydegoyon at gmail.com > > wrote: > > > > > > > From: ydegoyon at gmail.com > > > > > > Subject: Re: [PD] streaming audio and video in > > Linux > > > > To: mgrimm at syr.edu > > > > Cc: "pd-list" , > > "John Harrison" < > > > johnharrisonwsu at gmail.com> > > > > Date: Friday, February 27, 2009, 10:39 AM > > > > mark edward grimm wrote: > > > > > hmmm... yeah sorry for changing the subject > > on this. > > > > > > > > > > I was actually wondering the opposite of the > > original > > > > poster, how to get a stream 'into' pd.... > > > > > > > > > > For example i have access to a stream > > > > (http://someone-elses-website/live12.asx) that is > > not my > > > > own.... > > > > > > > > > > This stream I can open in VLC player for > > example.... > > > > > > > > > > How can I utilize this stream in pd? > > directly or > > > > indirectly (through vlc player?)..... to do > > motion tracking > > > > on the stream for example. > > > > > > > > > > the pdp_theora stuff is just for streaming > > out FROM pd > > > > correct? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > no, pdp_icedthe~ can receive a stream > > > > but only in ogg/theora format, > > > > we will not try to support an .asx/proprietary > > format, > > > > well not me. > > > > > > > > sevy > > > > > m > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > > > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > > > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > Jaime E Oliver LR > > > > joliverl at ucsd.edu > > www.realidadvisual.org/jaimeoliver > > www-crca.ucsd.edu/ > > www.realidadvisual.org > > > > 858 202 1522 > > 9168 Regents Rd. Apt. G > > La Jolla, CA 92037 > > USA > -- Jaime E Oliver LR joliverl at ucsd.edu www.realidadvisual.org/jaimeoliver www-crca.ucsd.edu/ www.realidadvisual.org 858 202 1522 9168 Regents Rd. Apt. G La Jolla, CA 92037 USA -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From martin.peach at sympatico.ca Sun Mar 1 18:56:01 2009 From: martin.peach at sympatico.ca (Martin Peach) Date: Sun, 01 Mar 2009 12:56:01 -0500 Subject: [PD] pd and tcp: what to do against crashes? In-Reply-To: <1235905522.7557.39.camel@yoyo2> References: <1235905522.7557.39.camel@yoyo2> Message-ID: Roman Haefeli wrote: > On Tue, 2009-02-24 at 21:15 +0000, Martin Peach wrote: >> Roman Haefeli wrote: >>> --- Martin Peach schrieb am Di, 24.2.2009: >>>> Roman Haefeli wrote: >>>>>>> On Mon, 2009-02-23 at 21:03 +0000, Martin >>>> Peach wrote: >>>> Yes, I agree. I think a status outlet on the [tcpserver] >>>> could be extended later to have more messages. Some of the >>>> stuff that gets printed to the Pd window could go there and >>>> then it could be handled by the patch instead of the >>>> 'operator'. I don't want to keep adding more >>>> outlets, so it would output lists with a selector, like >>>> [comport]. >>> i totally agree, that instead of adding more outlets it would be better to >>> provide additional information on the same outlet with appropriate >>> selector. >>> >> OK it's done for now, in svn. Each time something is sent, you get a "sent" >> message from the status outlet that gives the number of bytes that were >> actually sent and the client number. Also a [client( message with no data >> lists the connections using a "client" selector. >> The send function doesn't wait any more. If the number of bytes sent is >> zero, you have to try again. >> It all needs to be tested... > > thank you for implementing those changes. > > i finally had a chance (and time) to have a closer look and it turned > out, that the additional information is actually no gain and this still > doesn't allow to programm a non-blocking server. > it seems, that the 'sent' message is output, when something was _added_ > to the 'send' buffer. actually, we would need this message to appear > when something was _removed_ from the buffer, which is when a message > actually was sent. Yes, because the actual buffer is hidden from the user. You should get a 'sent 0' message when it would block though, I don't know why you don't. > > with the current implementation, the buffer still overruns without > having the chance to know this beforehand. whenever i send a message to > client, i get _immediately_ a 'sent 1 7' message, which i use to > trigger the next message, etc. so buffer keeps filling and filling. when > the buffer is full, [tcpserver] blocks pd. so, currently the situation > is not different from the one before i have started this thread. It's not supposed to do that. It should return 'sent 0' when it can't take any more, never block. Are you sending to the same client or many different ones? Can you post a test patch that will reproduce the bug? Something like this should stop when the buffer is full: [bang][r stop] | | [until] | [send 1 7 7 7 7 7 7 7( | [tcpserver] | | | | | [route sent] | [select 0] | [s stop] > > i don't know, how much control you have at c level over what is > happening at tcp level. in order to solve the current issues at > pd-level, information about either the current buffer size or amount of > sent bytes (number of bytes removed from the buffer) would be required. > i don't know how and if this is possible at all. I don't think it's possible (but then I'm often wrong ;(). There might be an ioctl that will return the buffer size so you could know how much is safe to send at once. > > i would be interested to read about the c functions providing tcp > capabilities. may i ask where you got your knowledge about those? > From all over, but usually from the man pages for tcp, send, ioctl, and the like. For Windows, MSDN has a lot of info about winsock, which is very similar to unix sockets. Martin From martin.peach at sympatico.ca Sun Mar 1 20:01:25 2009 From: martin.peach at sympatico.ca (Martin Peach) Date: Sun, 01 Mar 2009 14:01:25 -0500 Subject: [PD] pd and tcp: what to do against crashes? In-Reply-To: References: <1235905522.7557.39.camel@yoyo2> Message-ID: Martin Peach wrote: > Roman Haefeli wrote: >> i don't know, how much control you have at c level over what is >> happening at tcp level. in order to solve the current issues at >> pd-level, information about either the current buffer size or amount of >> sent bytes (number of bytes removed from the buffer) would be required. >> i don't know how and if this is possible at all. > > I don't think it's possible (but then I'm often wrong ;(). There might > be an ioctl that will return the buffer size so you could know how much > is safe to send at once. Yes you see I was wrong. There is a getsockopt call that will return the buffer size. And a setsockopt that can also set the size on a per-socket basis. On WinXp I get 8192 for the default send buffer. Martin From mjmogo at gmail.com Sun Mar 1 20:10:09 2009 From: mjmogo at gmail.com (Mike McGonagle) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 13:10:09 -0600 Subject: [PD] SQLite3DBv0.03 Message-ID: <370dda580903011110o59ff4f33mc04da4568953d8b1@mail.gmail.com> Hello all, I would like to announce the release of SQLite3db. This release represents a complete rewrite of the externals. It has been rolled into a single external library containing the externals [sqlite3db], [sqlite3query], [sqlite3rowid], and [sqlite3blob]. This release includes several features: 1. Database can be on disk or an in-memory database. 2. The [sqlite3query] object now supports Place Holders. 3. Comprehensive error reporting. 4. Includes a separate object for retrieving the ID for the last record inserted (allows making links between tables) 5. SSSAD plug-and-play panel for storing multiple sets of SSSAD parameters. You can get the archive for files at: http://puredata.info/Members/mjmogo/SQLite3db_v0_03.zip/view Also, the 'makefile' only contains a process for making a 'pd_darwin' external for the Mac. It should not be difficult to compile for Unix or Windows, as it is Ansi-C. Everything should work with Vanilla Pd as well. Let me know if you have any suggestions, criticism, or general praises ;) Mike -- Jean-Luc Godard - "To be or not to be. That's not really a question." From vincent.rioux at no-log.org Sun Mar 1 20:15:20 2009 From: vincent.rioux at no-log.org (Vincent Rioux) Date: Sun, 01 Mar 2009 20:15:20 +0100 Subject: [PD] OT Internet in the south of France In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49AADEC8.9080902@no-log.org> hi dafydd, you might have to take a subscription to a 3G network with a usb key (clef 3g) there is a comparison of prices and offers here: http://www.netbook3g.com/operateur/comparatif-des-offres-abonnement-cle-3g-sfr-bouygues-orange it's in french (oeufcorse) there are only 3 internet providers in france (it has recently been very difficult for others to enter this very "closed" market) if you are close to the marseille area it should be no problem... good luck, v Dafydd Hughes a ?crit : > Hi folks > > Can I pick the brains of my European friends? We're spending the month > of May in Six-Fours in southern France (not far from Marseille I > think). Just found out that I may need to keep working while we're > there and I'm trying to find out what my options are re: internet > access. I believe the house we're staying in doesn't have a phone, so > definitely no internet. Can anybody suggest a solution? Is there a > wireless or mobile internet option? Am I best to just get a hotspot > subscription? > > (sorry this is so OT) > > cheers > dafydd > > From dafydd61 at gmail.com Sun Mar 1 21:43:03 2009 From: dafydd61 at gmail.com (Dafydd Hughes) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 15:43:03 -0500 Subject: [PD] Arduino/SRF05 Message-ID: Hi folks I'm wondering if anybody can point me at an example of using Pduino and an SRF05 ultrasonic ranger? Not sure how to get the microsecond intervals needed. Apologies if this is covered elsewhere on the list or if it's just a stupid question. cheers dafydd -- www.sideshowmedia.ca skype: chickeninthegrass From hans at eds.org Sun Mar 1 22:59:34 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 16:59:34 -0500 Subject: [PD] Arduino/SRF05 In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <140F73C2-09A4-4DB1-B341-6CB0102F15EC@eds.org> I think that is one of the sensors where you have to do the triggering and pulseIn measurement yourself. There are examples on the arduino forum of firmwares that do this, then if you combine such a firmware with the Firmata Arduino library, then you'll have a firmware that will work with Pduino and that sensor. .hc On Mar 1, 2009, at 3:43 PM, Dafydd Hughes wrote: > Hi folks > > I'm wondering if anybody can point me at an example of using Pduino > and an SRF05 ultrasonic ranger? Not sure how to get the microsecond > intervals needed. Apologies if this is covered elsewhere on the list > or if it's just a stupid question. > > cheers > dafydd > > -- > www.sideshowmedia.ca > skype: chickeninthegrass > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- "It is convenient to imagine a power beyond us because that means we don't have to examine our own lives.", from "The Idols of Environmentalism", by Curtis White From martin.peach at sympatico.ca Sun Mar 1 23:01:48 2009 From: martin.peach at sympatico.ca (Martin Peach) Date: Sun, 01 Mar 2009 17:01:48 -0500 Subject: [PD] pd and tcp: what to do against crashes? In-Reply-To: References: <1235905522.7557.39.camel@yoyo2> Message-ID: So I added a [clientbuf( message to [tcpserver] to get/set the size of the send buffer. Apparently the actual buffer will be twice this size. I'm still looking for a way to know if the buffer is so full that any further data will block. It seems that even if the select() call returns OK there still may not be enough room for any arbitrary length of data. Probably I need to set the sockets to nonblocking. Latest is in svn, tested on WinXP only so far. Martin From dafydd61 at gmail.com Sun Mar 1 23:03:50 2009 From: dafydd61 at gmail.com (Dafydd Hughes) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 17:03:50 -0500 Subject: [PD] Arduino/SRF05 In-Reply-To: <140F73C2-09A4-4DB1-B341-6CB0102F15EC@eds.org> References: <140F73C2-09A4-4DB1-B341-6CB0102F15EC@eds.org> Message-ID: Thanks Hans-Christoph In over my head again. cheers dafydd On Sun, Mar 1, 2009 at 4:59 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > I think that is one of the sensors where you have to do the triggering and > ?pulseIn measurement yourself. There are examples on the arduino forum of > firmwares that do this, then if you combine such a firmware with the Firmata > Arduino library, then you'll have a firmware that will work with Pduino and > that sensor. > > .hc > > On Mar 1, 2009, at 3:43 PM, Dafydd Hughes wrote: > >> Hi folks >> >> I'm wondering if anybody can point me at an example of using Pduino >> and an SRF05 ultrasonic ranger? Not sure how to get the microsecond >> intervals needed. Apologies if this is covered elsewhere on the list >> or if it's just a stupid question. >> >> cheers >> dafydd >> >> -- >> www.sideshowmedia.ca >> skype: chickeninthegrass >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > "It is convenient to imagine a power beyond us because that means we don't > have to examine our own lives.", from "The Idols of Environmentalism", by > Curtis White > > > > > -- www.sideshowmedia.ca skype: chickeninthegrass From hans at eds.org Sun Mar 1 23:12:23 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 17:12:23 -0500 Subject: [PD] SQLite3DBv0.03 In-Reply-To: <370dda580903011110o59ff4f33mc04da4568953d8b1@mail.gmail.com> References: <370dda580903011110o59ff4f33mc04da4568953d8b1@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Sounds like a fast way to store a ton of preferences. I think I remembered in our old discussions about it that sqlite was fast enough that the Pd object didn't need to be threaded, which is nice. I think the code would be a lot easier to read if the classes where broken out into separate files. This is the standard way to do with externals: one class per file. Then it would be possible to also compile each class as a separate .pd_darwin, or compile it like you have now. .hc On Mar 1, 2009, at 2:10 PM, Mike McGonagle wrote: > Hello all, > > I would like to announce the release of SQLite3db. > > This release represents a complete rewrite of the externals. It has > been rolled into a single external library containing the externals > [sqlite3db], [sqlite3query], [sqlite3rowid], and [sqlite3blob]. > > This release includes several features: > > 1. Database can be on disk or an in-memory database. > > 2. The [sqlite3query] object now supports Place Holders. > > 3. Comprehensive error reporting. > > 4. Includes a separate object for retrieving the ID for the last > record inserted (allows making links between tables) > > 5. SSSAD plug-and-play panel for storing multiple sets of SSSAD > parameters. > > You can get the archive for files at: > > http://puredata.info/Members/mjmogo/SQLite3db_v0_03.zip/view > > Also, the 'makefile' only contains a process for making a 'pd_darwin' > external for the Mac. It should not be difficult to compile for Unix > or Windows, as it is Ansi-C. Everything should work with Vanilla Pd as > well. > > Let me know if you have any suggestions, criticism, or general > praises ;) > > > Mike > > > -- > > Jean-Luc Godard - "To be or not to be. That's not really a question." > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-dev mailing list > Pd-dev at iem.at > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-dev ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ?El pueblo unido jam?s ser? vencido! From hans at eds.org Sun Mar 1 23:14:23 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 17:14:23 -0500 Subject: [PD] Arduino/SRF05 In-Reply-To: References: <140F73C2-09A4-4DB1-B341-6CB0102F15EC@eds.org> Message-ID: <828BA0D7-9A7C-4B37-906C-7C295C23FD15@eds.org> It wouldn't be so hard, but you'd need some arduino programming experience. If you want something like that sensor that is really easy to use, get a Maxbotix, you can just hook them up to an analog pin and read them immediately with Pduino: http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/categories.php?c=84 .hc On Mar 1, 2009, at 5:03 PM, Dafydd Hughes wrote: > Thanks Hans-Christoph > > In over my head again. > > cheers > dafydd > > On Sun, Mar 1, 2009 at 4:59 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner > wrote: >> >> I think that is one of the sensors where you have to do the >> triggering and >> pulseIn measurement yourself. There are examples on the arduino >> forum of >> firmwares that do this, then if you combine such a firmware with >> the Firmata >> Arduino library, then you'll have a firmware that will work with >> Pduino and >> that sensor. >> >> .hc >> >> On Mar 1, 2009, at 3:43 PM, Dafydd Hughes wrote: >> >>> Hi folks >>> >>> I'm wondering if anybody can point me at an example of using Pduino >>> and an SRF05 ultrasonic ranger? Not sure how to get the microsecond >>> intervals needed. Apologies if this is covered elsewhere on the list >>> or if it's just a stupid question. >>> >>> cheers >>> dafydd >>> >>> -- >>> www.sideshowmedia.ca >>> skype: chickeninthegrass >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> "It is convenient to imagine a power beyond us because that means >> we don't >> have to examine our own lives.", from "The Idols of >> Environmentalism", by >> Curtis White >> >> >> >> >> > > > > -- > www.sideshowmedia.ca > skype: chickeninthegrass ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- All mankind is of one author, and is one volume; when one man dies, one chapter is not torn out of the book, but translated into a better language; and every chapter must be so translated.... -John Donne From hans at eds.org Sun Mar 1 23:29:04 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 17:29:04 -0500 Subject: [PD] call for help: help patch fixing In-Reply-To: References: <33A9E834-C5B8-4F94-A884-A70155159979@eds.org> Message-ID: This is great! First off, I'll just say, I don't think it matters which platform/OS you use, these things should work on all platforms. I think Kyle's process makes sense, here are a couple minor questions: - if you have svn access, commit directly (if you want svn access, request on pd-dev) - if you don't have svn access, then submit to the patch tracker There are a number of tests that we could run. Off the top of my head, I was thinking of starting off by running a script which opens every help patch, and if Pd crashes, it will send a report. Then we could add something that loads every One question is how to get the results from the script. An easy thing to setup would be to have the script send results to pd-cvs at iem.at. Does that work for everyone? .hc On Feb 28, 2009, at 2:02 PM, Kyle Klipowicz wrote: > Hans~ > > I am interested in finding ways to help. What would be required? > > I imagine something like: > > 1. getting an automatic email after the nightly tests. > 2. Logging into the svn or whatever your versioning system is (would > have to be trained on this part). > 3. Downloading the said help patches. > 4. Testing said help patches on local machine. > 5. If fix is found, upload new file to svn and add relevant comments > to versioning system (training again) . > > If you could come up with a very straightforward, idiot-proof > checklist of actions, I could likely offer an hour or two a week on > this task. My only machine right now is running OS X 10.5.6, so > that's the scope of my usefulness to the project. > > ~Kyle > > On Fri, Feb 27, 2009 at 12:19 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner > wrote: > > Hey all, > > A while back, I wrote some scripts that can automatically load every > help patch and load every objectclass. I would like to set these up > to run every night, but I don't think I'll be able to keep up with the > output from this, i.e. fixing the help patches that crash and at the > same manage getting this Pd-extended 0.41 release finished. So I want > to see if there is anyone willing to handle this whole process. > > I think it will make Pd much more reliable if we can track down the > little errors in help patches that can cause crashes. As far as I am > concerned it can be managed how ever anyone wants to do it. I have > these basic scripts ready to go, but they could easily be replaced > with something else, if anyone else wants to do that. > > I think this could then be expanded into a broader testing framework. > > .hc > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > 'You people have such restrictive dress for women,? she said, hobbling > away in three inch heels and panty hose to finish out another pink- > collar temp pool day. - ?Hijab Scene #2", by Mohja Kahf > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > -- > ----- > ------------ > ---- ----- > ---- -------- - ------ > http://perhapsidid.wordpress.com > http://myspace.com/kyleklipowicz ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- http://at.or.at/hans/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hans at eds.org Sun Mar 1 23:59:31 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 17:59:31 -0500 Subject: [PD] new Ubuntu builds: Jaunty/i386 and Netbook Remix/lpia Message-ID: <9017823A-3CF7-4BBE-8B8D-E9839A0D772E@eds.org> I just figured out the magic of chroot and debootstrap so now there are two more builds: ubuntu-jaunty-i386 and ubuntu-hardy-lpia. "lpia" is Low-Powered Intel Atom, and it is the architecture for Ubuntu's Netbook Remix distro. You can get these builds in the usual place, whenever they successfully build: http://autobuild.puredata.info/auto-build/latest/ If anyone is interested in setting up multiple Fedora build environments, let me know and I can get you what you need to set things up on the Fedora box in the build farm. .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- I spent 33 years and four months in active military service and during that period I spent most of my time as a high class muscle man for Big Business, for Wall Street and the bankers. - General Smedley Butler From reduzierer at yahoo.de Mon Mar 2 00:23:35 2009 From: reduzierer at yahoo.de (Roman Haefeli) Date: Mon, 02 Mar 2009 00:23:35 +0100 Subject: [PD] pd and tcp: what to do against crashes? In-Reply-To: References: <1235905522.7557.39.camel@yoyo2> Message-ID: <1235949815.7549.15.camel@yoyo2> On Sun, 2009-03-01 at 12:56 -0500, Martin Peach wrote: > Roman Haefeli wrote: > > On Tue, 2009-02-24 at 21:15 +0000, Martin Peach wrote: > >> Roman Haefeli wrote: > >>> --- Martin Peach schrieb am Di, 24.2.2009: > >>>> Roman Haefeli wrote: > >>>>>>> On Mon, 2009-02-23 at 21:03 +0000, Martin > >>>> Peach wrote: > >>>> Yes, I agree. I think a status outlet on the [tcpserver] > >>>> could be extended later to have more messages. Some of the > >>>> stuff that gets printed to the Pd window could go there and > >>>> then it could be handled by the patch instead of the > >>>> 'operator'. I don't want to keep adding more > >>>> outlets, so it would output lists with a selector, like > >>>> [comport]. > >>> i totally agree, that instead of adding more outlets it would be better to > >>> provide additional information on the same outlet with appropriate > >>> selector. > >>> > >> OK it's done for now, in svn. Each time something is sent, you get a "sent" > >> message from the status outlet that gives the number of bytes that were > >> actually sent and the client number. Also a [client( message with no data > >> lists the connections using a "client" selector. > >> The send function doesn't wait any more. If the number of bytes sent is > >> zero, you have to try again. > >> It all needs to be tested... > > > > thank you for implementing those changes. > > > > i finally had a chance (and time) to have a closer look and it turned > > out, that the additional information is actually no gain and this still > > doesn't allow to programm a non-blocking server. > > it seems, that the 'sent' message is output, when something was _added_ > > to the 'send' buffer. actually, we would need this message to appear > > when something was _removed_ from the buffer, which is when a message > > actually was sent. > > > Yes, because the actual buffer is hidden from the user. You should get a > 'sent 0' message when it would block though, I don't know why you don't. > > > > > > with the current implementation, the buffer still overruns without > > having the chance to know this beforehand. whenever i send a message to > > client, i get _immediately_ a 'sent 1 7' message, which i use to > > trigger the next message, etc. so buffer keeps filling and filling. when > > the buffer is full, [tcpserver] blocks pd. so, currently the situation > > is not different from the one before i have started this thread. > > It's not supposed to do that. It should return 'sent 0' when it can't > take any more, never block. Are you sending to the same client or many > different ones? Can you post a test patch that will reproduce the bug? > Something like this should stop when the buffer is full: > > [bang][r stop] > | | > [until] > | > [send 1 7 7 7 7 7 7 7( > | > [tcpserver] > | | | | | > [route sent] > | > [select 0] > | > [s stop] > ah, now i see your example, i understand how the additional information is supposed to be used. however, i never see a 'sent 0' message. even after pluging the cable back again, so that the buffer is flushed, there is no 'sent 0' message, but only lots of 'sent 1 7' messages. this means, that this example patch didn't work for me. pd was blocked after 5700 or so 8-byte messages. this is with a build from yesterday, so i will check out the todays build as well. you'll hear again from me soon. ;-) roman ___________________________________________________________ Der fr?he Vogel f?ngt den Wurm. Hier gelangen Sie zum neuen Yahoo! Mail: http://mail.yahoo.de From reduzierer at yahoo.de Mon Mar 2 00:30:40 2009 From: reduzierer at yahoo.de (Roman Haefeli) Date: Mon, 02 Mar 2009 00:30:40 +0100 Subject: [PD] pd and tcp: what to do against crashes? In-Reply-To: References: <1235905522.7557.39.camel@yoyo2> Message-ID: <1235950240.7549.23.camel@yoyo2> On Sun, 2009-03-01 at 14:01 -0500, Martin Peach wrote: > Martin Peach wrote: > > Roman Haefeli wrote: > >> i don't know, how much control you have at c level over what is > >> happening at tcp level. in order to solve the current issues at > >> pd-level, information about either the current buffer size or amount of > >> sent bytes (number of bytes removed from the buffer) would be required. > >> i don't know how and if this is possible at all. > > > > I don't think it's possible (but then I'm often wrong ;(). There might > > be an ioctl that will return the buffer size so you could know how much > > is safe to send at once. > > Yes you see I was wrong. There is a getsockopt call that will return the > buffer size. And a setsockopt that can also set the size on a per-socket > basis. > On WinXp I get 8192 for the default send buffer. hm... knowing the actual buffer size isn't really helpful. what would be helpful is to know, what is the state of the buffer: is it empty or full? even the tiniest bit of information (empty or not empty) would solve all issues. i really wonder, how other projects handle that. i mean, if several people download a big file from apache, then a disappearing client doesn't interfere with the other clients. i guess, in apache it is solved by using threads. when using threads, one single thread doesn't necessarily need to know about the buffer state, because it could be blocked without harm to the other apache children. so it can try to send as much data as possible. is using threads the _only_ solution to deal with that problem? i guess, it would overcomplicate the programming of [tcpserver], but you sure know better... roman ___________________________________________________________ Der fr?he Vogel f?ngt den Wurm. Hier gelangen Sie zum neuen Yahoo! Mail: http://mail.yahoo.de From reduzierer at yahoo.de Mon Mar 2 00:52:04 2009 From: reduzierer at yahoo.de (Roman Haefeli) Date: Mon, 02 Mar 2009 00:52:04 +0100 Subject: [PD] pd and tcp: what to do against crashes? In-Reply-To: References: <1235905522.7557.39.camel@yoyo2> Message-ID: <1235951524.7549.30.camel@yoyo2> On Sun, 2009-03-01 at 17:01 -0500, Martin Peach wrote: > So I added a [clientbuf( message to [tcpserver] to get/set the size of > the send buffer. Apparently the actual buffer will be twice this size. when i set the buffer to 10, i get a message: tcpserver_buf_size: client 1 set to 2048 when no cable is plugged in, pd blocks after the second 8-byte message, so i guess, that real client buffer is 10 and not 2048. > I'm still looking for a way to know if the buffer is so full that any > further data will block. it seems, that it would be more elegant to know, when it is empty. i think this is more useful, since then you know that you can send a message, which is <= buffersize without blocking pd. otoh, when you know, that it is almost full, then it is more likely to overrun the buffer with a big message. > It seems that even if the select() call returns > OK there still may not be enough room for any arbitrary length of data. > Probably I need to set the sockets to nonblocking. what does that mean: setting sockets to non-blocking? will this cause the sockets to simply ommit data, that cannot be sent in time? if so, i think, that would be the worst solution of all. roman ___________________________________________________________ Telefonate ohne weitere Kosten vom PC zum PC: http://messenger.yahoo.de From dafydd61 at gmail.com Mon Mar 2 00:56:23 2009 From: dafydd61 at gmail.com (Dafydd Hughes) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 18:56:23 -0500 Subject: [PD] Arduino/SRF05 In-Reply-To: <828BA0D7-9A7C-4B37-906C-7C295C23FD15@eds.org> References: <140F73C2-09A4-4DB1-B341-6CB0102F15EC@eds.org> <828BA0D7-9A7C-4B37-906C-7C295C23FD15@eds.org> Message-ID: Hey Hans-Christoph Actually, I've had the sensor working with Arduino and pulsing LEDs for a while - that part's fine. Now it's just getting Pd to understand Arduino's Serial.println that's giving me trouble. I'm going to open up [arduino] and I bet I'll find the secret there. I was hoping there's be a strictly Pd way to do it - it's for an intro workshop and I was going to show folks how super-easy it is. Hopefully I'll be able to show folks how almost super-easy it is instead. This may be one of those rare occasions where it's actually easier to do something _without_ Pd:) cheers dafydd On Sun, Mar 1, 2009 at 5:14 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > > It wouldn't be so hard, but you'd need some arduino programming experience. > ?If you want something like that sensor that is really easy to use, get a > Maxbotix, you can just hook them up to an analog pin and read them > immediately with Pduino: > > http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/categories.php?c=84 > > .hc > > On Mar 1, 2009, at 5:03 PM, Dafydd Hughes wrote: > >> Thanks Hans-Christoph >> >> In over my head again. >> >> cheers >> dafydd >> >> On Sun, Mar 1, 2009 at 4:59 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner >> wrote: >>> >>> I think that is one of the sensors where you have to do the triggering >>> and >>> ?pulseIn measurement yourself. There are examples on the arduino forum of >>> firmwares that do this, then if you combine such a firmware with the >>> Firmata >>> Arduino library, then you'll have a firmware that will work with Pduino >>> and >>> that sensor. >>> >>> .hc >>> >>> On Mar 1, 2009, at 3:43 PM, Dafydd Hughes wrote: >>> >>>> Hi folks >>>> >>>> I'm wondering if anybody can point me at an example of using Pduino >>>> and an SRF05 ultrasonic ranger? Not sure how to get the microsecond >>>> intervals needed. Apologies if this is covered elsewhere on the list >>>> or if it's just a stupid question. >>>> >>>> cheers >>>> dafydd >>>> >>>> -- >>>> www.sideshowmedia.ca >>>> skype: chickeninthegrass >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >>>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >>>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> >>> "It is convenient to imagine a power beyond us because that means we >>> don't >>> have to examine our own lives.", from "The Idols of Environmentalism", by >>> Curtis White >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> www.sideshowmedia.ca >> skype: chickeninthegrass > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > All mankind is of one author, and is one volume; when one man dies, one > chapter is not torn out of the book, but translated into a better language; > and every chapter must be so translated.... -John Donne > > > -- www.sideshowmedia.ca skype: chickeninthegrass From claudiusmaximus at goto10.org Mon Mar 2 01:02:37 2009 From: claudiusmaximus at goto10.org (Claude Heiland-Allen) Date: Mon, 02 Mar 2009 00:02:37 +0000 Subject: [PD] pd and tcp: what to do against crashes? In-Reply-To: <1235951524.7549.30.camel@yoyo2> References: <1235905522.7557.39.camel@yoyo2> <1235951524.7549.30.camel@yoyo2> Message-ID: <49AB221D.5070008@goto10.org> Roman Haefeli wrote: > On Sun, 2009-03-01 at 17:01 -0500, Martin Peach wrote: [snip] >> Probably I need to set the sockets to nonblocking. > > what does that mean: setting sockets to non-blocking? will this cause > the sockets to simply ommit data, that cannot be sent in time? http://docsrv.sco.com/SDK_netapi/sockC.nonBlockSocks.html Claude From martin.peach at sympatico.ca Mon Mar 2 01:30:48 2009 From: martin.peach at sympatico.ca (Martin Peach) Date: Sun, 01 Mar 2009 19:30:48 -0500 Subject: [PD] pd and tcp: what to do against crashes? In-Reply-To: <1235951524.7549.30.camel@yoyo2> References: <1235905522.7557.39.camel@yoyo2> <1235951524.7549.30.camel@yoyo2> Message-ID: Roman Haefeli wrote: > On Sun, 2009-03-01 at 17:01 -0500, Martin Peach wrote: >> So I added a [clientbuf( message to [tcpserver] to get/set the size of >> the send buffer. Apparently the actual buffer will be twice this size. > > when i set the buffer to 10, i get a message: > tcpserver_buf_size: client 1 set to 2048 > > when no cable is plugged in, pd blocks after the second 8-byte message, > so i guess, that real client buffer is 10 and not 2048. > I think it really is 2048, the smallest the OS will permit, and the send is blocking for another reason. The OS is not required to set the size you ask for, the number [tcpserver] gives you is obtained by asking for the size after setting it to 10. >> I'm still looking for a way to know if the buffer is so full that any >> further data will block. > > it seems, that it would be more elegant to know, when it is empty. i > think this is more useful, since then you know that you can send a > message, which is <= buffersize without blocking pd. otoh, when you > know, that it is almost full, then it is more likely to overrun the > buffer with a big message. > But if you know how much data you want to send you could set the buffer to at least that size first. I think the blocking happens because the connection is gone, not because of the buffer overflowing. If the connection is present the buffer will be emptying as fast as the network can drain it, so just pacing the writes should work. Trying to write an infinite amount instantly won't. >> It seems that even if the select() call returns >> OK there still may not be enough room for any arbitrary length of data. >> Probably I need to set the sockets to nonblocking. > > what does that mean: setting sockets to non-blocking? will this cause > the sockets to simply ommit data, that cannot be sent in time? > if so, i think, that would be the worst solution of all. > It's kind of like running each send call in its own thread, so if something gets stuck it won't block everything else in the process. That's better than making a thread for each connection. Martin From mjmogo at gmail.com Mon Mar 2 01:39:55 2009 From: mjmogo at gmail.com (Mike McGonagle) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 18:39:55 -0600 Subject: [PD] SQLite3DBv0.03 In-Reply-To: References: <370dda580903011110o59ff4f33mc04da4568953d8b1@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <370dda580903011639n4110c10dx822ad56ec06f2e4e@mail.gmail.com> Hi Hans, The reason that I put them all into a single source file is because they share other C data structures. Basically, the method I was using (in the older version) to share info back and forth between the objects was to pass messages back and forth. That got to be a bit confusing to deal with, as it was difficult to know exactly when a message might get sent or received. I understood it, but even after being away from it for a couple of months, it got hard to remember exactly what was going on, let alone anyone else figuring things out. Plus, another reason that I need to share access to the objects on the C level was so that when you close a database, it does not get corrupted because an SQL statement didn't get finalized (all prepared SQL statements need to be "destroyed" before a database can be closed safely). Do you know of a way that different externals can share access to C level code and objects? Mike On Sun, Mar 1, 2009 at 4:12 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > Sounds like a fast way to store a ton of preferences. ?I think I remembered > in our old discussions about it that sqlite was fast enough that the Pd > object didn't need to be threaded, which is nice. > > I think the code would be a lot easier to read if the classes where broken > out into separate files. ?This is the standard way to do with externals: one > class per file. ?Then it would be possible to also compile each class as a > separate .pd_darwin, or compile it like you have now. > > .hc > > On Mar 1, 2009, at 2:10 PM, Mike McGonagle wrote: > >> Hello all, >> >> I would like to announce the release of SQLite3db. >> >> This release represents a complete rewrite of the externals. It has >> been rolled into a single external library containing the externals >> [sqlite3db], [sqlite3query], [sqlite3rowid], and [sqlite3blob]. >> >> This release includes several features: >> >> 1. Database can be on disk or an in-memory database. >> >> 2. The [sqlite3query] object now supports Place Holders. >> >> 3. Comprehensive error reporting. >> >> 4. Includes a separate object for retrieving the ID for the last >> record inserted (allows making links between tables) >> >> 5. SSSAD plug-and-play panel for storing multiple sets of SSSAD >> parameters. >> >> You can get the archive for files at: >> >> http://puredata.info/Members/mjmogo/SQLite3db_v0_03.zip/view >> >> Also, the 'makefile' only contains a process for making a 'pd_darwin' >> external for the Mac. It should not be difficult to compile for Unix >> or Windows, as it is Ansi-C. Everything should work with Vanilla Pd as >> well. >> >> Let me know if you have any suggestions, criticism, or general praises ;) >> >> >> Mike >> >> >> -- >> >> Jean-Luc Godard ?- "To be or not to be. That's not really a question." >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-dev mailing list >> Pd-dev at iem.at >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-dev > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ??El pueblo unido jam?s ser? vencido! > > > -- Samuel Goldwyn - "I read part of it all the way through." From shima at pspunch.com Mon Mar 2 01:44:59 2009 From: shima at pspunch.com (PSPunch) Date: Mon, 02 Mar 2009 09:44:59 +0900 Subject: [PD] Arduino/SRF05 In-Reply-To: References: <140F73C2-09A4-4DB1-B341-6CB0102F15EC@eds.org> <828BA0D7-9A7C-4B37-906C-7C295C23FD15@eds.org> Message-ID: <49AB2C0B.8090205@pspunch.com> Hi Daffydd, I don't recall having too much trouble transferring bytes from an Arduino over to [comport]. Do you not have any data flowing between the two, or is your concern more about how numeric figures are to be formatted? -- David Shimamoto > Hey Hans-Christoph > > Actually, I've had the sensor working with Arduino and pulsing LEDs > for a while - that part's fine. Now it's just getting Pd to understand > Arduino's Serial.println that's giving me trouble. I'm going to open > up [arduino] and I bet I'll find the secret there. > > I was hoping there's be a strictly Pd way to do it - it's for an intro > workshop and I was going to show folks how super-easy it is. Hopefully > I'll be able to show folks how almost super-easy it is instead. > > This may be one of those rare occasions where it's actually easier to > do something _without_ Pd:) > > cheers > dafydd > > On Sun, Mar 1, 2009 at 5:14 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >> >> It wouldn't be so hard, but you'd need some arduino programming experience. >> If you want something like that sensor that is really easy to use, get a >> Maxbotix, you can just hook them up to an analog pin and read them >> immediately with Pduino: >> >> http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/categories.php?c=84 >> >> .hc >> >> On Mar 1, 2009, at 5:03 PM, Dafydd Hughes wrote: >> >>> Thanks Hans-Christoph >>> >>> In over my head again. >>> >>> cheers >>> dafydd >>> >>> On Sun, Mar 1, 2009 at 4:59 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner >>> wrote: >>>> I think that is one of the sensors where you have to do the triggering >>>> and >>>> pulseIn measurement yourself. There are examples on the arduino forum of >>>> firmwares that do this, then if you combine such a firmware with the >>>> Firmata >>>> Arduino library, then you'll have a firmware that will work with Pduino >>>> and >>>> that sensor. >>>> >>>> .hc >>>> >>>> On Mar 1, 2009, at 3:43 PM, Dafydd Hughes wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hi folks >>>>> >>>>> I'm wondering if anybody can point me at an example of using Pduino >>>>> and an SRF05 ultrasonic ranger? Not sure how to get the microsecond >>>>> intervals needed. Apologies if this is covered elsewhere on the list >>>>> or if it's just a stupid question. >>>>> >>>>> cheers >>>>> dafydd >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> www.sideshowmedia.ca >>>>> skype: chickeninthegrass >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >>>>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >>>>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> >>>> "It is convenient to imagine a power beyond us because that means we >>>> don't >>>> have to examine our own lives.", from "The Idols of Environmentalism", by >>>> Curtis White >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> www.sideshowmedia.ca >>> skype: chickeninthegrass >> >> >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> All mankind is of one author, and is one volume; when one man dies, one >> chapter is not torn out of the book, but translated into a better language; >> and every chapter must be so translated.... -John Donne >> >> >> > > > From dafydd61 at gmail.com Mon Mar 2 01:54:17 2009 From: dafydd61 at gmail.com (Dafydd Hughes) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 19:54:17 -0500 Subject: [PD] Arduino/SRF05 In-Reply-To: <49AB2C0B.8090205@pspunch.com> References: <140F73C2-09A4-4DB1-B341-6CB0102F15EC@eds.org> <828BA0D7-9A7C-4B37-906C-7C295C23FD15@eds.org> <49AB2C0B.8090205@pspunch.com> Message-ID: Hi David I'm sure it's easier than I'm making it. Really, I just need to turn the data from the arduino into usable floats. Right now it's coming in as ascii characters and I'm building lists between carriage returns. Hopefully I can now turn those lists into numbers without too much trouble. Should I maybe be doing this with binary numbers? Would that be easier? cheers dafydd On Sun, Mar 1, 2009 at 7:44 PM, PSPunch wrote: > > Hi Daffydd, > > > I don't recall having too much trouble transferring bytes from an > Arduino over to [comport]. > > Do you not have any data flowing between the two, or is your concern > more about how numeric figures are to be formatted? > > > -- > David Shimamoto > > >> Hey Hans-Christoph >> >> Actually, I've had the sensor working with Arduino and pulsing LEDs >> for a while - that part's fine. Now it's just getting Pd to understand >> Arduino's Serial.println that's giving me trouble. I'm going to open >> up [arduino] and I bet I'll find the secret there. >> >> I was hoping there's be a strictly Pd way to do it - it's for an intro >> workshop and I was going to show folks how super-easy it is. Hopefully >> I'll be able to show folks how almost super-easy it is instead. >> >> This may be one of those rare occasions where it's actually easier to >> do something _without_ Pd:) >> >> cheers >> dafydd >> >> On Sun, Mar 1, 2009 at 5:14 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >>> >>> It wouldn't be so hard, but you'd need some arduino programming experience. >>> ?If you want something like that sensor that is really easy to use, get a >>> Maxbotix, you can just hook them up to an analog pin and read them >>> immediately with Pduino: >>> >>> http://www.sparkfun.com/commerce/categories.php?c=84 >>> >>> .hc >>> >>> On Mar 1, 2009, at 5:03 PM, Dafydd Hughes wrote: >>> >>>> Thanks Hans-Christoph >>>> >>>> In over my head again. >>>> >>>> cheers >>>> dafydd >>>> >>>> On Sun, Mar 1, 2009 at 4:59 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner >>>> wrote: >>>>> I think that is one of the sensors where you have to do the triggering >>>>> and >>>>> ?pulseIn measurement yourself. There are examples on the arduino forum of >>>>> firmwares that do this, then if you combine such a firmware with the >>>>> Firmata >>>>> Arduino library, then you'll have a firmware that will work with Pduino >>>>> and >>>>> that sensor. >>>>> >>>>> .hc >>>>> >>>>> On Mar 1, 2009, at 3:43 PM, Dafydd Hughes wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> Hi folks >>>>>> >>>>>> I'm wondering if anybody can point me at an example of using Pduino >>>>>> and an SRF05 ultrasonic ranger? Not sure how to get the microsecond >>>>>> intervals needed. Apologies if this is covered elsewhere on the list >>>>>> or if it's just a stupid question. >>>>>> >>>>>> cheers >>>>>> dafydd >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> www.sideshowmedia.ca >>>>>> skype: chickeninthegrass >>>>>> >>>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>>> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >>>>>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >>>>>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>> >>>>> "It is convenient to imagine a power beyond us because that means we >>>>> don't >>>>> have to examine our own lives.", from "The Idols of Environmentalism", by >>>>> Curtis White >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> www.sideshowmedia.ca >>>> skype: chickeninthegrass >>> >>> >>> >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> >>> All mankind is of one author, and is one volume; when one man dies, one >>> chapter is not torn out of the book, but translated into a better language; >>> and every chapter must be so translated.... -John Donne >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -- www.sideshowmedia.ca skype: chickeninthegrass From reduzierer at yahoo.de Mon Mar 2 01:59:17 2009 From: reduzierer at yahoo.de (Roman Haefeli) Date: Mon, 02 Mar 2009 01:59:17 +0100 Subject: [PD] pd and tcp: what to do against crashes? In-Reply-To: References: <1235905522.7557.39.camel@yoyo2> <1235951524.7549.30.camel@yoyo2> Message-ID: <1235955557.7549.54.camel@yoyo2> On Sun, 2009-03-01 at 19:30 -0500, Martin Peach wrote: > > But if you know how much data you want to send you could set the buffer > to at least that size first. yeah, this works for the very first time you send a chunk of data. the next time, you don't know, if the buffer is already empty again or if there is still some data left to be sent. in an environment like netpd (and many others) you cannot make any assumptions about the internal buffer state, since it would be just too complex. there are situations, where there are problably some kilobytes sent in 0 logical time (on a state dump, for instance), where most of the time there are only sporadically distributed messages to be sent. > I think the blocking happens because the > connection is gone, not because of the buffer overflowing. i am not sure, if understand what you mean here. what i experience: when i overrun the buffer (by plugging out the ethernet cable to the client), the pd process of [tcpserver] is completely blocked after having sent $BUFFERSIZE bytes. it stays blocked, until i plug in the cable back again. the whole content of the buffer is sent after some seconds and the server pd instance responds again. this means, that even if the connection is not completely lost, a blocking of pd could occur. if the connection to the client is permanently lost, then there is no way to make pd responding again, after a buffer overrun occured. > If the connection is present the buffer will be emptying as fast as the > network can drain it, so just pacing the writes should work. Trying to > write an infinite amount instantly won't. i can't follow here as well. it's not about trying to send an infinite amount of data in zero time. it's about not knowing the current connection condition, and because of that risking a drop-out. since the connection condition changes all the time, you cannot implement a self-adapting system in pd without knowing the internal buffer status (empty or not). so even if you send data with a fixed rate, it still could happen, that you trigger the buffer overrun. > >> It seems that even if the select() call returns > >> OK there still may not be enough room for any arbitrary length of data. > >> Probably I need to set the sockets to nonblocking. > > > > what does that mean: setting sockets to non-blocking? will this cause > > the sockets to simply ommit data, that cannot be sent in time? > > if so, i think, that would be the worst solution of all. > > > > It's kind of like running each send call in its own thread, so if > something gets stuck it won't block everything else in the process. > That's better than making a thread for each connection. sounds exciting. do you think you could implement that? roman ___________________________________________________________ Der fr?he Vogel f?ngt den Wurm. Hier gelangen Sie zum neuen Yahoo! Mail: http://mail.yahoo.de From reduzierer at yahoo.de Mon Mar 2 01:38:45 2009 From: reduzierer at yahoo.de (Roman Haefeli) Date: Mon, 02 Mar 2009 01:38:45 +0100 Subject: [PD] pd and tcp: what to do against crashes? In-Reply-To: <49AB221D.5070008@goto10.org> References: <1235905522.7557.39.camel@yoyo2> <1235951524.7549.30.camel@yoyo2> <49AB221D.5070008@goto10.org> Message-ID: <1235954325.7549.38.camel@yoyo2> On Mon, 2009-03-02 at 00:02 +0000, Claude Heiland-Allen wrote: > Roman Haefeli wrote: > > On Sun, 2009-03-01 at 17:01 -0500, Martin Peach wrote: > [snip] > >> Probably I need to set the sockets to nonblocking. > > > > what does that mean: setting sockets to non-blocking? will this cause > > the sockets to simply ommit data, that cannot be sent in time? > > http://docsrv.sco.com/SDK_netapi/sockC.nonBlockSocks.html > yo, although it is well described, i am not sure, if understand everything correctly. if blocking would have occured, an error is returned instead and it would say how much data could be sent. so then you can try to send the rest of the data again some bit of time later? if that is the case: if you want to transmit data as fast as possible, the only non-blocking way would be to constantly try to send data, while triggering the error, and try to send the next chunk of data, when the error did _not_ occur? is 'pulling the error' the only solution to the issues of the currently blocking [tcpserver]? roman ___________________________________________________________ Der fr?he Vogel f?ngt den Wurm. Hier gelangen Sie zum neuen Yahoo! Mail: http://mail.yahoo.de From reduzierer at yahoo.de Mon Mar 2 02:11:37 2009 From: reduzierer at yahoo.de (Roman Haefeli) Date: Mon, 02 Mar 2009 02:11:37 +0100 Subject: [PD] Arduino/SRF05 In-Reply-To: References: <140F73C2-09A4-4DB1-B341-6CB0102F15EC@eds.org> <828BA0D7-9A7C-4B37-906C-7C295C23FD15@eds.org> <49AB2C0B.8090205@pspunch.com> Message-ID: <1235956297.7549.56.camel@yoyo2> On Sun, 2009-03-01 at 19:54 -0500, Dafydd Hughes wrote: > Hi David > > I'm sure it's easier than I'm making it. > > Really, I just need to turn the data from the arduino into usable > floats. Right now it's coming in as ascii characters and I'm building > lists between carriage returns. Hopefully I can now turn those lists > into numbers without too much trouble. Should I maybe be doing this > with binary numbers? Would that be easier? i'd guess so. you could use [mapping/debytemask] in order to convert the byte into its single bits. then parsing of the data you want should be really easy. roman ___________________________________________________________ Der fr?he Vogel f?ngt den Wurm. Hier gelangen Sie zum neuen Yahoo! Mail: http://mail.yahoo.de From dafydd61 at gmail.com Mon Mar 2 02:21:33 2009 From: dafydd61 at gmail.com (Dafydd Hughes) Date: Sun, 1 Mar 2009 20:21:33 -0500 Subject: [PD] Arduino/SRF05 In-Reply-To: <1235956297.7549.56.camel@yoyo2> References: <140F73C2-09A4-4DB1-B341-6CB0102F15EC@eds.org> <828BA0D7-9A7C-4B37-906C-7C295C23FD15@eds.org> <49AB2C0B.8090205@pspunch.com> <1235956297.7549.56.camel@yoyo2> Message-ID: Thanks. I'll look into that tomorrow. In the meantime, I have it working with decimal well enough. Thanks everybody for the help! cheers dafydd On Sun, Mar 1, 2009 at 8:11 PM, Roman Haefeli wrote: > On Sun, 2009-03-01 at 19:54 -0500, Dafydd Hughes wrote: >> Hi David >> >> I'm sure it's easier than I'm making it. >> >> Really, I just need to turn the data from the arduino into usable >> floats. Right now it's coming in as ascii characters and I'm building >> lists between carriage returns. Hopefully I can now turn those lists >> into numbers without too much trouble. Should I maybe be doing this >> with binary numbers? Would that be easier? > > i'd guess so. you could use [mapping/debytemask] in order to convert the > byte into its single bits. then parsing of the data you want should be > really easy. > > roman > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > Der fr?he Vogel f?ngt den Wurm. Hier gelangen Sie zum neuen Yahoo! Mail: http://mail.yahoo.de > > -- www.sideshowmedia.ca skype: chickeninthegrass From martin.peach at sympatico.ca Mon Mar 2 04:53:07 2009 From: martin.peach at sympatico.ca (Martin Peach) Date: Sun, 01 Mar 2009 22:53:07 -0500 Subject: [PD] pd and tcp: what to do against crashes? In-Reply-To: <1235955557.7549.54.camel@yoyo2> References: <1235905522.7557.39.camel@yoyo2> <1235951524.7549.30.camel@yoyo2> <1235955557.7549.54.camel@yoyo2> Message-ID: Roman Haefeli wrote: > On Sun, 2009-03-01 at 19:30 -0500, Martin Peach wrote: >> I think the blocking happens because the >> connection is gone, not because of the buffer overflowing. > > i am not sure, if understand what you mean here. what i experience: when > i overrun the buffer (by plugging out the ethernet cable to the client), > the pd process of [tcpserver] is completely blocked after having sent > $BUFFERSIZE bytes. it stays blocked, until i plug in the cable back > again. the whole content of the buffer is sent after some seconds and > the server pd instance responds again. this means, that even if the > connection is not completely lost, a blocking of pd could occur. You can send until the buffer fills up, even if it isn't emptying. I think it blocks because it only checks for at least one empty space in the buffer but then sends more than that. > > if the connection to the client is permanently lost, then there is no > way to make pd responding again, after a buffer overrun occured. > >> If the connection is present the buffer will be emptying as fast as the >> network can drain it, so just pacing the writes should work. Trying to >> write an infinite amount instantly won't. > > i can't follow here as well. it's not about trying to send an infinite > amount of data in zero time. it's about not knowing the current > connection condition, and because of that risking a drop-out. since the > connection condition changes all the time, you cannot implement a > self-adapting system in pd without knowing the internal buffer status > (empty or not). so even if you send data with a fixed rate, it still > could happen, that you trigger the buffer overrun. > > Well I guess empty and almost full are the same as long as we stick to single bytes. So I made [tcpserver] send the messages one byte at a time. This latest version should not block, since it adds only one element to the buffer for each select call that says the buffer is still writeable. Martin From danomatika at gmail.com Mon Mar 2 05:12:16 2009 From: danomatika at gmail.com (danomatika) Date: Mon, 02 Mar 2009 05:12:16 +0100 Subject: [PD] Building 64bit pd-extended on Ubuntu Intrepid Message-ID: <1235967136.854.2.camel@danoT500> After much playing around, I managed to build a pd-extended 64bit .deb for Ubuntu Intrepid. I put all of the steps on the pd-wiki: http://puredata.info/docs/developer/BuildingPdExtended64bitUbuntuIntrepid It's not a true pd-extended as the 0.41 version seems to still have the table bug, but now I can use my new computer for pd-age. --- Dan Wilcox danomatika.com robotcowboy.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From zmoelnig at iem.at Mon Mar 2 10:02:26 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Mon, 02 Mar 2009 10:02:26 +0100 Subject: [PD] Model.pd helppatch [was: call for help: help patch fixing] In-Reply-To: <49AABF72.5090007@gmx.net> References: <20090228103125.QGL2M.169260.imail@eastrmwml46> <49AA536A.4060703@iem.at> <49AABF72.5090007@gmx.net> Message-ID: <49ABA0A2.80107@iem.at> Martin Schied wrote: > hi, > > IOhannes m zmoelnig schrieb: >> bigswift at cox.net wrote: >> >>> Hans this may be off topic, but speaking of help patches. What is up >>> with the Gem/Examples/Basic/Model.pd file? >>> >> >> hmm, i really don't understand why hans is bothered with this. >> >> >> if it is a bug in Gem, please try to confirm so and post a bug-report at >> http://pd-gem.sf.net >> >> i think the Gem splash-screen (which you get when loading Gem) is pretty >> clear about this. >> >> > I already posted this bug and got reply from Cyrille Henry, it seemed > not to occur for recent cvs version, view link below. i think it could be related to: - your version of Gem (as cyrille suggested) - the model you are loading. - your gfx-card/ / openGL-driver let's try to rule out #1 and #2. mfga.sdr IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From fbar at footils.org Mon Mar 2 10:56:22 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 10:56:22 +0100 Subject: [PD] SQLite3DBv0.03 In-Reply-To: <370dda580903011110o59ff4f33mc04da4568953d8b1@mail.gmail.com> References: <370dda580903011110o59ff4f33mc04da4568953d8b1@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090302095622.GA1084@fliwatut.scifi> Hallo, Mike McGonagle hat gesagt: // Mike McGonagle wrote: > Also, the 'makefile' only contains a process for making a 'pd_darwin' > external for the Mac. It should not be difficult to compile for Unix > or Windows, as it is Ansi-C. Everything should work with Vanilla Pd as > well. Attached is a quickie makefile to compile a pd_linux. Use "make pd_linux". Ciao -- Frank Barknecht Do You RjDj.me? _ ______footils.org__ -------------- next part -------------- export MACOSX_DEPLOYMENT_TARGET = 10.4 pd_darwin: sqlite3db.pd_darwin .SUFFIXES: .pd_darwin MYINSTALL = .. MYHELP = ../../help/ DARWINCFLAGS = -DMACOSX -DUNIX -DPD -O2 -funroll-loops -fomit-frame-pointer -Wall -W -Wshadow -Wstrict-prototypes -Wno-unused -Wno-parentheses -Wno-switch DARWINCINCLUDE = -I/Applications/Pd-0.42-4.app/Contents/Resources/src/ sqlite3.o: sqlite3.c cc $(DARINWCFLAGS) $(DARWINCINCLUDE) -o sqlite3.o -c sqlite3.c sqlite3db.pd_darwin: sqlite3db.c sqlite3.o cc $(DARWINCFLAGS) $(DARWINCINCLUDE) -o $*.o -c $*.c cc -bundle -undefined dynamic_lookup -isysroot /Developer/SDKs/MacOSX10.4u.sdk \ -o $*.pd_darwin $*.o sqlite3.o clean: rm -f *.o *.pd_darwin *.pd_linux minstall: mv -f *.pd_darwin $(MYINSTALL) # ----------------------- LINUX i386 ----------------------- pd_linux: sqlite3db.pd_linux .SUFFIXES: .pd_linux TARGDIR= ./ #----------------------------------------------- EXSRCDIR= . LINUXCFLAGS = -DPD -O2 -funroll-loops -fomit-frame-pointer \ -Wall -W -Wshadow -Wstrict-prototypes \ -Wno-unused -Wno-parentheses -Wno-switch .c.pd_linux: cc $(LINUXCFLAGS) $(LINUXINCLUDE) -o $(EXSRCDIR)$*.o -c $*.c ld -export_dynamic -shared -o $(TARGDIR)$*.pd_linux $(EXSRCDIR)$*.o -lc -lm -lsqlite3 $(LDFLAGS) strip --strip-unneeded $(TARGDIR)$*.pd_linux rm $(EXSRCDIR)$*.o # cp $(TARGDIR)$*.pd_linux $(EXTERNALDIR) From organismo at gmail.com Mon Mar 2 14:14:24 2009 From: organismo at gmail.com (glerm soares) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 10:14:24 -0300 Subject: [PD] SQLite3DBv0.03 In-Reply-To: <20090302095622.GA1084@fliwatut.scifi> References: <370dda580903011110o59ff4f33mc04da4568953d8b1@mail.gmail.com> <20090302095622.GA1084@fliwatut.scifi> Message-ID: <9693578e0903020514x4808c2f2nf1720b4f39d79cf7@mail.gmail.com> 2009/3/2 Frank Barknecht > Hallo, > Mike McGonagle hat gesagt: // Mike McGonagle wrote: > > > Also, the 'makefile' only contains a process for making a 'pd_darwin' > > external for the Mac. It should not be difficult to compile for Unix > > or Windows, as it is Ansi-C. Everything should work with Vanilla Pd as > > well. > > Attached is a quickie makefile to compile a pd_linux. Use "make > pd_linux". > hey thanks for that! i will try on linux abra?o glerm -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From reduzierer at yahoo.de Mon Mar 2 14:47:01 2009 From: reduzierer at yahoo.de (Roman Haefeli) Date: Mon, 02 Mar 2009 14:47:01 +0100 Subject: [PD] pd and tcp: what to do against crashes? In-Reply-To: References: <1235905522.7557.39.camel@yoyo2> <1235951524.7549.30.camel@yoyo2> <1235955557.7549.54.camel@yoyo2> Message-ID: <1236001621.7549.76.camel@yoyo2> On Sun, 2009-03-01 at 22:53 -0500, Martin Peach wrote: > Roman Haefeli wrote: > > On Sun, 2009-03-01 at 19:30 -0500, Martin Peach wrote: > >> I think the blocking happens because the > >> connection is gone, not because of the buffer overflowing. > > > > i am not sure, if understand what you mean here. what i experience: when > > i overrun the buffer (by plugging out the ethernet cable to the client), > > the pd process of [tcpserver] is completely blocked after having sent > > $BUFFERSIZE bytes. it stays blocked, until i plug in the cable back > > again. the whole content of the buffer is sent after some seconds and > > the server pd instance responds again. this means, that even if the > > connection is not completely lost, a blocking of pd could occur. > > You can send until the buffer fills up, even if it isn't emptying. I > think it blocks because it only checks for at least one empty space in > the buffer but then sends more than that. exactly. if the next message is bigger than the left free space in the buffer, pd is blocked. i guess, we mean the same thing. > > if the connection to the client is permanently lost, then there is no > > way to make pd responding again, after a buffer overrun occured. > > > >> If the connection is present the buffer will be emptying as fast as the > >> network can drain it, so just pacing the writes should work. Trying to > >> write an infinite amount instantly won't. > > > > i can't follow here as well. it's not about trying to send an infinite > > amount of data in zero time. it's about not knowing the current > > connection condition, and because of that risking a drop-out. since the > > connection condition changes all the time, you cannot implement a > > self-adapting system in pd without knowing the internal buffer status > > (empty or not). so even if you send data with a fixed rate, it still > > could happen, that you trigger the buffer overrun. > > > > > > Well I guess empty and almost full are the same as long as we stick to > single bytes. ah, yes.. > So I made [tcpserver] send the messages one byte at a time. This latest > version should not block, since it adds only one element to the buffer > for each select call that says the buffer is still writeable. can you tell me something about how to use it correctly? i just compiled the newest version and still could prevent it from blocking pd. before the blocking happens, i do _not_ get any message from the new outlet from [tcpserver], such as 'sent 0'. so what happens is still, that i send messages to it until it blocks. is it different on windows? do you mind sending me a windows binary, if it is? is there anything i can do in terms of testing on linux? roman ___________________________________________________________ Telefonate ohne weitere Kosten vom PC zum PC: http://messenger.yahoo.de From ingo at miamiwave.com Mon Mar 2 15:51:36 2009 From: ingo at miamiwave.com (Ingo Scherzinger) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 15:51:36 +0100 Subject: [PD] external for sample loop start and end points? Message-ID: Hi, I am looking for an external that can read the sample loop start and end points of a .wav file. I found [wavinfo] but that doesn't do the trick - no loop info! It would be great if anybody knew anything like that! Thank you, Ingo -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mjmogo at gmail.com Mon Mar 2 18:42:24 2009 From: mjmogo at gmail.com (Mike McGonagle) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 11:42:24 -0600 Subject: [PD] SQLite3DBv0.03 In-Reply-To: <20090302095622.GA1084@fliwatut.scifi> References: <370dda580903011110o59ff4f33mc04da4568953d8b1@mail.gmail.com> <20090302095622.GA1084@fliwatut.scifi> Message-ID: <370dda580903020942g19b42952qbbc1295014031e26@mail.gmail.com> Frank, Thank you very much for the Linux Makefile. While I don't have access to a machine right at the moment, from reading this, it appears that this is set up to link to an SQLite3 LIBRARY file, right? If that is the case, the way that I am doing this on the Mac is to compile the object code of the compiled SQLite code, I am not linking to a library object. I pretty much do that because the Mac uses SQLite for a LOT of system things, and I have heard that there can be some issues with updating the Library object for SQLite on your system, and then the Mac does one of it "auto updates", finds that the SQLite object file is DIFFERENT than the one currently installed, and then will overwrite the NEWER version you just compiled, with the older library object. I don't know if this is a similar situation on Linux. At the same time, is it really necessary to have all the platforms do the same thing? I don't know how something like this might be handled in the Night Build system. Thanks again, I will probably have to wait a day or two before I might be able to try this myself. Mike On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 3:56 AM, Frank Barknecht wrote: > Hallo, > Mike McGonagle hat gesagt: // Mike McGonagle wrote: > >> Also, the 'makefile' only contains a process for making a 'pd_darwin' >> external for the Mac. It should not be difficult to compile for Unix >> or Windows, as it is Ansi-C. Everything should work with Vanilla Pd as >> well. > > Attached is a quickie makefile to compile a pd_linux. Use "make > pd_linux". > > Ciao > -- > ?Frank Barknecht ? ? ? ? ? ?Do You RjDj.me? ? ? ? ? ?_ ______footils.org__ > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > -- W. C. Fields - "I never drink water because of the disgusting things that fish do in it." From fbar at footils.org Mon Mar 2 19:21:29 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 19:21:29 +0100 Subject: [PD] SQLite3DBv0.03 In-Reply-To: <370dda580903020942g19b42952qbbc1295014031e26@mail.gmail.com> References: <370dda580903011110o59ff4f33mc04da4568953d8b1@mail.gmail.com> <20090302095622.GA1084@fliwatut.scifi> <370dda580903020942g19b42952qbbc1295014031e26@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090302182129.GA11646@footils.org> Hallo, Mike McGonagle hat gesagt: // Mike McGonagle wrote: > Thank you very much for the Linux Makefile. While I don't have access > to a machine right at the moment, from reading this, it appears that > this is set up to link to an SQLite3 LIBRARY file, right? If that is > the case, the way that I am doing this on the Mac is to compile the > object code of the compiled SQLite code, I am not linking to a library > object. > > I pretty much do that because the Mac uses SQLite for a LOT of system > things, and I have heard that there can be some issues with updating > the Library object for SQLite on your system, and then the Mac does > one of it "auto updates", finds that the SQLite object file is > DIFFERENT than the one currently installed, and then will overwrite > the NEWER version you just compiled, with the older library object. It's true, my Linux makefile links to the system wide version of sqlite3 and thus requires that and its -dev(el) headers installed. While it can happen that the distribution's package managers install versions that are newer/incompatible to the one you are using with the Pd library, we Linux users don't care too much and just do another "make pd_linux". ;) But my main reason was that I'm not good at writing makefiles at all so I just copied the standard snippet over with as little changes as possible. I only removed the -Werror (there is one warning when compiling which breaks on Linux) and added the library linking with -lsqlite3. Ciao -- Frank From hans.roels at versateladsl.be Mon Mar 2 19:23:42 2009 From: hans.roels at versateladsl.be (Hans Roels) Date: Mon, 02 Mar 2009 19:23:42 +0100 Subject: [PD] strange wave In-Reply-To: References: <140F73C2-09A4-4DB1-B341-6CB0102F15EC@eds.org> <828BA0D7-9A7C-4B37-906C-7C295C23FD15@eds.org> <49AB2C0B.8090205@pspunch.com> <1235956297.7549.56.camel@yoyo2> Message-ID: Hello, Sometimes when I record audio in Pd, a wave file is created that Pd can't open or play. If I try to open this wave file in an other audio program like Audacity, this is also impossible. VLC player does play the file though and when I open this file in Samplitude a message "file does not contain sample data" appears but I can open the file. If I resave it in Samplitude it can be opened in Pd. I guess something is wrong in the headers of the wave file that Pd creates. In attach is a short example of such a 'strange' wave file. I hope that somebody can see what is wrong in this file... There is still something very 'shaky' in the 'writesf~ ' object in Pd, I guess about 25% of the times I try to record something, I have this kind of problem. An other problem that sometimes occurs is that only a file with a name is created but without actual sampledata (and this isn't caused because I don't leave any time between the 'open' and 'start' command for 'writesf'). I haven't succeeded in isolating the exact problem yet but I'm trying... (I think it has something to do with using 'writesf' in an abstraction). I 'm working on Windows XP and this problem occured in Pd 0.40.3 and in 0.42-4. Hans R -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: test9-mono.wav Type: application/octet-stream Size: 260140 bytes Desc: not available URL: From cgclepper at gmail.com Mon Mar 2 19:30:54 2009 From: cgclepper at gmail.com (chris clepper) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 13:30:54 -0500 Subject: [PD] strange wave In-Reply-To: References: <140F73C2-09A4-4DB1-B341-6CB0102F15EC@eds.org> <828BA0D7-9A7C-4B37-906C-7C295C23FD15@eds.org> <49AB2C0B.8090205@pspunch.com> <1235956297.7549.56.camel@yoyo2> Message-ID: The length of that file is zero according to the header as read by SoundHack. On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 1:23 PM, Hans Roels wrote: > Hello, > > Sometimes when I record audio in Pd, a wave file is created that Pd can't > open or play. If I try to open this wave file in an other audio program like > Audacity, this is also impossible. VLC player does play the file though and > when I open this file in Samplitude a message "file does not contain sample > data" appears but I can open the file. If I resave it in Samplitude it can > be opened in Pd. I guess something is wrong in the headers of the wave file > that Pd creates. > In attach is a short example of such a 'strange' wave file. I hope that > somebody can see what is wrong in this file... > There is still something very 'shaky' in the 'writesf~ ' object in Pd, I > guess about 25% of the times I try to record something, I have this kind of > problem. An other problem that sometimes occurs is that only a file with a > name is created but without actual sampledata (and this isn't caused because > I don't leave any time between the 'open' and 'start' command for > 'writesf'). I haven't succeeded in isolating the exact problem yet but I'm > trying... (I think it has something to do with using 'writesf' in an > abstraction). > > I 'm working on Windows XP and this problem occured in Pd 0.40.3 and in > 0.42-4. > > Hans R > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From zmoelnig at iem.at Mon Mar 2 19:32:00 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Mon, 02 Mar 2009 19:32:00 +0100 Subject: [PD] strange wave In-Reply-To: References: <140F73C2-09A4-4DB1-B341-6CB0102F15EC@eds.org> <828BA0D7-9A7C-4B37-906C-7C295C23FD15@eds.org> <49AB2C0B.8090205@pspunch.com> <1235956297.7549.56.camel@yoyo2> Message-ID: <49AC2620.3090300@iem.at> Hans Roels wrote: > Hello, hi. how does this relate to "Arduino/SRF05" to which thread it references? > > Sometimes when I record audio in Pd, a wave file is created that Pd [...] > problem yet but I'm trying... (I think it has something to do with using > 'writesf' in an abstraction). > > I 'm working on Windows XP and this problem occured in Pd 0.40.3 and in > 0.42-4. your problem is most likely related to not properly closing the soundfile. you MUST send a [stop( message to [writesf~] in order to "finalize" the wav (that is: replace the dummy length in the header with the proper one, which is only known at closing time) fgmasdr IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From mjmogo at gmail.com Mon Mar 2 19:36:28 2009 From: mjmogo at gmail.com (Mike McGonagle) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 12:36:28 -0600 Subject: [PD] SQLite3DBv0.03 In-Reply-To: <20090302182129.GA11646@footils.org> References: <370dda580903011110o59ff4f33mc04da4568953d8b1@mail.gmail.com> <20090302095622.GA1084@fliwatut.scifi> <370dda580903020942g19b42952qbbc1295014031e26@mail.gmail.com> <20090302182129.GA11646@footils.org> Message-ID: <370dda580903021036l9cc5faaje99ca3b5dd8d1e28@mail.gmail.com> So, then do you think it would be better to link up to the system version? Or should I have it statically compile everything together into the external? While I don't know how large it is on Linux, but the Mac external (with the SQLite Amalgamated compile into the external) is about 660K. I have had the discussion with many people who "advocate" Linux about how "user friendly" it really is, and something tells me that this 'and just do another "make pd_linux"' might not be what we want for NON-Technical users. I mean, so far there appears to be a few people who are interested in using this, but because there is no make file, they have not been able to try this. Mike On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 12:21 PM, Frank Barknecht wrote: > Hallo, > Mike McGonagle hat gesagt: // Mike McGonagle wrote: > >> Thank you very much for the Linux Makefile. While I don't have access >> to a machine right at the moment, from reading this, it appears that >> this is set up to link to an SQLite3 LIBRARY file, right? If that is >> the case, the way that I am doing this on the Mac is to compile the >> object code of the compiled SQLite code, I am not linking to a library >> object. >> >> I pretty much do that because the Mac uses SQLite for a LOT of system >> things, and I have heard that there can be some issues with updating >> the Library object for SQLite on your system, and then the Mac does >> one of it "auto updates", finds that the SQLite object file is >> DIFFERENT than the one currently installed, and then will overwrite >> the NEWER version you just compiled, with the older library object. > > It's true, my Linux makefile links to the system wide version of sqlite3 > and thus requires that and its -dev(el) headers installed. While it can > happen that the distribution's package managers install versions that > are newer/incompatible to the one you are using with the Pd library, we > Linux users don't care too much and just do another "make pd_linux". ;) > > But my main reason was that I'm not good at writing makefiles at all so > I just copied the standard snippet over with as little changes as > possible. I only removed the -Werror (there is one warning when > compiling which breaks on Linux) and added the library linking with > -lsqlite3. > > Ciao > -- > Frank > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -- W. C. Fields - "I never drink water because of the disgusting things that fish do in it." From hans.roels at versateladsl.be Mon Mar 2 19:43:14 2009 From: hans.roels at versateladsl.be (Hans Roels) Date: Mon, 02 Mar 2009 19:43:14 +0100 Subject: [PD] strange wave In-Reply-To: <49AC2620.3090300@iem.at> References: <140F73C2-09A4-4DB1-B341-6CB0102F15EC@eds.org> <828BA0D7-9A7C-4B37-906C-7C295C23FD15@eds.org> <49AB2C0B.8090205@pspunch.com> <1235956297.7549.56.camel@yoyo2> <49AC2620.3090300@iem.at> Message-ID: At 19:32 2/03/2009, you wrote: >Hans Roels wrote: >>Hello, > >hi. > >how does this relate to "Arduino/SRF05" to which thread it references? > >>Sometimes when I record audio in Pd, a wave file is created that Pd >[...] >>problem yet but I'm trying... (I think it has something to do with >>using 'writesf' in an abstraction). >>I 'm working on Windows XP and this problem occured in Pd 0.40.3 >>and in 0.42-4. > > >your problem is most likely related to not properly closing the >soundfile. you MUST send a [stop( message to [writesf~] in order to >"finalize" the wav (that is: replace the dummy length in the header >with the proper one, which is only known at closing time) I did send a stop message to writesf~, I recorded a sound 10 times with exactly the same abstraction and 4 files had this problem... (the other 6 files were OK). >fgmasdr >IOhannes > From noise.now at gmail.com Mon Mar 2 22:02:09 2009 From: noise.now at gmail.com (Lao Yu) Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2009 05:02:09 +0800 Subject: [PD] OT: job offer with requested pd programming skills Message-ID: <1EC7DF05-C2EF-4C7E-8EBD-838DE1A3567A@gmail.com> Hi, I just came across the website of 'reactable systems' in Spain - they're looking for a software programmer who has among others C++ and pd programming skills http://www.reactable.com/join.html Interesting that they require someone with pd skills - it makes one think that their system is if not pd based at least prototyped in pd. Best Jurgen From crinimal at gmx.net Mon Mar 2 22:29:58 2009 From: crinimal at gmx.net (Martin Schied) Date: Mon, 02 Mar 2009 22:29:58 +0100 Subject: [PD] Model.pd helppatch [was: call for help: help patch fixing] In-Reply-To: <49ABA0A2.80107@iem.at> References: <20090228103125.QGL2M.169260.imail@eastrmwml46> <49AA536A.4060703@iem.at> <49AABF72.5090007@gmx.net> <49ABA0A2.80107@iem.at> Message-ID: <49AC4FD6.5020205@gmx.net> hi, IOhannes > > i think it could be related to: > - your version of Gem (as cyrille suggested) > - the model you are loading. > - your gfx-card/ / openGL-driver > > let's try to rule out #1 and #2. OK, now I have: - installed new pd extended version (Pd version 0.41-4extended-20090301) from autobuilds - tried again differend .obj, (venus.obj and also any simple object I made) no luck so far. still have to create gemwin before loading. I didn't change my graphics card's driver (using x.org "radeon" driver), if you have suggestions which settings might be responsible I'll try them. It's a pretty old notebook on board chip, lspci says: ATI Radeon Mobility M7 LW [Radeon Mobility 7500] cheers Martin From cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr Mon Mar 2 23:23:54 2009 From: cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr (cyrille henry) Date: Mon, 02 Mar 2009 23:23:54 +0100 Subject: [PD] Model.pd helppatch [was: call for help: help patch fixing] In-Reply-To: <49AC4FD6.5020205@gmx.net> References: <20090228103125.QGL2M.169260.imail@eastrmwml46> <49AA536A.4060703@iem.at> <49AABF72.5090007@gmx.net> <49ABA0A2.80107@iem.at> <49AC4FD6.5020205@gmx.net> Message-ID: <49AC5C7A.5000404@la-kitchen.fr> hello, ATI radeo on linux. i bet it's the problem. Cyrille Martin Schied a ?crit : > hi, IOhannes > >> i think it could be related to: >> - your version of Gem (as cyrille suggested) >> - the model you are loading. >> - your gfx-card/ / openGL-driver >> >> let's try to rule out #1 and #2. > > OK, > now I have: > > - installed new pd extended version (Pd version 0.41-4extended-20090301) > from autobuilds > - tried again differend .obj, (venus.obj and also any simple object I made) > > no luck so far. still have to create gemwin before loading. > > I didn't change my graphics card's driver (using x.org "radeon" driver), > if you have suggestions which settings might be responsible I'll try > them. It's a pretty old notebook on board chip, lspci says: ATI Radeon > Mobility M7 LW [Radeon Mobility 7500] > > cheers > Martin > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > From fbar at footils.org Mon Mar 2 23:47:06 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 23:47:06 +0100 Subject: [PD] OT: job offer with requested pd programming skills In-Reply-To: <1EC7DF05-C2EF-4C7E-8EBD-838DE1A3567A@gmail.com> References: <1EC7DF05-C2EF-4C7E-8EBD-838DE1A3567A@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090302224706.GA12118@footils.org> Hallo, Lao Yu hat gesagt: // Lao Yu wrote: > http://www.reactable.com/join.html > > Interesting that they require someone with pd skills - it makes one > think that their system is if not pd based at least prototyped in pd. The early prototype of the reactable was presented at the first Pd convention in Graz in 2004 and was implemented in Pd. AFAIK it still uses Pd internally. Ciao -- Frank From martin.peach at sympatico.ca Tue Mar 3 00:51:17 2009 From: martin.peach at sympatico.ca (Martin Peach) Date: Mon, 02 Mar 2009 18:51:17 -0500 Subject: [PD] pd and tcp: what to do against crashes? In-Reply-To: <1236001621.7549.76.camel@yoyo2> References: <1235905522.7557.39.camel@yoyo2> <1235951524.7549.30.camel@yoyo2> <1235955557.7549.54.camel@yoyo2> <1236001621.7549.76.camel@yoyo2> Message-ID: Roman Haefeli wrote: > On Sun, 2009-03-01 at 22:53 -0500, Martin Peach wrote: >> So I made [tcpserver] send the messages one byte at a time. This latest >> version should not block, since it adds only one element to the buffer >> for each select call that says the buffer is still writeable. > > can you tell me something about how to use it correctly? i just compiled > the newest version and still could prevent it from blocking pd. before > the blocking happens, i do _not_ get any message from the new outlet > from [tcpserver], such as 'sent 0'. so what happens is still, that i > send messages to it until it blocks. is it different on windows? do you > mind sending me a windows binary, if it is? > is there anything i can do in terms of testing on linux? > Sorry, there was a bug in it so it was staying in the send loop even though it couldn't send. I fixed it in the latest svn. When I use it, if I set the buffer size to 10 I can send 4 messages of 3 bytes after unpluggng the cable, but the last 'sent' says that only 2 bytes were transmitted. Subsequent attempts give 0. After a few seconds I also get a message saying the connection was terminated. It should work identically on linux. Martin From mmoserbooth at gmail.com Tue Mar 3 03:01:46 2009 From: mmoserbooth at gmail.com (Mike Moser-Booth) Date: Mon, 02 Mar 2009 21:01:46 -0500 Subject: [PD] strange wave In-Reply-To: References: <140F73C2-09A4-4DB1-B341-6CB0102F15EC@eds.org> <828BA0D7-9A7C-4B37-906C-7C295C23FD15@eds.org> <49AB2C0B.8090205@pspunch.com> <1235956297.7549.56.camel@yoyo2> Message-ID: <49AC8F8A.1080500@gmail.com> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hans at eds.org Tue Mar 3 01:08:04 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 19:08:04 -0500 Subject: [PD] pd on Ubuntu 64bit? In-Reply-To: <1235774998.22590.1.camel@danoT500> References: <1235258932.6126.5.camel@danomatika> <49A15921.7090400@iem.at> <20090222153051.GB4887@alien.mur.at> <49A171B3.7010902@iem.at> <49A17C55.5080809@iem.at> <1235454433.2533.11.camel@danomatika> <49A38DBC.1060400@alum.mit.edu> <1235455515.9242.1.camel@danomatika> <1235774998.22590.1.camel@danoT500> Message-ID: On Feb 27, 2009, at 5:49 PM, danomatika wrote: > On Tue, 2009-02-24 at 19:51 -0500, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >> >> On Feb 24, 2009, at 1:05 AM, danomatika wrote: >> >>> On Tue, 2009-02-24 at 00:03 -0600, John Harrison wrote: >>>> >>>> danomatika wrote: >>>> > >>>> > I made a 64bit build of pd-extended using the pd core (0.41 I >>>> believe) >>>> > from the pd-extended svn and it has this table bug. It seems >>>> to only >>>> > access half of the table, at least in the C08 and C09 audio >>>> example >>>> > patches. They work fine in my build using pd-vanilla 0.42.4. >>>> Wow I am surprised to hear that. I remember seeing this table bug >>>> in >>>> 0.40 but thought it disappeared on my 64 bit ubuntu Hardy build >>>> of 0.41. >>> >From reading some of the commit lines, it seems not all changes >>> in 0.41 have been merged into pd-extended yet. >> >> >> There is now pd-0.41.4 extended, you need to work from that branch, >> or get the code from rsync via the auto-build server. >> >> >> http://pure-data.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/pure-data/branches/pd-extended/0.41/ >> >> >> Right now, only 'pd' is in the branch, the nightly builds use >> everything else from trunk. > > I just built that version ... but still bad tables. This is not so > fun as the version I made with 0.42 as the core cannot seem to find > expr and expr~ ... If that version had table issues, then please submit a bug report and example patch to the bug tracker. 0.41.4 should work fine on 64-bit. I am cc'ing the list since you'll have better luck there. I don't have a 64-bit machine, and I don't use jack a lot. .hc > > > --- > Dan Wilcox > danomatika.com > robotcowboy.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Looking at things from a more basic level, you can come up with a more direct solution... It may sound small in theory, but it in practice, it can change entire economies. - Amy Smith -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From matju at artengine.ca Tue Mar 3 05:13:01 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 23:13:01 -0500 (EST) Subject: [PD] [arduino] object & analog inputs In-Reply-To: <9693578e0902280840n6a8a6eb8j691210c13bc03353@mail.gmail.com> References: <9693578e0902131240y79f39e14o4f965f52879c1a0@mail.gmail.com> <9693578e0902280840n6a8a6eb8j691210c13bc03353@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Sat, 28 Feb 2009, glerm soares wrote: > I did it in with: > #X obj 38 -73 delta; > #X obj 37 -50 abs; > #X obj 141 -72 sel 1; > is that what you meant? No, it only outputs when there is a large enough difference to the previous input that was not exactly the same. What I mean is to only output when there is a large enough difference to the previous output. Btw, what's [delta] ? I suppose you can do it with just a [t f f] and a [-] ? What I mean is something like this: #N canvas 497 97 450 300 10; #X obj 9 8 inlet; #X obj 9 46 -; #X obj 9 65 abs; #X obj 9 84 moses \$1; #X obj 60 9 inlet; #X obj 9 27 t f f; #X obj 80 132 f; #X obj 80 113 b; #X obj 80 151 outlet; #X connect 0 0 5 0; #X connect 1 0 2 0; #X connect 2 0 3 0; #X connect 3 1 7 0; #X connect 4 0 3 1; #X connect 5 0 1 0; #X connect 5 1 6 1; #X connect 6 0 8 0; #X connect 6 0 1 1; #X connect 7 0 6 0; _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From hans at eds.org Tue Mar 3 05:55:30 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 23:55:30 -0500 Subject: [PD] Arduino/SRF05 In-Reply-To: References: <140F73C2-09A4-4DB1-B341-6CB0102F15EC@eds.org> <828BA0D7-9A7C-4B37-906C-7C295C23FD15@eds.org> <49AB2C0B.8090205@pspunch.com> <1235956297.7549.56.camel@yoyo2> Message-ID: <9C2931A7-A826-4517-B741-3D58BE740610@eds.org> Instead of using Serial.print() in Arduino, use Firmata. Check out the Library-Firmata examples in Arduino. The "Firmata" object in Arduino replaces the Serial object and then automatically speaks the Firmata protocol, so that you can then use [arduino] in Pd. .hc On Mar 1, 2009, at 8:21 PM, Dafydd Hughes wrote: > Thanks. I'll look into that tomorrow. In the meantime, I have it > working with decimal well enough. > > Thanks everybody for the help! > > cheers > dafydd > > On Sun, Mar 1, 2009 at 8:11 PM, Roman Haefeli > wrote: >> On Sun, 2009-03-01 at 19:54 -0500, Dafydd Hughes wrote: >>> Hi David >>> >>> I'm sure it's easier than I'm making it. >>> >>> Really, I just need to turn the data from the arduino into usable >>> floats. Right now it's coming in as ascii characters and I'm >>> building >>> lists between carriage returns. Hopefully I can now turn those lists >>> into numbers without too much trouble. Should I maybe be doing this >>> with binary numbers? Would that be easier? >> >> i'd guess so. you could use [mapping/debytemask] in order to >> convert the >> byte into its single bits. then parsing of the data you want should >> be >> really easy. >> >> roman >> >> >> >> >> >> ___________________________________________________________ >> Der fr?he Vogel f?ngt den Wurm. Hier gelangen Sie zum neuen Yahoo! >> Mail: http://mail.yahoo.de >> >> > > > > -- > www.sideshowmedia.ca > skype: chickeninthegrass > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Access to computers should be unlimited and total. - the hacker ethic From hans at eds.org Tue Mar 3 05:59:01 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 23:59:01 -0500 Subject: [PD] SQLite3DBv0.03 In-Reply-To: <370dda580903021036l9cc5faaje99ca3b5dd8d1e28@mail.gmail.com> References: <370dda580903011110o59ff4f33mc04da4568953d8b1@mail.gmail.com> <20090302095622.GA1084@fliwatut.scifi> <370dda580903020942g19b42952qbbc1295014031e26@mail.gmail.com> <20090302182129.GA11646@footils.org> <370dda580903021036l9cc5faaje99ca3b5dd8d1e28@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4B46AB10-37FE-4362-BC69-DEB60DD0533C@eds.org> You should dynamically link to the libsqlite in the OS. Maybe for Windows it would need to be statically linked. .hc On Mar 2, 2009, at 1:36 PM, Mike McGonagle wrote: > So, then do you think it would be better to link up to the system > version? Or should I have it statically compile everything together > into the external? While I don't know how large it is on Linux, but > the Mac external (with the SQLite Amalgamated compile into the > external) is about 660K. > > I have had the discussion with many people who "advocate" Linux about > how "user friendly" it really is, and something tells me that this > 'and just do another "make pd_linux"' might not be what we want for > NON-Technical users. I mean, so far there appears to be a few people > who are interested in using this, but because there is no make file, > they have not been able to try this. > > Mike > > On Mon, Mar 2, 2009 at 12:21 PM, Frank Barknecht > wrote: >> Hallo, >> Mike McGonagle hat gesagt: // Mike McGonagle wrote: >> >>> Thank you very much for the Linux Makefile. While I don't have >>> access >>> to a machine right at the moment, from reading this, it appears that >>> this is set up to link to an SQLite3 LIBRARY file, right? If that is >>> the case, the way that I am doing this on the Mac is to compile the >>> object code of the compiled SQLite code, I am not linking to a >>> library >>> object. >>> >>> I pretty much do that because the Mac uses SQLite for a LOT of >>> system >>> things, and I have heard that there can be some issues with updating >>> the Library object for SQLite on your system, and then the Mac does >>> one of it "auto updates", finds that the SQLite object file is >>> DIFFERENT than the one currently installed, and then will overwrite >>> the NEWER version you just compiled, with the older library object. >> >> It's true, my Linux makefile links to the system wide version of >> sqlite3 >> and thus requires that and its -dev(el) headers installed. While it >> can >> happen that the distribution's package managers install versions that >> are newer/incompatible to the one you are using with the Pd >> library, we >> Linux users don't care too much and just do another "make >> pd_linux". ;) >> >> But my main reason was that I'm not good at writing makefiles at >> all so >> I just copied the standard snippet over with as little changes as >> possible. I only removed the -Werror (there is one warning when >> compiling which breaks on Linux) and added the library linking with >> -lsqlite3. >> >> Ciao >> -- >> Frank >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> > > > > -- > > W. C. Fields - "I never drink water because of the disgusting things > that fish do in it." > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- If you are not part of the solution, you are part of the problem. From brandt at subnet.at Tue Mar 3 07:50:58 2009 From: brandt at subnet.at (brandt at subnet.at) Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2009 07:50:58 +0100 (CET) Subject: [PD] Pd seriell printers Message-ID: <56848.81.223.29.242.1236063058.squirrel@webmail.*> Hello all Does anybody Know how to control a dot matrix printer troughout the seriell port within OD? Thank you in advanve markus From fbar at footils.org Tue Mar 3 08:19:03 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2009 08:19:03 +0100 Subject: [PD] SQLite3DBv0.03 In-Reply-To: <370dda580903021036l9cc5faaje99ca3b5dd8d1e28@mail.gmail.com> References: <370dda580903011110o59ff4f33mc04da4568953d8b1@mail.gmail.com> <20090302095622.GA1084@fliwatut.scifi> <370dda580903020942g19b42952qbbc1295014031e26@mail.gmail.com> <20090302182129.GA11646@footils.org> <370dda580903021036l9cc5faaje99ca3b5dd8d1e28@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090303071903.GB21720@fliwatut.scifi> Hallo, Mike McGonagle hat gesagt: // Mike McGonagle wrote: > I have had the discussion with many people who "advocate" Linux about > how "user friendly" it really is, and something tells me that this > 'and just do another "make pd_linux"' might not be what we want for > NON-Technical users. Well, usually you don't need to do it. But *if* something goes wrong, "make" to Linux users is what "reboot, reinstall app, reinstall Windows" is to Windows users. And if OS-X manages to update sqlite in a way that breaks simple objects using it (except for major version changes) than that's not very friendly to tech- and non-tech users. I think, if you want to distribute general purppose binaries from your site or pd.info, then linking statically is fine for sqlite (and things like pdlua). But people who download the source and compile it on their own can make use of the system wide libraries, so the default in the Makefile should be dynamic linking IMO. Ciao -- Frank Barknecht Do You RjDj.me? _ ______footils.org__ From algoritmia at labormedia.cl Tue Mar 3 00:39:17 2009 From: algoritmia at labormedia.cl (Correa Diego) Date: Mon, 2 Mar 2009 20:39:17 -0300 Subject: [PD] [PD-announce] Taller de Algoritmia Marzo 2009 Message-ID: <6c92874b0903021539q35142f6cn1c36657736e5d21e@mail.gmail.com> Taller de Algoritmia Inform?tica Aplicada a las Artes. T?cnicas en programaci?n audiovisual con Pure Data y MaxMSP*. Resumen: La orientaci?n del taller es la integraci?n de conocimientos pr?cticos de programaci?n visual para la formulaci?n de micro-proyectos audiovisuales/ac?sticos/musicales haciendo uso de la herramienta Pure Data (Pd)*. Durante cuatro sesiones se tratar?n de forma representativa y pr?ctica los temas de instalaci?n, uso y direcci?n de la herramienta Pd al control l?gico de m?todos b?sicos en audio y video. Al integrar los m?todos, los participantes deber?n imaginar un cauce de acci?n con la interfaz l?gica de Pd, para aplicar y formular alternativas en torno a las formas disponibles para la realizaci?n concreta en base a estructura, funci?n y experiencia ac?stico/visual. Todo esto se resumir? en una obra que ser? debatida en grupo. - Fecha: 9, 16, 23 y 30 de marzo. - Horario: 16:00 a 17:30 hrs. - Lugar: d?j? ??. Valenzuela Castillo 1269-B, Providencia, Santiago. - Informaci?n e Inscripciones: al correo algoritmia at labormedia.cl o al tel?fono (562) 880 54 76. http://www.labormedia.cl/algoritmia Sobre el expositor gu?a: diego correa t. ha promovido una profunda curiosidad por las plataformas que dan pie a proyectos relacionados con la concepci?n y experimentaci?n tanto en m?sica y arte como en matem?ticas. desde los inicios en 2003 del trabajo en modelado de agentes con programaci?n convexa, mientras era alumno de econom?a, su inter?s por el uso de herramientas para el modelado matem?tico se ha desarrollado. en 2004 en el Centro de M?sica y Tecnolog?a (CMT), actual Laboratorio Arcis de Inform?tica Musical (LAIM), en santiago de chile, se instruy? para el aprendizaje por medio de software libre en interpretaci?n musical y multimedial desarrollado en el instituto de investigaci?n y coordinaci?n ac?stica/musical (IRCAM) de francia. entre el 2006 y el 2008 desempe?? labores de producci?n e investigaci?n para el Laboratorio de Medios de la Universidad Cat?lica de Chile (MDLB UC), fundado por el neurobi?logo y artista de medios de la Universidad de Nueva York (NYU), Jos? Miguel Tagle. desde entonces ha estado desarrollando modelos de adaptaci?n de herramientas digitales al uso en ?reas no solo matem?ticas y ac?stico/musicales, sino tambi?n en econom?a, cibern?tica, inteligencia artificial, neurociencia te?rica y teor?a de la informaci?n. ORGANIZA: LABORMEDIA -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Talleres_de_Algoritmia_blog.png Type: image/png Size: 268147 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ Pd-announce mailing list Pd-announce at iem.at http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-announce From shima at pspunch.com Tue Mar 3 10:44:31 2009 From: shima at pspunch.com (PSPunch) Date: Tue, 03 Mar 2009 18:44:31 +0900 Subject: [PD] pd and tcp: what to do against crashes? In-Reply-To: <1235950240.7549.23.camel@yoyo2> References: <1235905522.7557.39.camel@yoyo2> <1235950240.7549.23.camel@yoyo2> Message-ID: <49ACFBFF.2070204@pspunch.com> > i really wonder, how other projects handle that. i mean, if several > people download a big file from apache, then a disappearing client > doesn't interfere with the other clients. i guess, in apache it is > solved by using threads. when using threads, one single thread doesn't > necessarily need to know about the buffer state, because it could be > blocked without harm to the other apache children. so it can try to send > as much data as possible. > is using threads the _only_ solution to deal with that problem? i guess, > it would overcomplicate the programming of [tcpserver], but you sure > know better... >From my understanding, the alternative to using multiple threads/processes would be to set the socket to "non-blocking" and implement a Pd object that buffers the messages requested to be sent. Then attempts to retry sending what the OS once rejected should be made. This will also involve giving the object a timer to call it a fault and close the socket if no bytes seemed to have traveled over a certain period of time. This probably calls for some decision making in the design of the Pd object, such as how frequently to retry sending the bytes to the socket. I was thinking a [bang] may be flexible. Whether it be triggered by [metro] or [bang~], the one designing the patch would have the most control over how to deal with the results of the transfer. I found this article helpful to gain basic understanding on which layer of the OS or library is responsible for the actions happening beneath the covers. http://www.amk.ca/python/howto/sockets/ I have yet to learn and may be wrong. Please excuse me if this has already been done. -- David Shimamoto From hans.roels at versateladsl.be Tue Mar 3 12:17:58 2009 From: hans.roels at versateladsl.be (Hans Roels) Date: Tue, 03 Mar 2009 12:17:58 +0100 Subject: [PD] strange wave In-Reply-To: <49AC2620.3090300@iem.at> References: <140F73C2-09A4-4DB1-B341-6CB0102F15EC@eds.org> <828BA0D7-9A7C-4B37-906C-7C295C23FD15@eds.org> <49AB2C0B.8090205@pspunch.com> <1235956297.7549.56.camel@yoyo2> <49AC2620.3090300@iem.at> Message-ID: I think/hope that I managed to isolate the problem with writesf~ and readsf~. There are two patches in attach that print out every step that you take so one can't forget to click 'open' for example, it also measures the time between the 'open' and 'start' command. Copy these 2 patches in the same folder. Try this test a few times: 1. start Pd 2. open main.pd 3. create abstraction 'rec' in main.pd (test writesf~) 4. open a file (comment 1 in 'rec') 5. start recording (comment 2 in 'rec') 6. stop the recording (comment 3 in 'rec') 7. send 'print' to writesf~ (comment 4 in 'rec') (test readsf~) 8. open a file (comment 5 in 'rec') 9. play a file (comment 6 in 'rec') 10. answer question (comment 7 in 'rec') 11. send 'print' to readsf~ (comment 8 in 'rec') 12.close Pd & don't save any changes I tried this 10 times on Windows XP (Pd 0-42-4) and 10 times in Mac Os X 10.3.9 (Pd 0-40-2) and readsf~ and writesf~ never worked and Pd only created a wav file with the right name but without sample data. Be sure to do exactly the required steps and nothing more. If for example you open 'test audio and midi' in de Media menu (or you delete and restore an audio cable within the abstraction 'rec') before step 12, the opened file will start playing, even if it was 30 seconds ago that you opened and tried to play the sound file. If you try recording (step 4 - 7) everything will work now n this case. This is what Pd prints (print commands in abstraction 'rec') when readsf and writesf don't work: print: open C:/Program Files/pd042-4/bin/aa.wav print: start time_beween_open_and_start: 2774.78 print: stop time_beween_start_and_stop: 3297.23 state 0 fifo head 0 fifo tail 0 fifo size 262144 fd -1 eof 0 print: open C:/Documents and Settings/Bureaublad/pianob7.wav print: 1 time_beween_open_and_start: 3668.75 readsf_sound?: no state 2 fifo head 70496 fifo tail 0 fifo size 262144 fd -1 eof 1 This what Pd prints when writesf and readsf do work after 'test audio and midi' was opened after step 11 print: open /elektromuziek/extra.wav print: start time_beween_open_and_start: 1364.17 print: stop time_beween_start_and_stop: 1834.38 state 0 fifo head 161792 fifo tail 161792 fifo size 262144 fd -1 eof 0 print: open /elektromuziek/PIANOB7.WAV print: 1 time_beween_open_and_start: 1428.03 readsf_sound?: yes state 0 fifo head 70496 fifo tail 70400 fifo size 262144 fd -1 eof 1 I hope someone can solve this problem... Hans r At 19:32 2/03/2009, IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: >Hans Roels wrote: >>Hello, > >hi. > >how does this relate to "Arduino/SRF05" to which thread it references? > >>Sometimes when I record audio in Pd, a wave file is created that Pd >[...] >>problem yet but I'm trying... (I think it has something to do with >>using 'writesf' in an abstraction). >>I 'm working on Windows XP and this problem occured in Pd 0.40.3 >>and in 0.42-4. > > >your problem is most likely related to not properly closing the >soundfile. you MUST send a [stop( message to [writesf~] in order to >"finalize" the wav (that is: replace the dummy length in the header >with the proper one, which is only known at closing time) > >fgmasdr >IOhannes > > -------------- next part -------------- #N canvas 719 338 458 308 12; #X msg 31 232 \; pd dsp 1; #X obj 32 198 loadbang; #X connect 1 0 0 0; -------------- next part -------------- #N canvas 498 19 630 639 12; #X msg 409 45 print; #X msg 176 58 start; #X msg 283 67 stop; #X obj 130 136 osc~ 440; #X msg 51 88 open \$1.wav; #X obj 52 31 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1; #X obj 53 60 savepanel; #X text 53 7 1; #X text 171 11 2; #X obj 41 438 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1; #X obj 40 467 openpanel; #X msg 140 436 1; #X obj 98 581 dac~; #X obj 132 165 *~ 0.1; #X msg 40 495 open \$1; #X obj 176 33 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1; #X obj 281 43 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1; #X text 281 12 3; #X obj 143 216 writesf~ 1; #X obj 458 170 print; #X obj 102 547 readsf~ 1; #X obj 112 315 timer; #X obj 112 339 print time_beween_open_and_start; #X obj 343 269 print time_beween_start_and_stop; #X obj 78 290 bang; #X obj 175 290 bang; #X obj 386 235 timer; #X obj 368 206 bang; #X obj 417 207 bang; #X text 424 19 4; #X msg 206 461 yes; #X msg 300 464 no; #X obj 250 530 print readsf_sound?; #X msg 443 448 print; #X text 250 464 or; #X obj 34 606 print; #X text 205 435 did you hear sound?; #X text 42 404 5; #X text 144 405 6; #X text 260 408 7; #X text 441 411 8; #X obj 182 615 timer; #X obj 182 639 print time_beween_open_and_start; #X obj 148 590 bang; #X obj 245 590 bang; #X connect 0 0 18 0; #X connect 1 0 18 0; #X connect 1 0 19 0; #X connect 1 0 25 0; #X connect 1 0 27 0; #X connect 2 0 18 0; #X connect 2 0 19 0; #X connect 2 0 28 0; #X connect 3 0 13 0; #X connect 4 0 18 0; #X connect 4 0 19 0; #X connect 4 0 24 0; #X connect 5 0 6 0; #X connect 6 0 4 0; #X connect 9 0 10 0; #X connect 10 0 14 0; #X connect 11 0 20 0; #X connect 11 0 35 0; #X connect 11 0 44 0; #X connect 13 0 18 0; #X connect 14 0 20 0; #X connect 14 0 35 0; #X connect 14 0 43 0; #X connect 15 0 1 0; #X connect 16 0 2 0; #X connect 20 0 12 0; #X connect 20 0 12 1; #X connect 21 0 22 0; #X connect 24 0 21 0; #X connect 25 0 21 1; #X connect 26 0 23 0; #X connect 27 0 26 0; #X connect 28 0 26 1; #X connect 30 0 32 0; #X connect 31 0 32 0; #X connect 33 0 20 0; #X connect 41 0 42 0; #X connect 43 0 41 0; #X connect 44 0 41 1; From zmoelnig at iem.at Tue Mar 3 12:40:33 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Tue, 03 Mar 2009 12:40:33 +0100 Subject: [PD] strange wave In-Reply-To: <49AC2620.3090300@iem.at> References: <140F73C2-09A4-4DB1-B341-6CB0102F15EC@eds.org> <828BA0D7-9A7C-4B37-906C-7C295C23FD15@eds.org> <49AB2C0B.8090205@pspunch.com> <1235956297.7549.56.camel@yoyo2> <49AC2620.3090300@iem.at> Message-ID: <49AD1731.4070108@iem.at> Hans Roels wrote: > I think/hope that I managed to isolate the problem with writesf~ and > readsf~. There are two patches in attach that print out every step that > you take so one can't forget to click 'open' for example, it also > measures the time between the 'open' and 'start' command. Copy these 2 > patches in the same folder. > the answer is simple: there is a (known) bug in Pd that does not re-start the dsp-graph in some situations when live-patching. i think there is at least 1 bug-report in the sf bug-tracker. so what happens here is: after you have started the dsp you create [rec] but for whatever reasons, the dsp-graph is not updated and thus your [writesf~] is not working at all. you can test this by: adding [env~] plust floatatom to [osc~] in your [rec] patch. save it. then re-start Pd, open main.pd, create [rec], open it up and lo-and-behold, the numberbox might still show 0 (and is not updated by [env~]) workaround: manually restart the dsp after you have dynamically created an object: [loadbang]->[; pd dsp 0; pd dsp 1( fgnmasdr IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From padawan12 at obiwannabe.co.uk Tue Mar 3 12:50:34 2009 From: padawan12 at obiwannabe.co.uk (Andy Farnell) Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2009 11:50:34 +0000 Subject: [PD] strange wave In-Reply-To: References: <140F73C2-09A4-4DB1-B341-6CB0102F15EC@eds.org> <828BA0D7-9A7C-4B37-906C-7C295C23FD15@eds.org> <49AB2C0B.8090205@pspunch.com> <1235956297.7549.56.camel@yoyo2> <49AC2620.3090300@iem.at> Message-ID: <20090303115034.4e7a8e3c.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> Your debug approach is commendable Hans. Notice that the EOF is different. It's not a well formed file unless eof works. The problem, as stated by another poster, is that the file appears zero length. Mike The errors are caused by bad message ordering in the patch. I have highlighted where they are, and suggested some corrections (use triggers) Please be thoughtful of posting in the right thread (It's okay to start a new one) a. On Tue, 03 Mar 2009 12:17:58 +0100 Hans Roels wrote: > I think/hope that I managed to isolate the problem with writesf~ and > readsf~. There are two patches in attach that print out every step > that you take so one can't forget to click 'open' for example, it > also measures the time between the 'open' and 'start' command. Copy > these 2 patches in the same folder. > > Try this test a few times: > > 1. start Pd > 2. open main.pd > 3. create abstraction 'rec' in main.pd > (test writesf~) > 4. open a file (comment 1 in 'rec') > 5. start recording (comment 2 in 'rec') > 6. stop the recording (comment 3 in 'rec') > 7. send 'print' to writesf~ (comment 4 in 'rec') > (test readsf~) > 8. open a file (comment 5 in 'rec') > 9. play a file (comment 6 in 'rec') > 10. answer question (comment 7 in 'rec') > 11. send 'print' to readsf~ (comment 8 in 'rec') > 12.close Pd & don't save any changes > > I tried this 10 times on Windows XP (Pd 0-42-4) and 10 times in Mac > Os X 10.3.9 (Pd 0-40-2) and readsf~ and writesf~ never worked and Pd > only created a wav file with the right name but without sample data. > Be sure to do exactly the required steps and nothing more. If for > example you open 'test audio and midi' in de Media menu (or you > delete and restore an audio cable within the abstraction 'rec') > before step 12, the opened file will start playing, even if it was 30 > seconds ago that you opened and tried to play the sound file. If you > try recording (step 4 - 7) everything will work now n this case. > > This is what Pd prints (print commands in abstraction 'rec') when > readsf and writesf don't work: > > print: open C:/Program Files/pd042-4/bin/aa.wav > print: start > time_beween_open_and_start: 2774.78 > print: stop > time_beween_start_and_stop: 3297.23 > state 0 > fifo head 0 > fifo tail 0 > fifo size 262144 > fd -1 > eof 0 > print: open C:/Documents and Settings/Bureaublad/pianob7.wav > print: 1 > time_beween_open_and_start: 3668.75 > readsf_sound?: no > state 2 > fifo head 70496 > fifo tail 0 > fifo size 262144 > fd -1 > eof 1 > > This what Pd prints when writesf and readsf do work after 'test audio > and midi' was opened after step 11 > print: open /elektromuziek/extra.wav > print: start > time_beween_open_and_start: 1364.17 > print: stop > time_beween_start_and_stop: 1834.38 > state 0 > fifo head 161792 > fifo tail 161792 > fifo size 262144 > fd -1 > eof 0 > print: open /elektromuziek/PIANOB7.WAV > print: 1 > time_beween_open_and_start: 1428.03 > readsf_sound?: yes > state 0 > fifo head 70496 > fifo tail 70400 > fifo size 262144 > fd -1 > eof 1 > > I hope someone can solve this problem... > > Hans r > > At 19:32 2/03/2009, IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: > >Hans Roels wrote: > >>Hello, > > > >hi. > > > >how does this relate to "Arduino/SRF05" to which thread it references? > > > >>Sometimes when I record audio in Pd, a wave file is created that Pd > >[...] > >>problem yet but I'm trying... (I think it has something to do with > >>using 'writesf' in an abstraction). > >>I 'm working on Windows XP and this problem occured in Pd 0.40.3 > >>and in 0.42-4. > > > > > >your problem is most likely related to not properly closing the > >soundfile. you MUST send a [stop( message to [writesf~] in order to > >"finalize" the wav (that is: replace the dummy length in the header > >with the proper one, which is only known at closing time) > > > >fgmasdr > >IOhannes > > > > > -- Use the source -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: rec2.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 3874 bytes Desc: not available URL: From athos.bacchiocchi at tin.it Tue Mar 3 14:23:07 2009 From: athos.bacchiocchi at tin.it (Athos Bacchiocchi) Date: Tue, 03 Mar 2009 14:23:07 +0100 Subject: [PD] pd-extended on ubuntu intrepid: troubles Message-ID: <49AD2F3B.9040207@tin.it> hi, I installed pd on ubuntu intrepid from official repositories through installer manager, and everything worked fine. After, I needed pd-extendend so I went on the pd website and I downloaded the pd-extended contributed build for intrepid, at: http://pd.ianagnostopoulos.postgrad.shef.ac.uk/pd-extended_0.40.3-intrepid6_i386.deb After installing the package, I noticed that pd seemed to have disappeared (of course if I install it again from repositories, it appears again and works, but it's not pd-extended... and every time I try to install again pd-extended I have the same trouble). There's something I miss? thanks, athos From hans.roels at versateladsl.be Tue Mar 3 14:30:55 2009 From: hans.roels at versateladsl.be (Hans Roels) Date: Tue, 03 Mar 2009 14:30:55 +0100 Subject: [PD] strange wave In-Reply-To: <49AD1731.4070108@iem.at> References: <140F73C2-09A4-4DB1-B341-6CB0102F15EC@eds.org> <828BA0D7-9A7C-4B37-906C-7C295C23FD15@eds.org> <49AB2C0B.8090205@pspunch.com> <1235956297.7549.56.camel@yoyo2> <49AC2620.3090300@iem.at> <49AD1731.4070108@iem.at> Message-ID: thanks a lot for this information, I added the [loadbang]->[; pd dsp 0; pd dsp 1( to my recording abstraction and after testing it a few times, this seems more reliable. Hans r At 12:40 3/03/2009, IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: >Hans Roels wrote: >>I think/hope that I managed to isolate the problem with writesf~ >>and readsf~. There are two patches in attach that print out every >>step that you take so one can't forget to click 'open' for example, >>it also measures the time between the 'open' and 'start' command. >>Copy these 2 patches in the same folder. > >the answer is simple: there is a (known) bug in Pd that does not >re-start the dsp-graph in some situations when live-patching. >i think there is at least 1 bug-report in the sf bug-tracker. > >so what happens here is: after you have started the dsp you create >[rec] but for whatever reasons, the dsp-graph is not updated and >thus your [writesf~] is not working at all. > >you can test this by: >adding [env~] plust floatatom to [osc~] in your [rec] patch. save it. >then re-start Pd, open main.pd, create [rec], open it up and >lo-and-behold, the numberbox might still show 0 (and is not updated by [env~]) > >workaround: manually restart the dsp after you have dynamically >created an object: [loadbang]->[; pd dsp 0; pd dsp 1( > > >fgnmasdr >IOhannes > > From I.Anagnostopoulos at sheffield.ac.uk Tue Mar 3 14:43:44 2009 From: I.Anagnostopoulos at sheffield.ac.uk (Ilias Anagnostopoulos) Date: Tue, 03 Mar 2009 13:43:44 +0000 Subject: [PD] pd-extended on ubuntu intrepid: troubles In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49AD3410.4010400@shef.ac.uk> Hello Athos, The packages of Puredata (Ubuntu Repos) and Pd-extended are made in such a way that only one can be installed at any given time. This is due to conflict issues. -Ilias > Message: 4 > Date: Tue, 03 Mar 2009 14:23:07 +0100 > From: Athos Bacchiocchi > Subject: [PD] pd-extended on ubuntu intrepid: troubles > To: PD list > Message-ID: <49AD2F3B.9040207 at tin.it> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-15; format=flowed > > hi, > > I installed pd on ubuntu intrepid from official repositories through > installer manager, and everything worked fine. After, I needed > pd-extendend so I went on the pd website and I downloaded the > pd-extended contributed build for intrepid, at: > > http://pd.ianagnostopoulos.postgrad.shef.ac.uk/pd-extended_0.40.3-intrepid6_i386.deb > > After installing the package, I noticed that pd seemed to have > disappeared (of course if I install it again from repositories, it > appears again and works, but it's not pd-extended... and every time I > try to install again pd-extended I have the same trouble). > > There's something I miss? > > thanks, > athos > From martin.peach at sympatico.ca Tue Mar 3 15:11:13 2009 From: martin.peach at sympatico.ca (Martin Peach) Date: Tue, 03 Mar 2009 09:11:13 -0500 Subject: [PD] pd and tcp: what to do against crashes? In-Reply-To: <49ACFBFF.2070204@pspunch.com> References: <1235905522.7557.39.camel@yoyo2> <1235950240.7549.23.camel@yoyo2> <49ACFBFF.2070204@pspunch.com> Message-ID: PSPunch wrote: > From my understanding, the alternative to using multiple > threads/processes would be to set the socket to "non-blocking" and > implement a Pd object that buffers the messages requested to be sent. > Then attempts to retry sending what the OS once rejected should be made. > It seems like that would always end up blocking something, depending on the reason for the inability to send the messages. If the other end has crashed the object would be trying sending for hours and its buffer would expand to fill up all available memory. The way I do it now in [tcpserver] is to send the messages one byte at a time, first using a select() call to verify that each byte can be sent without blocking. This is similar to using non-blocking sockets but doesn't involve timers. > This will also involve giving the object a timer to call it a fault and > close the socket if no bytes seemed to have traveled over a certain > period of time. This can be done in the patch, so the user can decide what to do about unsendable messages. They can implement a timer and know what state it was in. > > This probably calls for some decision making in the design of the Pd > object, such as how frequently to retry sending the bytes to the socket. > I was thinking a [bang] may be flexible. Whether it be triggered by > [metro] or [bang~], the one designing the patch would have the most > control over how to deal with the results of the transfer. > Yes, you can do all that in the patch that uses [tcpserver]. I don't think the object itself needs to be overly complex. In my experience, 'user-friendly' usually means 'opaque', 'inscrutable', 'why TF is it doing that?' Martin From athos.bacchiocchi at tin.it Tue Mar 3 15:28:36 2009 From: athos.bacchiocchi at tin.it (Athos Bacchiocchi) Date: Tue, 03 Mar 2009 15:28:36 +0100 Subject: [PD] pd-extended on ubuntu intrepid: troubles In-Reply-To: <49AD3410.4010400@shef.ac.uk> References: <49AD3410.4010400@shef.ac.uk> Message-ID: <49AD3E94.6020709@tin.it> Ilias Anagnostopoulos ha scritto: > Hello Athos, > > The packages of Puredata (Ubuntu Repos) and Pd-extended are made in such > a way that only one can be installed at any given time. This is due to > conflict issues. > Thanks for the help, but I still can't manage. I tried removing the puredata package in synaptic, and then installing pd-extended from the package downloaded from puredata.info Now, in synaptic, the pd-extended package results as installed. The version is 0.40.3-intrepid6, dimension is 0 B. But I still don't see the program in the menu. Maybe I should try a different package than the contributed build for intrepid? athos From simeon_cosik at fastmail.fm Tue Mar 3 15:30:08 2009 From: simeon_cosik at fastmail.fm (simeon cosik) Date: Tue, 03 Mar 2009 06:30:08 -0800 Subject: [PD] evaluate 3d iterative structures Message-ID: <1236090608.17197.1303374423@webmail.messagingengine.com> Hello, how can i evaluate 3d structures generated in puredata to know if it can support itself if i build it in reality? for example imagine that each structure is conformed by a group of boxes one over the others made with "repeat",i would like to add gravity and weight to all the boxes so i can i calculate the threshold that i need to maintain in order to avoid the collapse of my structure. Is this can be done with pmpd? Any idea? Simeon -- simeon cosik simeon_cosik at fastmail.fm -- http://www.fastmail.fm - I mean, what is it about a decent email service? From matju at artengine.ca Tue Mar 3 16:01:03 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2009 10:01:03 -0500 (EST) Subject: [PD] evaluate 3d iterative structures In-Reply-To: <1236090608.17197.1303374423@webmail.messagingengine.com> References: <1236090608.17197.1303374423@webmail.messagingengine.com> Message-ID: On Tue, 3 Mar 2009, simeon cosik wrote: > Hello, how can i evaluate 3d structures generated in puredata to know if > it can support itself if i build it in reality? for example imagine that > each structure is conformed by a group of boxes one over the others made > with "repeat",i would like to add gravity and weight to all the boxes so > i can i calculate the threshold that i need to maintain in order to > avoid the collapse of my structure. Is this can be done with pmpd? Any > idea? You would need to remake your patch to also work without GEM, or find a way to download the geos from GEM. One way to make such a "dual-output" patch, is to make it as an abstraction, taking an argument that selects the library it is going to use. suppose your patch is called mymodel.pd: [mymodel] would use GEM [mymodel gemdump/] would use a library called gemdump/ Then within that patch, you would prefix every geo and every geo transformation by $1, such as [$1rotateXYZ]. After that you'd have to make a somewhat complex abstraction library that could dump all the coordinates. Actually, this pattern (of switching libraries) is very useful, but in this case, it may be too hard, so if I were you, I'd first look for something that can download the geos from the video card, and if I don't find any, I'd make that GEM emulation library that would give me all vertices and edges. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From matju at artengine.ca Tue Mar 3 16:05:07 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2009 10:05:07 -0500 (EST) Subject: [PD] Pd seriell printers (fwd) Message-ID: I don't know why anyone still uses iem.kug.ac.at... is it an old address? Anyway, I re-send my reply just in case it's not getting through. ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2009 09:53:34 -0500 (EST) From: Mathieu Bouchard To: brandt at subnet.at Cc: Pd List Subject: Re: [PD] Pd seriell printers On Tue, 3 Mar 2009, brandt at subnet.at wrote: > Does anybody Know how to control a dot matrix printer troughout the seriell > port First you need to install the [comport] class or any equivalent. It's best to use my hacked version because none of the other versions can't handle flow-control properly. Second you need to figure out the wire protocol. Serial port is called serial port because it's using the RS-232 protocol, but this protocol has many variants and they are not autodetected. For example, you may have to say: speed 9600 bits/second, 8 data bits per byte, 1 stop bit per byte, no parity, CTS/RTS flow-control. Third you need to figure out the application protocol. The printer's manual may say, for example, that it's an Epson-compatible printer, or it may have a switch between Epson-compatible and a different mode. Old manuals often give you a list of all commands you can do on that printer, especially because they often offer extensions to the standard protocol they are basing themselves on, or sometimes because they have a completely different protocol. Most of those printers are based on escape-sequences starting with the escape-code ("ascii" # 27), which may sound familiar, but those sequences are not related with any of the screen-and-keyboard escape-sequences (VT/ANSI) used on BBSes and unix operating systems. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From matju at artengine.ca Tue Mar 3 15:53:34 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2009 09:53:34 -0500 (EST) Subject: [PD] Pd seriell printers In-Reply-To: <56848.81.223.29.242.1236063058.squirrel@webmail.*> References: <56848.81.223.29.242.1236063058.squirrel@webmail.*> Message-ID: On Tue, 3 Mar 2009, brandt at subnet.at wrote: > Does anybody Know how to control a dot matrix printer troughout the > seriell port First you need to install the [comport] class or any equivalent. It's best to use my hacked version because none of the other versions can't handle flow-control properly. Second you need to figure out the wire protocol. Serial port is called serial port because it's using the RS-232 protocol, but this protocol has many variants and they are not autodetected. For example, you may have to say: speed 9600 bits/second, 8 data bits per byte, 1 stop bit per byte, no parity, CTS/RTS flow-control. Third you need to figure out the application protocol. The printer's manual may say, for example, that it's an Epson-compatible printer, or it may have a switch between Epson-compatible and a different mode. Old manuals often give you a list of all commands you can do on that printer, especially because they often offer extensions to the standard protocol they are basing themselves on, or sometimes because they have a completely different protocol. Most of those printers are based on escape-sequences starting with the escape-code ("ascii" # 27), which may sound familiar, but those sequences are not related with any of the screen-and-keyboard escape-sequences (VT/ANSI) used on BBSes and unix operating systems. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From hans at eds.org Tue Mar 3 18:50:45 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Tue, 3 Mar 2009 12:50:45 -0500 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! Message-ID: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> Hey all, The Google Summer of Code ((http://code.google.com/soc/) application is due very soon, March 9th, and we need mentors! At this point, you just need to put down your name. Then once the projects are in, we'll choose projects and who will mentor them. You will then work with a student, either locally or remotely. Every pd developer who wants to support the project but is not student anymore is invited to join as mentor, since the number of sponsored projects by google depends on the number of mentors and students. If you are a student, then you should apply as a student to get funded. Mentors get $500 and students get $4500 for working on something Pd related. .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- "It is convenient to imagine a power beyond us because that means we don't have to examine our own lives.", from "The Idols of Environmentalism", by Curtis White From grh at mur.at Tue Mar 3 19:54:55 2009 From: grh at mur.at (Georg Holzmann) Date: Tue, 03 Mar 2009 19:54:55 +0100 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> Message-ID: <49AD7CFF.2060502@mur.at> Hallo! I started to put ideas together at the following WIKI page: http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/GoogleSummerOfCodeIdeas2009 If you are interested joining one project as a mentor, please just add your name in the list of possible mentors ... Please also add your projects using the following template: http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/ProjectTemplate (and look at the description of my already added projects) It should be as clear as possible for students how to start, where are the resources and etc. There are also still a lot of old projects from last year here: http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/GoogleSummerOfCodeIdeas which should be copied (and polished) to the new WIKI page - so some help is really needed ! Thanks for any contribution, LG Georg Hans-Christoph Steiner schrieb: > Hey all, > > The Google Summer of Code ((http://code.google.com/soc/) application > is due very soon, March 9th, and we need mentors! At this point, you > just need to put down your name. Then once the projects are in, we'll > choose projects and who will mentor them. You will then work with a > student, either locally or remotely. > > Every pd developer who wants to support the project but is not student > anymore is invited to join as mentor, since the number of sponsored > projects by google depends on the number of mentors and students. If > you are a student, then you should apply as a student to get funded. > Mentors get $500 and students get $4500 for working on something Pd > related. > > .hc > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > "It is convenient to imagine a power beyond us because that means we > don't have to examine our own lives.", from "The Idols of > Environmentalism", by Curtis White > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From grh at mur.at Tue Mar 3 21:23:51 2009 From: grh at mur.at (Georg Holzmann) Date: Tue, 03 Mar 2009 21:23:51 +0100 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <49AD7CFF.2060502@mur.at> References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> <49AD7CFF.2060502@mur.at> Message-ID: <49AD91D7.10107@mur.at> Hallo again ! I added now quite some projects from last year to the WIKI page: http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/GoogleSummerOfCodeIdeas2009 Please look through them and correct my bad english and/or add additional resources and ideas ! @Hans: I added you to some projects as mentor, I hope you don't mind ;) @IOhannes: same for you ;) - but you can of course join more projects (now I added you only to the gem multiwindow project, because here you are the only possible author) To all other mentors: please add you to the wiki and also add projects ! Thanks, LG Georg Georg Holzmann schrieb: > Hallo! > > I started to put ideas together at the following WIKI page: > http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/GoogleSummerOfCodeIdeas2009 > If you are interested joining one project as a mentor, please just add > your name in the list of possible mentors ... > > Please also add your projects using the following template: > http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/ProjectTemplate > (and look at the description of my already added projects) > It should be as clear as possible for students how to start, where are > the resources and etc. > > There are also still a lot of old projects from last year here: > http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/GoogleSummerOfCodeIdeas > which should be copied (and polished) to the new WIKI page - so some > help is really needed ! > > Thanks for any contribution, > LG > Georg > > > Hans-Christoph Steiner schrieb: >> Hey all, >> >> The Google Summer of Code ((http://code.google.com/soc/) application >> is due very soon, March 9th, and we need mentors! At this point, you >> just need to put down your name. Then once the projects are in, we'll >> choose projects and who will mentor them. You will then work with a >> student, either locally or remotely. >> >> Every pd developer who wants to support the project but is not student >> anymore is invited to join as mentor, since the number of sponsored >> projects by google depends on the number of mentors and students. If >> you are a student, then you should apply as a student to get funded. >> Mentors get $500 and students get $4500 for working on something Pd >> related. >> >> .hc >> >> >> >> >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> "It is convenient to imagine a power beyond us because that means we >> don't have to examine our own lives.", from "The Idols of >> Environmentalism", by Curtis White >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From I.Anagnostopoulos at sheffield.ac.uk Tue Mar 3 23:18:19 2009 From: I.Anagnostopoulos at sheffield.ac.uk (Ilias Anagnostopoulos) Date: Tue, 03 Mar 2009 22:18:19 +0000 Subject: [PD] pd-extended on ubuntu intrepid: troubles In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49ADACAB.5090904@shef.ac.uk> Hey Athos, I don't remember if there is a menu item coming with the package. If not, just start it from the terminal by typing: pd and pressing enter. You can manually add a menu item if there isn't one with the package, at least until I (or anybody else) find enough time to add one and update the package. You are running Ubuntu 8.10 Intrepid, aren't you? -Ilias > Date: Tue, 03 Mar 2009 15:28:36 +0100 > From: Athos Bacchiocchi > Subject: Re: [PD] pd-extended on ubuntu intrepid: troubles > To: pd-list at iem.at > Message-ID: <49AD3E94.6020709 at tin.it> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > > Ilias Anagnostopoulos ha scritto: > >> Hello Athos, >> >> The packages of Puredata (Ubuntu Repos) and Pd-extended are made in such >> a way that only one can be installed at any given time. This is due to >> conflict issues. >> >> > Thanks for the help, but I still can't manage. I tried removing the > puredata package in synaptic, and then installing pd-extended from the > package downloaded from puredata.info > > Now, in synaptic, the pd-extended package results as installed. The > version is 0.40.3-intrepid6, dimension is 0 B. But I still don't see the > program in the menu. > > Maybe I should try a different package than the contributed build for > intrepid? > > athos > > From shima at pspunch.com Wed Mar 4 00:08:24 2009 From: shima at pspunch.com (PSPunch) Date: Wed, 04 Mar 2009 08:08:24 +0900 Subject: [PD] pd and tcp: what to do against crashes? In-Reply-To: References: <1235905522.7557.39.camel@yoyo2> <1235950240.7549.23.camel@yoyo2> <49ACFBFF.2070204@pspunch.com> Message-ID: <49ADB868.7030009@pspunch.com> Hi Martin, >> From my understanding, the alternative to using multiple >> threads/processes would be to set the socket to "non-blocking" and >> implement a Pd object that buffers the messages requested to be sent. >> Then attempts to retry sending what the OS once rejected should be made. > > It seems like that would always end up blocking something, depending on > the reason for the inability to send the messages. If the other end has > crashed the object would be trying sending for hours and its buffer > would expand to fill up all available memory. Infinite retries will not occur if a timeout is set for the [tcpserver] to decide that the other end has crashed. This timer will not wait and block, but increment occasionally. The person programming the patch can wait for output of the object to confirm that the previous transfer has completed if it is of his concern. Yes, the data WILL be blocked in the sense that it is being buffered in the object, but without causing a pause in the process. (Whether setting the socket to non-block or using "select" with a timeout of zero was not my concern) Users will also benefit from, while having to pay attention to broken connections, can be less concerned about how to resend failed packets over a socket that is not broken but simply delayed. ...Doesn't allowing this sort of usage make your objects more compatible with the previous design? > The way I do it now in [tcpserver] is to send the messages one byte at a > time, first using a select() call to verify that each byte can be sent > without blocking. This is similar to using non-blocking sockets but > doesn't involve timers. Having said all of the above, this point was my main concern. With your new design, does the OS also flush data a byte at a time over the network, or does it buffer it for a reasonable duration? The earlier sounds like to introduce massive overhead caused by TCP headers, especially when we are speak of sending amounts of data that may flood the socket's "send buffer." In the later case, the OS may indicate that bytes entered the socket, while they were actually only buffered while the connection breaks and was never sent. >> This will also involve giving the object a timer to call it a fault and >> close the socket if no bytes seemed to have traveled over a certain >> period of time. > > This can be done in the patch, so the user can decide what to do about > unsendable messages. They can implement a timer and know what state it > was in. > >> >> This probably calls for some decision making in the design of the Pd >> object, such as how frequently to retry sending the bytes to the socket. >> I was thinking a [bang] may be flexible. Whether it be triggered by >> [metro] or [bang~], the one designing the patch would have the most >> control over how to deal with the results of the transfer. >> > > Yes, you can do all that in the patch that uses [tcpserver]. I don't > think the object itself needs to be overly complex. In my experience, > 'user-friendly' usually means 'opaque', 'inscrutable', 'why TF is it > doing that?' I agree with you on this point. All mentioned out of curiosity.. I don't know enough on writing externals to implement what I suggested myself, and do truly feel respect for your work. Perhaps I should just pull out a packet analyzer and confirm what goes on myself before nagging about it. -- David Shimamoto From reduzierer at yahoo.de Wed Mar 4 00:45:15 2009 From: reduzierer at yahoo.de (Roman Haefeli) Date: Wed, 04 Mar 2009 00:45:15 +0100 Subject: [PD] pd and tcp: what to do against crashes? In-Reply-To: References: <1235905522.7557.39.camel@yoyo2> <1235951524.7549.30.camel@yoyo2> <1235955557.7549.54.camel@yoyo2> <1236001621.7549.76.camel@yoyo2> Message-ID: <1236123916.7628.19.camel@yoyo2> On Mon, 2009-03-02 at 18:51 -0500, Martin Peach wrote: > Roman Haefeli wrote: > > On Sun, 2009-03-01 at 22:53 -0500, Martin Peach wrote: > > >> So I made [tcpserver] send the messages one byte at a time. This latest > >> version should not block, since it adds only one element to the buffer > >> for each select call that says the buffer is still writeable. > > > > can you tell me something about how to use it correctly? i just compiled > > the newest version and still could prevent it from blocking pd. before > > the blocking happens, i do _not_ get any message from the new outlet > > from [tcpserver], such as 'sent 0'. so what happens is still, that i > > send messages to it until it blocks. is it different on windows? do you > > mind sending me a windows binary, if it is? > > is there anything i can do in terms of testing on linux? > > > > Sorry, there was a bug in it so it was staying in the send loop even > though it couldn't send. I fixed it in the latest svn. great news with great results! it works for me as well. no blocking anymore and a feedback of what could be sent: that is what i needed. thanks for your work. > When I use it, if > I set the buffer size to 10 I can send 4 messages of 3 bytes after > unpluggng the cable, but the last 'sent' says that only 2 bytes were > transmitted. Subsequent attempts give 0. After a few seconds I also get > a message saying the connection was terminated. It should work > identically on linux. same behaviour here as well with server on linux and client on OS X. the only difference: the connection is not automatically terminated (or probably i have to wait longer then 10min). windows seems to be more keen to close 'unused' connections. just for the record: actually i wanted to test only on one computer running ubuntu with windows in a virtual box, but it didn't work, because whenever i shut down the network device in virtualbox, the connection was terminated. so i had to use physically two computers. i have some questions about the usage of [tcpserver]: when sending lists of floats to it, tracking of what is sent and what not is not very trivial to do, since you have to count the elements of each message 'going out', so that you can compare it with the status output of [tcpserver]. in order to resend omitted parts, you also need to store a copy of the last sent list. now, since i want to buffer the outgoing messages anyway, buffering them as lists is unpractical anyway and i much rather would buffer them in an array. programming-wise, it would be much easier to send byte-by-byte, a.k.a sending a 'client 1 BYTE' for every BYTE separately. is that a stupid thing to do? would it cause a lot of overhead in terms of cpu cycles, when trasferring big amounts of data this way? how do i know, when the [tcpserver] socket is ready to transmit another byte? do i have to nag it every ms with a message? if i go the BYTE-AT-A-TIME route, the interval would even need to be slower, if higher troughput should be achieved. is there any strategy to avoid too much overhead? thanks roman ___________________________________________________________ Der fr?he Vogel f?ngt den Wurm. Hier gelangen Sie zum neuen Yahoo! Mail: http://mail.yahoo.de From athos.bacchiocchi at tin.it Wed Mar 4 00:52:40 2009 From: athos.bacchiocchi at tin.it (Athos Bacchiocchi) Date: Wed, 04 Mar 2009 00:52:40 +0100 Subject: [PD] pd-extended on ubuntu intrepid: troubles In-Reply-To: <49ADACAB.5090904@shef.ac.uk> References: <49ADACAB.5090904@shef.ac.uk> Message-ID: <49ADC2C8.8000202@tin.it> Ilias Anagnostopoulos ha scritto: > I don't remember if there is a menu item coming with the package. If > not, just start it from the terminal by typing: > > pd > > and pressing enter. You can manually add a menu item if there isn't one > with the package, at least until I (or anybody else) find enough time to > add one and update the package. > > You are running Ubuntu 8.10 Intrepid, aren't you? > Yes, i tried typing pd in the terminal and it worked (but by mistake i wrote this only to john harrison, who suggested the same). The problem was my lack of linux knowledge and experience. :-/ Yes, i'm running 8.10 intrepid. thanks a lot to everybody! athos From reduzierer at yahoo.de Wed Mar 4 01:11:28 2009 From: reduzierer at yahoo.de (Roman Haefeli) Date: Wed, 04 Mar 2009 01:11:28 +0100 Subject: [PD] pd and tcp: what to do against crashes? In-Reply-To: <1236123916.7628.19.camel@yoyo2> References: <1235905522.7557.39.camel@yoyo2> <1235951524.7549.30.camel@yoyo2> <1235955557.7549.54.camel@yoyo2> <1236001621.7549.76.camel@yoyo2> <1236123916.7628.19.camel@yoyo2> Message-ID: <1236125488.7628.27.camel@yoyo2> On Wed, 2009-03-04 at 00:45 +0100, Roman Haefeli wrote: > > how do i know, when the [tcpserver] socket is ready to transmit another > byte? do i have to nag it every ms with a message? if i go the > BYTE-AT-A-TIME route, the interval would even need to be slower, if > higher troughput should be achieved. is there any strategy to avoid too > much overhead? > having thought another two minutes about it, i think i can answer my own question: i don't need to drip every byte with an interval, but just fill the buffer completely in zero logical time, then i wait a few miliseconds, then i do it again. depending on the wait time, the connection bandwidth and the buffersize, the buffer will be filled again before it completely got empty. this way the maximum available bandwidth can be exploited, when necessary, without having to penetrate [tcpserver] too much with 'buffer still full?' messages. martin, would you mind implementing similar changes to [tcpclient] as well? roman ___________________________________________________________ Telefonate ohne weitere Kosten vom PC zum PC: http://messenger.yahoo.de From reduzierer at yahoo.de Wed Mar 4 01:14:15 2009 From: reduzierer at yahoo.de (Roman Haefeli) Date: Wed, 04 Mar 2009 01:14:15 +0100 Subject: [PD] pd and tcp: what to do against crashes? In-Reply-To: <1236123916.7628.19.camel@yoyo2> References: <1235905522.7557.39.camel@yoyo2> <1235951524.7549.30.camel@yoyo2> <1235955557.7549.54.camel@yoyo2> <1236001621.7549.76.camel@yoyo2> <1236123916.7628.19.camel@yoyo2> Message-ID: <1236125655.7628.29.camel@yoyo2> On Wed, 2009-03-04 at 00:45 +0100, Roman Haefeli wrote: > how do i know, when the [tcpserver] socket is ready to transmit another > byte? do i have to nag it every ms with a message? if i go the > BYTE-AT-A-TIME route, the interval would even need to be slower i either wanted to say 'lower' or 'faster', but not 'slower'. roman ___________________________________________________________ Telefonate ohne weitere Kosten vom PC zum PC: http://messenger.yahoo.de From reduzierer at yahoo.de Wed Mar 4 01:21:04 2009 From: reduzierer at yahoo.de (Roman Haefeli) Date: Wed, 04 Mar 2009 01:21:04 +0100 Subject: [PD] pd and tcp: what to do against crashes? In-Reply-To: <49ACFBFF.2070204@pspunch.com> References: <1235905522.7557.39.camel@yoyo2> <1235950240.7549.23.camel@yoyo2> <49ACFBFF.2070204@pspunch.com> Message-ID: <1236126064.7628.37.camel@yoyo2> On Tue, 2009-03-03 at 18:44 +0900, PSPunch wrote: > > i really wonder, how other projects handle that. i mean, if several > > people download a big file from apache, then a disappearing client > > doesn't interfere with the other clients. i guess, in apache it is > > solved by using threads. when using threads, one single thread doesn't > > necessarily need to know about the buffer state, because it could be > > blocked without harm to the other apache children. so it can try to send > > as much data as possible. > > is using threads the _only_ solution to deal with that problem? i guess, > > it would overcomplicate the programming of [tcpserver], but you sure > > know better... > > >From my understanding, the alternative to using multiple > threads/processes would be to set the socket to "non-blocking" and > implement a Pd object that buffers the messages requested to be sent. > Then attempts to retry sending what the OS once rejected should be made. actually, there is no need for another external, if you implicitly meant an external here. even more since [tcpserver] accepts only floats, respectively lists of floats, the buffering can be done easily in pd. > This will also involve giving the object a timer to call it a fault and > close the socket if no bytes seemed to have traveled over a certain > period of time. when all of this is done in pd, one has much more control over it. i guess, depending on the circumstances, the time limit might differ much, depending on the application needed. i think, that also the kind of action, that needs to be performed when the other side stops listening, is dependent on the specific application of [tcpserver]. > This probably calls for some decision making in the design of the Pd > object, such as how frequently to retry sending the bytes to the socket. > I was thinking a [bang] may be flexible. Whether it be triggered by > [metro] or [bang~], the one designing the patch would have the most > control over how to deal with the results of the transfer. yeah, i actually mean the same. > I found this article helpful to gain basic understanding on which layer > of the OS or library is responsible for the actions happening beneath > the covers. > > http://www.amk.ca/python/howto/sockets/ thanks. this will be my bed reading for tonight. roman ___________________________________________________________ Der fr?he Vogel f?ngt den Wurm. Hier gelangen Sie zum neuen Yahoo! Mail: http://mail.yahoo.de From reduzierer at yahoo.de Wed Mar 4 01:29:58 2009 From: reduzierer at yahoo.de (Roman Haefeli) Date: Wed, 04 Mar 2009 01:29:58 +0100 Subject: [PD] pd and tcp: what to do against crashes? In-Reply-To: <49ADB868.7030009@pspunch.com> References: <1235905522.7557.39.camel@yoyo2> <1235950240.7549.23.camel@yoyo2> <49ACFBFF.2070204@pspunch.com> <49ADB868.7030009@pspunch.com> Message-ID: <1236126598.7628.47.camel@yoyo2> On Wed, 2009-03-04 at 08:08 +0900, PSPunch wrote: > The earlier sounds like to introduce massive overhead caused by TCP > headers, especially when we are speak of sending amounts of data that > may flood the socket's "send buffer." In the later case, the OS may > indicate that bytes entered the socket, while they were actually only > buffered while the connection breaks and was never sent. > if i interprete my observations correctly, this is not a big deal, since not every message sent to [tcpserver] will be transmitted in its own tcp frame. at least on my box (ubuntu 8.04), they are sent seperately, if there is at least a time interval of ~10ms between them. messages sent with shorter intervals are concatenated into one frame. said this, i have to add, that the above is only true, if the number of elements of a lists on the receiving side represent the framesize. for instance, when i plug out the ethernet cable and fill the buffer on the sender side, then plug the cable back in, i get one big list with ~5000 elements on the receiving side (don't try to print that one, it will hang pd) roman ___________________________________________________________ Der fr?he Vogel f?ngt den Wurm. Hier gelangen Sie zum neuen Yahoo! Mail: http://mail.yahoo.de From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 4 06:15:08 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2009 00:15:08 -0500 Subject: [PD] httpget: fun with tcpclient and pdstring Message-ID: <817D4F60-0B09-4D36-8472-EC70AD8E892F@eds.org> I made [httpget] for fetching webpages into pd: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: httpget-help.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 973 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: httpget.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 1014 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- http://at.or.at/hans/ From simeon_cosik at fastmail.fm Wed Mar 4 10:08:28 2009 From: simeon_cosik at fastmail.fm (simeon cosik) Date: Wed, 04 Mar 2009 01:08:28 -0800 Subject: [PD] evaluate 3d iterative structures In-Reply-To: References: <1236090608.17197.1303374423@webmail.messagingengine.com> Message-ID: <1236157708.13611.1303544469@webmail.messagingengine.com> hello, thanks for the reply, are you telling me to take off all the positions of all the geos and then evaluate in other program? what about gem_listinfo? i could take of all the positions an save them in a text file? and which other software should i use to make this calculations? I just checked there is a Ode version that run in pd , called pyode, i think ode works fine for rigid body simulations, do you think this is a good option in pd? On Tue, 3 Mar 2009 10:01:03 -0500 (EST), "Mathieu Bouchard" said: > On Tue, 3 Mar 2009, simeon cosik wrote: > > > Hello, how can i evaluate 3d structures generated in puredata to know if > > it can support itself if i build it in reality? for example imagine that > > each structure is conformed by a group of boxes one over the others made > > with "repeat",i would like to add gravity and weight to all the boxes so > > i can i calculate the threshold that i need to maintain in order to > > avoid the collapse of my structure. Is this can be done with pmpd? Any > > idea? > > You would need to remake your patch to also work without GEM, or find a > way to download the geos from GEM. > > One way to make such a "dual-output" patch, is to make it as an > abstraction, taking an argument that selects the library it is going to > use. suppose your patch is called mymodel.pd: > > [mymodel] would use GEM > [mymodel gemdump/] would use a library called gemdump/ > > Then within that patch, you would prefix every geo and every geo > transformation by $1, such as [$1rotateXYZ]. After that you'd have to > make > a somewhat complex abstraction library that could dump all the > coordinates. > > Actually, this pattern (of switching libraries) is very useful, but in > this case, it may be too hard, so if I were you, I'd first look for > something that can download the geos from the video card, and if I don't > find any, I'd make that GEM emulation library that would give me all > vertices and edges. > > _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... > | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec -- simeon cosik simeon_cosik at fastmail.fm -- http://www.fastmail.fm - Faster than the air-speed velocity of an unladen european swallow From THIS_IS_POP at web.de Wed Mar 4 11:07:13 2009 From: THIS_IS_POP at web.de (YOhannes) Date: Wed, 04 Mar 2009 11:07:13 +0100 Subject: [PD] list issue Message-ID: <49AE52D1.1030004@web.de> hello, ive got some trouble with list handling, maybe somone can give me a hand. i like to group an unnown number of floats in a list. (these floats are the result of different divisors, used all for a fixed value. like 100/16, 100/32...) what i want to do is to put them randomly into the list as long as the sum of all items in the list equals the size of the fixed value. this seems to be pretty difficult...since i use random i cant know what the next float will be. how to handle that? any experience with that issue ? thanks, johannes From fbar at footils.org Wed Mar 4 11:24:04 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2009 11:24:04 +0100 Subject: [PD] list issue In-Reply-To: <49AE52D1.1030004@web.de> References: <49AE52D1.1030004@web.de> Message-ID: <20090304102404.GA17394@footils.org> Hallo, YOhannes hat gesagt: // YOhannes wrote: > ive got some trouble with list handling, maybe somone can give me a hand. > > i like to group an unnown number of floats in a list. (these floats > are the result of different divisors, used all for a fixed value. like > 100/16, 100/32...) > > what i want to do is to put them randomly into the list as long as the > sum of all items > in the list equals the size of the fixed value. this seems to be pretty > difficult...since i use > random i cant know what the next float will be. I don't know if I understand correctly what you mean, but maybe [list-equalize] from the [list]-abs collection can help. It scales all elements in a list so that their sum is 1. If you add a new element into the list this will change the value of old elements in the list of course. Ciao -- Frank From brandt at subnet.at Wed Mar 4 11:54:36 2009 From: brandt at subnet.at (brandt at subnet.at) Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2009 11:54:36 +0100 (CET) Subject: [PD] Pd seriell printers In-Reply-To: References: <56848.81.223.29.242.1236063058.squirrel@webmail.*> <46908.81.223.29.242.1236149317.squirrel@webmail.*> Message-ID: <60473.81.223.29.242.1236164076.squirrel@webmail.*> Hello yes it is a new one. And now I will check the papers meanwhile thanks markus > On Wed, 4 Mar 2009, brandt at subnet.at wrote: > >> Hello and thank you >> [...] > > it would be better to keep the discussion on the pd-list. > > I know nothing about this printer in particular, but if it's a new machine > with a RS232 port, I suspect that it's because of systems that still use > the old Epson protocol: > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ESC/P > > See the external links for the manuals for it. This should make you able > to make your own drivers as pd patches, for whichever features of the > printer you want to use. > > _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... > | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From THIS_IS_POP at web.de Wed Mar 4 12:31:43 2009 From: THIS_IS_POP at web.de (YOhannes) Date: Wed, 04 Mar 2009 12:31:43 +0100 Subject: [PD] list issue In-Reply-To: <20090304102404.GA17394@footils.org> References: <49AE52D1.1030004@web.de> <20090304102404.GA17394@footils.org> Message-ID: <49AE669F.7090208@web.de> Frank Barknecht schrieb: > Hallo, > YOhannes hat gesagt: // YOhannes wrote: > > >> ive got some trouble with list handling, maybe somone can give me a hand. >> >> i like to group an unnown number of floats in a list. (these floats >> are the result of different divisors, used all for a fixed value. like >> 100/16, 100/32...) >> >> what i want to do is to put them randomly into the list as long as the >> sum of all items >> in the list equals the size of the fixed value. this seems to be pretty >> difficult...since i use >> random i cant know what the next float will be. >> > > I don't know if I understand correctly what you mean, but maybe > [list-equalize] from the [list]-abs collection can help. It scales all > elements in a list so that their sum is 1. > > If you add a new element into the list this will change the value of old > elements in the list of course. > > Ciao > maybe i should explain a bit more... the list is thougt as a sequence in (ms)values. i use the length of a master sequence (ms) and divide it by these values ( 2, 4, 8, 16, 32). now my idea was to use random and gate to trigger the different results of the division into a new slave sequence, the list. so the length of it depends on the random values... thanks.j From martin.peach at sympatico.ca Wed Mar 4 15:12:18 2009 From: martin.peach at sympatico.ca (Martin Peach) Date: Wed, 04 Mar 2009 09:12:18 -0500 Subject: [PD] pd and tcp: what to do against crashes? In-Reply-To: <1236126598.7628.47.camel@yoyo2> References: <1235905522.7557.39.camel@yoyo2> <1235950240.7549.23.camel@yoyo2> <49ACFBFF.2070204@pspunch.com> <49ADB868.7030009@pspunch.com> <1236126598.7628.47.camel@yoyo2> Message-ID: Roman Haefeli wrote: > On Wed, 2009-03-04 at 08:08 +0900, PSPunch wrote: > >> The earlier sounds like to introduce massive overhead caused by TCP >> headers, especially when we are speak of sending amounts of data that >> may flood the socket's "send buffer." In the later case, the OS may >> indicate that bytes entered the socket, while they were actually only >> buffered while the connection breaks and was never sent. >> > > if i interprete my observations correctly, this is not a big deal, since > not every message sent to [tcpserver] will be transmitted in its own tcp > frame. at least on my box (ubuntu 8.04), they are sent seperately, if > there is at least a time interval of ~10ms between them. messages sent > with shorter intervals are concatenated into one frame. > said this, i have to add, that the above is only true, if the number of > elements of a lists on the receiving side represent the framesize. for > instance, when i plug out the ethernet cable and fill the buffer on the > sender side, then plug the cable back in, i get one big list with ~5000 > elements on the receiving side (don't try to print that one, it will > hang pd) TCP is supposed to use the Nagle algorithm, which sends the first byte as soon as it is put into the buffer, then sends everything in its buffer whenever the other end acknowledges the previous message. That's the most efficient way to use packets with things like telnet, where someone is typing live at the keyboard. The OS takes care of this and there is no way to control it except to switch it off and have every byte sent immediately. Martin > > roman > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > Der fr?he Vogel f?ngt den Wurm. Hier gelangen Sie zum neuen Yahoo! Mail: http://mail.yahoo.de > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From martin.peach at sympatico.ca Wed Mar 4 15:14:24 2009 From: martin.peach at sympatico.ca (Martin Peach) Date: Wed, 04 Mar 2009 09:14:24 -0500 Subject: [PD] pd and tcp: what to do against crashes? In-Reply-To: <1236125488.7628.27.camel@yoyo2> References: <1235905522.7557.39.camel@yoyo2> <1235951524.7549.30.camel@yoyo2> <1235955557.7549.54.camel@yoyo2> <1236001621.7549.76.camel@yoyo2> <1236123916.7628.19.camel@yoyo2> <1236125488.7628.27.camel@yoyo2> Message-ID: Roman Haefeli wrote: > On Wed, 2009-03-04 at 00:45 +0100, Roman Haefeli wrote: >> how do i know, when the [tcpserver] socket is ready to transmit another >> byte? do i have to nag it every ms with a message? if i go the >> BYTE-AT-A-TIME route, the interval would even need to be slower, if >> higher troughput should be achieved. is there any strategy to avoid too >> much overhead? >> > > having thought another two minutes about it, i think i can answer my own > question: i don't need to drip every byte with an interval, but just > fill the buffer completely in zero logical time, then i wait a few > miliseconds, then i do it again. depending on the wait time, the > connection bandwidth and the buffersize, the buffer will be filled again > before it completely got empty. this way the maximum available bandwidth > can be exploited, when necessary, without having to penetrate > [tcpserver] too much with 'buffer still full?' messages. > You could also try setting the buffer size the same as the message length for each outgoing message. Then the buffer wouldn't consume thousands of bytes before it stopped. > martin, would you mind implementing similar changes to [tcpclient] as > well? > > I'll do that today if I have time. Martin From martin.peach at sympatico.ca Wed Mar 4 15:18:05 2009 From: martin.peach at sympatico.ca (Martin Peach) Date: Wed, 04 Mar 2009 09:18:05 -0500 Subject: [PD] httpget: fun with tcpclient and pdstring In-Reply-To: <817D4F60-0B09-4D36-8472-EC70AD8E892F@eds.org> References: <817D4F60-0B09-4D36-8472-EC70AD8E892F@eds.org> Message-ID: Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > I made [httpget] for fetching webpages into pd: That's nice. Now we need some html parsing objects so the pages go into the patch and not the pd window. It works well if the received pages are loaded into a table. I made tabfind to search a table for a string. Tables seem more efficient than lists and less volatile. Martin From mgrimm at syr.edu Wed Mar 4 15:54:32 2009 From: mgrimm at syr.edu (mark edward grimm) Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2009 06:54:32 -0800 (PST) Subject: [PD] streaming audio and video in Linux In-Reply-To: <616283880903010950h751f428fi1488ed68d6fba3e4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <449627.93824.qm@web32402.mail.mud.yahoo.com> so i did get this working on linux with mencoder + pdp_rawin using code: #! /bin/sh rm /tmp/pipe mknod /tmp/pipe p mencoder -nosound -ovc raw -of rawvideo -vf scale,format=rgb24 mms://ph.wm.live05.pscdn.net/00302597_live12?MSWMExt=.asf -o /tmp/pipe although i am finding this might be inefficient having to convert colorspace from yuv -> rgb -> yuv....the only way i have been able to get this to work is to do this. i am not sure why, admitting i am limited in my understanding of colorspace. >From mencoder i get something like: Decoder is capable of YUV output (flags 0x1b) VDec: vo config request - 320 x 240 (preferred colorspace: Packed YUY2) VDec: using Planar YV12 as output csp (no 0) Movie-Aspect is undefined - no prescaling applied. [swscaler @ 0x883e3d0]No accelerated colorspace conversion found [swscaler @ 0x883e3d0]SwScaler: using unscaled yuv420p -> rgb24 special converter then with pdp_rawin i have to send messages: [tmp/pipe( [bitmap/rgb/320x240( then i have to convert back to yuv using: [pdp_convert image/YCrCb/*] ....and thats the only way i can get it to work. i have tried something like: [pdp_rawin tmp/pipe bitmap/yuv (or even yv12)/320x240] with accompanying altered mencoder script with nothing but a static, f'ed up image. i am not complaining too much because i am pretty happy this is just working in general... i am just looking to make it a little more efficient and i am a little confused over all the yuv/yv12 stuff that is going on and why i have to convert to rgb and back to yuv just to get it to work right - with the understanding pdp/yuv is the fastest and most efficient. BTW the piping stuff is really killer! although i have only been able to get it to work on linux... osx gives me a wicked big file that continuously increases in size as the stream is converted. linux just makes a 0k tmp/pipe that is very nice. i guess this is just a mencoder thing on osx obviously. thanks! m ? --- On Sun, 3/1/09, Jaime Oliver wrote: > From: Jaime Oliver > Subject: Re: [PD] streaming audio and video in Linux > To: mgrimm at syr.edu > Cc: "ydegoyon at gmail.com" , "pd-list" , "John Harrison" > Date: Sunday, March 1, 2009, 12:50 PM > Well, I haven't done it myself, I just know you > can...there is a mencoder > list: "MEncoder usage discussions" > , > and documentation somewhere. > > best, > > Jaime > > On Sun, Mar 1, 2009 at 8:17 AM, mark edward grimm > wrote: > > > > > yeah i will take a look at this... > > > > might you have an example shell script + pd patch for > piping stream from > > mencoder to pdp_rawin? > > > > i saw this thread but i am not sure if issue ever were > resolved: > > > > > http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/2008-04/061727.html > > > > > > thanks! > > m > > > > > > > > --- On Sat, 2/28/09, Jaime Oliver > wrote: > > > > > From: Jaime Oliver > > > > Subject: Re: [PD] streaming audio and video in > Linux > > > To: mgrimm at syr.edu > > > Cc: "ydegoyon at gmail.com" > , "pd-list" > , > > "John Harrison" > > > > Date: Saturday, February 28, 2009, 2:24 AM > > > MEncoder maybe? > > > > > > On Fri, Feb 27, 2009 at 7:50 AM, mark edward > grimm > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > no, pdp_icedthe~ can receive a stream > > > > > > > > ah thats right thanks! > > > > > > > > > we will not try to support an > .asx/proprietary > > > format, > > > > > > > > understandable.... yeah i want to > "hijack" > > > someone else's stream - it just > > > > happens to be in .asx!!! > > > > > > > > i wonder if there is a method for real-time > > > transcoding....? from asx to > > > > ogg? > > > > > > > > ____________________ > > > > mark edward grimm | m.f.a | ed.m > > > > syracuse u. | vpa foundations | timearts > > > > adjunct | new media consultant > > > > megrimm.net | socialmedia.org/GROUP & > LLC > > > > mgrimm at syr.edu | 315.378.2136 > > > > ________________________________________ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- On Fri, 2/27/09, ydegoyon at gmail.com > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > From: ydegoyon at gmail.com > > > > > > > > Subject: Re: [PD] streaming audio and > video in > > > Linux > > > > > To: mgrimm at syr.edu > > > > > Cc: "pd-list" > , > > > "John Harrison" < > > > > johnharrisonwsu at gmail.com> > > > > > Date: Friday, February 27, 2009, 10:39 > AM > > > > > mark edward grimm wrote: > > > > > > hmmm... yeah sorry for changing > the subject > > > on this. > > > > > > > > > > > > I was actually wondering the > opposite of the > > > original > > > > > poster, how to get a stream > 'into' pd.... > > > > > > > > > > > > For example i have access to a > stream > > > > > > (http://someone-elses-website/live12.asx) that is > > > not my > > > > > own.... > > > > > > > > > > > > This stream I can open in VLC > player for > > > example.... > > > > > > > > > > > > How can I utilize this stream in > pd? > > > directly or > > > > > indirectly (through vlc player?)..... > to do > > > motion tracking > > > > > on the stream for example. > > > > > > > > > > > > the pdp_theora stuff is just for > streaming > > > out FROM pd > > > > > correct? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > no, pdp_icedthe~ can receive a stream > > > > > but only in ogg/theora format, > > > > > we will not try to support an > .asx/proprietary > > > format, > > > > > well not me. > > > > > > > > > > sevy > > > > > > m > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > > > > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > > > > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > Jaime E Oliver LR > > > > > > joliverl at ucsd.edu > > > www.realidadvisual.org/jaimeoliver > > > www-crca.ucsd.edu/ > > > www.realidadvisual.org > > > > > > 858 202 1522 > > > 9168 Regents Rd. Apt. G > > > La Jolla, CA 92037 > > > USA > > > > > > -- > Jaime E Oliver LR > > joliverl at ucsd.edu > www.realidadvisual.org/jaimeoliver > www-crca.ucsd.edu/ > www.realidadvisual.org > > 858 202 1522 > 9168 Regents Rd. Apt. G > La Jolla, CA 92037 > USA From matju at artengine.ca Wed Mar 4 16:19:23 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2009 10:19:23 -0500 (EST) Subject: [PD] Pd seriell printers In-Reply-To: <60473.81.223.29.242.1236164076.squirrel@webmail.*> References: <56848.81.223.29.242.1236063058.squirrel@webmail.*> <46908.81.223.29.242.1236149317.squirrel@webmail.*> <60473.81.223.29.242.1236164076.squirrel@webmail.*> Message-ID: On Wed, 4 Mar 2009, brandt at subnet.at wrote: > On 3 Mar 2009, matju at artengine.ca wrote: >> I know nothing about this printer in particular, but if it's a new machine >> with a RS232 port, I suspect that it's because of systems that still use >> the old Epson protocol: > yes it is a new one. And now I will check the papers yes I understood that it's a new one, I just mean "for any new machines with a RS232 port, it's probably because of systems that still use the old Epson protocol". I say that so that you understand my reasoning. You could use that idea to pick different hardware if you need to or if you find any other reason why anything else would be better. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From matju at artengine.ca Wed Mar 4 16:32:05 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2009 10:32:05 -0500 (EST) Subject: [PD] httpget: fun with tcpclient and pdstring In-Reply-To: References: <817D4F60-0B09-4D36-8472-EC70AD8E892F@eds.org> Message-ID: On Wed, 4 Mar 2009, Martin Peach wrote: > That's nice. Now we need some html parsing objects so the pages go into > the patch and not the pd window. It works well if the received pages are > loaded into a table. I made tabfind to search a table for a string. > Tables seem more efficient than lists and less volatile. Lists are volatile because they are (typically) stack-allocated or in any way their contract of use makes (argc,argv) only valid during the call... so you could use a heap-allocated argv but modify it between calls and it would still make the list data have a stack-wise accessibility. Because lists are volatile, they need to be copied by any object that wants to keep them. It's actually worse than that, as objects used recursively have to watch out for what they can deallocate. It's not like you could make [list] be faster without complicating it... and this includes plain data-recursion as well too (set cold-inlet of an object while its cold-inlet has still a job pending on the stack). Tables can be much faster but they also need to be statically-allocated (or dynamically-patched!), and they are type-restricted (where you can't say that any element slot may contain any atom one decides at runtime), and you have to find names for the tables because they can't be anonymous. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 4 16:42:38 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2009 10:42:38 -0500 Subject: [PD] httpget: fun with tcpclient and pdstring In-Reply-To: References: <817D4F60-0B09-4D36-8472-EC70AD8E892F@eds.org> Message-ID: On Mar 4, 2009, at 9:18 AM, Martin Peach wrote: > Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >> I made [httpget] for fetching webpages into pd: > > > That's nice. Now we need some html parsing objects so the pages go > into the patch and not the pd window. It works well if the received > pages are loaded into a table. I made tabfind to search a table for > a string. Tables seem more efficient than lists and less volatile. Any ideas on how to approach the HTML parsing? It seems like using an xml-based parsing library would be the way to do that. There is detox in jasch_lib, but I don't know the state of it. .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- "[W]e have invented the technology to eliminate scarcity, but we are deliberately throwing it away to benefit those who profit from scarcity." -John Gilmore From matju at artengine.ca Wed Mar 4 17:18:25 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2009 11:18:25 -0500 (EST) Subject: [PD] list issue In-Reply-To: <49AE52D1.1030004@web.de> References: <49AE52D1.1030004@web.de> Message-ID: On Wed, 4 Mar 2009, YOhannes wrote: > what i want to do is to put them randomly into the list as long as the > sum of all items in the list equals the size of the fixed value. this > seems to be pretty difficult...since i use random i cant know what the > next float will be. how to handle that? any experience with that issue ? Make a random recursive partition of the fixed value, then shuffle it. For example: * start with the list 16 (one element) * for each number in the list, throw dice to figure out whether you will replace it by two equal numbers. any new numbers shall have the same procedure reapplied to them (recursion), else I wouldn't be explaining it by saying "for each" when it's about a one-element list. this could give you, for example: 4 1 1 0.5 0.5 1 2 1 1 0.5 0.5 1 2 * a fair shuffle could give any sequence with the same number of 0.5,1,2,4 elements in it, let's say 0.5 4 1 1 0.5 2 1 0.5 2 1 0.5 1 1. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From matju at artengine.ca Wed Mar 4 17:20:38 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2009 11:20:38 -0500 (EST) Subject: [PD] evaluate 3d iterative structures In-Reply-To: <1236157708.13611.1303544469@webmail.messagingengine.com> References: <1236090608.17197.1303374423@webmail.messagingengine.com> <1236157708.13611.1303544469@webmail.messagingengine.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 4 Mar 2009, simeon cosik wrote: > hello, thanks for the reply, are you telling me to take off all the > positions of all the geos and then evaluate in other program? No, I only talked about how you are going to extract the positions out of the usual [gemhead] chains so that you can use them in whichever other way you want, which could be using pmpd, msd, gridflow, iemmatrix, pyode or whatever else. > I just checked there is a Ode version that run in pd , called pyode, i > think ode works fine for rigid body simulations, do you think this is a > good option in pd? no idea. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From ydegoyon at gmail.com Wed Mar 4 17:41:48 2009 From: ydegoyon at gmail.com (ydegoyon at gmail.com) Date: Wed, 04 Mar 2009 17:41:48 +0100 Subject: [PD] streaming audio and video in Linux In-Reply-To: <449627.93824.qm@web32402.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <449627.93824.qm@web32402.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <49AEAF4C.3090805@gmail.com> ola, > > i am not complaining too much because i am pretty happy this is just working in general... i am just looking to make it a little more efficient and i am a little confused over all the yuv/yv12 stuff that is going on and why i have to convert to rgb and back to yuv just to get it to work right - with the understanding pdp/yuv is the fastest and most efficient. > yes, pdp was all coded mostly in yuv since the beginning for efficiency and speed reasons, so we have to pass throough conversions to connect to other pieces of code. > BTW the piping stuff is really killer! although i have only been able to get it to work on linux... osx gives me a wicked big file that continuously increases in size as the stream is converted. linux just makes a 0k tmp/pipe that is very nice. i guess this is just a mencoder thing on osx obviously. > interesting bug, but it means it's not comp?tible with linux standards then, humm.. no osx here ( in all the house ) xiaoo, sevy > thanks! > m > > > > From martin.peach at sympatico.ca Wed Mar 4 17:46:50 2009 From: martin.peach at sympatico.ca (Martin Peach) Date: Wed, 04 Mar 2009 16:46:50 +0000 Subject: [PD] httpget: fun with tcpclient and pdstring In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Mathieu Bouchard wrote: >On Wed, 4 Mar 2009, Martin Peach wrote: > >>That's nice. Now we need some html parsing objects so the pages go into >>the patch and not the pd window. It works well if the received pages are >>loaded into a table. I made tabfind to search a table for a string. Tables >>seem more efficient than lists and less volatile. > >Lists are volatile because they are (typically) stack-allocated or in any >way their contract of use makes (argc,argv) only valid during the call... >so you could use a heap-allocated argv but modify it between calls and it >would still make the list data have a stack-wise accessibility. > >Because lists are volatile, they need to be copied by any object that wants >to keep them. It's actually worse than that, as objects used recursively >have to watch out for what they can deallocate. It's not like you could >make [list] be faster without complicating it... and this includes plain >data-recursion as well too (set cold-inlet of an object while its >cold-inlet has still a job pending on the stack). > >Tables can be much faster but they also need to be statically-allocated (or >dynamically-patched!), and they are type-restricted (where you can't say >that any element slot may contain any atom one decides at runtime), and you >have to find names for the tables because they can't be anonymous. Tables also use half as much memory as lists because they are mainly an array of floats, while a list of floats is actually an array of atoms, each atom comprising a tag indicating that it contains a float as well as the float itself. For the network objects the lists are made of floats so the type restriction is not important. Also a table can be reused and resized and its contents never get added to the symbol list so there's no constantly increasing memory involved. The typical web page has a huge amount of irrelevant text that would quickly clog the symbol table, so it's more efficient to extract the relevant bits before converting any of it to a symbol. Martin From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 4 19:01:31 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2009 13:01:31 -0500 Subject: [PD] httpget: fun with tcpclient and pdstring In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Mar 4, 2009, at 11:46 AM, Martin Peach wrote: > Mathieu Bouchard wrote: >> On Wed, 4 Mar 2009, Martin Peach wrote: >> >>> That's nice. Now we need some html parsing objects so the pages go >>> into the patch and not the pd window. It works well if the >>> received pages are loaded into a table. I made tabfind to search a >>> table for a string. Tables seem more efficient than lists and less >>> volatile. >> >> Lists are volatile because they are (typically) stack-allocated or >> in any way their contract of use makes (argc,argv) only valid >> during the call... so you could use a heap-allocated argv but >> modify it between calls and it would still make the list data have >> a stack-wise accessibility. >> >> Because lists are volatile, they need to be copied by any object >> that wants to keep them. It's actually worse than that, as objects >> used recursively have to watch out for what they can deallocate. >> It's not like you could make [list] be faster without complicating >> it... and this includes plain data-recursion as well too (set cold- >> inlet of an object while its cold-inlet has still a job pending on >> the stack). >> >> Tables can be much faster but they also need to be statically- >> allocated (or dynamically-patched!), and they are type-restricted >> (where you can't say that any element slot may contain any atom one >> decides at runtime), and you have to find names for the tables >> because they can't be anonymous. > > Tables also use half as much memory as lists because they are mainly > an array of floats, while a list of floats is actually an array of > atoms, each atom comprising a tag indicating that it contains a > float as well as the float itself. > For the network objects the lists are made of floats so the type > restriction is not important. > Also a table can be reused and resized and its contents never get > added to the symbol list so there's no constantly increasing memory > involved. The typical web page has a huge amount of irrelevant text > that would quickly clog the symbol table, so it's more efficient to > extract the relevant bits before converting any of it to a symbol. It seems that we should have a string.h for tables then. That would be a good starting point, just make a library that is just Pd interpretations of all the string.h strcpy, etc. functions, but have them operate on arrays and maybe lists of floats too. There could also be a totally Pd-ish string library too. .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 'You people have such restrictive dress for women,? she said, hobbling away in three inch heels and panty hose to finish out another pink- collar temp pool day. - ?Hijab Scene #2", by Mohja Kahf From moocow at ling.uni-potsdam.de Wed Mar 4 20:46:16 2009 From: moocow at ling.uni-potsdam.de (Bryan Jurish) Date: Wed, 04 Mar 2009 20:46:16 +0100 Subject: [PD] httpget: fun with tcpclient and pdstring In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49AEDA88.8070205@ling.uni-potsdam.de> adding this to the GSoC ideas wiki... actually, there's some disabled table-storage code in [pdstring] as well; perhaps I'll get a chance to polish that up sometime soon.. marmosets, Bryan On 2009-03-04 19:01:31, Hans-Christoph Steiner appears to have written: > It seems that we should have a string.h for tables then. That would > be a good starting point, just make a library that is just Pd > interpretations of all the string.h strcpy, etc. functions, but have > them operate on arrays and maybe lists of floats too. > > There could also be a totally Pd-ish string library too. -- Bryan Jurish "There is *always* one more bug." jurish at ling.uni-potsdam.de -Lubarsky's Law of Cybernetic Entomology From loic.kessous at gmail.com Wed Mar 4 21:56:45 2009 From: loic.kessous at gmail.com (Loic Kessous) Date: Wed, 4 Mar 2009 21:56:45 +0100 Subject: [PD] flext on os X In-Reply-To: <9655DD18-0D73-45A7-933C-AC24048CE38E@grrrr.org> References: <3563DAFA-DBBE-4E36-94EE-5BFDCBD6B570@gmail.com> <9655DD18-0D73-45A7-933C-AC24048CE38E@grrrr.org> Message-ID: <3857E001-EAAE-4789-9DF2-C8E13A0B8945@gmail.com> Hi, oups..... sorry I missed it... As I said everything is OK on os X for building flex, and I also can build a copied/modified version of the simple1 tutorial (called simplo1 with a 'o') to test my installation., and everything is ok. I did the same thing on linux ubuntu hardy , and I also been able to build flex, and the same copy of simple1, but when using it I get this bug : - if I open the help file for simple1 , or even one that I edited in text mode to change simple1 to simplo1 , bot of them are working. - BUT if I try to create one of them from scratch, by just doing: File > new, Put>object and typing the name , then Pd is out of order and I just can quit it. (Pd-extended 0.40.3) the ubuntu is running on a AMD 64 bit, running a 32 bit ubuntu hardy (and except this bug everything seems ok) I remember that for the optimisation flag in the config file when I installed flex, I didn't changed the 'pentium4' suggested because most of the other things that installed where also described as 'this is for intel' but where working. could it be this? should I re-install flext again by let it blank ? or put something instead of 'pentium4' ? and what? loic On Mar 4, 2009, at 9:01 PM, Thomas Grill wrote: > Hi Loic, > please direct all flext-related mails to the mailing list. > > > Am 04.03.2009 um 19:53 schrieb Loic Kessous: > >> >> I suppose if I was connected as root this would have not be a >> problem but I wonder if it would not be a problem then to run >> it...I don't know... >> >> anyway, this may help others to add the precision somewhere >> build.txt or somewher else. >> > > did you check out flext from the svn (which is the latest version)? > It's all in build.txt, just below the install commands. > > gr~~~ > From josepadovani at yahoo.com.br Wed Mar 4 22:17:04 2009 From: josepadovani at yahoo.com.br (padovani) Date: Wed, 04 Mar 2009 18:17:04 -0300 Subject: [PD] scheme or common lisp object? Message-ID: <49AEEFD0.6080906@yahoo.com.br> Is there some scheme or CL object running in PD? k_guile seems to be inactive, or am I wrong? -- http://www.padovani.googlepages.com From abonnements at revolwear.com Thu Mar 5 00:03:25 2009 From: abonnements at revolwear.com (Max) Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2009 00:03:25 +0100 Subject: [PD] pd~ to sync audio/video Message-ID: <0628D808-591E-45C8-960B-B5624DBB7A6D@revolwear.com> hi list, i am trying out if the pd~ object is an alternative for sync playback of audio and video to the ?traditional? method of using two instances of pd talking to each other by netserver/netclient. so the situation is that we need one pd instance with audio on and one without for gem. because audio needs to run without dropouts in the first process, while gem will run in the second process. to run the video in the parent process and the audio in the subprocess with pd~ doesn't work, because the main process needs audio on. (see pd~ helppatch the last lines) to run the audio in the parent process and the video in the subprocess using pd~ -noutsig 0 -ninsig 0 doesn't work because pd freezes when using these parameters on pd~ when using pd~-noutsig 0 it does work, but only if the subprocess will switch its dsp computing on for a moment it can be switched of afterwards. is it a good idea at all to use pd~ for that purpose or should i stick to the netserver/netclient solution? m. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: PGP.sig Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 194 bytes Desc: Signierter Teil der Nachricht URL: From reduzierer at yahoo.de Thu Mar 5 01:13:07 2009 From: reduzierer at yahoo.de (Roman Haefeli) Date: Thu, 05 Mar 2009 01:13:07 +0100 Subject: [PD] pd and tcp: what to do against crashes? In-Reply-To: References: <1235905522.7557.39.camel@yoyo2> <1235951524.7549.30.camel@yoyo2> <1235955557.7549.54.camel@yoyo2> <1236001621.7549.76.camel@yoyo2> <1236123916.7628.19.camel@yoyo2> <1236125488.7628.27.camel@yoyo2> Message-ID: <1236211987.7815.11.camel@yoyo2> On Wed, 2009-03-04 at 09:14 -0500, Martin Peach wrote: > > martin, would you mind implementing similar changes to [tcpclient] as > > well? > > > > > > I'll do that today if I have time. yo... no hurry.. but it seems you already did it. many thanks. those changes to [tcpserver] and [tcpclient] enable me to solve a _lot_ of issues with netpd (which currently is still based on [netclient]/[netserver]). some of them were very long standing problems, such as server hangs, and it took me also a long time to understand the underlying causes for those problems. i am very satisfied to see, that the current problems can be addressed now. i think there is nothing left to be said for now. it's definitely time to get my hands dirty again on the netpd-server and other related stuff. many thanks for your cooperation. roman ___________________________________________________________ Telefonate ohne weitere Kosten vom PC zum PC: http://messenger.yahoo.de From danomatika at gmail.com Thu Mar 5 01:52:49 2009 From: danomatika at gmail.com (danomatika) Date: Thu, 05 Mar 2009 01:52:49 +0100 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! Message-ID: <1236214369.7483.13.camel@danoT500> Do you think a valid project would be to debug pd / pd-extended 64 bit builds? After losing a few days trying to get a solid 64 build of pd +externals, I'm a bit disappointed at the current state. It's something rather boring, but would be quite useful for the future ... the next OSX (Snow Leaopard), for instance will be natively 64bit. (I assume for asking the question, I would need to be the mentor?) --- Dan Wilcox danomatika.com robotcowboy.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From THIS_IS_POP at web.de Thu Mar 5 12:21:25 2009 From: THIS_IS_POP at web.de (YOhannes) Date: Thu, 05 Mar 2009 12:21:25 +0100 Subject: [PD] list issue In-Reply-To: References: <49AE52D1.1030004@web.de> Message-ID: <49AFB5B5.6020002@web.de> thanks guys, i made a simple patch based on mathieus idea. (see attachment) i like to apply more control on listlength, without specifying it, like i would have to with [list-equalize]. now, depending on the devisor of 2, with my master-sequence of lets say 2000 (ms) i get lists with very small and very big values. for example: 15.625 1.95312 3.90625 1.95312 500 250 1000 31.25 62.5 7.8125 125 any ideas how to get smoother/smaller differences between the list-items? thanks. j -------------- next part -------------- An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: shakeitt.pd URL: -------------- next part -------------- An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: slave_seq2.pd URL: From zweitens at gmail.com Thu Mar 5 17:04:45 2009 From: zweitens at gmail.com (mrz) Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2009 11:04:45 -0500 Subject: [PD] pd and tcp: what to do against crashes? In-Reply-To: <1236211987.7815.11.camel@yoyo2> References: <1235955557.7549.54.camel@yoyo2> <1236001621.7549.76.camel@yoyo2> <1236123916.7628.19.camel@yoyo2> <1236125488.7628.27.camel@yoyo2> <1236211987.7815.11.camel@yoyo2> Message-ID: <628009480903050804xf255359o6c5323a9e5c916eb@mail.gmail.com> hi, i can't give any hints here but.. i just wanna thank you guys a lot that you're getting to solve this problem with a lot of dirty hands while mine stays clean. This problem brought us (in the past ;) ) a lot of interruption in exciting netpd-jams. all the best, moritz On Wed, Mar 4, 2009 at 7:13 PM, Roman Haefeli wrote: > On Wed, 2009-03-04 at 09:14 -0500, Martin Peach wrote: > > > > martin, would you mind implementing similar changes to [tcpclient] as > > > well? > > > > > > > > > > I'll do that today if I have time. > > yo... no hurry.. but it seems you already did it. many thanks. > > those changes to [tcpserver] and [tcpclient] enable me to solve a _lot_ > of issues with netpd (which currently is still based on > [netclient]/[netserver]). some of them were very long standing problems, > such as server hangs, and it took me also a long time to understand the > underlying causes for those problems. i am very satisfied to see, that > the current problems can be addressed now. > > i think there is nothing left to be said for now. it's definitely time > to get my hands dirty again on the netpd-server and other related > stuff. > > many thanks for your cooperation. > > roman > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > Telefonate ohne weitere Kosten vom PC zum PC: http://messenger.yahoo.de > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From matju at artengine.ca Thu Mar 5 17:07:37 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2009 11:07:37 -0500 (EST) Subject: [PD] httpget: fun with tcpclient and pdstring In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Wed, 4 Mar 2009, Martin Peach wrote: > Mathieu Bouchard wrote: >> Tables can be much faster but they also need to be statically-allocated (or >> dynamically-patched!), and they are type-restricted (where you can't say >> that any element slot may contain any atom one decides at runtime), and you >> have to find names for the tables because they can't be anonymous. > > For the network objects the lists are made of floats so the type restriction > is not important. Right, but when it comes to making reusable classes, you have to choose between type-restricted statically-allocated, and freely-typed stack-allocated, and whatever class you make for processing lists doesn't work on arrays, and whatever class you make for processing arrays doesn't work on lists. Is there any way around that problem? > Also a table can be reused and resized and its contents never get added > to the symbol list so there's no constantly increasing memory involved. The symbol-table is a separate issue. You could make use of lists with mixed floats and symbols freely in lists and always reuse the same symbols, or you could be mixing floats and pointers. > The typical web page has a huge amount of irrelevant text that would > quickly clog the symbol table, so it's more efficient to extract the > relevant bits before converting any of it to a symbol. I never ever mentioned converting a web page into a bunch of symbols. I'm concerned about the proliferation of list-operations and the duplication between list-operations and array-operations and how it will tend to inflate the number of classes and by default (if the design of classes just goes the usual way) the interfaces of those two sets of classes won't be synchronised with each other, so it will mean more documentation to make and especially more documentation to read. > Tables also use half as much memory as lists yeah, but you saw the price of RAM ? ;) _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From matju at artengine.ca Thu Mar 5 17:14:51 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2009 11:14:51 -0500 (EST) Subject: [PD] httpget: fun with tcpclient and pdstring In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Wed, 4 Mar 2009, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > It seems that we should have a string.h for tables then. That would be a > good starting point, just make a library that is just Pd interpretations of > all the string.h strcpy, etc. functions, but have them operate on arrays and > maybe lists of floats too. I very much recommend making a library that can handle both at an expense that is as close as possible to making a library for just one of them. But I believe that those list abstractions should be made for lists, and not for anythings, which is a dangerous precedent set by [list], because for example it prevents introducing a message "array $1" where $1 would be a send-symbol for an array. (Or it could be called [table]. why are there two names for that concept in pd anyway?) > There could also be a totally Pd-ish string library too. No idea what that means in your head, sorry... :/ _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From matju at artengine.ca Thu Mar 5 17:39:36 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2009 11:39:36 -0500 (EST) Subject: [PD] list issue In-Reply-To: <49AFB5B5.6020002@web.de> References: <49AE52D1.1030004@web.de> <49AFB5B5.6020002@web.de> Message-ID: On Thu, 5 Mar 2009, YOhannes wrote: > i like to apply more control on listlength, without > specifying it, like i would have to with [list-equalize]. > now, depending on the devisor of 2, with my master-sequence > of lets say 2000 (ms) i get lists with very small and very big values. > for example: > 15.625 1.95312 3.90625 1.95312 500 250 1000 31.25 62.5 7.8125 125 > any ideas how to get smoother/smaller differences between the list-items? You can also split note durations using a 2:1 ratio (2/3 + 1/3) and/or using a 3:1 ratio (3/4 + 1/4). In "normal" music this tends to happen non-recursively, that is, you would rarely ever apply such a ratio on an interval is already 2/3 or 1/3 or 3/4 of something else. But if you are ok to randomise intervals by a plain shuffle, you aren't making "normal" music anyway, so, why worry. There is music in 9/8 time-signature, and there is also music in 3/4 time-signature that has triplets inside it, but recent history has shown that people are a lot more tolerant to bottom-up rhythm construction than top-down: that is, if you take a 4/4 rhythm and split it twice in thirds, it's harder to get the mind into the beat than switch the beat to 3/4 and then split it in thirds, or just switch the whole beat to 9/8. You can also find music in 5/4, 7/8, 11/8, 13/8, 15/8, and many combinations of those in the same tune, but you will rarely have anything be split in fifths. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From jack at rybn.org Thu Mar 5 18:09:19 2009 From: jack at rybn.org (Jack) Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2009 18:09:19 +0100 Subject: [PD] Pd/GEM and camera for tracking Message-ID: <49F315F3-0FE9-402E-A841-E9281533E064@rybn.org> Hello list, I'm looking for a good camera (FireWire or USB) working on MacOSX with Pd and GEM. This camera will be used to track people in a closed space with lights. Do you know a good model for this application (industrial camera ?) ? Thanx. ++ Jack From hans at eds.org Thu Mar 5 18:25:28 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2009 12:25:28 -0500 Subject: [PD] GSoC projects: take a look and improve Message-ID: <11878E5F-9809-4525-A83E-7601C47C7397@eds.org> Hey all, Georg has been rocking out and put up a bunch of project pages on the Google Summer of Code app, Bryan and I have put up a couple as well. Take a look and improve wherever you think it needs it. It's a wiki so anyone can edit. Here is the list of the current projects for this year's application. Also, if you are a mentor, please take a look at the projects and add your name if there is any possibility that you might want to mentor that project (no commitments yet, that comes later). http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/GoogleSummerOfCodeIdeas2009 And here are all of the pages, in case you want to revive some pages from previous years: http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- "Free software means you control what your computer does. Non-free software means someone else controls that, and to some extent controls you." - Richard M. Stallman From gr at grrrr.org Thu Mar 5 18:26:10 2009 From: gr at grrrr.org (Thomas Grill) Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2009 18:26:10 +0100 Subject: [PD] flext on os X In-Reply-To: <3857E001-EAAE-4789-9DF2-C8E13A0B8945@gmail.com> References: <3563DAFA-DBBE-4E36-94EE-5BFDCBD6B570@gmail.com> <9655DD18-0D73-45A7-933C-AC24048CE38E@grrrr.org> <3857E001-EAAE-4789-9DF2-C8E13A0B8945@gmail.com> Message-ID: <03A5926A-4836-4482-A5FC-37A474E0A544@grrrr.org> Am 04.03.2009 um 21:56 schrieb Loic Kessous: > Hi, > > oups..... sorry I missed it... actually i meant the flext mailing list. > > I remember that for the optimisation flag in the config file when I > installed flex, I didn't changed the 'pentium4' suggested because most > of the other things that installed where also described as 'this is > for intel' but where working. > > could it be this? should I re-install flext again by let it blank ? > or put something instead of 'pentium4' ? and what? > you can try -march=native if your compiler supports it but i don't think that this is the source of the problem. Are you working with the SVN version? gr~~~ From cgclepper at gmail.com Thu Mar 5 18:54:33 2009 From: cgclepper at gmail.com (chris clepper) Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2009 12:54:33 -0500 Subject: [PD] Pd/GEM and camera for tracking In-Reply-To: <49F315F3-0FE9-402E-A841-E9281533E064@rybn.org> References: <49F315F3-0FE9-402E-A841-E9281533E064@rybn.org> Message-ID: Even the cheapest consumer DV camera will outperform industrial cameras costing thousands of dollars. On Thu, Mar 5, 2009 at 12:09 PM, Jack wrote: > Hello list, > > I'm looking for a good camera (FireWire or USB) working on MacOSX > with Pd and GEM. > This camera will be used to track people in a closed space with lights. > Do you know a good model for this application (industrial camera ?) ? > Thanx. > ++ > > Jack > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jaime.oliver2 at gmail.com Thu Mar 5 19:04:40 2009 From: jaime.oliver2 at gmail.com (Jaime Oliver) Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2009 10:04:40 -0800 Subject: [PD] Pd/GEM and camera for tracking In-Reply-To: References: <49F315F3-0FE9-402E-A841-E9281533E064@rybn.org> Message-ID: <616283880903051004m4e56791dnc64f8840736929b1@mail.gmail.com> yeah, just make sure it is uncompressed fw to avoid latency. On Thu, Mar 5, 2009 at 9:54 AM, chris clepper wrote: > Even the cheapest consumer DV camera will outperform industrial cameras > costing thousands of dollars. > > > On Thu, Mar 5, 2009 at 12:09 PM, Jack wrote: > >> Hello list, >> >> I'm looking for a good camera (FireWire or USB) working on MacOSX >> with Pd and GEM. >> This camera will be used to track people in a closed space with lights. >> Do you know a good model for this application (industrial camera ?) ? >> Thanx. >> ++ >> >> Jack >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > -- Jaime E Oliver LR joliverl at ucsd.edu www.realidadvisual.org/jaimeoliver www-crca.ucsd.edu/ www.realidadvisual.org 858 202 1522 9168 Regents Rd. Apt. G La Jolla, CA 92037 USA -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jack at rybn.org Thu Mar 5 19:05:02 2009 From: jack at rybn.org (Jack) Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2009 19:05:02 +0100 Subject: [PD] Pd/GEM and camera for tracking In-Reply-To: References: <49F315F3-0FE9-402E-A841-E9281533E064@rybn.org> Message-ID: <50F7D30D-386D-4689-BF82-57AB295B93BB@rybn.org> Thanks for your answer Chris. Do you know a specific model working with Pd and GEM on MacOSX ? ++ Jack Le 5 mars 09 ? 18:54, chris clepper a ?crit : > Even the cheapest consumer DV camera will outperform industrial > cameras costing thousands of dollars. > > On Thu, Mar 5, 2009 at 12:09 PM, Jack wrote: > Hello list, > > I'm looking for a good camera (FireWire or USB) working on MacOSX > with Pd and GEM. > This camera will be used to track people in a closed space with > lights. > Do you know a good model for this application (industrial camera ?) ? > Thanx. > ++ > > Jack > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/ > listinfo/pd-list > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jack at rybn.org Thu Mar 5 19:08:46 2009 From: jack at rybn.org (Jack) Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2009 19:08:46 +0100 Subject: [PD] Pd/GEM and camera for tracking In-Reply-To: <616283880903051004m4e56791dnc64f8840736929b1@mail.gmail.com> References: <49F315F3-0FE9-402E-A841-E9281533E064@rybn.org> <616283880903051004m4e56791dnc64f8840736929b1@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Thanks Jaime, i start to understand. What is the length of FireWire cable for a Mac with FireWire 800 port can i use ? ++ Jack Le 5 mars 09 ? 19:04, Jaime Oliver a ?crit : > yeah, just make sure it is uncompressed fw to avoid latency. > > On Thu, Mar 5, 2009 at 9:54 AM, chris clepper > wrote: > Even the cheapest consumer DV camera will outperform industrial > cameras costing thousands of dollars. > > > On Thu, Mar 5, 2009 at 12:09 PM, Jack wrote: > Hello list, > > I'm looking for a good camera (FireWire or USB) working on MacOSX > with Pd and GEM. > This camera will be used to track people in a closed space with > lights. > Do you know a good model for this application (industrial camera ?) ? > Thanx. > ++ > > Jack > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/ > listinfo/pd-list > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/ > listinfo/pd-list > > > > > -- > Jaime E Oliver LR > > joliverl at ucsd.edu > www.realidadvisual.org/jaimeoliver > www-crca.ucsd.edu/ > www.realidadvisual.org > > 858 202 1522 > 9168 Regents Rd. Apt. G > La Jolla, CA 92037 > USA -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From conorhigginsmaxmsp at gmail.com Thu Mar 5 19:13:59 2009 From: conorhigginsmaxmsp at gmail.com (Conor Higgins) Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2009 18:13:59 +0000 Subject: [PD] Pd/GEM and camera for tracking In-Reply-To: <50F7D30D-386D-4689-BF82-57AB295B93BB@rybn.org> References: <49F315F3-0FE9-402E-A841-E9281533E064@rybn.org> <50F7D30D-386D-4689-BF82-57AB295B93BB@rybn.org> Message-ID: <77B16377-7AB2-4AC5-8D18-1FF8B8426B91@gmail.com> Sony Handycams are pretty good but you need to make sure that you can mount it on a tripod and charge it at the same time. I have had a lot of problems using some models of them, as the quality is excellent, they work with firewire but some models will only allow a firewire cable to be hooked up to it when it is in its charging dock. Make sure you avoid that... Conor On 5 Mar 2009, at 18:05, Jack wrote: > Thanks for your answer Chris. > Do you know a specific model working with Pd and GEM on MacOSX ? > ++ > > Jack > > > Le 5 mars 09 ? 18:54, chris clepper a ?crit : > >> Even the cheapest consumer DV camera will outperform industrial >> cameras costing thousands of dollars. >> >> On Thu, Mar 5, 2009 at 12:09 PM, Jack wrote: >> Hello list, >> >> I'm looking for a good camera (FireWire or USB) working on MacOSX >> with Pd and GEM. >> This camera will be used to track people in a closed space with >> lights. >> Do you know a good model for this application (industrial camera ?) ? >> Thanx. >> ++ >> >> Jack >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cgclepper at gmail.com Thu Mar 5 19:19:35 2009 From: cgclepper at gmail.com (chris clepper) Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2009 13:19:35 -0500 Subject: [PD] Pd/GEM and camera for tracking In-Reply-To: <616283880903051004m4e56791dnc64f8840736929b1@mail.gmail.com> References: <49F315F3-0FE9-402E-A841-E9281533E064@rybn.org> <616283880903051004m4e56791dnc64f8840736929b1@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Latency is mostly affected by the device driver for any source. Even some of the professional capture boards have relatively high latency, but typically Firewire or USB based devices will have much higher processing time in the driver than an uncompressed PCIe card. On Thu, Mar 5, 2009 at 1:04 PM, Jaime Oliver wrote: > yeah, just make sure it is uncompressed fw to avoid latency. > > > On Thu, Mar 5, 2009 at 9:54 AM, chris clepper wrote: > >> Even the cheapest consumer DV camera will outperform industrial cameras >> costing thousands of dollars. >> >> >> On Thu, Mar 5, 2009 at 12:09 PM, Jack wrote: >> >>> Hello list, >>> >>> I'm looking for a good camera (FireWire or USB) working on MacOSX >>> with Pd and GEM. >>> This camera will be used to track people in a closed space with lights. >>> Do you know a good model for this application (industrial camera ?) ? >>> Thanx. >>> ++ >>> >>> Jack >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> >> > > > -- > Jaime E Oliver LR > > joliverl at ucsd.edu > www.realidadvisual.org/jaimeoliver > www-crca.ucsd.edu/ > www.realidadvisual.org > > 858 202 1522 > 9168 Regents Rd. Apt. G > La Jolla, CA 92037 > USA > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pkstone at ucdavis.edu Thu Mar 5 20:42:34 2009 From: pkstone at ucdavis.edu (Phil Stone) Date: Thu, 05 Mar 2009 11:42:34 -0800 Subject: [PD] music made with Pd Message-ID: <49B02B2A.2000507@ucdavis.edu> Hi, I'm trying out this website called soundcloud.com, which seems to be a fairly decent way of sharing music without much nonsense. Anyway, I uploaded a recent piece I made (completely with Pd, naturally!): http://soundcloud.com/putahslim/intrinsic Phil From grh at mur.at Thu Mar 5 21:02:29 2009 From: grh at mur.at (Georg Holzmann) Date: Thu, 05 Mar 2009 21:02:29 +0100 Subject: [PD] GSoC projects: take a look and improve In-Reply-To: <11878E5F-9809-4525-A83E-7601C47C7397@eds.org> References: <11878E5F-9809-4525-A83E-7601C47C7397@eds.org> Message-ID: <49B02FD5.9040200@mur.at> Hallo! Yes, please add/correct things to the projects, create new content etc. We will clean it up then at the last day ! To the categories: are the understandable ? Because I am not really happy with them ... Maybe we should order them like this: - pd patches - pd externals (C or Tcl knowledge required) - projects which touch the pd internals LG Georg Hans-Christoph Steiner schrieb: > Hey all, > > Georg has been rocking out and put up a bunch of project pages on the > Google Summer of Code app, Bryan and I have put up a couple as well. > Take a look and improve wherever you think it needs it. It's a wiki > so anyone can edit. > > Here is the list of the current projects for this year's application. > Also, if you are a mentor, please take a look at the projects and add > your name if there is any possibility that you might want to mentor > that project (no commitments yet, that comes later). > > http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/GoogleSummerOfCodeIdeas2009 > > And here are all of the pages, in case you want to revive some pages > from previous years: > > http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code > > .hc > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > "Free software means you control what your computer does. Non-free > software means someone else controls that, and to some extent controls > you." - Richard M. Stallman > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From hans at eds.org Thu Mar 5 21:16:43 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2009 15:16:43 -0500 Subject: [PD] httpget: fun with tcpclient and pdstring In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <3930C1D8-5F05-4631-8A2B-CB88BA812969@eds.org> On Mar 5, 2009, at 11:14 AM, Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > On Wed, 4 Mar 2009, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >> It seems that we should have a string.h for tables then. That >> would be a good starting point, just make a library that is just Pd >> interpretations of all the string.h strcpy, etc. functions, but >> have them operate on arrays and maybe lists of floats too. > > I very much recommend making a library that can handle both at an > expense that is as close as possible to making a library for just > one of them. > > But I believe that those list abstractions should be made for lists, > and not for anythings, which is a dangerous precedent set by [list], > because for example it prevents introducing a message "array $1" > where $1 would be a send-symbol for an array. (Or it could be called > [table]. why are there two names for that concept in pd anyway?) I think that [array $1( would be better represented by an argument and a matching inlet. I think that's clearer than using [array $1(. .hc > > >> There could also be a totally Pd-ish string library too. > > No idea what that means in your head, sorry... :/ > > _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... > | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- News is what people want to keep hidden and everything else is publicity. - Bill Moyers From hans at eds.org Thu Mar 5 21:38:46 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2009 15:38:46 -0500 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <1236214369.7483.13.camel@danoT500> References: <1236214369.7483.13.camel@danoT500> Message-ID: <7223A0F4-49DA-421E-8FFB-7324EF1246C2@eds.org> Yes, that's a great project. Add it to the wiki! .hc On Mar 4, 2009, at 7:52 PM, danomatika wrote: > > Do you think a valid project would be to debug pd / pd-extended 64 > bit builds? After losing a few days trying to get a solid 64 build > of pd+externals, I'm a bit disappointed at the current state. It's > something rather boring, but would be quite useful for the > future ... the next OSX (Snow Leaopard), for instance will be > natively 64bit. (I assume for asking the question, I would need to > be the mentor?) > > --- > Dan Wilcox > danomatika.com > robotcowboy.com > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- "[W]e have invented the technology to eliminate scarcity, but we are deliberately throwing it away to benefit those who profit from scarcity." -John Gilmore -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jancsika at yahoo.com Thu Mar 5 22:52:05 2009 From: jancsika at yahoo.com (Jonathan Wilkes) Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2009 13:52:05 -0800 (PST) Subject: [PD] list issue In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <290242.75993.qm@web65603.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> --- On Thu, 3/5/09, Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > From: Mathieu Bouchard > Subject: Re: [PD] list issue > To: "YOhannes" > Cc: pd-list at iem.at > Date: Thursday, March 5, 2009, 5:39 PM > On Thu, 5 Mar 2009, YOhannes wrote: > > > i like to apply more control on listlength, without > > specifying it, like i would have to with > [list-equalize]. > > now, depending on the devisor of 2, with my > master-sequence > > of lets say 2000 (ms) i get lists with very small and > very big values. > > for example: > > 15.625 1.95312 3.90625 1.95312 500 250 1000 31.25 62.5 > 7.8125 125 > > any ideas how to get smoother/smaller differences > between the list-items? > > You can also split note durations using a 2:1 ratio (2/3 + > 1/3) and/or using a 3:1 ratio (3/4 + 1/4). In > "normal" music this tends to happen > non-recursively, that is, you would rarely ever apply such a > ratio on an interval is already 2/3 or 1/3 or 3/4 of > something else. But if you are ok to randomise intervals by > a plain shuffle, you aren't making "normal" > music anyway, so, why worry. > > There is music in 9/8 time-signature, and there is also > music in 3/4 time-signature that has triplets inside it, but > recent history has shown that people are a lot more tolerant > to bottom-up rhythm construction than top-down: that is, if > you take a 4/4 rhythm and split it twice in thirds, it's > harder to get the mind into the beat than switch the beat to > 3/4 and then split it in thirds, or just switch the whole > beat to 9/8. > > You can also find music in 5/4, 7/8, 11/8, 13/8, 15/8, and > many combinations of those in the same tune, but you will > rarely have anything be split in fifths. Unless you happen to be listening to Carter, Cowell, Ferneyhough, Johnston, Nancarrow, or anyone who has ever happened to use a quintuplet (Chopin, Elvin Jones, maybe Al Pacino in "Heat") -Jonathan > > _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ > _____________________ ... > | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, > Qu?bec_______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From jack at rybn.org Thu Mar 5 23:22:38 2009 From: jack at rybn.org (Jack) Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2009 23:22:38 +0100 Subject: [PD] Pd/GEM and camera for tracking In-Reply-To: <77B16377-7AB2-4AC5-8D18-1FF8B8426B91@gmail.com> References: <49F315F3-0FE9-402E-A841-E9281533E064@rybn.org> <50F7D30D-386D-4689-BF82-57AB295B93BB@rybn.org> <77B16377-7AB2-4AC5-8D18-1FF8B8426B91@gmail.com> Message-ID: Thanx for the reply. The models are too big for me. I need a smaller camera (something like a cube) because the installation must be discreet. Have you something else to suggest ? Chris : what do you think about Sony driver ? I can't use a PCI card because i will work with a macmini. ++ Jack Le 5 mars 09 ? 19:13, Conor Higgins a ?crit : > Sony Handycams are pretty good but you need to make sure that you > can mount it on a tripod and charge it at the same time. I have had > a lot of problems using some models of them, as the quality is > excellent, they work with firewire but some models will only allow > a firewire cable to be hooked up to it when it is in its charging > dock. Make sure you avoid that... > > Conor > > > On 5 Mar 2009, at 18:05, Jack wrote: > >> Thanks for your answer Chris. >> Do you know a specific model working with Pd and GEM on MacOSX ? >> ++ >> >> Jack >> >> >> Le 5 mars 09 ? 18:54, chris clepper a ?crit : >> >>> Even the cheapest consumer DV camera will outperform industrial >>> cameras costing thousands of dollars. >>> >>> On Thu, Mar 5, 2009 at 12:09 PM, Jack wrote: >>> Hello list, >>> >>> I'm looking for a good camera (FireWire or USB) working on MacOSX >>> with Pd and GEM. >>> This camera will be used to track people in a closed space with >>> lights. >>> Do you know a good model for this application (industrial >>> camera ?) ? >>> Thanx. >>> ++ >>> >>> Jack >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/ >>> listinfo/pd-list >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/ >> listinfo/pd-list > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jaime.oliver2 at gmail.com Thu Mar 5 23:48:31 2009 From: jaime.oliver2 at gmail.com (Jaime Oliver) Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2009 14:48:31 -0800 Subject: [PD] Pd/GEM and camera for tracking In-Reply-To: References: <49F315F3-0FE9-402E-A841-E9281533E064@rybn.org> <616283880903051004m4e56791dnc64f8840736929b1@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <616283880903051448v69148381sd082c18b89115ed1@mail.gmail.com> mmh, I don't really know about lengths. I think there is a limit to how long your firewire cable should be. I usually work with analog cameras in linux where cables can be long ad I capture with a pci card. I think a cheap option that I've seen working well with macs is the unibrain fire-i: http://www.unibrain.com/Products/VisionImg/Fire_i_DC.htm you can buy lenses and chain them, not more than 30fps though, J On Thu, Mar 5, 2009 at 10:08 AM, Jack wrote: > Thanks Jaime, i start to understand.What is the length of FireWire cable > for a Mac with FireWire 800 port can i use ? > ++ > > Jack > > > Le 5 mars 09 ? 19:04, Jaime Oliver a ?crit : > > yeah, just make sure it is uncompressed fw to avoid latency. > > On Thu, Mar 5, 2009 at 9:54 AM, chris clepper wrote: > >> Even the cheapest consumer DV camera will outperform industrial cameras >> costing thousands of dollars. >> >> >> On Thu, Mar 5, 2009 at 12:09 PM, Jack wrote: >> >>> Hello list, >>> >>> I'm looking for a good camera (FireWire or USB) working on MacOSX >>> with Pd and GEM. >>> This camera will be used to track people in a closed space with lights. >>> Do you know a good model for this application (industrial camera ?) ? >>> Thanx. >>> ++ >>> >>> Jack >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> >> > > > -- > Jaime E Oliver LR > > joliverl at ucsd.edu > www.realidadvisual.org/jaimeoliver > www-crca.ucsd.edu/ > www.realidadvisual.org > > 858 202 1522 > 9168 Regents Rd. Apt. G > La Jolla, CA 92037 > USA > > > -- Jaime E Oliver LR joliverl at ucsd.edu www.realidadvisual.org/jaimeoliver www-crca.ucsd.edu/ www.realidadvisual.org 858 202 1522 9168 Regents Rd. Apt. G La Jolla, CA 92037 USA -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From danomatika at gmail.com Fri Mar 6 00:06:54 2009 From: danomatika at gmail.com (danomatika) Date: Fri, 06 Mar 2009 00:06:54 +0100 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <7223A0F4-49DA-421E-8FFB-7324EF1246C2@eds.org> References: <1236214369.7483.13.camel@danoT500> <7223A0F4-49DA-421E-8FFB-7324EF1246C2@eds.org> Message-ID: <1236294414.8960.0.camel@danoT500> Ok, I added it to the project wiki: http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/Debug64Bit On Thu, 2009-03-05 at 15:38 -0500, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > > Yes, that's a great project. Add it to the wiki! > > > .hc > > > > On Mar 4, 2009, at 7:52 PM, danomatika wrote: > > > > > > > Do you think a valid project would be to debug pd / pd-extended 64 > > bit builds? After losing a few days trying to get a solid 64 build > > of pd+externals, I'm a bit disappointed at the current state. It's > > something rather boring, but would be quite useful for the > > future ... the next OSX (Snow Leaopard), for instance will be > > natively 64bit. (I assume for asking the question, I would need to > > be the mentor?) > > > > --- > > Dan Wilcox > > danomatika.com > > robotcowboy.com > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > "[W]e have invented the technology to eliminate scarcity, but we are > deliberately throwing it away to benefit those who profit from > scarcity." -John Gilmore > > > > > --- Dan Wilcox danomatika.com robotcowboy.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hans at eds.org Fri Mar 6 00:56:18 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2009 18:56:18 -0500 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <1236294414.8960.0.camel@danoT500> References: <1236214369.7483.13.camel@danoT500> <7223A0F4-49DA-421E-8FFB-7324EF1246C2@eds.org> <1236294414.8960.0.camel@danoT500> Message-ID: Wow, nice, very thorough. I think this wiki will end up being a good reference for people who want to take on projects no matter if we get it or now. Dan, could you add your name and gmail account to the list of mentors (yes, it has to be gmail): http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/GSoCOrganizationApp2009 .hc On Mar 5, 2009, at 6:06 PM, danomatika wrote: > Ok, I added it to the project wiki: http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/Debug64Bit > > On Thu, 2009-03-05 at 15:38 -0500, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >> >> >> >> Yes, that's a great project. Add it to the wiki! >> >> >> .hc >> >> On Mar 4, 2009, at 7:52 PM, danomatika wrote: >> >>> >>> Do you think a valid project would be to debug pd / pd-extended 64 >>> bit builds? After losing a few days trying to get a solid 64 >>> build of pd+externals, I'm a bit disappointed at the current >>> state. It's something rather boring, but would be quite useful >>> for the future ... the next OSX (Snow Leaopard), for instance will >>> be natively 64bit. (I assume for asking the question, I would >>> need to be the mentor?) >>> >>> --- >>> Dan Wilcox >>> danomatika.com >>> robotcowboy.com >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> >> >> >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> >> "[W]e have invented the technology to eliminate scarcity, but we >> are deliberately throwing it away to benefit those who profit from >> scarcity." -John Gilmore >> >> >> > --- > Dan Wilcox > danomatika.com > robotcowboy.com ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Looking at things from a more basic level, you can come up with a more direct solution... It may sound small in theory, but it in practice, it can change entire economies. - Amy Smith -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hans at eds.org Fri Mar 6 01:22:29 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2009 19:22:29 -0500 Subject: [PD] external for sample loop start and end points? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <64DA371C-3889-4C3B-9E7E-034A040BB5C5@eds.org> That would be very handy to have, since other apps use that wav info. It wouldn't be too hard to write one, I am sure there is a library which handles the hard parts. .hc On Mar 2, 2009, at 9:51 AM, Ingo Scherzinger wrote: > Hi, > > I am looking for an external that can read the sample loop start and > end points of a .wav file. > I found [wavinfo] but that doesn?t do the trick ? no loop info! > > It would be great if anybody knew anything like that! > > Thank you, Ingo > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- If you are not part of the solution, you are part of the problem. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From matju at artengine.ca Fri Mar 6 01:29:13 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2009 19:29:13 -0500 (EST) Subject: [PD] list issue In-Reply-To: <290242.75993.qm@web65603.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> References: <290242.75993.qm@web65603.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 5 Mar 2009, Jonathan Wilkes wrote: > Unless you happen to be listening to Carter, Cowell, Ferneyhough, > Johnston, Nancarrow, or anyone who has ever happened to use a quintuplet > (Chopin, Elvin Jones, maybe Al Pacino in "Heat") I didn't say that quintuplets don't happen! I mean that quintuplets are relatively rare, and they rarely are used that much in one piece. You could take a complete piece of 5/4 and write it 4/4 and it would have quintuplets all over, and so you could take a piece that is mostly made of quintuplets and disguise it as a 5/4 without quintuplets, but if it wasn't all made of quintuplets, then the result should have some kind of anti-quintuplets, that is, multiplying the note durations by 1.25 times instead of 0.8 times. But I've never seen this in one notational form or another. Independently of how it's written, I've never heard it either. So, there is this asymmetry whereby you can find plenty of patterns of accretion of durations in multiples of 5, but not much splitting of durations in multiples of 5. I'd be glad to get references to specific pieces that contain a lot of quintuplets. Of the five composers you named, I only heard Nancarrow, I only heard of Nancarrow, and then, I don't recall any quintuplets in it, but I didn't see the score and perhaps I couldn't grasp the rhythm of it just by ear (?). It reminds me, I once applied in music composition at UQ?M, but when they sent me a letter telling me they wanted to test my piano skills with sheet music, I didn't reply, because I don't have any piano skills and can't read sheet music in realtime. The only instrument I was really ever proficient with was ScreamTracker, and boy did I abuse that thing. I made pieces in 21/8 time and whatnot. I found that notation much easier to deal with than classical notation... except for making quintuplets, that is. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From matju at artengine.ca Fri Mar 6 01:34:47 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2009 19:34:47 -0500 (EST) Subject: [PD] httpget: fun with tcpclient and pdstring In-Reply-To: <3930C1D8-5F05-4631-8A2B-CB88BA812969@eds.org> References: <3930C1D8-5F05-4631-8A2B-CB88BA812969@eds.org> Message-ID: On Thu, 5 Mar 2009, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > On Mar 5, 2009, at 11:14 AM, Mathieu Bouchard wrote: >> I very much recommend making a library that can handle both at an expense >> that is as close as possible to making a library for just one of them. >> But I believe that those list abstractions should be made for lists, and >> not for anythings, which is a dangerous precedent set by [list], because >> for example it prevents introducing a message "array $1" where $1 would be >> a send-symbol for an array. (Or it could be called [table]. why are there >> two names for that concept in pd anyway?) > I think that [array $1( would be better represented by an argument and a > matching inlet. I think that's clearer than using [array $1(. I've never seen an object have two different hot inlets doing the same thing for different types and two different cold inlets doing the same thing for different types. This is probably not what you mean, and if it's not, then you have to know that I'm talking about making classes that each can support both lists and array-names for each of the arguments to an operation. This is what I am talking about, and not about classes that support just arrays. >>> There could also be a totally Pd-ish string library too. >> No idea what that means in your head, sorry... :/ And I still don't know what that means, sorry again. :( _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From martin.peach at sympatico.ca Fri Mar 6 03:45:00 2009 From: martin.peach at sympatico.ca (Martin Peach) Date: Thu, 05 Mar 2009 21:45:00 -0500 Subject: [PD] httpget: fun with tcpclient and pdstring In-Reply-To: References: <3930C1D8-5F05-4631-8A2B-CB88BA812969@eds.org> Message-ID: Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > On Thu, 5 Mar 2009, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >> On Mar 5, 2009, at 11:14 AM, Mathieu Bouchard wrote: >>> I very much recommend making a library that can handle both at an >>> expense that is as close as possible to making a library for just one >>> of them. >>> But I believe that those list abstractions should be made for lists, >>> and not for anythings, which is a dangerous precedent set by [list], >>> because for example it prevents introducing a message "array $1" >>> where $1 would be a send-symbol for an array. (Or it could be called >>> [table]. why are there two names for that concept in pd anyway?) >> I think that [array $1( would be better represented by an argument and >> a matching inlet. I think that's clearer than using [array $1(. > > I've never seen an object have two different hot inlets doing the same > thing for different types and two different cold inlets doing the same > thing for different types. This is probably not what you mean, and if > it's not, then you have to know that I'm talking about making classes > that each can support both lists and array-names for each of the > arguments to an operation. This is what I am talking about, and not > about classes that support just arrays. > Yes it seems to me a string manipulation object like [strncmp] should be able to accept symbols, floats, lists of floats, and messages naming arrays, on any of its inlets that are meant to accept strings. Maybe it should be [arrble $1( or [tabray $1( so as not to prefer one over the other. Martin From matju at artengine.ca Fri Mar 6 04:19:51 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2009 22:19:51 -0500 (EST) Subject: [PD] httpget: fun with tcpclient and pdstring In-Reply-To: References: <3930C1D8-5F05-4631-8A2B-CB88BA812969@eds.org> Message-ID: On Thu, 5 Mar 2009, Martin Peach wrote: > Yes it seems to me a string manipulation object like [strncmp] should be able > to accept symbols, floats, lists of floats, and messages naming arrays, on > any of its inlets that are meant to accept strings. By floats, you mean a single float representing a single character? If not, then I suppose that any string made of individual float messages would have to be converted to a list of floats first, so that it goes well with all equivalent forms that use a single message per string. But now, La Question Qui Tue: if you do a [string append] on two strings of different format, what should be the format of the output? Actually, there's another killer question: if you do a [string append] on two arrays, and that it is agreed that the output should go in an array, in which array does the output go? > Maybe it should be [arrble $1( or [tabray $1( so as not to prefer one over > the other. The problem with that is that the big-endians will think that "arrble" connotes racial discrimination in favour of arrays whereas little-endians will claim that it is "tabray" that is favoured. A more politically correct way of constructing a new term would be by interleaving the letters from both words (inspired by INTERCAL), like "atrarbalye" or "taarbrlaey". This does not really solve the problem but it reduces it by a large factor so that you can conveniently sweep it under the carpet without making too much of an unsightly lump. This is the glory of Psychological Engineering at work. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From jancsika at yahoo.com Fri Mar 6 05:38:20 2009 From: jancsika at yahoo.com (Jonathan Wilkes) Date: Thu, 5 Mar 2009 20:38:20 -0800 (PST) Subject: [PD] list issue [Off-topic] In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <474462.46976.qm@web65612.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> --- On Fri, 3/6/09, Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > From: Mathieu Bouchard > Subject: Re: [PD] list issue > To: "Jonathan Wilkes" > Cc: "YOhannes" , pd-list at iem.at > Date: Friday, March 6, 2009, 1:29 AM > On Thu, 5 Mar 2009, Jonathan Wilkes wrote: > > > Unless you happen to be listening to Carter, Cowell, > Ferneyhough, Johnston, Nancarrow, or anyone who has ever > happened to use a quintuplet (Chopin, Elvin Jones, maybe Al > Pacino in "Heat") > > I didn't say that quintuplets don't happen! > > I mean that quintuplets are relatively rare, and they > rarely are used that much in one piece. You could take a > complete piece of 5/4 and write it 4/4 and it would have > quintuplets all over, and so you could take a piece that is > mostly made of quintuplets and disguise it as a 5/4 without > quintuplets, but if it wasn't all made of quintuplets, > then the result should have some kind of anti-quintuplets, > that is, multiplying the note durations by 1.25 times > instead of 0.8 times. But I've never seen this in one > notational form or another. Independently of how it's > written, I've never heard it either. You don't see that because composers generally don't hide quintuplets by adjusting the time signature. Put anything intended for human musicians into 5/4, for example, and then you must subdivide the measure-- 3+2, 2+3, etc.-- because that's the first thing a player will want to know/feel when reading it. So now each measure has some assymetrical subdivision. Then any "anti-quintuplets" would have to be shown as tuplets (e.g., 4 in the space of 5), which, even if there are fewer of them, would be unecessarily complex because common time is, well, common, symmetrical, and easier to subdivide. With quintuplets, there isn't (or at least ideally shouldn't be) an implicit hierarchy of beats within the quintuplet. I think that's why they are favored in late-Romantic piano music, like Scriabin's Prelude No. 1, Op. 15, to get a kind of floating, improvisatory quality in a melody against the underlying pulse. The "anti-quintuplets" here would be everything that's notated in the standard fashion. > > So, there is this asymmetry whereby you can find plenty of > patterns of accretion of durations in multiples of 5, but > not much splitting of durations in multiples of 5. You see plenty of examples of what Kyle Gann, in his Nancarrow biography, calls divisive rhythm-- dividing a measure up into groups of 5, 7, etc.-- in Schoenberg and many others. There was evidently a big divide between supporters of this procedure, and the additive procedure of Stravinsky et al of building asymmetrical rhythmic groups from a common small subdivision like the 16th-note. But for divisive rhythm, subdividing three or four levels deep quickly gets complicated and hard to read/conceptualize/perform/etc. Many of Stockhausen's early scores (ab)use this degree of complexity. He and others from the 50s evidently didn't find the need to stick strictly to one type of asymmetrical division, however-- there are triplets, nested in quintuplets, nested in whatever. But who knows, maybe there's some integral serialist "pioneer" out there who decided to break with convention and write a piece only using nested quintuplets. Henry Cowell divised a system of notation for things like "fifth-notes" in his book "New Musical Resources" from 1930. I think he actually used them in Quartet Romantic, though I haven't seen the score in a while. > > I'd be glad to get references to specific pieces that > contain a lot of quintuplets. Of the five composers you > named, I only heard Nancarrow, I only heard of Nancarrow, > and then, I don't recall any quintuplets in it, but I > didn't see the score and perhaps I couldn't grasp > the rhythm of it just by ear (?). What is the nature of the rhythm you're trying to grasp by ear? If it's rhythm within a common pulse that divides strictly into subdivisions of fives (instead of twos), I don't think I know examples of any music that do that. But it's intriguing to think about some kind of dance music being written with this constraint. What I have heard are a) quintuplets to notate an independent tempo in a multi-tempo context: Elliott Carter's "A Mirror in Which to Dwell" b) quintuplets as obsessively/excessively written-out rubato: Ben Johnston's "Sonata for Microtonal Piano" and c) tempo ratios like 4/5/6 in Nancarrow's Study No. 49. There's also the music of Brian Ferneyhough, which I don't know as well as the others. But it's basically divisive rhythm in which long pulses are divided up into any number of large and small nested tuplets. In this case the large tuplets have the effect of changing the tempo within the larger pulse. I'm guessing if you took the patch that's part of this thread and periodically randomized the type of beat divisions, you'd end up with similar-sounding rhythms, with the restriction that any nested tuplet would divide into the same number of parts as it's parent. > > It reminds me, I once applied in music composition at > UQ?M, but when they sent me a letter telling me they wanted > to test my piano skills with sheet music, I didn't > reply, because I don't have any piano skills and > can't read sheet music in realtime. The only instrument > I was really ever proficient with was ScreamTracker, and boy > did I abuse that thing. I made pieces in 21/8 time and > whatnot. I found that notation much easier to deal with than > classical notation... except for making quintuplets, that > is. So did you have to make your quintuplets in another program and then import them? > > _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ > _____________________ ... > | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, > Qu?bec From martin.peach at sympatico.ca Fri Mar 6 05:42:50 2009 From: martin.peach at sympatico.ca (Martin Peach) Date: Thu, 05 Mar 2009 23:42:50 -0500 Subject: [PD] httpget: fun with tcpclient and pdstring In-Reply-To: References: <3930C1D8-5F05-4631-8A2B-CB88BA812969@eds.org> Message-ID: Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > On Thu, 5 Mar 2009, Martin Peach wrote: > >> Yes it seems to me a string manipulation object like [strncmp] should >> be able to accept symbols, floats, lists of floats, and messages >> naming arrays, on any of its inlets that are meant to accept strings. > > By floats, you mean a single float representing a single character? If > not, then I suppose that any string made of individual float messages > would have to be converted to a list of floats first, so that it goes > well with all equivalent forms that use a single message per string. Yes single character, any unicode character will fit in a float. > > But now, La Question Qui Tue: if you do a [string append] on two strings > of different format, what should be the format of the output? The first argument of the object would be the name of a table, with a [set( message to change it. > > Actually, there's another killer question: if you do a [string append] > on two arrays, and that it is agreed that the output should go in an > array, in which array does the output go? > If it's like a [strcat] it goes into the table named by its first argument, or the most recent [set( message. I think instead of using zero to terminate the string the destination table should be resized to the length of the resulting string. >> Maybe it should be [arrble $1( or [tabray $1( so as not to prefer one >> over the other. > > The problem with that is that the big-endians will think that "arrble" > connotes racial discrimination in favour of arrays whereas > little-endians will claim that it is "tabray" that is favoured. A more > politically correct way of constructing a new term would be by > interleaving the letters from both words (inspired by INTERCAL), like > "atrarbalye" or "taarbrlaey". This does not really solve the problem but > it reduces it by a large factor so that you can conveniently sweep it > under the carpet without making too much of an unsightly lump. This is > the glory of Psychological Engineering at work. > But little-endians might just get confused by "elbrra" and "yarbat"...I think "eylabrarta" and "yealrbraat" would just compound the problem. Martin From ichabod at gmail.com Fri Mar 6 08:21:11 2009 From: ichabod at gmail.com (Ichabod) Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2009 02:21:11 -0500 Subject: [PD] list issue In-Reply-To: References: <290242.75993.qm@web65603.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Thu, Mar 5, 2009 at 7:29 PM, Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > On Thu, 5 Mar 2009, Jonathan Wilkes wrote: > > Unless you happen to be listening to Carter, Cowell, Ferneyhough, >> Johnston, Nancarrow, or anyone who has ever happened to use a quintuplet >> (Chopin, Elvin Jones, maybe Al Pacino in "Heat") > > This reminds me, I was just reading The Negative Dialectics of Poodle Play by Ben Watson, and he quotes an interview with Frank Zappa about his favorite records: "'Can I Come Over Tonight' ? The Velours. Any musicologist that can find that record and listen to the bass singer ... he's singing quintuplets and septulets. And considering where it came from and when it was made (it was on the East Coast Onyx label) it was amazing." Judge for yourself: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d-eO1TIgT8A http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Tn9TONsftM --Stefan -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ichabod at gmail.com Fri Mar 6 08:35:35 2009 From: ichabod at gmail.com (Ichabod) Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2009 02:35:35 -0500 Subject: [PD] music made with Pd In-Reply-To: <49B02B2A.2000507@ucdavis.edu> References: <49B02B2A.2000507@ucdavis.edu> Message-ID: Excellent! I like how it has a minimal feel but still sounds quite complete. --Stefan On Thu, Mar 5, 2009 at 2:42 PM, Phil Stone wrote: > Hi, > > I'm trying out this website called soundcloud.com, which seems to be a > fairly decent way of sharing music without much nonsense. Anyway, I > uploaded a recent piece I made (completely with Pd, naturally!): > > http://soundcloud.com/putahslim/intrinsic > > > Phil > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From sballmada at googlemail.com Fri Mar 6 12:23:47 2009 From: sballmada at googlemail.com (Simon Ball) Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2009 11:23:47 +0000 Subject: [PD] Installing PD... Message-ID: <31da0ae00903060323r38553e69n6fac424427063aa7@mail.gmail.com> Hello I'm having trouble getting started with PD-extended. It seems to be having trouble accessing the library, with red dots appearing around objects. I've tried re installing and am on an Intel MacBook Pro, OSX 10.4.11. Any ideas how to solve this? Thanks Simon -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: PD_Window.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 112858 bytes Desc: not available URL: From derek at umatic.nl Fri Mar 6 12:31:48 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Fri, 06 Mar 2009 12:31:48 +0100 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: References: <1236214369.7483.13.camel@danoT500> <7223A0F4-49DA-421E-8FFB-7324EF1246C2@eds.org> <1236294414.8960.0.camel@danoT500> Message-ID: <49B109A4.9050909@umatic.nl> Since I'm completely uninterested in touching anything C, C++, TclTk or otherwise related, I submitted two Pd patching projects which should be general enough to attract students, yet quite intensive to work on. Feedback welcome. http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/Undead http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/GEMVeeJay Anyone want to take up 2007's PluggoPd idea? best, D. -- derek holzer ::: http://www.umatic.nl ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ---Oblique Strategy # 194: "Steal a solution." From grh at mur.at Fri Mar 6 13:10:31 2009 From: grh at mur.at (Georg Holzmann) Date: Fri, 06 Mar 2009 13:10:31 +0100 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <49B109A4.9050909@umatic.nl> References: <1236214369.7483.13.camel@danoT500> <7223A0F4-49DA-421E-8FFB-7324EF1246C2@eds.org> <1236294414.8960.0.camel@danoT500> <49B109A4.9050909@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <49B112B7.8080908@mur.at> Hallo Derek ! Nice projects - I also think that we need more patcher-only projects ! LG Georg Derek Holzer schrieb: > Since I'm completely uninterested in touching anything C, C++, TclTk or > otherwise related, I submitted two Pd patching projects which should be > general enough to attract students, yet quite intensive to work on. > Feedback welcome. > > http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/Undead > http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/GEMVeeJay > > Anyone want to take up 2007's PluggoPd idea? > > best, > D. > From brandt at subnet.at Fri Mar 6 13:33:50 2009 From: brandt at subnet.at (brandt at subnet.at) Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2009 13:33:50 +0100 (CET) Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <49B112B7.8080908@mur.at> References: <1236214369.7483.13.camel@danoT500> <7223A0F4-49DA-421E-8FFB-7324EF1246C2@eds.org> <1236294414.8960.0.camel@danoT500> <49B109A4.9050909@umatic.nl> <49B112B7.8080908@mur.at> Message-ID: <39645.81.223.29.242.1236342830.squirrel@webmail.*> The same with me. interested in coding but just very rare skills.but patching. maybe the graphical userinterface which i started for gem could be interesting.As i am in the job now, i cannot send screenshots nor patches. if there is interest I put some things together tjis weekend. markus > Hallo Derek ! > > Nice projects - I also think that we need more patcher-only projects ! > > LG > Georg > > Derek Holzer schrieb: >> Since I'm completely uninterested in touching anything C, C++, TclTk or >> otherwise related, I submitted two Pd patching projects which should be >> general enough to attract students, yet quite intensive to work on. >> Feedback welcome. >> >> http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/Undead >> http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/GEMVeeJay >> >> Anyone want to take up 2007's PluggoPd idea? >> >> best, >> D. >> > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > From abonnements at revolwear.com Fri Mar 6 13:40:28 2009 From: abonnements at revolwear.com (Max) Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2009 13:40:28 +0100 Subject: [PD] list issue In-Reply-To: <49AFB5B5.6020002@web.de> References: <49AE52D1.1030004@web.de> <49AFB5B5.6020002@web.de> Message-ID: <0ADCBBAE-26D6-44A1-A547-B3551D8852F5@revolwear.com> here is my humble interpretation of mathieus idea. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: randombeatz.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 3120 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: list-shuffle.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 1758 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- Am 05.03.2009 um 12:21 schrieb YOhannes: > thanks guys, > > i made a simple patch based on mathieus idea. (see attachment) > i like to apply more control on listlength, without > specifying it, like i would have to with [list-equalize]. > > now, depending on the devisor of 2, with my master-sequence > of lets say 2000 (ms) i get lists with very small and very big values. > > for example: > 15.625 1.95312 3.90625 1.95312 500 250 1000 31.25 62.5 7.8125 125 > > any ideas how to get smoother/smaller differences between the list- > items? > > thanks. j > > #N canvas 437 216 195 346 10; > #X obj -72 146 urn; > #X obj -72 96 iter; > #X obj -72 24 inlet; > #X obj -72 173 pack 0 0; > #X obj -72 293 outlet; > #X msg 12 100 clear; > #X obj -72 120 t b a; > #X obj -72 61 t l l b; > #X obj -72 259 zl group; > #X obj 10 126 list length; > #X obj -72 238 pipe; > #X obj -72 216 unpack 0 0; > #X obj -72 194 zl rev; > #X connect 0 0 3 0; > #X connect 1 0 6 0; > #X connect 2 0 7 0; > #X connect 3 0 12 0; > #X connect 5 0 0 0; > #X connect 6 0 0 0; > #X connect 6 1 3 1; > #X connect 7 0 1 0; > #X connect 7 1 9 0; > #X connect 7 2 5 0; > #X connect 8 0 4 0; > #X connect 9 0 0 1; > #X connect 9 0 8 1; > #X connect 10 0 8 0; > #X connect 11 0 10 0; > #X connect 11 1 10 1; > #X connect 12 0 11 0; > #N canvas 91 22 294 416 10; > #X obj 35 0 loadbang; > #X obj 111 27 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 > -1; > #X obj 111 53 random 2; > #X obj 179 243 t f f; > #X obj 111 192 f; > #X obj 111 279 list-extend; > #X obj 77 307 list; > #X text -31 137 master(ms); > #X obj 77 337 shakeitt; > #X obj 77 359 print that; > #X obj -22 1 inlet; > #X obj 111 1 inlet; > #X obj 153 337 list-accum; > #X floatatom 153 360 5 0 0 0 - - -; > #X obj 111 74 route 0 1; > #X obj 179 192 f; > #X msg 35 139 2000; > #X obj 111 96 t b b b; > #X obj 179 214 / 2; > #X msg -22 27 set \$1; > #X text 14 359 slave(ms); > #X connect 0 0 16 0; > #X connect 1 0 2 0; > #X connect 2 0 14 0; > #X connect 3 0 5 0; > #X connect 3 1 4 1; > #X connect 3 1 15 1; > #X connect 4 0 5 0; > #X connect 5 0 6 1; > #X connect 6 0 8 0; > #X connect 6 0 12 0; > #X connect 8 0 9 0; > #X connect 10 0 19 0; > #X connect 11 0 1 0; > #X connect 12 0 13 0; > #X connect 14 0 17 0; > #X connect 14 1 15 0; > #X connect 15 0 18 0; > #X connect 16 0 15 1; > #X connect 16 0 4 1; > #X connect 17 0 16 0; > #X connect 17 0 6 0; > #X connect 17 1 5 1; > #X connect 17 2 4 0; > #X connect 18 0 3 0; > #X connect 19 0 16 0; > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: PGP.sig Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 194 bytes Desc: Signierter Teil der Nachricht URL: From grh at mur.at Fri Mar 6 13:55:24 2009 From: grh at mur.at (Georg Holzmann) Date: Fri, 06 Mar 2009 13:55:24 +0100 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <39645.81.223.29.242.1236342830.squirrel@webmail.*> References: <1236214369.7483.13.camel@danoT500> <7223A0F4-49DA-421E-8FFB-7324EF1246C2@eds.org> <1236294414.8960.0.camel@danoT500> <49B109A4.9050909@umatic.nl> <49B112B7.8080908@mur.at> <39645.81.223.29.242.1236342830.squirrel@webmail.*> Message-ID: <49B11D3C.2060303@mur.at> Hallo Markus ! > The same with me. > > interested in coding but just very rare skills.but patching. > > maybe the graphical userinterface which i started for gem could be > interesting.As i am in the job now, i cannot send screenshots nor patches. > > if there is interest I put some things together tjis weekend. Yes of course - just put it on the wiki ! LG Georg From dafydd61 at gmail.com Fri Mar 6 15:06:18 2009 From: dafydd61 at gmail.com (Dafydd Hughes) Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2009 09:06:18 -0500 Subject: [PD] Installing PD... In-Reply-To: <31da0ae00903060323r38553e69n6fac424427063aa7@mail.gmail.com> References: <31da0ae00903060323r38553e69n6fac424427063aa7@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi Simon Last time I saw this message, I think I solved it by installing X11 (from your install disk, or download it). Hope this helps. cheers dafydd On Fri, Mar 6, 2009 at 6:23 AM, Simon Ball wrote: > Hello > > I'm having trouble getting started with PD-extended. It seems to be having > trouble accessing the library, with red dots appearing around objects. I've > tried re installing and am on an Intel MacBook Pro, OSX 10.4.11. > > Any ideas how to solve this? > > Thanks > Simon > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > -- www.sideshowmedia.ca skype: chickeninthegrass From gr at grrrr.org Fri Mar 6 15:14:23 2009 From: gr at grrrr.org (Thomas Grill) Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2009 15:14:23 +0100 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <49AD91D7.10107@mur.at> References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> <49AD7CFF.2060502@mur.at> <49AD91D7.10107@mur.at> Message-ID: <0549ECF8-5837-457E-A78E-B1172ABD75FE@grrrr.org> Hi all, i added my name to two existing projects matching my competences. Just in case Georg is too busy with all the other ones he is part of. gr~~~ Am 03.03.2009 um 21:23 schrieb Georg Holzmann: > Hallo again ! > > I added now quite some projects from last year to the WIKI page: > http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/GoogleSummerOfCodeIdeas2009 > Please look through them and correct my bad english and/or add > additional resources and ideas ! > > @Hans: I added you to some projects as mentor, I hope you don't > mind ;) > > @IOhannes: same for you ;) - but you can of course join more projects > (now I added you only to the gem multiwindow project, because here you > are the only possible author) > > To all other mentors: please add you to the wiki and also add > projects ! > > Thanks, > LG > Georg > > Georg Holzmann schrieb: >> Hallo! >> >> I started to put ideas together at the following WIKI page: >> http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/GoogleSummerOfCodeIdeas2009 >> If you are interested joining one project as a mentor, please just >> add >> your name in the list of possible mentors ... >> >> Please also add your projects using the following template: >> http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/ProjectTemplate >> (and look at the description of my already added projects) >> It should be as clear as possible for students how to start, where >> are >> the resources and etc. >> >> There are also still a lot of old projects from last year here: >> http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/GoogleSummerOfCodeIdeas >> which should be copied (and polished) to the new WIKI page - so some >> help is really needed ! >> >> Thanks for any contribution, >> LG >> Georg >> >> >> Hans-Christoph Steiner schrieb: >>> Hey all, >>> >>> The Google Summer of Code ((http://code.google.com/soc/) application >>> is due very soon, March 9th, and we need mentors! At this point, >>> you >>> just need to put down your name. Then once the projects are in, >>> we'll >>> choose projects and who will mentor them. You will then work with a >>> student, either locally or remotely. >>> >>> Every pd developer who wants to support the project but is not >>> student >>> anymore is invited to join as mentor, since the number of sponsored >>> projects by google depends on the number of mentors and >>> students. If >>> you are a student, then you should apply as a student to get funded. >>> Mentors get $500 and students get $4500 for working on something Pd >>> related. >>> >>> .hc >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> -------- >>> >>> "It is convenient to imagine a power beyond us because that means we >>> don't have to examine our own lives.", from "The Idols of >>> Environmentalism", by Curtis White >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/ >>> listinfo/pd-list >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/ >> listinfo/pd-list > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/ > listinfo/pd-list From cgclepper at gmail.com Fri Mar 6 17:06:05 2009 From: cgclepper at gmail.com (chris clepper) Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2009 11:06:05 -0500 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <49B109A4.9050909@umatic.nl> References: <1236214369.7483.13.camel@danoT500> <7223A0F4-49DA-421E-8FFB-7324EF1246C2@eds.org> <1236294414.8960.0.camel@danoT500> <49B109A4.9050909@umatic.nl> Message-ID: I added my name to the VeeJay project to advise on how the low level stuff affects performance and stability. I don't know if a project can have more than one mentor though. On Fri, Mar 6, 2009 at 6:31 AM, Derek Holzer wrote: > Since I'm completely uninterested in touching anything C, C++, TclTk or > otherwise related, I submitted two Pd patching projects which should be > general enough to attract students, yet quite intensive to work on. > Feedback welcome. > > http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/Undead > http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/GEMVeeJay > > Anyone want to take up 2007's PluggoPd idea? > > best, > D. > > -- > derek holzer ::: http://www.umatic.nl ::: > http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista > ---Oblique Strategy # 194: > "Steal a solution." > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From derek at umatic.nl Fri Mar 6 17:43:42 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Fri, 06 Mar 2009 17:43:42 +0100 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: References: <1236214369.7483.13.camel@danoT500> <7223A0F4-49DA-421E-8FFB-7324EF1246C2@eds.org> <1236294414.8960.0.camel@danoT500> <49B109A4.9050909@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <49B152BE.2000703@umatic.nl> That's great, let's see what happens ;-) d. chris clepper wrote: > I added my name to the VeeJay project to advise on how the low level > stuff affects performance and stability. I don't know if a project can > have more than one mentor though. > > On Fri, Mar 6, 2009 at 6:31 AM, Derek Holzer > wrote: > > Since I'm completely uninterested in touching anything C, C++, TclTk or > otherwise related, I submitted two Pd patching projects which should be > general enough to attract students, yet quite intensive to work on. > Feedback welcome. > > http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/Undead > http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/GEMVeeJay > > Anyone want to take up 2007's PluggoPd idea? > > best, > D. > > -- > derek holzer ::: http://www.umatic.nl ::: > http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista > ---Oblique Strategy # 194: > "Steal a solution." > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > -- derek holzer ::: http://www.umatic.nl ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ---Oblique Strategy # 83: "How would someone else do it?" From cgclepper at gmail.com Fri Mar 6 17:58:22 2009 From: cgclepper at gmail.com (chris clepper) Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2009 11:58:22 -0500 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <49B152BE.2000703@umatic.nl> References: <1236214369.7483.13.camel@danoT500> <7223A0F4-49DA-421E-8FFB-7324EF1246C2@eds.org> <1236294414.8960.0.camel@danoT500> <49B109A4.9050909@umatic.nl> <49B152BE.2000703@umatic.nl> Message-ID: My own suggestion for a GEM project would be to create a tutorial and accompanying manual that covers the basic operation. The other idea involves making the more advanced features like GLSL and framebuffer rendering easier to use. These are mainly documentation projects, but also have some Pd, and possible C++ coding as well. On Fri, Mar 6, 2009 at 11:43 AM, Derek Holzer wrote: > That's great, let's see what happens ;-) > > d. > > chris clepper wrote: > >> I added my name to the VeeJay project to advise on how the low level stuff >> affects performance and stability. I don't know if a project can have more >> than one mentor though. >> >> On Fri, Mar 6, 2009 at 6:31 AM, Derek Holzer > derek at umatic.nl>> wrote: >> >> Since I'm completely uninterested in touching anything C, C++, TclTk or >> otherwise related, I submitted two Pd patching projects which should be >> general enough to attract students, yet quite intensive to work on. >> Feedback welcome. >> >> http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/Undead >> http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/GEMVeeJay >> >> Anyone want to take up 2007's PluggoPd idea? >> >> best, >> D. >> >> -- >> derek holzer ::: http://www.umatic.nl ::: >> http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista >> ---Oblique Strategy # 194: >> "Steal a solution." >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> >> >> > -- > derek holzer ::: http://www.umatic.nl ::: > http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista > ---Oblique Strategy # 83: > "How would someone else do it?" > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From derek at umatic.nl Fri Mar 6 18:01:03 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Fri, 06 Mar 2009 18:01:03 +0100 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: References: <1236214369.7483.13.camel@danoT500> <7223A0F4-49DA-421E-8FFB-7324EF1246C2@eds.org> <1236294414.8960.0.camel@danoT500> <49B109A4.9050909@umatic.nl> <49B152BE.2000703@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <49B156CF.7000203@umatic.nl> I already asked, and GSoC doesn't cover documentation, or else I would have pitched the Pd FLOSS Manual in there as well. But go for it with the GLSL/framebuffer coding stuff! d. chris clepper wrote: > My own suggestion for a GEM project would be to create a tutorial and > accompanying manual that covers the basic operation. The other idea > involves making the more advanced features like GLSL and framebuffer > rendering easier to use. These are mainly documentation projects, but > also have some Pd, and possible C++ coding as well. > > On Fri, Mar 6, 2009 at 11:43 AM, Derek Holzer > wrote: > > That's great, let's see what happens ;-) > > d. > > chris clepper wrote: > > I added my name to the VeeJay project to advise on how the low > level stuff affects performance and stability. I don't know if > a project can have more than one mentor though. > > On Fri, Mar 6, 2009 at 6:31 AM, Derek Holzer >> wrote: > > Since I'm completely uninterested in touching anything C, > C++, TclTk or > otherwise related, I submitted two Pd patching projects which > should be > general enough to attract students, yet quite intensive to > work on. > Feedback welcome. > > http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/Undead > http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/GEMVeeJay > > Anyone want to take up 2007's PluggoPd idea? > > best, > D. > > -- > derek holzer ::: http://www.umatic.nl ::: > http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista > ---Oblique Strategy # 194: > "Steal a solution." > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at > mailing list > > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > -- > derek holzer ::: http://www.umatic.nl ::: > http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista > ---Oblique Strategy # 83: > "How would someone else do it?" > > -- derek holzer ::: http://www.umatic.nl ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ---Oblique Strategy # 64: "Don't stress one thing more than another" From cgclepper at gmail.com Fri Mar 6 18:04:16 2009 From: cgclepper at gmail.com (chris clepper) Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2009 12:04:16 -0500 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <49B156CF.7000203@umatic.nl> References: <1236214369.7483.13.camel@danoT500> <7223A0F4-49DA-421E-8FFB-7324EF1246C2@eds.org> <1236294414.8960.0.camel@danoT500> <49B109A4.9050909@umatic.nl> <49B152BE.2000703@umatic.nl> <49B156CF.7000203@umatic.nl> Message-ID: On Fri, Mar 6, 2009 at 12:01 PM, Derek Holzer wrote: > I already asked, and GSoC doesn't cover documentation, or else I would have > pitched the Pd FLOSS Manual in there as well. But go for it with the > GLSL/framebuffer coding stuff! That is really a shame since most open source projects need way more documentation done than coding. Maybe they will have a Winter of Docs? > > > chris clepper wrote: > >> My own suggestion for a GEM project would be to create a tutorial and >> accompanying manual that covers the basic operation. The other idea >> involves making the more advanced features like GLSL and framebuffer >> rendering easier to use. These are mainly documentation projects, but also >> have some Pd, and possible C++ coding as well. >> >> -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From derek at umatic.nl Fri Mar 6 18:07:04 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Fri, 06 Mar 2009 18:07:04 +0100 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: References: <1236214369.7483.13.camel@danoT500> <7223A0F4-49DA-421E-8FFB-7324EF1246C2@eds.org> <1236294414.8960.0.camel@danoT500> <49B109A4.9050909@umatic.nl> <49B152BE.2000703@umatic.nl> <49B156CF.7000203@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <49B15838.5070700@umatic.nl> Agreed in full, my wish too!!!!!!!!!!!! d. chris clepper wrote: > On Fri, Mar 6, 2009 at 12:01 PM, Derek Holzer > wrote: > > I already asked, and GSoC doesn't cover documentation, or else I > would have pitched the Pd FLOSS Manual in there as well. But go for > it with the GLSL/framebuffer coding stuff! > > > That is really a shame since most open source projects need way more > documentation done than coding. Maybe they will have a Winter of Docs? > > > > > > chris clepper wrote: > > My own suggestion for a GEM project would be to create a > tutorial and accompanying manual that covers the basic > operation. The other idea involves making the more advanced > features like GLSL and framebuffer rendering easier to use. > These are mainly documentation projects, but also have some Pd, > and possible C++ coding as well. > > -- derek holzer ::: http://www.umatic.nl ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ---Oblique Strategy # 88: "Imagine the music as a set of disconnected events" From crinimal at gmx.net Fri Mar 6 18:06:47 2009 From: crinimal at gmx.net (Martin Schied) Date: Fri, 06 Mar 2009 18:06:47 +0100 Subject: [PD] Pd/GEM and camera for tracking In-Reply-To: References: <49F315F3-0FE9-402E-A841-E9281533E064@rybn.org> <50F7D30D-386D-4689-BF82-57AB295B93BB@rybn.org> <77B16377-7AB2-4AC5-8D18-1FF8B8426B91@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49B15827.3030509@gmx.net> hey all, Jaime Oliver schrieb: > mmh, I don't really know about lengths. I think there is a limit to > how long your firewire cable should be. I usually work with analog > cameras in linux where cables can be long ad I capture with a pci card. > > I think a cheap option that I've seen working well with macs is the > unibrain fire-i: > http://www.unibrain.com/Products/VisionImg/Fire_i_DC.htm > > you can buy lenses and chain them, not more than 30fps though, > > J lengths between firewire 400 devices is usually 4.5m, but you can daisy chain them up to 16 times giving you 72 metres. it's not very recommendable to make long chains, as every plug may be a "weak point" in your chain. firewire 800 can have longer cables, but i don't know... Jack schrieb: > Thanx for the reply. The models are too big for me. I need a smaller > camera (something like a cube) because the installation must be > discreet. Have you something else to suggest ? > Chris : what do you think about Sony driver ? I can't use a PCI card > because i will work with a macmini. > ++ as manufacturer of small firewire cameras there's also "point grey". I don't know exactly about cost, and didn't try them on my own but they often were recommended by people doing tracking, also being said they were affordable, especially the "firefly mv" which delivers 60fps at 640x480 and even higher frame rates at lower resolutions. that's what they say about macintosh (seems to work): http://www.ptgrey.com/support/kb/index.asp?a=4&q=173 i also made tests with usb webcams (only on linux and windows), some with usable results but most of them are crap. to be usable they should support "real" usb2.0 for high frame rates at full sensor resolution (usually 640x480), without compression and have ccd sensors for better quality and light sensitivity. (finding out usb version and other technical stuff can be real pain from manufacruerer sites, usually you'll have to try them). image quality was always worse than cheap video cameras - but as an advantage they were not interlaced like usual consumer video cameras. cable lengths can be extended by usb hubs or "repeater" cables several times, but that's also the "many-connectors - many errors" thing @Jack: what exactly will your tracking method be based on? natural features? colors? markers? with some luck a cheap usb webcam could be good enough and also really small. (yeah, i'm a fan of using cheap consumer producs and having trouble with them - be warned) cheers, Martin From reduzierer at yahoo.de Fri Mar 6 18:43:10 2009 From: reduzierer at yahoo.de (Roman Haefeli) Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2009 17:43:10 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [PD] list issue Message-ID: <583898.6073.qm@web26306.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> --- Mathieu Bouchard schrieb am Fr, 6.3.2009: > > > Unless you happen to be listening to Carter, Cowell, > Ferneyhough, Johnston, Nancarrow, or anyone who has ever > happened to use a quintuplet (Chopin, Elvin Jones, maybe Al > Pacino in "Heat") > > I didn't say that quintuplets don't happen! > > I'd be glad to get references to specific pieces that > contain a lot of quintuplets. Of the five composers you > named, I only heard Nancarrow, I only heard of Nancarrow, > and then, I don't recall any quintuplets in it, but I didn't > see the score and perhaps I couldn't grasp the rhythm of it > just by ear (?). 'the arabian dance' from the nut cracker ballet by tchaikovsky happens to have quintuplets. you can hear the piece here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rx8cCLumV10 listen to the lead melody. sometimes it plays some kind of a slow trill (quickly changing between two close notes), which happen to be quintuplets. i admit, that they sound like a duplet followed by a triplet, but i have the scores of the piece and they are written as quintuplets on 32nd's. roman > It reminds me, I once applied in music composition at > UQ?M, but when they sent me a letter telling me they wanted > to test my piano skills with sheet music, I didn't reply, > because I don't have any piano skills and can't read sheet > music in realtime. The only instrument I was really ever > proficient with was ScreamTracker, and boy did I abuse that > thing. I made pieces in 21/8 time and whatnot. I found that > notation much easier to deal with than classical notation... > except for making quintuplets, that is. > > _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ > _____________________ ... > | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, > Qu?bec > -----Integrierter Anhang folgt----- > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at > mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > From bigswift at cox.net Fri Mar 6 19:23:40 2009 From: bigswift at cox.net (bigswift at cox.net) Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2009 13:23:40 -0500 Subject: [PD] Installing PD... In-Reply-To: <31da0ae00903060323r38553e69n6fac424427063aa7@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090306132340.GAHPY.243221.imail@eastrmwml30> You need to install X11 off your OSX Install Disc ---- Simon Ball wrote: > Hello > > I'm having trouble getting started with PD-extended. It seems to be having > trouble accessing the library, with red dots appearing around objects. I've > tried re installing and am on an Intel MacBook Pro, OSX 10.4.11. > > Any ideas how to solve this? > > Thanks > Simon -- Patrick Pagano Sound and Light Technologist School of Theatre and Dance University of Florida From brbrofsvl at gmail.com Fri Mar 6 19:27:21 2009 From: brbrofsvl at gmail.com (Matt Barber) Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2009 13:27:21 -0500 Subject: [PD] list issue Message-ID: > > Unless you happen to be listening to Carter, Cowell, Ferneyhough, Johnston, Nancarrow, or anyone who has ever happened to use a quintuplet (Chopin, Elvin Jones, maybe Al Pacino in "Heat") > > -Jonathan > Or Beethoven, Schubert, Brahms, Tchaikovsky Wagner, Mahler, Strauss, Bartok, Schoenberg, Berg, Stravinsky, Prokofiev, Ravel, Debussy, etc., not to mention the more "temporally advanced" folks you mentioned. Plenty of jazz, and decent metal splits beats into fives, and you can't play in a drum corps without perfect subdivision chops... sometimes quintuplets are called "20th notes." But if you want pieces that make heavy use of quintuplets, you would want to check out Carter (start with the string quartets, for instance). Tuplets are often used to allow several people to play music in different tempi while each attending to a "master pulse." I just played a recorder motet where the the low voice was in 3/2, the middle voice in 2/2, and the upper voice in the equivalent of 5/10 time. Or, in Carter, often the old quintuplet becomes the new 16th note and the music proceeds at a faster tempo. There are plenty of composers who do the same simply using time signatures. I've conducted pieces which go fluidly from one meter to the next -- 3/4 5/6 2/4 3/8 31/32 5/4 19/10 etc. It's not that hard once you get the hang of it, but it is hard to get the hang of. I believe that most competent musicians should be able to handle rhythmic notation at least up to subdivisions of 6. Not that they can usually; but I believe it should be the case -- one can practice rhythm anywhere. In addition you can check out Stockhausen, Babbitt, Boulez, Wuorinen, or most anyone who structures rhythm parametrically. (pun) Or, for an extremely rich but different orientation, check out Carnatic (South Indian) classical music -- look up "Korvai" for instance. Matt From propaganda at goto10.org Fri Mar 6 19:43:24 2009 From: propaganda at goto10.org (propaganda at goto10.org) Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2009 19:43:24 +0100 Subject: [PD] [PD-announce] New netlabel GOSUB10 announces the Substrate release! Message-ID: <20090306184324.GA25721@hee.jungle> Sorry for autotune, please Spawn Pfunc -- NEW MUSIC COMPILATION, NEW NETLABEL Various Artists - Substrate (GOSUB10-001) -- The new netlabel GOSUB10 today launches Substrate, its inaugural release. A 12-track compilation of music from across the electronic music genre, it features friends and family of the GOTO10 collective, illustrating the strong networks by which the label will grow and providing insight into future directions. /Substrate/ features tracks by: Earweego, krgn, vacca, 0xA, Bazterrak, Frank Barknecht, Yee-King, Soudo, Julian Brook, Martin Howse, Rob Canning and Ultrageranium. Dedicated to innovative music and audio/visuals, the GOSUB10 label will feature an eclectic group of musicians drawn together by their shared use of Free/Libre/Open Source Software (FLOSS). Freely distributed by stream, download and special DVD releases, and made available through an open license, GOSUB10 is run by the GOTO10 collective, an international group of artists, musicians and programmers, dedicated to FLOSS and digital arts. Brought to life in a intensive three day work sprint, the GOSUB10 netlabel is a natural extension of GOTO10's activities supporting and promoting digital art alongside FLOSS tools through workshops, festivals, exhibitions, writing, and more. http://gosub10.org http://goto10.org -- We would like to thank the Institute of Network Cultures (http://networkcultures.org) for hosting us during this sprint and we also want to thank the GISS team (http://giss.tv) who is providing the streaming infrastucture of the GOSUB10 radio. -- :* PS: If you like it, send stroopwafels!!! _______________________________________________ Pd-announce mailing list Pd-announce at iem.at http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-announce From jack at rybn.org Fri Mar 6 20:32:31 2009 From: jack at rybn.org (Jack) Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2009 20:32:31 +0100 Subject: [PD] Pd/GEM and camera for tracking In-Reply-To: <49B15827.3030509@gmx.net> References: <49F315F3-0FE9-402E-A841-E9281533E064@rybn.org> <50F7D30D-386D-4689-BF82-57AB295B93BB@rybn.org> <77B16377-7AB2-4AC5-8D18-1FF8B8426B91@gmail.com> <49B15827.3030509@gmx.net> Message-ID: Hello Martin and thanx for your reply, In fact, i need a camera to track people in a space (indoor). The camera will be on the ceiling. There is 5 meters between the ceiling and the floor. With the coordinates of people, i will turn on/off differents lamps on a statue placed in the center of the space. So i need a camera working on a MacMini with MacOSX.5 and Pd and GEM. The last MacMini has a FireWire 800 and 5 USB 2.0. I saw the point grey website, but i can't find price on it. However, they talk about 10 meters cable for FireWire 800. Do you know a model and its price ? Today, I tried a Unibrain Fire-i? Digital Board Camera and it seems good (FireWire 400 : 89 euros + 19 euros with lens) But i never tried it in installation. ++ Jack Le 6 mars 09 ? 18:06, Martin Schied a ?crit : > hey all, > > Jaime Oliver schrieb: >> mmh, I don't really know about lengths. I think there is a limit >> to how long your firewire cable should be. I usually work with >> analog cameras in linux where cables can be long ad I capture with >> a pci card. >> >> I think a cheap option that I've seen working well with macs is >> the unibrain fire-i: >> http://www.unibrain.com/Products/VisionImg/Fire_i_DC.htm >> >> you can buy lenses and chain them, not more than 30fps though, >> >> J > lengths between firewire 400 devices is usually 4.5m, but you can > daisy chain them up to 16 times giving you 72 metres. it's not very > recommendable to make long chains, as every plug may be a "weak > point" in your chain. firewire 800 can have longer cables, but i > don't know... > > Jack schrieb: >> Thanx for the reply. The models are too big for me. I need a >> smaller camera (something like a cube) because the installation >> must be discreet. Have you something else to suggest ? >> Chris : what do you think about Sony driver ? I can't use a PCI >> card because i will work with a macmini. >> ++ > > as manufacturer of small firewire cameras there's also "point > grey". I don't know exactly about cost, and didn't try them on my > own but they often were recommended by people doing tracking, also > being said they were affordable, especially the "firefly mv" which > delivers 60fps at 640x480 and even higher frame rates at lower > resolutions. > > that's what they say about macintosh (seems to work): > http://www.ptgrey.com/support/kb/index.asp?a=4&q=173 > > i also made tests with usb webcams (only on linux and windows), > some with usable results but most of them are crap. to be usable > they should support "real" usb2.0 for high frame rates at full > sensor resolution (usually 640x480), without compression and have > ccd sensors for better quality and light sensitivity. (finding out > usb version and other technical stuff can be real pain from > manufacruerer sites, usually you'll have to try them). > image quality was always worse than cheap video cameras - but as an > advantage they were not interlaced like usual consumer video > cameras. cable lengths can be extended by usb hubs or "repeater" > cables several times, but that's also the "many-connectors - many > errors" thing > > @Jack: what exactly will your tracking method be based on? natural > features? colors? markers? with some luck a cheap usb webcam could > be good enough and also really small. (yeah, i'm a fan of using > cheap consumer producs and having trouble with them - be warned) > > cheers, > Martin From reakinator at gmail.com Fri Mar 6 21:28:18 2009 From: reakinator at gmail.com (Rich E) Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2009 21:28:18 +0100 Subject: [PD] music made with Pd In-Reply-To: References: <49B02B2A.2000507@ucdavis.edu> Message-ID: I liked it too, it has a nice energetic progression. I like the decaying melody notes in the beginning that drop in pitch and fade away at the same time. I also liked the site, just signed up :) rich On Fri, Mar 6, 2009 at 8:35 AM, Ichabod wrote: > Excellent! I like how it has a minimal feel but still sounds quite complete. > --Stefan > > On Thu, Mar 5, 2009 at 2:42 PM, Phil Stone wrote: >> >> Hi, >> >> I'm trying out this website called soundcloud.com, which seems to be a >> fairly decent way of sharing music without much nonsense. ?Anyway, I >> uploaded a recent piece I made (completely with Pd, naturally!): >> >> http://soundcloud.com/putahslim/intrinsic >> >> >> Phil >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > From crinimal at gmx.net Fri Mar 6 23:48:09 2009 From: crinimal at gmx.net (Martin Schied) Date: Fri, 06 Mar 2009 23:48:09 +0100 Subject: [PD] Pd/GEM and camera for tracking In-Reply-To: References: <49F315F3-0FE9-402E-A841-E9281533E064@rybn.org> <50F7D30D-386D-4689-BF82-57AB295B93BB@rybn.org> <77B16377-7AB2-4AC5-8D18-1FF8B8426B91@gmail.com> <49B15827.3030509@gmx.net> Message-ID: <49B1A829.5010700@gmx.net> hi Jack, it's about $200 for the "firefly mv". They somehow don't want their prices in public... I had a lower price in mind - maybe I mixed that up with the unibrain. I think for that application it's not necessary using higher frame rates. I tried simple movement detection and tracking in gem, using a low resolution 30fps picture and it was nice to play with, yet at low light. Martin > Hello Martin and thanx for your reply, > > In fact, i need a camera to track people in a space (indoor). The > camera will be on the ceiling. > There is 5 meters between the ceiling and the floor. > With the coordinates of people, i will turn on/off differents lamps > on a statue placed in the center of the space. > So i need a camera working on a MacMini with MacOSX.5 and Pd and GEM. > The last MacMini has a FireWire 800 and 5 USB 2.0. > I saw the point grey website, but i can't find price on it. However, > they talk about 10 meters cable for FireWire 800. > Do you know a model and its price ? > Today, I tried a Unibrain Fire-i? Digital Board Camera and it seems > good (FireWire 400 : 89 euros + 19 euros with lens) But i never tried > it in installation. > ++ > > Jack From jack at rybn.org Sat Mar 7 00:32:34 2009 From: jack at rybn.org (Jack) Date: Sat, 7 Mar 2009 00:32:34 +0100 Subject: [PD] Pd/GEM and camera for tracking In-Reply-To: <49B1A829.5010700@gmx.net> References: <49F315F3-0FE9-402E-A841-E9281533E064@rybn.org> <50F7D30D-386D-4689-BF82-57AB295B93BB@rybn.org> <77B16377-7AB2-4AC5-8D18-1FF8B8426B91@gmail.com> <49B15827.3030509@gmx.net> <49B1A829.5010700@gmx.net> Message-ID: Ok, thanx a lot Martin. Now, i will think about which model is the most appropriate for my installation. ++ Jack Le 6 mars 09 ? 23:48, Martin Schied a ?crit : > hi Jack, > > it's about $200 for the "firefly mv". They somehow don't want their > prices in public... > I had a lower price in mind - maybe I mixed that up with the > unibrain. I think for that application it's not necessary using > higher frame rates. I tried simple movement detection and tracking > in gem, using a low resolution 30fps picture and it was nice to > play with, yet at low light. > > Martin > > > >> Hello Martin and thanx for your reply, >> >> In fact, i need a camera to track people in a space (indoor). The >> camera will be on the ceiling. >> There is 5 meters between the ceiling and the floor. >> With the coordinates of people, i will turn on/off differents >> lamps on a statue placed in the center of the space. >> So i need a camera working on a MacMini with MacOSX.5 and Pd and >> GEM. The last MacMini has a FireWire 800 and 5 USB 2.0. >> I saw the point grey website, but i can't find price on it. >> However, they talk about 10 meters cable for FireWire 800. >> Do you know a model and its price ? >> Today, I tried a Unibrain Fire-i? Digital Board Camera and it >> seems good (FireWire 400 : 89 euros + 19 euros with lens) But i >> never tried it in installation. >> ++ >> >> Jack > From kyleklip at gmail.com Sat Mar 7 03:33:06 2009 From: kyleklip at gmail.com (Kyle Klipowicz) Date: Fri, 6 Mar 2009 20:33:06 -0600 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: References: <1236214369.7483.13.camel@danoT500> <7223A0F4-49DA-421E-8FFB-7324EF1246C2@eds.org> <1236294414.8960.0.camel@danoT500> <49B109A4.9050909@umatic.nl> <49B152BE.2000703@umatic.nl> <49B156CF.7000203@umatic.nl> Message-ID: True that! I would be way more useful writing documentation than code. If there was an opportunity like GSoC for that, I'd jump on it. ~Kyle On Fri, Mar 6, 2009 at 11:04 AM, chris clepper wrote: > On Fri, Mar 6, 2009 at 12:01 PM, Derek Holzer wrote: > >> I already asked, and GSoC doesn't cover documentation, or else I would >> have pitched the Pd FLOSS Manual in there as well. But go for it with the >> GLSL/framebuffer coding stuff! > > > That is really a shame since most open source projects need way more > documentation done than coding. Maybe they will have a Winter of Docs? > > > >> >> >> chris clepper wrote: >> >>> My own suggestion for a GEM project would be to create a tutorial and >>> accompanying manual that covers the basic operation. The other idea >>> involves making the more advanced features like GLSL and framebuffer >>> rendering easier to use. These are mainly documentation projects, but also >>> have some Pd, and possible C++ coding as well. >>> >>> > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > -- ----- ------------ ---- ----- ---- -------- - ------ http://perhapsidid.wordpress.com http://myspace.com/kyleklipowicz -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From djk_1200 at hotmail.com Sat Mar 7 06:18:41 2009 From: djk_1200 at hotmail.com (David Kirkpatrick) Date: Sat, 7 Mar 2009 16:18:41 +1100 Subject: [PD] Pd/GEM and camera for tracking Message-ID: Hi Jack, I've done a fair bit of this sort of thing before. The most useful setup i've found is: 1) Analogue monochrome CCTV camera. (Preferably with around 700 horizontal lines or so, very low lux, and self syncing) I use these. http://www.allthings.com.au/Catalogue/CCS/monochrome%20low%20light%20cctv%20dsp%20video%20camera.html You can then buy a C or CS lens that is the right angle for your situation. For roof mounted stuff I use an ultra-wide angle varifocal set to just before it noticably fisheyes. 2) Cat 5 balun connected to CCTV camera's analogue video output and power input. This allows signal to be sent, and power to be recieved via a single cheap UTP Cat 5 lead (i've gone 30 metres with no noticable image quality loss, supposedly you can go much further). Removes the need to run a mains power lead or coax lead to the camera so setup is quick and easy, and reduces time spent dangling from ladders. You can get sets of cat 5 baluns really cheap on ebay. 3) Second cat 5 balun, on the other end of the cat 5 lead, placed next to computer. Connect to a suitable power supply for your video camera, and connect signal to a near zero latency industrial firewire capture device such as a DFG/1394-1e. http://www.theimagingsource.com/en_US/products/converters/dfg13941e/ This allows you to hook up to a to a desktop or laptop, including a mac mini. Then you're done. Just set Pd to listen to the DFG/1394-1e. Image will be clean and roughly equivalent to 720x576 res. This setup can also be modified to work with near infra-red light instead of visible light if you want to avoid detecting lighting changes as movement. Just tape three squares of primary red and congo blue gel in front of the camera lens. Set up a few PAR56s to flood the space with light. Add the same gel to the 56's as you did to the camera and it will block almost all visible light. People will glow bright white when viewed through the camera, but most other stuff in the space will be close to invisible. Alternately, if you want to use a firewire board camera, you can get something like a Lindy CAT5 FireWire Extender. They aren't cheap but they extend the maximum length of a firewire run from around 5m to 70m without quality loss. Regards, David Kirkpatrick _________________________________________________________________ Looking to change your car this year? Find car news, reviews and more http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fsecure%2Dau%2Eimrworldwide%2Ecom%2Fcgi%2Dbin%2Fa%2Fci%5F450304%2Fet%5F2%2Fcg%5F801459%2Fpi%5F1004813%2Fai%5F859641&_t=762955845&_r=tig_OCT07&_m=EXT -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From grh at mur.at Sat Mar 7 10:52:05 2009 From: grh at mur.at (Georg Holzmann) Date: Sat, 07 Mar 2009 10:52:05 +0100 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <0549ECF8-5837-457E-A78E-B1172ABD75FE@grrrr.org> References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> <49AD7CFF.2060502@mur.at> <49AD91D7.10107@mur.at> <0549ECF8-5837-457E-A78E-B1172ABD75FE@grrrr.org> Message-ID: <49B243C5.4010809@mur.at> Hallo! > i added my name to two existing projects matching my competences. Just > in case Georg is too busy with all the other ones he is part of. Yes of course, feel free to add you to the projects ! I think we should have at least two mentors for each project, at least for the application now. LG Georg From enrique at netpd.org Sat Mar 7 11:26:44 2009 From: enrique at netpd.org (Enrique Erne) Date: Sat, 07 Mar 2009 11:26:44 +0100 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> Message-ID: <49B24BE4.5060702@netpd.org> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > The Google Summer of Code ((http://code.google.com/soc/) application > is due very soon, March 9th, and we need mentors! At this point, you > just need to put down your name. Then once the projects are in, we'll > choose projects and who will mentor them. > Every pd developer who wants to support the project but is not student > anymore is invited to join as mentor, since the number of sponsored > projects by google depends on the number of mentors and students. Andy, Claude, Frank, Marius, Mathieu, Roman where are you guys? add your names, hurry! :) http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/GSoCOrganizationApp2009 @both Chris's and Derek your names and gmail account are missing!! From jack at rybn.org Sat Mar 7 13:15:16 2009 From: jack at rybn.org (Jack) Date: Sat, 7 Mar 2009 13:15:16 +0100 Subject: [PD] Pd/GEM and camera for tracking In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <0186A29E-C12B-4AB3-80DF-C48D9E2CBD3E@rybn.org> Hello David, Thanx for all this informations using an analogue camera. It's good to know there is FireWire extensions, but it is very expensive (245 pound sterling !). If i understand, the system is like this : Analogue camera with BNC -> BNC baluns with power -> cat 5 cable -> composite baluns with power -> composite to FireWire400 converter -> FireWire400 to FireWire800 cable -> MacMini -> Pd/GEM ? I know that analogues cameras are good solutions, but with all this stuff, there is no risk of noise ? ;) (tell me if i'm wrong). ++` Jack Le 7 mars 09 ? 06:18, David Kirkpatrick a ?crit : > Hi Jack, > > I've done a fair bit of this sort of thing before. The most useful > setup i've found is: > > 1) Analogue monochrome CCTV camera. (Preferably with around 700 > horizontal lines or so, very low lux, and self syncing) > I use these. http://www.allthings.com.au/Catalogue/CCS/monochrome% > 20low%20light%20cctv%20dsp%20video%20camera.html > You can then buy a C or CS lens that is the right angle for your > situation. For roof mounted stuff I use an ultra-wide angle > varifocal set to just before it noticably fisheyes. > > 2) Cat 5 balun connected to CCTV camera's analogue video output and > power input. This allows signal to be sent, and power to be > recieved via a single cheap UTP Cat 5 lead (i've gone 30 metres > with no noticable image quality loss, supposedly you can go much > further). Removes the need to run a mains power lead or coax lead > to the camera so setup is quick and easy, and reduces time spent > dangling from ladders. You can get sets of cat 5 baluns really > cheap on ebay. > > 3) Second cat 5 balun, on the other end of the cat 5 lead, placed > next to computer. Connect to a suitable power supply for your video > camera, and connect signal to a near zero latency industrial > firewire capture device such as a DFG/1394-1e. http:// > www.theimagingsource.com/en_US/products/converters/dfg13941e/ This > allows you to hook up to a to a desktop or laptop, including a mac > mini. > > Then you're done. Just set Pd to listen to the DFG/1394-1e. Image > will be clean and roughly equivalent to 720x576 res. > > This setup can also be modified to work with near infra-red light > instead of visible light if you want to avoid detecting lighting > changes as movement. Just tape three squares of primary red and > congo blue gel in front of the camera lens. Set up a few PAR56s to > flood the space with light. Add the same gel to the 56's as you did > to the camera and it will block almost all visible light. People > will glow bright white when viewed through the camera, but most > other stuff in the space will be close to invisible. > > > Alternately, if you want to use a firewire board camera, you can > get something like a Lindy CAT5 FireWire Extender. They aren't > cheap but they extend the maximum length of a firewire run from > around 5m to 70m without quality loss. > > > Regards, > > David Kirkpatrick > > Find car news, reviews and more Looking to change your car this year? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From djk_1200 at hotmail.com Sat Mar 7 15:40:12 2009 From: djk_1200 at hotmail.com (David Kirkpatrick) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 01:40:12 +1100 Subject: [PD] Pd/GEM and camera for tracking In-Reply-To: <0186A29E-C12B-4AB3-80DF-C48D9E2CBD3E@rybn.org> References: <0186A29E-C12B-4AB3-80DF-C48D9E2CBD3E@rybn.org> Message-ID: Hi Jack, Yep, your chain is right. A minor difference is that I use two BNC baluns (one with a BNC to composite adaptor attached), but it should make very little difference. I also used a UTP cat 6 cable instead of cat 5, but I used cat 5 baluns. I've used this chain in multiple theatrical projects without noise issues, even with moving lights messing up the ambient light levels. Obviously you would have a dodgy signal if you ran the UTP cat 5 or 6 alongside a 3 phase lead or something, but apart from that you should be fine. I had the cat 6 lead running through a lighting grid full of 240V and it didn't degrade. It actually seemed cleaner than doing everything with coaxial cable. David Kirkpatrick CC: pd-list at iem.at From: jack at rybn.org Subject: Re: [PD] Pd/GEM and camera for tracking Date: Sat, 7 Mar 2009 13:15:16 +0100 To: djk_1200 at hotmail.com Hello David, Thanx for all this informations using an analogue camera. It's good to know there is FireWire extensions, but it is very expensive (245 pound sterling !). If i understand, the system is like this : Analogue camera with BNC -> BNC baluns with power -> cat 5 cable -> composite baluns with power -> composite to FireWire400 converter -> FireWire400 to FireWire800 cable -> MacMini -> Pd/GEM ? I know that analogues cameras are good solutions, but with all this stuff, there is no risk of noise ? ;) (tell me if i'm wrong). ++` Jack Le 7 mars 09 ? 06:18, David Kirkpatrick a ?crit : Hi Jack, I've done a fair bit of this sort of thing before. The most useful setup i've found is: 1) Analogue monochrome CCTV camera. (Preferably with around 700 horizontal lines or so, very low lux, and self syncing) I use these. http://www.allthings.com.au/Catalogue/CCS/monochrome%20low%20light%20cctv%20dsp%20video%20camera.html You can then buy a C or CS lens that is the right angle for your situation. For roof mounted stuff I use an ultra-wide angle varifocal set to just before it noticably fisheyes. 2) Cat 5 balun connected to CCTV camera's analogue video output and power input. This allows signal to be sent, and power to be recieved via a single cheap UTP Cat 5 lead (i've gone 30 metres with no noticable image quality loss, supposedly you can go much further). Removes the need to run a mains power lead or coax lead to the camera so setup is quick and easy, and reduces time spent dangling from ladders. You can get sets of cat 5 baluns really cheap on ebay. 3) Second cat 5 balun, on the other end of the cat 5 lead, placed next to computer. Connect to a suitable power supply for your video camera, and connect signal to a near zero latency industrial firewire capture device such as a DFG/1394-1e. http://www.theimagingsource.com/en_US/products/converters/dfg13941e/ This allows you to hook up to a to a desktop or laptop, including a mac mini. Then you're done. Just set Pd to listen to the DFG/1394-1e. Image will be clean and roughly equivalent to 720x576 res. This setup can also be modified to work with near infra-red light instead of visible light if you want to avoid detecting lighting changes as movement. Just tape three squares of primary red and congo blue gel in front of the camera lens. Set up a few PAR56s to flood the space with light. Add the same gel to the 56's as you did to the camera and it will block almost all visible light. People will glow bright white when viewed through the camera, but most other stuff in the space will be close to invisible. Alternately, if you want to use a firewire board camera, you can get something like a Lindy CAT5 FireWire Extender. They aren't cheap but they extend the maximum length of a firewire run from around 5m to 70m without quality loss. Regards, David Kirkpatrick Find car news, reviews and more Looking to change your car this year? _________________________________________________________________ View photos of singles in your area. Click Here http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fdating%2Eninemsn%2Ecom%2Eau%2Fchannel%2Findex%2Easpx%3Ftrackingid%3D1046247&_t=773166080&_r=Hotmail_Endtext&_m=EXT From reduzierer at yahoo.de Sat Mar 7 15:51:19 2009 From: reduzierer at yahoo.de (Roman Haefeli) Date: Sat, 07 Mar 2009 15:51:19 +0100 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <49B24BE4.5060702@netpd.org> References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> <49B24BE4.5060702@netpd.org> Message-ID: <1236437479.8049.39.camel@yoyo2> On Sat, 2009-03-07 at 11:26 +0100, Enrique Erne wrote: > Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > The Google Summer of Code ((http://code.google.com/soc/) application > > is due very soon, March 9th, and we need mentors! At this point, you > > just need to put down your name. Then once the projects are in, we'll > > choose projects and who will mentor them. > > > Every pd developer who wants to support the project but is not student > > anymore is invited to join as mentor, since the number of sponsored > > projects by google depends on the number of mentors and students. > > Andy, Claude, Frank, Marius, Mathieu, Roman where are you guys? > > add your names, hurry! :) yo, i am happy to add my name, but i guess it only makes sense for me to take a mentorship of a project, that is about patching and not c coding. from what i have seen, there is only one project - undead - which seems to be about patching. derek holzer is already proposed as a mentor. does it make sense to propose more then one mentor for a project? roman ___________________________________________________________ Telefonate ohne weitere Kosten vom PC zum PC: http://messenger.yahoo.de From derek at umatic.nl Sat Mar 7 16:08:57 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Sat, 07 Mar 2009 16:08:57 +0100 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <1236437479.8049.39.camel@yoyo2> References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> <49B24BE4.5060702@netpd.org> <1236437479.8049.39.camel@yoyo2> Message-ID: <49B28E09.2010204@umatic.nl> Hi Roman, actually GEMVeeJay is also a patching project. But yes, either propose a new project (the more the better!!!) or sign up as proposed mentor for Undead or GEMVeeJay. Having spare mentor shouldn't be a problem, I think the idea was to have two possible mentors for each one... best, D. Roman Haefeli wrote: > On Sat, 2009-03-07 at 11:26 +0100, Enrique Erne wrote: >> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >>> The Google Summer of Code ((http://code.google.com/soc/) application >>> is due very soon, March 9th, and we need mentors! At this point, you >>> just need to put down your name. Then once the projects are in, we'll >>> choose projects and who will mentor them. >>> Every pd developer who wants to support the project but is not student >>> anymore is invited to join as mentor, since the number of sponsored >>> projects by google depends on the number of mentors and students. >> Andy, Claude, Frank, Marius, Mathieu, Roman where are you guys? >> >> add your names, hurry! :) > > yo, i am happy to add my name, but i guess it only makes sense for me to > take a mentorship of a project, that is about patching and not c coding. > from what i have seen, there is only one project - undead - which seems > to be about patching. derek holzer is already proposed as a mentor. does > it make sense to propose more then one mentor for a project? > > roman > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > Telefonate ohne weitere Kosten vom PC zum PC: http://messenger.yahoo.de > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -- derek holzer ::: http://www.umatic.nl ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ---Oblique Strategy # 109: "Lost in useless territory" From jack at rybn.org Sat Mar 7 16:15:40 2009 From: jack at rybn.org (Jack) Date: Sat, 7 Mar 2009 16:15:40 +0100 Subject: [PD] Pd/GEM and camera for tracking In-Reply-To: References: <0186A29E-C12B-4AB3-80DF-C48D9E2CBD3E@rybn.org> Message-ID: Good ! Thanx a lot David. ++ Jack Le 7 mars 09 ? 15:40, David Kirkpatrick a ?crit : > > Hi Jack, > > Yep, your chain is right. A minor difference is that I use two BNC > baluns (one with a BNC to composite adaptor attached), but it > should make very little difference. I also used a UTP cat 6 cable > instead of cat 5, but I used cat 5 baluns. > > I've used this chain in multiple theatrical projects without noise > issues, even with moving lights messing up the ambient light > levels. Obviously you would have a dodgy signal if you ran the UTP > cat 5 or 6 alongside a 3 phase lead or something, but apart from > that you should be fine. I had the cat 6 lead running through a > lighting grid full of 240V and it didn't degrade. It actually > seemed cleaner than doing everything with coaxial cable. > > David Kirkpatrick > > > > CC: pd-list at iem.at > From: jack at rybn.org > Subject: Re: [PD] Pd/GEM and camera for tracking > Date: Sat, 7 Mar 2009 13:15:16 +0100 > To: djk_1200 at hotmail.com > > Hello David, > > > Thanx for all this informations using an analogue camera. > It's good to know there is FireWire extensions, but it is very > expensive (245 pound sterling !). > > > If i understand, the system is like this : > Analogue camera with BNC -> BNC baluns with power -> cat 5 cable -> > composite baluns with power -> composite to FireWire400 converter - > > FireWire400 to FireWire800 cable -> MacMini -> Pd/GEM ? > > > I know that analogues cameras are good solutions, but with all this > stuff, there is no risk of noise ? ;) (tell me if i'm wrong). > ++` > > > Jack > > > > > Le 7 mars 09 ? 06:18, David Kirkpatrick a ?crit : > > > > Hi Jack, > > I've done a fair bit of this sort of thing before. The most useful > setup i've found is: > > 1) Analogue monochrome CCTV camera. (Preferably with around 700 > horizontal lines or so, very low lux, and self syncing) > I use these. http://www.allthings.com.au/Catalogue/CCS/monochrome% > 20low%20light%20cctv%20dsp%20video%20camera.html > You can then buy a C or CS lens that is the right angle for your > situation. For roof mounted stuff I use an ultra-wide angle > varifocal set to just before it noticably fisheyes. > > 2) Cat 5 balun connected to CCTV camera's analogue video output and > power input. This allows signal to be sent, and power to be > recieved via a single cheap UTP Cat 5 lead (i've gone 30 metres > with no noticable image quality loss, supposedly you can go much > further). Removes the need to run a mains power lead or coax lead > to the camera so setup is quick and easy, and reduces time spent > dangling from ladders. You can get sets of cat 5 baluns really > cheap on ebay. > > 3) Second cat 5 balun, on the other end of the cat 5 lead, placed > next to computer. Connect to a suitable power supply for your video > camera, and connect signal to a near zero latency industrial > firewire capture device such as a DFG/1394-1e. http:// > www.theimagingsource.com/en_US/products/converters/dfg13941e/ This > allows you to hook up to a to a desktop or laptop, including a mac > mini. > > Then you're done. Just set Pd to listen to the DFG/1394-1e. Image > will be clean and roughly equivalent to 720x576 res. > > This setup can also be modified to work with near infra-red light > instead of visible light if you want to avoid detecting lighting > changes as movement. Just tape three squares of primary red and > congo blue gel in front of the camera lens. Set up a few PAR56s to > flood the space with light. Add the same gel to the 56's as you did > to the camera and it will block almost all visible light. People > will glow bright white when viewed through the camera, but most > other stuff in the space will be close to invisible. > > > Alternately, if you want to use a firewire board camera, you can > get something like a Lindy CAT5 FireWire Extender. They aren't > cheap but they extend the maximum length of a firewire run from > around 5m to 70m without quality loss. > > > Regards, > > David Kirkpatrick > > > > > > Find car news, reviews and more Looking to change your car this year? > _________________________________________________________________ > View photos of singles in your area. Click Here > http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fdating%2Eninemsn% > 2Ecom%2Eau%2Fchannel%2Findex%2Easpx%3Ftrackingid% > 3D1046247&_t=773166080&_r=Hotmail_Endtext&_m=EXT From matju at artengine.ca Sat Mar 7 16:27:39 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Sat, 7 Mar 2009 10:27:39 -0500 (EST) Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <49B24BE4.5060702@netpd.org> References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> <49B24BE4.5060702@netpd.org> Message-ID: On Sat, 7 Mar 2009, Enrique Erne wrote: > Andy, Claude, Frank, Marius, Mathieu, Roman where are you guys? Where should I be? > add your names, hurry! :) Why should I add my name? _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From marius.schebella at gmail.com Sat Mar 7 17:14:52 2009 From: marius.schebella at gmail.com (marius schebella) Date: Sat, 07 Mar 2009 17:14:52 +0100 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <49B24BE4.5060702@netpd.org> References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> <49B24BE4.5060702@netpd.org> Message-ID: <49B29D7C.1070407@gmail.com> Enrique Erne wrote: > Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >> The Google Summer of Code ((http://code.google.com/soc/) application >> is due very soon, March 9th, and we need mentors! At this point, you >> just need to put down your name. Then once the projects are in, we'll >> choose projects and who will mentor them. > >> Every pd developer who wants to support the project but is not student >> anymore is invited to join as mentor, since the number of sponsored >> projects by google depends on the number of mentors and students. > > Andy, Claude, Frank, Marius, Mathieu, Roman where are you guys? > I am over here, banging my head against the wall, because I am working on too many things at the same time... marius. > add your names, hurry! :) > > http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/GSoCOrganizationApp2009 > > @both Chris's and Derek your names and gmail account are missing!! > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > From padawan12 at obiwannabe.co.uk Sat Mar 7 17:24:38 2009 From: padawan12 at obiwannabe.co.uk (Andy Farnell) Date: Sat, 7 Mar 2009 16:24:38 +0000 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> <49B24BE4.5060702@netpd.org> Message-ID: <20090307162438.10210077.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> Sorry for the silence, I am quite busy at the moment, but to explain the situation viz GSoC mentoring, Google unilaterally and without warning disabled my account. Attempts to contact Google to remedy this result in a cul-de-sac web form that refuses to accept the email I registered with. I would very much like to offer my help to mentor students on Pd projects, but I don't have time to bang my head against a wall of listless corporate ambivalence. If any students want help on Pd audio related matters, as per normal please don't hesitate to contact me at the usual address. On Sat, 7 Mar 2009 10:27:39 -0500 (EST) Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > On Sat, 7 Mar 2009, Enrique Erne wrote: > > > Andy, Claude, Frank, Marius, Mathieu, Roman where are you guys? > > Where should I be? > > > add your names, hurry! :) > > Why should I add my name? > > _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... > | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec -- Use the source From marius.schebella at gmail.com Sat Mar 7 17:30:36 2009 From: marius.schebella at gmail.com (marius schebella) Date: Sat, 07 Mar 2009 17:30:36 +0100 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: References: <1236214369.7483.13.camel@danoT500> <7223A0F4-49DA-421E-8FFB-7324EF1246C2@eds.org> <1236294414.8960.0.camel@danoT500> <49B109A4.9050909@umatic.nl> <49B152BE.2000703@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <49B2A12C.1060207@gmail.com> chris clepper wrote: > My own suggestion for a GEM project would be to create a tutorial and > accompanying manual that covers the basic operation. I was planning to do this for years now, adding to dereks FLOSS Documentation or just as a separate project. there are a lot of unsorted patches on my drive, but as someone mentioned in a response to this email, documentation is not part of GSoC... The other idea > involves making the more advanced features like GLSL and framebuffer > rendering easier to use. I started to port vade's old v001 last year, including abstractions to easily chain several shaders together. not finished yet because with relation to GLSL stuff, I think I am just too stupid to get it... marius. These are mainly documentation projects, but > also have some Pd, and possible C++ coding as well. > > On Fri, Mar 6, 2009 at 11:43 AM, Derek Holzer > wrote: > > That's great, let's see what happens ;-) > > d. > > chris clepper wrote: > > I added my name to the VeeJay project to advise on how the low > level stuff affects performance and stability. I don't know if > a project can have more than one mentor though. > > On Fri, Mar 6, 2009 at 6:31 AM, Derek Holzer >> wrote: > > Since I'm completely uninterested in touching anything C, > C++, TclTk or > otherwise related, I submitted two Pd patching projects which > should be > general enough to attract students, yet quite intensive to > work on. > Feedback welcome. > > http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/Undead > http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/GEMVeeJay > > Anyone want to take up 2007's PluggoPd idea? > > best, > D. > > -- > derek holzer ::: http://www.umatic.nl ::: > http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista > ---Oblique Strategy # 194: > "Steal a solution." > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at > mailing list > > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > -- > derek holzer ::: http://www.umatic.nl ::: > http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista > ---Oblique Strategy # 83: > "How would someone else do it?" > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From enrique at netpd.org Sat Mar 7 17:51:08 2009 From: enrique at netpd.org (Enrique Erne) Date: Sat, 07 Mar 2009 17:51:08 +0100 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> <49B24BE4.5060702@netpd.org> Message-ID: <49B2A5FC.3040501@netpd.org> Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > On Sat, 7 Mar 2009, Enrique Erne wrote: > >> Andy, Claude, Frank, Marius, Mathieu, Roman where are you guys? > > Where should I be? > >> add your names, hurry! :) > > Why should I add my name? you could be mentor for a project. how about LibPDEngine? :) From matju at artengine.ca Sat Mar 7 18:10:08 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Sat, 7 Mar 2009 12:10:08 -0500 (EST) Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <49B2A5FC.3040501@netpd.org> References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> <49B24BE4.5060702@netpd.org> <49B2A5FC.3040501@netpd.org> Message-ID: On Sat, 7 Mar 2009, Enrique Erne wrote: > Mathieu Bouchard wrote: >> Why should I add my name? > you could be mentor for a project. I mean, why should I be mentor for a project? > how about LibPDEngine? :) That's not really related to anything I do. Well, I did a quick test of making and using libpd.so in DD, but I didn't have any real use for this in mind. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From hans at eds.org Sat Mar 7 18:18:10 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Sat, 7 Mar 2009 12:18:10 -0500 Subject: [PD] [PD-announce] Pd Demo @ Art and Code, CMU, Pittsburgh, PA March 7-9 Message-ID: <6B0DCE6C-AEB7-43F1-AB7A-C03C86A3C906@eds.org> This is quite last minute, so I am just emailed out about it now. At the Art And Code conference at CMU in Pittsburgh, PA, I'll be giving a talk about Pd on Sunday and a demo/workshop on Monday. You have to be registered for the talk part, but I think that the demo on monday is more or less open. http://artandcode.ning.com/ .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Computer science is no more related to the computer than astronomy is related to the telescope. -Edsger Dykstra _______________________________________________ Pd-announce mailing list Pd-announce at iem.at http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-announce From enrique at netpd.org Sat Mar 7 18:28:27 2009 From: enrique at netpd.org (Enrique Erne) Date: Sat, 07 Mar 2009 18:28:27 +0100 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> <49B24BE4.5060702@netpd.org> <49B2A5FC.3040501@netpd.org> Message-ID: <49B2AEBB.3030102@netpd.org> Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > On Sat, 7 Mar 2009, Enrique Erne wrote: >> how about LibPDEngine? :) > > That's not really related to anything I do. Well, I did a quick test of > making and using libpd.so in DD, but I didn't have any real use for this > in mind. is there any reason why you shouldn't be a mentor for a project? it's easy to setup a gmail account :) what about MoreGUIs since that is kind of related to DD, isn't it? even though it has already 2 mentors... the more the better right? i just picked randomly a few names of people, who are pretty active on this list and have great knowledge. it seems a pretty opportunity to add a project of your choice and add yourself as a mentor. you can only win or not? eni From gregpond at gmail.com Sat Mar 7 19:31:56 2009 From: gregpond at gmail.com (Greg Pond) Date: Sat, 7 Mar 2009 12:31:56 -0600 Subject: [PD] [PD-announce] Pd Demo @ Art and Code, CMU, Pittsburgh, PA March 7-9 In-Reply-To: <6B0DCE6C-AEB7-43F1-AB7A-C03C86A3C906@eds.org> References: <6B0DCE6C-AEB7-43F1-AB7A-C03C86A3C906@eds.org> Message-ID: <94e4b7b30903071031x2a2c0a69l2c493275c3775cd1@mail.gmail.com> Have fun there- say hello to Golan. Greg On Sat, Mar 7, 2009 at 11:18 AM, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > This is quite last minute, so I am just emailed out about it now. ?At > the Art And Code conference at CMU in Pittsburgh, PA, I'll be giving a > talk about Pd on Sunday and a demo/workshop on Monday. ?You have to be > registered for the talk part, but I think that the demo on monday is > more or less open. > > http://artandcode.ning.com/ > > .hc > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Computer science is no more related to the computer than astronomy is > related to the telescope. ? ? ?-Edsger Dykstra > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-announce mailing list > Pd-announce at iem.at > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-announce > From reduzierer at yahoo.de Sat Mar 7 19:54:34 2009 From: reduzierer at yahoo.de (Roman Haefeli) Date: Sat, 07 Mar 2009 19:54:34 +0100 Subject: [PD] new [tcpserver] (was: pd and tcp: what to do against crashes?) In-Reply-To: References: <1235905522.7557.39.camel@yoyo2> <1235951524.7549.30.camel@yoyo2> <1235955557.7549.54.camel@yoyo2> <1236001621.7549.76.camel@yoyo2> <1236123916.7628.19.camel@yoyo2> <1236125488.7628.27.camel@yoyo2> Message-ID: <1236452074.8049.72.camel@yoyo2> hi again a new stupid little problem occured. when working with [tcpserver], i usually identify the clients by their socket number and not by their client number; for two reasons: when a message is received or a new client connects, you can only know the socket number of it (since there is a dedicated socket outlet), but not the client id. the other reason is that socket numbers are persistent, while client numbers might change, if one or more clients disconnect or get disconnected. my problem is, that the new status outlet and also the method to set internal buffersize is based on the client number. it's not a that big problem, since whenever i sent a message to a socket number i will know the client number as well. but when receiving messages, you don't know which client it came from. i though about building a look-up table in order to look up a socket for its client number, but this is not very feasible, since the client id might not be valid anymore after one or more disconnects. what i want to say, that it is currently not handy to use the new features, because you are forced to work in both domains, client and socket, at the same time. personally, i would prefer if everything would be socket based and i think, if you want to change it, then better now than later. another solution (though uglier, imho) would be to implement an internal look-up: 'get_client_id ' -> [tcpserver] -> 'client_id ' to the status outlet. what do you think? roman ___________________________________________________________ Der fr?he Vogel f?ngt den Wurm. Hier gelangen Sie zum neuen Yahoo! Mail: http://mail.yahoo.de From reduzierer at yahoo.de Sat Mar 7 20:15:22 2009 From: reduzierer at yahoo.de (Roman Haefeli) Date: Sat, 07 Mar 2009 20:15:22 +0100 Subject: [PD] new [tcpserver] (was: pd and tcp: what to do against crashes?) In-Reply-To: <1236452074.8049.72.camel@yoyo2> References: <1235905522.7557.39.camel@yoyo2> <1235951524.7549.30.camel@yoyo2> <1235955557.7549.54.camel@yoyo2> <1236001621.7549.76.camel@yoyo2> <1236123916.7628.19.camel@yoyo2> <1236125488.7628.27.camel@yoyo2> <1236452074.8049.72.camel@yoyo2> Message-ID: <1236453322.8049.79.camel@yoyo2> On Sat, 2009-03-07 at 19:54 +0100, Roman Haefeli wrote: > hi again > > a new stupid little problem occured. when working with [tcpserver], i > usually identify the clients by their socket number and not by their > client number; for two reasons: when a message is received or a new > client connects, you can only know the socket number of it (since there > is a dedicated socket outlet), but not the client id. the other reason > is that socket numbers are persistent, while client numbers might > change, if one or more clients disconnect or get disconnected. my > problem is, that the new status outlet and also the method to set > internal buffersize is based on the client number. it's not a that big > problem, since whenever i sent a message to a socket number i will know > the client number as well. but when receiving messages, you don't know > which client it came from. i though about building a look-up table in > order to look up a socket for its client number, but this is not very > feasible, since the client id might not be valid anymore after one or > more disconnects. > what i want to say, that it is currently not handy to use the new > features, because you are forced to work in both domains, client and > socket, at the same time. personally, i would prefer if everything would > be socket based and i think, if you want to change it, then better now > than later. > another solution (though uglier, imho) would be to implement an internal > look-up: 'get_client_id ' -> [tcpserver] -> 'client_id ' > to the status outlet. > > what do you think? i just found out, that there is already something as a look-up table: when i send 'client' or 'client ' to [tcpserver], i actually get all necessary information. sorry for the noise. roman ___________________________________________________________ Telefonate ohne weitere Kosten vom PC zum PC: http://messenger.yahoo.de From martin.peach at sympatico.ca Sat Mar 7 20:30:48 2009 From: martin.peach at sympatico.ca (Martin Peach) Date: Sat, 07 Mar 2009 14:30:48 -0500 Subject: [PD] new [tcpserver] In-Reply-To: <1236453322.8049.79.camel@yoyo2> References: <1235905522.7557.39.camel@yoyo2> <1235951524.7549.30.camel@yoyo2> <1235955557.7549.54.camel@yoyo2> <1236001621.7549.76.camel@yoyo2> <1236123916.7628.19.camel@yoyo2> <1236125488.7628.27.camel@yoyo2> <1236452074.8049.72.camel@yoyo2> <1236453322.8049.79.camel@yoyo2> Message-ID: Roman Haefeli wrote: > On Sat, 2009-03-07 at 19:54 +0100, Roman Haefeli wrote: >> hi again >> >> a new stupid little problem occured. when working with [tcpserver], i >> usually identify the clients by their socket number and not by their >> client number; for two reasons: when a message is received or a new >> client connects, you can only know the socket number of it (since there >> is a dedicated socket outlet), but not the client id. the other reason >> is that socket numbers are persistent, while client numbers might >> change, if one or more clients disconnect or get disconnected. my >> problem is, that the new status outlet and also the method to set >> internal buffersize is based on the client number. it's not a that big >> problem, since whenever i sent a message to a socket number i will know >> the client number as well. but when receiving messages, you don't know >> which client it came from. i though about building a look-up table in >> order to look up a socket for its client number, but this is not very >> feasible, since the client id might not be valid anymore after one or >> more disconnects. >> what i want to say, that it is currently not handy to use the new >> features, because you are forced to work in both domains, client and >> socket, at the same time. personally, i would prefer if everything would >> be socket based and i think, if you want to change it, then better now >> than later. >> another solution (though uglier, imho) would be to implement an internal >> look-up: 'get_client_id ' -> [tcpserver] -> 'client_id ' >> to the status outlet. >> >> what do you think? > > i just found out, that there is already something as a look-up table: > when i send 'client' or 'client ' to [tcpserver], i actually > get all necessary information. > > sorry for the noise. > That's ok, but I've noticed that socket numbers are always in the hundreds while client numbers count up from 1. It would be easy enough to add a bit of code so that if the first number in a [send( message didn't match a client, it would be interpreted as a socket. Do you ever get overlap with client numbers and socket numbers? Martin From martin.peach at sympatico.ca Sat Mar 7 23:03:10 2009 From: martin.peach at sympatico.ca (Martin Peach) Date: Sat, 07 Mar 2009 17:03:10 -0500 Subject: [PD] new [tcpserver] In-Reply-To: References: <1235905522.7557.39.camel@yoyo2> <1235951524.7549.30.camel@yoyo2> <1235955557.7549.54.camel@yoyo2> <1236001621.7549.76.camel@yoyo2> <1236123916.7628.19.camel@yoyo2> <1236125488.7628.27.camel@yoyo2> <1236452074.8049.72.camel@yoyo2> <1236453322.8049.79.camel@yoyo2> Message-ID: Martin Peach wrote: > Roman Haefeli wrote: >> On Sat, 2009-03-07 at 19:54 +0100, Roman Haefeli wrote: >>> hi again >>> >>> a new stupid little problem occured. when working with [tcpserver], i >>> usually identify the clients by their socket number and not by their >>> client number; for two reasons: when a message is received or a new >>> client connects, you can only know the socket number of it (since there >>> is a dedicated socket outlet), but not the client id. the other reason >>> is that socket numbers are persistent, while client numbers might >>> change, if one or more clients disconnect or get disconnected. my >>> problem is, that the new status outlet and also the method to set >>> internal buffersize is based on the client number. it's not a that big >>> problem, since whenever i sent a message to a socket number i will know >>> the client number as well. but when receiving messages, you don't know >>> which client it came from. i though about building a look-up table in >>> order to look up a socket for its client number, but this is not very >>> feasible, since the client id might not be valid anymore after one or >>> more disconnects. >>> what i want to say, that it is currently not handy to use the new >>> features, because you are forced to work in both domains, client and >>> socket, at the same time. personally, i would prefer if everything would >>> be socket based and i think, if you want to change it, then better now >>> than later. >>> another solution (though uglier, imho) would be to implement an internal >>> look-up: 'get_client_id ' -> [tcpserver] -> 'client_id ' >>> to the status outlet. >>> >>> what do you think? >> i just found out, that there is already something as a look-up table: >> when i send 'client' or 'client ' to [tcpserver], i actually >> get all necessary information. >> >> sorry for the noise. >> > > That's ok, but I've noticed that socket numbers are always in the > hundreds while client numbers count up from 1. It would be easy enough > to add a bit of code so that if the first number in a [send( message > didn't match a client, it would be interpreted as a socket. Do you ever > get overlap with client numbers and socket numbers? > Actually if you use a [send( with [tcpserver] the first number is the socket number. If you use a [client( message the first number is a client number. I guess I meant to say that when you send a message containing only floats the first number is supposed to be a socket number, but it could also be a client number if the clients are always under 100 and the sockets are over 100. Also the 'sent' output could easily give the socket as well as the client. Martin From reduzierer at yahoo.de Sat Mar 7 23:06:06 2009 From: reduzierer at yahoo.de (Roman Haefeli) Date: Sat, 07 Mar 2009 23:06:06 +0100 Subject: [PD] new [tcpserver] In-Reply-To: References: <1235905522.7557.39.camel@yoyo2> <1235951524.7549.30.camel@yoyo2> <1235955557.7549.54.camel@yoyo2> <1236001621.7549.76.camel@yoyo2> <1236123916.7628.19.camel@yoyo2> <1236125488.7628.27.camel@yoyo2> <1236452074.8049.72.camel@yoyo2> <1236453322.8049.79.camel@yoyo2> Message-ID: <1236463566.8049.85.camel@yoyo2> On Sat, 2009-03-07 at 14:30 -0500, Martin Peach wrote: > Roman Haefeli wrote: > > On Sat, 2009-03-07 at 19:54 +0100, Roman Haefeli wrote: > >> hi again > >> > >> a new stupid little problem occured. when working with [tcpserver], i > >> usually identify the clients by their socket number and not by their > >> client number; for two reasons: when a message is received or a new > >> client connects, you can only know the socket number of it (since there > >> is a dedicated socket outlet), but not the client id. the other reason > >> is that socket numbers are persistent, while client numbers might > >> change, if one or more clients disconnect or get disconnected. my > >> problem is, that the new status outlet and also the method to set > >> internal buffersize is based on the client number. it's not a that big > >> problem, since whenever i sent a message to a socket number i will know > >> the client number as well. but when receiving messages, you don't know > >> which client it came from. i though about building a look-up table in > >> order to look up a socket for its client number, but this is not very > >> feasible, since the client id might not be valid anymore after one or > >> more disconnects. > >> what i want to say, that it is currently not handy to use the new > >> features, because you are forced to work in both domains, client and > >> socket, at the same time. personally, i would prefer if everything would > >> be socket based and i think, if you want to change it, then better now > >> than later. > >> another solution (though uglier, imho) would be to implement an internal > >> look-up: 'get_client_id ' -> [tcpserver] -> 'client_id ' > >> to the status outlet. > >> > >> what do you think? > > > > i just found out, that there is already something as a look-up table: > > when i send 'client' or 'client ' to [tcpserver], i actually > > get all necessary information. > > > > sorry for the noise. > > > > That's ok, but I've noticed that socket numbers are always in the > hundreds while client numbers count up from 1. It would be easy enough > to add a bit of code so that if the first number in a [send( message > didn't match a client, it would be interpreted as a socket. Do you ever > get overlap with client numbers and socket numbers? yes, i do. depending on the box, where the server runs, i get socket numbers starting from 4 (debian lenny) or 8 (ubuntu hardy), though on windows xp they seem to start at 432. roman ___________________________________________________________ Telefonate ohne weitere Kosten vom PC zum PC: http://messenger.yahoo.de From matju at artengine.ca Sun Mar 8 00:14:31 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Sat, 7 Mar 2009 18:14:31 -0500 (EST) Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <49B2AEBB.3030102@netpd.org> References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> <49B24BE4.5060702@netpd.org> <49B2A5FC.3040501@netpd.org> <49B2AEBB.3030102@netpd.org> Message-ID: On Sat, 7 Mar 2009, Enrique Erne wrote: > what about MoreGUIs since that is kind of related to DD, isn't it? Due to the GUI API being used by that project proposal, no, it's probably less related to DD than most any other GSoC submission. I mean, it's negatively related, whereas other proposals are just neutral towards it. > even though it has already 2 mentors... the more the better right? Well, after 2 applicants, it doesn't really matter. It's not like both are going to desist. Only one gets to be the mentor, in the end. > it seems a pretty opportunity to add a project of your choice and add > yourself as a mentor. you can only win or not? I have no idea what I could submit, that could be reasonably accepted and that could be reasonably completed by an unspecified student. So, what was the outcome of the previously accepted projects? Were the goals completed? How did it happen? I don't really recall reading about this. How do students get chosen? _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From lukexipd at gmail.com Sun Mar 8 02:22:43 2009 From: lukexipd at gmail.com (Luke Iannini) Date: Sat, 7 Mar 2009 17:22:43 -0800 Subject: [PD] I am the harbinger of crashing Message-ID: <7aaf8bb90903071722i542a6fe4m555757ac8cbe701c@mail.gmail.com> Sigh, here's another : ) This seems to have something to do with my MPD24 drum pads... whenever they're connected and I enter the MIDI preferences of Pd, I get the attached crash. It also occurs if they're configured (via .pdrc or the plist) as a default device. This started occurring on the newest builds of Pd-E as well as on Pd-0.42-4. It does not occur of my build of 0.40.3-extended. Anyone have any ideas? Best Luke -------------- next part -------------- Process: pd [19061] Path: /Users/lukeiannini/Desktop/Pd-0.42-4.app/Contents/Resources/Scripts/../bin/pd Identifier: pd Version: ??? (???) Code Type: X86 (Native) Parent Process: Pd [19060] Date/Time: 2009-03-07 17:18:35.904 -0800 OS Version: Mac OS X 10.5.6 (9G55) Report Version: 6 Exception Type: EXC_BAD_ACCESS (SIGBUS) Exception Codes: KERN_PROTECTION_FAILURE at 0x0000000000000000 Crashed Thread: 0 Thread 0 Crashed: 0 com.apple.CoreFoundation 0x90502e33 __CFStrConvertBytesToUnicode + 51 1 com.apple.CoreFoundation 0x904f5536 CFStringCompareWithOptionsAndLocale + 3542 2 com.apple.CoreFoundation 0x904f6455 CFStringCompareWithOptions + 53 3 pd 0x000868fb EndpointName + 315 (pmmacosxcm.c:692) 4 pd 0x00086ae3 cm_get_full_endpoint_name + 227 (pmmacosxcm.c:757) 5 pd 0x00086e18 pm_macosxcm_init + 472 (pmmacosxcm.c:901) 6 pd 0x00087781 Pm_Initialize + 49 (portmidi.c:293) 7 pd 0x00087802 Pm_CountDevices + 18 (portmidi.c:139) 8 pd 0x00077a99 midi_getdevs + 41 (s_midi_pm.c:289) 9 pd 0x00050d2c glob_midi_properties + 92 (s_midi.c:670) 10 pd 0x0003e972 pd_typedmess + 1026 (m_class.c:748) 11 pd 0x000425f1 binbuf_eval + 1121 12 pd 0x0004a155 socketreceiver_read + 949 13 pd 0x000490b9 sys_domicrosleep + 409 14 pd 0x00046c1a m_mainloop + 490 (m_sched.c:511) 15 pd 0x00048e9b sys_main + 1803 16 pd 0x000022e6 start + 54 Thread 1: 0 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b1b1c6 mach_msg_trap + 10 1 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b229bc mach_msg + 72 2 com.apple.CoreFoundation 0x904d20ae CFRunLoopRunSpecific + 1790 3 com.apple.CoreFoundation 0x904d2d34 CFRunLoopRun + 84 4 com.apple.DVCPROHDMuxer 0x003120fb AVS::DestroyAVCDeviceController(AVS::AVCDeviceController*) + 297 5 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4c095 _pthread_start + 321 6 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4bf52 thread_start + 34 Thread 2: 0 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b1b20e semaphore_wait_signal_trap + 10 1 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4d206 _pthread_cond_wait + 1267 2 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b92539 pthread_cond_wait + 48 3 com.grame.JackRouter 0x004953f9 CAGuard::Wait() + 73 4 com.grame.JackRouter 0x004a1779 HP_Device::ExecuteAllCommands() + 57 5 com.grame.JackRouter 0x004999ee CommandThread::ThreadEntry(CommandThread*) + 30 6 com.grame.JackRouter 0x00495f89 CAPThread::Entry(CAPThread*) + 121 7 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4c095 _pthread_start + 321 8 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4bf52 thread_start + 34 Thread 3: 0 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b1b1c6 mach_msg_trap + 10 1 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b229bc mach_msg + 72 2 com.apple.CoreFoundation 0x904d20ae CFRunLoopRunSpecific + 1790 3 com.apple.CoreFoundation 0x904d2cd8 CFRunLoopRunInMode + 88 4 com.apple.audio.CoreAudio 0x9231b5dc HALRunLoop::OwnThread(void*) + 160 5 com.apple.audio.CoreAudio 0x9231b464 CAPThread::Entry(CAPThread*) + 96 6 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4c095 _pthread_start + 321 7 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4bf52 thread_start + 34 Thread 4: 0 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b1b226 semaphore_timedwait_signal_trap + 10 1 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4d1ef _pthread_cond_wait + 1244 2 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4ea73 pthread_cond_timedwait_relative_np + 47 3 com.apple.audio.CoreAudio 0x9232abc3 CAGuard::WaitFor(unsigned long long) + 213 4 com.apple.audio.CoreAudio 0x9232c77e CAGuard::WaitUntil(unsigned long long) + 70 5 com.apple.audio.CoreAudio 0x9232af23 HP_IOThread::WorkLoop() + 759 6 com.apple.audio.CoreAudio 0x9232ac27 HP_IOThread::ThreadEntry(HP_IOThread*) + 17 7 com.apple.audio.CoreAudio 0x9231b464 CAPThread::Entry(CAPThread*) + 96 8 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4c095 _pthread_start + 321 9 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4bf52 thread_start + 34 Thread 5: 0 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b1b226 semaphore_timedwait_signal_trap + 10 1 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4d1ef _pthread_cond_wait + 1244 2 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4ea73 pthread_cond_timedwait_relative_np + 47 3 com.apple.audio.CoreAudio 0x9232abc3 CAGuard::WaitFor(unsigned long long) + 213 4 com.apple.audio.CoreAudio 0x9232c77e CAGuard::WaitUntil(unsigned long long) + 70 5 com.apple.audio.CoreAudio 0x9232af23 HP_IOThread::WorkLoop() + 759 6 com.apple.audio.CoreAudio 0x9232ac27 HP_IOThread::ThreadEntry(HP_IOThread*) + 17 7 com.apple.audio.CoreAudio 0x9231b464 CAPThread::Entry(CAPThread*) + 96 8 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4c095 _pthread_start + 321 9 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4bf52 thread_start + 34 Thread 6: 0 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b1b1c6 mach_msg_trap + 10 1 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b229bc mach_msg + 72 2 com.apple.audio.midi.CoreMIDI 0x000fcf0f XServerMachPort::ReceiveMessage(int&, void*, int&) + 101 3 com.apple.audio.midi.CoreMIDI 0x000ef477 MIDIInPortThread::Run() + 111 4 com.apple.audio.midi.CoreMIDI 0x000f307d XThread::RunHelper(void*) + 17 5 com.apple.audio.midi.CoreMIDI 0x000fd9ee CAPThread::Entry(CAPThread*) + 96 6 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4c095 _pthread_start + 321 7 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4bf52 thread_start + 34 Thread 0 crashed with X86 Thread State (32-bit): eax: 0xa00346e0 ebx: 0x90502e14 ecx: 0x00000000 edx: 0x00000000 edi: 0xbfffbfa0 esi: 0x00000009 ebp: 0xbfffbb98 esp: 0xbfffbb88 ss: 0x0000001f efl: 0x00010246 eip: 0x90502e33 cs: 0x00000017 ds: 0x0000001f es: 0x0000001f fs: 0x00000000 gs: 0x00000037 cr2: 0x00000000 Binary Images: 0x1000 - 0x95ff7 +pd ??? (???) /Users/lukeiannini/Desktop/Pd-0.42-4.app/Contents/Resources/bin/pd 0xeb000 - 0x108ff7 com.apple.audio.midi.CoreMIDI 1.6.1 (42) /System/Library/Frameworks/CoreMIDI.framework/Versions/A/CoreMIDI 0x120000 - 0x13efe3 libexpat.1.dylib ??? (???) /usr/lib/libexpat.1.dylib 0x156000 - 0x159fff com.apple.audio.AudioIPCPlugIn 1.0.5 (1.0.5) /System/Library/Extensions/AudioIPCDriver.kext/Contents/Resources/AudioIPCPlugIn.bundle/Contents/MacOS/AudioIPCPlugIn 0x15f000 - 0x164fff com.apple.audio.AppleHDAHALPlugIn 1.6.2 (1.6.2a37) /System/Library/Extensions/AppleHDA.kext/Contents/PlugIns/AppleHDAHALPlugIn.bundle/Contents/MacOS/AppleHDAHALPlugIn 0x169000 - 0x1bffd6 com.apple.DVCPROHDAudio 1.3 (1.3) /Library/Audio/Plug-Ins/HAL/DVCPROHDAudio.plugin/Contents/MacOS/DVCPROHDAudio 0x300000 - 0x34afec com.apple.DVCPROHDMuxer 1.3 (1.3) /Library/QuickTime/DVCPROHDMuxer.component/Contents/MacOS/DVCPROHDMuxer 0x405000 - 0x408fff com.apple.LiveType.component 2.1.3 (2.1.3) /Library/QuickTime/LiveType.component/Contents/MacOS/LiveType 0x40e000 - 0x473fde com.apple.LiveType.framework 2.1.3 (2.1.3) /System/Library/PrivateFrameworks/LiveType.framework/Versions/A/LiveType 0x493000 - 0x4c6fff +com.grame.JackRouter JackRouter (0.9.0) /Library/Audio/Plug-Ins/HAL/JackRouter.plugin/Contents/MacOS/JackRouter 0x4f7000 - 0x521fff +libjack.dylib ??? (???) <87ec84ca31b01744c5628918ae5edc10> /usr/local/lib/libjack.dylib 0x70000000 - 0x700e6ff2 com.apple.audio.units.Components 1.5.2 (1.5.2) /System/Library/Components/CoreAudio.component/Contents/MacOS/CoreAudio 0x8fe00000 - 0x8fe2db43 dyld 97.1 (???) <100d362e03410f181a34e04e94189ae5> /usr/lib/dyld 0x90028000 - 0x90071fef com.apple.Metadata 10.5.2 (398.25) /System/Library/Frameworks/CoreServices.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/Metadata.framework/Versions/A/Metadata 0x90072000 - 0x9034cff3 com.apple.CoreServices.CarbonCore 786.11 (786.11) /System/Library/Frameworks/CoreServices.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/CarbonCore.framework/Versions/A/CarbonCore 0x903cd000 - 0x9042affb libstdc++.6.dylib ??? (???) <04b812dcec670daa8b7d2852ab14be60> /usr/lib/libstdc++.6.dylib 0x9042b000 - 0x90434fff com.apple.speech.recognition.framework 3.7.24 (3.7.24) /System/Library/Frameworks/Carbon.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/SpeechRecognition.framework/Versions/A/SpeechRecognition 0x9045f000 - 0x90592fff com.apple.CoreFoundation 6.5.5 (476.17) <4a70c8dbb582118e31412c53dc1f407f> /System/Library/Frameworks/CoreFoundation.framework/Versions/A/CoreFoundation 0x905bf000 - 0x905bfffc com.apple.audio.units.AudioUnit 1.5 (1.5) /System/Library/Frameworks/AudioUnit.framework/Versions/A/AudioUnit 0x905c6000 - 0x905c6ffd com.apple.Accelerate 1.4.2 (Accelerate 1.4.2) /System/Library/Frameworks/Accelerate.framework/Versions/A/Accelerate 0x905c7000 - 0x905cefe9 libgcc_s.1.dylib ??? (???) /usr/lib/libgcc_s.1.dylib 0x905de000 - 0x90698fe3 com.apple.CoreServices.OSServices 226.5 (226.5) <2a135d4fb16f4954290f7b72b4111aa3> /System/Library/Frameworks/CoreServices.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/OSServices.framework/Versions/A/OSServices 0x90699000 - 0x906c4fe7 libauto.dylib ??? (???) <42d8422dc23a18071869fdf7b5d8fab5> /usr/lib/libauto.dylib 0x907f7000 - 0x907f7ffd com.apple.vecLib 3.4.2 (vecLib 3.4.2) /System/Library/Frameworks/vecLib.framework/Versions/A/vecLib 0x90979000 - 0x90a20feb com.apple.QD 3.11.54 (???) /System/Library/Frameworks/ApplicationServices.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/QD.framework/Versions/A/QD 0x90a21000 - 0x90a21ffd com.apple.Accelerate.vecLib 3.4.2 (vecLib 3.4.2) /System/Library/Frameworks/Accelerate.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/vecLib.framework/Versions/A/vecLib 0x90a23000 - 0x90a3effb libPng.dylib ??? (???) <4780e979d35aa5ec2cea22678836cea5> /System/Library/Frameworks/ApplicationServices.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/ImageIO.framework/Versions/A/Resources/libPng.dylib 0x90a5e000 - 0x90ab8ff7 com.apple.CoreText 2.0.4 (???) /System/Library/Frameworks/ApplicationServices.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/CoreText.framework/Versions/A/CoreText 0x90ab9000 - 0x90bffff7 com.apple.ImageIO.framework 2.0.4 (2.0.4) <6a6623d3d1a7292b5c3763dcd108b55f> /System/Library/Frameworks/ApplicationServices.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/ImageIO.framework/Versions/A/ImageIO 0x90c00000 - 0x90c00ffb com.apple.installserver.framework 1.0 (8) /System/Library/PrivateFrameworks/InstallServer.framework/Versions/A/InstallServer 0x90c01000 - 0x91011fef libBLAS.dylib ??? (???) /System/Library/Frameworks/Accelerate.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/vecLib.framework/Versions/A/libBLAS.dylib 0x91012000 - 0x910ddfff com.apple.ColorSync 4.5.1 (4.5.1) /System/Library/Frameworks/ApplicationServices.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/ColorSync.framework/Versions/A/ColorSync 0x911e2000 - 0x911e8fff com.apple.print.framework.Print 218.0.2 (220.1) <8bf7ef71216376d12fcd5ec17e43742c> /System/Library/Frameworks/Carbon.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/Print.framework/Versions/A/Print 0x911e9000 - 0x911e9ff8 com.apple.Cocoa 6.5 (???) /System/Library/Frameworks/Cocoa.framework/Versions/A/Cocoa 0x91241000 - 0x91269fff libcups.2.dylib ??? (???) <16bec7c6a004f744804e2281a1b1c094> /usr/lib/libcups.2.dylib 0x912aa000 - 0x91336ff7 com.apple.LaunchServices 290.3 (290.3) <6f9629f4ed1ba3bb313548e6838b2888> /System/Library/Frameworks/CoreServices.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/LaunchServices.framework/Versions/A/LaunchServices 0x91337000 - 0x919d7fff com.apple.CoreGraphics 1.407.2 (???) <3a91d1037afde01d1d8acdf9cd1caa14> /System/Library/Frameworks/ApplicationServices.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/CoreGraphics.framework/Versions/A/CoreGraphics 0x91a0d000 - 0x91d15fff com.apple.HIToolbox 1.5.4 (???) <3747086ba21ee419708a5cab946c8ba6> /System/Library/Frameworks/Carbon.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/HIToolbox.framework/Versions/A/HIToolbox 0x91d33000 - 0x91dfaff2 com.apple.vImage 3.0 (3.0) /System/Library/Frameworks/Accelerate.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/vImage.framework/Versions/A/vImage 0x91dfb000 - 0x91e1affa libJPEG.dylib ??? (???) /System/Library/Frameworks/ApplicationServices.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/ImageIO.framework/Versions/A/Resources/libJPEG.dylib 0x91f9b000 - 0x91fd5fe7 com.apple.coreui 1.2 (62) /System/Library/PrivateFrameworks/CoreUI.framework/Versions/A/CoreUI 0x91fd6000 - 0x922fbfe2 com.apple.QuickTime 7.6.0 (1290) /System/Library/Frameworks/QuickTime.framework/Versions/A/QuickTime 0x922fc000 - 0x922fdffc libffi.dylib ??? (???) /usr/lib/libffi.dylib 0x922fe000 - 0x9237bfeb com.apple.audio.CoreAudio 3.1.1 (3.1.1) /System/Library/Frameworks/CoreAudio.framework/Versions/A/CoreAudio 0x9237c000 - 0x92419fe4 com.apple.CFNetwork 422.15.2 (422.15.2) <80851410a5592b7c3b149b2ff849bcc1> /System/Library/Frameworks/CoreServices.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/CFNetwork.framework/Versions/A/CFNetwork 0x9241a000 - 0x928ebf3e libGLProgrammability.dylib ??? (???) <5d283543ac844e7c6fa3440ac56cd265> /System/Library/Frameworks/OpenGL.framework/Versions/A/Libraries/libGLProgrammability.dylib 0x928ec000 - 0x92948ff7 com.apple.htmlrendering 68 (1.1.3) /System/Library/Frameworks/Carbon.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/HTMLRendering.framework/Versions/A/HTMLRendering 0x92a9c000 - 0x92adefef com.apple.NavigationServices 3.5.2 (163) <91844980804067b07a0b6124310d3f31> /System/Library/Frameworks/Carbon.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/NavigationServices.framework/Versions/A/NavigationServices 0x92ae5000 - 0x92ae8fff com.apple.help 1.1 (36) /System/Library/Frameworks/Carbon.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/Help.framework/Versions/A/Help 0x92ae9000 - 0x92b18fe3 com.apple.AE 402.3 (402.3) <4cb9ef65cf116d6dd424f0ce98c2d015> /System/Library/Frameworks/CoreServices.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/AE.framework/Versions/A/AE 0x92b19000 - 0x92b19ffa com.apple.CoreServices 32 (32) <2fcc8f3bd5bbfc000b476cad8e6a3dd2> /System/Library/Frameworks/CoreServices.framework/Versions/A/CoreServices 0x92b1a000 - 0x92c81ff3 libSystem.B.dylib ??? (???) /usr/lib/libSystem.B.dylib 0x92d77000 - 0x92da4feb libvDSP.dylib ??? (???) /System/Library/Frameworks/Accelerate.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/vecLib.framework/Versions/A/libvDSP.dylib 0x92db2000 - 0x92e64ffb libcrypto.0.9.7.dylib ??? (???) <69bc2457aa23f12fa7d052601d48fa29> /usr/lib/libcrypto.0.9.7.dylib 0x92e6a000 - 0x92ee4ff8 com.apple.print.framework.PrintCore 5.5.3 (245.3) <222dade7b33b99708b8c09d1303f93fc> /System/Library/Frameworks/ApplicationServices.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/PrintCore.framework/Versions/A/PrintCore 0x92ef1000 - 0x92f4aff7 libGLU.dylib ??? (???) /System/Library/Frameworks/OpenGL.framework/Versions/A/Libraries/libGLU.dylib 0x92f4b000 - 0x92f4ffff libGIF.dylib ??? (???) <572a32e46e33be1ec041c5ef5b0341ae> /System/Library/Frameworks/ApplicationServices.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/ImageIO.framework/Versions/A/Resources/libGIF.dylib 0x92f50000 - 0x93035ff3 com.apple.CoreData 100.1 (186) <8e28162ef2288692615b52acc01f8b54> /System/Library/Frameworks/CoreData.framework/Versions/A/CoreData 0x93036000 - 0x9304eff7 com.apple.CoreVideo 1.6.0 (20.0) /System/Library/Frameworks/CoreVideo.framework/Versions/A/CoreVideo 0x9304f000 - 0x9305bffe libGL.dylib ??? (???) /System/Library/Frameworks/OpenGL.framework/Versions/A/Libraries/libGL.dylib 0x9305c000 - 0x931aeff3 com.apple.audio.toolbox.AudioToolbox 1.5.2 (1.5.2) /System/Library/Frameworks/AudioToolbox.framework/Versions/A/AudioToolbox 0x93333000 - 0x9346bff7 libicucore.A.dylib ??? (???) <18098dcf431603fe47ee027a60006c85> /usr/lib/libicucore.A.dylib 0x9346c000 - 0x9346eff5 libRadiance.dylib ??? 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(???) <6978bbcca4277d6ae9f042beff643f7d> /usr/lib/libsqlite3.0.dylib 0x9443f000 - 0x944cafff com.apple.framework.IOKit 1.5.1 (???) /System/Library/Frameworks/IOKit.framework/Versions/A/IOKit 0x944cb000 - 0x944cbff8 com.apple.ApplicationServices 34 (34) <8f910fa65f01d401ad8d04cc933cf887> /System/Library/Frameworks/ApplicationServices.framework/Versions/A/ApplicationServices 0x944cc000 - 0x944d1fff com.apple.CommonPanels 1.2.4 (85) /System/Library/Frameworks/Carbon.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/CommonPanels.framework/Versions/A/CommonPanels 0x944da000 - 0x9456dfff com.apple.ink.framework 101.3 (86) /System/Library/Frameworks/Carbon.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/Ink.framework/Versions/A/Ink 0x9560a000 - 0x95e08fef com.apple.AppKit 6.5.6 (949.43) /System/Library/Frameworks/AppKit.framework/Versions/C/AppKit 0x95e09000 - 0x95e1ffff com.apple.DictionaryServices 1.0.0 (1.0.0) /System/Library/Frameworks/CoreServices.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/DictionaryServices.framework/Versions/A/DictionaryServices 0x95e8f000 - 0x95e96ffe libbsm.dylib ??? (???) /usr/lib/libbsm.dylib 0x96167000 - 0x96247fff libobjc.A.dylib ??? (???) <7b92613fdf804fd9a0a3733a0674c30b> /usr/lib/libobjc.A.dylib 0x96462000 - 0x96472ffc com.apple.LangAnalysis 1.6.4 (1.6.4) <8b7831b5f74a950a56cf2d22a2d436f6> /System/Library/Frameworks/ApplicationServices.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/LangAnalysis.framework/Versions/A/LangAnalysis 0x96474000 - 0x9647cfff com.apple.DiskArbitration 2.2.1 (2.2.1) <75b0c8d8940a8a27816961dddcac8e0f> /System/Library/Frameworks/DiskArbitration.framework/Versions/A/DiskArbitration 0x9647d000 - 0x9649bfff libresolv.9.dylib ??? (???) /usr/lib/libresolv.9.dylib 0x965d5000 - 0x965d5fff com.apple.Carbon 136 (136) <450e7e239de3f8e559c78f6473ec5149> /System/Library/Frameworks/Carbon.framework/Versions/A/Carbon 0x965d6000 - 0x96994fea libLAPACK.dylib ??? (???) /System/Library/Frameworks/Accelerate.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/vecLib.framework/Versions/A/libLAPACK.dylib 0x96b52000 - 0x96c02fff edu.mit.Kerberos 6.0.12 (6.0.12) <685cc018c133668d0d3ac6a1cb63cff9> /System/Library/Frameworks/Kerberos.framework/Versions/A/Kerberos 0x96c03000 - 0x96c18ffb com.apple.ImageCapture 5.0.1 (5.0.1) /System/Library/Frameworks/Carbon.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/ImageCapture.framework/Versions/A/ImageCapture 0x96c4c000 - 0x96cc9fef libvMisc.dylib ??? (???) /System/Library/Frameworks/Accelerate.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/vecLib.framework/Versions/A/libvMisc.dylib 0x96cca000 - 0x96d1bff7 com.apple.HIServices 1.7.0 (???) <01b690d1f376e400ac873105533e39eb> /System/Library/Frameworks/ApplicationServices.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/HIServices.framework/Versions/A/HIServices 0x96d1c000 - 0x96eeaff3 com.apple.security 5.0.4 (34102) <55dda7486df4e8e1d61505be16f83a1c> /System/Library/Frameworks/Security.framework/Versions/A/Security 0x96eeb000 - 0x96f22fff com.apple.SystemConfiguration 1.9.2 (1.9.2) <8b26ebf26a009a098484f1ed01ec499c> /System/Library/Frameworks/SystemConfiguration.framework/Versions/A/SystemConfiguration 0x96f23000 - 0x96f33fff com.apple.speech.synthesis.framework 3.7.1 (3.7.1) <06d8fc0307314f8ffc16f206ad3dbf44> /System/Library/Frameworks/ApplicationServices.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/SpeechSynthesis.framework/Versions/A/SpeechSynthesis 0x96f66000 - 0x97047ff7 libxml2.2.dylib ??? (???) <306036e0070330e35045650e6d9f0d05> /usr/lib/libxml2.2.dylib 0x97058000 - 0x97097fef libTIFF.dylib ??? (???) <3589442575ac77746ae99ecf724f5f87> /System/Library/Frameworks/ApplicationServices.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/ImageIO.framework/Versions/A/Resources/libTIFF.dylib 0x97098000 - 0x970a2feb com.apple.audio.SoundManager 3.9.2 (3.9.2) <0f2ba6e891d3761212cf5a5e6134d683> /System/Library/Frameworks/Carbon.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/CarbonSound.framework/Versions/A/CarbonSound 0x970a3000 - 0x97440fef com.apple.QuartzCore 1.5.7 (1.5.7) <2fed2dd7565c84a0f0c608d41d4d172c> /System/Library/Frameworks/QuartzCore.framework/Versions/A/QuartzCore 0x9745f000 - 0x974deff5 com.apple.SearchKit 1.2.1 (1.2.1) <3140a605db2abf56b237fa156a08b28b> /System/Library/Frameworks/CoreServices.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/SearchKit.framework/Versions/A/SearchKit 0x97536000 - 0x9753afff libmathCommon.A.dylib ??? (???) /usr/lib/system/libmathCommon.A.dylib 0x9753b000 - 0x9753dfff com.apple.securityhi 3.0 (30817) /System/Library/Frameworks/Carbon.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/SecurityHI.framework/Versions/A/SecurityHI 0x9753e000 - 0x9757cff7 libGLImage.dylib ??? (???) <1123b8a48bcbe9cc7aa8dd8e1a214a66> /System/Library/Frameworks/OpenGL.framework/Versions/A/Libraries/libGLImage.dylib 0xfffe8000 - 0xfffebfff libobjc.A.dylib ??? (???) /usr/lib/libobjc.A.dylib 0xffff0000 - 0xffff1780 libSystem.B.dylib ??? (???) /usr/lib/libSystem.B.dylib From ydegoyon at gmail.com Sun Mar 8 06:55:50 2009 From: ydegoyon at gmail.com (ydegoyon at gmail.com) Date: Sun, 08 Mar 2009 06:55:50 +0100 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> <49B24BE4.5060702@netpd.org> <49B2A5FC.3040501@netpd.org> <49B2AEBB.3030102@netpd.org> Message-ID: <49B35DE6.20909@gmail.com> ola, > > Well, after 2 applicants, it doesn't really matter. It's not like both > are going to desist. Only one gets to be the mentor, in the end. > hey you're almost as a bad asssssssss as me. i would say 'fuck off corporate google collaborating on censorship in china', and 'you're still in a mentor/students relationship model, wow, 18th century' oops, can i ask to noone to make pdp run on windows ? and to windows to run a bulldozer, thanks sevy From ydegoyon at gmail.com Sun Mar 8 07:06:17 2009 From: ydegoyon at gmail.com (ydegoyon at gmail.com) Date: Sun, 08 Mar 2009 07:06:17 +0100 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <49B35DE6.20909@gmail.com> References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> <49B24BE4.5060702@netpd.org> <49B2A5FC.3040501@netpd.org> <49B2AEBB.3030102@netpd.org> <49B35DE6.20909@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49B36059.9050108@gmail.com> oh sorry, have to add we had a good laugh with alexei shulguin once saying 'Google is GOD' i find it more accurate now xiaoo, sevy ydegoyon at gmail.com wrote: > ola, >> >> Well, after 2 applicants, it doesn't really matter. It's not like >> both are going to desist. Only one gets to be the mentor, in the end. >> > hey you're almost as a bad asssssssss as me. > > i would say > 'fuck off corporate google collaborating on censorship in china', > and > 'you're still in a mentor/students relationship model, wow, 18th century' > > oops, can i ask to noone to make pdp run on windows ? > and to windows to run a bulldozer, > thanks > > sevy > From matju at artengine.ca Sun Mar 8 07:29:21 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 01:29:21 -0500 (EST) Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <49B35DE6.20909@gmail.com> References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> <49B24BE4.5060702@netpd.org> <49B2A5FC.3040501@netpd.org> <49B2AEBB.3030102@netpd.org> <49B35DE6.20909@gmail.com> Message-ID: On Sun, 8 Mar 2009, ydegoyon at gmail.com wrote: > hey you're almost as a bad asssssssss as me. I didn't want any of your mail, I don't want any of your mail, and I won't want any of your mail. that's all. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From ydegoyon at gmail.com Sun Mar 8 08:10:29 2009 From: ydegoyon at gmail.com (ydegoyon at gmail.com) Date: Sun, 08 Mar 2009 08:10:29 +0100 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <49B36059.9050108@gmail.com> References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> <49B24BE4.5060702@netpd.org> <49B2A5FC.3040501@netpd.org> <49B2AEBB.3030102@netpd.org> <49B35DE6.20909@gmail.com> <49B36059.9050108@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49B36F65.8090605@gmail.com> sorry, the subject of the mail was : 'why should i collaborate with google?' not : 'why should i speak to se?or bouchard?' right? From ingo at miamiwave.com Sun Mar 8 12:01:19 2009 From: ingo at miamiwave.com (Ingo Scherzinger) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 12:01:19 +0100 Subject: [PD] external for sample loop start and end points? In-Reply-To: <64DA371C-3889-4C3B-9E7E-034A040BB5C5@eds.org> Message-ID: Unfortunately I don?t have any programming skills. Otherwise I would do something myself. To me it appears to be rather simple to expand the existing [waveinfo] to also read out sustain and release loop start and endpoints as well as the original pitch that was set. The basics about reading that information are already in this external. As mentioned this would speed up the creation of sample based pitched instruments tremendously. Ingo _____ Von: Hans-Christoph Steiner [mailto:hans at eds.org] Gesendet: Freitag, 6. M?rz 2009 01:22 An: Ingo Scherzinger Cc: pd-list at iem.at Betreff: Re: [PD] external for sample loop start and end points? That would be very handy to have, since other apps use that wav info. It wouldn't be too hard to write one, I am sure there is a library which handles the hard parts. .hc On Mar 2, 2009, at 9:51 AM, Ingo Scherzinger wrote: Hi, I am looking for an external that can read the sample loop start and end points of a .wav file. I found [wavinfo] but that doesn?t do the trick ? no loop info! It would be great if anybody knew anything like that! Thank you, Ingo _______________________________________________ Pd-list at iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- If you are not part of the solution, you are part of the problem. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ingo at miamiwave.com Sun Mar 8 11:58:51 2009 From: ingo at miamiwave.com (Ingo Scherzinger) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 11:58:51 +0100 Subject: [PD] external for sample loop start and end points? In-Reply-To: <64DA371C-3889-4C3B-9E7E-034A040BB5C5@eds.org> Message-ID: <3DC05580A52344AF8818888894BF30CA@meincomputer> Unfortunately I don?t have any programming skills. Otherwise I would do something myself. To me it appears to be rather simple to expand the existing [waveinfo] to also read out sustain and release loop start and endpoints as well as the original pitch that was set. The basics about reading that information are already in this external. As mentioned this would speed up the creation of sample based pitched instruments tremendously. Ingo _____ Von: Hans-Christoph Steiner [mailto:hans at eds.org] Gesendet: Freitag, 6. M?rz 2009 01:22 An: Ingo Scherzinger Cc: pd-list at iem.at Betreff: Re: [PD] external for sample loop start and end points? That would be very handy to have, since other apps use that wav info. It wouldn't be too hard to write one, I am sure there is a library which handles the hard parts. .hc On Mar 2, 2009, at 9:51 AM, Ingo Scherzinger wrote: Hi, I am looking for an external that can read the sample loop start and end points of a .wav file. I found [wavinfo] but that doesn?t do the trick ? no loop info! It would be great if anybody knew anything like that! Thank you, Ingo _______________________________________________ Pd-list at iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- If you are not part of the solution, you are part of the problem. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hard.off at gmail.com Sun Mar 8 15:13:54 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 23:13:54 +0900 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <49B36F65.8090605@gmail.com> References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> <49B24BE4.5060702@netpd.org> <49B2A5FC.3040501@netpd.org> <49B2AEBB.3030102@netpd.org> <49B35DE6.20909@gmail.com> <49B36059.9050108@gmail.com> <49B36F65.8090605@gmail.com> Message-ID: <161320dd0903080713q6beaa1c5ieb0eee213f21b5@mail.gmail.com> i just added a pd patching idea, to build a library of filters. i think this idea would also work really well if merged with the 'blosc' one, because frankly $4500 for a student to make some bandlimited oscillators is pretty expensive! http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/PurePDFilters -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hans at eds.org Sun Mar 8 18:45:43 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 13:45:43 -0400 Subject: [PD] I am the harbinger of crashing In-Reply-To: <7aaf8bb90903071722i542a6fe4m555757ac8cbe701c@mail.gmail.com> References: <7aaf8bb90903071722i542a6fe4m555757ac8cbe701c@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <70C8A585-B7F1-4A8A-AAB5-D75C9867F66A@eds.org> Hmm, could you test Pd-vanilla 0.41.4? That might be where the bug was introduced. .hc On Mar 7, 2009, at 8:22 PM, Luke Iannini wrote: > Sigh, here's another : ) > > This seems to have something to do with my MPD24 drum pads... whenever > they're connected and I enter the MIDI preferences of Pd, I get the > attached crash. > > It also occurs if they're configured (via .pdrc or the plist) as a > default device. > > This started occurring on the newest builds of Pd-E as well as on > Pd-0.42-4. It does not occur of my build of 0.40.3-extended. > > Anyone have any ideas? > Best > Luke > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- http://at.or.at/hans/ From padawan12 at obiwannabe.co.uk Sun Mar 8 18:35:12 2009 From: padawan12 at obiwannabe.co.uk (Andy Farnell) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 17:35:12 +0000 Subject: [PD] external for sample loop start and end points? In-Reply-To: References: <64DA371C-3889-4C3B-9E7E-034A040BB5C5@eds.org> Message-ID: <20090308173512.6e1559ea.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> Not sure if you could describe the job as simple because after the initial header (which [wavinfo] reads using byte/word offsets) the data format can become variable length before you encounter loop chunks. http://www.sonicspot.com/guide/wavefiles.html Also, there can be several loop points and cues, so how should it work? It would be great to have an object that could usefully do all the cool things possible with ordinary wav files, but it needs a bit of thought. Maybe a message like [loop 3( could advance the output to give the third loop boundaries, and [next( could advance the "sampler" chunk and show the number of repeats. That way you could use wavs in a tracker style as they are in simple game music audio. What lib were you thinking of to simplify the job Hans? I think I suggested before, the idea of a more advanced "sampler" type object set for extended. (one that could eventually be extended by user code to read Akai, NI and Yamaha formats and suchlike) A more complete [wavinfo] would be a step in that direction. On Sun, 8 Mar 2009 12:01:19 +0100 "Ingo Scherzinger" wrote: > Unfortunately I don_t have any programming skills. Otherwise I would do > something myself. > > To me it appears to be rather simple to expand the existing [waveinfo] to > also read out sustain and release loop start and endpoints as well as the > original pitch that was set. The basics about reading that information are > already in this external. > > As mentioned this would speed up the creation of sample based pitched > instruments tremendously. > > > > Ingo > > > > _____ > > Von: Hans-Christoph Steiner [mailto:hans at eds.org] > Gesendet: Freitag, 6. M?rz 2009 01:22 > An: Ingo Scherzinger > Cc: pd-list at iem.at > Betreff: Re: [PD] external for sample loop start and end points? > > > > > > That would be very handy to have, since other apps use that wav info. It > wouldn't be too hard to write one, I am sure there is a library which > handles the hard parts. > > > > .hc > > > > On Mar 2, 2009, at 9:51 AM, Ingo Scherzinger wrote: > > > > Hi, > > > > I am looking for an external that can read the sample loop start and end > points of a .wav file. > > I found [wavinfo] but that doesn_t do the trick _ no loop info! > > > > It would be great if anybody knew anything like that! > > > > Thank you, Ingo > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > If you are not part of the solution, you are part of the problem. > > > > > > -- Use the source From hans at eds.org Sun Mar 8 19:08:44 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 14:08:44 -0400 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <39645.81.223.29.242.1236342830.squirrel@webmail.*> References: <1236214369.7483.13.camel@danoT500> <7223A0F4-49DA-421E-8FFB-7324EF1246C2@eds.org> <1236294414.8960.0.camel@danoT500> <49B109A4.9050909@umatic.nl> <49B112B7.8080908@mur.at> <39645.81.223.29.242.1236342830.squirrel@webmail.*> Message-ID: <4F9B0690-F300-42EC-96AF-21B890DA7FA5@eds.org> Yes, sounds like a good project, add it to the wiki. Do you want to mentor it? Or if you are a student, then you could find another mentor and do it yourself. .hc On Mar 6, 2009, at 7:33 AM, brandt at subnet.at wrote: > The same with me. > > interested in coding but just very rare skills.but patching. > > maybe the graphical userinterface which i started for gem could be > interesting.As i am in the job now, i cannot send screenshots nor > patches. > > if there is interest I put some things together tjis weekend. > > > markus > > > > > >> Hallo Derek ! >> >> Nice projects - I also think that we need more patcher-only >> projects ! >> >> LG >> Georg >> >> Derek Holzer schrieb: >>> Since I'm completely uninterested in touching anything C, C++, >>> TclTk or >>> otherwise related, I submitted two Pd patching projects which >>> should be >>> general enough to attract students, yet quite intensive to work on. >>> Feedback welcome. >>> >>> http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/Undead >>> http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/GEMVeeJay >>> >>> Anyone want to take up 2007's PluggoPd idea? >>> >>> best, >>> D. >>> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Access to computers should be unlimited and total. - the hacker ethic From mgrimm at syr.edu Sun Mar 8 19:53:02 2009 From: mgrimm at syr.edu (mark edward grimm) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 11:53:02 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] shell .... again.... Message-ID: <688761.7641.qm@web32405.mail.mud.yahoo.com> i have been "trying" to use shell... works OK in linux but in osx it just crashes. i am just wondering if this thread went anywhere: http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/2009-01/067700.html i have it in a bunch of patches now and would love to use it more ... if it had more cross-compatibility (osx) because i tend to work with others + other os's. maybe i should just change to pdlua as frank suggested? or might shell someday get fixed? not sure what to do.... cheers mark ? From reduzierer at yahoo.de Sun Mar 8 20:02:28 2009 From: reduzierer at yahoo.de (Roman Haefeli) Date: Sun, 08 Mar 2009 20:02:28 +0100 Subject: [PD] shell .... again.... In-Reply-To: <688761.7641.qm@web32405.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <688761.7641.qm@web32405.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1236538948.8049.131.camel@yoyo2> On Sun, 2009-03-08 at 11:53 -0700, mark edward grimm wrote: > i have been "trying" to use shell... works OK in linux but in osx it just crashes. > > i am just wondering if this thread went anywhere: > > http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/2009-01/067700.html > > i have it in a bunch of patches now and would love to use it more ... if it had more cross-compatibility (osx) because i tend to work with others + other os's. > > maybe i should just change to pdlua as frank suggested? or might shell someday get fixed? > > not sure what to do.... what are the symptoms of the crashes? does pd just quit with a segfault, or does [shell] makes pd hang? it's been a while, since i used [shell] the last time, but i remember, that i could always make it work with what i wanted, it was just a matter of writing the script in a way, so that it immediately exits or detaches the running processes to the background. commands, that do not exit, will make [shell] block pd. all this only applies, if you experience hangs, but not segfaults, of course. roman ___________________________________________________________ Der fr?he Vogel f?ngt den Wurm. Hier gelangen Sie zum neuen Yahoo! Mail: http://mail.yahoo.de From hans at eds.org Sun Mar 8 20:08:54 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 15:08:54 -0400 Subject: [PD] GSoC web project idea Message-ID: I've had an idea for a long time for a web interface to the patches that people post to the pd-list. Basically, lots of really great code is posted to the Pd list, but it is not very easy to find it there. What if there was a searchable database of all patches posted to the pd list. You could search by object name to see all patches that use a certain object, then download it. I think that someone who was a decent web programmer could do this. Perhaps using something like Lucene, or really whatever. Is it worth a summer of code project? .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- News is what people want to keep hidden and everything else is publicity. - Bill Moyers From jack at rybn.org Sun Mar 8 20:12:34 2009 From: jack at rybn.org (Jack) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 20:12:34 +0100 Subject: [PD] shell .... again.... In-Reply-To: <688761.7641.qm@web32405.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <688761.7641.qm@web32405.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Hello Mark, I use [shell] every days on MacOSX.4 with PowerPC and Intel. No problem here. ++ Jack Le 8 mars 09 ? 19:53, mark edward grimm a ?crit : > > i have been "trying" to use shell... works OK in linux but in osx > it just crashes. > > i am just wondering if this thread went anywhere: > > http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/2009-01/067700.html > > i have it in a bunch of patches now and would love to use it > more ... if it had more cross-compatibility (osx) because i tend to > work with others + other os's. > > maybe i should just change to pdlua as frank suggested? or might > shell someday get fixed? > > not sure what to do.... > > cheers > mark > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/ > listinfo/pd-list From narbino at ucsd.edu Sun Mar 8 20:13:46 2009 From: narbino at ucsd.edu (narbino at ucsd.edu) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 12:13:46 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] Turn off Output~ automatically Message-ID: <65081.132.239.1.231.1236539626.squirrel@acs-webmail.ucsd.edu> I have multiple output~ in a patch that have 2 number boxes feeding to it, and when the numbers are moving the output~ turns on but when the numbers are not moving it continues to play the last sound played. How do i turn off the sound when the numbers are not moving without having to mute it myself?? Thank you. -Natalie From grh at mur.at Sun Mar 8 20:20:25 2009 From: grh at mur.at (Georg Holzmann) Date: Sun, 08 Mar 2009 20:20:25 +0100 Subject: [PD] GSoC web project idea In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49B41A79.3070205@mur.at> Hallo! It sounds nice, but do they support such projects ? IMHO building websites and similar things are more documentation, which is not allowed. Maybe you should ask them ... LG Georg Hans-Christoph Steiner schrieb: > I've had an idea for a long time for a web interface to the patches > that people post to the pd-list. Basically, lots of really great code > is posted to the Pd list, but it is not very easy to find it there. > What if there was a searchable database of all patches posted to the > pd list. You could search by object name to see all patches that use > a certain object, then download it. > > I think that someone who was a decent web programmer could do this. > Perhaps using something like Lucene, or really whatever. Is it worth > a summer of code project? > > .hc > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > News is what people want to keep hidden and everything else is > publicity. - Bill Moyers > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From geoffspuredata at googlemail.com Sun Mar 8 20:36:54 2009 From: geoffspuredata at googlemail.com (Geoff) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 19:36:54 +0000 Subject: [PD] What is the name for a Patch memory object In-Reply-To: <49B41A79.3070205@mur.at> References: <49B41A79.3070205@mur.at> Message-ID: <98ABC3B2-61A7-43DA-B6F7-6704E705B638@gmail.com> Hi Quick question I am searching for an object to handle patch memories. I just want to be able to capture the values of nine sliders to a few different memory locations to act as presets but I can't seem to find an object to do this. Which object should I be reading about? If I knew the name I could find put about it :) cheers Geoff -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From josepadovani at yahoo.com.br Sun Mar 8 20:37:54 2009 From: josepadovani at yahoo.com.br (padovani) Date: Sun, 08 Mar 2009 16:37:54 -0300 Subject: [PD] shell .... again.... In-Reply-To: References: <688761.7641.qm@web32405.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <49B41E92.5000205@yahoo.com.br> Here, on 10.5.6(intel) [shell] crashes too.. But [popen] is working just fine... (what's the difference?) the [shell] crash happens simultaneously with the right outlet bang... Jack escreveu: > Hello Mark, > > I use [shell] every days on MacOSX.4 with PowerPC and Intel. No > problem here. > ++ > > Jack > -- http://www.padovani.googlepages.com From geoffspuredata at googlemail.com Sun Mar 8 20:54:48 2009 From: geoffspuredata at googlemail.com (Geoff) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 19:54:48 +0000 Subject: [PD] What is the name for a Patch memory object In-Reply-To: <20090308194248.0b4927a4.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> References: <49B41A79.3070205@mur.at> <98ABC3B2-61A7-43DA-B6F7-6704E705B638@gmail.com> <20090308194248.0b4927a4.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> Message-ID: <9D15D866-C1C1-4D0C-A59F-421C93736D62@gmail.com> >> You may want [memento] or [ssad] > Hi > I am using PD extended > are they objects? > > I ask because I tried to create either as an object but just got > the 'couldn't create' message. > > maybe I need jesus after all :) > geoff On 8 Mar 2009, at 19:42, Andy Farnell wrote: > > > > You may want [memento] or [ssad] > > There was also an amusingly named [jesus] > (Jesus saves) > > a. > > On Sun, 8 Mar 2009 19:36:54 +0000 > Geoff wrote: > >> Hi >> >> Quick question >> >> I am searching for an object to handle patch memories. >> >> I just want to be able to capture the values of nine sliders to a few >> different memory locations to act as presets but I can't seem to find >> an object to do this. >> >> Which object should I be reading about? >> >> If I knew the name I could find put about it :) >> >> cheers >> >> Geoff > > > -- > Use the source From hans at eds.org Sun Mar 8 20:49:13 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 15:49:13 -0400 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <49B2A12C.1060207@gmail.com> References: <1236214369.7483.13.camel@danoT500> <7223A0F4-49DA-421E-8FFB-7324EF1246C2@eds.org> <1236294414.8960.0.camel@danoT500> <49B109A4.9050909@umatic.nl> <49B152BE.2000703@umatic.nl> <49B2A12C.1060207@gmail.com> Message-ID: <96EA1D97-1996-48D3-9131-62F2E9FE51E4@eds.org> On Mar 7, 2009, at 11:30 AM, marius schebella wrote: > chris clepper wrote: >> My own suggestion for a GEM project would be to create a tutorial and >> accompanying manual that covers the basic operation. > > I was planning to do this for years now, adding to dereks FLOSS > Documentation or just as a separate project. there are a lot of > unsorted > patches on my drive, but as someone mentioned in a response to this > email, documentation is not part of GSoC... I think that we could also have books on specific topics. For example, it would be very nice to have a GLSL+Gem manual. .hc > > > The other idea >> involves making the more advanced features like GLSL and framebuffer >> rendering easier to use. > > I started to port vade's old v001 last year, including abstractions to > easily chain several shaders together. not finished yet because with > relation to GLSL stuff, I think I am just too stupid to get it... > > marius. > > These are mainly documentation projects, but >> also have some Pd, and possible C++ coding as well. >> >> On Fri, Mar 6, 2009 at 11:43 AM, Derek Holzer > > wrote: >> >> That's great, let's see what happens ;-) >> >> d. >> >> chris clepper wrote: >> >> I added my name to the VeeJay project to advise on how the low >> level stuff affects performance and stability. I don't know >> if >> a project can have more than one mentor though. >> >> On Fri, Mar 6, 2009 at 6:31 AM, Derek Holzer > > >> wrote: >> >> Since I'm completely uninterested in touching anything C, >> C++, TclTk or >> otherwise related, I submitted two Pd patching projects >> which >> should be >> general enough to attract students, yet quite intensive to >> work on. >> Feedback welcome. >> >> http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/Undead >> http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/GEMVeeJay >> >> Anyone want to take up 2007's PluggoPd idea? >> >> best, >> D. >> >> -- >> derek holzer ::: http://www.umatic.nl ::: >> http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista >> ---Oblique Strategy # 194: >> "Steal a solution." >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at > > mailing list >> >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> >> >> >> -- >> derek holzer ::: http://www.umatic.nl ::: >> http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista >> ---Oblique Strategy # 83: >> "How would someone else do it?" >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- The arc of history bends towards justice. - Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. From hans at eds.org Sun Mar 8 20:58:25 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 15:58:25 -0400 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903080713q6beaa1c5ieb0eee213f21b5@mail.gmail.com> References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> <49B24BE4.5060702@netpd.org> <49B2A5FC.3040501@netpd.org> <49B2AEBB.3030102@netpd.org> <49B35DE6.20909@gmail.com> <49B36059.9050108@gmail.com> <49B36F65.8090605@gmail.com> <161320dd0903080713q6beaa1c5ieb0eee213f21b5@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: I think we need to have a range of projects, from simple to complicated, so that we get a range of students. I would really like to have a solid, clean, easy to use blosc lib, so I think it would be worth it. Plus the devil is in the details on this one. Its not too hard to put together a demo of this library, but I think to really get it right and done is non-trivial. .hc On Mar 8, 2009, at 10:13 AM, hard off wrote: > i just added a pd patching idea, to build a library of filters. > > i think this idea would also work really well if merged with the > 'blosc' one, because frankly $4500 for a student to make some > bandlimited oscillators is pretty expensive! > > http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/PurePDFilters > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- News is what people want to keep hidden and everything else is publicity. - Bill Moyers -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hans at eds.org Sun Mar 8 21:04:00 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 16:04:00 -0400 Subject: [PD] external for sample loop start and end points? In-Reply-To: <20090308173512.6e1559ea.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> References: <64DA371C-3889-4C3B-9E7E-034A040BB5C5@eds.org> <20090308173512.6e1559ea.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> Message-ID: <5169E647-FE2A-4D1F-9891-5568253FF8A3@eds.org> Andy, I think you have it right, how you get the data out from the object is part of the problem. If that was well-mapped out, then that would make the C-coding much easier. I've never used those loop point things, so I don't really know much about them. A good starting point would be to sketch out how the interface of this loop point object would work, and how it would return the data. Then hopefully writing the C code would not be too hard. libsndfile supports reading the loop info from .WAVs and .AIFFs http://www.mega-nerd.com/libsndfile/ .hc On Mar 8, 2009, at 1:35 PM, Andy Farnell wrote: > > > > Not sure if you could describe the job as simple > because after the initial header (which [wavinfo] > reads using byte/word offsets) the data format > can become variable length before you encounter > loop chunks. > > http://www.sonicspot.com/guide/wavefiles.html > > Also, there can be several loop points and cues, > so how should it work? > > It would be great to have an object that could > usefully do all the cool things possible with > ordinary wav files, but it needs a bit of thought. > > Maybe a message like [loop 3( could advance the > output to give the third loop boundaries, > and [next( could advance the "sampler" chunk > and show the number of repeats. > That way you could use wavs in a tracker style > as they are in simple game music audio. > > What lib were you thinking of to simplify > the job Hans? > > I think I suggested before, the idea of a more > advanced "sampler" type object set for extended. > (one that could eventually be extended by user code > to read Akai, NI and Yamaha formats and suchlike) > > A more complete [wavinfo] would be a step in > that direction. > > > > > > On Sun, 8 Mar 2009 12:01:19 +0100 > "Ingo Scherzinger" wrote: > >> Unfortunately I don_t have any programming skills. Otherwise I >> would do >> something myself. >> >> To me it appears to be rather simple to expand the existing >> [waveinfo] to >> also read out sustain and release loop start and endpoints as well >> as the >> original pitch that was set. The basics about reading that >> information are >> already in this external. >> >> As mentioned this would speed up the creation of sample based pitched >> instruments tremendously. >> >> >> >> Ingo >> >> >> >> _____ >> >> Von: Hans-Christoph Steiner [mailto:hans at eds.org] >> Gesendet: Freitag, 6. M?rz 2009 01:22 >> An: Ingo Scherzinger >> Cc: pd-list at iem.at >> Betreff: Re: [PD] external for sample loop start and end points? >> >> >> >> >> >> That would be very handy to have, since other apps use that wav >> info. It >> wouldn't be too hard to write one, I am sure there is a library which >> handles the hard parts. >> >> >> >> .hc >> >> >> >> On Mar 2, 2009, at 9:51 AM, Ingo Scherzinger wrote: >> >> >> >> Hi, >> >> >> >> I am looking for an external that can read the sample loop start >> and end >> points of a .wav file. >> >> I found [wavinfo] but that doesn_t do the trick _ no loop info! >> >> >> >> It would be great if anybody knew anything like that! >> >> >> >> Thank you, Ingo >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> >> >> If you are not part of the solution, you are part of the problem. >> >> >> >> >> >> > > > -- > Use the source > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Programs should be written for people to read, and only incidentally for machines to execute. - from Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs From mgrimm at syr.edu Sun Mar 8 21:07:22 2009 From: mgrimm at syr.edu (mark edward grimm) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 13:07:22 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] shell .... again.... In-Reply-To: <1236538948.8049.131.camel@yoyo2> Message-ID: <655885.62268.qm@web32405.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > what are the symptoms of the crashes? does pd just quit > with a segfault, > or does [shell] makes pd hang? yeah its really weird.... i get: "the application pd quit unexpectedly" then i can ignore or relaunch... either choice PD still runs in the background. the "ignore" or "relaunch" seems to be only a nag screen that does not do anything... but at the same time creates the situation that make PD unusable... anyone else with he same? maybe its leopard thing? ? --- On Sun, 3/8/09, Roman Haefeli wrote: > From: Roman Haefeli > Subject: Re: [PD] shell .... again.... > To: mgrimm at syr.edu > Cc: "pd_list" > Date: Sunday, March 8, 2009, 3:02 PM > On Sun, 2009-03-08 at 11:53 -0700, mark edward grimm wrote: > > i have been "trying" to use shell... works > OK in linux but in osx it just crashes. > > > > i am just wondering if this thread went anywhere: > > > > > http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/2009-01/067700.html > > > > i have it in a bunch of patches now and would love to > use it more ... if it had more cross-compatibility (osx) > because i tend to work with others + other os's. > > > > maybe i should just change to pdlua as frank > suggested? or might shell someday get fixed? > > > > not sure what to do.... > > what are the symptoms of the crashes? does pd just quit > with a segfault, > or does [shell] makes pd hang? > > it's been a while, since i used [shell] the last time, > but i remember, > that i could always make it work with what i wanted, it was > just a > matter of writing the script in a way, so that it > immediately exits or > detaches the running processes to the background. commands, > that do not > exit, will make [shell] block pd. all this only applies, if > you > experience hangs, but not segfaults, of course. > > roman > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > Der fr?he Vogel f?ngt den Wurm. Hier gelangen Sie zum > neuen Yahoo! Mail: http://mail.yahoo.de From padawan12 at obiwannabe.co.uk Sun Mar 8 21:08:43 2009 From: padawan12 at obiwannabe.co.uk (Andy Farnell) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 20:08:43 +0000 Subject: [PD] What is the name for a Patch memory object In-Reply-To: <9D15D866-C1C1-4D0C-A59F-421C93736D62@gmail.com> References: <49B41A79.3070205@mur.at> <98ABC3B2-61A7-43DA-B6F7-6704E705B638@gmail.com> <20090308194248.0b4927a4.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> <9D15D866-C1C1-4D0C-A59F-421C93736D62@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090308200843.322ee604.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> Yes, they are abstractions found in extended. For just a few sliders you could use the trick of setting their properties to Init=true, so they are persistent between patch save/loads and also send out their values when the patch loads. Another simple way is to rig a message box to store some values with the 'set' message, then use [loadbang] and [route] to restore them to objects/guis. On Sun, 8 Mar 2009 19:54:48 +0000 Geoff wrote: > >> You may want [memento] or [ssad] > > > Hi > > I am using PD extended > > are they objects? > > > > I ask because I tried to create either as an object but just got > > the 'couldn't create' message. > > > > maybe I need jesus after all :) > > geoff > > > On 8 Mar 2009, at 19:42, Andy Farnell wrote: > > > > > > > > > You may want [memento] or [ssad] > > > > There was also an amusingly named [jesus] > > (Jesus saves) > > > > a. > > > > On Sun, 8 Mar 2009 19:36:54 +0000 > > Geoff wrote: > > > >> Hi > >> > >> Quick question > >> > >> I am searching for an object to handle patch memories. > >> > >> I just want to be able to capture the values of nine sliders to a few > >> different memory locations to act as presets but I can't seem to find > >> an object to do this. > >> > >> Which object should I be reading about? > >> > >> If I knew the name I could find put about it :) > >> > >> cheers > >> > >> Geoff > > > > > > -- > > Use the source > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list -- Use the source From mjmogo at gmail.com Sun Mar 8 21:12:05 2009 From: mjmogo at gmail.com (Mike McGonagle) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 15:12:05 -0500 Subject: [PD] Turn off Output~ automatically In-Reply-To: <65081.132.239.1.231.1236539626.squirrel@acs-webmail.ucsd.edu> References: <65081.132.239.1.231.1236539626.squirrel@acs-webmail.ucsd.edu> Message-ID: <370dda580903081312v4231bb7flb5d1300f80b86bcd@mail.gmail.com> Natalie, You might want to check out the [switch~] object. It allows for a patch to turn off the audio generation for objects in the same subpatch. Mike On Sun, Mar 8, 2009 at 2:13 PM, wrote: > I have multiple output~ in a patch that have 2 number boxes feeding to it, > and when the numbers are moving the output~ turns on but when the numbers > are not moving it continues to play the last sound played. How do i turn > off the sound when the numbers are not moving without having to mute it > myself?? Thank you. > > -Natalie > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -- Ani DiFranco - "Art may imitate life, but life imitates TV." From mgrimm at syr.edu Sun Mar 8 21:12:10 2009 From: mgrimm at syr.edu (mark edward grimm) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 13:12:10 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] shell .... again.... In-Reply-To: <655885.62268.qm@web32405.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <788978.4641.qm@web32404.mail.mud.yahoo.com> oh... and PD does not quit. even if i hit "relaunch" or "ignore" or even if i just try to quit in general.... i have to "force quit" and this has been like this for a little while on differnt systems.. at least at the leopard level. not sure about tiger/ppc/intel - not sure if that all made a difference.... --- On Sun, 3/8/09, mark edward grimm wrote: > From: mark edward grimm > Subject: Re: [PD] shell .... again.... > To: reduzierer at yahoo.de > Cc: "pd_list" > Date: Sunday, March 8, 2009, 4:07 PM > > what are the symptoms of the crashes? does pd just quit > > with a segfault, > > or does [shell] makes pd hang? > > yeah its really weird.... > > i get: > > "the application pd quit unexpectedly" > > then i can ignore or relaunch... > > either choice PD still runs in the background. the > "ignore" or "relaunch" seems to be only > a nag screen that does not do anything... but at the same > time creates the situation that make PD unusable... > > anyone else with he same? > > maybe its leopard thing? > ? > > > --- On Sun, 3/8/09, Roman Haefeli > wrote: > > > From: Roman Haefeli > > Subject: Re: [PD] shell .... again.... > > To: mgrimm at syr.edu > > Cc: "pd_list" > > Date: Sunday, March 8, 2009, 3:02 PM > > On Sun, 2009-03-08 at 11:53 -0700, mark edward grimm > wrote: > > > i have been "trying" to use shell... > works > > OK in linux but in osx it just crashes. > > > > > > i am just wondering if this thread went anywhere: > > > > > > > > > http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/2009-01/067700.html > > > > > > i have it in a bunch of patches now and would > love to > > use it more ... if it had more cross-compatibility > (osx) > > because i tend to work with others + other os's. > > > > > > maybe i should just change to pdlua as frank > > suggested? or might shell someday get fixed? > > > > > > not sure what to do.... > > > > what are the symptoms of the crashes? does pd just > quit > > with a segfault, > > or does [shell] makes pd hang? > > > > it's been a while, since i used [shell] the last > time, > > but i remember, > > that i could always make it work with what i wanted, > it was > > just a > > matter of writing the script in a way, so that it > > immediately exits or > > detaches the running processes to the background. > commands, > > that do not > > exit, will make [shell] block pd. all this only > applies, if > > you > > experience hangs, but not segfaults, of course. > > > > roman > > > > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > > > Der fr?he Vogel f?ngt den Wurm. Hier gelangen Sie > zum > > neuen Yahoo! Mail: http://mail.yahoo.de > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From jack at rybn.org Sun Mar 8 21:18:12 2009 From: jack at rybn.org (Jack) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 21:18:12 +0100 Subject: [PD] shell .... again.... In-Reply-To: <788978.4641.qm@web32404.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <788978.4641.qm@web32404.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <6CE3FCC2-ECA3-40D5-91BE-8BE785C1D598@rybn.org> Often, on MacOSX, when 'Pd-extended' quit, 'pd' stay. You have to force 'pd' to quit then relauch 'Pd-extended' (if i'm right). ++ Jack Le 8 mars 09 ? 21:12, mark edward grimm a ?crit : > > oh... and PD does not quit. even if i hit "relaunch" or "ignore" or > even if i just try to quit in general.... > > i have to "force quit" > > and this has been like this for a little while on differnt > systems.. at least at the leopard level. not sure about tiger/ppc/ > intel - not sure if that all made a difference.... > > > > --- On Sun, 3/8/09, mark edward grimm wrote: > >> From: mark edward grimm >> Subject: Re: [PD] shell .... again.... >> To: reduzierer at yahoo.de >> Cc: "pd_list" >> Date: Sunday, March 8, 2009, 4:07 PM >>> what are the symptoms of the crashes? does pd just quit >>> with a segfault, >>> or does [shell] makes pd hang? >> >> yeah its really weird.... >> >> i get: >> >> "the application pd quit unexpectedly" >> >> then i can ignore or relaunch... >> >> either choice PD still runs in the background. the >> "ignore" or "relaunch" seems to be only >> a nag screen that does not do anything... but at the same >> time creates the situation that make PD unusable... >> >> anyone else with he same? >> >> maybe its leopard thing? >> >> >> >> --- On Sun, 3/8/09, Roman Haefeli >> wrote: >> >>> From: Roman Haefeli >>> Subject: Re: [PD] shell .... again.... >>> To: mgrimm at syr.edu >>> Cc: "pd_list" >>> Date: Sunday, March 8, 2009, 3:02 PM >>> On Sun, 2009-03-08 at 11:53 -0700, mark edward grimm >> wrote: >>>> i have been "trying" to use shell... >> works >>> OK in linux but in osx it just crashes. >>>> >>>> i am just wondering if this thread went anywhere: >>>> >>>> >>> >> http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/2009-01/067700.html >>>> >>>> i have it in a bunch of patches now and would >> love to >>> use it more ... if it had more cross-compatibility >> (osx) >>> because i tend to work with others + other os's. >>>> >>>> maybe i should just change to pdlua as frank >>> suggested? or might shell someday get fixed? >>>> >>>> not sure what to do.... >>> >>> what are the symptoms of the crashes? does pd just >> quit >>> with a segfault, >>> or does [shell] makes pd hang? >>> >>> it's been a while, since i used [shell] the last >> time, >>> but i remember, >>> that i could always make it work with what i wanted, >> it was >>> just a >>> matter of writing the script in a way, so that it >>> immediately exits or >>> detaches the running processes to the background. >> commands, >>> that do not >>> exit, will make [shell] block pd. all this only >> applies, if >>> you >>> experience hangs, but not segfaults, of course. >>> >>> roman >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> ___________________________________________________________ >>> >>> Der fr?he Vogel f?ngt den Wurm. Hier gelangen Sie >> zum >>> neuen Yahoo! Mail: http://mail.yahoo.de >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/ > listinfo/pd-list From fbar at footils.org Sun Mar 8 21:26:39 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 21:26:39 +0100 Subject: [PD] Turn off Output~ automatically In-Reply-To: <65081.132.239.1.231.1236539626.squirrel@acs-webmail.ucsd.edu> References: <65081.132.239.1.231.1236539626.squirrel@acs-webmail.ucsd.edu> Message-ID: <20090308202639.GA31652@footils.org> Hallo, narbino at ucsd.edu hat gesagt: // narbino at ucsd.edu wrote: > I have multiple output~ in a patch that have 2 number boxes feeding to it, > and when the numbers are moving the output~ turns on but when the numbers > are not moving it continues to play the last sound played. How do i turn > off the sound when the numbers are not moving without having to mute it > myself?? Thank you. The [delay] object is nice to monitor something for activity. The basic idiom goes like this: [0 \ | [t b a] | | | [s NUMBER_UPDATED] | [delay 100] | [s NUMBER_STOPPED] On [r NUMBER_UPDATED] you will get updates when the number box is moving, and if the number box hasn't changed for 100 msec, you will get a bang to [r NUMBER_STOPPED] that you can use to stop whatever needs stopping. As long as the number box is changing, you don't get this bang, because [delay] is a "simple" delay that gets reset every time a new message comes in. Btw.: [pipe] is not "simple" in this sense - it's what Miller calls a "compound" delay in his book: http://crca.ucsd.edu/~msp/techniques/latest/book-html/node48.html http://crca.ucsd.edu/~msp/techniques/latest/book-html/node49.html Ciao -- Frank From marius.schebella at gmail.com Sun Mar 8 21:35:56 2009 From: marius.schebella at gmail.com (marius schebella) Date: Sun, 08 Mar 2009 21:35:56 +0100 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <96EA1D97-1996-48D3-9131-62F2E9FE51E4@eds.org> References: <1236214369.7483.13.camel@danoT500> <7223A0F4-49DA-421E-8FFB-7324EF1246C2@eds.org> <1236294414.8960.0.camel@danoT500> <49B109A4.9050909@umatic.nl> <49B152BE.2000703@umatic.nl> <49B2A12C.1060207@gmail.com> <96EA1D97-1996-48D3-9131-62F2E9FE51E4@eds.org> Message-ID: <49B42C2C.2010807@gmail.com> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > On Mar 7, 2009, at 11:30 AM, marius schebella wrote: > >> chris clepper wrote: >>> My own suggestion for a GEM project would be to create a tutorial and >>> accompanying manual that covers the basic operation. >> >> I was planning to do this for years now, adding to dereks FLOSS >> Documentation or just as a separate project. there are a lot of unsorted >> patches on my drive, but as someone mentioned in a response to this >> email, documentation is not part of GSoC... > > I think that we could also have books on specific topics. For example, > it would be very nice to have a GLSL+Gem manual. oh, that reminds me that the gl_MultiTexCoord1-8 stuff is still broken. fixing that bug would be worth a GSoC project. marius. > >> >> >> The other idea >>> involves making the more advanced features like GLSL and framebuffer >>> rendering easier to use. >> >> I started to port vade's old v001 last year, including abstractions to >> easily chain several shaders together. not finished yet because with >> relation to GLSL stuff, I think I am just too stupid to get it... >> >> marius. >> >> These are mainly documentation projects, but >>> also have some Pd, and possible C++ coding as well. >>> >>> On Fri, Mar 6, 2009 at 11:43 AM, Derek Holzer >> > wrote: >>> >>> That's great, let's see what happens ;-) >>> >>> d. >>> >>> chris clepper wrote: >>> >>> I added my name to the VeeJay project to advise on how the low >>> level stuff affects performance and stability. I don't know if >>> a project can have more than one mentor though. >>> >>> On Fri, Mar 6, 2009 at 6:31 AM, Derek Holzer >> >> >> wrote: >>> >>> Since I'm completely uninterested in touching anything C, >>> C++, TclTk or >>> otherwise related, I submitted two Pd patching projects which >>> should be >>> general enough to attract students, yet quite intensive to >>> work on. >>> Feedback welcome. >>> >>> http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/Undead >>> http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/GEMVeeJay >>> >>> Anyone want to take up 2007's PluggoPd idea? >>> >>> best, >>> D. >>> >>> -- >>> derek holzer ::: http://www.umatic.nl ::: >>> http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista >>> ---Oblique Strategy # 194: >>> "Steal a solution." >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pd-list at iem.at >> > mailing list >>> >>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> derek holzer ::: http://www.umatic.nl ::: >>> http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista >>> ---Oblique Strategy # 83: >>> "How would someone else do it?" >>> >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > The arc of history bends towards justice. - Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. > > > From brbrofsvl at gmail.com Sun Mar 8 21:38:38 2009 From: brbrofsvl at gmail.com (Matt Barber) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 15:38:38 -0500 Subject: [PD] What is the name for a Patch memory object Message-ID: > For just a few sliders you could use the trick > of setting their properties to Init=true, so > they are persistent between patch save/loads > and also send out their values when the patch > loads. > > Another simple way is to rig a message box > to store some values with the 'set' message, > then use [loadbang] and [route] to restore > them to objects/guis. > For a bank of sliders, radio buttons, toggles, etc. -- anything which sends numeric data -- you can also store the values into an array the contents of which are saved with the patch ([table] won't work for this). Each slider/etc. writes to a given index in the array and can easily be retrieved upon [loadbang]. Matt From mgrimm at syr.edu Sun Mar 8 21:46:19 2009 From: mgrimm at syr.edu (mark edward grimm) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 13:46:19 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] shell .... again.... In-Reply-To: <6CE3FCC2-ECA3-40D5-91BE-8BE785C1D598@rybn.org> Message-ID: <665580.57054.qm@web32402.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > Often, on MacOSX, when 'Pd-extended' quit, > 'pd' stay. You have to r u saying this might be a normal thing for pd-extended? for the most part no (actually on ubuntu 8.10 pd-extended recently i have to xkill fairly often?) on osx... but sometimes, more rarely, yes. not sure what you are asking though... is this a general problem or an issue related to [shell] still? m? --- On Sun, 3/8/09, Jack wrote: > From: Jack > Subject: Re: [PD] shell .... again.... > To: mgrimm at syr.edu > Cc: reduzierer at yahoo.de, "pd_list" > Date: Sunday, March 8, 2009, 4:18 PM > Often, on MacOSX, when 'Pd-extended' quit, > 'pd' stay. You have to > force 'pd' to quit then relauch > 'Pd-extended' (if i'm right). > ++ > > Jack > > > Le 8 mars 09 ? 21:12, mark edward grimm a ?crit : > > > > > oh... and PD does not quit. even if i hit > "relaunch" or "ignore" or > > even if i just try to quit in general.... > > > > i have to "force quit" > > > > and this has been like this for a little while on > differnt > > systems.. at least at the leopard level. not sure > about tiger/ppc/ > > intel - not sure if that all made a difference.... > > > > > > > > --- On Sun, 3/8/09, mark edward grimm > wrote: > > > >> From: mark edward grimm > >> Subject: Re: [PD] shell .... again.... > >> To: reduzierer at yahoo.de > >> Cc: "pd_list" > >> Date: Sunday, March 8, 2009, 4:07 PM > >>> what are the symptoms of the crashes? does pd > just quit > >>> with a segfault, > >>> or does [shell] makes pd hang? > >> > >> yeah its really weird.... > >> > >> i get: > >> > >> "the application pd quit unexpectedly" > >> > >> then i can ignore or relaunch... > >> > >> either choice PD still runs in the background. the > >> "ignore" or "relaunch" seems > to be only > >> a nag screen that does not do anything... but at > the same > >> time creates the situation that make PD > unusable... > >> > >> anyone else with he same? > >> > >> maybe its leopard thing? > >> > >> > >> > >> --- On Sun, 3/8/09, Roman Haefeli > >> wrote: > >> > >>> From: Roman Haefeli > > >>> Subject: Re: [PD] shell .... again.... > >>> To: mgrimm at syr.edu > >>> Cc: "pd_list" > >>> Date: Sunday, March 8, 2009, 3:02 PM > >>> On Sun, 2009-03-08 at 11:53 -0700, mark edward > grimm > >> wrote: > >>>> i have been "trying" to use > shell... > >> works > >>> OK in linux but in osx it just crashes. > >>>> > >>>> i am just wondering if this thread went > anywhere: > >>>> > >>>> > >>> > >> > http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/2009-01/067700.html > >>>> > >>>> i have it in a bunch of patches now and > would > >> love to > >>> use it more ... if it had more > cross-compatibility > >> (osx) > >>> because i tend to work with others + other > os's. > >>>> > >>>> maybe i should just change to pdlua as > frank > >>> suggested? or might shell someday get fixed? > >>>> > >>>> not sure what to do.... > >>> > >>> what are the symptoms of the crashes? does pd > just > >> quit > >>> with a segfault, > >>> or does [shell] makes pd hang? > >>> > >>> it's been a while, since i used [shell] > the last > >> time, > >>> but i remember, > >>> that i could always make it work with what i > wanted, > >> it was > >>> just a > >>> matter of writing the script in a way, so that > it > >>> immediately exits or > >>> detaches the running processes to the > background. > >> commands, > >>> that do not > >>> exit, will make [shell] block pd. all this > only > >> applies, if > >>> you > >>> experience hangs, but not segfaults, of > course. > >>> > >>> roman > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > >> > ___________________________________________________________ > >>> > >>> Der fr?he Vogel f?ngt den Wurm. Hier > gelangen Sie > >> zum > >>> neuen Yahoo! Mail: http://mail.yahoo.de > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/ > > listinfo/pd-list From fbar at footils.org Sun Mar 8 22:10:06 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 22:10:06 +0100 Subject: [PD] What is the name for a Patch memory object In-Reply-To: <9D15D866-C1C1-4D0C-A59F-421C93736D62@gmail.com> References: <49B41A79.3070205@mur.at> <98ABC3B2-61A7-43DA-B6F7-6704E705B638@gmail.com> <20090308194248.0b4927a4.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> <9D15D866-C1C1-4D0C-A59F-421C93736D62@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090308211005.GA32211@footils.org> Hallo, Geoff hat gesagt: // Geoff wrote: > >> You may want [memento] or [ssad] > > > Hi > > I am using PD extended > > are they objects? > > > > I ask because I tried to create either as an object but just got > > the 'couldn't create' message. > > > > maybe I need jesus after all :) There is no object called [memento], but a whole saving system called that. Its main objects are [commun], [originator]. But better go with the other one, which is called [sssad] (three s!). It's just one abstraction and some docs and if it's missing in Pd-extended, you can download it from the Sourceforge site of Pd. Ciao -- Frank From jack at rybn.org Mon Mar 9 00:16:32 2009 From: jack at rybn.org (Jack) Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2009 00:16:32 +0100 Subject: [PD] shell .... again.... In-Reply-To: <665580.57054.qm@web32402.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <665580.57054.qm@web32402.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <67517ABF-A40E-4D39-A0F8-36989D965CF5@rybn.org> Le 8 mars 09 ? 21:46, mark edward grimm a ?crit : > >> Often, on MacOSX, when 'Pd-extended' quit, >> 'pd' stay. You have to > > r u saying this might be a normal thing for pd-extended? for the > most part no (actually on ubuntu 8.10 pd-extended recently i have > to xkill fairly often?) on osx... but sometimes, more rarely, yes. No, it is not normal that Pd-extended crash ;) But it occurs sometimes. And in this case, if 'Pd-entended' crash and 'pd' is launched, you'd better to force to quit 'pd' before to relaunch 'Pd- extended'. > > not sure what you are asking though... is this a general problem or > an issue related to [shell] still? This is not related to [shell], only a general behaviour. ++ Jack > > m > > > --- On Sun, 3/8/09, Jack wrote: > >> From: Jack >> Subject: Re: [PD] shell .... again.... >> To: mgrimm at syr.edu >> Cc: reduzierer at yahoo.de, "pd_list" >> Date: Sunday, March 8, 2009, 4:18 PM >> Often, on MacOSX, when 'Pd-extended' quit, >> 'pd' stay. You have to >> force 'pd' to quit then relauch >> 'Pd-extended' (if i'm right). >> ++ >> >> Jack >> >> >> Le 8 mars 09 ? 21:12, mark edward grimm a ?crit : >> >>> >>> oh... and PD does not quit. even if i hit >> "relaunch" or "ignore" or >>> even if i just try to quit in general.... >>> >>> i have to "force quit" >>> >>> and this has been like this for a little while on >> differnt >>> systems.. at least at the leopard level. not sure >> about tiger/ppc/ >>> intel - not sure if that all made a difference.... >>> >>> >>> >>> --- On Sun, 3/8/09, mark edward grimm >> wrote: >>> >>>> From: mark edward grimm >>>> Subject: Re: [PD] shell .... again.... >>>> To: reduzierer at yahoo.de >>>> Cc: "pd_list" >>>> Date: Sunday, March 8, 2009, 4:07 PM >>>>> what are the symptoms of the crashes? does pd >> just quit >>>>> with a segfault, >>>>> or does [shell] makes pd hang? >>>> >>>> yeah its really weird.... >>>> >>>> i get: >>>> >>>> "the application pd quit unexpectedly" >>>> >>>> then i can ignore or relaunch... >>>> >>>> either choice PD still runs in the background. the >>>> "ignore" or "relaunch" seems >> to be only >>>> a nag screen that does not do anything... but at >> the same >>>> time creates the situation that make PD >> unusable... >>>> >>>> anyone else with he same? >>>> >>>> maybe its leopard thing? >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> --- On Sun, 3/8/09, Roman Haefeli >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> From: Roman Haefeli >> >>>>> Subject: Re: [PD] shell .... again.... >>>>> To: mgrimm at syr.edu >>>>> Cc: "pd_list" >>>>> Date: Sunday, March 8, 2009, 3:02 PM >>>>> On Sun, 2009-03-08 at 11:53 -0700, mark edward >> grimm >>>> wrote: >>>>>> i have been "trying" to use >> shell... >>>> works >>>>> OK in linux but in osx it just crashes. >>>>>> >>>>>> i am just wondering if this thread went >> anywhere: >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >> http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/2009-01/067700.html >>>>>> >>>>>> i have it in a bunch of patches now and >> would >>>> love to >>>>> use it more ... if it had more >> cross-compatibility >>>> (osx) >>>>> because i tend to work with others + other >> os's. >>>>>> >>>>>> maybe i should just change to pdlua as >> frank >>>>> suggested? or might shell someday get fixed? >>>>>> >>>>>> not sure what to do.... >>>>> >>>>> what are the symptoms of the crashes? does pd >> just >>>> quit >>>>> with a segfault, >>>>> or does [shell] makes pd hang? >>>>> >>>>> it's been a while, since i used [shell] >> the last >>>> time, >>>>> but i remember, >>>>> that i could always make it work with what i >> wanted, >>>> it was >>>>> just a >>>>> matter of writing the script in a way, so that >> it >>>>> immediately exits or >>>>> detaches the running processes to the >> background. >>>> commands, >>>>> that do not >>>>> exit, will make [shell] block pd. all this >> only >>>> applies, if >>>>> you >>>>> experience hangs, but not segfaults, of >> course. >>>>> >>>>> roman >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>> >> ___________________________________________________________ >>>>> >>>>> Der fr?he Vogel f?ngt den Wurm. Hier >> gelangen Sie >>>> zum >>>>> neuen Yahoo! Mail: http://mail.yahoo.de >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >>>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >>>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/ >>> listinfo/pd-list From jmmmpais at googlemail.com Mon Mar 9 00:42:25 2009 From: jmmmpais at googlemail.com (=?iso-8859-15?Q?Jo=E3o_Pais?=) Date: Sun, 08 Mar 2009 23:42:25 -0000 Subject: [PD] GSC 09 : Organisation and Categorisation of Pd-Extended Externals Message-ID: Hi, I just added a new category for the GSC09, Organisation and Categorisation of Pd-Extended Externals. This follows up recent discussions on the pd-dev list. It might not be eligible due to being more about restructuring already existing code than to make new code (which could be seen as "documentation"). But if doesn't go on, at least there was some effort to sketch the problem. The page is at http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/OrganisationAndCategorisationOfPdExtendedExternals. About mentoring: neither me nor Enrique are up for the task of reorganising svn, as we don't know enough about what goes on below the user level of Pd - so we can't do much more than say "this or this would be nice". So our names are there due to interest in the project, but someone else should take care of the practical part of working the compilation material. If you think this person could be you, just put your name in. Best, Jo?o Pais -- Friedenstr. 58 10249 Berlin (Deutschland) Tel +49 30 42020091 | Mob +49 162 6843570 jmmmpais at googlemail.com | skype: jmmmpjmmmp From kyleklip at gmail.com Mon Mar 9 05:18:03 2009 From: kyleklip at gmail.com (Kyle Klipowicz) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 23:18:03 -0500 Subject: [PD] GSoC web project idea In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: What would really be tops is if this could somehow automatically do a screen grab of the path so you could see a screenshot before downloading. Neat Idea. Right now I just keep all these tidbits in a /pd-list dir on my comp. ~Kyle On Sun, Mar 8, 2009 at 2:08 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > I've had an idea for a long time for a web interface to the patches > that people post to the pd-list. Basically, lots of really great code > is posted to the Pd list, but it is not very easy to find it there. > What if there was a searchable database of all patches posted to the > pd list. You could search by object name to see all patches that use > a certain object, then download it. > > I think that someone who was a decent web programmer could do this. > Perhaps using something like Lucene, or really whatever. Is it worth > a summer of code project? > > .hc > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > News is what people want to keep hidden and everything else is > publicity. - Bill Moyers > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -- ----- ------------ ---- ----- ---- -------- - ------ http://perhapsidid.wordpress.com http://myspace.com/kyleklipowicz -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dmotd at gmx.net Mon Mar 9 05:52:26 2009 From: dmotd at gmx.net (dmotd) Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2009 14:52:26 +1000 Subject: [PD] GSoC web project idea In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200903091452.26936.dmotd@gmx.net> hey hans, for what its worth, the pd-list is indexed on markmail.org, which has a very powerful search facility. a simple query of: [list:at.iem extension:pd writesf~] finds a post on any of the pd lists, with a reference to writesf~ and a attached pd file.. or if i want to stalk you and every patch you have ever posted: [list:at.iem extension:pd from:"Hans-Christoph Steiner"] trying to index a mail database is in my opinion quite outside the scope of pd documentation, even if it could make trawling through list archives simpler. i would certainly hate to be the student whose job it is to maintain a database of current or previously submitted attachments.. even if this job was automated, sifting out peoples problem posts from the articulate solutions is about as much fun as sorting spam on hotmail. i essentially like the idea but i really think this comes down to a few disciplined people on the list wanting to maintain a slice of puredata.org/pdpedia every time they see a piece of pd magic. cheers, dmotd On Monday 09 March 2009 05:08:54 Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > I've had an idea for a long time for a web interface to the patches > that people post to the pd-list. Basically, lots of really great code > is posted to the Pd list, but it is not very easy to find it there. > What if there was a searchable database of all patches posted to the > pd list. You could search by object name to see all patches that use > a certain object, then download it. > > I think that someone who was a decent web programmer could do this. > Perhaps using something like Lucene, or really whatever. Is it worth > a summer of code project? > > .hc > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------------- >- > > News is what people want to keep hidden and everything else is > publicity. - Bill Moyers > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From lukexipd at gmail.com Mon Mar 9 08:16:18 2009 From: lukexipd at gmail.com (Luke Iannini) Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2009 00:16:18 -0700 Subject: [PD] I am the harbinger of crashing In-Reply-To: <70C8A585-B7F1-4A8A-AAB5-D75C9867F66A@eds.org> References: <7aaf8bb90903071722i542a6fe4m555757ac8cbe701c@mail.gmail.com> <70C8A585-B7F1-4A8A-AAB5-D75C9867F66A@eds.org> Message-ID: <7aaf8bb90903090016ned9061cv16ffd7f4f1b86a11@mail.gmail.com> Good call - that's correct. Pd 41-4 crashes the same way, log's attached (and here's the relevant snippet afaik) Thread 0 Crashed: 0 com.apple.CoreFoundation 0x90502e33 __CFStrConvertBytesToUnicode + 51 1 com.apple.CoreFoundation 0x904f5536 CFStringCompareWithOptionsAndLocale + 3542 2 com.apple.CoreFoundation 0x904f6455 CFStringCompareWithOptions + 53 3 pd 0x0007bb42 EndpointName + 324 (pmmacosxcm.c:692) 4 pd 0x0007bd09 cm_get_full_endpoint_name + 223 (pmmacosxcm.c:757) 5 pd 0x0007c005 pm_macosxcm_init + 448 (pmmacosxcm.c:901) 6 pd 0x0007c82d Pm_Initialize + 48 (portmidi.c:293) 7 pd 0x0007c884 Pm_CountDevices + 17 (portmidi.c:139) 8 pd 0x0006dafb midi_getdevs + 41 (s_midi_pm.c:289) 9 pd 0x0004a6aa glob_midi_properties + 91 (s_midi.c:670) 10 pd 0x00039810 pd_typedmess + 965 (m_class.c:728) 11 pd 0x0003ce27 binbuf_eval + 1075 (m_binbuf.c:722) 12 pd 0x000442d7 socketreceiver_read + 1016 (s_inter.c:546) 13 pd 0x0004336a sys_domicrosleep + 385 (s_inter.c:184) 14 pd 0x000433cf sys_microsleep + 19 (s_inter.c:207) 15 pd 0x000410ee m_mainloop + 468 (m_sched.c:511) 16 pd 0x00042fb6 sys_main + 1199 (s_main.c:309) 17 pd 0x00001de6 _start + 216 18 pd 0x00001d0d start + 41 On Sun, Mar 8, 2009 at 10:45 AM, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > Hmm, could you test Pd-vanilla 0.41.4? ?That might be where the bug was > introduced. > > .hc > > On Mar 7, 2009, at 8:22 PM, Luke Iannini wrote: > >> Sigh, here's another : ) >> >> This seems to have something to do with my MPD24 drum pads... whenever >> they're connected and I enter the MIDI preferences of Pd, I get the >> attached crash. >> >> It also occurs if they're configured (via .pdrc or the plist) as a >> default device. >> >> This started occurring on the newest builds of Pd-E as well as on >> Pd-0.42-4. ?It does not occur of my build of 0.40.3-extended. >> >> Anyone have any ideas? >> Best >> Luke >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?http://at.or.at/hans/ > > > -------------- next part -------------- Process: pd [25206] Path: /Users/lukeiannini/Downloads/Pd-0.41-4.app/Contents/Resources/Scripts/../bin/pd Identifier: pd Version: ??? (???) Code Type: X86 (Native) Parent Process: Pd [25204] Date/Time: 2009-03-09 00:13:30.791 -0700 OS Version: Mac OS X 10.5.6 (9G55) Report Version: 6 Exception Type: EXC_BAD_ACCESS (SIGBUS) Exception Codes: KERN_PROTECTION_FAILURE at 0x0000000000000000 Crashed Thread: 0 Thread 0 Crashed: 0 com.apple.CoreFoundation 0x90502e33 __CFStrConvertBytesToUnicode + 51 1 com.apple.CoreFoundation 0x904f5536 CFStringCompareWithOptionsAndLocale + 3542 2 com.apple.CoreFoundation 0x904f6455 CFStringCompareWithOptions + 53 3 pd 0x0007bb42 EndpointName + 324 (pmmacosxcm.c:692) 4 pd 0x0007bd09 cm_get_full_endpoint_name + 223 (pmmacosxcm.c:757) 5 pd 0x0007c005 pm_macosxcm_init + 448 (pmmacosxcm.c:901) 6 pd 0x0007c82d Pm_Initialize + 48 (portmidi.c:293) 7 pd 0x0007c884 Pm_CountDevices + 17 (portmidi.c:139) 8 pd 0x0006dafb midi_getdevs + 41 (s_midi_pm.c:289) 9 pd 0x0004a6aa glob_midi_properties + 91 (s_midi.c:670) 10 pd 0x00039810 pd_typedmess + 965 (m_class.c:728) 11 pd 0x0003ce27 binbuf_eval + 1075 (m_binbuf.c:722) 12 pd 0x000442d7 socketreceiver_read + 1016 (s_inter.c:546) 13 pd 0x0004336a sys_domicrosleep + 385 (s_inter.c:184) 14 pd 0x000433cf sys_microsleep + 19 (s_inter.c:207) 15 pd 0x000410ee m_mainloop + 468 (m_sched.c:511) 16 pd 0x00042fb6 sys_main + 1199 (s_main.c:309) 17 pd 0x00001de6 _start + 216 18 pd 0x00001d0d start + 41 Thread 1: 0 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b1b1c6 mach_msg_trap + 10 1 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b229bc mach_msg + 72 2 com.apple.CoreFoundation 0x904d20ae CFRunLoopRunSpecific + 1790 3 com.apple.CoreFoundation 0x904d2d34 CFRunLoopRun + 84 4 com.apple.DVCPROHDMuxer 0x006c90fb AVS::DestroyAVCDeviceController(AVS::AVCDeviceController*) + 297 5 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4c095 _pthread_start + 321 6 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4bf52 thread_start + 34 Thread 2: 0 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b1b1c6 mach_msg_trap + 10 1 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b229bc mach_msg + 72 2 com.apple.CoreFoundation 0x904d20ae CFRunLoopRunSpecific + 1790 3 com.apple.CoreFoundation 0x904d2cd8 CFRunLoopRunInMode + 88 4 com.apple.audio.CoreAudio 0x9231b5dc HALRunLoop::OwnThread(void*) + 160 5 com.apple.audio.CoreAudio 0x9231b464 CAPThread::Entry(CAPThread*) + 96 6 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4c095 _pthread_start + 321 7 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4bf52 thread_start + 34 Thread 3: 0 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b1b226 semaphore_timedwait_signal_trap + 10 1 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4d1ef _pthread_cond_wait + 1244 2 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4ea73 pthread_cond_timedwait_relative_np + 47 3 com.apple.audio.CoreAudio 0x9232abc3 CAGuard::WaitFor(unsigned long long) + 213 4 com.apple.audio.CoreAudio 0x9232c77e CAGuard::WaitUntil(unsigned long long) + 70 5 com.apple.audio.CoreAudio 0x9232af23 HP_IOThread::WorkLoop() + 759 6 com.apple.audio.CoreAudio 0x9232ac27 HP_IOThread::ThreadEntry(HP_IOThread*) + 17 7 com.apple.audio.CoreAudio 0x9231b464 CAPThread::Entry(CAPThread*) + 96 8 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4c095 _pthread_start + 321 9 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4bf52 thread_start + 34 Thread 4: 0 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b1b226 semaphore_timedwait_signal_trap + 10 1 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4d1ef _pthread_cond_wait + 1244 2 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4ea73 pthread_cond_timedwait_relative_np + 47 3 com.apple.audio.CoreAudio 0x9232abc3 CAGuard::WaitFor(unsigned long long) + 213 4 com.apple.audio.CoreAudio 0x9232c77e CAGuard::WaitUntil(unsigned long long) + 70 5 com.apple.audio.CoreAudio 0x9232af23 HP_IOThread::WorkLoop() + 759 6 com.apple.audio.CoreAudio 0x9232ac27 HP_IOThread::ThreadEntry(HP_IOThread*) + 17 7 com.apple.audio.CoreAudio 0x9231b464 CAPThread::Entry(CAPThread*) + 96 8 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4c095 _pthread_start + 321 9 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4bf52 thread_start + 34 Thread 5: 0 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b1b20e semaphore_wait_signal_trap + 10 1 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4d206 _pthread_cond_wait + 1267 2 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b92539 pthread_cond_wait + 48 3 py.pd_darwin 0x0101062a flext_multi::ThrCond::Wait() + 34 4 py.pd_darwin 0x010106f3 flext_multi::ThrHelper(void*) + 177 5 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4c095 _pthread_start + 321 6 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4bf52 thread_start + 34 Thread 6: 0 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b1b226 semaphore_timedwait_signal_trap + 10 1 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4d1ef _pthread_cond_wait + 1244 2 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b97aaf pthread_cond_timedwait + 47 3 py.pd_darwin 0x0100fdcb flext_multi::ThrCond::TimedWait(double) + 203 4 py.pd_darwin 0x01012931 flext_base_multi::QWorker(flext_multi::thr_params*) + 61 5 py.pd_darwin 0x01010595 flext_multi::PopThread() + 149 6 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4c095 _pthread_start + 321 7 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4bf52 thread_start + 34 Thread 7: 0 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b6a6f2 select$DARWIN_EXTSN + 10 1 org.python.python 0x0105d505 PyObject_Call + 50 2 org.python.python 0x010c682d PyEval_CallObjectWithKeywords + 211 3 org.python.python 0x0105d4d1 PyObject_CallObject + 32 4 py.pd_darwin 0x01009204 pybase::pyworker(flext_multi::thr_params*) + 102 5 py.pd_darwin 0x01010595 flext_multi::PopThread() + 149 6 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4c095 _pthread_start + 321 7 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4bf52 thread_start + 34 Thread 8: 0 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b1b20e semaphore_wait_signal_trap + 10 1 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4d206 _pthread_cond_wait + 1267 2 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b92539 pthread_cond_wait + 48 3 py.pd_darwin 0x0101062a flext_multi::ThrCond::Wait() + 34 4 py.pd_darwin 0x0100942a pybase::quworker(flext_multi::thr_params*) + 198 5 py.pd_darwin 0x01010595 flext_multi::PopThread() + 149 6 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4c095 _pthread_start + 321 7 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4bf52 thread_start + 34 Thread 9: 0 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b1b1c6 mach_msg_trap + 10 1 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b229bc mach_msg + 72 2 com.apple.audio.midi.CoreMIDI 0x00216f0f XServerMachPort::ReceiveMessage(int&, void*, int&) + 101 3 com.apple.audio.midi.CoreMIDI 0x00209477 MIDIInPortThread::Run() + 111 4 com.apple.audio.midi.CoreMIDI 0x0020d07d XThread::RunHelper(void*) + 17 5 com.apple.audio.midi.CoreMIDI 0x002179ee CAPThread::Entry(CAPThread*) + 96 6 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4c095 _pthread_start + 321 7 libSystem.B.dylib 0x92b4bf52 thread_start + 34 Thread 0 crashed with X86 Thread State (32-bit): eax: 0xa00346e0 ebx: 0x90502e14 ecx: 0x00000000 edx: 0x00000000 edi: 0xbfffbf40 esi: 0x00000009 ebp: 0xbfffbb38 esp: 0xbfffbb28 ss: 0x0000001f efl: 0x00010246 eip: 0x90502e33 cs: 0x00000017 ds: 0x0000001f es: 0x0000001f fs: 0x00000000 gs: 0x00000037 cr2: 0x00000000 Binary Images: 0x1000 - 0x8afe3 +pd ??? (???) /Users/lukeiannini/Downloads/Pd-0.41-4.app/Contents/Resources/bin/pd 0x205000 - 0x222ff7 com.apple.audio.midi.CoreMIDI 1.6.1 (42) /System/Library/Frameworks/CoreMIDI.framework/Versions/A/CoreMIDI 0x23a000 - 0x258fe3 libexpat.1.dylib ??? (???) /usr/lib/libexpat.1.dylib 0x273000 - 0x276fff com.apple.audio.AudioIPCPlugIn 1.0.5 (1.0.5) /System/Library/Extensions/AudioIPCDriver.kext/Contents/Resources/AudioIPCPlugIn.bundle/Contents/MacOS/AudioIPCPlugIn 0x27c000 - 0x281fff com.apple.audio.AppleHDAHALPlugIn 1.6.2 (1.6.2a37) /System/Library/Extensions/AppleHDA.kext/Contents/PlugIns/AppleHDAHALPlugIn.bundle/Contents/MacOS/AppleHDAHALPlugIn 0x297000 - 0x2c1fff +libjack.dylib ??? (???) <87ec84ca31b01744c5628918ae5edc10> /usr/local/lib/libjack.dylib 0x500000 - 0x556fd6 com.apple.DVCPROHDAudio 1.3 (1.3) /Library/Audio/Plug-Ins/HAL/DVCPROHDAudio.plugin/Contents/MacOS/DVCPROHDAudio 0x59e000 - 0x59eff4 +libdir.pd_darwin ??? (???) <1251df1e103455c4ac313b3584be66a1> /Applications/Pd-extended.app/Contents/Resources/extra/libdir.pd_darwin 0x629000 - 0x62cfff com.apple.LiveType.component 2.1.3 (2.1.3) /Library/QuickTime/LiveType.component/Contents/MacOS/LiveType 0x632000 - 0x697fde com.apple.LiveType.framework 2.1.3 (2.1.3) /System/Library/PrivateFrameworks/LiveType.framework/Versions/A/LiveType 0x6b7000 - 0x701fec com.apple.DVCPROHDMuxer 1.3 (1.3) /Library/QuickTime/DVCPROHDMuxer.component/Contents/MacOS/DVCPROHDMuxer 0x71f000 - 0x752fff +com.grame.JackRouter JackRouter (0.9.0) /Library/Audio/Plug-Ins/HAL/JackRouter.plugin/Contents/MacOS/JackRouter 0x7bb000 - 0x7daff8 +xsample.pd_darwin ??? (???) /Applications/Pd-extended.app/Contents/Resources/extra/xsample.pd_darwin 0x7f1000 - 0x7f2fff time.so ??? (???) <0f45f604e60a700f3f29b31621e20168> /System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.5/lib/python2.5/lib-dynload/time.so 0x7f7000 - 0x7fafff +_dotblas.so ??? (???) <56efe0b260036ff322d3ea5b025c6603> /Library/Python/2.5/site-packages/numpy/core/_dotblas.so 0x1000000 - 0x1027fff +py.pd_darwin ??? (???) /Applications/Pd-extended.app/Contents/Resources/extra/py.pd_darwin 0x1055000 - 0x1121feb org.python.python 2.5 (2.5) /System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.5/Python 0x1286000 - 0x12d3fe7 +multiarray.so ??? (???) <303b6d5d2211de38a93a3e57359f4aa1> /Library/Python/2.5/site-packages/numpy/core/multiarray.so 0x1305000 - 0x132dfff +umath.so ??? (???) <45014c599a57a7bb548d15619c42eba3> /Library/Python/2.5/site-packages/numpy/core/umath.so 0x1348000 - 0x1356ffe +_sort.so ??? (???) /Library/Python/2.5/site-packages/numpy/core/_sort.so 0x135d000 - 0x1367fff cPickle.so ??? (???) /System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.5/lib/python2.5/lib-dynload/cPickle.so 0x136c000 - 0x136dfff cStringIO.so ??? (???) <5fdfcdebb435a006e03061febe620ece> /System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.5/lib/python2.5/lib-dynload/cStringIO.so 0x1377000 - 0x1379fff operator.so ??? (???) /System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.5/lib/python2.5/lib-dynload/operator.so 0x137e000 - 0x137ffff math.so ??? (???) <618a37e746e12cbfb79979dfb2da010b> /System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.5/lib/python2.5/lib-dynload/math.so 0x1408000 - 0x141efff +scalarmath.so ??? (???) <850f39fba9cc4732aaafcd5a49584ede> /Library/Python/2.5/site-packages/numpy/core/scalarmath.so 0x146d000 - 0x146ffff +_compiled_base.so ??? (???) /Library/Python/2.5/site-packages/numpy/lib/_compiled_base.so 0x1473000 - 0x1475ffe itertools.so ??? (???) <85c84899db557e83080acbd9ed88fe3c> /System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.5/lib/python2.5/lib-dynload/itertools.so 0x14c0000 - 0x14c3ffd +lapack_lite.so ??? (???) <927782e16ea6086bc223f324f67f6760> /Library/Python/2.5/site-packages/numpy/linalg/lapack_lite.so 0x14c8000 - 0x14cffff +fftpack_lite.so ??? (???) <2f407dfec69cda9492fb6cb12ad044fb> /Library/Python/2.5/site-packages/numpy/fft/fftpack_lite.so 0x14d4000 - 0x14e0ffb _ctypes.so ??? (???) <34ff7ffa895c654f653d24dcac5355c4> /System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.5/lib/python2.5/lib-dynload/_ctypes.so 0x14e7000 - 0x14e9ffb _struct.so ??? (???) /System/Library/Frameworks/Python.framework/Versions/2.5/lib/python2.5/lib-dynload/_struct.so 0x152d000 - 0x1553fff +mtrand.so ??? (???) <8de35b66a3c609a4add8c9e7ee637006> /Library/Python/2.5/site-packages/numpy/random/mtrand.so 0x70000000 - 0x700e6ff2 com.apple.audio.units.Components 1.5.2 (1.5.2) /System/Library/Components/CoreAudio.component/Contents/MacOS/CoreAudio 0x8fe00000 - 0x8fe2db43 dyld 97.1 (???) <100d362e03410f181a34e04e94189ae5> /usr/lib/dyld 0x90028000 - 0x90071fef com.apple.Metadata 10.5.2 (398.25) /System/Library/Frameworks/CoreServices.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/Metadata.framework/Versions/A/Metadata 0x90072000 - 0x9034cff3 com.apple.CoreServices.CarbonCore 786.11 (786.11) /System/Library/Frameworks/CoreServices.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/CarbonCore.framework/Versions/A/CarbonCore 0x903cd000 - 0x9042affb libstdc++.6.dylib ??? 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(???) /System/Library/Frameworks/Accelerate.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/vecLib.framework/Versions/A/libLAPACK.dylib 0x96b52000 - 0x96c02fff edu.mit.Kerberos 6.0.12 (6.0.12) <685cc018c133668d0d3ac6a1cb63cff9> /System/Library/Frameworks/Kerberos.framework/Versions/A/Kerberos 0x96c03000 - 0x96c18ffb com.apple.ImageCapture 5.0.1 (5.0.1) /System/Library/Frameworks/Carbon.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/ImageCapture.framework/Versions/A/ImageCapture 0x96c4c000 - 0x96cc9fef libvMisc.dylib ??? (???) /System/Library/Frameworks/Accelerate.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/vecLib.framework/Versions/A/libvMisc.dylib 0x96cca000 - 0x96d1bff7 com.apple.HIServices 1.7.0 (???) <01b690d1f376e400ac873105533e39eb> /System/Library/Frameworks/ApplicationServices.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/HIServices.framework/Versions/A/HIServices 0x96d1c000 - 0x96eeaff3 com.apple.security 5.0.4 (34102) <55dda7486df4e8e1d61505be16f83a1c> /System/Library/Frameworks/Security.framework/Versions/A/Security 0x96eeb000 - 0x96f22fff com.apple.SystemConfiguration 1.9.2 (1.9.2) <8b26ebf26a009a098484f1ed01ec499c> /System/Library/Frameworks/SystemConfiguration.framework/Versions/A/SystemConfiguration 0x96f23000 - 0x96f33fff com.apple.speech.synthesis.framework 3.7.1 (3.7.1) <06d8fc0307314f8ffc16f206ad3dbf44> /System/Library/Frameworks/ApplicationServices.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/SpeechSynthesis.framework/Versions/A/SpeechSynthesis 0x96f66000 - 0x97047ff7 libxml2.2.dylib ??? (???) <306036e0070330e35045650e6d9f0d05> /usr/lib/libxml2.2.dylib 0x97058000 - 0x97097fef libTIFF.dylib ??? (???) <3589442575ac77746ae99ecf724f5f87> /System/Library/Frameworks/ApplicationServices.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/ImageIO.framework/Versions/A/Resources/libTIFF.dylib 0x97098000 - 0x970a2feb com.apple.audio.SoundManager 3.9.2 (3.9.2) <0f2ba6e891d3761212cf5a5e6134d683> /System/Library/Frameworks/Carbon.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/CarbonSound.framework/Versions/A/CarbonSound 0x970a3000 - 0x97440fef com.apple.QuartzCore 1.5.7 (1.5.7) <2fed2dd7565c84a0f0c608d41d4d172c> /System/Library/Frameworks/QuartzCore.framework/Versions/A/QuartzCore 0x9745f000 - 0x974deff5 com.apple.SearchKit 1.2.1 (1.2.1) <3140a605db2abf56b237fa156a08b28b> /System/Library/Frameworks/CoreServices.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/SearchKit.framework/Versions/A/SearchKit 0x97536000 - 0x9753afff libmathCommon.A.dylib ??? (???) /usr/lib/system/libmathCommon.A.dylib 0x9753b000 - 0x9753dfff com.apple.securityhi 3.0 (30817) /System/Library/Frameworks/Carbon.framework/Versions/A/Frameworks/SecurityHI.framework/Versions/A/SecurityHI 0x9753e000 - 0x9757cff7 libGLImage.dylib ??? (???) <1123b8a48bcbe9cc7aa8dd8e1a214a66> /System/Library/Frameworks/OpenGL.framework/Versions/A/Libraries/libGLImage.dylib 0xfffe8000 - 0xfffebfff libobjc.A.dylib ??? (???) /usr/lib/libobjc.A.dylib 0xffff0000 - 0xffff1780 libSystem.B.dylib ??? (???) /usr/lib/libSystem.B.dylib From lukexipd at gmail.com Mon Mar 9 08:40:52 2009 From: lukexipd at gmail.com (Luke Iannini) Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2009 00:40:52 -0700 Subject: [PD] pd~ loadbanged stdout hangs all pd processes Message-ID: <7aaf8bb90903090040y785f8131hcfbf28e82d263088@mail.gmail.com> Hallo, the attached repro hangs for me quite reliably : ) It's not always reproducible with just one [pd~] object, but two seem to do the trick every time. 42-4 of course. Best and sorry for the never-ending stream of crashes : ) Luke -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: pd~-stdout-crash.zip Type: application/zip Size: 1745 bytes Desc: not available URL: From alvaro at berlin.de Mon Mar 9 10:28:13 2009 From: alvaro at berlin.de (Alvaro) Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2009 10:28:13 +0100 (CET) Subject: [PD] kein Betreff Message-ID: <1236590893.182230-1431@marvin4.daybyday.de> Hi, I'm having trouble using [piperead~] on Ubuntu Linux. When I try the example from the help file, [pipewrite~] works ok, but [piperead~] crashes with a segfault. Anybody having similar trouble, or perhaps knows a solution? Thanks. einszueins. From lukexipd at gmail.com Mon Mar 9 11:40:12 2009 From: lukexipd at gmail.com (Luke Iannini) Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2009 03:40:12 -0700 Subject: [PD] pd~ loadbanged stdout hangs all pd processes In-Reply-To: <7aaf8bb90903090040y785f8131hcfbf28e82d263088@mail.gmail.com> References: <7aaf8bb90903090040y785f8131hcfbf28e82d263088@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <7aaf8bb90903090340j3ff9384ofb65479b0963361e@mail.gmail.com> Whoops - I think this was just because I did not have the audio on! But then... there does seem to be a bonus hang in there after all: if I have audio on, the patches both launch successfully, but, if I then click the bang in OPEN-ME.pd again, there's no response: everything hangs. On Mon, Mar 9, 2009 at 12:40 AM, Luke Iannini wrote: > Hallo, the attached repro hangs for me quite reliably : ) > > It's not always reproducible with just one [pd~] object, but two seem > to do the trick every time. > > 42-4 of course. > > Best and sorry for the never-ending stream of crashes : ) > Luke > From cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr Mon Mar 9 11:45:00 2009 From: cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr (cyrille henry) Date: Mon, 09 Mar 2009 11:45:00 +0100 Subject: [PD] pd~ loadbanged stdout hangs all pd processes In-Reply-To: <7aaf8bb90903090040y785f8131hcfbf28e82d263088@mail.gmail.com> References: <7aaf8bb90903090040y785f8131hcfbf28e82d263088@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49B4F32C.50405@la-kitchen.fr> same here. cyrille Luke Iannini a ?crit : > Hallo, the attached repro hangs for me quite reliably : ) > > It's not always reproducible with just one [pd~] object, but two seem > to do the trick every time. > > 42-4 of course. > > Best and sorry for the never-ending stream of crashes : ) > Luke > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr Mon Mar 9 12:20:59 2009 From: cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr (cyrille henry) Date: Mon, 09 Mar 2009 12:20:59 +0100 Subject: [PD] pd~ loadbanged stdout hangs all pd processes In-Reply-To: <7aaf8bb90903090340j3ff9384ofb65479b0963361e@mail.gmail.com> References: <7aaf8bb90903090040y785f8131hcfbf28e82d263088@mail.gmail.com> <7aaf8bb90903090340j3ff9384ofb65479b0963361e@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49B4FB9B.6030001@la-kitchen.fr> hello, you're right, audio must be on, in both patch. it is still hanging on the 2nd time, but it's not related to the loadbanged stdout. see attachement. Cyrille Luke Iannini a ?crit : > Whoops - I think this was just because I did not have the audio on! > But then... there does seem to be a bonus hang in there after all: if > I have audio on, the patches both launch successfully, but, if I then > click the bang in OPEN-ME.pd again, there's no response: everything > hangs. > > On Mon, Mar 9, 2009 at 12:40 AM, Luke Iannini wrote: >> Hallo, the attached repro hangs for me quite reliably : ) >> >> It's not always reproducible with just one [pd~] object, but two seem >> to do the trick every time. >> >> 42-4 of course. >> >> Best and sorry for the never-ending stream of crashes : ) >> Luke >> > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: pd~-stdout-crash.tar.gz Type: application/x-gzip Size: 770 bytes Desc: not available URL: From lukexipd at gmail.com Mon Mar 9 13:12:22 2009 From: lukexipd at gmail.com (Luke Iannini) Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2009 05:12:22 -0700 Subject: [PD] pd~.abstraction to make pd~ more like pd Message-ID: <7aaf8bb90903090512k7c97c354tcb6ca2fed537e913@mail.gmail.com> Hallo all - Speaking of [pd~], I made this tonight. It's meant to let you make (or convert) abstractions for pd~ more easily, with the niceties of abstractions (mainly: arguments!) and straightforward inlet and outlet handling. Call it like [pd~.abstraction myabstraction foo bar baz] and it will do its best to emulate simply writing [myabstraction foo bar baz]. The only caveat is it requires a standardized input/output layout (1 inlet/outlet and 2 inlet~/outlet~s) - modify as you wish; I'll see if I can think of a more flexible implementation. Send messages like [INLET whateveryouwant( to send [whateveryouwant( to the inlet of your abstraction. The outlet of your abstraction will come to the outlet of [pd~.abstraction]. The inlet~s and outlet~s are also mapped accordingly. Thanks to IOhannes for testargs and FBar for list-l2s - those made the (purepd) argument hackery possible. It would be cool if pd~ supported arguments natively! Hope this helps get more started using [pd~]. Best Luke -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: pd~.abstraction.zip Type: application/zip Size: 3567 bytes Desc: not available URL: From hans at eds.org Sun Mar 8 20:53:40 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 15:53:40 -0400 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <1236437479.8049.39.camel@yoyo2> References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> <49B24BE4.5060702@netpd.org> <1236437479.8049.39.camel@yoyo2> Message-ID: <2AE574D7-078C-47BC-A548-41CC05E77BC8@eds.org> On Mar 7, 2009, at 9:51 AM, Roman Haefeli wrote: > On Sat, 2009-03-07 at 11:26 +0100, Enrique Erne wrote: >> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >>> The Google Summer of Code ((http://code.google.com/soc/) application >>> is due very soon, March 9th, and we need mentors! At this point, >>> you >>> just need to put down your name. Then once the projects are in, >>> we'll >>> choose projects and who will mentor them. >> >>> Every pd developer who wants to support the project but is not >>> student >>> anymore is invited to join as mentor, since the number of sponsored >>> projects by google depends on the number of mentors and students. >> >> Andy, Claude, Frank, Marius, Mathieu, Roman where are you guys? >> >> add your names, hurry! :) > > yo, i am happy to add my name, but i guess it only makes sense for > me to > take a mentorship of a project, that is about patching and not c > coding. > from what i have seen, there is only one project - undead - which > seems > to be about patching. derek holzer is already proposed as a mentor. > does > it make sense to propose more then one mentor for a project? You could also create a new project based on something like creating libraries out of all that useful code in netpd. Basically, think of something that you would like implemented in Pd that you could mentor. .hc > > > roman > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > Telefonate ohne weitere Kosten vom PC zum PC: http:// > messenger.yahoo.de ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- If nature has made any one thing less susceptible than all others of exclusive property, it is the action of the thinking power called an idea, which an individual may exclusively possess as long as he keeps it to himself; but the moment it is divulged, it forces itself into the possession of everyone, and the receiver cannot dispossess himself of it. - Thomas Jefferson From hans at eds.org Sun Mar 8 20:43:38 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Sun, 8 Mar 2009 15:43:38 -0400 Subject: [PD] documentation sprint WAS: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: References: <1236214369.7483.13.camel@danoT500> <7223A0F4-49DA-421E-8FFB-7324EF1246C2@eds.org> <1236294414.8960.0.camel@danoT500> <49B109A4.9050909@umatic.nl> <49B152BE.2000703@umatic.nl> <49B156CF.7000203@umatic.nl> Message-ID: Yes, that is good. We could have a documentation sprint at the next PdCon. I think we should have something like a 5 hour session where we just sit and work on documentation. We are also trying to organize a FLOSSmanuals Pd book sprint, probably NYC, but also other locations as well. The more the merrier! .hc On Mar 6, 2009, at 9:33 PM, Kyle Klipowicz wrote: > True that! I would be way more useful writing documentation than > code. If there was an opportunity like GSoC for that, I'd jump on it. > > ~Kyle > > On Fri, Mar 6, 2009 at 11:04 AM, chris clepper > wrote: > On Fri, Mar 6, 2009 at 12:01 PM, Derek Holzer wrote: > I already asked, and GSoC doesn't cover documentation, or else I > would have pitched the Pd FLOSS Manual in there as well. But go for > it with the GLSL/framebuffer coding stuff! > > That is really a shame since most open source projects need way more > documentation done than coding. Maybe they will have a Winter of > Docs? > > > > > chris clepper wrote: > My own suggestion for a GEM project would be to create a tutorial > and accompanying manual that covers the basic operation. The other > idea involves making the more advanced features like GLSL and > framebuffer rendering easier to use. These are mainly documentation > projects, but also have some Pd, and possible C++ coding as well. > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > -- > ----- > ------------ > ---- ----- > ---- -------- - ------ > http://perhapsidid.wordpress.com > http://myspace.com/kyleklipowicz > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Mistrust authority - promote decentralization. - the hacker ethic -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From derek at umatic.nl Mon Mar 9 14:11:20 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Mon, 09 Mar 2009 14:11:20 +0100 Subject: [PD] documentation sprint WAS: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: References: <1236214369.7483.13.camel@danoT500> <7223A0F4-49DA-421E-8FFB-7324EF1246C2@eds.org> <1236294414.8960.0.camel@danoT500> <49B109A4.9050909@umatic.nl> <49B152BE.2000703@umatic.nl> <49B156CF.7000203@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <49B51578.2030801@umatic.nl> Probably will do parallel Pd FLOSS Manual sprint in Berlin at same time as NYC one. Early to mid-April? Will post more on this later when I have a chance to draw up some outline for this. best! Derek Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > Yes, that is good. We could have a documentation sprint at the next > PdCon. I think we should have something like a 5 hour session where we > just sit and work on documentation. We are also trying to organize a > FLOSSmanuals Pd book sprint, probably NYC, but also other locations as > well. The more the merrier! > > .hc > > On Mar 6, 2009, at 9:33 PM, Kyle Klipowicz wrote: > >> True that! I would be way more useful writing documentation than code. >> If there was an opportunity like GSoC for that, I'd jump on it. >> >> ~Kyle >> >> On Fri, Mar 6, 2009 at 11:04 AM, chris clepper > > wrote: >> >> On Fri, Mar 6, 2009 at 12:01 PM, Derek Holzer > > wrote: >> >> I already asked, and GSoC doesn't cover documentation, or else >> I would have pitched the Pd FLOSS Manual in there as well. But >> go for it with the GLSL/framebuffer coding stuff! >> >> >> That is really a shame since most open source projects need way >> more documentation done than coding. Maybe they will have a >> Winter of Docs? >> >> >> >> >> >> chris clepper wrote: >> >> My own suggestion for a GEM project would be to create a >> tutorial and accompanying manual that covers the basic >> operation. The other idea involves making the more >> advanced features like GLSL and framebuffer rendering >> easier to use. These are mainly documentation projects, >> but also have some Pd, and possible C++ coding as well. -- derek holzer ::: http://www.umatic.nl ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ---Oblique Strategy # 129: "Put in earplugs" From lordi at styleliga.org Mon Mar 9 15:02:22 2009 From: lordi at styleliga.org (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Hannes_Gr=E4uler?=) Date: Mon, 09 Mar 2009 15:02:22 +0100 Subject: [PD] Simultaneous Computation Message-ID: <49B5216E.5020502@styleliga.org> Hi all, I'm new to Pd and I'm looking for some hints on implementing a DSP external. I want to implement an external which is capable of simultaneous calculation of 2 or more coupled instances of it. On the signal level, this is not possible, because the construction of the DSP tree forbids feedback loops. Another way to achieve simultaneous computation of coupled objects is the following: The coupled objects exchange their adresses via pointer messages. Now, when the signal of the first of the coupled objects is about to be computed it should also calculate all coupled objects and store each result in a buffer. When the DSP-perform on of the remaining objects is called, it simply copies the buffer its outlet. 1. While the above proposal feels like a hack to me, I'd like to ask if there is any other (smarter) way to enable simultaneous computations? 2. Given my proposal is worth to be tried, how would I get to know the "first of the coupled objects"? Is there a way to get the timestamp of the current DSP iteration, so that I can determine when to calculate all buffers? Thanks for reading, Hannes From zmoelnig at iem.at Mon Mar 9 15:45:19 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Mon, 09 Mar 2009 15:45:19 +0100 Subject: [PD] Simultaneous Computation In-Reply-To: <49B5216E.5020502@styleliga.org> References: <49B5216E.5020502@styleliga.org> Message-ID: <49B52B7F.5090703@iem.at> Hannes Gr?uler wrote: > Hi all, > > I'm new to Pd and I'm looking for some hints on implementing a DSP external. > I want to implement an external which is capable of simultaneous calculation > of 2 or more coupled instances of it. > > On the signal level, this is not possible, because the construction of the DSP > tree forbids feedback loops. > > Another way to achieve simultaneous computation of coupled objects is the > following: The coupled objects exchange their adresses via pointer messages. > Now, when the signal of the first of the coupled objects is about to be > computed it should also calculate all coupled objects and store each result > in a buffer. When the DSP-perform on of the remaining objects is called, > it simply copies the buffer its outlet. hmm, but you know that you might not have the input signals available at your "other" objects yet. so the best you could come up with that way can be simulated by a simple singleton oscillator which you distribute via [send~]. i guess this is not what you want. > 1. While the above proposal feels like a hack to me, I'd like to ask if there > is any other (smarter) way to enable simultaneous computations? i don't fully understand why you actually need simultaneous computations. the trivial answer is of course to do the simultaneous computation in a single object... and handle "simultaneousity" on the patch-level rather than the object-level. > > 2. Given my proposal is worth to be tried, how would I get to know the "first > of the coupled objects"? Is there a way to get the timestamp of the current > DSP iteration, so that I can determine when to calculate all buffers? there's a non-public, non-exported function "ugen_getsortno()" which is used for this very purpose in d_delay.c depending on your linker, you might be able to use it anyhow (note that it must be called in the _dsp() callback) fgamdr IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From martin.peach at sympatico.ca Mon Mar 9 15:57:58 2009 From: martin.peach at sympatico.ca (Martin Peach) Date: Mon, 09 Mar 2009 14:57:58 +0000 Subject: [PD] Simultaneous Computation In-Reply-To: <49B5216E.5020502@styleliga.org> Message-ID: Hannes Gr?ulerwrote: >Hi all, > >I'm new to Pd and I'm looking for some hints on implementing a DSP >external. >I want to implement an external which is capable of simultaneous >calculation >of 2 or more coupled instances of it. > >On the signal level, this is not possible, because the construction of the >DSP >tree forbids feedback loops. > >Another way to achieve simultaneous computation of coupled objects is the >following: The coupled objects exchange their adresses via pointer >messages. >Now, when the signal of the first of the coupled objects is about to be >computed it should also calculate all coupled objects and store each result >in a buffer. When the DSP-perform on of the remaining objects is called, >it simply copies the buffer its outlet. > >1. While the above proposal feels like a hack to me, I'd like to ask if >there > is any other (smarter) way to enable simultaneous computations? > >2. Given my proposal is worth to be tried, how would I get to know the >"first > of the coupled objects"? Is there a way to get the timestamp of the >current > DSP iteration, so that I can determine when to calculate all buffers? > Maybe if you have two inlets and two outlets on each object and you chain the objects like this: [audio in] |\______ | [*~ 0] | | [parallel~] | | [parallel~] | | [parallel~] | [audio out] The first inlet just passes the audio block through to the first outlet. The second inlet receives the buffer block from the previous stage. The object does its processing on the raw audio block and modifies the buffer block. The entire chain will be executed once per audio block. Of course if all you are doing is adding to the buffer you can just connect all the objects to the same inlet. Martin From matju at artengine.ca Mon Mar 9 18:09:12 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2009 13:09:12 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] documentation sprint WAS: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: References: <1236214369.7483.13.camel@danoT500> <7223A0F4-49DA-421E-8FFB-7324EF1246C2@eds.org> <1236294414.8960.0.camel@danoT500> <49B109A4.9050909@umatic.nl> <49B152BE.2000703@umatic.nl> <49B156CF.7000203@umatic.nl> Message-ID: On Sun, 8 Mar 2009, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > Yes, that is good. We could have a documentation sprint at the next > PdCon. I think we should have something like a 5 hour session where we > just sit and work on documentation. We are also trying to organize a > FLOSSmanuals Pd book sprint, probably NYC, but also other locations as > well. The more the merrier! If this is to be a scheduled sprint, then watch out for the scheduling... and for any impromptus and accidents. For example, at last convention, all the artist-talks of the exhibition where scheduled at the same time as the sprint, and all of DorkBot-Montr?al was scheduled at the same time as the sprint as well. I'm pretty sure I recall that an extra roundtable was improvised at the same time as the sprint too, which was also at the same time as the artist talks. It doesn't stop there: in the morning, there was an outage of the Angrignon line because of a crack in boulevard de Maisonneuve, so all papers of the morning had to be postponed by over 30 minutes and then you have to account for the time it takes to walk to SAT, so, in practice, my last paper overlapped with three other things. To top it off, I discovered that there was an extra pd performance (by Sylvie Ch?nard) that was completely outside of the convention, and to walk there in time I had to leave before the scheduled end of the sprint. So if you want to get serious work done on the documentation, perhaps you could stretch some time at the end of the convention while nothing else is scheduled, or secure enough time for it in the convention, and I mean real time, not just something happening at the same time as everything else. Five hours won't be enough, even if the sprint is really sprinting. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From matju at artengine.ca Mon Mar 9 18:25:36 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2009 13:25:36 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] documentation sprint WAS: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: References: <1236214369.7483.13.camel@danoT500> <7223A0F4-49DA-421E-8FFB-7324EF1246C2@eds.org> <1236294414.8960.0.camel@danoT500> <49B109A4.9050909@umatic.nl> <49B152BE.2000703@umatic.nl> <49B156CF.7000203@umatic.nl> Message-ID: On Mon, 9 Mar 2009, Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > For example, at last convention, all the artist-talks of the exhibition where > scheduled at the same time as the sprint, and all of DorkBot-Montr?al was > scheduled at the same time as the sprint as well. I'm pretty sure I recall > that an extra roundtable was improvised at the same time as the sprint too, > which was also at the same time as the artist talks. It doesn't stop there: > in the morning, there was an outage of the Angrignon line because of a crack > in boulevard de Maisonneuve, so all papers of the morning had to be postponed > by over 30 minutes and then you have to account for the time it takes to walk > to SAT, so, in practice, my last paper overlapped with three other things. To > top it off, I discovered that there was an extra pd performance (by Sylvie > Ch?nard) that was completely outside of the convention, and to walk there in > time I had to leave before the scheduled end of the sprint. I forgot: the vernissage of pd works at PFOAC was also running from 14:30 to 17:00, thus overlapping both the artist talks and all of dorkbot, and thus the sprint overlapped it completely, and again it took some walking to get there and back. I went to several conferences in which almost any talk was scheduled at the same time as several others, but it's not the same: in those events, i never really felt the need to be attending several different things at once. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From hans at eds.org Mon Mar 9 23:32:04 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2009 18:32:04 -0400 Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended Message-ID: <1A6ACCDE-8D0F-4094-B979-16919791C754@eds.org> There is a object in iemlib called [output~], and its currently the default object called [output~]. All of Miller's sound examples use an included object called [output~]. So if you save one of those examples to a different folder, then open it, that patch will then have [iemlib/output~] instead of Miller's. This is very confusing to many people, so I'd like to try to remedy the situation. The question is how... - make Miller's output~ an object in extra, and make it the default output~ - replace [output~] in those patches with something like rradical/ ezdac~ in the build process - other ideas? .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- http://at.or.at/hans/ From hans at eds.org Mon Mar 9 23:38:20 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2009 18:38:20 -0400 Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: <1A6ACCDE-8D0F-4094-B979-16919791C754@eds.org> References: <1A6ACCDE-8D0F-4094-B979-16919791C754@eds.org> Message-ID: On Mar 9, 2009, at 6:32 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > There is a object in iemlib called [output~], and its currently the > default object called [output~]. All of Miller's sound examples use > an included object called [output~]. So if you save one of those > examples to a different folder, then open it, that patch will then > have [iemlib/output~] instead of Miller's. This is very confusing > to many people, so I'd like to try to remedy the situation. The > question is how... > > - make Miller's output~ an object in extra, and make it the default > output~ > - replace [output~] in those patches with something like rradical/ > ezdac~ in the build process > - other ideas? Or perhaps a better idea: make a better version combining output~, ezdac~, and pddp/dsp into a nice pure pd controller, include it as a standard object in extra, then lobby Miller to accept changes to make it the default output object for all the included doc patches. Fixing this would a huge help to newbies. .hc > > > .hc > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > http://at.or.at/hans/ > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- There is no way to peace, peace is the way. -A.J. Muste From abonnements at revolwear.com Mon Mar 9 23:59:23 2009 From: abonnements at revolwear.com (Max) Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2009 23:59:23 +0100 Subject: [PD] change for symbols Message-ID: is there something like [change] for symbols? m. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: PGP.sig Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 194 bytes Desc: Signierter Teil der Nachricht URL: From kyleklip at gmail.com Tue Mar 10 00:08:02 2009 From: kyleklip at gmail.com (Kyle Klipowicz) Date: Mon, 9 Mar 2009 18:08:02 -0500 Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: References: <1A6ACCDE-8D0F-4094-B979-16919791C754@eds.org> Message-ID: +1 I love [ezdac~]. If there's an output patch that's better, I'd like to see it! ~Kyle On Mon, Mar 9, 2009 at 5:38 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > On Mar 9, 2009, at 6:32 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > > > > There is a object in iemlib called [output~], and its currently the > > default object called [output~]. All of Miller's sound examples use > > an included object called [output~]. So if you save one of those > > examples to a different folder, then open it, that patch will then > > have [iemlib/output~] instead of Miller's. This is very confusing > > to many people, so I'd like to try to remedy the situation. The > > question is how... > > > > - make Miller's output~ an object in extra, and make it the default > > output~ > > - replace [output~] in those patches with something like rradical/ > > ezdac~ in the build process > > - other ideas? > > Or perhaps a better idea: make a better version combining output~, > ezdac~, and pddp/dsp into a nice pure pd controller, include it as a > standard object in extra, then lobby Miller to accept changes to make > it the default output object for all the included doc patches. > > Fixing this would a huge help to newbies. > > .hc > > > > > > > .hc > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > http://at.or.at/hans/ > > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > There is no way to peace, peace is the way. -A.J. Muste > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -- ----- ------------ ---- ----- ---- -------- - ------ http://perhapsidid.wordpress.com http://myspace.com/kyleklipowicz -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jack at rybn.org Tue Mar 10 00:19:04 2009 From: jack at rybn.org (Jack) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 00:19:04 +0100 Subject: [PD] change for symbols In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <62DBFA50-D4E6-4F78-9327-45A1474E2E43@rybn.org> hello, A small abstraction for your problem here. Beware, your first symbol should not be 'aqwxsz' (you can change it in the abstraction). ++ Jack -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... 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Name: symbolChange-help.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 269 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- Le 9 mars 09 ? 23:59, Max a ?crit : > is there something like [change] for symbols? > > m. > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/ > listinfo/pd-list From jack at rybn.org Tue Mar 10 00:54:03 2009 From: jack at rybn.org (Jack) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 00:54:03 +0100 Subject: [PD] change for symbols In-Reply-To: <62DBFA50-D4E6-4F78-9327-45A1474E2E43@rybn.org> References: <62DBFA50-D4E6-4F78-9327-45A1474E2E43@rybn.org> Message-ID: <73D18E58-AB32-4145-AEF5-C7EF41CA727D@rybn.org> Oops, a small error in the name of the abstraction. ++ Jack -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... 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Name: symbolChange-help.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 269 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- Le 10 mars 09 ? 00:19, Jack a ?crit : > hello, > > A small abstraction for your problem here. > Beware, your first symbol should not be 'aqwxsz' (you can change it > in the abstraction). > ++ > > Jack > > Le 9 mars 09 ? 23:59, Max a ?crit : > >> is there something like [change] for symbols? >> >> m. >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/ >> listinfo/pd-list > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/ > listinfo/pd-list From hard.off at gmail.com Tue Mar 10 03:45:25 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 11:45:25 +0900 Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: References: <1A6ACCDE-8D0F-4094-B979-16919791C754@eds.org> Message-ID: <161320dd0903091945n56a19a93tcfea7c6dc17dd6e7@mail.gmail.com> a very simple solution would be to use a subpatch instead of an abstraction in the help files. [pd output~] this would also remedy the problem reported more often: "why doesn't the output~ object work when i copy the help files to my desktop?" -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From fbar at footils.org Tue Mar 10 08:02:04 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 08:02:04 +0100 Subject: [PD] pd~.abstraction to make pd~ more like pd In-Reply-To: <7aaf8bb90903090512k7c97c354tcb6ca2fed537e913@mail.gmail.com> References: <7aaf8bb90903090512k7c97c354tcb6ca2fed537e913@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090310070204.GA11213@fliwatut.scifi> Hallo, Luke Iannini hat gesagt: // Luke Iannini wrote: > Thanks to IOhannes for testargs and FBar for list-l2s - those made the > (purepd) argument hackery possible. Quick remark: You maybe want to update your copy of list-l2s: The most recent one uses [makefilename %g] instead of [makefilename %d]. Ciao -- Frank Barknecht Do You RjDj.me? _ ______footils.org__ From fbar at footils.org Tue Mar 10 08:06:27 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 08:06:27 +0100 Subject: [PD] change for symbols In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20090310070627.GB11213@fliwatut.scifi> Hallo, Max hat gesagt: // Max wrote: > is there something like [change] for symbols? [select] ? See attachment. Ciao -- Frank Barknecht Do You RjDj.me? _ ______footils.org__ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: symbol-change.pd Type: application/puredata Size: 404 bytes Desc: not available URL: From jack at rybn.org Tue Mar 10 11:07:44 2009 From: jack at rybn.org (Jack) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 11:07:44 +0100 Subject: [PD] change for symbols In-Reply-To: <20090310070627.GB11213@fliwatut.scifi> References: <20090310070627.GB11213@fliwatut.scifi> Message-ID: <6D875E59-BE56-45FD-AFA4-25E782BFFDB1@rybn.org> Yep, simple and nice. ++ Jack Le 10 mars 09 ? 08:06, Frank Barknecht a ?crit : > Hallo, > Max hat gesagt: // Max wrote: > >> is there something like [change] for symbols? > > [select] ? See attachment. > > Ciao > -- > Frank Barknecht Do You RjDj.me? _ > ______footils.org__ change.pd>_______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/ > listinfo/pd-list From ggkarman at musicologia.com Tue Mar 10 12:58:28 2009 From: ggkarman at musicologia.com (Gregorio G. Karman) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 12:58:28 +0100 (CET) Subject: [PD] partconv optimization Message-ID: <47919.217.66.32.101.1236686308.squirrel@mail.musicologia.com> hello, I would appreciate knowing if the build of partconv~ v0.2 included in 0.40.3-extended-macosx104 is currently taking advantage of sse optimization? thanks Gregorio -- Gregorio Garc?a Karman Runzstra?e 71. 79102 Freiburg - Germany home: 0049 (0)761 2852 808 office: 0049 (0)761 3808 276 handy: 0049 (0)1515 3292 098 From cgclepper at gmail.com Tue Mar 10 13:36:54 2009 From: cgclepper at gmail.com (chris clepper) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 08:36:54 -0400 Subject: [PD] partconv optimization In-Reply-To: <47919.217.66.32.101.1236686308.squirrel@mail.musicologia.com> References: <47919.217.66.32.101.1236686308.squirrel@mail.musicologia.com> Message-ID: Ben tried to write an SSE version of the convolution routine, but did not get a working one. As I recall the problem is that SSE lacks a critical operation to make it efficient (or perhaps even possible) to run as vector code. You can always just set the compiler flags to the extreme levels and see if that helps. I wrote Altivec code for partconv~ a few years ago, and built a PPC version with an optimized FFTW, but I don't know if that is what is included with pd-extended or not. I guess if you can load it on Intel machines it is running a more generic version. FFTW needs to have at least an architecture, or ideally a CPU, specific build to run well. On Tue, Mar 10, 2009 at 7:58 AM, Gregorio G. Karman < ggkarman at musicologia.com> wrote: > hello, > > I would appreciate knowing if the build of partconv~ v0.2 included in > 0.40.3-extended-macosx104 is currently taking advantage of sse > optimization? > > thanks > > Gregorio > -- > Gregorio Garc?a Karman > Runzstra?e 71. > 79102 Freiburg - Germany > home: 0049 (0)761 2852 808 > office: 0049 (0)761 3808 276 > handy: 0049 (0)1515 3292 098 > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mbutubuntu at yahoo.it Tue Mar 10 14:32:19 2009 From: mbutubuntu at yahoo.it (mbutubuntu) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 14:32:19 +0100 Subject: [PD] Pd on MIPS Message-ID: <49B66BE3.2040707@yahoo.it> hello everyone!! I'm going to buy an embedded motherboard with a MIPS CPU, does someone compiled and tested PureData on a similar architecture?? thanks Fabio Buda From st.scholl at live.de Tue Mar 10 15:18:35 2009 From: st.scholl at live.de (steffen scholl) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 15:18:35 +0100 Subject: [PD] max/msp/jitter projects In-Reply-To: <3BF78D3F-CE3A-4355-A749-90C005695584@craque.net> References: <5D6893E1-F9B1-491E-BF81-2FB3C0CF61B4@anechoicmedia.com> <3BF78D3F-CE3A-4355-A749-90C005695584@craque.net> Message-ID: hello, i m writing my phd about Max/MSP/Jitter and i m looking for interesting projects realized with this "autor-sytem" in the domain of live-electronic-music... thanks in advance,steffen _________________________________________________________________ http://redirect.gimas.net/?n=M0903xSearchVideo Videosuche - Ganz einfach mit der Live Search -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hans at eds.org Tue Mar 10 18:08:02 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 13:08:02 -0400 Subject: [PD] max/msp/jitter projects In-Reply-To: References: <5D6893E1-F9B1-491E-BF81-2FB3C0CF61B4@anechoicmedia.com> <3BF78D3F-CE3A-4355-A749-90C005695584@craque.net> Message-ID: <59EC697F-29F9-4E1A-AEFC-1DA99C4D37BD@eds.org> The Pd list has nothing to do with max/msp, please don't post such things here. If you want to know about Pd, then it is the right place. .hc On Mar 10, 2009, at 10:18 AM, steffen scholl wrote: > > > > hello, i m writing my phd about Max/MSP/Jitter and i m looking for > interesting projects realized with this "autor-sytem" in the domain > of live-electronic-music... > > thanks in advance, > steffen > > > > Promo machen f?r deine Party. Im neuen Live Messenger. Hier > kostenlos downloaden!_______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- You can't steal a gift. Bird gave the world his music, and if you can hear it, you can have it. - Dizzy Gillespie -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hans at eds.org Tue Mar 10 18:11:39 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 13:11:39 -0400 Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903091945n56a19a93tcfea7c6dc17dd6e7@mail.gmail.com> References: <1A6ACCDE-8D0F-4094-B979-16919791C754@eds.org> <161320dd0903091945n56a19a93tcfea7c6dc17dd6e7@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <58A25F57-1CBA-4BB8-BFC4-43012B0C3F0C@eds.org> On Mar 9, 2009, at 10:45 PM, hard off wrote: > a very simple solution would be to use a subpatch instead of an > abstraction in the help files. > > > [pd output~] Yeah, some of them have a subpatch. > this would also remedy the problem reported more often: "why > doesn't the output~ object work when i copy the help files to my > desktop?" Having a abstraction in "extra" would also solve this problem. I think that we can make [ezdac~] better by adding the db numbox and mute function from Miller's [output~], and the green/white toggle from [pddp/dsp]. .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Programs should be written for people to read, and only incidentally for machines to execute. - from Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs From hans at eds.org Tue Mar 10 18:14:24 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 13:14:24 -0400 Subject: [PD] partconv optimization In-Reply-To: References: <47919.217.66.32.101.1236686308.squirrel@mail.musicologia.com> Message-ID: <9959A53F-1BFE-4AF2-9A43-E0FA8DEAD509@eds.org> I think the mac/fink builds of FFTW do use SSE2, since that is the minimum that a Mac/Intel has. I believe SSE2 is required to run Mac/ Intel. As for more optimizations, I would like to turn those on for the whole Pd-extended builds, but the strict-aliasing errors need to be fixed in order to do that. If you want to make this happen quicker, you could check the archives about the strict aliasing errors, and submit fixes to the patch tracker. .hc On Mar 10, 2009, at 8:36 AM, chris clepper wrote: > Ben tried to write an SSE version of the convolution routine, but > did not get a working one. As I recall the problem is that SSE > lacks a critical operation to make it efficient (or perhaps even > possible) to run as vector code. You can always just set the > compiler flags to the extreme levels and see if that helps. > > I wrote Altivec code for partconv~ a few years ago, and built a PPC > version with an optimized FFTW, but I don't know if that is what is > included with pd-extended or not. I guess if you can load it on > Intel machines it is running a more generic version. FFTW needs to > have at least an architecture, or ideally a CPU, specific build to > run well. > > > > On Tue, Mar 10, 2009 at 7:58 AM, Gregorio G. Karman > wrote: > hello, > > I would appreciate knowing if the build of partconv~ v0.2 included in > 0.40.3-extended-macosx104 is currently taking advantage of sse > optimization? > > thanks > > Gregorio > -- > Gregorio Garc?a Karman > Runzstra?e 71. > 79102 Freiburg - Germany > home: 0049 (0)761 2852 808 > office: 0049 (0)761 3808 276 > handy: 0049 (0)1515 3292 098 > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Man has survived hitherto because he was too ignorant to know how to realize his wishes. Now that he can realize them, he must either change them, or perish. -William Carlos Williams -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hans at eds.org Tue Mar 10 18:15:03 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 13:15:03 -0400 Subject: [PD] Pd on MIPS In-Reply-To: <49B66BE3.2040707@yahoo.it> References: <49B66BE3.2040707@yahoo.it> Message-ID: Do you mean ARM? Or really MIPS? There are packages for ARM embedded linux machines as part of the pd-anywhere project: http://sf.net/projects/pd-anywhere .hc On Mar 10, 2009, at 9:32 AM, mbutubuntu wrote: > hello everyone!! > I'm going to buy an embedded motherboard with a MIPS CPU, does someone > compiled and tested PureData on a similar architecture?? > > thanks > > Fabio Buda > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- There is no way to peace, peace is the way. -A.J. Muste From hans at eds.org Tue Mar 10 18:16:15 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 13:16:15 -0400 Subject: [PD] change for symbols In-Reply-To: <6D875E59-BE56-45FD-AFA4-25E782BFFDB1@rybn.org> References: <20090310070627.GB11213@fliwatut.scifi> <6D875E59-BE56-45FD-AFA4-25E782BFFDB1@rybn.org> Message-ID: <78663733-9446-442F-B4F0-29577BB9E72C@eds.org> Sounds handy, but it would be nice to have [change] directly support symbols... .hc On Mar 10, 2009, at 6:07 AM, Jack wrote: > Yep, simple and nice. > ++ > > Jack > > > Le 10 mars 09 ? 08:06, Frank Barknecht a ?crit : > >> Hallo, >> Max hat gesagt: // Max wrote: >> >>> is there something like [change] for symbols? >> >> [select] ? See attachment. >> >> Ciao >> -- >> Frank Barknecht Do You RjDj.me? _ >> ______footils.org__> change.pd>_______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/ >> listinfo/pd-list > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- All mankind is of one author, and is one volume; when one man dies, one chapter is not torn out of the book, but translated into a better language; and every chapter must be so translated.... -John Donne From timvets at gmail.com Tue Mar 10 19:12:40 2009 From: timvets at gmail.com (tim vets) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 19:12:40 +0100 Subject: [PD] change for symbols In-Reply-To: <78663733-9446-442F-B4F0-29577BB9E72C@eds.org> References: <20090310070627.GB11213@fliwatut.scifi> <6D875E59-BE56-45FD-AFA4-25E782BFFDB1@rybn.org> <78663733-9446-442F-B4F0-29577BB9E72C@eds.org> Message-ID: 2009/3/10 Hans-Christoph Steiner > > Sounds handy, but it would be nice to have [change] directly support > symbols... > > .hc > > > On Mar 10, 2009, at 6:07 AM, Jack wrote: > > Yep, simple and nice. >> ++ >> >> Jack >> >> >> Le 10 mars 09 ? 08:06, Frank Barknecht a ?crit : >> >> Hallo, >>> Max hat gesagt: // Max wrote: >>> >>> is there something like [change] for symbols? >>>> >>> >>> [select] ? See attachment. >>> >>> Ciao >>> -- Frank Barknecht Do You RjDj.me? _ >>> >> Hi, there's also [nchange] (maxlib) gr, Tim -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mbutubuntu at yahoo.it Tue Mar 10 19:34:06 2009 From: mbutubuntu at yahoo.it (mbutubuntu) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 19:34:06 +0100 Subject: [PD] Pd on MIPS In-Reply-To: References: <49B66BE3.2040707@yahoo.it> Message-ID: <49B6B29E.2040107@yahoo.it> I mean really MIPS, but does pd-anywhere support all pd externals??? If I need zexy may I be able to compile it and will zexy run on pd-anywhere??? Thanks Fabio Buda Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > Do you mean ARM? Or really MIPS? There are packages for ARM embedded > linux machines as part of the pd-anywhere project: > > http://sf.net/projects/pd-anywhere > > .hc > > On Mar 10, 2009, at 9:32 AM, mbutubuntu wrote: > >> hello everyone!! >> I'm going to buy an embedded motherboard with a MIPS CPU, does someone >> compiled and tested PureData on a similar architecture?? >> >> thanks >> >> Fabio Buda >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > There is no way to peace, peace is the way. -A.J. Muste > > > From adrian.goya at gmail.com Tue Mar 10 19:48:57 2009 From: adrian.goya at gmail.com (adrian goya) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 12:48:57 -0600 Subject: [PD] [GEM] pix_video, firewire, and linux ? Message-ID: <2b3b19680903101148p67a90a3cl9d27348fe2f347da@mail.gmail.com> Hello to all. I'm having problems trying to connect a unibrain's fire-i firewire board camera in GEM. When I send a [driver 1( message and then [device /dev/video1394/0( to pix_video i get : initializing: Inappropriate ioctl for device If I send [driver 0( message I get get capabilities: Inappropriate ioctl for device The camera works under coriander no problem. I use it with openFrameworks also. It doesn't work with dvgrab. http://www.unibrain.com/Products/Vision ? e_i_BC.htm A sony minidv firewire camera does work with pix_video however. Since my Debian system is a mess I downloaded pure:dyne's leek and potato to test the camera and had the same results. The miso version gave the same results. Does anyone have any idea how to fix this? I've searched the mail archives and every resource I could think of. I'm new to linux so maybe I'm missing some basic stuff. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Debian lenny/sid. Kernel 2.6.24 thankyou. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From stffn at dibidut.dk Tue Mar 10 19:50:00 2009 From: stffn at dibidut.dk (Steffen Juul) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 19:50:00 +0100 Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: <58A25F57-1CBA-4BB8-BFC4-43012B0C3F0C@eds.org> References: <1A6ACCDE-8D0F-4094-B979-16919791C754@eds.org> <161320dd0903091945n56a19a93tcfea7c6dc17dd6e7@mail.gmail.com> <58A25F57-1CBA-4BB8-BFC4-43012B0C3F0C@eds.org> Message-ID: <966A603E-9392-40E3-BE65-E29731616CE0@dibidut.dk> On 10/03/2009, at 18.11, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > (...) and the green/white toggle from [pddp/dsp]. I quite strongly think [cvn]'s tricks should be avoided in help patches, especially those default for vanilla objects. Reason being it took me quite some time before i got heads and tails of it. Before that, it was a total mystery. Such mysteries are bad for learning since it may well obstruct learning of basic things. There is enough syntax to get into when starting to learn Pd. From florian.m at coolux-us.com Tue Mar 10 20:17:16 2009 From: florian.m at coolux-us.com (florian mosleh) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 12:17:16 -0700 Subject: [PD] sprintf and netsend for comma delimited UDP data Message-ID: <49B6BCBC.3040101@coolux-us.com> Hello, I already posted this to the forum, so I hope it's no foible to post it here as well... I am building a connector for PD to communicate with an external application running on another system. I am using netsend to craft UDP packets that the remote application can parse for actions. The payload is supposed to look sort of like this: (STRING,STRING,INTEGER,INTEGER,STRING,INTEGER) Initially I was unable to get commas into the netsend stream because PD uses commas as in internal delimiter. I was able to circumvent this by using the cyclone external's 'sprintf' function. Like this: |44| | |send (STRING%cSTRING%cINTEGER%cINTEGER%cSTRING%cINTEGER) | | |netsend| this almost works, except that pd inserts whitespace characters after the commas, which the remote application doesn't understand. I noticed that 'print' actually puts a space before and after the commas, whereas netsend (or sprintf) only puts one after the commas. Does anyone know how to circumvent this behavior? Or, perhaps a simpler way to achieve what I am trying to do? Thank you. Florian -- :[ flo ]: There is something you must understand about the Soviet system. They have the ability to concentrate all their efforts on a given design, and develop all components simulateously, but sometimes without proper testing. Then they end up with a technological disaster like the Tu-144. In a technology race at the time, that aircraft was two months ahead of the Concorde. Four Tu-144s were built; two have crashed, and two are in museums. The Concorde has been flying safely for over 10 years. -- Victor Belenko, MiG-25 fighter pilot who defected in 1976 "Defense Electronics", Vol 20, No. 6, pg. 100 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hans at eds.org Tue Mar 10 23:27:07 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 18:27:07 -0400 Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: <966A603E-9392-40E3-BE65-E29731616CE0@dibidut.dk> References: <1A6ACCDE-8D0F-4094-B979-16919791C754@eds.org> <161320dd0903091945n56a19a93tcfea7c6dc17dd6e7@mail.gmail.com> <58A25F57-1CBA-4BB8-BFC4-43012B0C3F0C@eds.org> <966A603E-9392-40E3-BE65-E29731616CE0@dibidut.dk> Message-ID: <6AA70944-BE2B-4084-8C81-A934E53C1369@eds.org> On Mar 10, 2009, at 2:50 PM, Steffen Juul wrote: > > On 10/03/2009, at 18.11, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > >> (...) and the green/white toggle from [pddp/dsp]. > > > I quite strongly think [cvn]'s tricks should be avoided in help > patches, especially those default for vanilla objects. > > Reason being it took me quite some time before i got heads and tails > of it. Before that, it was a total mystery. Such mysteries are bad > for learning since it may well obstruct learning of basic things. > There is enough syntax to get into when starting to learn Pd. I agree that the patch should be conceptually simple, but usability is also a concern. Many newbies are hung up because they can't get the example patches to do anything. A lot of the time, that's because they haven't turned up the audio. If it is encapsulated in an object, then the complexity is hidden until you want to see it. Same idea with a osc~. The osc~ C code is far more complex. .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- kill your television From martin.peach at sympatico.ca Tue Mar 10 23:56:42 2009 From: martin.peach at sympatico.ca (Martin Peach) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 18:56:42 -0400 Subject: [PD] sprintf and netsend for comma delimited UDP data In-Reply-To: <49B6BCBC.3040101@coolux-us.com> References: <49B6BCBC.3040101@coolux-us.com> Message-ID: florian mosleh wrote: > Hello, > > I already posted this to the forum, so I hope it's no foible to post > it here as well... > > I am building a connector for PD to communicate with an external > application running on another system. I am using netsend to craft UDP > packets that the remote application can parse for actions. The payload > is supposed to look sort of like this: > (STRING,STRING,INTEGER,INTEGER,STRING,INTEGER) > > Initially I was unable to get commas into the netsend stream because PD > uses commas as in internal delimiter. I was able to circumvent this by > using the cyclone external's 'sprintf' function. Like this: > > |44| > | > |send (STRING%cSTRING%cINTEGER%cINTEGER%cSTRING%cINTEGER) | > | > |netsend| > > this almost works, except that pd inserts whitespace characters after > the commas, which the remote application doesn't understand. > > I noticed that 'print' actually puts a space before and after the > commas, whereas netsend (or sprintf) only puts one after the commas. > > Does anyone know how to circumvent this behavior? Or, perhaps a simpler > way to achieve what I am trying to do? > If you're using pd-extended you could use [any2string] to convert to lists of (ASCII) floats and [udpsend] to send the list of floats. Also the [str] object might work as a way to convert symbols into lists of ASCII characters. Martin From maredmo at gmail.com Wed Mar 11 00:56:23 2009 From: maredmo at gmail.com (Mario Mora) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 20:56:23 -0300 Subject: [PD] [GEM] pix_video, firewire, and linux ? In-Reply-To: <2b3b19680903101148p67a90a3cl9d27348fe2f347da@mail.gmail.com> References: <2b3b19680903101148p67a90a3cl9d27348fe2f347da@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: pure:dyne never has worked with firewire for me, but i have used dyne:bolic with firewire with great results, but i have tested only audio, dyne:bolic has GEM and i have used flawessly but not tried capturing video by firewire yet. Maybe you can try using dyne:bolic and using the "modules" of pure:dyne for puredata and GEM so you can get a newer version than dyne:bolic has inside, that's the way i have used pd+gem in dybe:bolic with no problems so far 2009/3/10 adrian goya > Hello to all. > > I'm having problems trying to connect a unibrain's fire-i firewire board > camera in GEM. When I send a [driver 1( message and then [device > /dev/video1394/0( to pix_video i get : > > initializing: Inappropriate ioctl for device > > If I send [driver 0( message I get > > get capabilities: Inappropriate ioctl for device > > The camera works under coriander no problem. I use it with openFrameworks > also. It doesn't work with dvgrab. http://www.unibrain.com/Products/Vision > ? e_i_BC.htm > > A sony minidv firewire camera does work with pix_video however. > > Since my Debian system is a mess I downloaded pure:dyne's leek and potato > to test the camera and had the same results. The miso version gave the same > results. > > Does anyone have any idea how to fix this? I've searched the mail archives > and every resource I could think of. I'm new to linux so maybe I'm missing > some basic stuff. Any help would be greatly appreciated. > > Debian lenny/sid. Kernel 2.6.24 > > thankyou. > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 11 01:11:34 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 20:11:34 -0400 Subject: [PD] FFT and curve3d? Message-ID: Anyone know of a patch that maps an FFT over time to something like a curve3d in Gem? I remember a while back people posted something like that, but I can't find it. .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- All mankind is of one author, and is one volume; when one man dies, one chapter is not torn out of the book, but translated into a better language; and every chapter must be so translated.... -John Donne From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 11 01:17:05 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 20:17:05 -0400 Subject: [PD] xbee reading for Pd Message-ID: <8AB5CA65-97C8-492A-9670-E2FE63F1535F@eds.org> In case anyone wants to read data from an xbee in Pd, here's a pd that does it, converted from a Max patch: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: xbee_io_reader.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 15977 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- "[W]e have invented the technology to eliminate scarcity, but we are deliberately throwing it away to benefit those who profit from scarcity." -John Gilmore From claudiusmaximus at goto10.org Wed Mar 11 01:37:44 2009 From: claudiusmaximus at goto10.org (Claude Heiland-Allen) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 00:37:44 +0000 Subject: [PD] FFT and curve3d? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49B707D8.2010609@goto10.org> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > Anyone know of a patch that maps an FFT over time to something like a > curve3d in Gem? I remember a while back people posted something like > that, but I can't find it. > > .hc I just knocked the attached together, doesn't use curve3d though.. Claude -- http://claudiusmaximus.goto10.org -------------- next part -------------- An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: fft-curve-gem.pd URL: From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 11 04:44:58 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 23:44:58 -0400 Subject: [PD] FFT and curve3d? In-Reply-To: <49B707D8.2010609@goto10.org> References: <49B707D8.2010609@goto10.org> Message-ID: That's quite nice, you are quite the Gem master. I was thinking of a 3D view that incorporates time. That's where the curve3d comes in. .hc On Mar 10, 2009, at 8:37 PM, Claude Heiland-Allen wrote: > Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >> Anyone know of a patch that maps an FFT over time to something like >> a curve3d in Gem? I remember a while back people posted something >> like that, but I can't find it. >> .hc > > I just knocked the attached together, doesn't use curve3d though.. > > Claude > -- > http://claudiusmaximus.goto10.org > #N canvas 0 0 450 405 10; > #X obj 20 14 adc~; > #X obj 12 108 table \$0-window 1024; > #N canvas 0 0 450 300 \$0-make-window 0; > #X obj 31 18 loadbang; > #X obj 10 19 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 > -1; > #X obj 31 50 f 1024; > #X obj 31 80 until; > #X obj 30 104 f 0; > #X obj 77 101 + 1; > #X obj 77 121 mod 1024; > #X obj 30 156 / 512; > #X obj 30 177 * 3.14159; > #X obj 30 209 cos; > #X obj 30 230 * -0.5; > #X obj 30 256 + 0.5; > #X obj 29 279 tabwrite \$0-window; > #X obj 31 135 t f f; > #X connect 0 0 2 0; > #X connect 1 0 2 0; > #X connect 2 0 3 0; > #X connect 3 0 4 0; > #X connect 4 0 5 0; > #X connect 4 0 13 0; > #X connect 5 0 6 0; > #X connect 6 0 4 1; > #X connect 7 0 8 0; > #X connect 8 0 9 0; > #X connect 9 0 10 0; > #X connect 10 0 11 0; > #X connect 11 0 12 0; > #X connect 13 0 7 0; > #X connect 13 1 12 1; > #X restore 13 80 pd \$0-make-window; > #N canvas 0 238 450 300 \$0-fft-analysis 0; > #X obj 18 18 inlet~; > #X obj 86 121 block~ 1024 4 1; > #X obj 18 67 rfft~; > #X obj 18 98 *~; > #X obj 18 42 *~; > #X obj 45 98 *~; > #X obj 18 124 +~; > #X obj 17 177 sqrt~; > #X obj 65 43 tabreceive~ \$0-window; > #X obj 17 209 tabsend~ \$0-fft; > #X obj 18 151 /~ 1024; > #X connect 0 0 4 0; > #X connect 2 0 3 0; > #X connect 2 0 3 1; > #X connect 2 1 5 0; > #X connect 2 1 5 1; > #X connect 3 0 6 0; > #X connect 4 0 2 0; > #X connect 5 0 6 1; > #X connect 6 0 10 0; > #X connect 7 0 9 0; > #X connect 8 0 4 1; > #X connect 10 0 7 0; > #X restore 27 47 pd \$0-fft-analysis; > #X obj 12 128 table \$0-fft 256; > #X obj 26 234 gemwin; > #X obj 26 189 tgl 15 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1 1 > 1; > #X msg 52 191 create; > #X msg 55 211 destroy; > #X obj 192 27 gemhead; > #X obj 193 61 t a a a; > #X obj 182 90 GEMglEnd; > #X obj 238 89 GEMglBegin; > #X obj 295 62 GLdefine GL_LINES; > #X obj 295 32 loadbang; > #X obj 274 33 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 > -1; > #X obj 211 230 gemlist; > #X obj 212 144 f 256; > #X obj 211 170 until; > #X obj 210 194 t b b; > #X obj 295 192 + 1; > #X obj 212 118 t b b a; > #X obj 278 168 f 0; > #X obj 264 191 f; > #X obj 212 269 GEMglVertex2f; > #X obj 297 242 tabread \$0-fft; > #X obj 212 309 GEMglVertex2f; > #X obj 297 282 * -1; > #X obj 265 217 / 32; > #X obj 263 242 - 4; > #X connect 0 0 3 0; > #X connect 0 1 3 0; > #X connect 6 0 5 0; > #X connect 7 0 5 0; > #X connect 8 0 5 0; > #X connect 9 0 10 0; > #X connect 10 0 11 0; > #X connect 10 1 21 0; > #X connect 10 2 12 0; > #X connect 13 0 12 1; > #X connect 14 0 13 0; > #X connect 15 0 13 0; > #X connect 16 0 24 0; > #X connect 17 0 18 0; > #X connect 18 0 19 0; > #X connect 19 0 16 0; > #X connect 19 1 23 0; > #X connect 20 0 23 1; > #X connect 21 0 17 0; > #X connect 21 1 22 0; > #X connect 21 2 16 1; > #X connect 22 0 23 1; > #X connect 23 0 20 0; > #X connect 23 0 25 0; > #X connect 23 0 28 0; > #X connect 24 0 26 0; > #X connect 25 0 24 2; > #X connect 25 0 27 0; > #X connect 27 0 26 2; > #X connect 28 0 29 0; > #X connect 29 0 24 1; > #X connect 29 0 26 1; ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Programs should be written for people to read, and only incidentally for machines to execute. - from Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs From jaime.oliver2 at gmail.com Wed Mar 11 07:08:26 2009 From: jaime.oliver2 at gmail.com (Jaime Oliver) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 23:08:26 -0700 Subject: [PD] [GEM] pix_video, firewire, and linux ? In-Reply-To: References: <2b3b19680903101148p67a90a3cl9d27348fe2f347da@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <616283880903102308k1bdd6eb9k8391f897cf3eab52@mail.gmail.com> have you tried coriander? I know it is the way to make firewire cameras work in linux using libdc, but had no luck interfacing with gem. it is something I've putting off for a while, J On Tue, Mar 10, 2009 at 4:56 PM, Mario Mora wrote: > pure:dyne never has worked with firewire for me, but i have used dyne:bolic > with firewire with great results, but i have tested only audio, dyne:bolic > has GEM and i have used flawessly but not tried capturing video by firewire > yet. > Maybe you can try using dyne:bolic and using the "modules" of pure:dyne for > puredata and GEM so you can get a newer version than dyne:bolic has inside, > that's the way i have used pd+gem in dybe:bolic with no problems so far > > > 2009/3/10 adrian goya >> >> Hello to all. >> >> I'm having problems trying to connect a unibrain's fire-i firewire board >> camera in GEM. When I send a? ?[driver 1(? ? message and then? ?[device >> /dev/video1394/0(? ?to pix_video i get : >> >> initializing: Inappropriate ioctl for device >> >> If I send [driver 0(? ?message I get >> >> get capabilities: Inappropriate ioctl for device >> >> The camera works under coriander no problem. I use it with openFrameworks >> also. It doesn't work with dvgrab.? http://www.unibrain.com/Products/Vision >> ? e_i_BC.htm >> >> A sony minidv firewire camera does work with pix_video however. >> >> Since my Debian system is a mess I downloaded pure:dyne's leek and potato >> to test the camera and had the same results. The miso version gave the same >> results. >> >> Does anyone have any idea how to fix this? I've searched the mail archives >> and every resource I could think of. I'm new to linux so maybe I'm missing >> some basic stuff. Any help would be greatly appreciated. >> >> Debian lenny/sid. Kernel 2.6.24 >> >> thankyou. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > -- Jaime E Oliver LR joliverl at ucsd.edu www.realidadvisual.org/jaimeoliver www-crca.ucsd.edu/ www.realidadvisual.org 858 202 1522 9168 Regents Rd. Apt. G La Jolla, CA 92037 USA From errordeveloper at gmail.com Wed Mar 11 07:32:32 2009 From: errordeveloper at gmail.com (errordeveloper at gmail.com) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 06:32:32 +0000 Subject: [PD] pdtoblender In-Reply-To: <487F1E51.5010608@mamalala.org> References: <487F1E51.5010608@mamalala.org> Message-ID: <20090311063232.GA19266@00110101.errordevlopment.0> hi me too .. i just started to study blender .. to get to interact with pd is a brilliant idea - i was thinking of 3d visual interfaces to some syhnths would be great! did you make any progerss with pd+blender since that post? i'm quite keen on python ..but seems like it's not very pyhtonie stuff that ..)))) cheers, please keep in touch! -- ilya .d On Thu, Jul 17, 2008 at 12:26:25PM +0200, patrice colet wrote: > Hi, > > I started to learn to use Blender for controlling it with puredata with OSC > protocol, > > I would have been glad to use gamelogic sockets instead but it's poorly > documented and OSC seems more useful in huge project implementations > > Welcome to any kind of comment > > instructions are into blend file > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From stffn at dibidut.dk Wed Mar 11 08:47:45 2009 From: stffn at dibidut.dk (Steffen Juul) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 08:47:45 +0100 Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: <6AA70944-BE2B-4084-8C81-A934E53C1369@eds.org> References: <1A6ACCDE-8D0F-4094-B979-16919791C754@eds.org> <161320dd0903091945n56a19a93tcfea7c6dc17dd6e7@mail.gmail.com> <58A25F57-1CBA-4BB8-BFC4-43012B0C3F0C@eds.org> <966A603E-9392-40E3-BE65-E29731616CE0@dibidut.dk> <6AA70944-BE2B-4084-8C81-A934E53C1369@eds.org> Message-ID: <1FEFF775-4272-4562-8568-1EA0BBBD84AC@dibidut.dk> On 10/03/2009, at 23.27, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > (snip) Many newbies are hung up because they can't get the example > patches to do anything. A lot of the time, that's because they > haven't turned up the audio. So to be precis and to check if i understand you correct: It's the word "dB" that is confusing? - While maybe the word "Vol" or "Volume" might clear it. > If it is encapsulated in an object, then the complexity is hidden > until you want to see it. Same idea with a osc~. The osc~ C code > is far more complex. I don't think that's a fair analogy. I think it's quite clear, and i think most folk will have something like the same feeling, that what is "beneath" osc~ and other things you can type into a object-box such that an object is instantiated is by the syntax in a class of "hidden until I want to see it". Abstractions generate another class and so does subpatches. The to later are maybe in the same class to some. Then comes GOBified abstractions. Then GOBified abstactions that use [cvn] tricks to make a "funky" interface. The syntax of the last is way different from the first and different from the rest too in the way that the syntax is a "graphical design matter". GOP asb inherent syntax from the Pd it passes though, some i don't think that is conceptually that hard. Is this all blahblabbarbar? I agree it's getting hairy. From zmoelnig at iem.at Wed Mar 11 09:24:54 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 09:24:54 +0100 Subject: [PD] Pd on MIPS In-Reply-To: <49B6B29E.2040107@yahoo.it> References: <49B66BE3.2040707@yahoo.it> <49B6B29E.2040107@yahoo.it> Message-ID: <49B77556.7010001@iem.at> mbutubuntu wrote: > I mean really MIPS, but does pd-anywhere support all pd externals??? If > I need zexy may I be able to compile it and will zexy run on pd-anywhere??? > i'm pretty sure it won't (esp. the signal objects). however, it would be nice to have zexy support PDa; so if somebody feels like doing it, i will happily integrate it. fgamr IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From marius.schebella at gmail.com Wed Mar 11 09:27:53 2009 From: marius.schebella at gmail.com (marius schebella) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 09:27:53 +0100 Subject: [PD] FFT and curve3d? In-Reply-To: References: <49B707D8.2010609@goto10.org> Message-ID: <49B77609.50809@gmail.com> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > That's quite nice, you are quite the Gem master. I was thinking of a 3D > view that incorporates time. That's where the curve3d comes in. a quick hack here is to add some feedback (see attached). but I guess you want something more like this http://www.wakayama-u.ac.jp/~kawahara/PSSws/ (grab the videos) marius. > > .hc > > On Mar 10, 2009, at 8:37 PM, Claude Heiland-Allen wrote: > >> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >>> Anyone know of a patch that maps an FFT over time to something like a >>> curve3d in Gem? I remember a while back people posted something like >>> that, but I can't find it. >>> .hc >> >> I just knocked the attached together, doesn't use curve3d though.. >> >> Claude >> -- >> http://claudiusmaximus.goto10.org >> #N canvas 0 0 450 405 10; >> #X obj 20 14 adc~; >> #X obj 12 108 table \$0-window 1024; >> #N canvas 0 0 450 300 \$0-make-window 0; >> #X obj 31 18 loadbang; >> #X obj 10 19 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 >> -1; >> #X obj 31 50 f 1024; >> #X obj 31 80 until; >> #X obj 30 104 f 0; >> #X obj 77 101 + 1; >> #X obj 77 121 mod 1024; >> #X obj 30 156 / 512; >> #X obj 30 177 * 3.14159; >> #X obj 30 209 cos; >> #X obj 30 230 * -0.5; >> #X obj 30 256 + 0.5; >> #X obj 29 279 tabwrite \$0-window; >> #X obj 31 135 t f f; >> #X connect 0 0 2 0; >> #X connect 1 0 2 0; >> #X connect 2 0 3 0; >> #X connect 3 0 4 0; >> #X connect 4 0 5 0; >> #X connect 4 0 13 0; >> #X connect 5 0 6 0; >> #X connect 6 0 4 1; >> #X connect 7 0 8 0; >> #X connect 8 0 9 0; >> #X connect 9 0 10 0; >> #X connect 10 0 11 0; >> #X connect 11 0 12 0; >> #X connect 13 0 7 0; >> #X connect 13 1 12 1; >> #X restore 13 80 pd \$0-make-window; >> #N canvas 0 238 450 300 \$0-fft-analysis 0; >> #X obj 18 18 inlet~; >> #X obj 86 121 block~ 1024 4 1; >> #X obj 18 67 rfft~; >> #X obj 18 98 *~; >> #X obj 18 42 *~; >> #X obj 45 98 *~; >> #X obj 18 124 +~; >> #X obj 17 177 sqrt~; >> #X obj 65 43 tabreceive~ \$0-window; >> #X obj 17 209 tabsend~ \$0-fft; >> #X obj 18 151 /~ 1024; >> #X connect 0 0 4 0; >> #X connect 2 0 3 0; >> #X connect 2 0 3 1; >> #X connect 2 1 5 0; >> #X connect 2 1 5 1; >> #X connect 3 0 6 0; >> #X connect 4 0 2 0; >> #X connect 5 0 6 1; >> #X connect 6 0 10 0; >> #X connect 7 0 9 0; >> #X connect 8 0 4 1; >> #X connect 10 0 7 0; >> #X restore 27 47 pd \$0-fft-analysis; >> #X obj 12 128 table \$0-fft 256; >> #X obj 26 234 gemwin; >> #X obj 26 189 tgl 15 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1 1 >> 1; >> #X msg 52 191 create; >> #X msg 55 211 destroy; >> #X obj 192 27 gemhead; >> #X obj 193 61 t a a a; >> #X obj 182 90 GEMglEnd; >> #X obj 238 89 GEMglBegin; >> #X obj 295 62 GLdefine GL_LINES; >> #X obj 295 32 loadbang; >> #X obj 274 33 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 >> -1; >> #X obj 211 230 gemlist; >> #X obj 212 144 f 256; >> #X obj 211 170 until; >> #X obj 210 194 t b b; >> #X obj 295 192 + 1; >> #X obj 212 118 t b b a; >> #X obj 278 168 f 0; >> #X obj 264 191 f; >> #X obj 212 269 GEMglVertex2f; >> #X obj 297 242 tabread \$0-fft; >> #X obj 212 309 GEMglVertex2f; >> #X obj 297 282 * -1; >> #X obj 265 217 / 32; >> #X obj 263 242 - 4; >> #X connect 0 0 3 0; >> #X connect 0 1 3 0; >> #X connect 6 0 5 0; >> #X connect 7 0 5 0; >> #X connect 8 0 5 0; >> #X connect 9 0 10 0; >> #X connect 10 0 11 0; >> #X connect 10 1 21 0; >> #X connect 10 2 12 0; >> #X connect 13 0 12 1; >> #X connect 14 0 13 0; >> #X connect 15 0 13 0; >> #X connect 16 0 24 0; >> #X connect 17 0 18 0; >> #X connect 18 0 19 0; >> #X connect 19 0 16 0; >> #X connect 19 1 23 0; >> #X connect 20 0 23 1; >> #X connect 21 0 17 0; >> #X connect 21 1 22 0; >> #X connect 21 2 16 1; >> #X connect 22 0 23 1; >> #X connect 23 0 20 0; >> #X connect 23 0 25 0; >> #X connect 23 0 28 0; >> #X connect 24 0 26 0; >> #X connect 25 0 24 2; >> #X connect 25 0 27 0; >> #X connect 27 0 26 2; >> #X connect 28 0 29 0; >> #X connect 29 0 24 1; >> #X connect 29 0 26 1; > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > Programs should be written for people to read, and only incidentally for > machines to execute. > - from Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: fft-curve-gem.pd.zip Type: application/zip Size: 1963 bytes Desc: not available URL: From zmoelnig at iem.at Wed Mar 11 09:29:01 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 09:29:01 +0100 Subject: [PD] FFT and curve3d? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49B7764D.30809@iem.at> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > Anyone know of a patch that maps an FFT over time to something like a > curve3d in Gem? I remember a while back people posted something like > that, but I can't find it. [pix_sig2pix~] was originally created by gg to create waterfall diagrams in combination with [imageVert]. [pix_sig2pix~] has changed a bit since then which requires to use heavy overlapping in order to produce waterfall diagrams. iirc there was a thread about this a couple of years ago. fgas,drt IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From zmoelnig at iem.at Wed Mar 11 09:42:04 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 09:42:04 +0100 Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: <966A603E-9392-40E3-BE65-E29731616CE0@dibidut.dk> References: <1A6ACCDE-8D0F-4094-B979-16919791C754@eds.org> <161320dd0903091945n56a19a93tcfea7c6dc17dd6e7@mail.gmail.com> <58A25F57-1CBA-4BB8-BFC4-43012B0C3F0C@eds.org> <966A603E-9392-40E3-BE65-E29731616CE0@dibidut.dk> Message-ID: <49B7795C.3010507@iem.at> Steffen Juul wrote: > > On 10/03/2009, at 18.11, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > >> (...) and the green/white toggle from [pddp/dsp]. > > > I quite strongly think [cvn]'s tricks should be avoided in help patches, > especially those default for vanilla objects. what are "[cnv]'s tricks"? setting their colour? i wouldn't call it a trick, as it is one of the few things you can actually do with a cnv. (a trick would probably be to set the send/receive labels at runtime; which really makes patches rather unreadably; another trick would be to move objects around to make GOPs be polymorphic; i agree that simple every-day objects should probably avoid such things; i still don't see any trick in setting the colour of a canvas or the value of a numberbox) > > Reason being it took me quite some time before i got heads and tails of > it. Before that, it was a total mystery. Such mysteries are bad for > learning since it may well obstruct learning of basic things. There is > enough syntax to get into when starting to learn Pd. but myteries unveiled are good for learning. so it boils down to in-line documentation of the mysteries used. fgmasdr IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From zmoelnig at iem.at Wed Mar 11 09:54:40 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 09:54:40 +0100 Subject: [PD] [GEM] pix_video, firewire, and linux ? In-Reply-To: <616283880903102308k1bdd6eb9k8391f897cf3eab52@mail.gmail.com> References: <2b3b19680903101148p67a90a3cl9d27348fe2f347da@mail.gmail.com> <616283880903102308k1bdd6eb9k8391f897cf3eab52@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49B77C50.2080104@iem.at> Jaime Oliver wrote: > have you tried coriander? > I know it is the way to make firewire cameras work in linux using > libdc, but had no luck interfacing with gem. it is something I've > putting off for a while, it seems like i don't have any device that properly works with coriander. however, from what i read, coriander can create a videoloopback device which can then be used by Gem as an ordinary "v4l" device. have you tried that? if it doesn't work, how does it fail? fgmadr IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr Wed Mar 11 09:57:55 2009 From: cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr (cyrille henry) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 09:57:55 +0100 Subject: [PD] FFT and curve3d? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49B77D13.8050609@la-kitchen.fr> curve3d will be to slow. here is mine, made with openGL primitive. like Claude one, but with a log for the frequency + a time filter for the curve to be better. i think the best would be to add some feedback effect to create a kind of 3d effect. c Hans-Christoph Steiner a ?crit : > > Anyone know of a patch that maps an FFT over time to something like a > curve3d in Gem? I remember a while back people posted something like > that, but I can't find it. > > .hc > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > All mankind is of one author, and is one volume; when one man dies, one > chapter is not torn out of the book, but translated into a better > language; and every chapter must be so translated.... -John Donne > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -------------- next part -------------- An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: gem_spectrum.pd URL: From jaime.oliver2 at gmail.com Wed Mar 11 10:02:22 2009 From: jaime.oliver2 at gmail.com (Jaime Oliver) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 02:02:22 -0700 Subject: [PD] [GEM] pix_video, firewire, and linux ? In-Reply-To: <49B77C50.2080104@iem.at> References: <2b3b19680903101148p67a90a3cl9d27348fe2f347da@mail.gmail.com> <616283880903102308k1bdd6eb9k8391f897cf3eab52@mail.gmail.com> <49B77C50.2080104@iem.at> Message-ID: <616283880903110202m69c93189g629c27dcbfeb30db@mail.gmail.com> Well, I'll send the details as soon as i get a hand of the computer where i use it. >From what I remember, I expected to find the device in /video0 and when I sent pix_video the dev /video0 I did't get an error message, but I did't get an image either. When I try /video1 however i get device doesn't exist or similar message. I should get back to you with more precise errors soon. J On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 1:54 AM, IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: > Jaime Oliver wrote: >> >> have you tried coriander? >> I know it is the way to make firewire cameras work in linux using >> libdc, but had no luck interfacing with gem. it is something I've >> putting off for a while, > > it seems like i don't have any device that properly works with coriander. > however, from what i read, coriander can create a videoloopback device which > can then be used by Gem as an ordinary "v4l" device. > > have you tried that? > if it doesn't work, how does it fail? > > fgmadr > IOhannes > -- Jaime E Oliver LR joliverl at ucsd.edu www.realidadvisual.org/jaimeoliver www-crca.ucsd.edu/ www.realidadvisual.org 858 202 1522 9168 Regents Rd. Apt. G La Jolla, CA 92037 USA From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 11 15:29:18 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 10:29:18 -0400 Subject: [PD] xbee reading for Pd In-Reply-To: <351100D2-7BCB-4958-954D-48DAC96AA45F@cs.tcd.ie> References: <8AB5CA65-97C8-492A-9670-E2FE63F1535F@eds.org> <351100D2-7BCB-4958-954D-48DAC96AA45F@cs.tcd.ie> Message-ID: Hey, If you are using xbees with arduinos, then you want this, then you can just use the Pduino [arduino] object to get the data from it. http://michaelclemow.com/?p=296 That patch was for getting data straight from the xbee without an arduino. I've never used an xbee, I was just helping some people get it working with Pd, so I can't really give any advice on how to use them. .hc On Mar 11, 2009, at 6:21 AM, nicholas ward wrote: > Hi Hans, > Excellent timing. I was just about to order some xbee shields for > arduinos. I was wondering what xbee hardware you went for? I know > very little about xbee but need to set up a network of 8 agents and > thought this could be the way to go. > If you had anymore details that would be great. > All the best > Nick > > > On 11 Mar 2009, at 00:17, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > >> >> In case anyone wants to read data from an xbee in Pd, here's a pd >> that does it, converted from a Max patch: >> >> >> >> .hc >> >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> "[W]e have invented the technology to eliminate scarcity, but we >> are deliberately throwing it away to benefit those who profit from >> scarcity." -John Gilmore >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > Nicholas Ward, Ph.D Student > Sonic Arts Research Centre > Queens University Belfast > Northern Ireland > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- All mankind is of one author, and is one volume; when one man dies, one chapter is not torn out of the book, but translated into a better language; and every chapter must be so translated.... -John Donne -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rorywalsh at ear.ie Wed Mar 11 15:45:45 2009 From: rorywalsh at ear.ie (Rory Walsh) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 14:45:45 +0000 Subject: [PD] dynamic creation arguments for route Message-ID: <80ace1a10903110745y5b412b21nad266e33850132f0@mail.gmail.com> Is is possible to dynamically alter the creation arguments for a route object? I'm currently building a patch that receives OSC messages which I want to parse using route. Each relevant message I would like to grab starts with a unique integer ID. I would like to pass this unique ID to my route object each time the ID changes so that I can retrieve the data which follows it. Any ideas? Rory. From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 11 15:49:35 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 10:49:35 -0400 Subject: [PD] FFT and curve3d? In-Reply-To: <49B77D13.8050609@la-kitchen.fr> References: <49B77D13.8050609@la-kitchen.fr> Message-ID: I was thinking more about the look of it, rather than the speed of it. Any of you mind if I turn these into Gem examples and commit them? .hc On Mar 11, 2009, at 4:57 AM, cyrille henry wrote: > curve3d will be to slow. > > here is mine, made with openGL primitive. > like Claude one, but with a log for the frequency + a time filter > for the curve to be better. > > i think the best would be to add some feedback effect to create a > kind of 3d effect. > > c > > > Hans-Christoph Steiner a ?crit : >> Anyone know of a patch that maps an FFT over time to something like >> a curve3d in Gem? I remember a while back people posted something >> like that, but I can't find it. >> .hc >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- All >> mankind is of one author, and is one volume; when one man dies, >> one chapter is not torn out of the book, but translated into a >> better language; and every chapter must be so translated.... -John >> Donne >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > #N canvas 830 500 450 300 10; > #N canvas 607 37 645 663 osc~ 0; > #X obj 12 133 pack~; > #X obj 14 7 inlet~; > #X text 269 6 change block size; > #X msg 77 379 0; > #X obj 47 403 f; > #X obj 63 428 + 1; > #X obj 17 379 t a b; > #X obj 16 245 gemhead; > #X text 72 7 audio input; > #X obj 13 29 rfft~; > #X obj 13 51 *~; > #X obj 53 53 *~; > #X obj 173 6 block~ 4096 4; > #X obj 12 75 /~ 4096; > #X obj 12 95 log~; > #X obj 12 114 *~ 0.05; > #X obj 12 152 list prepend 0; > #X obj 12 173 s \$0-fft; > #X obj 172 26 table \$0-fft 2048; > #X obj 172 46 table \$0-fft-lop 2048; > #X obj 401 13 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 > -1; > #X obj 401 31 t b b; > #X obj 400 71 until; > #X msg 401 52 2048; > #X msg 443 74 0; > #X obj 400 96 f; > #X obj 415 119 + 1; > #X obj 400 163 tabread \$0-fft; > #X obj 494 163 tabread \$0-fft-lop; > #X obj 400 213 +; > #X obj 400 256 tabwrite \$0-fft-lop; > #X obj 400 138 t f f f; > #X obj 424 7 bang~; > #X obj 400 235 / 8; > #X obj 495 187 * 7; > #X obj 77 494 tabread \$0-fft-lop; > #X obj 30 589 loadbang; > #X obj 47 451 t f f; > #X obj 98 591 l; > #X obj 22 224 tgl 15 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1 0 > 1; > #X obj 97 560 t l b; > #X obj 18 659 curve 2; > #X obj 46 519 pack f f f; > #X floatatom 36 296 5 0 0 0 - - -; > #X floatatom 78 297 5 0 0 0 - - -; > #X obj 17 334 t a b; > #X floatatom 72 250 5 0 0 0 - - -; > #X floatatom 114 251 5 0 0 0 - - -; > #X obj 17 358 repeat 2048; > #X obj 14 277 translateXYZ -4 0 0; > #X obj 47 471 log; > #X obj 17 314 scaleXYZ 1.04 6 0; > #X msg 30 611 res 2; > #X connect 0 0 16 0; > #X connect 1 0 9 0; > #X connect 3 0 4 0; > #X connect 4 0 5 0; > #X connect 4 0 37 0; > #X connect 5 0 4 1; > #X connect 6 0 41 0; > #X connect 6 1 4 0; > #X connect 7 0 49 0; > #X connect 9 0 10 0; > #X connect 9 0 10 1; > #X connect 9 1 11 0; > #X connect 9 1 11 1; > #X connect 10 0 13 0; > #X connect 11 0 13 0; > #X connect 13 0 14 0; > #X connect 14 0 15 0; > #X connect 15 0 0 0; > #X connect 16 0 17 0; > #X connect 20 0 21 0; > #X connect 21 0 23 0; > #X connect 21 1 24 0; > #X connect 22 0 25 0; > #X connect 23 0 22 0; > #X connect 24 0 25 1; > #X connect 25 0 26 0; > #X connect 25 0 31 0; > #X connect 26 0 25 1; > #X connect 27 0 29 0; > #X connect 28 0 34 0; > #X connect 29 0 33 0; > #X connect 31 0 27 0; > #X connect 31 1 28 0; > #X connect 31 2 30 1; > #X connect 32 0 21 0; > #X connect 33 0 30 0; > #X connect 34 0 29 1; > #X connect 35 0 42 1; > #X connect 36 0 52 0; > #X connect 37 0 50 0; > #X connect 37 1 35 0; > #X connect 38 0 41 2; > #X connect 39 0 7 0; > #X connect 40 0 38 1; > #X connect 40 1 38 0; > #X connect 42 0 40 0; > #X connect 42 0 41 1; > #X connect 43 0 51 1; > #X connect 44 0 51 2; > #X connect 45 0 48 0; > #X connect 45 1 3 0; > #X connect 46 0 49 1; > #X connect 47 0 49 2; > #X connect 48 0 6 0; > #X connect 49 0 51 0; > #X connect 50 0 42 0; > #X connect 51 0 45 0; > #X connect 52 0 41 0; > #X restore 138 152 pd osc~; > #X msg 301 135 reset \, create \, 1; > #X msg 307 157 0 \, destroy; > #X floatatom 137 50 5 0 0 0 - - -; > #X obj 301 179 gemwin 60; > #X msg 299 97 \; pd dsp 1 \;; > #X obj 153 120 osc~ 333; > #X obj 137 98 osc~ 3333; > #X obj 137 73 mtof; > #X floatatom 177 79 9 0 0 0 - - -; > #X obj 77 102 adc~; > #X connect 1 0 4 0; > #X connect 2 0 4 0; > #X connect 3 0 8 0; > #X connect 8 0 7 0; > #X connect 8 0 9 0; > #X connect 10 0 0 0; > #X connect 10 1 0 0; ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- There is no way to peace, peace is the way. -A.J. Muste From zmoelnig at iem.at Wed Mar 11 16:10:28 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 16:10:28 +0100 Subject: [PD] dynamic creation arguments for route In-Reply-To: <80ace1a10903110745y5b412b21nad266e33850132f0@mail.gmail.com> References: <80ace1a10903110745y5b412b21nad266e33850132f0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49B7D464.50709@iem.at> Rory Walsh wrote: > Is is possible to dynamically alter the creation arguments for a route > object? no. (i general it is not possible to dynamically alter the creation arguments of any object :-)) > I'm currently building a patch that receives OSC messages > which I want to parse using route. Each relevant message I would like > to grab starts with a unique integer ID. I would like to pass this > unique ID to my route object each time the ID changes so that I can > retrieve the data which follows it. Any ideas? you can build abstractions that behave almost like settable routes. you can also desing your application differently. mfgasdr IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: froute.pd URL: -------------- next part -------------- An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: sroute.pd URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From martin.peach at sympatico.ca Wed Mar 11 16:09:17 2009 From: martin.peach at sympatico.ca (Martin Peach) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 15:09:17 +0000 Subject: [PD] dynamic creation arguments for route In-Reply-To: <80ace1a10903110745y5b412b21nad266e33850132f0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Rory Walsh wrote: >Is is possible to dynamically alter the creation arguments for a route >object? I'm currently building a patch that receives OSC messages >which I want to parse using route. Each relevant message I would like >to grab starts with a unique integer ID. I would like to pass this >unique ID to my route object each time the ID changes so that I can >retrieve the data which follows it. Any ideas? > [mrpeach/routeOSC] can do that. Martin From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 11 16:12:59 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 11:12:59 -0400 Subject: [PD] last call for gsoc mentors Message-ID: <9DF373BD-36D1-42C8-AD98-0BA9158C3EA8@eds.org> Hey, I am going to submit the application today, it turns out it is due on the 13th, the app opened on the 9th. Everyone got their gmail accounts listed on the app? http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/GSoCOrganizationApp2009 .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- "[W]e have invented the technology to eliminate scarcity, but we are deliberately throwing it away to benefit those who profit from scarcity." -John Gilmore From mbutubuntu at yahoo.it Wed Mar 11 16:40:41 2009 From: mbutubuntu at yahoo.it (mbutubuntu) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 16:40:41 +0100 Subject: [PD] Pd on MIPS In-Reply-To: <49B77556.7010001@iem.at> References: <49B66BE3.2040707@yahoo.it> <49B6B29E.2040107@yahoo.it> <49B77556.7010001@iem.at> Message-ID: <49B7DB79.8050409@yahoo.it> IOhannes, the MIPS doesn't have an FPU but the linux kernel will emulate it... I think Pd should works also with ~ objects... doesn't it? IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: > mbutubuntu wrote: >> I mean really MIPS, but does pd-anywhere support all pd externals??? >> If I need zexy may I be able to compile it and will zexy run on >> pd-anywhere??? >> > > i'm pretty sure it won't (esp. the signal objects). > however, it would be nice to have zexy support PDa; so if somebody > feels like doing it, i will happily integrate it. > > fgamr > IOhannes From bbakersmith at gmail.com Wed Mar 11 16:58:54 2009 From: bbakersmith at gmail.com (Ben Baker-Smith) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 10:58:54 -0500 Subject: [PD] GEM on Linux netbook Message-ID: I currently use a Macbook (OS 10.5) for all my PD patching. However, as I am primarily focused on using GEM for live video performance alongside musical groups, I am thinking about getting a second laptop for performances (to keep my Macbook safe). I'm thinking of getting an Acer Aspire One netbook running linux. I'd like to know the pros and cons of this. -Will swapping patches between Mac OS and Linux be a problem (I'm guessing no, but I figured I'd ask)? -I've heard of some problems with VGA out on Linux laptops, is this going to be an issue? -Does the netbook have enough processing power for general GEM applications? I'm usually not dealing with video files, but rather particle generation, shape manipulation, GIF texturing, and audio-response. On my Macbook (2.0 GHz intel processor) the CPU meter always shows below 50% usage (of course, that's not to say that it doesn't freeze up and boot me out sometimes). -Are there any other issues that you think of given this scenario? and if so, what other affordable/really-cheap laptops are there out there that I can run linux on? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From adrian.goya at gmail.com Wed Mar 11 17:45:14 2009 From: adrian.goya at gmail.com (adrian goya) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 10:45:14 -0600 Subject: [PD] [GEM] pix_video, firewire, and linux ? In-Reply-To: <616283880903110202m69c93189g629c27dcbfeb30db@mail.gmail.com> References: <2b3b19680903101148p67a90a3cl9d27348fe2f347da@mail.gmail.com> <616283880903102308k1bdd6eb9k8391f897cf3eab52@mail.gmail.com> <49B77C50.2080104@iem.at> <616283880903110202m69c93189g629c27dcbfeb30db@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <2b3b19680903110945i920caaemc1a4eb01d21b904d@mail.gmail.com> The coriander approach sounds like a great idea, this camera works no problem under it and you get total control over its functions. It would be out of my league to try to make that work myself, but I can help with testing if that's of any use. adrian. On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 3:02 AM, Jaime Oliver wrote: > Well, I'll send the details as soon as i get a hand of the computer > where i use it. > > From what I remember, I expected to find the device in /video0 and > when I sent pix_video the dev /video0 I did't get an error message, > but I did't get an image either. When I try /video1 however i get > device doesn't exist or similar message. > > I should get back to you with more precise errors soon. > > J > > On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 1:54 AM, IOhannes m zmoelnig > wrote: > > Jaime Oliver wrote: > >> > >> have you tried coriander? > >> I know it is the way to make firewire cameras work in linux using > >> libdc, but had no luck interfacing with gem. it is something I've > >> putting off for a while, > > > > it seems like i don't have any device that properly works with coriander. > > however, from what i read, coriander can create a videoloopback device > which > > can then be used by Gem as an ordinary "v4l" device. > > > > have you tried that? > > if it doesn't work, how does it fail? > > > > fgmadr > > IOhannes > > > > > > -- > Jaime E Oliver LR > > joliverl at ucsd.edu > www.realidadvisual.org/jaimeoliver > www-crca.ucsd.edu/ > www.realidadvisual.org > > 858 202 1522 > 9168 Regents Rd. Apt. G > La Jolla, CA 92037 > USA > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 11 17:46:51 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 12:46:51 -0400 Subject: [PD] Pd on MIPS In-Reply-To: <49B7DB79.8050409@yahoo.it> References: <49B66BE3.2040707@yahoo.it> <49B6B29E.2040107@yahoo.it> <49B77556.7010001@iem.at> <49B7DB79.8050409@yahoo.it> Message-ID: <4C67DB97-ABA7-4F32-A3D6-9DBCBCB31E83@eds.org> What kind of MIPS is this? Like an old SGI? If so, that should run Linux and Pd with no special tricks. .hc On Mar 11, 2009, at 11:40 AM, mbutubuntu wrote: > IOhannes, the MIPS doesn't have an FPU but the linux kernel will > emulate it... I think Pd should works also with ~ objects... doesn't > it? > > IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: >> mbutubuntu wrote: >>> I mean really MIPS, but does pd-anywhere support all pd >>> externals??? If I need zexy may I be able to compile it and will >>> zexy run on pd-anywhere??? >>> >> >> i'm pretty sure it won't (esp. the signal objects). >> however, it would be nice to have zexy support PDa; so if somebody >> feels like doing it, i will happily integrate it. >> >> fgamr >> IOhannes > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Looking at things from a more basic level, you can come up with a more direct solution... It may sound small in theory, but it in practice, it can change entire economies. - Amy Smith From jaime.oliver2 at gmail.com Wed Mar 11 17:48:11 2009 From: jaime.oliver2 at gmail.com (Jaime Oliver) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 09:48:11 -0700 Subject: [PD] [GEM] pix_video, firewire, and linux ? In-Reply-To: <2b3b19680903110945i920caaemc1a4eb01d21b904d@mail.gmail.com> References: <2b3b19680903101148p67a90a3cl9d27348fe2f347da@mail.gmail.com> <616283880903102308k1bdd6eb9k8391f897cf3eab52@mail.gmail.com> <49B77C50.2080104@iem.at> <616283880903110202m69c93189g629c27dcbfeb30db@mail.gmail.com> <2b3b19680903110945i920caaemc1a4eb01d21b904d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <616283880903110948g6d8f9862id476b6559d9a3a64@mail.gmail.com> do you have coriander working? from what i remember it wasn't that hard to compile or get the libraries. On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 9:45 AM, adrian goya wrote: > The coriander approach sounds like a great idea, this camera works no > problem under it and you get total control over its functions. > It would be out of? my league to try to make that work myself, but I can > help with testing if that's of any use. > > adrian. > > On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 3:02 AM, Jaime Oliver > wrote: >> >> Well, I'll send the details as soon as i get a hand of the computer >> where i use it. >> >> From what I remember, I expected to find the device in /video0 and >> when I sent pix_video the dev /video0 I did't get an error message, >> but I did't get an image either. When I try /video1 however i get >> device doesn't exist or similar message. >> >> I should get back to you with more precise errors soon. >> >> J >> >> On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 1:54 AM, IOhannes m zmoelnig >> wrote: >> > Jaime Oliver wrote: >> >> >> >> have you tried coriander? >> >> I know it is the way to make firewire cameras work in linux using >> >> libdc, but had no luck interfacing with gem. it is something I've >> >> putting off for a while, >> > >> > it seems like i don't have any device that properly works with >> > coriander. >> > however, from what i read, coriander can create a videoloopback device >> > which >> > can then be used by Gem as an ordinary "v4l" device. >> > >> > have you tried that? >> > if it doesn't work, how does it fail? >> > >> > fgmadr >> > IOhannes >> > >> >> >> >> -- >> Jaime E Oliver LR >> >> joliverl at ucsd.edu >> www.realidadvisual.org/jaimeoliver >> www-crca.ucsd.edu/ >> www.realidadvisual.org >> >> 858 202 1522 >> 9168 Regents Rd. Apt. G >> La Jolla, CA 92037 >> USA >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > -- Jaime E Oliver LR joliverl at ucsd.edu www.realidadvisual.org/jaimeoliver www-crca.ucsd.edu/ www.realidadvisual.org 858 202 1522 9168 Regents Rd. Apt. G La Jolla, CA 92037 USA From cgclepper at gmail.com Wed Mar 11 17:49:24 2009 From: cgclepper at gmail.com (chris clepper) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 12:49:24 -0400 Subject: [PD] GEM on Linux netbook In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Linux the Nvidia GPU is the way to go for GEM. You could probably get acceptable performance for basic GEM use from the Acer, but what takes most of the CPU to do with the Intel GMA processor barely taxes a modern GPU. For example, I have measured performance between a MacBook/Mac Mini and MacBook Pro where the Pro was 40x faster because of the GPU! There are netbooks with NV chips in them, but they cost a little more: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834220385 cgc On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 11:58 AM, Ben Baker-Smith wrote: > I currently use a Macbook (OS 10.5) for all my PD patching. However, as I > am primarily focused on using GEM for live video performance alongside > musical groups, I am thinking about getting a second laptop for performances > (to keep my Macbook safe). > > I'm thinking of getting an Acer Aspire One netbook running linux. > > I'd like to know the pros and cons of this. > > -Will swapping patches between Mac OS and Linux be a problem (I'm guessing > no, but I figured I'd ask)? > > -I've heard of some problems with VGA out on Linux laptops, is this going > to be an issue? > > -Does the netbook have enough processing power for general GEM > applications? I'm usually not dealing with video files, but rather particle > generation, shape manipulation, GIF texturing, and audio-response. On my > Macbook (2.0 GHz intel processor) the CPU meter always shows below 50% usage > (of course, that's not to say that it doesn't freeze up and boot me out > sometimes). > > -Are there any other issues that you think of given this scenario? and if > so, what other affordable/really-cheap laptops are there out there that I > can run linux on? > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From zmoelnig at iem.at Wed Mar 11 17:55:35 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 17:55:35 +0100 Subject: [PD] Pd on MIPS In-Reply-To: <49B7DB79.8050409@yahoo.it> References: <49B66BE3.2040707@yahoo.it> <49B6B29E.2040107@yahoo.it> <49B77556.7010001@iem.at> <49B7DB79.8050409@yahoo.it> Message-ID: <49B7ED07.7080906@iem.at> mbutubuntu wrote: > IOhannes, the MIPS doesn't have an FPU but the linux kernel will emulate > it... I think Pd should works also with ~ objects... doesn't it? yes of course; and there is no reason why zexy should not work with that. however for PDanywhere (which i know that you are not using), zexy would have to be adapted, and i would like to have these changes (preferably without too much work) fgamsdr IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From adrian.goya at gmail.com Wed Mar 11 18:01:33 2009 From: adrian.goya at gmail.com (adrian goya) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 11:01:33 -0600 Subject: [PD] [GEM] pix_video, firewire, and linux ? In-Reply-To: <616283880903110948g6d8f9862id476b6559d9a3a64@mail.gmail.com> References: <2b3b19680903101148p67a90a3cl9d27348fe2f347da@mail.gmail.com> <616283880903102308k1bdd6eb9k8391f897cf3eab52@mail.gmail.com> <49B77C50.2080104@iem.at> <616283880903110202m69c93189g629c27dcbfeb30db@mail.gmail.com> <2b3b19680903110945i920caaemc1a4eb01d21b904d@mail.gmail.com> <616283880903110948g6d8f9862id476b6559d9a3a64@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <2b3b19680903111001j130b40f4k613d28f350c8d1c3@mail.gmail.com> I have coriander in the debian machine, I configured that computer about 8 months ago, left it in an expo and only got it back this week, so details about how I got it working are gone from my memory. However, in pure:dyne's leek&potato livecd a basic apt-get install coriander will get it working. On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 10:48 AM, Jaime Oliver wrote: > do you have coriander working? > from what i remember it wasn't that hard to compile or get the libraries. > > On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 9:45 AM, adrian goya > wrote: > > The coriander approach sounds like a great idea, this camera works no > > problem under it and you get total control over its functions. > > It would be out of my league to try to make that work myself, but I can > > help with testing if that's of any use. > > > > adrian. > > > > On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 3:02 AM, Jaime Oliver > > wrote: > >> > >> Well, I'll send the details as soon as i get a hand of the computer > >> where i use it. > >> > >> From what I remember, I expected to find the device in /video0 and > >> when I sent pix_video the dev /video0 I did't get an error message, > >> but I did't get an image either. When I try /video1 however i get > >> device doesn't exist or similar message. > >> > >> I should get back to you with more precise errors soon. > >> > >> J > >> > >> On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 1:54 AM, IOhannes m zmoelnig > >> wrote: > >> > Jaime Oliver wrote: > >> >> > >> >> have you tried coriander? > >> >> I know it is the way to make firewire cameras work in linux using > >> >> libdc, but had no luck interfacing with gem. it is something I've > >> >> putting off for a while, > >> > > >> > it seems like i don't have any device that properly works with > >> > coriander. > >> > however, from what i read, coriander can create a videoloopback device > >> > which > >> > can then be used by Gem as an ordinary "v4l" device. > >> > > >> > have you tried that? > >> > if it doesn't work, how does it fail? > >> > > >> > fgmadr > >> > IOhannes > >> > > >> > >> > >> > >> -- > >> Jaime E Oliver LR > >> > >> joliverl at ucsd.edu > >> www.realidadvisual.org/jaimeoliver > >> www-crca.ucsd.edu/ > >> www.realidadvisual.org > >> > >> 858 202 1522 > >> 9168 Regents Rd. Apt. G > >> La Jolla, CA 92037 > >> USA > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > > > > -- > Jaime E Oliver LR > > joliverl at ucsd.edu > www.realidadvisual.org/jaimeoliver > www-crca.ucsd.edu/ > www.realidadvisual.org > > 858 202 1522 > 9168 Regents Rd. Apt. G > La Jolla, CA 92037 > USA > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From derek at umatic.nl Wed Mar 11 18:55:21 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 18:55:21 +0100 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching Message-ID: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> Would like to show some examples of dynamic and self-modifying Pd patches during a workshop here in Berlin. I know there are some in the archives (and maybe on people's HDs) somewhere, but damned if I can find them. Links to previkous posts or new examples welcome! best! Derek -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 163: "Turn it upside down" From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 11 19:47:44 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 14:47:44 -0400 Subject: [PD] [PD-announce] Hack Yer iPod! in Liverpool, March 12th thru 17th Message-ID: <7F2A6B66-FF7F-4DCE-87DF-FCCAC9D9AF1F@eds.org> Hey, come join me in Liverpool at FACT and hack your iPod! It starts tomorrow, its pretty last minute, we have dates, but the times aren't ironed out yet. Where: http://fact.co.uk/ in Liverpool, England When: March 12th thru 17th (check the website for times) Have an iPod you want to repurpose into a hackable music machine? Install iPodLinux and make music with Pd! Want to play Doom on your iPod Video? Come install Rockbox! Did your trusty iPod?s battery finally die, or disk give in? Come and break open your iPod, either the software, the hardware or both. Give it new life and new purpose. Also, we have on hand our stash of old iPods for harvesting parts, and the newfound skills for frankensteining dead iPods into living ones. Join Hans-Christoph Steiner and Chris ?the Widget? DiMauro with your own iPod, or try your hand to see if you can create a living one from our pile. This workshop is a place to get exposed to the possibilities. We?ve been hacking on some iPods to see what?s possible. Lots of this software is kind of raw, but you can do lots of fun stuff now. We are just getting started, we are having fun exploring the options. Now we want to help you do the same. Check out our web page to see if your devices are supported: http://dev.eyebeam.org/projects/reware/wiki/FactWorkshop .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Access to computers should be unlimited and total. - the hacker ethic _______________________________________________ Pd-announce mailing list Pd-announce at iem.at http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-announce From algoritmia at labormedia.cl Wed Mar 11 20:04:32 2009 From: algoritmia at labormedia.cl (Correa Diego) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 16:04:32 -0300 Subject: [PD] [PD-announce] Hack Yer iPod! in Liverpool, March 12th thru 17th In-Reply-To: <7F2A6B66-FF7F-4DCE-87DF-FCCAC9D9AF1F@eds.org> References: <7F2A6B66-FF7F-4DCE-87DF-FCCAC9D9AF1F@eds.org> Message-ID: <6c92874b0903111204w731de382n49babc184b795860@mail.gmail.com> Pens? que le pod?a interesar a tu gente. saludos, Diego 2009/3/11 Hans-Christoph Steiner > > Hey, come join me in Liverpool at FACT and hack your iPod! It starts > tomorrow, its pretty last minute, we have dates, but the times aren't ironed > out yet. > > Where: http://fact.co.uk/ in Liverpool, England > When: March 12th thru 17th (check the website for times) > > Have an iPod you want to repurpose into a hackable music machine? Install > iPodLinux and make music with Pd! Want to play Doom on your iPod Video? Come > install Rockbox! Did your trusty iPod?s battery finally die, or disk give > in? Come and break open your iPod, either the software, the hardware or > both. Give it new life and new purpose. Also, we have on hand our stash of > old iPods for harvesting parts, and the newfound skills for frankensteining > dead iPods into living ones. Join Hans-Christoph Steiner and Chris ?the > Widget? DiMauro with your own iPod, or try your hand to see if you can > create a living one from our pile. > > This workshop is a place to get exposed to the possibilities. We?ve been > hacking on some iPods to see what?s possible. Lots of this software is kind > of raw, but you can do lots of fun stuff now. We are just getting started, > we are having fun exploring the options. Now we want to help you do the > same. > > Check out our web page to see if your devices are supported: > http://dev.eyebeam.org/projects/reware/wiki/FactWorkshop > > .hc > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Access to computers should be unlimited and total. - the hacker ethic > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-announce mailing list > Pd-announce at iem.at > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-announce > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From algoritmia at labormedia.cl Wed Mar 11 20:04:54 2009 From: algoritmia at labormedia.cl (Correa Diego) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 16:04:54 -0300 Subject: [PD] [PD-announce] Hack Yer iPod! in Liverpool, March 12th thru 17th In-Reply-To: <7F2A6B66-FF7F-4DCE-87DF-FCCAC9D9AF1F@eds.org> References: <7F2A6B66-FF7F-4DCE-87DF-FCCAC9D9AF1F@eds.org> Message-ID: <6c92874b0903111204l770ef292j30d11511ce24bca@mail.gmail.com> Pens? que le pod?a interesar a tu gente. saludos, Diego 2009/3/11 Hans-Christoph Steiner > > Hey, come join me in Liverpool at FACT and hack your iPod! It starts > tomorrow, its pretty last minute, we have dates, but the times aren't ironed > out yet. > > Where: http://fact.co.uk/ in Liverpool, England > When: March 12th thru 17th (check the website for times) > > Have an iPod you want to repurpose into a hackable music machine? Install > iPodLinux and make music with Pd! Want to play Doom on your iPod Video? Come > install Rockbox! Did your trusty iPod?s battery finally die, or disk give > in? Come and break open your iPod, either the software, the hardware or > both. Give it new life and new purpose. Also, we have on hand our stash of > old iPods for harvesting parts, and the newfound skills for frankensteining > dead iPods into living ones. Join Hans-Christoph Steiner and Chris ?the > Widget? DiMauro with your own iPod, or try your hand to see if you can > create a living one from our pile. > > This workshop is a place to get exposed to the possibilities. We?ve been > hacking on some iPods to see what?s possible. Lots of this software is kind > of raw, but you can do lots of fun stuff now. We are just getting started, > we are having fun exploring the options. Now we want to help you do the > same. > > Check out our web page to see if your devices are supported: > http://dev.eyebeam.org/projects/reware/wiki/FactWorkshop > > .hc > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Access to computers should be unlimited and total. - the hacker ethic > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-announce mailing list > Pd-announce at iem.at > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-announce > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From arifd86 at gmail.com Wed Mar 11 20:19:13 2009 From: arifd86 at gmail.com (Arif Driessen) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 19:19:13 +0000 Subject: [PD] [PD-announce] Hack Yer iPod! in Liverpool, March 12th thru 17th In-Reply-To: <7F2A6B66-FF7F-4DCE-87DF-FCCAC9D9AF1F@eds.org> References: <7F2A6B66-FF7F-4DCE-87DF-FCCAC9D9AF1F@eds.org> Message-ID: Oh Hans! Why weren't we told sooner!! Train tickets will be ?80 by now. In slightly more positive news, I noticed 'Arduino Hackday' on the 23rd of May! On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 6:47 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > Hey, come join me in Liverpool at FACT and hack your iPod! It starts > tomorrow, its pretty last minute, we have dates, but the times aren't ironed > out yet. > > Where: http://fact.co.uk/ in Liverpool, England > When: March 12th thru 17th (check the website for times) > > Have an iPod you want to repurpose into a hackable music machine? Install > iPodLinux and make music with Pd! Want to play Doom on your iPod Video? Come > install Rockbox! Did your trusty iPod?s battery finally die, or disk give > in? Come and break open your iPod, either the software, the hardware or > both. Give it new life and new purpose. Also, we have on hand our stash of > old iPods for harvesting parts, and the newfound skills for frankensteining > dead iPods into living ones. Join Hans-Christoph Steiner and Chris ?the > Widget? DiMauro with your own iPod, or try your hand to see if you can > create a living one from our pile. > > This workshop is a place to get exposed to the possibilities. We?ve been > hacking on some iPods to see what?s possible. Lots of this software is kind > of raw, but you can do lots of fun stuff now. We are just getting started, > we are having fun exploring the options. Now we want to help you do the > same. > > Check out our web page to see if your devices are supported: > http://dev.eyebeam.org/projects/reware/wiki/FactWorkshop > > .hc > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Access to computers should be unlimited and total. - the hacker ethic > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-announce mailing list > Pd-announce at iem.at > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-announce > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ Pd-announce mailing list Pd-announce at iem.at http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-announce From pkstone at ucdavis.edu Wed Mar 11 20:27:24 2009 From: pkstone at ucdavis.edu (Phil Stone) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 12:27:24 -0700 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> Hi Derek, Maybe a very simple example would be good. I have an Ozone MIDI-controller, and it has eight knobs, which send out continuous controller data on 8 different MIDI CC numbers. Now, [ctlin] (MIDI control input) doesn't have settable arguments -- only creation args., so I racked my brains trying to figure out how to make an object that would take a knob number argument, 1-8, convert that number to the corresponding controller number, and watch that controller number with [ctlin]. (Admittedly, it would have been easy to create [Ozknob1]...[Ozknob8] objects, but this reeked of kludge to my sensibilities; neither did I consider it elegant to use a [ctlin] for each knob that watched *all* controller data, then [route]d the data from the desired control number -- I wanted the pre-filtering to be done by [ctlin], if possible). The more generalized problem is this: take a creation argument of an abstraction, *do something with it*, then get it into the creation argument of a contained abstraction. Nothing I tried worked, until I took the attached dynamic approach. Phil Stone www.pkstonemusic.com Derek Holzer wrote: > Would like to show some examples of dynamic and self-modifying Pd > patches during a workshop here in Berlin. I know there are some in the > archives (and maybe on people's HDs) somewhere, but damned if I can > find them. Links to previkous posts or new examples welcome! > > best! > Derek > -------------- next part -------------- An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: OzKnob.pd URL: From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 11 21:02:02 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 16:02:02 -0400 Subject: [PD] [PD-announce] Hack Yer iPod! in Liverpool, March 12th thru 17th In-Reply-To: References: <7F2A6B66-FF7F-4DCE-87DF-FCCAC9D9AF1F@eds.org> Message-ID: <33B17D80-F77E-4E6C-9935-250F790A4EB7@eds.org> Sorry, its been a little chaotic on my end these past weeks. Maybe they have last minute specials on trains, or rideshares with people with cards. .hc On Mar 11, 2009, at 3:19 PM, Arif Driessen wrote: > Oh Hans! Why weren't we told sooner!! > > Train tickets will be ?80 by now. > > In slightly more positive news, I noticed 'Arduino Hackday' on the > 23rd of May! > > On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 6:47 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner > wrote: > > Hey, come join me in Liverpool at FACT and hack your iPod! It > starts tomorrow, its pretty last minute, we have dates, but the > times aren't ironed out yet. > > Where: http://fact.co.uk/ in Liverpool, England > When: March 12th thru 17th (check the website for times) > > Have an iPod you want to repurpose into a hackable music machine? > Install iPodLinux and make music with Pd! Want to play Doom on your > iPod Video? Come install Rockbox! Did your trusty iPod?s battery > finally die, or disk give in? Come and break open your iPod, either > the software, the hardware or both. Give it new life and new > purpose. Also, we have on hand our stash of old iPods for harvesting > parts, and the newfound skills for frankensteining dead iPods into > living ones. Join Hans-Christoph Steiner and Chris ?the Widget? > DiMauro with your own iPod, or try your hand to see if you can > create a living one from our pile. > > This workshop is a place to get exposed to the possibilities. We?ve > been hacking on some iPods to see what?s possible. Lots of this > software is kind of raw, but you can do lots of fun stuff now. We > are just getting started, we are having fun exploring the options. > Now we want to help you do the same. > > Check out our web page to see if your devices are supported: > http://dev.eyebeam.org/projects/reware/wiki/FactWorkshop > > .hc > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Access to computers should be unlimited and total. - the hacker ethic > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-announce mailing list > Pd-announce at iem.at > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-announce > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-announce mailing list > Pd-announce at iem.at > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-announce > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- As we enjoy great advantages from inventions of others, we should be glad of an opportunity to serve others by any invention of ours; and this we should do freely and generously. - Benjamin Franklin -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 11 21:03:23 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 16:03:23 -0400 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> Message-ID: polypoly and nqpoly4 are good examples. nqpoly4 is in Pd-extended, you can get polypoly here: http://itp.nyu.edu/dataflow/uploads/polypoly.zip .hc On Mar 11, 2009, at 3:27 PM, Phil Stone wrote: > Hi Derek, > > Maybe a very simple example would be good. I have an Ozone MIDI- > controller, and it has eight knobs, which send out continuous > controller data on 8 different MIDI CC numbers. Now, [ctlin] (MIDI > control input) doesn't have settable arguments -- only creation > args., so I racked my brains trying to figure out how to make an > object that would take a knob number argument, 1-8, convert that > number to the corresponding controller number, and watch that > controller number with [ctlin]. > > (Admittedly, it would have been easy to create [Ozknob1]...[Ozknob8] > objects, but this reeked of kludge to my sensibilities; neither did > I consider it elegant to use a [ctlin] for each knob that watched > *all* controller data, then [route]d the data from the desired > control number -- I wanted the pre-filtering to be done by [ctlin], > if possible). > > The more generalized problem is this: take a creation argument of an > abstraction, *do something with it*, then get it into the creation > argument of a contained abstraction. > > Nothing I tried worked, until I took the attached dynamic approach. > > > Phil Stone > www.pkstonemusic.com > > > > Derek Holzer wrote: >> Would like to show some examples of dynamic and self-modifying Pd >> patches during a workshop here in Berlin. I know there are some in >> the archives (and maybe on people's HDs) somewhere, but damned if I >> can find them. Links to previkous posts or new examples welcome! >> >> best! >> Derek >> > > #N canvas 676 96 394 341 10; > #X obj 8 105 21; > #X obj 34 105 22; > #X obj 60 105 23; > #X obj 86 105 24; > #X obj 112 105 25; > #X obj 138 105 26; > #X obj 164 105 27; > #X obj 189 105 28; > #X obj 37 74 select 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8; > #X obj 37 51 f \$1; > #X obj 37 6 loadbang; > #X obj 103 304 outlet; > #X text 8 149 Ozone mapping; > #X msg 237 93 2; > #X text 267 91 channel; > #X obj 37 28 t b b; > #X obj 102 158 pack f f; > #X text 110 16 Use: [OzKnob n] where n is the knob #; > #N canvas 0 22 210 111 \$0-oz_ctrlknob 0; > #X obj 28 72 outlet; > #X restore 103 272 pd \$0-oz_ctrlknob; > #X obj 102 218 s pd-\$0-oz_ctrlknob; > #X msg 102 187 obj 10 10 ctlin \$1 \$2 \, connect 1 0 0 0; > #X connect 0 0 16 0; > #X connect 1 0 16 0; > #X connect 2 0 16 0; > #X connect 3 0 16 0; > #X connect 4 0 16 0; > #X connect 5 0 16 0; > #X connect 6 0 16 0; > #X connect 7 0 16 0; > #X connect 8 0 0 0; > #X connect 8 1 1 0; > #X connect 8 2 2 0; > #X connect 8 3 3 0; > #X connect 8 4 4 0; > #X connect 8 5 5 0; > #X connect 8 6 6 0; > #X connect 8 7 7 0; > #X connect 9 0 8 0; > #X connect 10 0 15 0; > #X connect 13 0 16 1; > #X connect 15 0 9 0; > #X connect 15 1 13 0; > #X connect 16 0 20 0; > #X connect 18 0 11 0; > #X connect 20 0 19 0; > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- You can't steal a gift. Bird gave the world his music, and if you can hear it, you can have it. - Dizzy Gillespie From fbar at footils.org Wed Mar 11 21:26:08 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 21:26:08 +0100 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> Message-ID: <20090311202608.GB4913@footils.org> Hallo, Hans-Christoph Steiner hat gesagt: // Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > polypoly and nqpoly4 are good examples. nqpoly4 is in Pd-extended, you > can get polypoly here: > > http://itp.nyu.edu/dataflow/uploads/polypoly.zip Isn't polypoly also in pd-extended? Anyway the reference location is the pd subversion in: /trunk/abstractions/footils/foo/ Ciao -- Frank From lukexipd at gmail.com Wed Mar 11 23:21:49 2009 From: lukexipd at gmail.com (Luke Iannini) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 15:21:49 -0700 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <7aaf8bb90903111521r6308fe84y76951a48b0f8594b@mail.gmail.com> On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 10:55 AM, Derek Holzer wrote: > Would like to show some examples of dynamic and self-modifying Pd patches > during a workshop here in Berlin. I know there are some in the archives (and > maybe on people's HDs) somewhere, but damned if I can find them. Links to > previkous posts or new examples welcome! Here are a few I've done: [hotpack] (in sfruit/ in pd-extended) dynamically builds a [pack] object along with enough [t b a] objects to make every inlet hot. [deeprouteOSC] (ditto) creates a chain of [routeOSC] objects so you can route something like /synth/filter/cutoff instead of making 3 objects. [troute] (ditto) is a settable [route] object, where you can pass a list to its rightmost inlet to change what its routing. [nsend/nreceive] (in nsend/ in pd-extended) gangs sends together, for when you want to send the output of a multi-output object elsewhere (e.g. [nsend 3 $0.notein] creates an nsend with 3 inlets, and [nreceive 3 $0.notein] creates a corresponding nreceive). [hotpack] and [deeprouteOSC] are probably the best balance of complexity vs. utility. Best Luke > > best! > Derek > > -- > ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: > http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 163: > "Turn it upside down" > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > From matju at artengine.ca Thu Mar 12 01:39:27 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 20:39:27 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <7aaf8bb90903111521r6308fe84y76951a48b0f8594b@mail.gmail.com> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <7aaf8bb90903111521r6308fe84y76951a48b0f8594b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 10:55 AM, Derek Holzer wrote: > Would like to show some examples of dynamic and self-modifying Pd patches > during a workshop here in Berlin. I know there are some in the archives (and > maybe on people's HDs) somewhere, but damned if I can find them. Links to > previous posts or new examples welcome! [#in] and [#out] in GridFlow >= 0.9.2. But make sure to pick the latest, as 0.9.2 was quite buggy. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From potaxpotax at gmail.com Thu Mar 12 01:43:45 2009 From: potaxpotax at gmail.com (potax flan) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 01:43:45 +0100 Subject: [PD] *weird* characters Message-ID: hi using [textfile], i want to concatenate long strings of *unusual* characters (like the "triangle" or Delta character you get by pressing ALT, caps, d). maybe there is an alternative to [textfile]? Is there a way to handle these characters in pd (have them in a message, then add them to textfile would be wonderful)? if i press ALT caps d while editing a message i get an error rectangle ? is it because the font in pd cant deal with the ? sign? can i use ascii codes for this? key gives me 8710 for delta, any way i can use that? thanks -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jack at rybn.org Thu Mar 12 02:00:08 2009 From: jack at rybn.org (Jack) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 02:00:08 +0100 Subject: [PD] [PD-announce] Exhibition in IMAL (Bruxelles/Brussels) Message-ID: Hello list, Our next exhibition at Imal (Bruxelles/Brussels). If you are interested by the subject, you are welcome (and all is made with Pd/GEM). ++ Jack [Fran?ais / English ] Stock Overflow : Recontextualising the Crisis 12 - 31 / 03/ 2009 Exposition & Conf?rences / Exhibition & Conferences Vernissage ce Jeudi 12 ? 18h00 avec conf?rences de Geert Lovink et Florian Schneider d?s 19h00 Opening on Thursday 12, 18:00 with Geert Lovink and Florian Schneider's lectures at 19:00 Stock Overflow est une op?ration propos?e par RYBN pour recontextualiser la crise et les strat?gies politiques et m?diatiques qui l'accompagnent, autour des th?mes de la catastrophe, de l'instabilit? structurelle et des mythologies des march?s. Stock Overflow is an operation proposed by RYBN to recontextualize the crisis, its mediatic and politic strategies, on the topics of disaster, structural instability and financial markets mythologies. WITH / AVEC RYBN, Geert Lovink (net activist and theoretician), Florian Schneider (writer, filmmaker, net activist), Brian Holmes (art critic), Late S. Horace Lawson-Hetchely (information systems consulting), Soci?t? R?aliste (artists), Bertrand Charles (journalist specialized in business intelligence). *EXHIBITION* / *EXPOSITION* ANTIDATAMINING, RYBN 2006-2009 http://www.antidatamining.net Antidatamining est une s?rie de repr?sentations visuelles des donn?es financi?res qui transitent sur internet. L'?conomie contemporaine y est incarn?e par ses principaux acteurs - entreprises, place boursi?res, banques et fonds d'investissement, grands groupes - et par leurs interactions : liens capitalistiques entre les acteurs ?conomiques, d?ploiements g?ographiques, articulation autour des places de march?s. Au-del? de la crise actuelle, de sa m?diatisation et des leviers politiques qu'elle g?n?re, Antidatamining est un dispositif de veille permanente qui tente de mettre en ?vidence la structure de l'?conomie mondiale, envisag?e comme un syst?me dynamique complexe. Antidatamining is a series of visualizations of financial data extracted from the web. Economy is represented by its main agents - companies, groups and holdings, stock exchanges, banks and investment funds - and their interactions : capital relationships, geographic deployments, structuralization on market places. Beyond the current crisis, its mediatic and polictic levers, Antidatamining is a permanent monitoring device, which aims to highlight the structure of the contemporary economy, seen as a complex dynamic system. *CONFERENCES* GEERT LOVINK & FLORIAN SCHNEIDER Net activism and tactical medias / M?dias tactiques et net-activisme Thursday 12 march - 19h / jeudi 12 mars - 19:00 (in english) RYBN & HORACE LATE LAWSON Financial Information systems / Syst?mes d'informations financiers Friday 20 march - 20h / vendredi 20 mars - 20:00 BRIAN HOLMES Ecological domination of financial capitalism / Domination ?cologique du capitalisme financier Wednesday 25 march - 19h / mercredi 25 mars - 19:00 SOCIETE REALISTE & BERTRAND CHARLES Economics subversion / D?tournement ?conomique Friday 27 march - 20h / vendredi 27 mars - 20:00 **** conferences streaming on **** * http://giss.tv:8000/iMAL_live.ogg * http://giss.tv/interface/?mp=iMAL_live.ogg *INFO* Opening Hours: Wednesday -> Sunday 14:00 - 19:00 Heures d'ouverture: Mercredi -> Dimanche 14:00 - 19:0 Vernissage Expo: jeudi 12 mars - 18:00 / Exhibition Opening: Thursday 12 march - 18:00 FEES/TARIFS : EXHIBITION/EXPOSITION 3?, CONFERENCES free/gratuit Avec le soutien de / With the support of : iMAL, Cimatics and Predict-market.biz leader in the field of financial prediction analysis. More on/ Plus d'infos sur: http://www.imal.org/StockOverflow -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ Pd-announce mailing list Pd-announce at iem.at http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-announce From koray.tahiroglu at tkk.fi Thu Mar 12 08:01:33 2009 From: koray.tahiroglu at tkk.fi (Koray Tahiroglu) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 09:01:33 +0200 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <19940_1236798424_ZZ0KGC000FCVRPH6.00_mailman.21.1236798143.705.pd-list@iem.at> References: <19940_1236798424_ZZ0KGC000FCVRPH6.00_mailman.21.1236798143.705.pd-list@iem.at> Message-ID: <0E6AD449-648F-4D50-A807-1C5DB27C5D31@tkk.fi> Hello Derek, enclosed there is OSC multicast dynamic patching example I did during eNTERFACE 07 workshop for our bio-music performance, if you find it useful, you can show it during your workshop. Koray, On Mar 11, 2009, at 9:02 PM, pd-list-request at iem.at wrote: > Message: 3 > Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 18:55:21 +0100 > From: Derek Holzer > Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching > To: pd-list at iem.at > Message-ID: <49B7FB09.4060704 at umatic.nl> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > > Would like to show some examples of dynamic and self-modifying Pd > patches during a workshop here in Berlin. I know there are some in the > archives (and maybe on people's HDs) somewhere, but damned if I can > find > them. Links to previkous posts or new examples welcome! > > best! > Derek > > -- > ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: > http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 163: > "Turn it upside down" ------------------------------------- M.Koray Tahiroglu Acoustics Lab / TKK http://www.acoustics.hut.fi/~ktahirog/ tel: +358 45 233 6272 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: OSC_multicast.zip Type: application/zip Size: 3662 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From abonnements at revolwear.com Thu Mar 12 09:01:15 2009 From: abonnements at revolwear.com (Max) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 16:01:15 +0800 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> Message-ID: <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> the midi controller example is a good one i believe. here is what i did a while ago http://www.netpd.org/Midilearn Am 12.03.2009 um 03:27 schrieb Phil Stone: > Hi Derek, > > Maybe a very simple example would be good. I have an Ozone MIDI- > controller, and it has eight knobs, which send out continuous > controller data on 8 different MIDI CC numbers. Now, [ctlin] (MIDI > control input) doesn't have settable arguments -- only creation > args., so I racked my brains trying to figure out how to make an > object that would take a knob number argument, 1-8, convert that > number to the corresponding controller number, and watch that > controller number with [ctlin]. > > (Admittedly, it would have been easy to create [Ozknob1]...[Ozknob8] > objects, but this reeked of kludge to my sensibilities; neither did > I consider it elegant to use a [ctlin] for each knob that watched > *all* controller data, then [route]d the data from the desired > control number -- I wanted the pre-filtering to be done by [ctlin], > if possible). > > The more generalized problem is this: take a creation argument of an > abstraction, *do something with it*, then get it into the creation > argument of a contained abstraction. > > Nothing I tried worked, until I took the attached dynamic approach. > > > Phil Stone > www.pkstonemusic.com > > > > Derek Holzer wrote: >> Would like to show some examples of dynamic and self-modifying Pd >> patches during a workshop here in Berlin. I know there are some in >> the archives (and maybe on people's HDs) somewhere, but damned if I >> can find them. Links to previkous posts or new examples welcome! >> >> best! >> Derek >> > > #N canvas 676 96 394 341 10; > #X obj 8 105 21; > #X obj 34 105 22; > #X obj 60 105 23; > #X obj 86 105 24; > #X obj 112 105 25; > #X obj 138 105 26; > #X obj 164 105 27; > #X obj 189 105 28; > #X obj 37 74 select 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8; > #X obj 37 51 f \$1; > #X obj 37 6 loadbang; > #X obj 103 304 outlet; > #X text 8 149 Ozone mapping; > #X msg 237 93 2; > #X text 267 91 channel; > #X obj 37 28 t b b; > #X obj 102 158 pack f f; > #X text 110 16 Use: [OzKnob n] where n is the knob #; > #N canvas 0 22 210 111 \$0-oz_ctrlknob 0; > #X obj 28 72 outlet; > #X restore 103 272 pd \$0-oz_ctrlknob; > #X obj 102 218 s pd-\$0-oz_ctrlknob; > #X msg 102 187 obj 10 10 ctlin \$1 \$2 \, connect 1 0 0 0; > #X connect 0 0 16 0; > #X connect 1 0 16 0; > #X connect 2 0 16 0; > #X connect 3 0 16 0; > #X connect 4 0 16 0; > #X connect 5 0 16 0; > #X connect 6 0 16 0; > #X connect 7 0 16 0; > #X connect 8 0 0 0; > #X connect 8 1 1 0; > #X connect 8 2 2 0; > #X connect 8 3 3 0; > #X connect 8 4 4 0; > #X connect 8 5 5 0; > #X connect 8 6 6 0; > #X connect 8 7 7 0; > #X connect 9 0 8 0; > #X connect 10 0 15 0; > #X connect 13 0 16 1; > #X connect 15 0 9 0; > #X connect 15 1 13 0; > #X connect 16 0 20 0; > #X connect 18 0 11 0; > #X connect 20 0 19 0; > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: PGP.sig Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 194 bytes Desc: Signierter Teil der Nachricht URL: From derek at umatic.nl Thu Mar 12 09:47:30 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 09:47:30 +0100 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> Message-ID: <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> Hi all and thanks for chiming in on this thread. There was once, long ago, a simple mixer which dynamically created the busses and channels. If anyone can remember that one, it must have been 5 years ago, and was the first dynamic patch I had ever seen. Also fun, non-utilitarian ones, like once someone sent some kind of "card" to the list which just made a huge self-generating GUI art-mess on the screen. I wish I could remember who wrote it. Lastly, IOhannes showed a very nice self-modifying patch at Piksel last December using iemguts. best! Derek -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 130: "Question the heroic" From zmoelnig at iem.at Thu Mar 12 10:04:57 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 10:04:57 +0100 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> Derek Holzer wrote: > Hi all and thanks for chiming in on this thread. There was once, long > ago, a simple mixer which dynamically created the busses and channels. > If anyone can remember that one, it must have been 5 years ago, and was > the first dynamic patch I had ever seen. could be my "abcde(fg)", the great "ambisonics-based coding and decoding environment (for graz)". you can get it here: http://iem.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/iem/spatialization/abcde/ however, my experiences with abcde were the main reason i s did not touch self-modifying patches for years and years. the lesson i learned was: never do self-modification in patches that other people will ever have to regularily use. (the original phrase would have been "never do self-modification in patches that other people will ever have to maintain"; however, this might give the impression that chances are low that somebody else will really have to "maintain" a patch); in practice you pass maintainership to somebody as soon as you give them your patch: they will eventually start to modify it. having said that, self-modification might work resasonably well with _small_ "atomic" abstractions e.g. implementing a settable [route] via self-modification might be fine, but don't try to do so with core-components of a big application. > > Also fun, non-utilitarian ones, like once someone sent some kind of > "card" to the list which just made a huge self-generating GUI art-mess > on the screen. I wish I could remember who wrote it. Lastly, IOhannes > showed a very nice self-modifying patch at Piksel last December using > iemguts. i'll see what i still have on my disk. being a live-coding session i had not prepared so much "patch" in advance which i could share now... vhmysdrt IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From hard.off at gmail.com Thu Mar 12 10:05:43 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 18:05:43 +0900 Subject: [PD] how to freeze pd Message-ID: <161320dd0903120205o3f206dc0i39061b7c837790b7@mail.gmail.com> * create a subpatch * create an object box in the subpatch, but don't type anything inside the box * go back to the parent patch and convert the subpatch into another object (i tried to make it a [send]) * enjoy pd freeze -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From derek at umatic.nl Thu Mar 12 10:06:01 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 10:06:01 +0100 Subject: [PD] Pd-Extended 0.40.3 + Jack OSX Message-ID: <49B8D079.7010706@umatic.nl> This combination crashes immediately, reproducible every time. I've tried standard the Sourceforge version and also the latest nightly build (Jan 2009). D. -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 142: "Shut the door and listen from outside" From derek at umatic.nl Thu Mar 12 10:15:24 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 10:15:24 +0100 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> Message-ID: <49B8D2AC.9030806@umatic.nl> Thx IOhannes, IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: > Derek Holzer wrote: >> Hi all and thanks for chiming in on this thread. There was once, long >> ago, a simple mixer which dynamically created the busses and channels. >> If anyone can remember that one, it must have been 5 years ago, and >> was the first dynamic patch I had ever seen. > > could be my "abcde(fg)", the great "ambisonics-based coding and decoding > environment (for graz)". > you can get it here: > http://iem.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/iem/spatialization/abcde/ It was something less complex than this I think. Just a mixer with dynamic creation of channels. It was very green, IIRC ;-) D. -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 185: "Which parts can be grouped?" From zmoelnig at iem.at Thu Mar 12 10:30:14 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 10:30:14 +0100 Subject: [PD] how to freeze pd In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903120205o3f206dc0i39061b7c837790b7@mail.gmail.com> References: <161320dd0903120205o3f206dc0i39061b7c837790b7@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49B8D626.7020604@iem.at> hard off wrote: > * create a subpatch > * create an object box in the subpatch, but don't type anything inside the > box > * go back to the parent patch and convert the subpatch into another object > (i tried to make it a [send]) > * enjoy pd freeze isn't this that old and already fixed bug reported in: https://sourceforge.net/tracker2/?func=detail&aid=1191610&group_id=55736&atid=478070 please update your Pd. fmgasdr IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From derek at umatic.nl Thu Mar 12 10:35:15 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 10:35:15 +0100 Subject: [PD] Pd-Extended 0.40.3 + Jack OSX In-Reply-To: <49B8D079.7010706@umatic.nl> References: <49B8D079.7010706@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <49B8D753.9020309@umatic.nl> Situation improves when using latest Pd-Extended 0.41 nightly build + latest JackOSX package. D. Derek Holzer wrote: > This combination crashes immediately, reproducible every time. I've > tried standard the Sourceforge version and also the latest nightly build > (Jan 2009). > > D. > -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 68: "Faced with a choice, do both" From dmotd at gmx.net Thu Mar 12 10:39:12 2009 From: dmotd at gmx.net (dmotd) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 19:39:12 +1000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B8D2AC.9030806@umatic.nl> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> <49B8D2AC.9030806@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <200903121939.13238.dmotd@gmx.net> hey derek.. i've done some hunting on your behalf, and i think i've found what you are referring to.. a patch created by leonard swiezinski in 2002: http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/2002-03/004940.html alas, the link is a 404.. and mr. swiezinski has been inactive for several years. although he does still own the parent site floppy35.de.. markmail.com is useful ;) ciao, dmotd ps.. i have numerous experiments in dyn-pd on old hard-disk-drives.. wouldn't be too difficult to dig through, but i am sure you will find plenty of examples.. On Thursday 12 March 2009 19:15:24 Derek Holzer wrote: > Thx IOhannes, > > IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: > > Derek Holzer wrote: > >> Hi all and thanks for chiming in on this thread. There was once, long > >> ago, a simple mixer which dynamically created the busses and channels. > >> If anyone can remember that one, it must have been 5 years ago, and > >> was the first dynamic patch I had ever seen. > > > > could be my "abcde(fg)", the great "ambisonics-based coding and decoding > > environment (for graz)". > > you can get it here: > > http://iem.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/iem/spatialization/abcde/ > > It was something less complex than this I think. Just a mixer with > dynamic creation of channels. It was very green, IIRC ;-) > > D. From jmmmpais at googlemail.com Thu Mar 12 11:09:46 2009 From: jmmmpais at googlemail.com (=?iso-8859-15?Q?Jo=E3o_Pais?=) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 10:09:46 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> Message-ID: small stuff in the /jmmmp folder (if you have a night build from the last weeks), but more using data structures and namecanvasdialog. maybe not really total dynamic - sliders - pdcolors - there's a color matrix for data-s > Would like to show some examples of dynamic and self-modifying Pd > patches during a workshop here in Berlin. I know there are some in the > archives (and maybe on people's HDs) somewhere, but damned if I can find > them. Links to previkous posts or new examples welcome! > > best! > Derek > -- Friedenstr. 58 10249 Berlin (Deutschland) Tel +49 30 42020091 | Mob +49 162 6843570 jmmmpais at googlemail.com | skype: jmmmpjmmmp From smills at rootsix.net Thu Mar 12 11:09:23 2009 From: smills at rootsix.net (Si Mills) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 10:09:23 +0000 Subject: [PD] Pd-Extended 0.40.3 + Jack OSX In-Reply-To: <49B8D753.9020309@umatic.nl> References: <49B8D079.7010706@umatic.nl> <49B8D753.9020309@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <5A3E11CB-7A3D-47DA-BB82-2D42643ECC56@rootsix.net> Have you noticed when turning off audio that cpu jumps up in the Jack cpu meter? Switch back on reduces it... weird On 12 Mar 2009, at 09:35, Derek Holzer wrote: > Situation improves when using latest Pd-Extended 0.41 nightly build > + latest JackOSX package. > > D. > > Derek Holzer wrote: >> This combination crashes immediately, reproducible every time. I've >> tried standard the Sourceforge version and also the latest nightly >> build (Jan 2009). >> D. > > -- > ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: > http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 68: > "Faced with a choice, do both" > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From crinimal at gmx.net Thu Mar 12 11:53:12 2009 From: crinimal at gmx.net (Martin Schied) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 11:53:12 +0100 Subject: [PD] how to freeze pd In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903120205o3f206dc0i39061b7c837790b7@mail.gmail.com> References: <161320dd0903120205o3f206dc0i39061b7c837790b7@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49B8E998.30001@gmx.net> same here. Pd version 0.41-4extended-20090301 compiled 09:29:58 Mar 1 2009 cheers, Martin hard off schrieb: > * create a subpatch > * create an object box in the subpatch, but don't type anything inside > the box > * go back to the parent patch and convert the subpatch into another > object (i tried to make it a [send]) > * enjoy pd freeze > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > From jbturgid at hotmail.com Thu Mar 12 13:35:04 2009 From: jbturgid at hotmail.com (Andrew Faraday) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 12:35:04 +0000 Subject: [PD] Gem to screensaver Message-ID: Hey guysPossibly a noob question but is it possible to package a generative gem patch as a screensaver? How would I go about this?God BlessAndrew Faraday _________________________________________________________________ Free photo editing software from Windows Live?. Try it now! http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665240/direct/01/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From zmoelnig at iem.at Thu Mar 12 14:01:24 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 14:01:24 +0100 Subject: [PD] PdCon09: TeX paper templates Message-ID: <49B907A4.8060902@iem.at> hi, sorry for OTism does anybody have a LaTeX version of the paper-templates for the PdConvention09? i just cannot write a paper in an office app. mfg,asdr IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From moocow at ling.uni-potsdam.de Thu Mar 12 14:13:53 2009 From: moocow at ling.uni-potsdam.de (Bryan Jurish) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 14:13:53 +0100 Subject: [PD] PdCon09: TeX paper templates In-Reply-To: <49B907A4.8060902@iem.at> References: <49B907A4.8060902@iem.at> Message-ID: <49B90A91.6030203@ling.uni-potsdam.de> On 2009-03-12 14:01:24, IOhannes m zmoelnig appears to have written: > i just cannot write a paper in an office app. amen! -- Bryan Jurish "There is *always* one more bug." jurish at ling.uni-potsdam.de -Lubarsky's Law of Cybernetic Entomology From david.doukhan at gmail.com Thu Mar 12 15:08:08 2009 From: david.doukhan at gmail.com (David Doukhan) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 15:08:08 +0100 Subject: [PD] PdCon09: TeX paper templates In-Reply-To: <49B907A4.8060902@iem.at> References: <49B907A4.8060902@iem.at> Message-ID: Neither do I... If anyone got such template, I would be intersted in obtaining it... Before the deadline... 2009/3/12 IOhannes m zmoelnig : > hi, sorry for OTism > > does anybody have a LaTeX version of the paper-templates for the > PdConvention09? > > i just cannot write a paper in an office app. > > > mfg,asdr > IOhannes > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > -- David Doukhan From crislists at gmail.com Thu Mar 12 16:06:38 2009 From: crislists at gmail.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?cristiano_figueir=F3?=) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 12:06:38 -0300 Subject: [PD] PdCon09: TeX paper templates In-Reply-To: References: <49B907A4.8060902@iem.at> Message-ID: <728d2a350903120806r4439cbc9sb5868f0b87420ae2@mail.gmail.com> Hi, we're working on a latex template to Pd Con 09. I'm not a very latex person so i'm asking help to others to improve this. Would be nice if any of you could help on this :) I think that this model could be good (with all images and .sty in one package) : http://www.sbc.org.br/index.php?language=1&content=downloads&id=286 The work should be to adapt this .tex to our office templates: http://porres.googlepages.com/Paper.zip Cheers. Cristiano -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kyleklip at gmail.com Thu Mar 12 16:53:54 2009 From: kyleklip at gmail.com (Kyle Klipowicz) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 10:53:54 -0500 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <2AE574D7-078C-47BC-A548-41CC05E77BC8@eds.org> References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> <49B24BE4.5060702@netpd.org> <1236437479.8049.39.camel@yoyo2> <2AE574D7-078C-47BC-A548-41CC05E77BC8@eds.org> Message-ID: How about this project: Beginners Building Blocks. Right now, If I want to even make a simple sine oscillator synth with an ADSR envelope on it, it's not very easy to do out of the box. What if there were some entry-level abstractions in a very OBVIOUS location that people could instantly piece together some classic Unit Generators. Important for these would be the ability to copy/paste items from a main page of abstractions. Also, they should have a simple GUI interface, and possibly be set up automatically to use SSAD. I'm thinking stuff like: -basic envelope generators -basic oscillators (bandlimited ones would be nice): sine, square, triangle, sawtooth -basic i/o that is more intuitive to newbies -basic sample players (one shot, looping, pitch shifting, multi-sample a la fluidsynth) -basic MIDI controller mapping tools (so people could just twist a knob to assign a parameter) -basic step, piano roll, &c sequencers -basic pitch/rhythm analysis (wrappers for sigmund~, fiddle~, and bonk~) -basic modular counters -an extensive collection of examples using these objects, documenting parameters, as well as ways to connect and/or modify and save new versions of objects using SSAD -video stuff would also be great, something akin to a freshened up PixelTango. Anyway, I just thought these things would be really nice to have in an accessible place in Pd-extended. Because right now whenever I just want to make something very simple, i end up having to click a mouse about 200 times which is annoying and makes me worried about RTS! Pd and Pd-extended are so difficult to navigate for newbies. There need to be more "pick up and go" audio tools. I'm thinking of how Reaktor and Max/MSP are so easy to dive into. Pd is a lot like a cold cold ocean whereas the other two are nice warm swimming pools. Pd is deeper and more exciting by far, but you can get swept away in an undertow never to return! This project could be accomplished by merging elements from NetPd, Pdmtl, and various slick patches made by the resident list geniuses. (Another thing about NetPd if Roman and Eni are listening: can you make a tar.gz or zip download of ALL current NetPd patches? I hate having to download 30+ items one at a time. RTS fears again!) So there's my way more than 2 cents. Take what you will from it. ~Kyle On Sun, Mar 8, 2009 at 2:53 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > On Mar 7, 2009, at 9:51 AM, Roman Haefeli wrote: > > > On Sat, 2009-03-07 at 11:26 +0100, Enrique Erne wrote: > >> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > >>> The Google Summer of Code ((http://code.google.com/soc/) application > >>> is due very soon, March 9th, and we need mentors! At this point, > >>> you > >>> just need to put down your name. Then once the projects are in, > >>> we'll > >>> choose projects and who will mentor them. > >> > >>> Every pd developer who wants to support the project but is not > >>> student > >>> anymore is invited to join as mentor, since the number of sponsored > >>> projects by google depends on the number of mentors and students. > >> > >> Andy, Claude, Frank, Marius, Mathieu, Roman where are you guys? > >> > >> add your names, hurry! :) > > > > yo, i am happy to add my name, but i guess it only makes sense for > > me to > > take a mentorship of a project, that is about patching and not c > > coding. > > from what i have seen, there is only one project - undead - which > > seems > > to be about patching. derek holzer is already proposed as a mentor. > > does > > it make sense to propose more then one mentor for a project? > > You could also create a new project based on something like creating > libraries out of all that useful code in netpd. Basically, think of > something that you would like implemented in Pd that you could mentor. > > .hc > > > > > > > > roman > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > Telefonate ohne weitere Kosten vom PC zum PC: http:// > > messenger.yahoo.de > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > If nature has made any one thing less susceptible than all others of > exclusive property, it is the action of the thinking power called an > idea, which an individual may exclusively possess as long as he keeps > it to himself; but the moment it is divulged, it forces itself into > the possession of everyone, and the receiver cannot dispossess himself > of it. - Thomas Jefferson > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -- ----- ------------ ---- ----- ---- -------- - ------ http://perhapsidid.wordpress.com http://myspace.com/kyleklipowicz -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From enrique at netpd.org Thu Mar 12 17:03:02 2009 From: enrique at netpd.org (Enrique Erne) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 17:03:02 +0100 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <49B93236.9000400@netpd.org> Hi Derek i made a mixer for netpd once, that dynamically creates channels and fx-bus. it uses the whole netpd framework, statesaving etc. http://www.netpd.org/Mx if you have already a netpd synth it's quite easy to plugin to the mx, something like that: [osc~] |\ [i2mx~ $0 yourInstrumentName] but: it only works with netpd :) but2: there seems to be a problem with pd-0.42, that i will fix soon. eni Derek Holzer wrote: > Hi all and thanks for chiming in on this thread. There was once, long > ago, a simple mixer which dynamically created the busses and channels. > If anyone can remember that one, it must have been 5 years ago, and was > the first dynamic patch I had ever seen. > > Also fun, non-utilitarian ones, like once someone sent some kind of > "card" to the list which just made a huge self-generating GUI art-mess > on the screen. I wish I could remember who wrote it. Lastly, IOhannes > showed a very nice self-modifying patch at Piksel last December using > iemguts. > > best! > Derek > From puredata at 11h11.com Thu Mar 12 15:55:17 2009 From: puredata at 11h11.com (patrick) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 10:55:17 -0400 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <49B92255.6020900@11h11.com> hi, just updated the video showing voice patching in pure data. i am now using dyn~ (thank you thomas grill for your externals). http://www.vimeo.com/2814913 lower your volume when you hear "send, 1, 400". pat From pkstone at ucdavis.edu Thu Mar 12 17:01:57 2009 From: pkstone at ucdavis.edu (Phil Stone) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 09:01:57 -0700 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> Message-ID: <49B931F5.80107@ucdavis.edu> Good point; I assume you're going to emphasize the pitfalls of dynamic patching while you're at it, Derek? I have a habit of opening up patches to see how they work, and if I can't read them because they're too messy, I'll move stuff around. This is fine, unless it's a dynamic patch and I hit "ctrl-s" without thinking. D'oh! The initial state of a dynamic patch is critical to its correct function, and one has to think very carefully before saving changes. I think I'm going to develop the habit of putting a large warning comment on any self-modifying patch. Phil IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: > however, my experiences with abcde were the main reason i s did not > touch self-modifying patches for years and years. > the lesson i learned was: never do self-modification in patches that > other people will ever have to regularily use. > (the original phrase would have been "never do self-modification in > patches that other people will ever have to maintain"; however, this > might give the impression that chances are low that somebody else will > really have to "maintain" a patch); in practice you pass > maintainership to somebody as soon as you give them your patch: they > will eventually start to modify it. From zmoelnig at iem.at Thu Mar 12 17:35:48 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 17:35:48 +0100 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B931F5.80107@ucdavis.edu> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> <49B931F5.80107@ucdavis.edu> Message-ID: <49B939E4.8040904@iem.at> Phil Stone wrote: > Good point; I assume you're going to emphasize the pitfalls of dynamic > patching while you're at it, Derek? I have a habit of opening up > patches to see how they work, and if I can't read them because they're > too messy, I'll move stuff around. This is fine, unless it's a dynamic > patch and I hit "ctrl-s" without thinking. D'oh! The initial state of > a dynamic patch is critical to its correct function, and one has to > think very carefully before saving changes. I think I'm going to > develop the habit of putting a large warning comment on any > self-modifying patch. > i did that, to no avail :-) f gamsdr IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From fbar at footils.org Thu Mar 12 17:43:11 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 17:43:11 +0100 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B931F5.80107@ucdavis.edu> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> <49B931F5.80107@ucdavis.edu> Message-ID: <20090312164311.GF8088@footils.org> Hallo, Phil Stone hat gesagt: // Phil Stone wrote: > Good point; I assume you're going to emphasize the pitfalls of dynamic > patching while you're at it, Derek? I have a habit of opening up > patches to see how they work, and if I can't read them because they're > too messy, I'll move stuff around. This is fine, unless it's a dynamic > patch and I hit "ctrl-s" without thinking. D'oh! The initial state of > a dynamic patch is critical to its correct function, and one has to > think very carefully before saving changes. I think I'm going to > develop the habit of putting a large warning comment on any > self-modifying patch. With certain clean patching habits it's not that bad. For example the original nqpoly4 was rather messy because it did the dynamic patching in the abstraction itself, used namcanvas for it and thus relied on a certain initial state. What I changed was to remove namcanvas, do the dynamic patching inside of a subpatch and started with clearing that patch from a loadbang. A loadbanged [; pd-subpatch clear( IMO is mandatory for dynamic patching in abstractions. Even if it's saved with old content that will be removed on the next load. Another use for dynamic patching is automatically creating parts of static patches. For example my piece "Frost" on the GOSUB10 netlabel release uses 60 resonant bandpass filters driven by noise bursts. Of course I didn't patch all of these manually and changed their arguments, instead I used dynamic patching to generate the filter bank once, which then was saved into a static patch. In that use case, one should not use a loadbang'd clear of course. ;) To add another example: I use dynamic patching in the list-abs-intro.pd patch to generate a list of all list-abs in the [list]-abs collection. Ciao -- Frank From pkstone at ucdavis.edu Thu Mar 12 18:00:28 2009 From: pkstone at ucdavis.edu (Phil Stone) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 10:00:28 -0700 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <20090312164311.GF8088@footils.org> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> <49B931F5.80107@ucdavis.edu> <20090312164311.GF8088@footils.org> Message-ID: <49B93FAC.9010506@ucdavis.edu> I may not be thinking this through correctly, but how do you handle broken connections with inlets/outlets in the cleared subpatch? I.e., the containing patch will lose its patch connections to the inlets/outlets of the subpatch if the sbupatch is cleared. Phil > With certain clean patching habits it's not that bad. For example the original > nqpoly4 was rather messy because it did the dynamic patching in the abstraction > itself, used namcanvas for it and thus relied on a certain initial state. > > What I changed was to remove namcanvas, do the dynamic patching inside of a > subpatch and started with clearing that patch from a loadbang. > > A loadbanged [; pd-subpatch clear( IMO is mandatory for dynamic patching in > abstractions. Even if it's saved with old content that will be removed on the > next load. > > Another use for dynamic patching is automatically creating parts of static > patches. For example my piece "Frost" on the GOSUB10 netlabel release uses 60 > resonant bandpass filters driven by noise bursts. Of course I didn't patch all > of these manually and changed their arguments, instead I used dynamic patching > to generate the filter bank once, which then was saved into a static patch. > > In that use case, one should not use a loadbang'd clear of course. ;) > > To add another example: I use dynamic patching in the list-abs-intro.pd patch > to generate a list of all list-abs in the [list]-abs collection. > > Ciao > From hans at eds.org Thu Mar 12 18:00:42 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 17:00:42 +0000 Subject: [PD] GSoC App is in! Message-ID: <46AE7B39-DC4E-421D-A0F6-CC19B5149B4A@eds.org> http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/GSoCOrganizationApp2009 So the GSoC app is in! That is everything on the above page was submitted. Please continue to work on the project ideas page, that part hasn't been submitted yet. .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- "It is convenient to imagine a power beyond us because that means we don't have to examine our own lives.", from "The Idols of Environmentalism", by Curtis White From fbar at footils.org Thu Mar 12 18:13:02 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 18:13:02 +0100 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B93FAC.9010506@ucdavis.edu> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> <49B931F5.80107@ucdavis.edu> <20090312164311.GF8088@footils.org> <49B93FAC.9010506@ucdavis.edu> Message-ID: <20090312171302.GA8499@footils.org> Hallo, Phil Stone hat gesagt: // Phil Stone wrote: > I may not be thinking this through correctly, but how do you handle > broken connections with inlets/outlets in the cleared subpatch? I.e., > the containing patch will lose its patch connections to the > inlets/outlets of the subpatch if the sbupatch is cleared. Just don't use any inlets and outlets! ;) I use [r $0-inlet] and [s $0-outlet] in the subpatch instead. See polypoly for an example of this "fake xlet" approach. Ciao -- Frnak From matju at artengine.ca Thu Mar 12 20:03:38 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 15:03:38 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <20090312164311.GF8088@footils.org> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> <49B931F5.80107@ucdavis.edu> <20090312164311.GF8088@footils.org> Message-ID: On Thu, 12 Mar 2009, Frank Barknecht wrote: > A loadbanged [; pd-subpatch clear( IMO is mandatory for dynamic patching in > abstractions. Even if it's saved with old content that will be removed on the > next load. It's not sufficient because you could be getting error messages from dynamically patched abstractions, or other strange behaviour. For example, if I make an [#out window], or an [#out] to which I send "open window", then on next load of any [#out] you will see a window open, and on any [#out window] you will see a window open, close, and open again. In other circumstances, I could get a "no such directory" error everytime I load, because I saved [#out] while it was writing a movie, and the directory has been renamed or removed or it's just a different machine... _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From reduzierer at yahoo.de Thu Mar 12 20:08:26 2009 From: reduzierer at yahoo.de (Roman Haefeli) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 20:08:26 +0100 Subject: [PD] FFT and curve3d? In-Reply-To: <49B707D8.2010609@goto10.org> References: <49B707D8.2010609@goto10.org> Message-ID: <1236884906.7769.5.camel@yoyo2> On Wed, 2009-03-11 at 00:37 +0000, Claude Heiland-Allen wrote: > Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > > > Anyone know of a patch that maps an FFT over time to something like a > > curve3d in Gem? I remember a while back people posted something like > > that, but I can't find it. > > > > .hc > > I just knocked the attached together, doesn't use curve3d thogh.. > beautiful! this is the kind of stuff, that triggers me to want to explore (in my perspective) undiscovered fields, such as (in this case) the gemGL* classes. very illustrative. roman ___________________________________________________________ Telefonate ohne weitere Kosten vom PC zum PC: http://messenger.yahoo.de From porres at gmail.com Thu Mar 12 20:50:36 2009 From: porres at gmail.com (Alexandre Porres) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 16:50:36 -0300 Subject: [PD] PdCon09: TeX paper templates In-Reply-To: <49B907A4.8060902@iem.at> References: <49B907A4.8060902@iem.at> Message-ID: <161a0b1e0903121250s40135c6by81af6aac76daff80@mail.gmail.com> Dear Folks, please forgive us for ignoring the important scientific standard provided by the LaTex formatt. since we only have a few days left. My idea is to go directly to http://www.acm.org/sigs/publications/proceedings-templates and get the templates from there. One might notice that the original templates were from them, as acknowledged on our Template. So it is the same thing. It should be fine. I dont work with LaTex, so it might take me too long to make the proper changes (Cris, from the committe is also overbooked). Maybe someone out there would help out. But no need to worry much... because the papers are not supposed to be "camera ready" versions at this point. Let us just peer-review the work. Thanks, and sorry for the inconvenience. Alex On Thu, Mar 12, 2009 at 10:01 AM, IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: > hi, sorry for OTism > > does anybody have a LaTeX version of the paper-templates for the > PdConvention09? > > i just cannot write a paper in an office app. > > > mfg,asdr > IOhannes > -- Alexandre Torres Porres cel. (11)8179-6226 Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From oded at ccrma.Stanford.EDU Thu Mar 12 23:03:15 2009 From: oded at ccrma.Stanford.EDU (Oded Ben-Tal) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 15:03:15 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] adaptive amplification? Message-ID: hello, I need to mic a player who will play either tiny, soft sounds (extended technique playing) or normal musical sounds soft-to-load. I want to mix the instrument sound with pd generated material BUT I want to amplify the soft sounds while only mixing a little bit of the normal sounds. Is there some clever way of making pd 'identify' the incoming sound and boost the signal when the input is the soft ones only? thanks Oded ___________________________________________________ Oded Ben-Tal http://ccrma.stanford.edu/~oded oded at ccrma.stanford.edu From lukexipd at gmail.com Fri Mar 13 00:21:26 2009 From: lukexipd at gmail.com (Luke Iannini) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 16:21:26 -0700 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> <49B931F5.80107@ucdavis.edu> <20090312164311.GF8088@footils.org> Message-ID: <7aaf8bb90903121621o6547cfa4l72c207b864af6beb@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, Mar 12, 2009 at 12:03 PM, Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > On Thu, 12 Mar 2009, Frank Barknecht wrote: > >> A loadbanged [; pd-subpatch clear( IMO is mandatory for dynamic patching >> in >> abstractions. Even if it's saved with old content that will be removed on >> the >> next load. > > It's not sufficient because you could be getting error messages from > dynamically patched abstractions, or other strange behaviour. For example, > if I make an [#out window], or an [#out] to which I send "open window", then > on next load of any [#out] you will see a window open, and on any [#out > window] you will see a window open, close, and open again. In other > circumstances, I could get a "no such directory" error everytime I load, > because I saved [#out] while it was writing a movie, and the directory has > been renamed or removed or it's just a different machine... Yes, the better solution methinks would be a vanilla* "savebang" to clear out the dynamic subpatch just before save. But I suppose that requires acknowledging dynamic patching. lxi *the [tot]-based method just does not work reliably > > ?_ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... > | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > From hans at eds.org Fri Mar 13 00:37:36 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 23:37:36 +0000 Subject: [PD] PdCon09: TeX paper templates In-Reply-To: <161a0b1e0903121250s40135c6by81af6aac76daff80@mail.gmail.com> References: <49B907A4.8060902@iem.at> <161a0b1e0903121250s40135c6by81af6aac76daff80@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Yeah, just use the ACM templates, they are good. I use the NIME ones, which are slightly modified ACM ones: http://nime.org/2002/submissions.html .hc On Mar 12, 2009, at 7:50 PM, Alexandre Porres wrote: > Dear Folks, please forgive us for ignoring the important scientific > standard provided by the LaTex formatt. > > since we only have a few days left. My idea is to go directly to > > http://www.acm.org/sigs/publications/proceedings-templates > > and get the templates from there. > > One might notice that the original templates were from them, as > acknowledged on our Template. So it is the same thing. It should be > fine. > > I dont work with LaTex, so it might take me too long to make the > proper changes (Cris, from the committe is also overbooked). > > Maybe someone out there would help out. But no need to worry much... > because the papers are not supposed to be "camera ready" versions > at this point. Let us just peer-review the work. > > Thanks, and sorry for the inconvenience. > Alex > > > > On Thu, Mar 12, 2009 at 10:01 AM, IOhannes m zmoelnig > wrote: > hi, sorry for OTism > > does anybody have a LaTeX version of the paper-templates for the > PdConvention09? > > i just cannot write a paper in an office app. > > > mfg,asdr > IOhannes > > > > -- > Alexandre Torres Porres > cel. (11)8179-6226 > Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home > http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Access to computers should be unlimited and total. - the hacker ethic -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From porres at gmail.com Fri Mar 13 00:45:55 2009 From: porres at gmail.com (Alexandre Porres) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 20:45:55 -0300 Subject: [PD] PdCon09: TeX paper templates In-Reply-To: References: <49B907A4.8060902@iem.at> <161a0b1e0903121250s40135c6by81af6aac76daff80@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <161a0b1e0903121645u21b328f7m3ffc4f81de20a50e@mail.gmail.com> exactly, In fact I got to this template because it was the one I used when I wrote a Paper to NIME Ooops, you caught me :) busted... But David did work on a version for us, I cant even see it, but I am uploading them to our website. I have it attached here. Hope it helps... Sorry again for the inconvenience... cheers Alex On Thu, Mar 12, 2009 at 8:37 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > Yeah, just use the ACM templates, they are good. I use the NIME ones, > which are slightly modified ACM ones: > > http://nime.org/2002/submissions.html > > .hc > > On Mar 12, 2009, at 7:50 PM, Alexandre Porres wrote: > > Dear Folks, please forgive us for ignoring the important scientific > standard provided by the LaTex formatt. > since we only have a few days left. My idea is to go directly to > > http://www.acm.org/sigs/publications/proceedings-templates > > and get the templates from there. > > One might notice that the original templates were from them, as > acknowledged on our Template. So it is the same thing. It should be fine. > > I dont work with LaTex, so it might take me too long to make the proper > changes (Cris, from the committe is also overbooked). > > Maybe someone out there would help out. But no need to worry much... > because the papers are not supposed to be "camera ready" versions at this > point. Let us just peer-review the work. > > Thanks, and sorry for the inconvenience. > Alex > > > > On Thu, Mar 12, 2009 at 10:01 AM, IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: > >> hi, sorry for OTism >> >> does anybody have a LaTeX version of the paper-templates for the >> PdConvention09? >> >> i just cannot write a paper in an office app. >> >> >> mfg,asdr >> IOhannes >> > > > > -- > Alexandre Torres Porres > cel. (11)8179-6226 > Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home > http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Access to computers should be unlimited and total. - the hacker ethic > > > -- Alexandre Torres Porres cel. (11)8179-6226 Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: pdcon09.zip Type: application/zip Size: 254931 bytes Desc: not available URL: From hans at eds.org Fri Mar 13 00:56:14 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 23:56:14 +0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <20090311202608.GB4913@footils.org> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <20090311202608.GB4913@footils.org> Message-ID: <24CE09CB-B1BA-4356-B61F-E6D7C53754E8@eds.org> On Mar 11, 2009, at 8:26 PM, Frank Barknecht wrote: > Hallo, > Hans-Christoph Steiner hat gesagt: // Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > >> polypoly and nqpoly4 are good examples. nqpoly4 is in Pd-extended, >> you >> can get polypoly here: >> >> http://itp.nyu.edu/dataflow/uploads/polypoly.zip > > Isn't polypoly also in pd-extended? Anyway the reference location is > the pd > subversion in: /trunk/abstractions/footils/foo/ polypoly is not included in Pd-extended. Newbies find downloading from svn daunting so I provided the zip. It would be even better if there was an official release. .hc > > > Ciao > -- > Frank > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Programs should be written for people to read, and only incidentally for machines to execute. - from Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs From hans at eds.org Fri Mar 13 01:07:27 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 00:07:27 +0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <672DFB8C-A319-4ECA-A2E5-9DFBD7F86CF8@eds.org> Perhaps you are thinking of parazit and pure. parazit is an object included in Pd-extended. And you can get Gerard Van Dongen's pure here: http://itp.nyu.edu/dataflow/uploads/tgb-pure.tar.gz .hc On Mar 12, 2009, at 8:47 AM, Derek Holzer wrote: > Hi all and thanks for chiming in on this thread. There was once, > long ago, a simple mixer which dynamically created the busses and > channels. If anyone can remember that one, it must have been 5 years > ago, and was the first dynamic patch I had ever seen. > > Also fun, non-utilitarian ones, like once someone sent some kind of > "card" to the list which just made a huge self-generating GUI art- > mess on the screen. I wish I could remember who wrote it. Lastly, > IOhannes showed a very nice self-modifying patch at Piksel last > December using iemguts. > > best! > Derek > > -- > ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista > ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 130: > "Question the heroic" > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Computer science is no more related to the computer than astronomy is related to the telescope. -Edsger Dykstra From jmmmpais at googlemail.com Fri Mar 13 01:18:15 2009 From: jmmmpais at googlemail.com (=?iso-8859-15?Q?Jo=E3o_Pais?=) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 00:18:15 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> Message-ID: ah, forgot, a very simple one: dacm~, also in /jmmmp (in a recent night build) > Would like to show some examples of dynamic and self-modifying Pd > patches during a workshop here in Berlin. I know there are some in the > archives (and maybe on people's HDs) somewhere, but damned if I can find > them. Links to previkous posts or new examples welcome! > > best! > Derek > -- Friedenstr. 58 10249 Berlin (Deutschland) Tel +49 30 42020091 | Mob +49 162 6843570 jmmmpais at googlemail.com | skype: jmmmpjmmmp From hard.off at gmail.com Fri Mar 13 04:20:06 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 12:20:06 +0900 Subject: [PD] adaptive amplification? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <161320dd0903122020g55c89a70r4f5462499040cbb0@mail.gmail.com> a compressor? there's a good one in the net-pd library. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dmotd at gmx.net Fri Mar 13 04:22:21 2009 From: dmotd at gmx.net (dmotd) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 13:22:21 +1000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <200903131322.22125.dmotd@gmx.net> hey derek.. attached is the dynamic GOP abstraction [mtx_tog], used as an extension to iemmatrix lib. it's a viewer/editor for simple binary matrices. it may be useful in your presentation as it uses [namecanvas] to edit the top level GOP. the actual code should be fairly readable and straight forward, although the logic is a little complex. i have attached the help file and a little example that generates a 16x4 step sequencer. obviously it requires the iemmatrix library to function (although it should still render the grid without). i haven't relied on this too heavily in the past so it may be buggy.. as with all dynamic patching (especially GOP/namecanvas) use with caution! cheers, dmotd On Thursday 12 March 2009 03:55:21 Derek Holzer wrote: > Would like to show some examples of dynamic and self-modifying Pd > patches during a workshop here in Berlin. I know there are some in the > archives (and maybe on people's HDs) somewhere, but damned if I can find > them. Links to previkous posts or new examples welcome! > > best! > Derek -------------- next part -------------- #N canvas 99 276 450 300 10; #X floatatom 241 79 4 0 0 0 - - -; #X msg 242 98 column \$1; #X msg 66 82 matrix 2 2 1 1 1 1; #X obj 149 241 unpack 0 0 0 0; #X obj 150 265 tgl 15 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1 0 1; #X obj 173 267 tgl 15 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1 0 1; #X obj 205 268 tgl 15 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1 0 1; #X obj 241 266 tgl 15 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1 0 1; #X obj 64 210 route matrix; #X floatatom 241 35 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 64 133 mtx_tog 4 16; #N canvas 0 0 450 300 count[16] 0; #X obj 77 129 metro 100; #X obj 78 161 f; #X obj 111 158 + 1; #X obj 139 174 >= 16; #X msg 140 214 0; #X obj 140 194 sel 1; #X obj 176 98 inlet; #X obj 92 35 inlet; #X obj 94 61 moses 0; #X msg 101 84 1; #X floatatom 149 14 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X msg 93 104 0; #X obj 71 200 outlet; #X connect 0 0 1 0; #X connect 1 0 2 0; #X connect 2 0 1 1; #X connect 2 0 3 0; #X connect 2 0 12 0; #X connect 3 0 5 0; #X connect 4 0 1 1; #X connect 5 0 4 0; #X connect 6 0 3 1; #X connect 7 0 8 0; #X connect 8 0 11 0; #X connect 8 1 9 0; #X connect 8 1 0 1; #X connect 9 0 0 0; #X connect 10 0 8 0; #X connect 11 0 0 0; #X restore 240 56 pd count[16]; #X text 282 34 <- step (msec); #X connect 0 0 1 0; #X connect 1 0 10 0; #X connect 2 0 10 0; #X connect 3 0 4 0; #X connect 3 1 5 0; #X connect 3 2 6 0; #X connect 3 3 7 0; #X connect 8 1 3 0; #X connect 9 0 11 0; #X connect 10 0 8 0; #X connect 11 0 0 0; -------------- next part -------------- #N canvas 129 0 450 326 10; #X obj 324 251 mtx_print; #X obj 324 229 matrix; #X obj 45 110 mtx_eye 8; #X obj 46 89 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1; #X obj 323 207 spigot; #X obj 374 188 tgl 15 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1 0 1; #X msg 244 48 print 1; #X msg 256 67 print 0; #X text 263 86 print (including \$0 arg); #X text 34 283 warning! can choke pd when building larger matrices ; #X text 33 9 [mtx_tog] is a binary viewer/editor abs for iemmatrix ; #X text 292 299 (c) 2006 dmotd; #X obj 244 177 mtx_tog 2 2; #X obj 241 105 mtx_tog 4 4; #X obj 46 138 mtx_tog 8 8; #X obj 246 220 mtx_tog 3 1; #X obj 212 176 mtx_tog 3 1; #X text 65 28 usage: [mtx_tog m n]; #X text 65 46 where m = rows; #X text 79 65 and n = columns; #X connect 1 0 0 0; #X connect 2 0 14 0; #X connect 3 0 2 0; #X connect 4 0 1 0; #X connect 5 0 4 1; #X connect 6 0 13 0; #X connect 7 0 13 0; #X connect 12 0 4 0; #X connect 12 0 15 0; #X connect 13 0 12 0; #X connect 13 0 16 0; -------------- next part -------------- #N canvas 100 82 373 383 10; #N canvas 317 180 450 300 \$0-subpatch 0; #X obj 0 0 tgl 15 0 1011_1_1_send 1011_1_1_receive empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1 0 1; #X coords 0 -1 1 1 15 15 2 0 0; #X restore 0 50 pd \$0-subpatch; #N canvas 167 102 450 300 edit_mtx 0; #X obj 41 46 r \$0-matrix; #X obj 72 236 outlet; #X obj 286 174 spigot; #X obj 322 128 tgl 15 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1 0 1; #X obj 320 99 inlet; #X obj 166 24 inlet; #X obj 178 115 mtx_check; #N canvas 67 97 523 386 mtx_set 0; #N canvas 18 295 450 300 doit 0; #X obj 88 62 until; #X obj 88 90 f; #X obj 119 92 + 1; #X obj 163 92 sel 0; #X obj 117 119 mod 5; #X obj 90 32 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1; #N canvas 161 343 450 300 count 0; #X obj 85 15 inlet; #X obj 219 108 f; #X obj 276 104 + 1; #X msg 194 75 bang; #X floatatom 277 138 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X msg 263 77 0; #X obj 212 181 select 1; #X obj 230 147 < 5; #X obj 278 4 inlet; #X obj 299 43 int; #X obj 197 242 outlet; #X obj 300 263 outlet; #X obj 211 208 del 10; #X obj 269 207 del 11; #X connect 0 0 3 0; #X connect 1 0 2 0; #X connect 2 0 1 1; #X connect 2 0 4 0; #X connect 2 0 7 0; #X connect 2 0 10 0; #X connect 3 0 1 0; #X connect 5 0 1 1; #X connect 6 0 12 0; #X connect 6 1 13 0; #X connect 7 0 6 0; #X connect 8 0 9 0; #X connect 9 0 7 1; #X connect 12 0 1 0; #X connect 13 0 5 0; #X connect 13 0 11 0; #X restore 159 -23 pd count; #X obj 157 -47 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1; #X floatatom 203 -53 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 215 14 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1; #X floatatom 158 5 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 194 141 pack; #X obj 150 29 t b f; #X floatatom 108 -26 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 43 -68 inlet; #X obj 127 -71 inlet; #X obj 211 -76 inlet; #X obj 246 185 outlet; #X obj 229 -33 max 1; #X obj 63 -23 max 1; #X obj 362 190 outlet; #X connect 0 0 1 0; #X connect 1 0 2 0; #X connect 2 0 4 0; #X connect 2 0 11 0; #X connect 3 0 0 1; #X connect 4 0 1 1; #X connect 4 0 3 0; #X connect 5 0 0 0; #X connect 6 0 10 0; #X connect 6 0 12 0; #X connect 6 1 9 0; #X connect 7 0 6 0; #X connect 8 0 18 0; #X connect 9 0 20 0; #X connect 11 0 17 0; #X connect 12 0 5 0; #X connect 12 1 11 1; #X connect 13 0 4 1; #X connect 14 0 7 0; #X connect 15 0 19 0; #X connect 16 0 8 0; #X connect 18 0 6 1; #X connect 19 0 13 0; #X restore 165 98 pd doit; #X floatatom 195 78 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X floatatom 245 79 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 80 38 inlet; #X obj 77 171 matrix; #X obj 167 246 pack 0 0 0 0; #X obj 140 211 route matrix; #X obj 77 228 \$0; #X obj 204 179 unpack; #X obj 172 124 t a a; #X obj 78 199 t b a; #X msg 145 73 bang; #X obj 220 -24 loadbang; #X obj 220 0 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1; #X obj 222 24 t b b; #X obj 52 313 outlet; #X obj 119 274 t a b; #X obj 46 105 t a a; #X obj 240 49 \$2; #X obj 268 50 \$1; #X msg 112 145 element \$2 \$1; #X msg 164 284 \; \$1_\$2_\$3_receive set \$4; #X connect 0 0 9 0; #X connect 1 0 0 1; #X connect 2 0 0 2; #X connect 3 0 17 0; #X connect 4 0 10 0; #X connect 5 0 21 0; #X connect 6 0 16 0; #X connect 6 1 5 3; #X connect 7 0 5 0; #X connect 8 0 5 1; #X connect 8 1 5 2; #X connect 9 0 20 0; #X connect 9 1 8 0; #X connect 10 0 7 0; #X connect 10 1 6 0; #X connect 11 0 0 0; #X connect 12 0 13 0; #X connect 13 0 14 0; #X connect 14 0 18 0; #X connect 14 1 19 0; #X connect 16 1 11 0; #X connect 17 0 15 0; #X connect 17 1 4 0; #X connect 18 0 1 0; #X connect 19 0 2 0; #X connect 20 0 4 0; #X restore 174 158 pd mtx_set; #X obj 48 128 t b a; #X obj 177 46 route matrix; #X obj 177 65 list prepend matrix; #X obj 178 85 list trim; #X obj 283 204 mtx_print mtx_tog[\$0]; #X obj 78 193 matrix \$1 \$2; #X obj 176 137 mtx_resize \$1 \$2; #X msg 43 69 element \$2 \$3 \$1; #X connect 0 0 15 0; #X connect 2 0 12 0; #X connect 3 0 2 1; #X connect 4 0 3 0; #X connect 5 0 9 0; #X connect 6 0 14 0; #X connect 7 0 13 0; #X connect 8 0 13 0; #X connect 8 1 13 0; #X connect 9 0 10 0; #X connect 9 1 13 0; #X connect 10 0 11 0; #X connect 11 0 6 0; #X connect 13 0 1 0; #X connect 13 0 2 0; #X connect 14 0 7 0; #X connect 15 0 8 0; #X restore 15 -10 pd edit_mtx; #N canvas 295 414 450 300 build 0; #N canvas 76 2 1055 684 make 0; #X msg 233 368 clear; #N canvas 52 319 450 300 doit 0; #X obj 88 62 until; #X obj 88 90 f; #X obj 119 92 + 1; #X obj 163 92 sel 0; #X obj 117 119 mod 5; #X obj 90 32 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1; #N canvas 161 343 450 300 count 0; #X obj 85 15 inlet; #X obj 219 108 f; #X obj 276 104 + 1; #X msg 194 75 bang; #X floatatom 277 138 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X msg 263 77 0; #X obj 212 181 select 1; #X obj 269 207 del 51; #X obj 211 208 del 50; #X obj 230 147 < 5; #X obj 278 4 inlet; #X obj 299 43 int; #X obj 197 242 outlet; #X obj 300 263 outlet; #X connect 0 0 3 0; #X connect 1 0 2 0; #X connect 2 0 1 1; #X connect 2 0 4 0; #X connect 2 0 9 0; #X connect 2 0 12 0; #X connect 3 0 1 0; #X connect 5 0 1 1; #X connect 6 0 8 0; #X connect 6 1 7 0; #X connect 7 0 5 0; #X connect 7 0 13 0; #X connect 8 0 1 0; #X connect 9 0 6 0; #X connect 10 0 11 0; #X connect 11 0 9 1; #X restore 159 -23 pd count; #X obj 157 -47 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1; #X floatatom 203 -53 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 215 14 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1; #X floatatom 158 5 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 194 141 pack; #X obj 150 29 t b f; #X floatatom 108 -26 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 43 -68 inlet; #X obj 127 -71 inlet; #X obj 211 -76 inlet; #X obj 246 185 outlet; #X obj 229 -33 max 1; #X obj 63 -23 max 1; #X connect 0 0 1 0; #X connect 1 0 2 0; #X connect 2 0 4 0; #X connect 2 0 11 0; #X connect 3 0 0 1; #X connect 4 0 1 1; #X connect 4 0 3 0; #X connect 5 0 0 0; #X connect 6 0 10 0; #X connect 6 0 12 0; #X connect 6 1 9 0; #X connect 7 0 6 0; #X connect 8 0 18 0; #X connect 11 0 17 0; #X connect 12 0 5 0; #X connect 12 1 11 1; #X connect 13 0 4 1; #X connect 14 0 7 0; #X connect 15 0 19 0; #X connect 16 0 8 0; #X connect 18 0 6 1; #X connect 19 0 13 0; #X restore 35 191 pd doit; #X floatatom 81 170 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X floatatom 137 168 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 191 515 pack; #X msg 190 571 donecanvasdialog 1 -1 2 0 -1 1 1 \$1 \$2 0 0; #X obj 35 311 expr ($f1 - 1) * 15 \; ($f2 - 1) * 15 \; $f1 \; $f2 \; (($f1 - 1) * 15) + 15 \; (($f2 - 1) * 15) + 15 \;; #X msg 240 517 15 15; #X obj 25 50 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1; #X obj 37 25 inlet; #X obj 86 652 s pd-\$0-subpatch; #X obj 74 147 inlet; #X obj 133 144 inlet; #X msg 523 403 clear; #X obj 698 642 s pd-\$0-pool; #X obj 35 407 pack 0 0 0 0 0; #X obj 654 176 \$0; #X obj 121 69 t b b b b; #X obj 585 208 pack 0 0 0; #X obj 842 347 pack 0 0 0 0 0; #X obj 843 269 expr $f1 * 130 \; ($f2 * 40) -40 \; $f3 \; $f1 \; $f2 ; #X obj 631 349 pack 0 0 0 0; #X obj 591 235 t a a; #X obj 631 449 f; #X obj 629 424 t b a; #X obj 681 450 + 2; #X msg 725 580 connect \$1 0 \$2 0; #X obj 686 480 expr $f1 - 1 \; $f1; #X obj 689 523 pack; #X msg 676 425 0; #X obj 693 549 t a a; #X msg 726 605 connect \$2 0 0 0; #X msg 485 477 obj 0 100 s \$1-matrix; #X obj 485 448 \$0; #X obj 622 271 expr $f1 * 130 \; ($f2 * 40) - 20 \; $f1 \; $f2; #X obj 247 310 \$0; #X obj 190 543 t a a; #X msg 223 597 donecanvasdialog 1 -1 2 0 -1 1 1 \$1 \$2 0 50; #X obj 222 624 s \$0-mtx_tog; #X msg 629 373 obj \$1 \$2 pack 0 \$4 \$3; #X msg 36 440 obj \$1 \$2 tgl 15 0 \$5_\$3_\$4_send \$5_\$3_\$4_receive empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1 0; #X msg 842 373 obj \$1 \$2 r \$3_\$4_\$5_send; #X connect 0 0 10 0; #X connect 1 0 6 0; #X connect 1 0 18 0; #X connect 4 0 36 0; #X connect 5 0 10 0; #X connect 6 0 15 0; #X connect 6 1 15 1; #X connect 6 2 15 2; #X connect 6 3 15 3; #X connect 6 4 4 0; #X connect 6 5 4 1; #X connect 7 0 36 0; #X connect 9 0 8 0; #X connect 9 0 17 0; #X connect 11 0 2 0; #X connect 11 0 1 1; #X connect 12 0 3 0; #X connect 12 0 1 2; #X connect 13 0 14 0; #X connect 15 0 40 0; #X connect 16 0 18 2; #X connect 17 0 1 0; #X connect 17 1 7 0; #X connect 17 1 33 0; #X connect 17 2 0 0; #X connect 17 2 13 0; #X connect 17 3 16 0; #X connect 17 3 29 0; #X connect 17 3 35 0; #X connect 18 0 22 0; #X connect 19 0 41 0; #X connect 20 0 19 0; #X connect 20 1 19 1; #X connect 20 2 19 2; #X connect 20 3 19 3; #X connect 20 4 19 4; #X connect 21 0 39 0; #X connect 22 0 34 0; #X connect 22 1 20 0; #X connect 23 0 25 0; #X connect 24 0 23 0; #X connect 24 1 14 0; #X connect 25 0 23 1; #X connect 25 0 27 0; #X connect 26 0 14 0; #X connect 27 0 28 0; #X connect 27 1 28 1; #X connect 28 0 30 0; #X connect 29 0 23 1; #X connect 30 0 31 0; #X connect 30 1 26 0; #X connect 31 0 14 0; #X connect 32 0 14 0; #X connect 33 0 32 0; #X connect 34 0 21 0; #X connect 34 1 21 1; #X connect 34 2 21 2; #X connect 34 3 21 3; #X connect 35 0 15 4; #X connect 36 0 5 0; #X connect 36 1 37 0; #X connect 37 0 38 0; #X connect 39 0 24 0; #X connect 40 0 10 0; #X connect 41 0 14 0; #X restore 65 217 pd make; #X obj 66 150 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1; #X obj 105 90 loadbang; #X obj 107 138 t b b b; #X obj 105 114 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1; #X floatatom 157 188 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X floatatom 199 188 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 125 163 \$2; #X obj 157 165 \$1; #X connect 1 0 0 0; #X connect 2 0 4 0; #X connect 3 0 1 0; #X connect 3 1 7 0; #X connect 3 2 8 0; #X connect 4 0 3 0; #X connect 5 0 0 1; #X connect 6 0 0 2; #X connect 7 0 0 1; #X connect 8 0 0 2; #X restore 117 -50 pd build; #N canvas 498 146 450 300 \$0-pool 0; #X obj 0 100 s 1011-matrix; #X obj 130 0 r 1011_1_1_send; #X obj 130 20 pack 0 1 1; #X connect 1 0 2 0; #X connect 2 0 0 0; #X restore 117 -30 pd \$0-pool; #X obj 15 10 outlet; #X obj 15 -70 inlet; #X obj 15 -50 route print; #X obj 117 -70 namecanvas \$0-mtx_tog; #N canvas 405 428 450 300 notes 0; #X text 55 25 [mtx_tog] binary editor/viewer for iemmatrix; #X text 107 49 usage: [mtx_tog m n]; #X text 157 70 where m = rows; #X text 171 89 and n = columns; #X text 276 253 (c) 2006 dmotd; #X text 56 121 the dynamic part has a metro to build the rows; #X text 56 136 and an until to build the columns..; #X text 55 155 this limit assures that pd doesn't die on building; #X text 57 171 but does make generating the content a little slow. ; #X text 57 239 toggles [pd \$0-subpatch]; #X text 31 127; #X text 57 255 receivers [pd \$0-pool]; #X text 55 189 (this limit could be removed in the future?); #X text 55 219 dynamic holders:; #X restore 117 -10 pd notes; #X connect 1 0 4 0; #X connect 5 0 6 0; #X connect 6 0 1 1; #X connect 6 1 1 0; #X coords 0 -1 1 1 15 15 2 0 50; From derek at umatic.nl Fri Mar 13 07:47:43 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 07:47:43 +0100 Subject: [PD] adaptive amplification? In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903122020g55c89a70r4f5462499040cbb0@mail.gmail.com> References: <161320dd0903122020g55c89a70r4f5462499040cbb0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49BA018F.2050409@umatic.nl> Or [limiter], which has a compressor mode as well. Part of IEM libs I think. D. hard off wrote: > a compressor? > > there's a good one in the net-pd library. -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 21: "Be less critical" From derek at umatic.nl Fri Mar 13 07:53:57 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 07:53:57 +0100 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <672DFB8C-A319-4ECA-A2E5-9DFBD7F86CF8@eds.org> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> <672DFB8C-A319-4ECA-A2E5-9DFBD7F86CF8@eds.org> Message-ID: <49BA0305.6080106@umatic.nl> Yeah, parazit was one of them! Thx! D. Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > Perhaps you are thinking of parazit and pure. parazit is an object > included in Pd-extended. And you can get Gerard Van Dongen's pure here: > > http://itp.nyu.edu/dataflow/uploads/tgb-pure.tar.gz > > .hc > > On Mar 12, 2009, at 8:47 AM, Derek Holzer wrote: > >> Hi all and thanks for chiming in on this thread. There was once, long >> ago, a simple mixer which dynamically created the busses and channels. >> If anyone can remember that one, it must have been 5 years ago, and >> was the first dynamic patch I had ever seen. >> >> Also fun, non-utilitarian ones, like once someone sent some kind of >> "card" to the list which just made a huge self-generating GUI art-mess >> on the screen. I wish I could remember who wrote it. Lastly, IOhannes >> showed a very nice self-modifying patch at Piksel last December using >> iemguts. >> >> best! >> Derek >> >> -- >> ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: >> http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: >> ---Oblique Strategy # 130: >> "Question the heroic" >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > Computer science is no more related to the computer than astronomy is > related to the telescope. -Edsger Dykstra > > > -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 63: "Don't break the silence" From fbar at footils.org Fri Mar 13 08:09:45 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 08:09:45 +0100 Subject: [PD] adaptive amplification? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20090313070945.GA10976@footils.org> Hallo, Oded Ben-Tal hat gesagt: // Oded Ben-Tal wrote: > I need to mic a player who will play either tiny, soft sounds (extended > technique playing) or normal musical sounds soft-to-load. I want to mix > the instrument sound with pd generated material BUT I want to amplify the > soft sounds while only mixing a little bit of the normal sounds. > Is there some clever way of making pd 'identify' the incoming sound and > boost the signal when the input is the soft ones only? You need a compressor with a so called side-chain. The RjDj library has two: e_compress.pd and e_dynproc.pd at: http://trac.rjdj.me/browser/trunk/rjlib/rj/ (e_dynproc can also be used as a noisegate, which is an kind of inverse compressor) Feed the signal to control into the left and the controlling signal into the middle inlet~. Ciao -- Frank From hans.roels at versateladsl.be Fri Mar 13 10:58:32 2009 From: hans.roels at versateladsl.be (Hans Roels) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 10:58:32 +0100 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> <49B24BE4.5060702@netpd.org> <1236437479.8049.39.camel@yoyo2> <2AE574D7-078C-47BC-A548-41CC05E77BC8@eds.org> Message-ID: In fact I'm working on a very similar project (called 'abunch') since a year, I hope to release it in one of the following weeks. Everything is in pd vanilla. I tried to make it as user friendly as possible, I've been testing and using it a lot in my lessons. It contains a lot of the units that you mentioned... Hans R At 16:53 12/03/2009, Kyle Klipowicz wrote: >How about this project: > >Beginners Building Blocks. > >Right now, If I want to even make a simple sine oscillator synth >with an ADSR envelope on it, it's not very easy to do out of the >box. What if there were some entry-level abstractions in a very >OBVIOUS location that people could instantly piece together some >classic Unit Generators. Important for these would be the ability to >copy/paste items from a main page of abstractions. Also, they should >have a simple GUI interface, and possibly be set up automatically to use SSAD. > >I'm thinking stuff like: > >-basic envelope generators >-basic oscillators (bandlimited ones would be nice): sine, square, >triangle, sawtooth >-basic i/o that is more intuitive to newbies >-basic sample players (one shot, looping, pitch shifting, >multi-sample a la fluidsynth) >-basic MIDI controller mapping tools (so people could just twist a >knob to assign a parameter) >-basic step, piano roll, &c sequencers >-basic pitch/rhythm analysis (wrappers for sigmund~, fiddle~, and bonk~) >-basic modular counters >-an extensive collection of examples using these objects, >documenting parameters, as well as ways to connect and/or modify and >save new versions of objects using SSAD >-video stuff would also be great, something akin to a freshened up PixelTango. > >Anyway, I just thought these things would be really nice to have in >an accessible place in Pd-extended. Because right now whenever I >just want to make something very simple, i end up having to click a >mouse about 200 times which is annoying and makes me worried about RTS! > >Pd and Pd-extended are so difficult to navigate for newbies. There >need to be more "pick up and go" audio tools. I'm thinking of how >Reaktor and Max/MSP are so easy to dive into. Pd is a lot like a >cold cold ocean whereas the other two are nice warm swimming pools. >Pd is deeper and more exciting by far, but you can get swept away in >an undertow never to return! > >This project could be accomplished by merging elements from NetPd, >Pdmtl, and various slick patches made by the resident list geniuses. >(Another thing about NetPd if Roman and Eni are listening: can you >make a tar.gz or zip download of ALL current NetPd patches? I hate >having to download 30+ items one at a time. RTS fears again!) > >So there's my way more than 2 cents. Take what you will from it. > >~Kyle > > >On Sun, Mar 8, 2009 at 2:53 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner ><hans at eds.org> wrote: >On Mar 7, 2009, at 9:51 AM, Roman Haefeli wrote: > > On Sat, 2009-03-07 at 11:26 +0100, Enrique Erne wrote: > >> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > >>> The Google Summer of Code > ((http://code.google.com/soc/) application > >>> is due very soon, March 9th, and we need mentors! At this point, > >>> you > >>> just need to put down your name. Then once the projects are in, > >>> we'll > >>> choose projects and who will mentor them. > >> > >>> Every pd developer who wants to support the project but is not > >>> student > >>> anymore is invited to join as mentor, since the number of sponsored > >>> projects by google depends on the number of mentors and students. > >> > >> Andy, Claude, Frank, Marius, Mathieu, Roman where are you guys? > >> > >> add your names, hurry! :) > > > > yo, i am happy to add my name, but i guess it only makes sense for > > me to > > take a mentorship of a project, that is about patching and not c > > coding. > > from what i have seen, there is only one project - undead - which > > seems > > to be about patching. derek holzer is already proposed as a mentor. > > does > > it make sense to propose more then one mentor for a project? >You could also create a new project based on something like creating >libraries out of all that useful code in netpd. Basically, think of >something that you would like implemented in Pd that you could mentor. >.hc > > > > > > > roman > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > Telefonate ohne weitere Kosten vom PC zum PC: http:// > > messenger.yahoo.de > > >---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >If nature has made any one thing less susceptible than all others of >exclusive property, it is the action of the thinking power called an >idea, which an individual may exclusively possess as long as he keeps >it to himself; but the moment it is divulged, it forces itself into >the possession of everyone, and the receiver cannot dispossess himself >of it. - Thomas Jefferson > > >_______________________________________________ >Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > >-- >----- >------------ > ---- ----- >---- -------- - ------ >http://perhapsidid.wordpress.com >http://myspace.com/kyleklipowicz >_______________________________________________ >Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nicolas_montgermont at yahoo.fr Fri Mar 13 12:28:35 2009 From: nicolas_montgermont at yahoo.fr (Nicolas Montgermont) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 12:28:35 +0100 Subject: [PD] visible bang without output Message-ID: <49BA4363.4080106@yahoo.fr> Hi list, Is there a simple solution to have the GUI bang visually shows a bang but without output? As the others GUI object do with the set message. [set bang( outputs a bang. Thanks, Nicolas -- http://nim.on.free.fr From hans at eds.org Fri Mar 13 16:10:10 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 15:10:10 +0000 Subject: [PD] visible bang without output In-Reply-To: <49BA4363.4080106@yahoo.fr> References: <49BA4363.4080106@yahoo.fr> Message-ID: Make a GOP that uses the set message to control a spigot. .hc On Mar 13, 2009, at 11:28 AM, Nicolas Montgermont wrote: > Hi list, > > Is there a simple solution to have the GUI bang visually shows a > bang but without output? > As the others GUI object do with the set message. > [set bang( outputs a bang. > > Thanks, > > Nicolas > -- > http://nim.on.free.fr > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- You can't steal a gift. Bird gave the world his music, and if you can hear it, you can have it. - Dizzy Gillespie From hans at eds.org Fri Mar 13 16:12:11 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 15:12:11 +0000 Subject: [PD] [PD-announce] Hack Yer iPod! in Liverpool, March 12th thru 17th In-Reply-To: References: <7F2A6B66-FF7F-4DCE-87DF-FCCAC9D9AF1F@eds.org> Message-ID: So I'll be here everyday thru the 18th, more or less from 11am til 6pm, and maybe longer. There are workshop times, but I'll be here hacking away the whole time if you want to join in or visit. Here's the workshop schedule: http://climateforchange.fact.co.uk/calendar .hc On Mar 11, 2009, at 7:19 PM, Arif Driessen wrote: > Oh Hans! Why weren't we told sooner!! > > Train tickets will be ?80 by now. > > In slightly more positive news, I noticed 'Arduino Hackday' on the > 23rd of May! > > On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 6:47 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner > wrote: > > Hey, come join me in Liverpool at FACT and hack your iPod! It > starts tomorrow, its pretty last minute, we have dates, but the > times aren't ironed out yet. > > Where: http://fact.co.uk/ in Liverpool, England > When: March 12th thru 17th (check the website for times) > > Have an iPod you want to repurpose into a hackable music machine? > Install iPodLinux and make music with Pd! Want to play Doom on your > iPod Video? Come install Rockbox! Did your trusty iPod?s battery > finally die, or disk give in? Come and break open your iPod, either > the software, the hardware or both. Give it new life and new > purpose. Also, we have on hand our stash of old iPods for harvesting > parts, and the newfound skills for frankensteining dead iPods into > living ones. Join Hans-Christoph Steiner and Chris ?the Widget? > DiMauro with your own iPod, or try your hand to see if you can > create a living one from our pile. > > This workshop is a place to get exposed to the possibilities. We?ve > been hacking on some iPods to see what?s possible. Lots of this > software is kind of raw, but you can do lots of fun stuff now. We > are just getting started, we are having fun exploring the options. > Now we want to help you do the same. > > Check out our web page to see if your devices are supported: > http://dev.eyebeam.org/projects/reware/wiki/FactWorkshop > > .hc > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Access to computers should be unlimited and total. - the hacker ethic > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-announce mailing list > Pd-announce at iem.at > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-announce > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-announce mailing list > Pd-announce at iem.at > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-announce > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- "[T]he greatest purveyor of violence in the world today [is] my own government." - Martin Luther King, Jr. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hans at eds.org Fri Mar 13 16:18:44 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 15:18:44 +0000 Subject: [PD] *weird* characters In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <6D5283F9-FE25-4D36-B8B2-B59F98D6BD11@eds.org> Sounds like you should start being an alpha tester for pd-devel. moocow is working on getting full UTF-8 support. But otherwise I think you are stuck with latin1, and maybe some others if you are lucky. .hc On Mar 12, 2009, at 12:43 AM, potax flan wrote: > hi > using [textfile], i want to concatenate long strings of *unusual* > characters (like the "triangle" or Delta character you get by > pressing ALT, caps, d). maybe there is an alternative to [textfile]? > Is there a way to handle these characters in pd (have them in a > message, then add them to textfile would be wonderful)? if i press > ALT caps d while editing a message i get an error rectangle ? is it > because the font in pd cant deal with the ? sign? can i use ascii > codes for this? key gives me 8710 for delta, any way i can use that? > thanks > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- All information should be free. - the hacker ethic From nicolas_montgermont at yahoo.fr Fri Mar 13 18:02:44 2009 From: nicolas_montgermont at yahoo.fr (Nicolas Montgermont) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 18:02:44 +0100 Subject: [PD] visible bang without output In-Reply-To: References: <49BA4363.4080106@yahoo.fr> Message-ID: <49BA91B4.2060302@yahoo.fr> h?h?, Clever. i don't have the reflex to make mini-GOP. Thanks, n Le 13/03/09 16:10, Hans-Christoph Steiner a ?crit : > > Make a GOP that uses the set message to control a spigot. > > .hc > > On Mar 13, 2009, at 11:28 AM, Nicolas Montgermont wrote: > >> Hi list, >> >> Is there a simple solution to have the GUI bang visually shows a bang >> but without output? >> As the others GUI object do with the set message. >> [set bang( outputs a bang. >> >> Thanks, >> >> Nicolas >> -- >> http://nim.on.free.fr >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > You can't steal a gift. Bird gave the world his music, and if you can > hear it, you can have it. - Dizzy Gillespie > > > > -- http://nim.on.free.fr From enrique at netpd.org Fri Mar 13 18:12:28 2009 From: enrique at netpd.org (Enrique Erne) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 18:12:28 +0100 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> <49B24BE4.5060702@netpd.org> <1236437479.8049.39.camel@yoyo2> <2AE574D7-078C-47BC-A548-41CC05E77BC8@eds.org> Message-ID: <49BA93FC.7020209@netpd.org> hi Kyle i love the idea of a Classic Unit Library (CUL?) BBB - Beginners Building Blocks WSP - (Where to Start with Pd) WSP - warm swimming pool :) for me the first step would be to write some specs: - coding style guide (who did it? luke?), license, naming convention, howto contribute and also analyze existing libs: pdmtl, rjlib maybe you could even just build on them? i'd like to see the WSP Lib: - bsd - flat - super simple black&white interfaces - as pure as possible - a minimum of possible dependencies - not gopish ? - howto contribute? - with self explaining naming? i'm just about to upload my zipped netpd directory. http://netpd.org/eni/downloads/?C=M;O=D (8.9MB because there are some samples) eni Kyle Klipowicz wrote: > How about this project: > Beginners Building Blocks. > > Right now, If I want to even make a simple sine oscillator synth with an > ADSR envelope on it, it's not very easy to do out of the box. What if there > were some entry-level abstractions in a very OBVIOUS location that people > could instantly piece together some classic Unit Generators. Important for > these would be the ability to copy/paste items from a main page of > abstractions. Also, they should have a simple GUI interface, and possibly be > set up automatically to use SSAD. > > I'm thinking stuff like: > > -basic envelope generators > -basic oscillators (bandlimited ones would be nice): sine, square, triangle, > sawtooth > -basic i/o that is more intuitive to newbies > -basic sample players (one shot, looping, pitch shifting, multi-sample a la > fluidsynth) > -basic MIDI controller mapping tools (so people could just twist a knob to > assign a parameter) > -basic step, piano roll, &c sequencers > -basic pitch/rhythm analysis (wrappers for sigmund~, fiddle~, and bonk~) > -basic modular counters > -an extensive collection of examples using these objects, documenting > parameters, as well as ways to connect and/or modify and save new versions > of objects using SSAD > -video stuff would also be great, something akin to a freshened up > PixelTango. > > Anyway, I just thought these things would be really nice to have in an > accessible place in Pd-extended. Because right now whenever I just want to > make something very simple, i end up having to click a mouse about 200 times > which is annoying and makes me worried about RTS! > > Pd and Pd-extended are so difficult to navigate for newbies. There need to > be more "pick up and go" audio tools. I'm thinking of how Reaktor and > Max/MSP are so easy to dive into. Pd is a lot like a cold cold ocean whereas > the other two are nice warm swimming pools. Pd is deeper and more exciting > by far, but you can get swept away in an undertow never to return! > > This project could be accomplished by merging elements from NetPd, Pdmtl, > and various slick patches made by the resident list geniuses. (Another thing > about NetPd if Roman and Eni are listening: can you make a tar.gz or zip > download of ALL current NetPd patches? I hate having to download 30+ items > one at a time. RTS fears again!) > > So there's my way more than 2 cents. Take what you will from it. > > ~Kyle > > > On Sun, Mar 8, 2009 at 2:53 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > >> On Mar 7, 2009, at 9:51 AM, Roman Haefeli wrote: >> >>> On Sat, 2009-03-07 at 11:26 +0100, Enrique Erne wrote: >>>> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >>>>> The Google Summer of Code ((http://code.google.com/soc/) application >>>>> is due very soon, March 9th, and we need mentors! At this point, >>>>> you >>>>> just need to put down your name. Then once the projects are in, >>>>> we'll >>>>> choose projects and who will mentor them. >>>>> Every pd developer who wants to support the project but is not >>>>> student >>>>> anymore is invited to join as mentor, since the number of sponsored >>>>> projects by google depends on the number of mentors and students. >>>> Andy, Claude, Frank, Marius, Mathieu, Roman where are you guys? >>>> >>>> add your names, hurry! :) >>> yo, i am happy to add my name, but i guess it only makes sense for >>> me to >>> take a mentorship of a project, that is about patching and not c >>> coding. >>> from what i have seen, there is only one project - undead - which >>> seems >>> to be about patching. derek holzer is already proposed as a mentor. >>> does >>> it make sense to propose more then one mentor for a project? >> You could also create a new project based on something like creating >> libraries out of all that useful code in netpd. Basically, think of >> something that you would like implemented in Pd that you could mentor. >> >> .hc >> >> >>> >>> roman >>> >>> >>> >>> ___________________________________________________________ >>> Telefonate ohne weitere Kosten vom PC zum PC: http:// >>> messenger.yahoo.de >> >> >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> If nature has made any one thing less susceptible than all others of >> exclusive property, it is the action of the thinking power called an >> idea, which an individual may exclusively possess as long as he keeps >> it to himself; but the moment it is divulged, it forces itself into >> the possession of everyone, and the receiver cannot dispossess himself >> of it. - Thomas Jefferson >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From kyleklip at gmail.com Fri Mar 13 18:37:22 2009 From: kyleklip at gmail.com (Kyle Klipowicz) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 12:37:22 -0500 Subject: [PD] EzPd (Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline!) Message-ID: Thanks everyone for your replies and suggestions! It's good to know I'm not alone in my frustrations. I would really love to work on this project, since it would make it easier for me to teach K-8 students about acoustics and math using Pd if there were more LEGO-like primitives to snap together easily. If we can get something like this up as a candidate for GSoC, some wonderful things could arise from it. Most definitely, the names should be very easy to understand. That is part of my frustration right now with Pd-extended. There is a wealth of stuff, but it's all named oddly by different people and is difficult to explore in a meaningful way. Part of me thinks that Pd-extended needs to cut the fat a little bit...maybe a Pd-intended version? Only including an organized catalog of well-named, glue-able parts that all play nice together? ~Kyle On Fri, Mar 13, 2009 at 12:12 PM, Enrique Erne wrote: > hi Kyle > > i love the idea of a Classic Unit Library (CUL?) > BBB - Beginners Building Blocks > WSP - (Where to Start with Pd) > WSP - warm swimming pool :) > > for me the first step would be to write some specs: > - coding style guide (who did it? luke?), license, naming convention, howto > contribute > and also analyze existing libs: pdmtl, rjlib maybe you could even just > build on them? > > i'd like to see the WSP Lib: > - bsd > - flat > - super simple black&white interfaces > - as pure as possible > - a minimum of possible dependencies > - not gopish ? > - howto contribute? > - with self explaining naming? > > > i'm just about to upload my zipped netpd directory. > http://netpd.org/eni/downloads/?C=M;O=D > (8.9MB because there are some samples) > > eni > > > > > > Kyle Klipowicz wrote: > >> How about this project: >> Beginners Building Blocks. >> >> Right now, If I want to even make a simple sine oscillator synth with an >> ADSR envelope on it, it's not very easy to do out of the box. What if >> there >> were some entry-level abstractions in a very OBVIOUS location that people >> could instantly piece together some classic Unit Generators. Important for >> these would be the ability to copy/paste items from a main page of >> abstractions. Also, they should have a simple GUI interface, and possibly >> be >> set up automatically to use SSAD. >> >> I'm thinking stuff like: >> >> -basic envelope generators >> -basic oscillators (bandlimited ones would be nice): sine, square, >> triangle, >> sawtooth >> -basic i/o that is more intuitive to newbies >> -basic sample players (one shot, looping, pitch shifting, multi-sample a >> la >> fluidsynth) >> -basic MIDI controller mapping tools (so people could just twist a knob to >> assign a parameter) >> -basic step, piano roll, &c sequencers >> -basic pitch/rhythm analysis (wrappers for sigmund~, fiddle~, and bonk~) >> -basic modular counters >> -an extensive collection of examples using these objects, documenting >> parameters, as well as ways to connect and/or modify and save new versions >> of objects using SSAD >> -video stuff would also be great, something akin to a freshened up >> PixelTango. >> >> Anyway, I just thought these things would be really nice to have in an >> accessible place in Pd-extended. Because right now whenever I just want to >> make something very simple, i end up having to click a mouse about 200 >> times >> which is annoying and makes me worried about RTS! >> >> Pd and Pd-extended are so difficult to navigate for newbies. There need to >> be more "pick up and go" audio tools. I'm thinking of how Reaktor and >> Max/MSP are so easy to dive into. Pd is a lot like a cold cold ocean >> whereas >> the other two are nice warm swimming pools. Pd is deeper and more exciting >> by far, but you can get swept away in an undertow never to return! >> >> This project could be accomplished by merging elements from NetPd, Pdmtl, >> and various slick patches made by the resident list geniuses. (Another >> thing >> about NetPd if Roman and Eni are listening: can you make a tar.gz or zip >> download of ALL current NetPd patches? I hate having to download 30+ items >> one at a time. RTS fears again!) >> >> So there's my way more than 2 cents. Take what you will from it. >> >> ~Kyle >> >> >> On Sun, Mar 8, 2009 at 2:53 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner >> wrote: >> >> On Mar 7, 2009, at 9:51 AM, Roman Haefeli wrote: >>> >>> On Sat, 2009-03-07 at 11:26 +0100, Enrique Erne wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> The Google Summer of Code ((http://code.google.com/soc/) application >>>>>> is due very soon, March 9th, and we need mentors! At this point, >>>>>> you >>>>>> just need to put down your name. Then once the projects are in, >>>>>> we'll >>>>>> choose projects and who will mentor them. >>>>>> Every pd developer who wants to support the project but is not >>>>>> student >>>>>> anymore is invited to join as mentor, since the number of sponsored >>>>>> projects by google depends on the number of mentors and students. >>>>>> >>>>> Andy, Claude, Frank, Marius, Mathieu, Roman where are you guys? >>>>> >>>>> add your names, hurry! :) >>>>> >>>> yo, i am happy to add my name, but i guess it only makes sense for >>>> me to >>>> take a mentorship of a project, that is about patching and not c >>>> coding. >>>> from what i have seen, there is only one project - undead - which >>>> seems >>>> to be about patching. derek holzer is already proposed as a mentor. >>>> does >>>> it make sense to propose more then one mentor for a project? >>>> >>> You could also create a new project based on something like creating >>> libraries out of all that useful code in netpd. Basically, think of >>> something that you would like implemented in Pd that you could mentor. >>> >>> .hc >>> >>> >>> >>>> roman >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ___________________________________________________________ >>>> Telefonate ohne weitere Kosten vom PC zum PC: http:// >>>> messenger.yahoo.de >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> >>> If nature has made any one thing less susceptible than all others of >>> exclusive property, it is the action of the thinking power called an >>> idea, which an individual may exclusively possess as long as he keeps >>> it to himself; but the moment it is divulged, it forces itself into >>> the possession of everyone, and the receiver cannot dispossess himself >>> of it. - Thomas Jefferson >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >>> >>> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> > > -- ----- ------------ ---- ----- ---- -------- - ------ http://perhapsidid.wordpress.com http://myspace.com/kyleklipowicz -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From matju at artengine.ca Fri Mar 13 18:57:36 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 13:57:36 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <49BA93FC.7020209@netpd.org> References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> <49B24BE4.5060702@netpd.org> <1236437479.8049.39.camel@yoyo2> <2AE574D7-078C-47BC-A548-41CC05E77BC8@eds.org> <49BA93FC.7020209@netpd.org> Message-ID: On Fri, 13 Mar 2009, Enrique Erne wrote: > - with self explaining naming? The problem with that is that long names still don't say how it works, and as people learn how it works, they don't need long names anymore, and it gets in the way a bit. What you need is not long names, it's a system so that mouseover would show the descriptions that you'd otherwise look up in help-intro.pd, and that are often missing for externals. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From hard.off at gmail.com Fri Mar 13 18:59:27 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 02:59:27 +0900 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <49BA93FC.7020209@netpd.org> References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> <49B24BE4.5060702@netpd.org> <1236437479.8049.39.camel@yoyo2> <2AE574D7-078C-47BC-A548-41CC05E77BC8@eds.org> <49BA93FC.7020209@netpd.org> Message-ID: <161320dd0903131059v731a00bk567dde6454a9e8f4@mail.gmail.com> i think this idea of making a unified library of patches is fantastic. but i don't think it should be a project given to a student with little experience in pd. i'd be more than happy to help out. what would be the best way to set up communications between us, if we take this on? that would be the first step i guess. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From matju at artengine.ca Fri Mar 13 19:08:27 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 14:08:27 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> Message-ID: On Thu, 12 Mar 2009, IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: > however, my experiences with abcde were the main reason i s did not > touch self-modifying patches for years and years. the lesson i learned > was: never do self-modification in patches that other people will ever > have to regularily use. (the original phrase would have been "never do > self-modification in patches that other people will ever have to > maintain"; however, this might give the impression that chances are low > that somebody else will really have to "maintain" a patch); in practice > you pass maintainership to somebody as soon as you give them your patch: > they will eventually start to modify it. Because self-modifying patches are more tricky and complicated than most other things, it's especially important to aggressively abstract them. If you can, you abstract them in a way that each self-modifying abstraction represents an elementary pattern that no-one will want to modify, because it's too basic and fundamental, and so there's nothing that one could possibly want to customise about them. Therefore all the aspects that make sense to customise will be in abstractions that themselves are not self-modifying, because they use elementary self-modifying abstractions instead. But that's not always easy to do or feasible. This concept can also be useful with lots more things than just self-modifying patches, but it's with self-modifying patches that there is the most payoff. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From fbar at footils.org Fri Mar 13 19:15:53 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 19:15:53 +0100 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> <49B24BE4.5060702@netpd.org> <1236437479.8049.39.camel@yoyo2> <2AE574D7-078C-47BC-A548-41CC05E77BC8@eds.org> Message-ID: <20090313181553.GA20042@fliwatut.scifi> Hallo, Kyle Klipowicz hat gesagt: // Kyle Klipowicz wrote: > How about this project: > Beginners Building Blocks. A lot of the goals you describe overlap with goals of the RjDj library, that the RjDj team (like Gunter Geiger, Amaury Hazan, Paul Brossier, myself and others) is working on. It's generally sssad-enabled and pure vanilla (even omitting expr). Some parts are specific to the targetted platform (mobile devices like iPod Touch and iPhone), so e.g. the touch screen interfacing is useless outside of that. Ciao -- Frank Barknecht Do You RjDj.me? _ ______footils.org__ From matju at artengine.ca Fri Mar 13 20:59:22 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 15:59:22 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] httpget: fun with tcpclient and pdstring In-Reply-To: References: <3930C1D8-5F05-4631-8A2B-CB88BA812969@eds.org> Message-ID: On Thu, 5 Mar 2009, Martin Peach wrote: > Mathieu Bouchard wrote: >> By floats, you mean a single float representing a single character? > Yes single character, any unicode character will fit in a float. Well, my question was not about whether they'd fit or not in a single float, but rather whether you were talking about supporting sequences of float messages as being a string. I just wanted to make clear that i believe that a message sequence "72,101,108,108,111" should be converted to a single list message "72 101 108 108 111" to make things easier. But now that I think of it, a float only represents a code-point. In most of the usage of unicode, a code-point = a character, but I've already encountered cases where I typed a character in two parts that are registered as one code-point each. I thought I never would. >> But now, La Question Qui Tue: if you do a [string append] on two strings of >> different format, what should be the format of the output? > The first argument of the object would be the name of a table, with a [set( > message to change it. Well, my goal was to come up with an idea of a [string append] that isn't array-centric, for example, or at least, doesn't look like it when you try to use it with something else than arrays. But if the $1 of [string append] means an array name when it's a symbol, then it can't mean a symbol whose letters would be turned into list elements or array elements, for example. >> Actually, there's another killer question: if you do a [string append] >> on two arrays, and that it is agreed that the output should go in an >> array, in which array does the output go? > If it's like a [strcat] it goes into the table named by its first argument, > or the most recent [set( message. Seems good. > I think instead of using zero to terminate the string the destination > table should be resized to the length of the resulting string. Ideally, yeah, many programming languages don't use zero-termination, including a bunch that used to use zero-termination and went away from it. (Those languages that used to still store it as a hidden element in the array, but that's an optimisation trick for interfacing with C, and it doesn't apply if your array is made of floats and not of bytes.) It would be a lot better if arrays could be resized in more flexible ways. That way, you could gradually add elements to it without fearing of hitting a mountain of redundant reallocations, that is, one per character added in a long sequence of strcats of single chars. For example, I made an implementation of t_binbuf in which "size" is distinguished from "capacity", and the difference between the two is some padding for future use. The capacity grows by bigger amounts than the size, so that the capacity doesn't have to grow as often. Many programming languages have arrays that work like this. Several of those also have an index for padding at the beginning so that you can gradually chop off elements at the beginning without having to copy the table a bunch of times. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From jancsika at yahoo.com Fri Mar 13 23:28:48 2009 From: jancsika at yahoo.com (Jonathan Wilkes) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 15:28:48 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] visible bang without output In-Reply-To: <49BA91B4.2060302@yahoo.fr> Message-ID: <830653.4928.qm@web65607.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Or you can just make your own bng, and add whatever features you want. -Jonathan --- On Fri, 3/13/09, Nicolas Montgermont wrote: > From: Nicolas Montgermont > Subject: Re: [PD] visible bang without output > To: "Hans-Christoph Steiner" > Cc: "pd" > Date: Friday, March 13, 2009, 6:02 PM > h?h?, > > Clever. i don't have the reflex to make mini-GOP. > Thanks, > > n > > Le 13/03/09 16:10, Hans-Christoph Steiner a ?crit : > > > > Make a GOP that uses the set message to control a > spigot. > > > > .hc > > > > On Mar 13, 2009, at 11:28 AM, Nicolas Montgermont > wrote: > > > >> Hi list, > >> > >> Is there a simple solution to have the GUI bang > visually shows a bang but without output? > >> As the others GUI object do with the set message. > >> [set bang( outputs a bang. > >> > >> Thanks, > >> > >> Nicolas > >> -- http://nim.on.free.fr > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > You can't steal a gift. Bird gave the world his > music, and if you can hear it, you can have it. - Dizzy > Gillespie > > > > > > > > > > -- http://nim.on.free.fr > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: ds-bng.pd Type: application/puredata Size: 4455 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: ds-bng2.pd Type: application/puredata Size: 4457 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: ds-bng-help.pd Type: application/puredata Size: 1046 bytes Desc: not available URL: From enrique at netpd.org Sat Mar 14 00:02:34 2009 From: enrique at netpd.org (Enrique Erne) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 00:02:34 +0100 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> <49B24BE4.5060702@netpd.org> <1236437479.8049.39.camel@yoyo2> <2AE574D7-078C-47BC-A548-41CC05E77BC8@eds.org> <49BA93FC.7020209@netpd.org> Message-ID: <49BAE60A.4030005@netpd.org> Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > On Fri, 13 Mar 2009, Enrique Erne wrote: > >> - with self explaining naming? > > The problem with that is that long names still don't say how it works, > and as people learn how it works, they don't need long names anymore, > and it gets in the way a bit. What you need is not long names, it's a > system so that mouseover would show the descriptions that you'd > otherwise look up in help-intro.pd, and that are often missing for > externals. wasn't that tooltip feature implement in desiredata? maybe one could port this as a own GSoC project to puredata. i don't think names have to be fully self explaining, but at least that you get the clue of what the abstraction might do. rjlib and pdmtl seems pretty nice. From mis at artengine.ca Sat Mar 14 04:16:42 2009 From: mis at artengine.ca (Michal Seta) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 23:16:42 -0400 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> Message-ID: See also [panN~] in xjimmies for an example of simple dynamically built abstraction that adapts to the number of channels you need for panning. ./MiS From shima at pspunch.com Sat Mar 14 06:09:58 2009 From: shima at pspunch.com (PSPunch) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 14:09:58 +0900 Subject: [PD] Gem to screensaver In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49BB3C26.9070401@pspunch.com> > Hey guys > > Possibly a noob question but is it possible to package a generative gem > patch as a screensaver? How would I go about this? Attached files contain what may be a working solution under Windows. Quick starter: (Assuming you have Pd installed under 'c:\Program Files\pd\) 1. Store the following 3 files under 'c:\' 1) pd_scr.pd 2) pd_scr_helper.pd 3) pd_scr.bat 2. Set the attached file 'pd_scr.scr' as your screen saver. etc. 'pd_scr.scr' is a simple program that launches 'c:\pd_src.bat' pd_scr_edit.bat starts up with the -noloadbang option added for ease of editing. -- David Shimamoto -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: pd_scr.zip Type: application/x-zip-compressed Size: 6925 bytes Desc: not available URL: From czhenry at gmail.com Sat Mar 14 15:05:21 2009 From: czhenry at gmail.com (Charles Henry) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 09:05:21 -0500 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <7aaf8bb90903121621o6547cfa4l72c207b864af6beb@mail.gmail.com> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> <49B931F5.80107@ucdavis.edu> <20090312164311.GF8088@footils.org> <7aaf8bb90903121621o6547cfa4l72c207b864af6beb@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <518fe7b20903140705x49f7a617paf0796850407e057@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, Mar 12, 2009 at 6:21 PM, Luke Iannini wrote: > Yes, the better solution methinks would be a vanilla* "savebang" to > clear out the dynamic subpatch just before save. ?But I suppose that > requires acknowledging dynamic patching. > > lxi > > *the [tot]-based method just does not work reliably To mention programming languages, here (I wouldn't propose to open this can of worms, but to look at the options for a more complete programming style in Pd) I think this makes sense from a programming languages point of view. If you're creating a dynamic-based abstraction, it should be analogous to writing a class. There is a way to write the code for a "new" or "create" routine in your class via [loadbang], so you need a way to code a "free" or "delete" routine as well. A selective-save feature would be a more pragmatic approach for Pd users. I think of data-structures in C, where you add a pointer in your struct. You can later dynamically allocate memory for an array and set the pointer, but the structure itself does not include the dynamically created array. However, I think that coding a new method would be expensive and problematic. What set of operations is necessary to be able to create dynamic patching capability? Do you think there's a top-down design based approach to outline the necessary principles for it? Chuck From zmoelnig at iem.at Sat Mar 14 16:22:32 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?IOhannes_m_zm=F6lnig?=) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 16:22:32 +0100 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <518fe7b20903140705x49f7a617paf0796850407e057@mail.gmail.com> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> <49B931F5.80107@ucdavis.edu> <20090312164311.GF8088@footils.org> <7aaf8bb90903121621o6547cfa4l72c207b864af6beb@mail.gmail.com> <518fe7b20903140705x49f7a617paf0796850407e057@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49BBCBB8.1050809@iem.at> Charles Henry wrote: > > There is a way to write the code for a "new" or "create" routine in > your class via [loadbang], where did you get that impression from? [loadbang] does _not_ work as a constructor (it's too late). that's why i had written [initbang], which unfortunately never made it into Pd. > so you need a way to code a "free" or > "delete" routine as well. that's why i had written [closebang], which (surprise!) never made it into Pd either mfga.s IOhannes From jmmmpais at googlemail.com Sat Mar 14 16:35:15 2009 From: jmmmpais at googlemail.com (=?iso-8859-15?Q?Jo=E3o_Pais?=) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 15:35:15 -0000 Subject: [PD] dyn~ and writesf~? Message-ID: Hi, I was trying to use a writesf~ inside a dyn~ (xp). The audio files get generated, but with no audio inside. Does anyone used this combination sucessfully so far? (XP here) All the connections were in place, of course. I haven't any example patch here, but maybe can send it later. Best, Jo?o Pais -- Friedenstr. 58 10249 Berlin (Deutschland) Tel +49 30 42020091 | Mob +49 162 6843570 jmmmpais at googlemail.com | skype: jmmmpjmmmp From achim.bornhoeft at googlemail.com Sat Mar 14 17:13:25 2009 From: achim.bornhoeft at googlemail.com (Achim Bornhoeft) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 17:13:25 +0100 Subject: [PD] 8ch diffusion Message-ID: Can anybody help me to extend this patch from 4ch to 8ch? (I found it somewhere...) Or is there an even easier (better) way to do the same. I already tried [vbap] but the objects [define_loudspeaker] and [matrix~] are not recognized by my PD-Extended 40.3 on Max OS 10.5. (see other attachment). Many thanks in advance for your help, Achim Achim Bornhoeft Neckarhalde 38, D-72070 Tuebingen tel/fax +49 (0)7071 942745 mobil +49 (0)179 6936930 skype:achim.bornhoeft?call www.bornhoeft.org -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: 4ch-grid.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 2519 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: vbap-test.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 1293 bytes Desc: not available URL: From matju at artengine.ca Sat Mar 14 17:33:33 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 12:33:33 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] 8ch diffusion In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Sat, 14 Mar 2009, Achim Bornhoeft wrote: > Can anybody help me to extend this patch from 4ch to 8ch? Well, I don't really have any experience with spatialisation, but if you're trying to make a rectangular-prism structure from a rectangle structure, you will need to add a 3rd [expr], add a new [inlet] and [/ 200], add four more [t f b] 50 [line~] [outlet~], and quadruple the number of [*]. The latter is because now each corner is made by multiplying two things together, and what you want is probably multiplying three things together, so you need 2 [*] per channel. Look at the pattern of wires, how it tries all four combinations of going through [expr] and not going through it, and how the number of combinations grows to 8 when adding a third inlet, and that to multiply the third inlet (or its [expr] counterpart) you need the extra [*] for each. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From matju at artengine.ca Sat Mar 14 17:43:04 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 12:43:04 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49BBCBB8.1050809@iem.at> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> <49B931F5.80107@ucdavis.edu> <20090312164311.GF8088@footils.org> <7aaf8bb90903121621o6547cfa4l72c207b864af6beb@mail.gmail.com> <518fe7b20903140705x49f7a617paf0796850407e057@mail.gmail.com> <49BBCBB8.1050809@iem.at> Message-ID: On Sat, 14 Mar 2009, IOhannes m zm?lnig wrote: > where did you get that impression from? [loadbang] does _not_ work as a > constructor (it's too late). that's why i had written [initbang], which > unfortunately never made it into Pd. >> so you need a way to code a "free" or "delete" routine as well. > that's why i had written [closebang], which (surprise!) never made it > into Pd either Well, you could start a fund for this feature on paypal, the Miller-SourceForge Bug Ticket Denial-of-Service Attack Fund (MSFBTDoSAF). Because if someone doesn't understand, then maybe the message has to be repeated. kidding, of course. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From dmotd at gmx.net Sat Mar 14 18:01:52 2009 From: dmotd at gmx.net (dmotd) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 03:01:52 +1000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49BBCBB8.1050809@iem.at> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <518fe7b20903140705x49f7a617paf0796850407e057@mail.gmail.com> <49BBCBB8.1050809@iem.at> Message-ID: <200903150301.53050.dmotd@gmx.net> i received this rationale from miller not too long ago for the hesitation in including iohannes' methods: "Anyhow, I'm trying to think of a better mechanism for allowing abstractions to have variable numbers of inlets/outlets, so I'm hoping initbang won't be necessary in the long run. closebang, though, will probably be needed in some form or other." so it's obviously still a work in progress, regardless initbang/closebang are at least fairly consistent with constructor/destructor methods in other languages. we'll see where this goes. cheers, dmotd IOhannes m zm?lnig wrote: > Charles Henry wrote: > > There is a way to write the code for a "new" or "create" routine in > > your class via [loadbang], > > where did you get that impression from? > [loadbang] does _not_ work as a constructor (it's too late). > that's why i had written [initbang], which unfortunately never made it > into Pd. > > > so you need a way to code a "free" or > > "delete" routine as well. > > that's why i had written [closebang], which (surprise!) never made it > into Pd either > > > mfga.s > IOhannes > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From errordeveloper at gmail.com Sat Mar 14 21:06:25 2009 From: errordeveloper at gmail.com (errordeveloper at gmail.com) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 20:06:25 +0000 Subject: [PD] GEM on Linux netbook In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20090314200625.GA7254@00110101.errordevlopment.0> On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 10:58:54AM -0500, Ben Baker-Smith wrote: > I currently use a Macbook (OS 10.5) for all my PD patching. However, as I > am primarily focused on using GEM for live video performance alongside > musical groups, I am thinking about getting a second laptop for performances > (to keep my Macbook safe). > > I'm thinking of getting an Acer Aspire One netbook running linux. > better install a popular distro instead of the Linpus thing which acer ships ;) > I'd like to know the pros and cons of this. > > -Will swapping patches between Mac OS and Linux be a problem (I'm guessing > no, but I figured I'd ask)? > > -I've heard of some problems with VGA out on Linux laptops, is this going to > be an issue? what is that about? > > -Does the netbook have enough processing power for general GEM > applications? I'm usually not dealing with video files, but rather particle > generation, shape manipulation, GIF texturing, and audio-response. On my > Macbook (2.0 GHz intel processor) the CPU meter always shows below 50% usage > (of course, that's not to say that it doesn't freeze up and boot me out > sometimes). none of them "netbooks" will cope with that stuff! why did you think of a such low-end machine for such a task?!? > > -Are there any other issues that you think of given this scenario? and if > so, what other affordable/really-cheap laptops are there out there that I > can run linux on? > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From gr at grrrr.org Sat Mar 14 23:17:09 2009 From: gr at grrrr.org (Thomas Grill) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 23:17:09 +0100 Subject: [PD] dyn~ and writesf~? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi, an example patch would be helpful - i have not encountered any problems so far. gr~~~ 2009/3/14 Jo?o Pais : > Hi, > > I was trying to use a writesf~ inside a dyn~ (xp). The audio files get > generated, but with no audio inside. Does anyone used this combination > sucessfully so far? (XP here) > All the connections were in place, of course. > > I haven't any example patch here, but maybe can send it later. > > Best, > > Jo?o Pais > > -- > Friedenstr. 58 > 10249 Berlin (Deutschland) > Tel +49 30 42020091 | Mob +49 162 6843570 > jmmmpais at googlemail.com | skype: jmmmpjmmmp > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -- Thomas Grill http://grrrr.org From jmmmpais at googlemail.com Sun Mar 15 03:46:22 2009 From: jmmmpais at googlemail.com (=?iso-8859-15?Q?Jo=E3o_Pais?=) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 02:46:22 -0000 Subject: [PD] dyn~ and writesf~? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: here it is. it needs my abstraction rec-name. in case you don't have pd-ext, I send it with this. just to repeat, output of this patch is an empty audio file - the duration is right. > Hi, an example patch would be helpful - i have not encountered any > problems so far. > gr~~~ > > 2009/3/14 Jo?o Pais : >> Hi, >> >> I was trying to use a writesf~ inside a dyn~ (xp). The audio files get >> generated, but with no audio inside. Does anyone used this combination >> sucessfully so far? (XP here) >> All the connections were in place, of course. >> >> I haven't any example patch here, but maybe can send it later. >> >> Best, >> >> Jo?o Pais >> >> -- >> Friedenstr. 58 >> 10249 Berlin (Deutschland) >> Tel +49 30 42020091 | Mob +49 162 6843570 >> jmmmpais at googlemail.com | skype: jmmmpjmmmp >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> > > > -- Friedenstr. 58 10249 Berlin (Deutschland) Tel +49 30 42020091 | Mob +49 162 6843570 jmmmpais at googlemail.com | skype: jmmmpjmmmp -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: aufnahme~-dyn.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 1019 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: rec-name.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 3481 bytes Desc: not available URL: From danomatika at gmail.com Sun Mar 15 04:28:37 2009 From: danomatika at gmail.com (danomatika) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 04:28:37 +0100 Subject: [PD] Unified Library was Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! Message-ID: <1237087717.7695.8.camel@danoT500> Count me in ... I think we just need to make a wiki page and all agree on patching conventions as well as who can/should do what ... oh and mailing lists? My patches are focused on allowing me to playback midi files to run a drum machine, live effects for guitar and vocals, generative or sequenced analog style bass/lead synths, and easy mixing/bussing etc. I do not have a dsp/digital approach to Pd, but I'm sure there's plenty who do ... this could be a good collaborative project for sure. i think this idea of making a unified library of patches is fantastic. but i don't think it should be a project given to a student with little experience in pd. i'd be more than happy to help out. what would be the best way to set up communications between us, if we take this on? that would be the first step i guess. --- Dan Wilcox danomatika.com robotcowboy.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kyleklip at gmail.com Sun Mar 15 05:05:44 2009 From: kyleklip at gmail.com (Kyle Klipowicz) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 23:05:44 -0500 Subject: [PD] Unified Library was Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <1237087717.7695.8.camel@danoT500> References: <1237087717.7695.8.camel@danoT500> Message-ID: Maybe take a vote and see what convention is most popular: pdmtl, s-abstractions, rjlib, netpd, or others I am not remembering. Then, figure out which items from other libraries should be ported first to this convention. Next, give this library a special status within Pd-extended so that people know they can go to it very easily, rather than getting mired down in the list of funny names that is currently the examples folder. A wiki is a good idea for the API f'sho. I am thinking pdmtl right now, but have not looked at s-abs or rjlib very closely. Netpd is very nice too, just needs to be categorized like pdmtl. ~Kyle On Sat, Mar 14, 2009 at 10:28 PM, danomatika wrote: > Count me in ... I think we just need to make a wiki page and all agree on > patching conventions as well as who can/should do what ... oh and mailing > lists? > > My patches are focused on allowing me to playback midi files to run a drum > machine, live effects for guitar and vocals, generative or sequenced analog > style bass/lead synths, and easy mixing/bussing etc. I do not have a > dsp/digital approach to Pd, but I'm sure there's plenty who do ... this > could be a good collaborative project for sure. > > i think this idea of making a unified library of patches is fantastic. > but > i don't think it should be a project given to a student with little > experience in pd. > > i'd be more than happy to help out. > > what would be the best way to set up communications between us, if we take > this on? that would be the first step i guess. > > --- > Dan Wilcox > danomatika.com > robotcowboy.com > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > -- ----- ------------ ---- ----- ---- -------- - ------ http://perhapsidid.wordpress.com http://myspace.com/kyleklipowicz -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hard.off at gmail.com Sun Mar 15 07:34:28 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 15:34:28 +0900 Subject: [PD] read sysex files (hex) Message-ID: <161320dd0903142334m2c11d345j8ce900c2f3bdf8db@mail.gmail.com> is there a way to read .syx files in pd? these are in raw hex format. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hard.off at gmail.com Sun Mar 15 08:44:03 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 16:44:03 +0900 Subject: [PD] change samplerate locally Message-ID: <161320dd0903150044o40e499aexd3701171746e3d5b@mail.gmail.com> to re-create the sound of a dx7 i need to change samplerate from my default (44.1khz) to 28khz. globally changing pd's samplerate to 28khz has the intended effect, but i want to be able to run other patches at 44.1khz while running my dx7 at 28khz. i naively tried adding this construct to the output, but the sound is completely wrong: (if it doesn't show, the phasor~ is connected to the right inlet of the [samplehold~]) [inlet~] [phasor~ 28000] | | [samplehold~] | [outlet~] i thought about it for a bit, and i understand why that doesn't work, but i can't think of another solution. is there some way i can 'mimic' 28khz samplerate while running pd at 44.1? or even better, is there some way to locally set the samplerate for a patch? i tried messing round with [block~] but i can't make it do what i need. also, i need to mimic a 12bit DAC~ too. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hard.off at gmail.com Sun Mar 15 09:29:01 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 17:29:01 +0900 Subject: [PD] change samplerate locally In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903150044o40e499aexd3701171746e3d5b@mail.gmail.com> References: <161320dd0903150044o40e499aexd3701171746e3d5b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <161320dd0903150129t293812c0tada3ce93352830b5@mail.gmail.com> so, i thought about this more, and realized that 28hz is quite close to being 2/3 of 44.1 so, it MIGHT be enough to do the following: for every 3 samples, output the first sample, the second sample, and then instead of playing the 3rd sample, repeat the second sample. so, if my block looks like: 0.597, 0.604, 0.628, 0.651.. then the output block would be 0.597, 0.604, 0.604, 0.651 ... i still have no idea how i would do that. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From fbar at footils.org Sun Mar 15 10:50:19 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 10:50:19 +0100 Subject: [PD] 8ch diffusion In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20090315095019.GB18220@fliwatut.scifi> Hallo, Achim Bornhoeft hat gesagt: // Achim Bornhoeft wrote: > Can anybody help me to extend this patch from 4ch to 8ch? (I found it > somewhere...) Or is there an even easier (better) way to do the same. I > already tried [vbap] but the objects [define_loudspeaker] and [matrix~] > are not recognized by my PD-Extended 40.3 on Max OS 10.5. (see other > attachment). Attached is a cosine-panner that I built to pan sounds accross a 12x5 speaker matrix [1] (with help by Peter Plessas, thanks again!). If you want to pan to that many outputs, I highly recommend to use the iemmatrix objects, they make things much easier. Never use [matrix~] that object is nameclash-polluted, use [mtx_mul~] instead, an example is in the cospan help file. Anway you can pan with just [*~] as well using [cospan], it's just a lot more patching work, more error prone and slower. The basic idea is to create as many [cospan ] objects as you need. Say you want to pan over 4 channels left to right, you create these: [cospan 0 4] [cospan 1 4] [cospan 2 4] [cospan 3 4] and send each of them a position in degrees from 0-360. The left outlet of cospan will output the raw amplitudes of the respective channel, the right one will output messages for [mtx_mul~]. Now if you want two-dimennsional panning, you duplicate the setup for each the vertical or y-axis. See cospan16to9.pd for how I did it for the speaker wall (which is called "16:9" although it only has 12x5 speakers.) HOTH [1] this one: http://footils.org/cms/weblog/2008/jul/28/schusslig-17-beta/ Ciao -- Frank Barknecht Do You RjDj.me? _ ______footils.org__ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... 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In-Reply-To: References: <1237087717.7695.8.camel@danoT500> Message-ID: <11627B2D-E126-4977-9981-6F46C275CE9A@eds.org> There are lots of great ideas in all of those libraries, and I think Pd would be really well served having a big grand unified collection of libraries. But I think that we don't really know well enough how to do the whole thing right. So we really should think of this as some stepping stones. That is why I have been advocating for people to take on specific libraries first, like a filter lib, or a midi lib, or a mapping lib, etc. Then in thru that process we can both figure out how to build the whole grand unified scheme, and build up the chunks while we are at it. .hc On Mar 15, 2009, at 4:05 AM, Kyle Klipowicz wrote: > Maybe take a vote and see what convention is most popular: pdmtl, s- > abstractions, rjlib, netpd, or others I am not remembering. > > Then, figure out which items from other libraries should be ported > first to this convention. > > Next, give this library a special status within Pd-extended so that > people know they can go to it very easily, rather than getting mired > down in the list of funny names that is currently the examples folder. > > A wiki is a good idea for the API f'sho. I am thinking pdmtl right > now, but have not looked at s-abs or rjlib very closely. Netpd is > very nice too, just needs to be categorized like pdmtl. > > ~Kyle > > On Sat, Mar 14, 2009 at 10:28 PM, danomatika > wrote: > Count me in ... I think we just need to make a wiki page and all > agree on patching conventions as well as who can/should do what ... > oh and mailing lists? > > My patches are focused on allowing me to playback midi files to run > a drum machine, live effects for guitar and vocals, generative or > sequenced analog style bass/lead synths, and easy mixing/bussing > etc. I do not have a dsp/digital approach to Pd, but I'm sure > there's plenty who do ... this could be a good collaborative project > for sure. > > i think this idea of making a unified library of patches is > fantastic. but > i don't think it should be a project given to a student with little > experience in pd. > > i'd be more than happy to help out. > > what would be the best way to set up communications between us, if > we take > this on? that would be the first step i guess. > --- > Dan Wilcox > danomatika.com > robotcowboy.com > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > -- > ----- > ------------ > ---- ----- > ---- -------- - ------ > http://perhapsidid.wordpress.com > http://myspace.com/kyleklipowicz > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Computer science is no more related to the computer than astronomy is related to the telescope. -Edsger Dykstra -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From purengo at gmail.com Sun Mar 15 16:08:53 2009 From: purengo at gmail.com (Nicanor Garcia) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 10:08:53 -0500 Subject: [PD] Pd-extended on AMD 64 Message-ID: <5f57e84f0903150808v565dfe7ctfc3bae5e4cc41fff@mail.gmail.com> Hello, I'm trying to install the published .deb package for amd64 but I'm havint trouble with the needed libs. I'm using a amd64 machine with Studio 64 as OS. When I try to install with dpkg it tells me that I need to have liblame0 installed, but liblame0 is incompatible with libquicktime1 which is also needed to install. I'm a bit novice in linux and I don't know what to do, can anyone help me with this?? Thank you very much. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From achim.bornhoeft at googlemail.com Sun Mar 15 16:36:14 2009 From: achim.bornhoeft at googlemail.com (Achim Bornhoeft) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 16:36:14 +0100 Subject: [PD] 8ch diffusion In-Reply-To: <20090315095019.GB18220@fliwatut.scifi> References: <20090315095019.GB18220@fliwatut.scifi> Message-ID: Hello Frank, thank you very much for your patches. I'll have a look at it very soon. Because of [mtx_mul~] I would like to add iemmatrix to my path list. How can I set a new search path for a library when the folder is inside the PD package (because I can't open the PD Contents from the window that opens.) Thanks for help. Achim Am 15.03.2009 um 10:50 schrieb Frank Barknecht: > Hallo, > Achim Bornhoeft hat gesagt: // Achim Bornhoeft wrote: > >> Can anybody help me to extend this patch from 4ch to 8ch? (I found it >> somewhere...) Or is there an even easier (better) way to do the >> same. I >> already tried [vbap] but the objects [define_loudspeaker] and >> [matrix~] >> are not recognized by my PD-Extended 40.3 on Max OS 10.5. (see other >> attachment). > > Attached is a cosine-panner that I built to pan sounds accross a 12x5 > speaker matrix [1] (with help by Peter Plessas, thanks again!). If you > want to pan to that many outputs, I highly recommend to use the > iemmatrix objects, they make things much easier. Never use [matrix~] > that object is nameclash-polluted, use [mtx_mul~] instead, an example > is in the cospan help file. > > Anway you can pan with just [*~] as well using [cospan], it's just a > lot more patching work, more error prone and slower. > > The basic idea is to create as many [cospan ] > objects as you need. Say you want to pan over 4 channels left to > right, you create these: > > [cospan 0 4] > [cospan 1 4] > [cospan 2 4] > [cospan 3 4] > > and send each of them a position in degrees from 0-360. The left > outlet of cospan will output the raw amplitudes of the respective > channel, the right one will output messages for [mtx_mul~]. > > Now if you want two-dimennsional panning, you duplicate the setup for > each the vertical or y-axis. See cospan16to9.pd for how I did it for > the speaker wall (which is called "16:9" although it only has 12x5 > speakers.) > > HOTH > > [1] this one: http://footils.org/cms/weblog/2008/jul/28/schusslig-17-beta/ > > Ciao > -- > Frank Barknecht Do You RjDj.me? _ > ______footils.org__ > help > .pd > > > < > cospan > .pd > > > < > cospan12 > ~ > .pd > > > < > cospan16to9 > ~.pd>_______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list Achim Bornhoeft Neckarhalde 38, D-72070 Tuebingen tel/fax +49 (0)7071 942745 mobil +49 (0)179 6936930 skype:achim.bornhoeft?call www.bornhoeft.org From danomatika at gmail.com Sun Mar 15 17:13:34 2009 From: danomatika at gmail.com (danomatika) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 17:13:34 +0100 Subject: [PD] The PdCon09 webpage is down ... am I too late? Message-ID: <1237133614.11190.0.camel@danoT500> Does the PdCon 09 page work for anyone? Naturally, I forgot to apply and realized it is due today and now the page is down ... :( --- Dan Wilcox danomatika.com robotcowboy.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gr at grrrr.org Sun Mar 15 17:25:28 2009 From: gr at grrrr.org (Thomas Grill) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 17:25:28 +0100 Subject: [PD] dyn~ and writesf~? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Thanks - i can reproduce the problem... the solution will take a bit, though. please stand by, gr~~~ Am 15.03.2009 um 03:46 schrieb Jo?o Pais: > here it is. it needs my abstraction rec-name. in case you don't have > pd-ext, I send it with this. > > just to repeat, output of this patch is an empty audio file - the > duration is right. > > >> Hi, an example patch would be helpful - i have not encountered any >> problems so far. >> gr~~~ >> >> 2009/3/14 Jo?o Pais : >>> Hi, >>> >>> I was trying to use a writesf~ inside a dyn~ (xp). The audio files >>> get >>> generated, but with no audio inside. Does anyone used this >>> combination >>> sucessfully so far? (XP here) >>> All the connections were in place, of course. >>> >>> I haven't any example patch here, but maybe can send it later. >>> >>> Best, >>> >>> Jo?o Pais >>> >>> -- >>> Friedenstr. 58 >>> 10249 Berlin (Deutschland) >>> Tel +49 30 42020091 | Mob +49 162 6843570 >>> jmmmpais at googlemail.com | skype: jmmmpjmmmp >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >>> >> >> >> > > > > -- > Friedenstr. 58 > 10249 Berlin (Deutschland) > Tel +49 30 42020091 | Mob +49 162 6843570 > jmmmpais at googlemail.com | skype: jmmmpjmmmp name.pd> From jmmmpais at googlemail.com Sun Mar 15 17:37:23 2009 From: jmmmpais at googlemail.com (=?iso-8859-15?Q?Jo=E3o_Pais?=) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 16:37:23 -0000 Subject: [PD] steep filter? Message-ID: Hi, does anyone has a good suggestion for a very steep filter? Preferably something that cuts through the frequencies without any rollof at all? (if possible) I've tried the iemlib hp10_** filters, also 2 in a row, but the result is still too gradual. Putting 16 lop~ in a row make makes roughly the same result. I wanted to avoid fft filters, because they might alter the original signal. Or is there any other option? (even if it has to be fft) cheers, Jo?o -- Friedenstr. 58 10249 Berlin (Deutschland) Tel +49 30 42020091 | Mob +49 162 6843570 jmmmpais at googlemail.com | skype: jmmmpjmmmp From martin.peach at sympatico.ca Sun Mar 15 17:36:30 2009 From: martin.peach at sympatico.ca (Martin Peach) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 12:36:30 -0400 Subject: [PD] change samplerate locally In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903150044o40e499aexd3701171746e3d5b@mail.gmail.com> References: <161320dd0903150044o40e499aexd3701171746e3d5b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: hard off wrote: > to re-create the sound of a dx7 i need to change samplerate from my > default (44.1khz) to 28khz. > globally changing pd's samplerate to 28khz has the intended effect, but > i want to be able to run other patches at 44.1khz while running my dx7 > at 28khz. > I think that the sound card decides what sample rates you can use, you probably can get 22.5 and 11.25 but not 28. A clean resampling usually would mean sampling at a common multiple of 28kHz and 44.1kHz and then downsampling again, not really feasible with Pd. > i naively tried adding this construct to the output, but the sound is > completely wrong: > (if it doesn't show, the phasor~ is connected to the right inlet of the > [samplehold~]) > > [inlet~] [phasor~ 28000] > | | > [samplehold~] > | > [outlet~] > > i thought about it for a bit, and i understand why that doesn't work, > but i can't think of another solution. > > is there some way i can 'mimic' 28khz samplerate while running pd at > 44.1? or even better, is there some way to locally set the samplerate > for a patch? i tried messing round with [block~] but i can't make it do > what i need. > Unless you're looking for aliasing artifacts, wouldn't it be easier to use a multi-pole low-pass filter at around 14kHz? > also, i need to mimic a 12bit DAC~ too. For that you could multiply the samples by 2048 (for bipolar signal) and then divide them modulo 2048, like this: [*~ 2048] | [expr~ $v1%2048] | [/~ 2048] | [dac~] Martin From hard.off at gmail.com Sun Mar 15 18:00:26 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 02:00:26 +0900 Subject: [PD] Unified Library was Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <11627B2D-E126-4977-9981-6F46C275CE9A@eds.org> References: <1237087717.7695.8.camel@danoT500> <11627B2D-E126-4977-9981-6F46C275CE9A@eds.org> Message-ID: <161320dd0903151000n626f6134h19ea91c5757a76a0@mail.gmail.com> >>But I think that we don't really know well enough how to do the whole thing right<< i have good experience in doing a library wrong. :) i can at least point out the flaws in that so they don't get repeated. none of the libraries are very good general all-purpose toolkits though, in my opinion. i guess that's mainly because none of them have really been designed as general toolkits. there is heaps of good stuff in rjdj, but it's all for the phone, which has no pd GUI component. netpd on the other hand, everything has a gui, and it's all designed to work well as a part of the netpd system. but it's a little bit tricky to then use the netpd patches outside of netpd. not really spent too much time with pdmtl, but that just seems like more of a collection of patches than an actual library. s-abstractions and the diy library i did both fall down a bit for me because they tie the functionality of the patches in too much with the gui and state saving. i think what hans is talking about and what we are discussing might be completely different things though. i think hans is talking about a truly unified library to join together all the different pieces in pd-extended and put them all together in a logical and user-friendly manner. which would be a pretty massive project, i admit. i think though, what we're talking about here is more just like a collection of tools to build synths, sequencers, effects, samplers, recorders, soundfile players, etc etc etc. most of the libraries already mentioned are doing that. but the problem is that there are no unified conventions for patching, naming, licencing, etc. and it would be nice to have all the best and most useful bits of each library in one place, all working together, and all very simply and easily ported into other pd projects. i think it's well within our reach to do that at the moment. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hard.off at gmail.com Sun Mar 15 18:33:50 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 02:33:50 +0900 Subject: [PD] change samplerate locally In-Reply-To: References: <161320dd0903150044o40e499aexd3701171746e3d5b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <161320dd0903151033j7d543672yfb3521e6b466789@mail.gmail.com> hi martin, thanks for taking the time to reply. i can set pd to whatever samplerate i want in media->audio settings. i just checked again going through a whole bunch of values between 22050 and 44100 and they all work. my problem is that the samplerate is global, and i need it only to be local. i think the 'solution' i suggested in my 2nd post is going to be the way to do it, but i just don't know how to do that. [*~ 2048] > | > [expr~ $v1%2048] > | > [/~ 2048] > thanks. that's what i had done originally, but i couldn't hear any effect. i guess if i really want 12-bit sound in pd, i'd have to use that construct after each and every calculation in the signal chain. seems a fair bit of overkill just to make the sound WORSE though! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hard.off at gmail.com Sun Mar 15 18:37:58 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 02:37:58 +0900 Subject: [PD] steep filter? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <161320dd0903151037u6caa3f54p3ac85c7f5546d303@mail.gmail.com> it's not possible to filter without ANY roll-off as far as i know. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jmmmpais at googlemail.com Sun Mar 15 18:57:52 2009 From: jmmmpais at googlemail.com (=?iso-8859-15?Q?Jo=E3o_Pais?=) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 17:57:52 -0000 Subject: [PD] steep filter? In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903151037u6caa3f54p3ac85c7f5546d303@mail.gmail.com> References: <161320dd0903151037u6caa3f54p3ac85c7f5546d303@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: and close to that? just like the spectral trim in audition or something similar. > it's not possible to filter without ANY roll-off as far as i know. -- Friedenstr. 58 10249 Berlin (Deutschland) Tel +49 30 42020091 | Mob +49 162 6843570 jmmmpais at googlemail.com | skype: jmmmpjmmmp From hard.off at gmail.com Sun Mar 15 19:02:49 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 03:02:49 +0900 Subject: [PD] steep filter? In-Reply-To: References: <161320dd0903151037u6caa3f54p3ac85c7f5546d303@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <161320dd0903151102s1346f4d2kdfb0f94593ea8e28@mail.gmail.com> chebychev filters look good, elliptic ones look better: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Electronic_linear_filters.svg -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hard.off at gmail.com Sun Mar 15 19:26:44 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 03:26:44 +0900 Subject: [PD] change samplerate locally In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903151033j7d543672yfb3521e6b466789@mail.gmail.com> References: <161320dd0903150044o40e499aexd3701171746e3d5b@mail.gmail.com> <161320dd0903151033j7d543672yfb3521e6b466789@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <161320dd0903151126y2432df25s537be23a042564f4@mail.gmail.com> actually, i just checked and that method i suggested before doesn't work at all. it's the same as the [phasor~ 28000] - [samphold~] effect. martin, i missed this part of your mail before: >>Unless you're looking for aliasing artifacts, wouldn't it be easier to use a multi-pole low-pass filter at around 14kHz?<< i just tried that, and i guess what i need must be the aliasing artifacts. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From martin.peach at sympatico.ca Sun Mar 15 19:31:51 2009 From: martin.peach at sympatico.ca (Martin Peach) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 14:31:51 -0400 Subject: [PD] change samplerate locally In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903151033j7d543672yfb3521e6b466789@mail.gmail.com> References: <161320dd0903150044o40e499aexd3701171746e3d5b@mail.gmail.com> <161320dd0903151033j7d543672yfb3521e6b466789@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: hard off wrote: > hi martin, thanks for taking the time to reply. > > i can set pd to whatever samplerate i want in media->audio settings. i > just checked again going through a whole bunch of values between 22050 > and 44100 and they all work. Yes you're right. I should have checked first ;) Maybe writing into a table at 44100 and using [tabread4~] with a signal that is quantized to the ratio of sample rates would work? > > my problem is that the samplerate is global, and i need it only to be > local. i think the 'solution' i suggested in my 2nd post is going to be > the way to do it, but i just don't know how to do that. > > > [*~ 2048] > | > [expr~ $v1%2048] > | > [/~ 2048] > > > thanks. that's what i had done originally, but i couldn't hear any > effect. i guess if i really want 12-bit sound in pd, i'd have to use > that construct after each and every calculation in the signal chain. > seems a fair bit of overkill just to make the sound WORSE though! > > Well 12-bit sound is pretty good, as good as audio cassette with no dolby. You should try replacing 2048 with 128 or less to hear true lo-fi. Martin From zmoelnig at iem.at Sun Mar 15 19:58:12 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (=?UTF-8?B?SU9oYW5uZXMgbSB6bcO2bG5pZw==?=) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 19:58:12 +0100 Subject: [PD] The PdCon09 webpage is down ... am I too late? In-Reply-To: <1237133614.11190.0.camel@danoT500> References: <1237133614.11190.0.camel@danoT500> Message-ID: <49BD4FC4.9070103@iem.at> danomatika wrote: > Does the PdCon 09 page work for anyone? > > Naturally, I forgot to apply and realized it is due today and now the > page is down ... :( try these instead: paper submit page: http://pdcon09.devolts.org/author/submit.php paper upload page (once you have submitted it): http://pdcon09.devolts.org/author/upload.php cheers fgmadsr IOhannes From mjmogo at gmail.com Sun Mar 15 20:04:15 2009 From: mjmogo at gmail.com (Mike McGonagle) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 14:04:15 -0500 Subject: [PD] Question on SSSAD and scalability Message-ID: <370dda580903151204v50ab9f58w30abeebe73fbe1cf@mail.gmail.com> Hello all, I was wondering about the scalability of SSSAD. While it is probably not an issue when only a small number of parameters are being used, what would happen when you are creating objects that, themselves, create many parameters? I was noticing that any time I make a change to any of the parameters under SSSAD control, a message gets sent to EVERY OTHER parameter, whether or not it is of the same key. Many of those messages get sent only to be rejected. I was wondering how it might effect things that instead of having the SSSAD bus at all, that a message point would be created for each parameter. We already know that a parameter has a specific unique key, so why not use that to send messages to to change the value of the parameter? It would reduce the number of messages being sent. So, basically, the two things that have changed here is that the SSSAD bus get eliminated, and is replaced by sending a message directly to the parameters key, and in the "loading" process, instead of sending the messages to SSSAD, you would use the first parameter in the saved data stream as the place to send the parameter. I tried to mock up what I am talking about, and have attached it to this email. As far as I can tell, this should be functional replacement for SSSAD, with the exception of having to send the message to the key, rather than SSSAD. Mike PS, if you find this useful, please don't start to use it, as I don't think we really need an alternative to SSSAD, I only make this proposal to see if it would be worthwhile to modify SSSAD. -- Douglas Adams - "I love deadlines. I like the whooshing sound they make as they fly by." -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: aspect_V0.0.zip Type: application/zip Size: 6246 bytes Desc: not available URL: From hans at eds.org Sun Mar 15 20:06:33 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 19:06:33 +0000 Subject: [PD] Pd book sprint in NYC/Berlin Message-ID: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> Hey all, Adam Hyde, Derek Holzer, me, and others are working to organize a Pd book sprint to continue work on the Pure Data book that was started before. It is looking like it will be in early April (soon!) and both in NYC and Berlin, connected via video streams. We are still working out the details, but I just wanted to get the word out now so that people can plan on it and come and participate in Berlin or NYC. One thing that could be very useful is advice on how to best stream this kind of thing. For example, should we use GISS? Ekiga? Skype? .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 'You people have such restrictive dress for women,? she said, hobbling away in three inch heels and panty hose to finish out another pink- collar temp pool day. - ?Hijab Scene #2", by Mohja Kahf From hans at eds.org Sun Mar 15 20:08:23 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 19:08:23 +0000 Subject: [PD] [PD-announce] Pd Instrument Building talk in Newcastle, March 19th Message-ID: <899F1B71-FCDC-422A-92EC-580D748252D0@eds.org> Hey all, I'll be giving a talk at the Culture Lab in Newcastle this week on Thursday. I'll mostly be talking about the ideas behind the mapping and hid libraries for Pd: http://www.ncl.ac.uk/culturelab/events/item/enabling-the-spirit-of-play-in-musical-instrument-building .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Programs should be written for people to read, and only incidentally for machines to execute. - from Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs _______________________________________________ Pd-announce mailing list Pd-announce at iem.at http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-announce From schafferdavid at hotmail.com Sun Mar 15 20:12:33 2009 From: schafferdavid at hotmail.com (David Schaffer) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 20:12:33 +0100 Subject: [PD] looking for state saving documentation... Message-ID: Hi everybody, I've been into pd for quite a while now and I feel like I'm slowly reaching musical maturity using this amazing environment, however, there's one big challenge I haven't faced yet: state saving and preset management. I heard about memento, semento, sssad but I'm having troubles knowing which one does what and how to use them. Does anyone know of some tutorial around that could help me? Thank you! David http://www.flickr.com/photos/schafferdavid/ http://audioblog.arteradio.com/David_Schaffer/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From porres at gmail.com Sun Mar 15 20:31:15 2009 From: porres at gmail.com (Alexandre Porres) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 16:31:15 -0300 Subject: [PD] The PdCon09 webpage is down ... am I too late? Message-ID: <161a0b1e0903151231q158dda33t2bdebd9ba3a2787f@mail.gmail.com> the webpage is down, we are trying to get it up ASAP, a damn back up was schedulled for today... Anyway, you guys can still get the forms at http://porres.googlepages.com/Art.zip http://porres.googlepages.com/Workshop.zip http://porres.googlepages.com/Paper.zip then go to http://pdcon09.devolts.org/openconf.php click at Make a Submission, fill the form, get an ID then go to Upload File to send us the PDFs Sorry for the trouble. other extra files can be sent to pdcon09 at estudiolivre.orgOn Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 3:55 PM, wrote: > Send Pd-list mailing list submissions to > pd-list at iem.at > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > pd-list-request at iem.at > > You can reach the person managing the list at > pd-list-owner at iem.at > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Pd-list digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Unified Library was Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th > deadline! (hard off) > 2. Re: change samplerate locally (hard off) > 3. Re: steep filter? (hard off) > 4. Re: steep filter? (Jo?o Pais) > 5. Re: steep filter? (hard off) > 6. Re: change samplerate locally (hard off) > 7. Re: change samplerate locally (Martin Peach) > 8. Re: The PdCon09 webpage is down ... am I too late? > (IOhannes m zm?lnig) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 02:00:26 +0900 > From: hard off > Subject: Re: [PD] Unified Library was Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March > 9th deadline! > To: Hans-Christoph Steiner > Cc: danomatika , "pd-list at iem.at" > , Kyle Klipowicz > Message-ID: > <161320dd0903151000n626f6134h19ea91c5757a76a0 at mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > >>But I think that we don't really know well enough how to do the whole > thing right<< > > > i have good experience in doing a library wrong. :) i can at least point > out the flaws in that so they don't get repeated. > > none of the libraries are very good general all-purpose toolkits though, in > my opinion. i guess that's mainly because none of them have really been > designed as general toolkits. there is heaps of good stuff in rjdj, but > it's all for the phone, which has no pd GUI component. netpd on the other > hand, everything has a gui, and it's all designed to work well as a part of > the netpd system. but it's a little bit tricky to then use the netpd > patches outside of netpd. not really spent too much time with pdmtl, but > that just seems like more of a collection of patches than an actual > library. > s-abstractions and the diy library i did both fall down a bit for me > because > they tie the functionality of the patches in too much with the gui and > state > saving. > > i think what hans is talking about and what we are discussing might be > completely different things though. i think hans is talking about a truly > unified library to join together all the different pieces in pd-extended > and > put them all together in a logical and user-friendly manner. which would > be > a pretty massive project, i admit. > > i think though, what we're talking about here is more just like a > collection > of tools to build synths, sequencers, effects, samplers, recorders, > soundfile players, etc etc etc. most of the libraries already mentioned > are > doing that. but the problem is that there are no unified conventions for > patching, naming, licencing, etc. and it would be nice to have all the > best > and most useful bits of each library in one place, all working together, > and > all very simply and easily ported into other pd projects. > > i think it's well within our reach to do that at the moment. > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: < > http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/attachments/20090316/7b3afd16/attachment-0001.htm > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 02:33:50 +0900 > From: hard off > Subject: Re: [PD] change samplerate locally > To: Martin Peach > Cc: Pd List > Message-ID: > <161320dd0903151033j7d543672yfb3521e6b466789 at mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > hi martin, thanks for taking the time to reply. > > i can set pd to whatever samplerate i want in media->audio settings. i > just > checked again going through a whole bunch of values between 22050 and 44100 > and they all work. > > my problem is that the samplerate is global, and i need it only to be > local. i think the 'solution' i suggested in my 2nd post is going to be > the > way to do it, but i just don't know how to do that. > > > [*~ 2048] > > | > > [expr~ $v1%2048] > > | > > [/~ 2048] > > > > thanks. that's what i had done originally, but i couldn't hear any effect. > i guess if i really want 12-bit sound in pd, i'd have to use that construct > after each and every calculation in the signal chain. seems a fair bit of > overkill just to make the sound WORSE though! > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: < > http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/attachments/20090316/af8b9f6f/attachment-0001.htm > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 02:37:58 +0900 > From: hard off > Subject: Re: [PD] steep filter? > To: Jo?o Pais > Cc: PD-List > Message-ID: > <161320dd0903151037u6caa3f54p3ac85c7f5546d303 at mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > it's not possible to filter without ANY roll-off as far as i know. > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: < > http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/attachments/20090316/7c76d73b/attachment-0001.htm > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 17:57:52 -0000 > From: Jo?o Pais > Subject: Re: [PD] steep filter? > To: "hard off" > Cc: PD-List > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; > charset=iso-8859-15 > > and close to that? just like the spectral trim in audition or something > similar. > > > it's not possible to filter without ANY roll-off as far as i know. > > > > -- > Friedenstr. 58 > 10249 Berlin (Deutschland) > Tel +49 30 42020091 | Mob +49 162 6843570 > jmmmpais at googlemail.com | skype: jmmmpjmmmp > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 5 > Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 03:02:49 +0900 > From: hard off > Subject: Re: [PD] steep filter? > To: Jo?o Pais > Cc: PD-List > Message-ID: > <161320dd0903151102s1346f4d2kdfb0f94593ea8e28 at mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > chebychev filters look good, elliptic ones look better: > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Electronic_linear_filters.svg > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: < > http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/attachments/20090316/fd11e740/attachment-0001.htm > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 6 > Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 03:26:44 +0900 > From: hard off > Subject: Re: [PD] change samplerate locally > To: Martin Peach > Cc: Pd List > Message-ID: > <161320dd0903151126y2432df25s537be23a042564f4 at mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > actually, i just checked and that method i suggested before doesn't work at > all. it's the same as the [phasor~ 28000] - [samphold~] effect. > > > > martin, i missed this part of your mail before: > > >>Unless you're looking for aliasing artifacts, wouldn't it be easier to > use > a multi-pole low-pass filter at around 14kHz?<< > > i just tried that, and i guess what i need must be the aliasing artifacts. > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: < > http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/attachments/20090316/f4e6b417/attachment-0001.htm > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 7 > Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 14:31:51 -0400 > From: Martin Peach > Subject: Re: [PD] change samplerate locally > To: hard off > Cc: Pd List > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > > hard off wrote: > > hi martin, thanks for taking the time to reply. > > > > i can set pd to whatever samplerate i want in media->audio settings. i > > just checked again going through a whole bunch of values between 22050 > > and 44100 and they all work. > > Yes you're right. I should have checked first ;) > Maybe writing into a table at 44100 and using [tabread4~] with a signal > that is quantized to the ratio of sample rates would work? > > > > > my problem is that the samplerate is global, and i need it only to be > > local. i think the 'solution' i suggested in my 2nd post is going to be > > the way to do it, but i just don't know how to do that. > > > > > > [*~ 2048] > > | > > [expr~ $v1%2048] > > | > > [/~ 2048] > > > > > > thanks. that's what i had done originally, but i couldn't hear any > > effect. i guess if i really want 12-bit sound in pd, i'd have to use > > that construct after each and every calculation in the signal chain. > > seems a fair bit of overkill just to make the sound WORSE though! > > > > > > Well 12-bit sound is pretty good, as good as audio cassette with no > dolby. You should try replacing 2048 with 128 or less to hear true lo-fi. > > Martin > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 8 > Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 19:58:12 +0100 > From: IOhannes m zm?lnig > Subject: Re: [PD] The PdCon09 webpage is down ... am I too late? > To: danomatika > Cc: "pd-list at iem.at" > Message-ID: <49BD4FC4.9070103 at iem.at> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 > > danomatika wrote: > > Does the PdCon 09 page work for anyone? > > > > Naturally, I forgot to apply and realized it is due today and now the > > page is down ... :( > > try these instead: > > paper submit page: > http://pdcon09.devolts.org/author/submit.php > > paper upload page (once you have submitted it): > http://pdcon09.devolts.org/author/upload.php > > > cheers > > fgmadsr > IOhannes > > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list mailing list > Pd-list at iem.at > to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > End of Pd-list Digest, Vol 48, Issue 67 > *************************************** > -- Alexandre Torres Porres cel. (11)8179-6226 Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From danomatika at gmail.com Sun Mar 15 20:35:50 2009 From: danomatika at gmail.com (danomatika) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 20:35:50 +0100 Subject: [PD] The PdCon09 webpage is down ... am I too late? In-Reply-To: <49BD4FC4.9070103@iem.at> References: <1237133614.11190.0.camel@danoT500> <49BD4FC4.9070103@iem.at> Message-ID: <1237145750.15917.3.camel@danoT500> On Sun, 2009-03-15 at 19:58 +0100, IOhannes m zm?lnig wrote: > danomatika wrote: > > Does the PdCon 09 page work for anyone? > > > > Naturally, I forgot to apply and realized it is due today and now the > > page is down ... :( > > try these instead: > > paper submit page: > http://pdcon09.devolts.org/author/submit.php > > paper upload page (once you have submitted it): > http://pdcon09.devolts.org/author/upload.php Thanks IOhannes, but I'm looking for the performance application ... --- Dan Wilcox danomatika.com robotcowboy.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From danomatika at gmail.com Sun Mar 15 20:48:29 2009 From: danomatika at gmail.com (danomatika) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 20:48:29 +0100 Subject: [PD] PD and cpu freq scaling in Linux Message-ID: <1237146509.16094.11.camel@danoT500> Howdy, I recently got a new Thinkpad T500 with a duo core 2.53Ghz processor running Ubuntu Intrepid and was a bit annoyed that I was getting far more audio DIO dropouts in PD than my previous single core Pentium M 2Ghz Thinkpad T42p. Last night I realized that the cpu frequency scaling was actually interfering and running both cores at 800Mhz while I had Jack and PD running in realtime mode! I had little to no dropouts on the T42p since the OnDemand scaling algorithm used by default only had one core to do the work and automatically bumped the cpu to max freq. With two cores it seems to think it can keep the freq lower and I get dropouts. For those of you who might have noticed the same problem ("WTF! How can my NEW FAST machine be running PD like crap!!??!"), you can set the cpu scaling manually. Once I set my machine to Performance it bumped the speed to max and PD runs smooth as silk. (I highly recommend this machine BTW, it is super quiet and super cool temperature wise. My previous Thinkpad feels like a hurricane toaster by comparison) In Gnome you can add the CPU Frequency Scaling Monitor applet or you can use the commandline. SUID root control of the applet is enabled in Intrepid, so you can skip the sudo dpkg-reconfigure gnome-applets step. Hope this helps. --- Dan Wilcox danomatika.com robotcowboy.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From fbar at footils.org Sun Mar 15 21:32:40 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 21:32:40 +0100 Subject: [PD] Question on SSSAD and scalability In-Reply-To: <370dda580903151204v50ab9f58w30abeebe73fbe1cf@mail.gmail.com> References: <370dda580903151204v50ab9f58w30abeebe73fbe1cf@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090315203240.GB1133@fliwatut.scifi> Hallo Mike, yeah, that's a fundamentally different approach: Basically in aspect, you create a lot of global senders and receivers, while in sssad there are only two of these. I think, limiting the amount of globals used in abstraction libraries is important to avoid pitfalls with nameclashes and to give the users of your libraries as much freedom in choosing names as possible. Globals in other programming languages often are avoided for similar reasons: They are too error prone. Now if you really worry about the load of having a lot of [route]-misses when sending message, I'd recommend to use the "local" senders in sssad, that are used when adding a second argument to a [sssad] object: [sssad key $0] will use a bus called [r $0-SSSAD] and [r $0-SSSAD_ADMIN] instead of the global ones. In RjDj's library we only use the local sssads. There is an additional object in each abstracition which connects the local busses to the global "SSSAD" and "SSSAD_ADMIN" bus: It's called [u_loader] in the RjDj library and has its own small number of global senders (RJ_SAVE, ...). By using local sssads you can build a chain of such objects pretty nicely. Ciao -- Frank Mike McGonagle hat gesagt: // Mike McGonagle wrote: > I was wondering about the scalability of SSSAD. While it is probably > not an issue when only a small number of parameters are being used, > what would happen when you are creating objects that, themselves, > create many parameters? > > I was noticing that any time I make a change to any of the parameters > under SSSAD control, a message gets sent to EVERY OTHER parameter, > whether or not it is of the same key. Many of those messages get sent > only to be rejected. > > I was wondering how it might effect things that instead of having the > SSSAD bus at all, that a message point would be created for each > parameter. We already know that a parameter has a specific unique key, > so why not use that to send messages to to change the value of the > parameter? It would reduce the number of messages being sent. > > So, basically, the two things that have changed here is that the SSSAD > bus get eliminated, and is replaced by sending a message directly to > the parameters key, and in the "loading" process, instead of sending > the messages to SSSAD, you would use the first parameter in the saved > data stream as the place to send the parameter. > > I tried to mock up what I am talking about, and have attached it to > this email. As far as I can tell, this should be functional > replacement for SSSAD, with the exception of having to send the > message to the key, rather than SSSAD. > > Mike > > PS, if you find this useful, please don't start to use it, as I don't > think we really need an alternative to SSSAD, I only make this > proposal to see if it would be worthwhile to modify SSSAD. > > -- > > Douglas Adams - "I love deadlines. I like the whooshing sound they > make as they fly by." > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list -- Frank Barknecht Do You RjDj.me? _ ______footils.org__ From fbar at footils.org Sun Mar 15 21:47:22 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 21:47:22 +0100 Subject: [PD] Unified Library was Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903151000n626f6134h19ea91c5757a76a0@mail.gmail.com> References: <1237087717.7695.8.camel@danoT500> <11627B2D-E126-4977-9981-6F46C275CE9A@eds.org> <161320dd0903151000n626f6134h19ea91c5757a76a0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090315204722.GC1133@fliwatut.scifi> Hallo, hard off hat gesagt: // hard off wrote: > none of the libraries are very good general all-purpose toolkits though, in > my opinion. i guess that's mainly because none of them have really been > designed as general toolkits. there is heaps of good stuff in rjdj, but > it's all for the phone, which has no pd GUI component. Well, the RjDj patches (scenes) are written on a computer as well. The focus on GUI-less objects so far is by design: I believe, that we need to have basic building blocks *without* GUI first (maybe you remember the list thread about a dsp or "tilde" library? That had an influence on the RjDj design). Later we can decorate any abstraction with GUIs, provided the basic block offer a standardized communication interface. In RjDj the rightmost inlet in (most) abstractions is this interface: This inlet accepts tagged messages like "freq " or "delay " or "note ". RjDjlib includes a handful of custom GUI elements which just are GOP wrappers around sliders, numbers etc. that automatically create these messages. For example you can create a [g_hsl freq 0 22050] to get a slider GUI, that will have a range of 0...22050 and outputs messages like "freq " and can be set with "freq " messages to its inlet. The g_* abstractions in RjDj all can be chained: [g_hsl pitch 0 127] | [g_hsl vel 0 127] | [g_hradio octave 4] | [mycoolsynthesiszer] so GUIs can be built in a consistent way and they can even be reused in parts. Having the GUI separate from the DSP abstraction also makes polyphony easy: You can use just one GUI to control many voices in a synth. Ciao -- Frank Barknecht Do You RjDj.me? _ ______footils.org__ From morph_2016 at yahoo.co.uk Sun Mar 15 22:51:24 2009 From: morph_2016 at yahoo.co.uk (Ed Kelly) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 21:51:24 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [PD] PDCon09 deadline - Sao Paulo? Message-ID: <612581.74364.qm@web26303.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Hi chaps, Sorry I've been away, but life happened! Please please tell me the deadline for the Sao Paulo convention is Brazil time - I'll be up until 3am GMT finishing this at least. Luv u all, Ed Lone Shark: Synchromatic: Out December 1st 2008 http://www.pyramidtransmissions.com/store Also available through the iTunes store From morph_2016 at yahoo.co.uk Sun Mar 15 23:00:44 2009 From: morph_2016 at yahoo.co.uk (Ed Kelly) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 22:00:44 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [PD] Unified Library was Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! Message-ID: <614691.50386.qm@web26304.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Back again... I think those who are really interested in a library of objects, suitable for early users (I hate the term 'beginners') to explore acoustics, synthesis etc, will be interested in Metastudio 0.3, which will be released soon, with full help files for each object. I'll SVN it when I have a candidate for release. I am really close to completion, and it's nicely deep! I mean it has usability for the early user and deep structure for the more adventurous type. I'm putting together my workshop proposal/paper/gig now. I'll email once I've finished that with some working examples. Anything PD is just an abstraction. In theory, any group of abstractions can be built to teach or to play. The wonderful thing about PD is that teaching and playing are only a cut-and-paste away, or an abstraction call within a PD patch. Well...I got work to do. ED Lone Shark: Synchromatic: Out December 1st 2008 http://www.pyramidtransmissions.com/store Also available through the iTunes store --- On Sun, 15/3/09, Frank Barknecht wrote: > From: Frank Barknecht > Subject: Re: [PD] Unified Library was Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! > To: pd-list at iem.at, "Kyle Klipowicz" > Date: Sunday, 15 March, 2009, 8:47 PM > > -----Inline Attachment Follows----- > > Hallo, > hard off hat gesagt: // hard off wrote: > > > none of the libraries are very good general > all-purpose toolkits though, in > > my opinion.? i guess that's mainly because none > of them have really been > > designed as general toolkits.? there is heaps of > good stuff in rjdj, but > > it's all for the phone, which has no pd GUI component. > > > Well, the RjDj patches (scenes) are written on a computer > as well. > > The focus on GUI-less objects so far is by design: I > believe, that we > need to have basic building blocks *without* GUI first > (maybe you > remember the list thread about a dsp or "tilde" library? > That had an > influence on the RjDj design). Later we can decorate any > abstraction > with GUIs, provided the basic block offer a standardized > communication > interface. > > In RjDj the rightmost inlet in (most) abstractions is this > interface: > This inlet accepts tagged messages like "freq " > or "delay " > or "note ". RjDjlib includes a > handful of custom GUI > elements which just are GOP wrappers around sliders, > numbers etc. that > automatically create these messages. For example you can > create a > [g_hsl freq 0 22050] to get a slider GUI, that will have a > range of > 0...22050 and outputs messages like "freq " > and can be set with > "freq " messages to its inlet. > > The g_* abstractions in RjDj all can be chained: > > [g_hsl pitch 0 127] > | > [g_hsl vel 0 127] > | > [g_hradio octave 4] > | > [mycoolsynthesiszer] > > so GUIs can be built in a consistent way and they can even > be reused > in parts. > > Having the GUI separate from the DSP abstraction also makes > polyphony > easy: You can use just one GUI to control many voices in a > synth. > > Ciao > -- > Frank Barknecht? ? ? ? ? ? > Do You RjDj.me?? ? ? ? ? _ > ______footils.org__ > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at > mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > From porres at gmail.com Mon Mar 16 00:16:05 2009 From: porres at gmail.com (Alexandre Porres) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 20:16:05 -0300 Subject: [PD] The PdCon09 webpage is UP Message-ID: <161a0b1e0903151616te0a4f36g8a069a3c8c2328d9@mail.gmail.com> http://convention.puredata.info is back on air hope you have seen it... cheers -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From marius.schebella at gmail.com Mon Mar 16 00:23:38 2009 From: marius.schebella at gmail.com (marius schebella) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 00:23:38 +0100 Subject: [PD] The PdCon09 webpage is UP In-Reply-To: <161a0b1e0903151616te0a4f36g8a069a3c8c2328d9@mail.gmail.com> References: <161a0b1e0903151616te0a4f36g8a069a3c8c2328d9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49BD8DFA.4030102@gmail.com> and the deadline is at midnight? marius. Alexandre Porres wrote: > http://convention.puredata.info > > is back on air > > hope you have seen it... > > cheers > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From porres at gmail.com Mon Mar 16 00:39:49 2009 From: porres at gmail.com (Alexandre Porres) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 20:39:49 -0300 Subject: [PD] The PdCon09 webpage is UP In-Reply-To: <49BD8DFA.4030102@gmail.com> References: <161a0b1e0903151616te0a4f36g8a069a3c8c2328d9@mail.gmail.com> <49BD8DFA.4030102@gmail.com> Message-ID: <161a0b1e0903151639i1f456a5cw23d14945a30de3c9@mail.gmail.com> oficial deadline is about 3:30h from now. midnight UTC-3 but we are being flexible and comprehensive as a lot of people are in trouble... thanks for the submitions :) On Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 8:23 PM, marius schebella < marius.schebella at gmail.com> wrote: > and the deadline is at midnight? > marius. > > Alexandre Porres wrote: > >> http://convention.puredata.info >> is back on air >> >> hope you have seen it... >> >> cheers >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> > > -- Alexandre Torres Porres cel. (11)8179-6226 Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From porres at gmail.com Mon Mar 16 00:44:13 2009 From: porres at gmail.com (Alexandre Porres) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 20:44:13 -0300 Subject: [PD] The PdCon09 webpage is UP (use our submission system) Message-ID: <161a0b1e0903151644r4ee0d460rc6825528aef3be64@mail.gmail.com> It is up, but, all details are there... but for those who have read the page ( http://convention.puredata.info ) and are familiar with it.. just get the forms at http://porres.googlepages.com/Art.zip http://porres.googlepages.com/Workshop.zip http://porres.googlepages.com/Paper.zip then go to http://pdcon09.devolts.org/openconf.php click at Make a Submission, fill the form, get an ID then go to Upload File to send us the PDFs Sorry for the trouble. On Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 8:39 PM, Alexandre Porres wrote: > oficial deadline is about 3:30h from now. midnight UTC-3 > but we are being flexible and comprehensive as a lot of people are in > trouble... > > thanks for the submitions > > :) > > > On Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 8:23 PM, marius schebella < > marius.schebella at gmail.com> wrote: > >> and the deadline is at midnight? >> marius. >> >> Alexandre Porres wrote: >> >>> http://convention.puredata.info >>> is back on air >>> >>> hope you have seen it... >>> >>> cheers >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >>> >> >> > > > -- > Alexandre Torres Porres > cel. (11)8179-6226 > Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home > http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres > > -- Alexandre Torres Porres cel. (11)8179-6226 Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jmmmpais at googlemail.com Mon Mar 16 00:44:22 2009 From: jmmmpais at googlemail.com (=?iso-8859-15?Q?Jo=E3o_Pais?=) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 23:44:22 -0000 Subject: [PD] steep filter? In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903151102s1346f4d2kdfb0f94593ea8e28@mail.gmail.com> References: <161320dd0903151037u6caa3f54p3ac85c7f5546d303@mail.gmail.com> <161320dd0903151102s1346f4d2kdfb0f94593ea8e28@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: yes, I had seen that graphic as well. but trying out the highpass iemfilters with noise, turns out that 10 hip~s work better. I looked in my list of pd-ext objects, but found no elliptic filters. are there any, or any way of getting their coefficients to use with biquad~? > chebychev filters look good, elliptic ones look better: > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Electronic_linear_filters.svg -- Friedenstr. 58 10249 Berlin (Deutschland) Tel +49 30 42020091 | Mob +49 162 6843570 jmmmpais at googlemail.com | skype: jmmmpjmmmp From morph_2016 at yahoo.co.uk Mon Mar 16 00:52:21 2009 From: morph_2016 at yahoo.co.uk (Ed Kelly) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 23:52:21 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [PD] The PdCon09 webpage is UP (use our submission system) Message-ID: <907502.38560.qm@web26308.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> i am one of those people who are in trouble! But...blessed chance, I am not alone! ed Lone Shark: Synchromatic: Out December 1st 2008 http://www.pyramidtransmissions.com/store Also available through the iTunes store --- On Sun, 15/3/09, Alexandre Porres wrote: > From: Alexandre Porres > Subject: Re: [PD] The PdCon09 webpage is UP (use our submission system) > To: "pd-list" > Date: Sunday, 15 March, 2009, 11:44 PM > It is up, but, all details > are there... but for those who have read the page ( http://convention.puredata.info > ) and are familiar with it.. just?get the forms > at > > http://porres.googlepages.com/Art.zip > http://porres.googlepages.com/Workshop.zip > > http://porres.googlepages.com/Paper.zip > > then go to > > http://pdcon09.devolts.org/openconf.php > > > click at Make a Submission, fill the form, get an ID > > then go to Upload File to send us the PDFs > > Sorry for the trouble. > > > On Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 8:39 PM, > Alexandre Porres > wrote: > > oficial > deadline is about 3:30h from now. midnight UTC-3 > but we are being flexible and comprehensive as a > lot of people are in trouble... > > thanks for the submitions > > :) > > On Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 8:23 PM, > marius schebella > wrote: > > > and the > deadline is at midnight? > > marius. > > > > Alexandre Porres wrote: > > > http://convention.puredata.info > > > is back on air > > > > hope you have seen it... > > > > cheers > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Pd-list at iem.at > mailing list > > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > > > > -- > Alexandre Torres Porres > cel. (11)8179-6226 > Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home > > http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres > > > > > > > > -- > Alexandre Torres Porres > cel. (11)8179-6226 > Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home > http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres > > > > > > -----Inline Attachment Follows----- > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at > mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > From santorcuato76 at gmail.com Mon Mar 16 01:42:20 2009 From: santorcuato76 at gmail.com (Jose Luis Santorcuato) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 20:42:20 -0400 Subject: [PD] from Chile greetings Message-ID: <4345df630903151742u1116bf73rd6f2d45fd65af847@mail.gmail.com> Hi my dear friends, this is my first contact with the community...well i like this sinergy... i try go to the convention. Please visit my blog... with love http://arselectronicachile.blogspot.com see you!!!! Jos? Luis -- http://arselectronicachile.blogspot.com/ www.myspace.com/santorcuato -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From amos.robinson at gmail.com Mon Mar 16 01:47:38 2009 From: amos.robinson at gmail.com (Amos Robinson) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 11:47:38 +1100 Subject: [PD] from Chile greetings In-Reply-To: <4345df630903151742u1116bf73rd6f2d45fd65af847@mail.gmail.com> References: <4345df630903151742u1116bf73rd6f2d45fd65af847@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On a related note, greetings from Newcastle, Australia. I'm wondering whether there are any other people from Newcastle? On Mon, Mar 16, 2009 at 11:42 AM, Jose Luis Santorcuato wrote: > Hi my dear friends, this is my first contact with the community...well i > like this sinergy... i try go to the convention. > Please visit my blog... with love > > http://arselectronicachile.blogspot.com > > see you!!!! > > Jos? Luis > > -- > http://arselectronicachile.blogspot.com/ > www.myspace.com/santorcuato > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > From ydegoyon at gmail.com Mon Mar 16 01:51:14 2009 From: ydegoyon at gmail.com (ydegoyon at gmail.com) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 01:51:14 +0100 Subject: [PD] Pd book sprint in NYC/Berlin In-Reply-To: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> Message-ID: <49BDA282.9040607@gmail.com> ola, > For example, should we use GISS? Ekiga? Skype? > the main difference between a video streaming solution and a video conference solution ( ekiga, skype ) is that anybody is able to see what's happening, e.g. that's it's public ( no need to authentify and join a conference room ).. so it depends on what you want.. xiaoo, sevy From morph_2016 at yahoo.co.uk Mon Mar 16 01:59:38 2009 From: morph_2016 at yahoo.co.uk (Ed Kelly) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 00:59:38 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [PD] from Chile greetings Message-ID: <254016.56845.qm@web26308.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> And... your timing is impeccable...sort of. Come to Sao Paulo in July. You won't regret it. The best art, by the best people, and in a very best place. Or stay home in CHile, brain your drain! aaa- deadline approacheth! Lone Shark: Synchromatic: Out December 1st 2008 http://www.pyramidtransmissions.com/store Also available through the iTunes store --- On Mon, 16/3/09, Amos Robinson wrote: > From: Amos Robinson > Subject: Re: [PD] from Chile greetings > To: > Cc: pd-list at iem.at > Date: Monday, 16 March, 2009, 12:47 AM > On a related note, greetings from > Newcastle, Australia. I'm wondering > whether there are any other people from Newcastle? > > On Mon, Mar 16, 2009 at 11:42 AM, Jose Luis Santorcuato > > wrote: > > Hi my dear friends, this is my first contact with the > community...well i > > like this sinergy... i try go to the convention. > > Please visit my blog... with love > > > > http://arselectronicachile.blogspot.com > > > > see you!!!! > > > > Jos? Luis > > > > -- > > http://arselectronicachile.blogspot.com/ > > www.myspace.com/santorcuato > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Pd-list at iem.at > mailing list > > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at > mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > From hans at eds.org Mon Mar 16 02:25:00 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 01:25:00 +0000 Subject: [PD] Pd book sprint in NYC/Berlin In-Reply-To: <49BDA282.9040607@gmail.com> References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <49BDA282.9040607@gmail.com> Message-ID: <2D6F62EB-0878-4205-A5EA-AB248E81A93E@eds.org> On Mar 16, 2009, at 12:51 AM, ydegoyon at gmail.com wrote: > ola, >> For example, should we use GISS? Ekiga? Skype? >> > the main difference between a video streaming solution > and a video conference solution ( ekiga, skype ) > is that anybody is able to see what's happening, > e.g. that's it's public > ( no need to authentify and join a conference room ).. > so it depends on what you want.. I think the other key difference is that ekiga/skype are tuned for low latency while streaming is usually tuned to have a big buffer so that the stream doesn't get interrupted. Any idea on the latency of GISS? When I was using Darwin Streaming Server, it usually had a buffer of 10 seconds, which makes live interaction impossible. I suppose we could have one computer streaming and the other doing video conferencing. .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- As we enjoy great advantages from inventions of others, we should be glad of an opportunity to serve others by any invention of ours; and this we should do freely and generously. - Benjamin Franklin From ydegoyon at gmail.com Mon Mar 16 03:12:51 2009 From: ydegoyon at gmail.com (ydegoyon at gmail.com) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 03:12:51 +0100 Subject: [PD] Pd book sprint in NYC/Berlin In-Reply-To: <2D6F62EB-0878-4205-A5EA-AB248E81A93E@eds.org> References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <49BDA282.9040607@gmail.com> <2D6F62EB-0878-4205-A5EA-AB248E81A93E@eds.org> Message-ID: <49BDB5A3.9090606@gmail.com> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > On Mar 16, 2009, at 12:51 AM, ydegoyon at gmail.com wrote: > >> ola, >>> For example, should we use GISS? Ekiga? Skype? >>> >> the main difference between a video streaming solution >> and a video conference solution ( ekiga, skype ) >> is that anybody is able to see what's happening, >> e.g. that's it's public >> ( no need to authentify and join a conference room ).. >> so it depends on what you want.. > > > I think the other key difference is that ekiga/skype are tuned for low > latency while streaming is usually tuned to have a big buffer so that > the stream doesn't get interrupted. the tipical question where there is no answer.. is there an answer to 'how much latency you get with pd compared to using analog sound effects ?' all depends on many parameters and all is setable also, even in the client that receives.. > > Any idea on the latency of GISS? When I was using Darwin Streaming > Server, it usually had a buffer of 10 seconds, nahh, surely less ( except maybe with dv ) xiaoo, sevy From mjmogo at gmail.com Mon Mar 16 03:14:56 2009 From: mjmogo at gmail.com (Mike McGonagle) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 21:14:56 -0500 Subject: [PD] Question on SSSAD and scalability In-Reply-To: <20090315203240.GB1133@fliwatut.scifi> References: <370dda580903151204v50ab9f58w30abeebe73fbe1cf@mail.gmail.com> <20090315203240.GB1133@fliwatut.scifi> Message-ID: <370dda580903151914l5b1b7a4ak3cefed4d7d09b0e5@mail.gmail.com> On Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 3:32 PM, Frank Barknecht wrote: > Hallo Mike, > > yeah, that's a fundamentally different approach: Basically in aspect, > you create a lot of global senders and receivers, while in sssad there > are only two of these. I think, limiting the amount of globals used in > abstraction libraries is important to avoid pitfalls with nameclashes > and to give the users of your libraries as much freedom in choosing > names as possible. Globals in other programming languages often are > avoided for similar reasons: They are too error prone. The context that I was actually thinking was in trying to do "live coding". Of all the times that I have been using SSSAD, my biggest complaint about it is that I would always need to resave, close, and reopen the file. It always seemed that the one instance of an SSSAD reference that I was deleting was the FIRST ONE. Of course, doing that was sure to make that parameters NOT SAVE, unless I reopened. > Now if you really worry about the load of having a lot of > [route]-misses when sending message, I'd recommend to use the "local" > senders in sssad, that are used when adding a second argument to a > [sssad] object: [sssad key $0] will use a bus called [r $0-SSSAD] and > [r $0-SSSAD_ADMIN] instead of the global ones. My whole point of bringing this up has more to do with how an "external" (yes, actual C code) might be able to implement the SSSAD protocol. I can think of MANY EXTERNALS that would benefit by doing this... At the same time, that might make it appear that SSSAD is an accepted standard in Pd. And Miller, himself has written on this very topic... So, what is the means of storing data... is there one? I'm curious, but how many "externals" do you have with RjDj? I can only assume that you can't do too much with it, other than the basic implementation of Pd. Mike -- Douglas Adams - "I love deadlines. I like the whooshing sound they make as they fly by." From hard.off at gmail.com Mon Mar 16 04:02:21 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 12:02:21 +0900 Subject: [PD] Unified Library was Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <614691.50386.qm@web26304.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> References: <614691.50386.qm@web26304.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <161320dd0903152002v4ad053f1r56f5b8edd369fcca@mail.gmail.com> yeah sorry frank, i should have explained more clearly. i also think that no GUI is the way to go for functional abstractions. that was the big flaw of the DIY library i did, that the function of the abstractions was tied in with the gui component. i did it that way because i didn't want to clutter the namespace with too many abstractions, and the thought of one abstraction for function, and then a different one for GUI was not appealing at the time. but now, i think that is the only way to go. like, as you said, for polyphony. and then also for the many many cases in which you'd want to build your own gui for custom control. i do think you guys have got a really really strong system there with rjlib. but i was just saying that without the gui stuff, it doesn't exactly fit into being that 'all purpose building blocks' library that we are discussing. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alex3lucas at googlemail.com Mon Mar 16 08:19:46 2009 From: alex3lucas at googlemail.com (Alex Lucas) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 07:19:46 +0000 Subject: [PD] Problems accessing Pdlist Archives Message-ID: <6b61086c0903160019n17d108b0gde7013ee3a69dd1a@mail.gmail.com> Hello everyone, Over the last couple of days I haven't been able to access the Pdlist Archives by following the link on this page http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list. Has anyone else had the same problem or dose anyone know of an alternative link? Thanks Alex -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From morph_2016 at yahoo.co.uk Mon Mar 16 08:31:27 2009 From: morph_2016 at yahoo.co.uk (Ed Kelly) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 07:31:27 +0000 (GMT) Subject: [PD] The PdCon09 webpage is UP Message-ID: <222070.83944.qm@web26306.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> AAArgh Should I send the paper? Please be gentle with me! Ed Lone Shark: Synchromatic: Out December 1st 2008 http://www.pyramidtransmissions.com/store Also available through the iTunes store --- On Sun, 15/3/09, Alexandre Porres wrote: > From: Alexandre Porres > Subject: Re: [PD] The PdCon09 webpage is UP > To: "marius schebella" , "pd-list" > Date: Sunday, 15 March, 2009, 11:39 PM > oficial deadline is about 3:30h from > now. midnight UTC-3 > but we are being flexible and comprehensive as a > lot of people are in trouble... > thanks for the submitions > > :) > > On Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 8:23 PM, > marius schebella > wrote: > > and the > deadline is at midnight? > > marius. > > > > Alexandre Porres wrote: > > > http://convention.puredata.info > > > is back on air > > > > hope you have seen it... > > > > cheers > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Pd-list at iem.at > mailing list > > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > > > > -- > Alexandre Torres Porres > cel. (11)8179-6226 > Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home > http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres > > > > > > -----Inline Attachment Follows----- > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at > mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > From fbar at footils.org Mon Mar 16 08:54:44 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 08:54:44 +0100 Subject: [PD] Question on SSSAD and scalability In-Reply-To: <370dda580903151914l5b1b7a4ak3cefed4d7d09b0e5@mail.gmail.com> References: <370dda580903151204v50ab9f58w30abeebe73fbe1cf@mail.gmail.com> <20090315203240.GB1133@fliwatut.scifi> <370dda580903151914l5b1b7a4ak3cefed4d7d09b0e5@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090316075444.GA15510@footils.org> Hallo, Mike McGonagle hat gesagt: // Mike McGonagle wrote: > On Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 3:32 PM, Frank Barknecht wrote: > > The context that I was actually thinking was in trying to do "live > coding". Of all the times that I have been using SSSAD, my biggest > complaint about it is that I would always need to resave, close, and > reopen the file. It always seemed that the one instance of an SSSAD > reference that I was deleting was the FIRST ONE. Of course, doing that > was sure to make that parameters NOT SAVE, unless I reopened. A closebang would solve this. It will probably happen less often with local sssads. > > Now if you really worry about the load of having a lot of > > [route]-misses when sending message, I'd recommend to use the "local" > > senders in sssad, that are used when adding a second argument to a > > [sssad] object: [sssad key $0] will use a bus called [r $0-SSSAD] and > > [r $0-SSSAD_ADMIN] instead of the global ones. > > My whole point of bringing this up has more to do with how an > "external" (yes, actual C code) might be able to implement the SSSAD > protocol. I can think of MANY EXTERNALS that would benefit by doing > this... > > At the same time, that might make it appear that SSSAD is an accepted > standard in Pd. And Miller, himself has written on this very topic... > So, what is the means of storing data... is there one? Storing data is not in the realm of sssad - again this is by design and comes from my experience with RRADical/Memento where the storage was inside the saving system and tied to [pool]. SSSAD is intended to to just one thing but do that right: Its purpose is to eavesdrop on the messages that objects send to each other and distribute them to rsp. modify them from a central place. That's all. What comes after that central place is up to the end user. It would be easy to make an external that does the same. sssad is just a wrapper around [list], [route] [send] and [receive]. One "S" in its name stands for "simple". ;) > I'm curious, but how many "externals" do you have with RjDj? I can > only assume that you can't do too much with it, other than the basic > implementation of Pd. Hm, I don't understand this question? RjDj is pretty much pure Pd and has almost no externals at all - which doesn't mean that you can't do much with it: For audio work Pd is very powerful and no externals are (strictly) necessary. Ciao -- Frank From zmoelnig at iem.at Mon Mar 16 09:02:29 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 09:02:29 +0100 Subject: [PD] The PdCon09 webpage is down ... am I too late? In-Reply-To: <1237145750.15917.3.camel@danoT500> References: <1237133614.11190.0.camel@danoT500> <49BD4FC4.9070103@iem.at> <1237145750.15917.3.camel@danoT500> Message-ID: <49BE0795.2050309@iem.at> danomatika wrote: > On Sun, 2009-03-15 at 19:58 +0100, IOhannes m zm?lnig wrote: > >> paper submit page: >> http://pdcon09.devolts.org/author/submit.php >> >> paper upload page (once you have submitted it): >> http://pdcon09.devolts.org/author/upload.php > > Thanks IOhannes, but I'm looking for the performance application ... > you can (or "could", by now) submit performances, installations, workshops and papers with the above two links. fgmasdr mfasdf. IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From fbar at footils.org Mon Mar 16 09:25:28 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 09:25:28 +0100 Subject: [PD] steep filter? In-Reply-To: References: <161320dd0903151037u6caa3f54p3ac85c7f5546d303@mail.gmail.com> <161320dd0903151102s1346f4d2kdfb0f94593ea8e28@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090316082528.GB15510@footils.org> Hallo, Jo?o Pais hat gesagt: // Jo?o Pais wrote: > yes, I had seen that graphic as well. but trying out the highpass > iemfilters with noise, turns out that 10 hip~s work better. Hehe, I guess that's because you filter noise: It's harder to recognize the noise that the 10 hip stages added. :) > I looked in my list of pd-ext objects, but found no elliptic filters. are > there any, or any way of getting their coefficients to use with biquad~? Elliptic filters are rather hard to design, most of the time you will find Butterworth or Chebyshev designs in our little audio world. A biquad~ has only two poles and zeroes, so you would need to cascade several stages to get a really sharp filter. Ciao -- Frank From fbar at footils.org Mon Mar 16 09:30:59 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 09:30:59 +0100 Subject: [PD] Unified Library was Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903152002v4ad053f1r56f5b8edd369fcca@mail.gmail.com> References: <614691.50386.qm@web26304.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> <161320dd0903152002v4ad053f1r56f5b8edd369fcca@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090316083059.GC15510@footils.org> Hallo, hard off hat gesagt: // hard off wrote: > yeah sorry frank, i should have explained more clearly. > > i also think that no GUI is the way to go for functional abstractions. that > was the big flaw of the DIY library i did, that the function of the > abstractions was tied in with the gui component. i did it that way because > i didn't want to clutter the namespace with too many abstractions, and the > thought of one abstraction for function, and then a different one for GUI > was not appealing at the time. > > but now, i think that is the only way to go. like, as you said, for > polyphony. and then also for the many many cases in which you'd want to > build your own gui for custom control. Yeah, basically that was all I wanted to say as well. ;) > i do think you guys have got a really really strong system there with > rjlib. but i was just saying that without the gui stuff, it doesn't exactly > fit into being that 'all purpose building blocks' library that we are > discussing. Yes, that's true. rjlib has its focus on audio and control abstractions to be used on mobile devices with vanilla Pd. Some of this fits into a "all purpose" library, but a lot of it doesn't. Ciao -- Frank From derek at umatic.nl Mon Mar 16 09:41:32 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 09:41:32 +0100 Subject: [PD] Pd book sprint in NYC/Berlin In-Reply-To: <49BDB5A3.9090606@gmail.com> References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <49BDA282.9040607@gmail.com> <2D6F62EB-0878-4205-A5EA-AB248E81A93E@eds.org> <49BDB5A3.9090606@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49BE10BC.4010908@umatic.nl> My tendency is to keep everything as simple and low-tech as possible. Does video conferencing add anything substantial that IRC doesn't have already? Do we want to do interpretive dance for each other in order to write a FLOSS manual? Do we really need to look at another room full of people sitting behind laptops across the ocean somewhere? Does anybody ever actually watch these video streams from meetings like these? I could see some sense if there was some sort of presentation aspect, but these will be working sessions, i.e. very boring to look at . D. -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 15: "Ask your body" From jaime.oliver2 at gmail.com Mon Mar 16 09:49:46 2009 From: jaime.oliver2 at gmail.com (Jaime Oliver) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 01:49:46 -0700 Subject: [PD] The PdCon09 webpage is down ... am I too late? In-Reply-To: <49BE0795.2050309@iem.at> References: <1237133614.11190.0.camel@danoT500> <49BD4FC4.9070103@iem.at> <1237145750.15917.3.camel@danoT500> <49BE0795.2050309@iem.at> Message-ID: <616283880903160149i6d48d63br41d7f8bc5c8197ba@mail.gmail.com> hi everyone i have been trying for hours to upload the pdf form, but it doesn't work for me, should I just try to send it by e-mail? J On Mon, Mar 16, 2009 at 1:02 AM, IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: > danomatika wrote: >> >> On Sun, 2009-03-15 at 19:58 +0100, IOhannes m zm?lnig wrote: >> >>> paper submit page: >>> http://pdcon09.devolts.org/author/submit.php >>> >>> paper upload page (once you have submitted it): >>> http://pdcon09.devolts.org/author/upload.php >> >> Thanks IOhannes, but I'm looking for the performance application ... >> > > you can (or "could", by now) submit performances, installations, workshops > and papers with the above two links. > > fgmasdr > mfasdf. > IOhannes > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > -- Jaime E Oliver LR joliverl at ucsd.edu www.realidadvisual.org/jaimeoliver www-crca.ucsd.edu/ www.realidadvisual.org 858 202 1522 9168 Regents Rd. Apt. G La Jolla, CA 92037 USA From grh at mur.at Mon Mar 16 09:54:12 2009 From: grh at mur.at (Georg Holzmann) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 09:54:12 +0100 Subject: [PD] Pd book sprint in NYC/Berlin In-Reply-To: <49BE10BC.4010908@umatic.nl> References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <49BDA282.9040607@gmail.com> <2D6F62EB-0878-4205-A5EA-AB248E81A93E@eds.org> <49BDB5A3.9090606@gmail.com> <49BE10BC.4010908@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <49BE13B4.4030400@mur.at> Derek Holzer schrieb: > My tendency is to keep everything as simple and low-tech as possible. > Does video conferencing add anything substantial that IRC doesn't have > already? Do we want to do interpretive dance for each other in order to > write a FLOSS manual? Do we really need to look at another room full of > people sitting behind laptops across the ocean somewhere? Does anybody > ever actually watch these video streams from meetings like these? I > could see some sense if there was some sort of presentation aspect, but > these will be working sessions, i.e. very boring to look at . You are right. And if one really wants to speak/see each other, one can use ekiga, skype or whatever ... LG Georg From derek at umatic.nl Mon Mar 16 09:57:30 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 09:57:30 +0100 Subject: [PD] Problems accessing Pdlist Archives In-Reply-To: <6b61086c0903160019n17d108b0gde7013ee3a69dd1a@mail.gmail.com> References: <6b61086c0903160019n17d108b0gde7013ee3a69dd1a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49BE147A.4080709@umatic.nl> Hi Alex, I had the same problem yesterday. There are three alternates listed at: http://puredata.info/community/lists Gmane, Mail Archive and Markmail. One of those should work for you. best! Derek Alex Lucas wrote: > Hello everyone, > > Over the last couple of days I haven't been able to access the Pdlist > Archives by following the link on this page > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list. Has anyone else had the > same problem or dose anyone know of an alternative link? -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 173: "Voice your suspicions" From alex3lucas at googlemail.com Mon Mar 16 10:16:49 2009 From: alex3lucas at googlemail.com (Alex Lucas) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 09:16:49 +0000 Subject: [PD] Problems accessing Pdlist Archives In-Reply-To: <49BE147A.4080709@umatic.nl> References: <6b61086c0903160019n17d108b0gde7013ee3a69dd1a@mail.gmail.com> <49BE147A.4080709@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <6b61086c0903160216m79ba0ecch27b317a42038faf7@mail.gmail.com> Hi Derek, Thanks for your help, I really like markmail! Thanks, Alex 2009/3/16 Derek Holzer > Hi Alex, > > I had the same problem yesterday. There are three alternates listed at: > > http://puredata.info/community/lists > > Gmane, Mail Archive and Markmail. One of those should work for you. > > best! > Derek > > > Alex Lucas wrote: > >> Hello everyone, >> >> Over the last couple of days I haven't been able to access the Pdlist >> Archives by following the link on this page >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list. Has anyone else had the same >> problem or dose anyone know of an alternative link? >> > > > -- > ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: > http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 173: > "Voice your suspicions" > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From matju at artengine.ca Mon Mar 16 12:33:34 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 07:33:34 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] Pd book sprint in NYC/Berlin In-Reply-To: <49BE10BC.4010908@umatic.nl> References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <49BDA282.9040607@gmail.com> <2D6F62EB-0878-4205-A5EA-AB248E81A93E@eds.org> <49BDB5A3.9090606@gmail.com> <49BE10BC.4010908@umatic.nl> Message-ID: On Mon, 16 Mar 2009, Derek Holzer wrote: > My tendency is to keep everything as simple and low-tech as possible. > Does video conferencing add anything substantial that IRC doesn't have > already? Seeing faces might be unconsciously motivational. But it might not work so well for any ugly faces. > I could see some sense if there was some sort of presentation aspect, > but these will be working sessions, i.e. very boring to look at . This is an excellent occasion to distinguish yourself by your clothes... Or learn the italian body-language to spice up your content. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From jmmmpais at googlemail.com Mon Mar 16 13:11:04 2009 From: jmmmpais at googlemail.com (=?iso-8859-15?Q?Jo=E3o_Pais?=) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 12:11:04 -0000 Subject: [PD] steep filter? In-Reply-To: <20090316082528.GB15510@footils.org> References: <161320dd0903151037u6caa3f54p3ac85c7f5546d303@mail.gmail.com> <161320dd0903151102s1346f4d2kdfb0f94593ea8e28@mail.gmail.com> <20090316082528.GB15510@footils.org> Message-ID: >> yes, I had seen that graphic as well. but trying out the highpass >> iemfilters with noise, turns out that 10 hip~s work better. > > Hehe, I guess that's because you filter noise: It's harder to recognize > the > noise that the 10 hip stages added. :) that's true. I started then using other signals with varying complexity, and the output was better. btw, I was testing the signal only by looking at it, through a spectral analysis. >> I looked in my list of pd-ext objects, but found no elliptic filters. >> are >> there any, or any way of getting their coefficients to use with biquad~? > > Elliptic filters are rather hard to design, most of the time you will > find > Butterworth or Chebyshev designs in our little audio world. > > A biquad~ has only two poles and zeroes, so you would need to cascade > several > stages to get a really sharp filter. yep, I only found those. I'll try cascading other types of filters as well. I thought there would be a magic filter somewhere that would do any operation imaginable by men. From czhenry at gmail.com Mon Mar 16 13:37:51 2009 From: czhenry at gmail.com (Charles Henry) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 07:37:51 -0500 Subject: [PD] change samplerate locally In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903150044o40e499aexd3701171746e3d5b@mail.gmail.com> References: <161320dd0903150044o40e499aexd3701171746e3d5b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <518fe7b20903160537r27ec7a07g4afaa46c9aa5774a@mail.gmail.com> On Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 2:44 AM, hard off wrote: > to re-create the sound of a dx7 i need to change samplerate from my default > (44.1khz) to 28khz. > globally changing pd's samplerate to 28khz has the intended effect, but i > want to be able to run other patches at 44.1khz while running my dx7 at > 28khz. One thing that occurs to me is that the quality of the reconstructed sound has more to do with the interpolator rather than the sample rate. The actual output is an analog signal which is obtained by interpolating samples. Most audio systems use linear interpolation, which has characteristic spectral characteristics. A low-end or possibly obsolete system may use sample-and-hold rather than interpolation. Probably, there's a high-frequency "sizzle" that you want to emulate here. To get that full sound (an analog signal), there's a freq domain transformation that should work. It comes from the linear interpolator. It actually leaves some sound in the range from 14kHz to 22.05kHz. To reproduce the effect, you would fold over frequencies from 5.95kHz to 14 kHz into 14kHz to 22.05kHz. Then you would apply the spectrum of the interpolator, which will reduce but not eliminate the high frequencies. I haven't worked it all out. That's as far as I got this weekend. Chuck > > i naively tried adding this construct to the output, but the sound is > completely wrong: > (if it doesn't show, the phasor~ is connected to the right inlet of the > [samplehold~]) > > [inlet~] ???? ?? ? [phasor~ 28000] > |????????????????????? | > [samplehold~] > | > [outlet~] > > i thought about it for a bit, and i understand why that doesn't work, but i > can't think of another solution. > > is there some way i can 'mimic' 28khz samplerate while running pd at 44.1? > or even better, is there some way to locally set the samplerate for a > patch?? i tried messing round with [block~] but i can't make it do what i > need. > > also, i need to mimic a 12bit DAC~ too. > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > From sballmada at googlemail.com Mon Mar 16 13:53:18 2009 From: sballmada at googlemail.com (Simon Ball) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 12:53:18 +0000 Subject: [PD] Mouse Control... Message-ID: <31da0ae00903160553r3ed6d30dp1de22c101094a477@mail.gmail.com> Hi there I'm having trouble realising an idea. I've got the software running (mac book pro) and managed to play with some of the examples, however I am new to PD, so bare with me! I'm trying to generate a composition of images that float in 3D space. I want the images or layers to move and rotate towards areas of a screen where movement is detected. I don't need to track specific points of motion, simply to judge where movement is taking place. I think this will involve reading frames and analysing changes in pixels. Does that make sense? I plan to use a mini DV camera to run this, on a high contrast background, although I've seen a similar method of recording movement with a webcam and processing, which worked pretty well. ( http://vimeo.com/1948430?pg=embed&sec= - tracks changes in pixels, although I'm not sure how). I assume that this will involve some sort of trigonometry to move images towards points where motion is detected, although I'm not sure how to apply this in PD. Also, how to I generate a floating effect, much like 'easing' does in animation software. And can this work with 3D, mapped images in PD? I hope thats clear, if a little broad, let me know you need any further info. Thanks in advance for any suggestions/solutions. Simon Simon Ball -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hans at eds.org Mon Mar 16 13:53:56 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 12:53:56 +0000 Subject: [PD] Pd book sprint in NYC/Berlin In-Reply-To: <49BE13B4.4030400@mur.at> References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <49BDA282.9040607@gmail.com> <2D6F62EB-0878-4205-A5EA-AB248E81A93E@eds.org> <49BDB5A3.9090606@gmail.com> <49BE10BC.4010908@umatic.nl> <49BE13B4.4030400@mur.at> Message-ID: <597D53A5-9B00-40CE-8B7F-776A826E9DE2@eds.org> On Mar 16, 2009, at 8:54 AM, Georg Holzmann wrote: > Derek Holzer schrieb: >> My tendency is to keep everything as simple and low-tech as >> possible. Does video conferencing add anything substantial that IRC >> doesn't have already? Do we want to do interpretive dance for each >> other in order to write a FLOSS manual? Do we really need to look >> at another room full of people sitting behind laptops across the >> ocean somewhere? Does anybody ever actually watch these video >> streams from meetings like these? I could see some sense if there >> was some sort of presentation aspect, but these will be working >> sessions, i.e. very boring to look at . > > You are right. > And if one really wants to speak/see each other, one can use ekiga, > skype or whatever ... I find IRC meetings to be very unproductive. Everyone is usually too busy multitasking to get anything done in the meeting. I think that the high bandwidth of voice and seeing the person holds your attention longer, so there is less multitasking and more focused discussion. That said, if the audio connection is bad, then it gets worse than IRC. IRC is good for asking pointed questions back and forth, better than audio/video chat. I think we should have IRC running, but also it would be great to have video chat with projectors, speakers, and a decent mic setup. Marius and I ran the streaming for a class at Brooklyn Poly. One student was joining in from Canada. When it was set up and running well, it actually worked quite well. This means spending a little time setting up the speakers and mics, and a projector is good too instead of a screen. Since this will be happening over three days, it makes sense to spend some time on setup. ITP can provide all of the equipment on the NYC end. .hc > > > LG > Georg > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Man has survived hitherto because he was too ignorant to know how to realize his wishes. Now that he can realize them, he must either change them, or perish. -William Carlos Williams From marius.schebella at gmail.com Mon Mar 16 14:20:08 2009 From: marius.schebella at gmail.com (marius schebella) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 14:20:08 +0100 Subject: [PD] Pd book sprint in NYC/Berlin In-Reply-To: <597D53A5-9B00-40CE-8B7F-776A826E9DE2@eds.org> References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <49BDA282.9040607@gmail.com> <2D6F62EB-0878-4205-A5EA-AB248E81A93E@eds.org> <49BDB5A3.9090606@gmail.com> <49BE10BC.4010908@umatic.nl> <49BE13B4.4030400@mur.at> <597D53A5-9B00-40CE-8B7F-776A826E9DE2@eds.org> Message-ID: 2009/3/16 Hans-Christoph Steiner : > I think we should have IRC running, but also it would be great to have video > chat with projectors, speakers, and a decent mic setup. ?Marius and I ran > the streaming for a class at Brooklyn Poly. ?One student was joining in from > Canada. ?When it was set up and running well, it actually worked quite well. we used iChat for these sessions, and usually there were 3 streams involved. if more than one person is involved on one side, you really have to put some focus on the audio aspect, like using microphones that can be passed around. I will be in Berlin from mar27 to mar30, and I would also like to contribute to the book sprint, but it is difficult for me during week/business hours. is tehre already a plan for the schedule? marius. > ?This means spending a little time setting up the speakers and mics, and a > projector is good too instead of a screen. ?Since this will be happening > over three days, it makes sense to spend some time on setup. ?ITP can > provide all of the equipment on the NYC end. > > .hc > > >> >> >> LG >> Georg >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Man has survived hitherto because he was too ignorant to know how to realize > his wishes. ?Now that he can realize them, he must either change them, or > perish. ? ?-William Carlos Williams > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > From vboehm at gmx.ch Mon Mar 16 13:37:35 2009 From: vboehm at gmx.ch (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?volker_b=F6hm?=) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 13:37:35 +0100 Subject: [PD] steep filter? In-Reply-To: <20090316082528.GB15510@footils.org> References: <161320dd0903151037u6caa3f54p3ac85c7f5546d303@mail.gmail.com> <161320dd0903151102s1346f4d2kdfb0f94593ea8e28@mail.gmail.com> <20090316082528.GB15510@footils.org> Message-ID: On 16 Mar 2009, at 09:25, Frank Barknecht wrote: > > Jo?o Pais hat gesagt: // Jo?o Pais wrote: > > >> I looked in my list of pd-ext objects, but found no elliptic >> filters. are >> there any, or any way of getting their coefficients to use with >> biquad~? >> > > Elliptic filters are rather hard to design, most of the time you > will find > Butterworth or Chebyshev designs in our little audio world. > hey, jo?o you still haven't made friends with fft? ;) i've just finished a max external that does chebyshev filtering with a variable number of poles and adjustable % of ripple in the passband. repackaging this into a pd external wouldn't be too hard. if you are interested in trying this out, drop me a mail and i'll see when i can get it done. volker. From dmotd at gmx.net Mon Mar 16 14:29:16 2009 From: dmotd at gmx.net (dmotd) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 23:29:16 +1000 Subject: [PD] Pd book sprint in NYC/Berlin In-Reply-To: <597D53A5-9B00-40CE-8B7F-776A826E9DE2@eds.org> References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <49BE13B4.4030400@mur.at> <597D53A5-9B00-40CE-8B7F-776A826E9DE2@eds.org> Message-ID: <200903162329.16546.dmotd@gmx.net> i am really unsure what you are talking about.. a meeting is what it is, and the medium will never dictate what you are talking about and the intensity with which it is conducted.. perhaps face to face contact is good for watching the iris quiver and building a psychological profile based on that particular interaction, but really the amount of focus and dedication that anyone gives to a subject is dependent on variables that are quite out of control to other participants. in terms of multi-tasking... i am usually engaged on a number of things in any given time period.. what at least is consistent about IRC is that i can chose to focus on any given problem without having to make myself publically withdrawn from the discussion, and in such a circumstance i have a log to refer to what i have missed.. which leads me to my final point.. i have a log.. which everyone does, without transcription, without poor pronunciation and bad language getting in the way.. easy to archive and so on.. i have no real interest in the topic, but i have been a particpant in enough 'online meetings' to know that video conferencing is a complete waste of time, beyond the initial distraction of connectivity issues.. if people have something valid to say and real-time is the only productive forum then IRC works and works well, otherwise voice probably makes up for where text lacks, but only in small groups.. video is just an unnecessary and unproductive formality.. meetings are never as productive as the facilitato On Monday 16 March 2009 22:53:56 Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > I find IRC meetings to be very unproductive. Everyone is usually too > busy multitasking to get anything done in the meeting. I think that > the high bandwidth of voice and seeing the person holds your attention > longer, so there is less multitasking and more focused discussion. > That said, if the audio connection is bad, then it gets worse than > IRC. IRC is good for asking pointed questions back and forth, better > than audio/video chat. > > I think we should have IRC running, but also it would be great to have > video chat with projectors, speakers, and a decent mic setup. Marius > and I ran the streaming for a class at Brooklyn Poly. One student was > joining in from Canada. When it was set up and running well, it > actually worked quite well. This means spending a little time setting > up the speakers and mics, and a projector is good too instead of a > screen. Since this will be happening over three days, it makes sense > to spend some time on setup. ITP can provide all of the equipment on > the NYC end. > > .hc > > > LG > > Georg > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > --------------------------------------------------------------------------- >- > > Man has survived hitherto because he was too ignorant to know how to > realize his wishes. Now that he can realize them, he must either > change them, or perish. -William Carlos Williams > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From brandt at subnet.at Mon Mar 16 14:45:29 2009 From: brandt at subnet.at (brandt at subnet.at) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 14:45:29 +0100 (CET) Subject: [PD] Midi in with arduino In-Reply-To: References: <161320dd0903151037u6caa3f54p3ac85c7f5546d303@mail.gmail.com> <161320dd0903151102s1346f4d2kdfb0f94593ea8e28@mail.gmail.com> <20090316082528.GB15510@footils.org> Message-ID: <7796.81.223.29.242.1237211129.squirrel@webmail.*> Does anybody know how to wire a midi in on to the arduino. any help appreciate markus From grh at mur.at Mon Mar 16 14:53:26 2009 From: grh at mur.at (Georg Holzmann) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 14:53:26 +0100 Subject: [PD] Pd book sprint in NYC/Berlin In-Reply-To: References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <49BDA282.9040607@gmail.com> <2D6F62EB-0878-4205-A5EA-AB248E81A93E@eds.org> <49BDB5A3.9090606@gmail.com> <49BE10BC.4010908@umatic.nl> <49BE13B4.4030400@mur.at> <597D53A5-9B00-40CE-8B7F-776A826E9DE2@eds.org> Message-ID: <49BE59D6.30109@mur.at> Hallo! > I will be in Berlin from mar27 to mar30, and I would also like to > contribute to the book sprint, but it is difficult for me during > week/business hours. Yes, this weekend would be also nice for me ;) ! LG Georg From porres at gmail.com Mon Mar 16 15:06:32 2009 From: porres at gmail.com (Alexandre Porres) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 11:06:32 -0300 Subject: [PD] (Form Trouble) The PdCon09 webpage is down ... am I too late? Message-ID: <161a0b1e0903160706t175e13d4g8f72c89a2e6778aa@mail.gmail.com> well, some people are habing problems sending us the Forms, I dont know why... maybe some browser bug... please dont panic, just try it gently and calmly, if any problems, let us know pdcon09 at estudiolivre.org cheers On Mon, Mar 16, 2009 at 6:14 AM, wrote: > Send Pd-list mailing list submissions to > pd-list at iem.at > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > pd-list-request at iem.at > > You can reach the person managing the list at > pd-list-owner at iem.at > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Pd-list digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Question on SSSAD and scalability (Frank Barknecht) > 2. Re: The PdCon09 webpage is down ... am I too late? > (IOhannes m zmoelnig) > 3. Re: steep filter? (Frank Barknecht) > 4. Re: Unified Library was Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th > deadline! (Frank Barknecht) > 5. Re: Pd book sprint in NYC/Berlin (Derek Holzer) > 6. Re: The PdCon09 webpage is down ... am I too late? (Jaime Oliver) > 7. Re: Pd book sprint in NYC/Berlin (Georg Holzmann) > 8. Re: Problems accessing Pdlist Archives (Derek Holzer) > 9. Re: Problems accessing Pdlist Archives (Alex Lucas) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 08:54:44 +0100 > From: Frank Barknecht > Subject: Re: [PD] Question on SSSAD and scalability > To: pd-list at iem.at > Message-ID: <20090316075444.GA15510 at footils.org> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > Hallo, > Mike McGonagle hat gesagt: // Mike McGonagle wrote: > > > On Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 3:32 PM, Frank Barknecht > wrote: > > > > The context that I was actually thinking was in trying to do "live > > coding". Of all the times that I have been using SSSAD, my biggest > > complaint about it is that I would always need to resave, close, and > > reopen the file. It always seemed that the one instance of an SSSAD > > reference that I was deleting was the FIRST ONE. Of course, doing that > > was sure to make that parameters NOT SAVE, unless I reopened. > > A closebang would solve this. It will probably happen less often with local > sssads. > > > > Now if you really worry about the load of having a lot of > > > [route]-misses when sending message, I'd recommend to use the "local" > > > senders in sssad, that are used when adding a second argument to a > > > [sssad] object: [sssad key $0] will use a bus called [r $0-SSSAD] and > > > [r $0-SSSAD_ADMIN] instead of the global ones. > > > > My whole point of bringing this up has more to do with how an > > "external" (yes, actual C code) might be able to implement the SSSAD > > protocol. I can think of MANY EXTERNALS that would benefit by doing > > this... > > > > At the same time, that might make it appear that SSSAD is an accepted > > standard in Pd. And Miller, himself has written on this very topic... > > So, what is the means of storing data... is there one? > > Storing data is not in the realm of sssad - again this is by design and > comes > from my experience with RRADical/Memento where the storage was inside the > saving system and tied to [pool]. > > SSSAD is intended to to just one thing but do that right: Its purpose is to > eavesdrop on the messages that objects send to each other and distribute > them > to rsp. modify them from a central place. That's all. What comes after that > central place is up to the end user. It would be easy to make an external > that > does the same. sssad is just a wrapper around [list], [route] [send] and > [receive]. One "S" in its name stands for "simple". ;) > > > I'm curious, but how many "externals" do you have with RjDj? I can > > only assume that you can't do too much with it, other than the basic > > implementation of Pd. > > Hm, I don't understand this question? RjDj is pretty much pure Pd and has > almost no externals at all - which doesn't mean that you can't do much with > it: > For audio work Pd is very powerful and no externals are (strictly) > necessary. > > Ciao > -- > Frank > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 09:02:29 +0100 > From: IOhannes m zmoelnig > Subject: Re: [PD] The PdCon09 webpage is down ... am I too late? > To: danomatika > Cc: "pd-list at iem.at" > Message-ID: <49BE0795.2050309 at iem.at> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-15"; Format="flowed" > > danomatika wrote: > > On Sun, 2009-03-15 at 19:58 +0100, IOhannes m zm?lnig wrote: > > > >> paper submit page: > >> http://pdcon09.devolts.org/author/submit.php > >> > >> paper upload page (once you have submitted it): > >> http://pdcon09.devolts.org/author/upload.php > > > > Thanks IOhannes, but I'm looking for the performance application ... > > > > you can (or "could", by now) submit performances, installations, > workshops and papers with the above two links. > > fgmasdr > mfasdf. > IOhannes > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: smime.p7s > Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature > Size: 3636 bytes > Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature > URL: < > http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/attachments/20090316/2f7c9b40/attachment-0001.bin > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 09:25:28 +0100 > From: Frank Barknecht > Subject: Re: [PD] steep filter? > To: pd-list at iem.at > Message-ID: <20090316082528.GB15510 at footils.org> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > Hallo, > Jo?o Pais hat gesagt: // Jo?o Pais wrote: > > > yes, I had seen that graphic as well. but trying out the highpass > > iemfilters with noise, turns out that 10 hip~s work better. > > Hehe, I guess that's because you filter noise: It's harder to recognize the > noise that the 10 hip stages added. :) > > > I looked in my list of pd-ext objects, but found no elliptic filters. are > > there any, or any way of getting their coefficients to use with biquad~? > > Elliptic filters are rather hard to design, most of the time you will find > Butterworth or Chebyshev designs in our little audio world. > > A biquad~ has only two poles and zeroes, so you would need to cascade > several > stages to get a really sharp filter. > > Ciao > -- > Frank > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 09:30:59 +0100 > From: Frank Barknecht > Subject: Re: [PD] Unified Library was Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March > 9th deadline! > To: PD List > Message-ID: <20090316083059.GC15510 at footils.org> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > Hallo, > hard off hat gesagt: // hard off wrote: > > > yeah sorry frank, i should have explained more clearly. > > > > i also think that no GUI is the way to go for functional abstractions. > that > > was the big flaw of the DIY library i did, that the function of the > > abstractions was tied in with the gui component. i did it that way > because > > i didn't want to clutter the namespace with too many abstractions, and > the > > thought of one abstraction for function, and then a different one for GUI > > was not appealing at the time. > > > > but now, i think that is the only way to go. like, as you said, for > > polyphony. and then also for the many many cases in which you'd want to > > build your own gui for custom control. > > Yeah, basically that was all I wanted to say as well. ;) > > > i do think you guys have got a really really strong system there with > > rjlib. but i was just saying that without the gui stuff, it doesn't > exactly > > fit into being that 'all purpose building blocks' library that we are > > discussing. > > Yes, that's true. rjlib has its focus on audio and control abstractions to > be > used on mobile devices with vanilla Pd. Some of this fits into a "all > purpose" > library, but a lot of it doesn't. > > Ciao > -- > Frank > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 5 > Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 09:41:32 +0100 > From: Derek Holzer > Subject: Re: [PD] Pd book sprint in NYC/Berlin > Cc: PD List > Message-ID: <49BE10BC.4010908 at umatic.nl> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > > My tendency is to keep everything as simple and low-tech as possible. > Does video conferencing add anything substantial that IRC doesn't have > already? Do we want to do interpretive dance for each other in order to > write a FLOSS manual? Do we really need to look at another room full of > people sitting behind laptops across the ocean somewhere? Does anybody > ever actually watch these video streams from meetings like these? I > could see some sense if there was some sort of presentation aspect, but > these will be working sessions, i.e. very boring to look at . > > D. > > -- > ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: > http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 15: > "Ask your body" > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 6 > Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 01:49:46 -0700 > From: Jaime Oliver > Subject: Re: [PD] The PdCon09 webpage is down ... am I too late? > To: IOhannes m zmoelnig > Cc: danomatika , "pd-list at iem.at" > > Message-ID: > <616283880903160149i6d48d63br41d7f8bc5c8197ba at mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > hi everyone i have been trying for hours to upload the pdf form, but > it doesn't work for me, should I just try to send it by e-mail? > > J > > On Mon, Mar 16, 2009 at 1:02 AM, IOhannes m zmoelnig > wrote: > > danomatika wrote: > >> > >> On Sun, 2009-03-15 at 19:58 +0100, IOhannes m zm?lnig wrote: > >> > >>> paper submit page: > >>> http://pdcon09.devolts.org/author/submit.php > >>> > >>> paper upload page (once you have submitted it): > >>> http://pdcon09.devolts.org/author/upload.php > >> > >> Thanks IOhannes, but I'm looking for the performance application ... > >> > > > > you can (or "could", by now) submit performances, installations, > workshops > > and papers with the above two links. > > > > fgmasdr > > mfasdf. > > IOhannes > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > > > > -- > Jaime E Oliver LR > > joliverl at ucsd.edu > www.realidadvisual.org/jaimeoliver > www-crca.ucsd.edu/ > www.realidadvisual.org > > 858 202 1522 > 9168 Regents Rd. Apt. G > La Jolla, CA 92037 > USA > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 7 > Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 09:54:12 +0100 > From: Georg Holzmann > Subject: Re: [PD] Pd book sprint in NYC/Berlin > To: Derek Holzer > Cc: PD List > Message-ID: <49BE13B4.4030400 at mur.at> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > > Derek Holzer schrieb: > > My tendency is to keep everything as simple and low-tech as possible. > > Does video conferencing add anything substantial that IRC doesn't have > > already? Do we want to do interpretive dance for each other in order to > > write a FLOSS manual? Do we really need to look at another room full of > > people sitting behind laptops across the ocean somewhere? Does anybody > > ever actually watch these video streams from meetings like these? I > > could see some sense if there was some sort of presentation aspect, but > > these will be working sessions, i.e. very boring to look at . > > You are right. > And if one really wants to speak/see each other, one can use ekiga, > skype or whatever ... > > LG > Georg > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 8 > Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 09:57:30 +0100 > From: Derek Holzer > Subject: Re: [PD] Problems accessing Pdlist Archives > To: Alex Lucas > Cc: pd-list at iem.at > Message-ID: <49BE147A.4080709 at umatic.nl> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > > Hi Alex, > > I had the same problem yesterday. There are three alternates listed at: > > http://puredata.info/community/lists > > Gmane, Mail Archive and Markmail. One of those should work for you. > > best! > Derek > > Alex Lucas wrote: > > Hello everyone, > > > > Over the last couple of days I haven't been able to access the Pdlist > > Archives by following the link on this page > > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list. Has anyone else had the > > same problem or dose anyone know of an alternative link? > > > -- > ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: > http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 173: > "Voice your suspicions" > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 9 > Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 09:16:49 +0000 > From: Alex Lucas > Subject: Re: [PD] Problems accessing Pdlist Archives > To: Derek Holzer > Cc: pd-list at iem.at > Message-ID: > <6b61086c0903160216m79ba0ecch27b317a42038faf7 at mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > Hi Derek, > > Thanks for your help, I really like markmail! > > Thanks, > Alex > > 2009/3/16 Derek Holzer > > > Hi Alex, > > > > I had the same problem yesterday. There are three alternates listed at: > > > > http://puredata.info/community/lists > > > > Gmane, Mail Archive and Markmail. One of those should work for you. > > > > best! > > Derek > > > > > > Alex Lucas wrote: > > > >> Hello everyone, > >> > >> Over the last couple of days I haven't been able to access the Pdlist > >> Archives by following the link on this page > >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list. Has anyone else had the > same > >> problem or dose anyone know of an alternative link? > >> > > > > > > -- > > ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: > > http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: > > ---Oblique Strategy # 173: > > "Voice your suspicions" > > > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: < > http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/attachments/20090316/adf09b8d/attachment.htm > > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list mailing list > Pd-list at iem.at > to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > End of Pd-list Digest, Vol 48, Issue 72 > *************************************** > -- Alexandre Torres Porres cel. (11)8179-6226 Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From derek at umatic.nl Mon Mar 16 15:11:22 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 15:11:22 +0100 Subject: [PD] Pd book sprint in NYC/Berlin In-Reply-To: <49BE59D6.30109@mur.at> References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <49BDA282.9040607@gmail.com> <2D6F62EB-0878-4205-A5EA-AB248E81A93E@eds.org> <49BDB5A3.9090606@gmail.com> <49BE10BC.4010908@umatic.nl> <49BE13B4.4030400@mur.at> <597D53A5-9B00-40CE-8B7F-776A826E9DE2@eds.org> <49BE59D6.30109@mur.at> Message-ID: <49BE5E0A.3000802@umatic.nl> Glad there is some interest!!!!! It's looking like it will be 4, 5, 6 April (Saturday-Monday). I will post again when all is confirmed. best! Derek Georg Holzmann wrote: > Hallo! > >> I will be in Berlin from mar27 to mar30, and I would also like to >> contribute to the book sprint, but it is difficult for me during >> week/business hours. > > Yes, this weekend would be also nice for me ;) ! > > LG > Georg > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 138: "Retrace your steps" From dmotd at gmx.net Mon Mar 16 15:05:39 2009 From: dmotd at gmx.net (dmotd) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 00:05:39 +1000 Subject: [PD] Mouse Control... In-Reply-To: <31da0ae00903160553r3ed6d30dp1de22c101094a477@mail.gmail.com> References: <31da0ae00903160553r3ed6d30dp1de22c101094a477@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200903170005.39951.dmotd@gmx.net> hi simon and welcome to the pd community.. it's a decent question and you will no doubt get a number of different responses.. depending on your system you have a few options: gem, pdp or gridflow, which all cover the imaging section of your question. gem however is probably the most appropriate as it covers both the 3D and the interactive part in one. gem allows you to interact with image, video and GL primitives in a 3D space.. it also covers input and depending on how you require live imagary to be captured you have varying levels of control, for example there is [pix_blob], which describes the average mass (gravity) of movement in terms of X+Y (which sounds like what you're after), there is [pix_hit] which allows you to describe parts of the image grid which trigger when the input passes through, or there is [pix_dump] which outputs the incoming pixel grid as a list which you can process with your own math. as for your camera, it should be supported by gem, but DV support can be a bit sketchy on some platforms.. gem is part of the pd-extended build which runs on many systems.. this is a fairly broad answer to a broad question, i hope it helps.. dmotd On Monday 16 March 2009 22:53:18 Simon Ball wrote: > Hi there > > I'm having trouble realising an idea. I've got the software running (mac > book pro) and managed to play with some of the examples, however I am new > to PD, so bare with me! > > I'm trying to generate a composition of images that float in 3D space. I > want the images or layers to move and rotate towards areas of a screen > where movement is detected. I don't need to track specific points of > motion, simply to judge where movement is taking place. I think this will > involve reading frames and analysing changes in pixels. Does that make > sense? > > I plan to use a mini DV camera to run this, on a high contrast background, > although I've seen a similar method of recording movement with a webcam and > processing, which worked pretty well. ( > http://vimeo.com/1948430?pg=embed&sec= - tracks changes in pixels, although > I'm not sure how). > > I assume that this will involve some sort of trigonometry to move images > towards points where motion is detected, although I'm not sure how to apply > this in PD. Also, how to I generate a floating effect, much like 'easing' > does in animation software. And can this work with 3D, mapped images in PD? > > I hope thats clear, if a little broad, let me know you need any further > info. > > Thanks in advance for any suggestions/solutions. > > Simon > > Simon Ball From dmotd at gmx.net Mon Mar 16 15:48:14 2009 From: dmotd at gmx.net (dmotd) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 00:48:14 +1000 Subject: [PD] Mouse Control... In-Reply-To: <200903170005.39951.dmotd@gmx.net> References: <31da0ae00903160553r3ed6d30dp1de22c101094a477@mail.gmail.com> <200903170005.39951.dmotd@gmx.net> Message-ID: <200903170048.14837.dmotd@gmx.net> oh and don't forget that this mailing list is archived, and this is actually a query that comes up once every few months.. you could probably answer all of your own questions with a few well targeted search terms.. http://puredata.info/community/lists/ On Tuesday 17 March 2009 00:05:39 dmotd wrote: > hi simon and welcome to the pd community.. > > it's a decent question and you will no doubt get a number of different > responses.. > > depending on your system you have a few options: gem, pdp or gridflow, > which all cover the imaging section of your question. gem however is > probably the most appropriate as it covers both the 3D and the interactive > part in one. gem allows you to interact with image, video and GL primitives > in a 3D space.. it also covers input and depending on how you require live > imagary to be captured you have varying levels of control, for example > there is [pix_blob], which describes the average mass (gravity) of movement > in terms of X+Y (which sounds like what you're after), there is [pix_hit] > which allows you to describe parts of the image grid which trigger when the > input passes through, or there is [pix_dump] which outputs the incoming > pixel grid as a list which you can process with your own math. > > as for your camera, it should be supported by gem, but DV support can be a > bit sketchy on some platforms.. > > gem is part of the pd-extended build which runs on many systems.. > > this is a fairly broad answer to a broad question, i hope it helps.. > > dmotd > > On Monday 16 March 2009 22:53:18 Simon Ball wrote: > > Hi there > > > > I'm having trouble realising an idea. I've got the software running (mac > > book pro) and managed to play with some of the examples, however I am new > > to PD, so bare with me! > > > > I'm trying to generate a composition of images that float in 3D space. I > > want the images or layers to move and rotate towards areas of a screen > > where movement is detected. I don't need to track specific points of > > motion, simply to judge where movement is taking place. I think this will > > involve reading frames and analysing changes in pixels. Does that make > > sense? > > > > I plan to use a mini DV camera to run this, on a high contrast > > background, although I've seen a similar method of recording movement > > with a webcam and processing, which worked pretty well. ( > > http://vimeo.com/1948430?pg=embed&sec= - tracks changes in pixels, > > although I'm not sure how). > > > > I assume that this will involve some sort of trigonometry to move images > > towards points where motion is detected, although I'm not sure how to > > apply this in PD. Also, how to I generate a floating effect, much like > > 'easing' does in animation software. And can this work with 3D, mapped > > images in PD? > > > > I hope thats clear, if a little broad, let me know you need any further > > info. > > > > Thanks in advance for any suggestions/solutions. > > > > Simon > > > > Simon Ball > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From hard.off at gmail.com Mon Mar 16 15:49:41 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 23:49:41 +0900 Subject: [PD] change samplerate locally In-Reply-To: <518fe7b20903160537r27ec7a07g4afaa46c9aa5774a@mail.gmail.com> References: <161320dd0903150044o40e499aexd3701171746e3d5b@mail.gmail.com> <518fe7b20903160537r27ec7a07g4afaa46c9aa5774a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <161320dd0903160749g2a2eaa7ei661b1747684d2b59@mail.gmail.com> >>One thing that occurs to me is that the quality of the reconstructed sound has more to do with the interpolator rather than the sample rate.<< i have a feeling that because the synth has non-bandlimited oscillators, that the sample rate itself is pretty important, or more importantly, the aliasing effect it has is very important. i think that that reason why 28khz is sounding 'better' than 44.1 is because of more high frequencies folding back over and thickening the sound up in the low end. i could be totally wrong, but that's what it sounds like. 44.1khz is 'thin and wimpy', but at 28khz it's a thicker, fuller sound. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From matju at artengine.ca Mon Mar 16 15:59:38 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 10:59:38 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] Pd book sprint in NYC/Berlin In-Reply-To: <200903162329.16546.dmotd@gmx.net> References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <49BE13B4.4030400@mur.at> <597D53A5-9B00-40CE-8B7F-776A826E9DE2@eds.org> <200903162329.16546.dmotd@gmx.net> Message-ID: On Mon, 16 Mar 2009, dmotd wrote: > i am really unsure what you are talking about.. a meeting is what it is, > and the medium will never dictate what you are talking about and the > intensity with which it is conducted.. perhaps face to face contact is > good for watching the iris quiver and building a psychological profile > based on that particular interaction, It also goes the other way around. The knowledge of being watched leads people to act very differently: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6KV9vOQiBTQ (a 1994 classic... but very undermarketed) _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From hard.off at gmail.com Mon Mar 16 16:04:20 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 00:04:20 +0900 Subject: [PD] change samplerate locally In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903160749g2a2eaa7ei661b1747684d2b59@mail.gmail.com> References: <161320dd0903150044o40e499aexd3701171746e3d5b@mail.gmail.com> <518fe7b20903160537r27ec7a07g4afaa46c9aa5774a@mail.gmail.com> <161320dd0903160749g2a2eaa7ei661b1747684d2b59@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <161320dd0903160804i72f673faw4c7cbb9789b009d@mail.gmail.com> so if those aliasing effects are going to help, then maybe a big step will be to ADD aliasing. there are a couple of suggestions here: http://www.music.columbia.edu/pipermail/music-dsp/2002-March/047953.html and here: http://www.music.columbia.edu/pipermail/music-dsp/2002-March/047966.html i'll give them a go tomorrow. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From crislists at gmail.com Mon Mar 16 16:16:22 2009 From: crislists at gmail.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?cristiano_figueir=F3?=) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 12:16:22 -0300 Subject: [PD] The PdCon09 webpage is UP In-Reply-To: <222070.83944.qm@web26306.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> References: <222070.83944.qm@web26306.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <728d2a350903160816s774f7c96g4b5391d90837ddc6@mail.gmail.com> Hi Ed, yes you still can upload the paper to your submission. Cheers Cristiano On Mon, Mar 16, 2009 at 4:31 AM, Ed Kelly wrote: > > AAArgh > > Should I send the paper? > Please be gentle with me! > > Ed > > Lone Shark: Synchromatic: Out December 1st 2008 > http://www.pyramidtransmissions.com/store > Also available through the iTunes store > > > --- On Sun, 15/3/09, Alexandre Porres wrote: > > > From: Alexandre Porres > > Subject: Re: [PD] The PdCon09 webpage is UP > > To: "marius schebella" , "pd-list" < > pd-list at iem.at> > > Date: Sunday, 15 March, 2009, 11:39 PM > > oficial deadline is about 3:30h from > > now. midnight UTC-3 > > but we are being flexible and comprehensive as a > > lot of people are in trouble... > > thanks for the submitions > > > > :) > > > > On Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 8:23 PM, > > marius schebella > > wrote: > > > > and the > > deadline is at midnight? > > > > marius. > > > > > > > > Alexandre Porres wrote: > > > > > > http://convention.puredata.info > > > > > > is back on air > > > > > > > > hope you have seen it... > > > > > > > > cheers > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Pd-list at iem.at > > mailing list > > > > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > Alexandre Torres Porres > > cel. (11)8179-6226 > > Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home > > http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Inline Attachment Follows----- > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Pd-list at iem.at > > mailing list > > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From martin.peach at sympatico.ca Mon Mar 16 16:33:14 2009 From: martin.peach at sympatico.ca (martin.peach at sympatico.ca) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 15:33:14 +0000 Subject: [PD] Midi in with arduino In-Reply-To: <7796.81.223.29.242.1237211129.squirrel@webmail.*> References: <161320dd0903151037u6caa3f54p3ac85c7f5546d303@mail.gmail.com> <161320dd0903151102s1346f4d2kdfb0f94593ea8e28@mail.gmail.com> <20090316082528.GB15510@footils.org> <7796.81.223.29.242.1237211129.squirrel@webmail.*> Message-ID: > Does anybody know how to wire a midi in on to the arduino. > See the attached schematic. The Rx pin is whichever digital input on the Arduino you are using. The two MIDI wires are pins 4 and 5 of a DIN-5 connector. You must not connect the ground (shield or pin 2) from the MIDI cable. R2 and D1 are there to let you see the data as it arrives by flashing the LED, so they're not essential. Martin -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... 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Name: MIDI_IN.PNG Type: image/png Size: 20044 bytes Desc: not available URL: From hard.off at gmail.com Mon Mar 16 16:35:58 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 00:35:58 +0900 Subject: [PD] change samplerate locally In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903160804i72f673faw4c7cbb9789b009d@mail.gmail.com> References: <161320dd0903150044o40e499aexd3701171746e3d5b@mail.gmail.com> <518fe7b20903160537r27ec7a07g4afaa46c9aa5774a@mail.gmail.com> <161320dd0903160749g2a2eaa7ei661b1747684d2b59@mail.gmail.com> <161320dd0903160804i72f673faw4c7cbb9789b009d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <161320dd0903160835q749d4920j395ef373e86c651d@mail.gmail.com> i had a minor breakthrough. upsampling my signal path, by using [block~ 64 1 2] has the same effect on the sound as lowering pd's global sample rate to 22050. not perfect, and to me it defies logic, but certainly a lot closer to the 28khz sound than the 44.1khz sound was getting. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From nicholas.mariette at limsi.fr Mon Mar 16 17:21:33 2009 From: nicholas.mariette at limsi.fr (Nicholas Mariette) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 17:21:33 +0100 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> Message-ID: I have an old patch called nm-grainer that used an earlier version of nqpoly to do granular synthesis using a self modifying patch to do variable polyphony. http://soundsorange.net/cmsimple/index.php?projects:nm-grainer_granular_synthesis_patch_for_Pd http://puredata.info/Members/nmariette/nm-grainer-description/?searchterm=nm-grainer Nick On Mar 11, 2009, at 6:55 PM, Derek Holzer wrote: > Would like to show some examples of dynamic and self-modifying Pd > patches during a workshop here in Berlin. I know there are some in > the archives (and maybe on people's HDs) somewhere, but damned if I > can find them. Links to previkous posts or new examples welcome! > > best! > Derek > > -- > ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista > ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 163: > "Turn it upside down" > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From amos.robinson at gmail.com Mon Mar 16 17:30:28 2009 From: amos.robinson at gmail.com (Amos Robinson) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 03:30:28 +1100 Subject: [PD] change samplerate locally In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903160835q749d4920j395ef373e86c651d@mail.gmail.com> References: <161320dd0903150044o40e499aexd3701171746e3d5b@mail.gmail.com> <518fe7b20903160537r27ec7a07g4afaa46c9aa5774a@mail.gmail.com> <161320dd0903160749g2a2eaa7ei661b1747684d2b59@mail.gmail.com> <161320dd0903160804i72f673faw4c7cbb9789b009d@mail.gmail.com> <161320dd0903160835q749d4920j395ef373e86c651d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Hmm. I thought the DX7 was ~57khz, anyway: http://www.maths.abdn.ac.uk/~bensondj/html/Chowning.html On Tue, Mar 17, 2009 at 2:35 AM, hard off wrote: > i had a minor breakthrough. > > upsampling my signal path, by using [block~ 64 1 2] has the same effect on > the sound as lowering pd's global sample rate to 22050. > > not perfect, and to me it defies logic, but certainly a lot closer to the > 28khz sound than the 44.1khz sound was getting. > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > From jmmmpais at googlemail.com Mon Mar 16 17:58:19 2009 From: jmmmpais at googlemail.com (=?iso-8859-15?Q?Jo=E3o_Pais?=) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 16:58:19 -0000 Subject: [PD] steep filter? In-Reply-To: References: <161320dd0903151037u6caa3f54p3ac85c7f5546d303@mail.gmail.com> <161320dd0903151102s1346f4d2kdfb0f94593ea8e28@mail.gmail.com> <20090316082528.GB15510@footils.org> Message-ID: >>> I looked in my list of pd-ext objects, but found no elliptic filters. >>> are >>> there any, or any way of getting their coefficients to use with >>> biquad~? >>> >> >> Elliptic filters are rather hard to design, most of the time you will >> find >> Butterworth or Chebyshev designs in our little audio world. >> > > hey, jo?o > you still haven't made friends with fft? ;) > i've just finished a max external that does chebyshev filtering with a > variable number of poles and adjustable % of ripple in the passband. > repackaging this into a pd external wouldn't be too hard. > if you are interested in trying this out, drop me a mail and i'll see > when i can get it done. > volker. ah ah, that's true. actually I didn't need anything so far that *had* to be done with fft, so I never learned it properly (just unproperly a couple of times, like yours, in which I didn't exercise afterwards). of course I would be interested in the filter, as well as the rest of the community should be. don't make any rush because of me, because it can happen that after a while I don't need it anymore (in case you're too busy with something else). but if you want to join your code to pd-ext, everyone will be happy. (and windows compatible, please) From jmmmpais at googlemail.com Mon Mar 16 18:04:16 2009 From: jmmmpais at googlemail.com (=?iso-8859-15?Q?Jo=E3o_Pais?=) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 17:04:16 -0000 Subject: [PD] Pd book sprint in NYC/Berlin In-Reply-To: <49BE59D6.30109@mur.at> References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <49BDA282.9040607@gmail.com> <2D6F62EB-0878-4205-A5EA-AB248E81A93E@eds.org> <49BDB5A3.9090606@gmail.com> <49BE10BC.4010908@umatic.nl> <49BE13B4.4030400@mur.at> <597D53A5-9B00-40CE-8B7F-776A826E9DE2@eds.org> <49BE59D6.30109@mur.at> Message-ID: I'll be back in Berlin on the 25th. I'm usually flexible - i.e. I must work, but not on a fixed schedule. what's actually the theme of the work to be done? I saw no link so far. a book on pd, what could that be? printing the tutorials and appending them together? >> I will be in Berlin from mar27 to mar30, and I would also like to >> contribute to the book sprint, but it is difficult for me during >> week/business hours. > > Yes, this weekend would be also nice for me ;) ! > > LG > Georg > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list -- Friedenstr. 58 10249 Berlin (Deutschland) Tel +49 30 42020091 | Mob +49 162 6843570 jmmmpais at googlemail.com | skype: jmmmpjmmmp From hans at eds.org Mon Mar 16 18:30:32 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 17:30:32 +0000 Subject: [PD] Pd book sprint in NYC/Berlin In-Reply-To: <200903162329.16546.dmotd@gmx.net> References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <49BE13B4.4030400@mur.at> <597D53A5-9B00-40CE-8B7F-776A826E9DE2@eds.org> <200903162329.16546.dmotd@gmx.net> Message-ID: Marshall McLuhan would strongly disagree with you, as do I. The medium with which you communicate has a very strong impact on the conversation. That does not mean that it is the only influence. There are many things that lead to a bad meeting, and from my experience of having many meetings in person, on IRC, on IM, on phones, on voice chat, on video chat, and many different mixes above, I am a strong believer in high-bandwidth communication like voice. .hc On Mar 16, 2009, at 1:29 PM, dmotd wrote: > i am really unsure what you are talking about.. a meeting is what it > is, and > the medium will never dictate what you are talking about and the > intensity > with which it is conducted.. perhaps face to face contact is good for > watching the iris quiver and building a psychological profile based > on that > particular interaction, but really the amount of focus and > dedication that > anyone gives to a subject is dependent on variables that are quite > out of > control to other participants. > > in terms of multi-tasking... i am usually engaged on a number of > things in any > given time period.. what at least is consistent about IRC is that i > can chose > to focus on any given problem without having to make myself publically > withdrawn from the discussion, and in such a circumstance i have a > log to > refer to what i have missed.. > > which leads me to my final point.. i have a log.. which everyone > does, without > transcription, without poor pronunciation and bad language getting > in the > way.. easy to archive and so on.. > > i have no real interest in the topic, but i have been a particpant in > enough 'online meetings' to know that video conferencing is a > complete waste > of time, beyond the initial distraction of connectivity issues.. > > if people have something valid to say and real-time is the only > productive > forum then IRC works and works well, otherwise voice probably makes > up for > where text lacks, but only in small groups.. video is just an > unnecessary and > unproductive formality.. > > meetings are never as productive as the facilitato > > On Monday 16 March 2009 22:53:56 Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >> I find IRC meetings to be very unproductive. Everyone is usually too >> busy multitasking to get anything done in the meeting. I think that >> the high bandwidth of voice and seeing the person holds your >> attention >> longer, so there is less multitasking and more focused discussion. >> That said, if the audio connection is bad, then it gets worse than >> IRC. IRC is good for asking pointed questions back and forth, better >> than audio/video chat. >> >> I think we should have IRC running, but also it would be great to >> have >> video chat with projectors, speakers, and a decent mic setup. Marius >> and I ran the streaming for a class at Brooklyn Poly. One student >> was >> joining in from Canada. When it was set up and running well, it >> actually worked quite well. This means spending a little time >> setting >> up the speakers and mics, and a projector is good too instead of a >> screen. Since this will be happening over three days, it makes sense >> to spend some time on setup. ITP can provide all of the equipment on >> the NYC end. >> >> .hc >> >>> LG >>> Georg >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> - >> >> Man has survived hitherto because he was too ignorant to know how to >> realize his wishes. Now that he can realize them, he must either >> change them, or perish. -William Carlos Williams >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- kill your television From hans at eds.org Mon Mar 16 18:31:43 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 17:31:43 +0000 Subject: [PD] Pd book sprint in NYC/Berlin In-Reply-To: <49BE59D6.30109@mur.at> References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <49BDA282.9040607@gmail.com> <2D6F62EB-0878-4205-A5EA-AB248E81A93E@eds.org> <49BDB5A3.9090606@gmail.com> <49BE10BC.4010908@umatic.nl> <49BE13B4.4030400@mur.at> <597D53A5-9B00-40CE-8B7F-776A826E9DE2@eds.org> <49BE59D6.30109@mur.at> Message-ID: On Mar 16, 2009, at 1:53 PM, Georg Holzmann wrote: > Hallo! > >> I will be in Berlin from mar27 to mar30, and I would also like to >> contribute to the book sprint, but it is difficult for me during >> week/business hours. > > Yes, this weekend would be also nice for me ;) ! What time are people thinking of starting in Berlin? I am trying to organize the space in NYC. Will this be a morning thing there? If so, that's easier for NYC time to sync up with. But that's not essential. .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- If nature has made any one thing less susceptible than all others of exclusive property, it is the action of the thinking power called an idea, which an individual may exclusively possess as long as he keeps it to himself; but the moment it is divulged, it forces itself into the possession of everyone, and the receiver cannot dispossess himself of it. - Thomas Jefferson From devel at thesaddj.com Mon Mar 16 18:44:57 2009 From: devel at thesaddj.com (Marco Donnarumma) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 18:44:57 +0100 Subject: [PD] C::NTR::L - AV+physical computing processing Message-ID: Hi all, i'm really glad to share with the list my latest project, cause without the help of everybody here i wouldn't be able to speak about it now.. ;) C::NTR::L is a "software", naturally Pd-based, for audiovisual live performances exploiting physical computing. It transforms a standard musical instrument in an augmented tool to control real-time audio-video processing, without the need of any external device (damned expensive) or MIDI. You play your score and to each note is connected an audio, video or audiovisual fx, and you can connect whatever you want with whatever you desire. It's Pd! C::NTR::L is Cross-Platform for Mac, Linux and Windows (so far i've been able to keep the same patch working on all platform, too lucky...) By now it has been succesfully tested with electric bass guitar, guitar, piano (only two octaves working right now), accordion and trumpet. I conceived this project almost three years ago (when i was just starting to get aware of the existence of Pd). I was playing the bass guitar trying to control videos with resolume :( and sound with AudioMulch. wow.. i cannot figure out how! anyway, since my competences and passion for Pd grew up, i decided to make the whole project become a software for public use and to do it exclusively focusing on Pd. Today this is the result (I C::ntr::l Nature, my audiovisual performance for electric bass guitar and butterfly): http://vimeo.com/2225345 I sent out a call for beta-testers on the most used audiovisual-related forums (Pd forum too), i fixed most of the bugs and someone is planning to do things with my lil creature. Now I'm planning the public release of version 1.2 Beta in the end of this month (if i won't be eated by my everyday job). I'm writing to the list not only to let you know the news, but specially because i would like to know if there is anybody out there who has time and will to help me in the cleaning and further development of the code. Being a webdesigner, usability and accessiblity are my first aims. I've many ideas and many suggestions collected in my to-do list, but being alone, the development would be really slow, maybe even pointless. I would be glad to answer to all questions, technical, conceptual and more... and to explain more in depth how C::NTR::L is working. I know everybody is quite busy, infact i would be really glad also of some little help with some taks. I'm also developing a new interface trying to make C::NTR::L user-friendly for real. But this is another issue that i also would like to discuss about with the list. My idea, maybe pretty ingenuos, is to create a software for audiovisual performances so easy to use also for no-Pd'rs, that one would download Pd (and starting to familiarize with it) because of the interest towards C::NTR::L, or any other user-friendly software - unfortunately i don't see many around. For sure it wouldn't happen with millions of people, but maybe it could help in the spreading of Pd, and OS multimedia creation. further link (still have to update some contents, but....the most is there....) www.thesaddj.com/cntrl www.thesaddj.com/icontrolnature sorry for the very very long e-mail. best -- Marco Donnarumma aka The !S.A.D! Multimedia Artist, Live Performer Roma, IT LAB: http://www.thesaddj.com | http://www.flxer.net EVENT: http://www.liveperformersmeeting.net -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From derek at umatic.nl Mon Mar 16 19:06:20 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 19:06:20 +0100 Subject: [PD] Pd book sprint in NYC/Berlin In-Reply-To: References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <49BDA282.9040607@gmail.com> <2D6F62EB-0878-4205-A5EA-AB248E81A93E@eds.org> <49BDB5A3.9090606@gmail.com> <49BE10BC.4010908@umatic.nl> <49BE13B4.4030400@mur.at> <597D53A5-9B00-40CE-8B7F-776A826E9DE2@eds.org> <49BE59D6.30109@mur.at> Message-ID: <49BE951C.50806@umatic.nl> Hi Jo?o, sorry not to be clearer... in between Pd workshop last week and week long "tour" in London this week. Here is the existing Pd FLOSS Manual: http://en.flossmanuals.net/puredata And I will post more info about chapters which need work soon. You can check archives of Pd list for previous discussion of Pd FLOSS in the meantime, and make yourself a login at flossmanuals.net and have a "behind the scenes" look beforehand, but when I'm back from London on 25th I'll be able to explain better. Would be great to have you on board! best, Derek Jo?o Pais wrote: > I'll be back in Berlin on the 25th. I'm usually flexible - i.e. I must > work, but not on a fixed schedule. > > what's actually the theme of the work to be done? I saw no link so far. > a book on pd, what could that be? printing the tutorials and appending > them together? > > > >>> I will be in Berlin from mar27 to mar30, and I would also like to >>> contribute to the book sprint, but it is difficult for me during >>> week/business hours. >> >> Yes, this weekend would be also nice for me ;) ! >> >> LG >> Georg >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 44: "Discard an axiom" From derek at umatic.nl Mon Mar 16 19:12:01 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 19:12:01 +0100 Subject: [PD] Pd book sprint in NYC/Berlin In-Reply-To: References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <49BDA282.9040607@gmail.com> <2D6F62EB-0878-4205-A5EA-AB248E81A93E@eds.org> <49BDB5A3.9090606@gmail.com> <49BE10BC.4010908@umatic.nl> <49BE13B4.4030400@mur.at> <597D53A5-9B00-40CE-8B7F-776A826E9DE2@eds.org> <49BE59D6.30109@mur.at> Message-ID: <49BE9671.6050904@umatic.nl> I charge double for mornings ;-) Honestly, I don't expect anything to ever happen in Berlin before noon, anywhere. Why is morning here easier to sync up with there? I don't get it.... Should be afternoons/evenings would be easier to get during NY daytime... D. Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > On Mar 16, 2009, at 1:53 PM, Georg Holzmann wrote: > >> Hallo! >> >>> I will be in Berlin from mar27 to mar30, and I would also like to >>> contribute to the book sprint, but it is difficult for me during >>> week/business hours. >> >> Yes, this weekend would be also nice for me ;) ! > > What time are people thinking of starting in Berlin? I am trying to > organize the space in NYC. Will this be a morning thing there? If so, > that's easier for NYC time to sync up with. But that's not essential. -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 69: "Feed the recording back out of the medium" From pkstone at ucdavis.edu Mon Mar 16 19:24:33 2009 From: pkstone at ucdavis.edu (Phil Stone) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 11:24:33 -0700 Subject: [PD] C::NTR::L - AV+physical computing processing In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49BE9961.2010303@ucdavis.edu> This is very impressive, Marco. What grabs me immediately is that you are demo'ing with bass (nice Steiny or Hohner, btw) - lower-frequency instruments are particularly difficult for pitch-detection. What is the latency? It's hard to tell from the video, but it looks pretty responsive. How accurate? I've been waiting a long time to plug my bass into my Pd stuff. I will be happy to test anything, and also to help with the code cleanup, if it lies within my area of competence. Nice work! Phil Stone www.pkstonemusic.com Marco Donnarumma wrote: > Hi all, > i'm really glad to share with the list my latest project, cause > without the help of everybody here i wouldn't be able to speak about > it now.. ;) > C::NTR::L is a "software", naturally Pd-based, for audiovisual live > performances exploiting physical computing. It transforms a standard > musical instrument in an augmented tool to control real-time > audio-video processing, without the need of any external device > (damned expensive) or MIDI. You play your score and to each note is > connected an audio, video or audiovisual fx, and you can connect > whatever you want with whatever you desire. It's Pd! > > C::NTR::L is Cross-Platform for Mac, Linux and Windows (so far i've > been able to keep the same patch working on all platform, too lucky...) > By now it has been succesfully tested with electric bass guitar, > guitar, piano (only two octaves working right now), accordion and trumpet. > I conceived this project almost three years ago (when i was just > starting to get aware of the existence of Pd). I was playing the bass > guitar trying to control videos with resolume :( and sound with > AudioMulch. wow.. i cannot figure out how! > anyway, since my competences and passion for Pd grew up, i decided to > make the whole project become a software for public use and to do it > exclusively focusing on Pd. > Today this is the result (I C::ntr::l Nature, my audiovisual > performance for electric bass guitar and butterfly): > > http://vimeo.com/2225345 > > I sent out a call for beta-testers on the most used > audiovisual-related forums (Pd forum too), i fixed most of the bugs > and someone is planning to do things with my lil creature. > Now I'm planning the public release of version 1.2 Beta in the end > of this month (if i won't be eated by my everyday job). > > I'm writing to the list not only to let you know the news, but > specially because i would like to know if there is anybody out there > who has time and will to help me in the cleaning and further > development of the code. > Being a webdesigner, usability and accessiblity are my first aims. > I've many ideas and many suggestions collected in my to-do list, but > being alone, the development would be really slow, maybe even pointless. > I would be glad to answer to all questions, technical, conceptual and > more... and to explain more in depth how C::NTR::L is working. > I know everybody is quite busy, infact i would be really glad also of > some little help with some taks. > > I'm also developing a new interface trying to make C::NTR::L > user-friendly for real. But this is another issue that i also would > like to discuss about with the list. > My idea, maybe pretty ingenuos, is to create a software for > audiovisual performances so easy to use also for no-Pd'rs, that one > would download Pd (and starting to familiarize with it) because of the > interest towards C::NTR::L, or any other user-friendly software - > unfortunately i don't see many around. > For sure it wouldn't happen with millions of people, but maybe it > could help in the spreading of Pd, and OS multimedia creation. > > further link (still have to update some contents, but....the most is > there....) > > www.thesaddj.com/cntrl > www.thesaddj.com/icontrolnature > > sorry for the very very long e-mail. > best > > > > > -- > Marco Donnarumma aka The !S.A.D! > > > > Multimedia Artist, Live Performer > Roma, IT > > LAB: http://www.thesaddj.com | http://www.flxer.net > > EVENT: http://www.liveperformersmeeting.net > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > From jkreidler at gmx.de Mon Mar 16 20:12:21 2009 From: jkreidler at gmx.de (Johannes Kreidler) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 20:12:21 +0100 Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com Message-ID: <49BEA495.8060106@gmx.de> hi list, I am pleased to announce that the big pd tutorial I wrote in the last years with the help of a grant by the Music University of Freiburg / Germany, is now online, in english and in german. It is also available as a book (paperback) at Wolke Publishing House, where the "bang" book was released. At the moment, Amazon says that it's not available, which is strange because it's definitely released, but at least it can be purchased at the Publishing House itself. http://www.pd-tutorial.com http://www.wolke-verlag.de/musik_u_t/loadbang.html http://www.buecher-zur-musik.de/assets/s2dmain.html?http://www.buecher-zur-musik.de/53108697370a2cb3f/5310869bc400a7a02.html http://www.amazon.de/Loadbang-Programming-Electronic-Music-Pure/dp/3936000573/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&s=books-intl-de&qid=1235853524&sr=8-3 Cheers Johannes From jmmmpais at googlemail.com Mon Mar 16 20:32:44 2009 From: jmmmpais at googlemail.com (=?iso-8859-15?Q?Jo=E3o_Pais?=) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 19:32:44 -0000 Subject: [PD] Pd book sprint in NYC/Berlin In-Reply-To: References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <49BE13B4.4030400@mur.at> <597D53A5-9B00-40CE-8B7F-776A826E9DE2@eds.org> <200903162329.16546.dmotd@gmx.net> Message-ID: Is this a one time thing, or might happen more times? I would say that at least voice connection would be productive. I haven't that much experience with video conferencing, but a medium where people can react at the same time they can think would be important. (although after too much time, even the fingers are faster than some heads) How about voice connection for general talk + an irc chat for small, fast questions? We can also send a group foto with skype, so that everyone feels the warmth. > Marshall McLuhan would strongly disagree with you, as do I. The medium > with which you communicate has a very strong impact on the > conversation. That does not mean that it is the only influence. There > are many things that lead to a bad meeting, and from my experience of > having many meetings in person, on IRC, on IM, on phones, on voice chat, > on video chat, and many different mixes above, I am a strong believer in > high-bandwidth communication like voice. From jmmmpais at googlemail.com Mon Mar 16 20:40:30 2009 From: jmmmpais at googlemail.com (=?iso-8859-15?Q?Jo=E3o_Pais?=) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 19:40:30 -0000 Subject: [PD] Pd book sprint in NYC/Berlin In-Reply-To: <49BE951C.50806@umatic.nl> References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <49BDA282.9040607@gmail.com> <2D6F62EB-0878-4205-A5EA-AB248E81A93E@eds.org> <49BDB5A3.9090606@gmail.com> <49BE10BC.4010908@umatic.nl> <49BE13B4.4030400@mur.at> <597D53A5-9B00-40CE-8B7F-776A826E9DE2@eds.org> <49BE59D6.30109@mur.at> <49BE951C.50806@umatic.nl> Message-ID: Ah, of course, I haven't seen that for a while. Ok, after I'm back on the 25th as well, I should remain for a while there. Although there is still M?rzmusik happening at that time. > sorry not to be clearer... in between Pd workshop last week and week > long "tour" in London this week. > > Here is the existing Pd FLOSS Manual: > > http://en.flossmanuals.net/puredata > > And I will post more info about chapters which need work soon. You can > check archives of Pd list for previous discussion of Pd FLOSS in the > meantime, and make yourself a login at flossmanuals.net and have a > "behind the scenes" look beforehand, but when I'm back from London on > 25th I'll be able to explain better. Would be great to have you on board! > > best, > Derek > > Jo?o Pais wrote: >> I'll be back in Berlin on the 25th. I'm usually flexible - i.e. I must >> work, but not on a fixed schedule. >> what's actually the theme of the work to be done? I saw no link so >> far. a book on pd, what could that be? printing the tutorials and >> appending them together? >> >>>> I will be in Berlin from mar27 to mar30, and I would also like to >>>> contribute to the book sprint, but it is difficult for me during >>>> week/business hours. >>> >>> Yes, this weekend would be also nice for me ;) ! >>> >>> LG >>> Georg >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> > -- Friedenstr. 58 10249 Berlin (Deutschland) Tel +49 30 42020091 | Mob +49 162 6843570 jmmmpais at googlemail.com | skype: jmmmpjmmmp From hans at eds.org Mon Mar 16 18:57:53 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 17:57:53 +0000 Subject: [PD] Mouse Control... In-Reply-To: <31da0ae00903160553r3ed6d30dp1de22c101094a477@mail.gmail.com> References: <31da0ae00903160553r3ed6d30dp1de22c101094a477@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <095953CE-15CC-4940-B8DF-85CBF4665D7F@eds.org> Video tracking is tricky, but the basics are not too hard. In the Pd- extended Help Browser, check out these patches: manuals -> 2.Image -> 17.tracking.pd examples -> Gem -> 04.video -> 03.movement_detection.pd I am guessing the first is the one you want, its based on background subtractions, which is a widely used technique. .hc On Mar 16, 2009, at 12:53 PM, Simon Ball wrote: > Hi there > > I'm having trouble realising an idea. I've got the software running > (mac book pro) and managed to play with some of the examples, > however I am new to PD, so bare with me! > > I'm trying to generate a composition of images that float in 3D > space. I want the images or layers to move and rotate towards areas > of a screen where movement is detected. I don't need to track > specific points of motion, simply to judge where movement is taking > place. I think this will involve reading frames and analysing > changes in pixels. Does that make sense? > > I plan to use a mini DV camera to run this, on a high contrast > background, although I've seen a similar method of recording > movement with a webcam and processing, which worked pretty well. (http://vimeo.com/1948430?pg=embed&sec= > - tracks changes in pixels, although I'm not sure how). > > I assume that this will involve some sort of trigonometry to move > images towards points where motion is detected, although I'm not > sure how to apply this in PD. Also, how to I generate a floating > effect, much like 'easing' does in animation software. And can this > work with 3D, mapped images in PD? > > I hope thats clear, if a little broad, let me know you need any > further info. > > Thanks in advance for any suggestions/solutions. > > Simon > > Simon Ball > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- All mankind is of one author, and is one volume; when one man dies, one chapter is not torn out of the book, but translated into a better language; and every chapter must be so translated.... -John Donne -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jancsika at yahoo.com Mon Mar 16 20:56:02 2009 From: jancsika at yahoo.com (Jonathan Wilkes) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 12:56:02 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com In-Reply-To: <49BEA495.8060106@gmx.de> Message-ID: <591205.92197.qm@web65606.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> This looks very nice! I especially like the illustrations like the dac->speaker in 3.1.1.1.1. What version of pd is this? I don't recognize some of the object names in the list-of-all-objects jpg in chapter 2, like "active" and "allow." -Jonathan --- On Mon, 3/16/09, Johannes Kreidler wrote: > From: Johannes Kreidler > Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com > To: pd-list at iem.at > Date: Monday, March 16, 2009, 8:12 PM > hi list, > > I am pleased to announce that the big pd tutorial I wrote > in the last years with the help of a grant by the Music > University of Freiburg / Germany, is now online, in english > and in german. > > It is also available as a book (paperback) at Wolke > Publishing House, where the "bang" book was > released. > > At the moment, Amazon says that it's not available, > which is strange because it's definitely released, but > at least it can be purchased at the Publishing House itself. > > http://www.pd-tutorial.com > > http://www.wolke-verlag.de/musik_u_t/loadbang.html > > http://www.buecher-zur-musik.de/assets/s2dmain.html?http://www.buecher-zur-musik.de/53108697370a2cb3f/5310869bc400a7a02.html > > http://www.amazon.de/Loadbang-Programming-Electronic-Music-Pure/dp/3936000573/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&s=books-intl-de&qid=1235853524&sr=8-3 > > Cheers > Johannes > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From matju at artengine.ca Mon Mar 16 21:10:39 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 16:10:39 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com In-Reply-To: <49BEA495.8060106@gmx.de> References: <49BEA495.8060106@gmx.de> Message-ID: On Mon, 16 Mar 2009, Johannes Kreidler wrote: > I am pleased to announce that the big pd tutorial I wrote in the last > years with the help of a grant by the Music University of Freiburg / > Germany, is now online, in english and in german. Wow. But, are there plans for a French translation? If there were one by the time I teach the next pd workshop, then I would make it required reading... and if I end up not teaching, I'd get other teachers to make it required reading... if they wouldn't already do that. Really, I think that plenty of people in my city could enjoy that book, and would enjoy it more if it were in French. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From fbar at footils.org Mon Mar 16 21:11:19 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 21:11:19 +0100 Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com In-Reply-To: <591205.92197.qm@web65606.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> References: <49BEA495.8060106@gmx.de> <591205.92197.qm@web65606.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20090316201119.GB17433@footils.org> Hallo, Jonathan Wilkes hat gesagt: // Jonathan Wilkes wrote: > > This looks very nice! I especially like the illustrations like the dac->speaker in 3.1.1.1.1. > > What version of pd is this? I don't recognize some of the object names in the list-of-all-objects jpg in chapter 2, like "active" and "allow." [allow] is in maxlib, [active] is in cyclone. The screenshot probably shows a modified intro.txt, that doesn't separate between internals and externals (which makes patching for pd-vanilla a bit harder) Ciao -- Frank From padawan12 at obiwannabe.co.uk Mon Mar 16 22:03:12 2009 From: padawan12 at obiwannabe.co.uk (Andy Farnell) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 21:03:12 +0000 Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com In-Reply-To: <49BEA495.8060106@gmx.de> References: <49BEA495.8060106@gmx.de> Message-ID: <20090316210312.10227980.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> On Mon, 16 Mar 2009 20:12:21 +0100 Johannes Kreidler wrote: > hi list, > > I am pleased to announce that the big pd tutorial I wrote in the last > years with the help of a grant by the Music University of Freiburg / > Germany, is now online, in english and in german. Congrats on finishing it Johannes. This looks very nice. Some people ask if my book focuses on sound design, and Millers book focuses on DSP theory, why is there not a book dedicated to composition in Pd? Well now there is. (and Todd Winkler "Composing Interactive Music" but that is quite a 'conceptual' level and uses the non-free Max) > > At the moment, Amazon says that it's not available, which is strange > because it's definitely released, but at least it can be purchased at > the Publishing House itself. I had the opposite problem, Amazon were listing mine as available and taking orders AFAIK, but it isn't actually available there (because it would cost too much). With so many good things happening on the docs front nobody can say Max has better documentation any longer, Pd has a great choice covering a range of applications and abilities. -- Use the source From jkreidler at gmx.de Mon Mar 16 22:03:10 2009 From: jkreidler at gmx.de (Johannes Kreidler) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 22:03:10 +0100 Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com In-Reply-To: References: <49BEA495.8060106@gmx.de> Message-ID: <49BEBE8E.5030006@gmx.de> > On Mon, 16 Mar 2009, Johannes Kreidler wrote: > >> I am pleased to announce that the big pd tutorial I wrote in the last >> years with the help of a grant by the Music University of Freiburg / >> Germany, is now online, in english and in german. > > > Wow. But, are there plans for a French translation? If there were one by > the time I teach the next pd workshop, then I would make it required > reading... and if I end up not teaching, I'd get other teachers to make > it required reading... if they wouldn't already do that. Really, I think > that plenty of people in my city could enjoy that book, and would enjoy > it more if it were in French. No, there are no plans, but of course it would be great if anyone could do that. Joh. From marc at anorg.net Mon Mar 16 22:17:13 2009 From: marc at anorg.net (marc widmer) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 22:17:13 +0100 Subject: [PD] pidip compilation problem Message-ID: <49BEC1D9.2050707@anorg.net> hi list i have to compile pidip from source (on ubuntu studio 8.04) because i have a project where i depend on some changed files. after a year of not touching the library (never change running system) i had to move everything to another system and therefore need to recompile pidip. first i tried to use my old pidip sources, after running into troubles with (quicktime and lqt) which i could solve. compilation stopped when pdp_capture should be compiled: pdp_capture.c: In function ?XMyClientWindow?: pdp_capture.c:129: warning: implicit declaration of function ?XWindowByProperty? pdp_capture.c: In function ?XMyGetWindowImage?: pdp_capture.c:335: warning: implicit declaration of function ?XDestroyImage? pdp_capture.c:339: error: ?Visual? has no member named ?klass? pdp_capture.c:340: error: ?Visual? has no member named ?klass? pdp_capture.c:398: error: ?Visual? has no member named ?klass? pdp_capture.c:399: error: ?Visual? has no member named ?klass? pdp_capture.c:440: error: ?Visual? has no member named ?klass? pdp_capture.c:453: warning: implicit declaration of function ?XGetPixel? pdp_capture.c:455: warning: implicit declaration of function ?ScaleShortToQuantum? pdp_capture.c: In function ?pdp_capture_do_capture?: pdp_capture.c:591: error: ?XTextProperty? undeclared (first use in this function) pdp_capture.c:591: error: (Each undeclared identifier is reported only once pdp_capture.c:591: error: for each function it appears in.) pdp_capture.c:591: error: expected ?;? before ?window_name? pdp_capture.c:603: error: ?XError? undeclared (first use in this function) pdp_capture.c:684: warning: implicit declaration of function ?XGetWMName? pdp_capture.c:684: error: ?window_name? undeclared (first use in this function) pdp_capture.c: In function ?pdp_capture_sendpacket?: pdp_capture.c:819: warning: passing argument 2 of ?pdp_packet_pass_if_valid? from incompatible pointer type make[1]: *** [pdp_capture.o] Error 1 after this i tried to compile from svn, again i had to outcomment libquicktime issues (though there was already a condition included in the modules source, whicht was somehow ignored) add the end again i ended up with problems compiling pdp_capture make[1]: *** No rule to make target `@PDP_CAPTURE_OBJECT@', needed by `all_modules'. Stop. make[1]: Leaving directory `/home/metafor/Desktop/puredata-externals/externals/pidip/modules' make: *** [pdp_pidip_all] Error 2 i guess because old and new pidip are not compiling i miss something with a library (is it this libquicktiem problem?), but as configure went fine, i am not sure which one is missing/or wrong version, has anybody run into these troubles as well? what am i doing wrong? well, any help is apreciated. cheers marc From mpuckett at imusic1.ucsd.edu Mon Mar 16 23:25:35 2009 From: mpuckett at imusic1.ucsd.edu (Miller Puckette) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 15:25:35 -0700 Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com In-Reply-To: <49BEA495.8060106@gmx.de> References: <49BEA495.8060106@gmx.de> Message-ID: <20090316222535.GC28491@imusic1.ucsd.edu> Wow, that's incredibly readable and useful - bravo! Miller On Mon, Mar 16, 2009 at 08:12:21PM +0100, Johannes Kreidler wrote: > hi list, > > I am pleased to announce that the big pd tutorial I wrote in the last > years with the help of a grant by the Music University of Freiburg / > Germany, is now online, in english and in german. > > It is also available as a book (paperback) at Wolke Publishing House, > where the "bang" book was released. > > At the moment, Amazon says that it's not available, which is strange > because it's definitely released, but at least it can be purchased at > the Publishing House itself. > > http://www.pd-tutorial.com > > http://www.wolke-verlag.de/musik_u_t/loadbang.html > > http://www.buecher-zur-musik.de/assets/s2dmain.html?http://www.buecher-zur-musik.de/53108697370a2cb3f/5310869bc400a7a02.html > > http://www.amazon.de/Loadbang-Programming-Electronic-Music-Pure/dp/3936000573/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&s=books-intl-de&qid=1235853524&sr=8-3 > > Cheers > Johannes > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From marius.schebella at gmail.com Tue Mar 17 00:14:28 2009 From: marius.schebella at gmail.com (marius schebella) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 00:14:28 +0100 Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com In-Reply-To: <49BEA495.8060106@gmx.de> References: <49BEA495.8060106@gmx.de> Message-ID: <49BEDD54.8000402@gmail.com> this is awesome!! wow. thanks for this huge effort! marius. Johannes Kreidler wrote: > hi list, > > I am pleased to announce that the big pd tutorial I wrote in the last > years with the help of a grant by the Music University of Freiburg / > Germany, is now online, in english and in german. > > It is also available as a book (paperback) at Wolke Publishing House, > where the "bang" book was released. > > At the moment, Amazon says that it's not available, which is strange > because it's definitely released, but at least it can be purchased at > the Publishing House itself. > > http://www.pd-tutorial.com > > http://www.wolke-verlag.de/musik_u_t/loadbang.html > > http://www.buecher-zur-musik.de/assets/s2dmain.html?http://www.buecher-zur-musik.de/53108697370a2cb3f/5310869bc400a7a02.html > > > http://www.amazon.de/Loadbang-Programming-Electronic-Music-Pure/dp/3936000573/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&s=books-intl-de&qid=1235853524&sr=8-3 > > > Cheers > Johannes > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > From joseghast at joseghast.org Tue Mar 17 00:16:21 2009 From: joseghast at joseghast.org (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Roberto_Mallo_Garc=EDa?=) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 00:16:21 +0100 Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: El 16/03/2009, a las 20.42, pd-list-request at iem.at escribi?: > Message: 4 > Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 20:12:21 +0100 > From: Johannes Kreidler > Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com > To: pd-list at iem.at > Message-ID: <49BEA495.8060106 at gmx.de> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed > > hi list, > > I am pleased to announce that the big pd tutorial I wrote in the last > years with the help of a grant by the Music University of Freiburg / > Germany, is now online, in english and in german. Thank you very much for this material, very useful for a beginner like me!! Congratulations Johannes! Regards, Roberto -- joseghast.org taumaturgia.com From padawan12 at obiwannabe.co.uk Tue Mar 17 01:02:53 2009 From: padawan12 at obiwannabe.co.uk (Andy Farnell) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 00:02:53 +0000 Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com In-Reply-To: <49BEA495.8060106@gmx.de> References: <49BEA495.8060106@gmx.de> Message-ID: <20090317000253.6f1c3acc.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> Just finished scanning all the material, it's a goldmine of pd musical knowledge. Totally excellent!!! a. On Mon, 16 Mar 2009 20:12:21 +0100 Johannes Kreidler wrote: > hi list, > > I am pleased to announce that the big pd tutorial I wrote in the last > years with the help of a grant by the Music University of Freiburg / > Germany, is now online, in english and in german. > > It is also available as a book (paperback) at Wolke Publishing House, > where the "bang" book was released. > > At the moment, Amazon says that it's not available, which is strange > because it's definitely released, but at least it can be purchased at > the Publishing House itself. > > http://www.pd-tutorial.com > > http://www.wolke-verlag.de/musik_u_t/loadbang.html > > http://www.buecher-zur-musik.de/assets/s2dmain.html?http://www.buecher-zur-musik.de/53108697370a2cb3f/5310869bc400a7a02.html > > http://www.amazon.de/Loadbang-Programming-Electronic-Music-Pure/dp/3936000573/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&s=books-intl-de&qid=1235853524&sr=8-3 > > Cheers > Johannes > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list -- Use the source From danomatika at gmail.com Tue Mar 17 01:13:50 2009 From: danomatika at gmail.com (danomatika) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 01:13:50 +0100 Subject: [PD] Unified Library was Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! Message-ID: <1237248830.25065.7.camel@danoT500> yeah sorry frank, i should have explained more clearly. i also think that no GUI is the way to go for functional abstractions. that was the big flaw of the DIY library i did, that the function of the abstractions was tied in with the gui component. i did it that way because i didn't want to clutter the namespace with too many abstractions, and the thought of one abstraction for function, and then a different one for GUI was not appealing at the time. but now, i think that is the only way to go. like, as you said, for polyphony. and then also for the many many cases in which you'd want to build your own gui for custom control. i do think you guys have got a really really strong system there with rjlib. but i was just saying that without the gui stuff, it doesn't exactly fit into being that 'all purpose building blocks' library that we are discussing. This is where the pd-mtl convention makes so much sense ... Core functionality is made into patches with an underscore at the end of the name and the regular name is just a gui wrapper around it. I've started using the approach in the rc-patches and, as Frank said before, it makes building larger gui objects much simpler. The right inlet takes all the control whenever possible using name messages. So rc-chorus~_ is a regular object and rc-chorus~ is a gui wrapper with SSSAD. So if you want SSSAD you use the gui. --- Dan Wilcox danomatika.com robotcowboy.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dmotd at gmx.net Tue Mar 17 02:27:24 2009 From: dmotd at gmx.net (dmotd) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 11:27:24 +1000 Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com In-Reply-To: <49BEA495.8060106@gmx.de> References: <49BEA495.8060106@gmx.de> Message-ID: <200903171127.25505.dmotd@gmx.net> this looks likely to be a brilliant reference, very balanced language, not too patronising and not too convoluted. it presents a number of complex methods in a straight forward manner, but with enough depth to really build upon. many congratulations johannes and please pass on my praise to your translator mark barden, who has also done an excellent job. dmotd On Tuesday 17 March 2009 05:12:21 Johannes Kreidler wrote: > hi list, > > I am pleased to announce that the big pd tutorial I wrote in the last > years with the help of a grant by the Music University of Freiburg / > Germany, is now online, in english and in german. > > It is also available as a book (paperback) at Wolke Publishing House, > where the "bang" book was released. > > At the moment, Amazon says that it's not available, which is strange > because it's definitely released, but at least it can be purchased at > the Publishing House itself. > > http://www.pd-tutorial.com > > http://www.wolke-verlag.de/musik_u_t/loadbang.html > > http://www.buecher-zur-musik.de/assets/s2dmain.html?http://www.buecher-zur- >musik.de/53108697370a2cb3f/5310869bc400a7a02.html > > http://www.amazon.de/Loadbang-Programming-Electronic-Music-Pure/dp/39360005 >73/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&s=books-intl-de&qid=1235853524&sr=8-3 > > Cheers > Johannes > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From ydegoyon at gmail.com Tue Mar 17 03:10:00 2009 From: ydegoyon at gmail.com (ydegoyon at gmail.com) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 03:10:00 +0100 Subject: [PD] pidip compilation problem In-Reply-To: <49BEC1D9.2050707@anorg.net> References: <49BEC1D9.2050707@anorg.net> Message-ID: <49BF0678.2030101@gmail.com> ola, what was you configure command ? ./configure --help --enable-capture capture optional object ( only works with Image Magick <= 6.0.7 ) this became optional ... in a way deprecated... it would not work with most recent Image Magick.. xiaoo, sevy marc widmer wrote: > hi list > > i have to compile pidip from source (on ubuntu studio 8.04) because i > have a project where i depend on some changed files. > > after a year of not touching the library (never change running system) > i had to move everything to another system and therefore need to > recompile pidip. first i tried to use my old pidip sources, after > running into troubles with (quicktime and lqt) which i could solve. > compilation stopped when pdp_capture should be compiled: > > pdp_capture.c: In function ?XMyClientWindow?: > pdp_capture.c:129: warning: implicit declaration of function > ?XWindowByProperty? > pdp_capture.c: In function ?XMyGetWindowImage?: > pdp_capture.c:335: warning: implicit declaration of function > ?XDestroyImage? > pdp_capture.c:339: error: ?Visual? has no member named ?klass? > pdp_capture.c:340: error: ?Visual? has no member named ?klass? > pdp_capture.c:398: error: ?Visual? has no member named ?klass? > pdp_capture.c:399: error: ?Visual? has no member named ?klass? > pdp_capture.c:440: error: ?Visual? has no member named ?klass? > pdp_capture.c:453: warning: implicit declaration of function ?XGetPixel? > pdp_capture.c:455: warning: implicit declaration of function > ?ScaleShortToQuantum? > pdp_capture.c: In function ?pdp_capture_do_capture?: > pdp_capture.c:591: error: ?XTextProperty? undeclared (first use in > this function) > pdp_capture.c:591: error: (Each undeclared identifier is reported only > once > pdp_capture.c:591: error: for each function it appears in.) > pdp_capture.c:591: error: expected ?;? before ?window_name? > pdp_capture.c:603: error: ?XError? undeclared (first use in this > function) > pdp_capture.c:684: warning: implicit declaration of function ?XGetWMName? > pdp_capture.c:684: error: ?window_name? undeclared (first use in this > function) > pdp_capture.c: In function ?pdp_capture_sendpacket?: > pdp_capture.c:819: warning: passing argument 2 of > ?pdp_packet_pass_if_valid? from incompatible pointer type > make[1]: *** [pdp_capture.o] Error 1 > > after this i tried to compile from svn, again i had to outcomment > libquicktime issues (though there was already a condition included in > the modules source, whicht was somehow ignored) > > > add the end again i ended up with problems compiling pdp_capture > make[1]: *** No rule to make target `@PDP_CAPTURE_OBJECT@', needed by > `all_modules'. Stop. > make[1]: Leaving directory > `/home/metafor/Desktop/puredata-externals/externals/pidip/modules' > make: *** [pdp_pidip_all] Error 2 > > i guess because old and new pidip are not compiling i miss something > with a library (is it this libquicktiem problem?), but as configure > went fine, i am not sure which one is missing/or wrong version, has > anybody run into these troubles as well? what am i doing wrong? > > well, any help is apreciated. > > cheers > marc > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > From pdcon09 at estudiolivre.org Tue Mar 17 04:07:08 2009 From: pdcon09 at estudiolivre.org (PdCon09 3rd International Puredata Convention) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 00:07:08 -0300 Subject: [PD] [PD-announce] New Deadline 29th - 30th Message-ID: *NEW DEADLINE.* *Since we have had some problems with our server on the last day of submissions, and some are questioning and having problems sending us the forms, we are extending a bit the deadline, in two weeks.* New deadline is midnight from 29th to 30th UTC-3 Nevertheless, we are already working on the submissions we received! In order to not get behind schedule info at: http://convention.puredata.info -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ Pd-announce mailing list Pd-announce at iem.at http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-announce From porres at gmail.com Tue Mar 17 04:13:48 2009 From: porres at gmail.com (Alexandre Porres) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 00:13:48 -0300 Subject: [PD] Fwd: New Deadline 29th - 30th In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <161a0b1e0903162013p4d38c6b1x73fd65fcd4a802@mail.gmail.com> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: PdCon09 3rd International Puredata Convention < pdcon09 at estudiolivre.org> Date: Tue, Mar 17, 2009 at 12:07 AM Subject: New Deadline 29th - 30th To: pd-announce at iem.at *NEW DEADLINE.* *Since we have had some problems with our server on the last day of submissions, and some are questioning and having problems sending us the forms, we are extending a bit the deadline, in two weeks.* New deadline is midnight from 29th to 30th UTC-3 Nevertheless, we are already working on the submissions we received! In order to not get behind schedule info at: http://convention.puredata.info -- Alexandre Torres Porres cel. (11)8179-6226 Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From fbar at footils.org Tue Mar 17 07:42:37 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 07:42:37 +0100 Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com In-Reply-To: <20090316210312.10227980.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> References: <49BEA495.8060106@gmx.de> <20090316210312.10227980.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> Message-ID: <20090317064237.GA19437@footils.org> Hallo, Andy Farnell hat gesagt: // Andy Farnell wrote: > Congrats on finishing it Johannes. > This looks very nice. Some people ask if my book > focuses on sound design, and Millers book focuses on > DSP theory, why is there not a book dedicated to > composition in Pd? Well now there is. Hm, you all are so fast readers, reading a book in less than one evening. :) By quickly scanning through the book and grep'ing the patches, I wonder, why not a single patch uses the [list] object which - not only because of the [list]-abs - is one of my most often used objects especially for composition? I would expect a section on list-processing when teaching people how to compose. Anyway, I haven't read it yet, maybe these topics are presented without [list]. Ciao -- Frank From fbar at footils.org Tue Mar 17 07:47:07 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 07:47:07 +0100 Subject: [PD] Unified Library was Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <1237248830.25065.7.camel@danoT500> References: <1237248830.25065.7.camel@danoT500> Message-ID: <20090317064707.GB19437@footils.org> Hallo, danomatika hat gesagt: // danomatika wrote: > So rc-chorus~_ is a regular object and rc-chorus~ is a gui wrapper with > SSSAD. So if you want SSSAD you use the gui. I wouldn't put the sssad objects in the version with GUI. IMO It's more useful to have them in the engine objects, e.g. for polyphony. Ciao -- Frank From enrique at netpd.org Tue Mar 17 08:46:51 2009 From: enrique at netpd.org (Enrique Erne) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 08:46:51 +0100 Subject: [PD] Unified Library was Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <20090317064707.GB19437@footils.org> References: <1237248830.25065.7.camel@danoT500> <20090317064707.GB19437@footils.org> Message-ID: <49BF556B.1080404@netpd.org> Frank Barknecht wrote: > Hallo, > danomatika hat gesagt: // danomatika wrote: > >> So rc-chorus~_ is a regular object and rc-chorus~ is a gui wrapper with >> SSSAD. So if you want SSSAD you use the gui. > > I wouldn't put the sssad objects in the version with GUI. IMO It's more useful > to have them in the engine objects, e.g. for polyphony. could you explain the polyphony example? doesn't each voice have the same parameter, coming from the gui? in my experience it's best to save the state right at the interface, i don't see the point of saving state deep in the core. From enrique at netpd.org Tue Mar 17 09:14:44 2009 From: enrique at netpd.org (Enrique Erne) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 09:14:44 +0100 Subject: [PD] Unified Library was Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <20090316083059.GC15510@footils.org> References: <614691.50386.qm@web26304.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> <161320dd0903152002v4ad053f1r56f5b8edd369fcca@mail.gmail.com> <20090316083059.GC15510@footils.org> Message-ID: <49BF5BF4.7060805@netpd.org> i had a look at rjlib. it's a beautiful collection. i love the fact that it is not too big and not using any external. though why is there a u_sssad.pd it seems the same as the original sssad.pd frank didn't you say once you would prefer that people don't include their own copy of sssad? same with the new-fast list-drip in u_listdrip.. is it just for naming-convention that you renamed the abstraction? the whole e_ and s_ part is fantastic there are some really powerful effects and filters in there. i looked more carefully and the only phone related one is m_touch2grid which could be useful without a phone too. is this the correct url? http://svn.rjdj.me/scenes/trunk/rjlib/rj hm... now i've seen http://svn.rjdj.me/scenes/trunk/rjlib/ this is ofcorse phone specific and what confuses me now is that there is a copy of sssad.pd anyway rjlib/rj is just beautiful. what license is it released under? i couldn't find anything about that in the wiki. eni Frank Barknecht wrote: > Hallo, > hard off hat gesagt: // hard off wrote: > >> yeah sorry frank, i should have explained more clearly. >> >> i also think that no GUI is the way to go for functional abstractions. that >> was the big flaw of the DIY library i did, that the function of the >> abstractions was tied in with the gui component. i did it that way because >> i didn't want to clutter the namespace with too many abstractions, and the >> thought of one abstraction for function, and then a different one for GUI >> was not appealing at the time. >> >> but now, i think that is the only way to go. like, as you said, for >> polyphony. and then also for the many many cases in which you'd want to >> build your own gui for custom control. > > Yeah, basically that was all I wanted to say as well. ;) > >> i do think you guys have got a really really strong system there with >> rjlib. but i was just saying that without the gui stuff, it doesn't exactly >> fit into being that 'all purpose building blocks' library that we are >> discussing. > > Yes, that's true. rjlib has its focus on audio and control abstractions to be > used on mobile devices with vanilla Pd. Some of this fits into a "all purpose" > library, but a lot of it doesn't. > > Ciao From koray.tahiroglu at tkk.fi Tue Mar 17 08:59:37 2009 From: koray.tahiroglu at tkk.fi (Koray Tahiroglu) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 09:59:37 +0200 Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com In-Reply-To: <10947_1237232807_ZZ0KGM008WN6XTG7.00_mailman.17.1237232552.26945.pd-list@iem.at> References: <10947_1237232807_ZZ0KGM008WN6XTG7.00_mailman.17.1237232552.26945.pd-list@iem.at> Message-ID: Congratulations Johannes, This book will definitely be a bonus teaching material together with Miller's book for the computer generated music course that I am planning to teach next autumn. I had already involved Andy's book for the Sound design ( + a bit physics of sound ) course. Now lets hope that they will add these courses in the next curriculum :) and I guess there is one book we are still seeking at the moment that focuses Physical Interaction Design, the same way as Johannes' book. Earlier together with Hans we developed PID course materials, and his latest work embedding firmata in arduino library hopefully will bring up more Pd examples, and maybe later we will have another book. What do you think about this Hans? That would be great :) Koray On Mar 16, 2009, at 9:42 PM, pd-list-request at iem.at wrote: > Message: 4 > Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 20:12:21 +0100 > From: Johannes Kreidler > Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com > To: pd-list at iem.at > Message-ID: <49BEA495.8060106 at gmx.de> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed > > hi list, > > I am pleased to announce that the big pd tutorial I wrote in the last > years with the help of a grant by the Music University of Freiburg / > Germany, is now online, in english and in german. > > It is also available as a book (paperback) at Wolke Publishing House, > where the "bang" book was released. > > At the moment, Amazon says that it's not available, which is strange > because it's definitely released, but at least it can be purchased at > the Publishing House itself. > > http://www.pd-tutorial.com > > http://www.wolke-verlag.de/musik_u_t/loadbang.html > > http://www.buecher-zur-musik.de/assets/s2dmain.html?http://www.buecher-zur-musik.de/53108697370a2cb3f/5310869bc400a7a02.html > > http://www.amazon.de/Loadbang-Programming-Electronic-Music-Pure/dp/3936000573/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&s=books-intl-de&qid=1235853524&sr=8-3 > > Cheers > Johannes ------------------------------------- M.Koray Tahiroglu Acoustics Lab / TKK http://mlab.taik.fi/~korayt http://www.acoustics.hut.fi/~ktahirog/ tel: +358 45 233 6272 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From lukexipd at gmail.com Tue Mar 17 09:49:11 2009 From: lukexipd at gmail.com (Luke Iannini) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 03:49:11 -0500 Subject: [PD] Unified Library was Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <49BF5BF4.7060805@netpd.org> References: <614691.50386.qm@web26304.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> <161320dd0903152002v4ad053f1r56f5b8edd369fcca@mail.gmail.com> <20090316083059.GC15510@footils.org> <49BF5BF4.7060805@netpd.org> Message-ID: <7aaf8bb90903170149pbbad8dev531903ffa934aaa9@mail.gmail.com> Yo! Sorry I have been absent, I've been at SXSW : ). You asked about the style guide in the other thread: Amusingly I ground to a halt on it when I tried to figure out the different word-separators for hierarchies, spaces and OSC addresses : ). But! I've finally somehow spontaneously decided the most "Pd-like" specification is: "-" for hierarchies, as Miller and Frank and many others seem to do (e.g. $0-foobar-baz, and as part of pd itself: [s pd-mysubpatch]) "_" as "space", e.g. [receive a_certain_frob] AFAICT this is pretty much what rjlib has settled on as well? (perhaps less deliberately) SO! If you love consistency and interoperability, please now begin using this : ). (I myself am now condemned to obsessively change hundreds of my patches, since I had personally settled on an inconsistent mess of "." and "/" for hierarchies and "-" for space :&.) And, if anyone else cared about programmatically reconciling such names with OSC addresses, it's easy enough to just dynamically replace "-" with "/" where appropriate (using zexy or any2string or whatever). I've resurrected the Style Guide here with this mandate ;) and will continue folding things into it from the previous discussions as well as those about to occur... http://puredata.info/docs/style-guide/StyleGuideDraft2 I'm very much in agreement with everything else being said about separation of gui and logic... Best Luke On Tue, Mar 17, 2009 at 3:14 AM, Enrique Erne wrote: > i had a look at rjlib. it's a beautiful collection. i love the fact that it > is not too big and not using any external. > > though why is there a u_sssad.pd it seems the same as the original sssad.pd > frank didn't you say once you would prefer that people don't include their > own copy of sssad? > > same with the new-fast list-drip in u_listdrip.. is it just for > naming-convention that you renamed the abstraction? > > the whole e_ and s_ part is fantastic there are some really powerful effects > and filters in there. i looked more carefully and the only phone related one > is m_touch2grid which could be useful without a phone too. > > is this the correct url? > http://svn.rjdj.me/scenes/trunk/rjlib/rj > > hm... now i've seen > http://svn.rjdj.me/scenes/trunk/rjlib/ > > this is ofcorse phone specific and what confuses me now is that there is a > copy of sssad.pd > > anyway rjlib/rj is just beautiful. what license is it released under? > i couldn't find anything about that in the wiki. > > eni > > > > > > Frank Barknecht wrote: >> >> Hallo, >> hard off hat gesagt: // hard off wrote: >> >>> yeah sorry frank, i should have explained more clearly. >>> >>> i also think that no GUI is the way to go for functional abstractions. >>> ?that >>> was the big flaw of the DIY library i did, that the function of the >>> abstractions was tied in with the gui component. ?i did it that way >>> because >>> i didn't want to clutter the namespace with too many abstractions, and >>> the >>> thought of one abstraction for function, and then a different one for GUI >>> was not appealing at the time. >>> >>> but now, i think that is the only way to go. ?like, as you said, for >>> polyphony. ?and then also for the many many cases in which you'd want to >>> build your own gui for custom control. >> >> Yeah, basically that was all I wanted to say as well. ;) >> >>> >>> i do think you guys have got a really really strong system there with >>> rjlib. ?but i was just saying that without the gui stuff, it doesn't >>> exactly >>> fit into being that 'all purpose building blocks' library that we are >>> discussing. >> >> Yes, that's true. rjlib has its focus on audio and control abstractions to >> be >> used on mobile devices with vanilla Pd. Some of this fits into a "all >> purpose" >> library, but a lot of it doesn't. >> Ciao > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > From fbar at footils.org Tue Mar 17 10:16:53 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 10:16:53 +0100 Subject: [PD] Unified Library was Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <49BF5BF4.7060805@netpd.org> References: <614691.50386.qm@web26304.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> <161320dd0903152002v4ad053f1r56f5b8edd369fcca@mail.gmail.com> <20090316083059.GC15510@footils.org> <49BF5BF4.7060805@netpd.org> Message-ID: <20090317091653.GA19857@footils.org> Hallo, Enrique Erne hat gesagt: // Enrique Erne wrote: > i had a look at rjlib. it's a beautiful collection. i love the fact that > it is not too big and not using any external. > > though why is there a u_sssad.pd it seems the same as the original > sssad.pd frank didn't you say once you would prefer that people don't > include their own copy of sssad? No, I'm fine with that - actually it's encouraged. sssad.pd is just a single file. But people should keep theire copy up to date. ;) What I don't like is if people use [sssad/sssad] and expect it to work on everyone's system automatically. > same with the new-fast list-drip in u_listdrip.. is it just for > naming-convention that you renamed the abstraction? Yes, it's just for the naming convention we use. While I don't want to duplicate other libraries, I also wanted to include a minimal set of useful list-handling-objects. IMO list-drip, list-map/reduce/filter, a list serializer and an index lookup are the core objects for list-operations in addition to the builtins. > the whole e_ and s_ part is fantastic there are some really powerful > effects and filters in there. i looked more carefully and the only phone > related one is m_touch2grid which could be useful without a phone too. > > is this the correct url? > http://svn.rjdj.me/scenes/trunk/rjlib/rj > > hm... now i've seen > http://svn.rjdj.me/scenes/trunk/rjlib/ > > this is ofcorse phone specific and what confuses me now is that there is > a copy of sssad.pd We include sssad as u_sssad because it's central to the saving system (as are the u_loader and u_dispatch objects) so including it lets people use it without having to fetch it from somewhere else first. Rjlib is pretty much self-contained. > anyway rjlib/rj is just beautiful. what license is it released under? > i couldn't find anything about that in the wiki. Ah, tagging all objects with licenses - that's something on my big TODO list. :( rjlib is planned to be GPL v3 with some patches, like those that have been taken from the docs, under BSD. sssad or the list-stuff for example is still BSD. Ciao -- Frank From padawan12 at obiwannabe.co.uk Tue Mar 17 11:14:48 2009 From: padawan12 at obiwannabe.co.uk (Andy Farnell) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 10:14:48 +0000 Subject: [PD] Unified Library was Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <7aaf8bb90903170149pbbad8dev531903ffa934aaa9@mail.gmail.com> References: <614691.50386.qm@web26304.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> <161320dd0903152002v4ad053f1r56f5b8edd369fcca@mail.gmail.com> <20090316083059.GC15510@footils.org> <49BF5BF4.7060805@netpd.org> <7aaf8bb90903170149pbbad8dev531903ffa934aaa9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090317101448.28bc3110.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> On Tue, 17 Mar 2009 03:49:11 -0500 Luke Iannini wrote: > "-" for hierarchies, as Miller and Frank and many others seem to do > (e.g. $0-foobar-baz, and as part of pd itself: [s pd-mysubpatch]) > "_" as "space", e.g. [receive a_certain_frob] How do "we" feel about the use of actual whitespace, particularly in inlet and outlet boxes. I generally use - and _ as hierarchy and spacing delimiters as per convention, but when it comes to inlets and outlets I often say [outlet patch params] or something, thinking everything but 'patch' will be ignored. Anyone else suspect this is storing up trouble for the future? a. -- Use the source From fbar at footils.org Tue Mar 17 11:34:05 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 11:34:05 +0100 Subject: [PD] Unified Library was Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <20090317101448.28bc3110.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> References: <614691.50386.qm@web26304.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> <161320dd0903152002v4ad053f1r56f5b8edd369fcca@mail.gmail.com> <20090316083059.GC15510@footils.org> <49BF5BF4.7060805@netpd.org> <7aaf8bb90903170149pbbad8dev531903ffa934aaa9@mail.gmail.com> <20090317101448.28bc3110.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> Message-ID: <20090317103405.GA20055@footils.org> Hallo, Andy Farnell hat gesagt: // Andy Farnell wrote: > How do "we" feel about the use of actual whitespace, particularly > in inlet and outlet boxes. I generally use - and _ as hierarchy > and spacing delimiters as per convention, but when it comes to inlets > and outlets I often say [outlet patch params] or something, thinking > everything but 'patch' will be ignored. > > Anyone else suspect this is storing up trouble for the future? With xlets, there still is the undecided question if the first argument should serve a different purpose than tooltips. It could be used to specify the order explicitly or to do reblocking etc. So even the use of inlet arguments to specify tooltips is unofficial. It's probably to late already, but grabbing more arguments is a bit dangerous IMO (I don't even use the first arg so far, but I'm always a bit extracautious). Ciao -- Frank From marc at anorg.net Tue Mar 17 12:21:01 2009 From: marc at anorg.net (marc widmer) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 12:21:01 +0100 Subject: [PD] pidip compilation problem In-Reply-To: <49BF0678.2030101@gmail.com> References: <49BEC1D9.2050707@anorg.net> <49BF0678.2030101@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49BF879D.7040905@anorg.net> hi my configure command looks like this: ./configure --with-pd=/usr/lib/pd --with-pdp=/home/metafor/Desktop/puredata-externals/externals/pdp/ --with-ffmpeg=/home/metafor/Desktop/puredata-externals/ffmpeg/ i added this option --disable-capture but with no success, old pidip fails at the same point. (actually the disable option is not available in this version) my image-magick version is obviously later: imagemagick_6.3.7.9.dfsg1-2ubuntu1_i386.deb i checked, the new pidip from svn has --disable-option with autoconf i genereated a new configure and after this i could compile further but, now im stucked with pdp_live~ i have installed latest ffmpeg from source, but now i am stucked with this (see below) it does not mention anything missing, so i do not know where to search. btw. can i easily port my changed pdp_ctrack (v 0.1) to the newest pidip install (haven't done it yet)? i guess my pidip at the time was .18 or .19, in .23 pdp_ctrack still has version number 0.1 which makes me confident. if you could help me out, i would be reallly happy. pdp_live~.c: In function ?pdp_live_decode_packet?: pdp_live~.c:268: warning: comparison between signed and unsigned pdp_live~.c:282: error: request for member ?codec_type? in something not a structure or union pdp_live~.c:294: warning: implicit declaration of function ?avcodec_decode_audio? pdp_live~.c:342: error: request for member ?channels? in something not a structure or union pdp_live~.c:343: error: request for member ?sample_rate? in something not a structure or union pdp_live~.c:346: warning: ?audio_resample_init? is deprecated (declared at /usr/local/include/libavcodec/avcodec.h:2573) pdp_live~.c:347: error: request for member ?channels? in something not a structure or union pdp_live~.c:349: error: request for member ?sample_rate? in something not a structure or union pdp_live~.c:354: error: request for member ?channels? in something not a structure or union pdp_live~.c:400: error: request for member ?width? in something not a structure or union pdp_live~.c:401: error: request for member ?height? in something not a structure or union pdp_live~.c:403: error: request for member ?frame_rate? in something not a structure or union pdp_live~.c:410: warning: passing argument 1 of ?avcodec_decode_video? from incompatible pointer type pdp_live~.c:411: error: request for member ?pix_fmt? in something not a structure or union pdp_live~.c:414: error: request for member ?pix_fmt? in something not a structure or union pdp_live~.c:445: error: request for member ?width? in something not a structure or union pdp_live~.c:446: error: request for member ?height? in something not a structure or union pdp_live~.c: In function ?pdp_live_connect_to_url?: pdp_live~.c:590: error: ?AVFormatParameters? has no member named ?image_format? pdp_live~.c:623: warning: comparison between signed and unsigned pdp_live~.c:652: error: request for member ?codec_type? in something not a structure or union pdp_live~.c:656: error: request for member ?codec_type? in something not a structure or union pdp_live~.c:659: error: request for member ?codec_id? in something not a structure or union pdp_live~.c:659: error: request for member ?bit_rate? in something not a structure or union pdp_live~.c:661: error: request for member ?sample_rate? in something not a structure or union pdp_live~.c:661: error: request for member ?channels? in something not a structure or union pdp_live~.c:664: error: request for member ?codec_type? in something not a structure or union pdp_live~.c:667: error: request for member ?codec_id? in something not a structure or union pdp_live~.c:668: error: request for member ?bit_rate? in something not a structure or union pdp_live~.c:670: error: request for member ?frame_rate? in something not a structure or union pdp_live~.c:671: error: request for member ?width? in something not a structure or union pdp_live~.c:672: error: request for member ?height? in something not a structure or union pdp_live~.c:679: warning: comparison between signed and unsigned pdp_live~.c:686: error: request for member ?codec_id? in something not a structure or union pdp_live~.c:700: warning: passing argument 1 of ?avcodec_open? from incompatible pointer type pdp_live~.c: In function ?pdp_live_disconnect?: pdp_live~.c:778: warning: comparison between signed and unsigned pdp_live~.c:783: warning: passing argument 1 of ?avcodec_close? from incompatible pointer type pdp_live~.c: In function ?pdp_live_free?: pdp_live~.c:980: warning: implicit declaration of function ?av_free_static? make[1]: *** [pdp_live~.o] Error 1 make[1]: Leaving directory `/home/metafor/Desktop/puredata-externals/externals/pidip/modules' make: *** [pdp_pidip_all] Error 2 cheers marc ydegoyon at gmail.com wrote: > ola, > > what was you configure command ? > > ./configure --help > --enable-capture capture optional object ( only works with > Image Magick <= 6.0.7 ) > > this became optional ... > in a way deprecated... > it would not work with most recent Image Magick.. > > xiaoo, > sevy > > > marc widmer wrote: >> hi list >> >> i have to compile pidip from source (on ubuntu studio 8.04) because i >> have a project where i depend on some changed files. >> >> after a year of not touching the library (never change running >> system) i had to move everything to another system and therefore need >> to recompile pidip. first i tried to use my old pidip sources, after >> running into troubles with (quicktime and lqt) which i could solve. >> compilation stopped when pdp_capture should be compiled: >> >> pdp_capture.c: In function ?XMyClientWindow?: >> pdp_capture.c:129: warning: implicit declaration of function >> ?XWindowByProperty? >> pdp_capture.c: In function ?XMyGetWindowImage?: >> pdp_capture.c:335: warning: implicit declaration of function >> ?XDestroyImage? >> pdp_capture.c:339: error: ?Visual? has no member named ?klass? >> pdp_capture.c:340: error: ?Visual? has no member named ?klass? >> pdp_capture.c:398: error: ?Visual? has no member named ?klass? >> pdp_capture.c:399: error: ?Visual? has no member named ?klass? >> pdp_capture.c:440: error: ?Visual? has no member named ?klass? >> pdp_capture.c:453: warning: implicit declaration of function ?XGetPixel? >> pdp_capture.c:455: warning: implicit declaration of function >> ?ScaleShortToQuantum? >> pdp_capture.c: In function ?pdp_capture_do_capture?: >> pdp_capture.c:591: error: ?XTextProperty? undeclared (first use in >> this function) >> pdp_capture.c:591: error: (Each undeclared identifier is reported >> only once >> pdp_capture.c:591: error: for each function it appears in.) >> pdp_capture.c:591: error: expected ?;? before ?window_name? >> pdp_capture.c:603: error: ?XError? undeclared (first use in this >> function) >> pdp_capture.c:684: warning: implicit declaration of function >> ?XGetWMName? >> pdp_capture.c:684: error: ?window_name? undeclared (first use in this >> function) >> pdp_capture.c: In function ?pdp_capture_sendpacket?: >> pdp_capture.c:819: warning: passing argument 2 of >> ?pdp_packet_pass_if_valid? from incompatible pointer type >> make[1]: *** [pdp_capture.o] Error 1 >> >> after this i tried to compile from svn, again i had to outcomment >> libquicktime issues (though there was already a condition included in >> the modules source, whicht was somehow ignored) >> >> >> add the end again i ended up with problems compiling pdp_capture >> make[1]: *** No rule to make target `@PDP_CAPTURE_OBJECT@', needed by >> `all_modules'. Stop. >> make[1]: Leaving directory >> `/home/metafor/Desktop/puredata-externals/externals/pidip/modules' >> make: *** [pdp_pidip_all] Error 2 >> >> i guess because old and new pidip are not compiling i miss something >> with a library (is it this libquicktiem problem?), but as configure >> went fine, i am not sure which one is missing/or wrong version, has >> anybody run into these troubles as well? what am i doing wrong? >> >> well, any help is apreciated. >> >> cheers >> marc >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> > From hans at eds.org Tue Mar 17 12:41:46 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 11:41:46 +0000 Subject: [PD] Pd book sprint in NYC/Berlin In-Reply-To: References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <49BE13B4.4030400@mur.at> <597D53A5-9B00-40CE-8B7F-776A826E9DE2@eds.org> <200903162329.16546.dmotd@gmx.net> Message-ID: <81FC897D-7E39-4613-B82A-B571925E3AAF@eds.org> Yeah, in case I came across too strong, I think that IRC is very useful, and voice chat is too. We can have both running for this meeting, and people can choose where they participate. IRC is great for async communications, like asking specific questions. But I find it takes 10-20x longer to work through difficult issues thru text-only media like IRC, IM, email, etc. as compared to a voice conversation. .hc On Mar 16, 2009, at 7:32 PM, Jo?o Pais wrote: > Is this a one time thing, or might happen more times? I would say > that at least voice connection would be productive. I haven't that > much experience with video conferencing, but a medium where people > can react at the same time they can think would be important. > (although after too much time, even the fingers are faster than some > heads) > > How about voice connection for general talk + an irc chat for small, > fast questions? We can also send a group foto with skype, so that > everyone feels the warmth. > > >> Marshall McLuhan would strongly disagree with you, as do I. The >> medium with which you communicate has a very strong impact on the >> conversation. That does not mean that it is the only influence. >> There are many things that lead to a bad meeting, and from my >> experience of having many meetings in person, on IRC, on IM, on >> phones, on voice chat, on video chat, and many different mixes >> above, I am a strong believer in high-bandwidth communication like >> voice. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Mistrust authority - promote decentralization. - the hacker ethic From hans at eds.org Tue Mar 17 12:57:27 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 11:57:27 +0000 Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com In-Reply-To: References: <10947_1237232807_ZZ0KGM008WN6XTG7.00_mailman.17.1237232552.26945.pd-list@iem.at> Message-ID: <9F9592A8-8120-4E13-BDDE-037F9C421EFC@eds.org> Looks good, a nice surprise, I didn't even realize you were writing it. I added this to my class syllabus site, I'll let you know what the students say. Koray, a PID would be a fun book to write, I am up for it! First lets get the FLOSS manuals Pure Data book out there. .hc On Mar 17, 2009, at 7:59 AM, Koray Tahiroglu wrote: > > Congratulations Johannes, > > This book will definitely be a bonus teaching material together with > Miller's book for the computer generated music course that I am > planning to teach next autumn. I had already involved Andy's book > for the Sound design ( + a bit physics of sound ) course. Now lets > hope that they will add these courses in the next curriculum :) and > I guess there is one book we are still seeking at the moment that > focuses Physical Interaction Design, the same way as Johannes' book. > Earlier together with Hans we developed PID course materials, and > his latest work embedding firmata in arduino library hopefully will > bring up more Pd examples, and maybe later we will have another > book. What do you think about this Hans? That would be great :) > > > Koray > > > > On Mar 16, 2009, at 9:42 PM, pd-list-request at iem.at wrote: > >> Message: 4 >> Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 20:12:21 +0100 >> From: Johannes Kreidler >> Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com >> To: pd-list at iem.at >> Message-ID: <49BEA495.8060106 at gmx.de> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed >> >> hi list, >> >> I am pleased to announce that the big pd tutorial I wrote in the last >> years with the help of a grant by the Music University of Freiburg / >> Germany, is now online, in english and in german. >> >> It is also available as a book (paperback) at Wolke Publishing House, >> where the "bang" book was released. >> >> At the moment, Amazon says that it's not available, which is strange >> because it's definitely released, but at least it can be purchased at >> the Publishing House itself. >> >> http://www.pd-tutorial.com >> >> http://www.wolke-verlag.de/musik_u_t/loadbang.html >> >> http://www.buecher-zur-musik.de/assets/s2dmain.html?http://www.buecher-zur-musik.de/53108697370a2cb3f/5310869bc400a7a02.html >> >> http://www.amazon.de/Loadbang-Programming-Electronic-Music-Pure/dp/3936000573/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&s=books-intl-de&qid=1235853524&sr=8-3 >> >> Cheers >> Johannes > > > > ------------------------------------- > M.Koray Tahiroglu > Acoustics Lab / TKK > http://mlab.taik.fi/~korayt > http://www.acoustics.hut.fi/~ktahirog/ > tel: +358 45 233 6272 > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- All mankind is of one author, and is one volume; when one man dies, one chapter is not torn out of the book, but translated into a better language; and every chapter must be so translated.... -John Donne -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From zmoelnig at iem.at Tue Mar 17 13:00:32 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 13:00:32 +0100 Subject: [PD] pidip compilation problem In-Reply-To: <49BF879D.7040905@anorg.net> References: <49BEC1D9.2050707@anorg.net> <49BF0678.2030101@gmail.com> <49BF879D.7040905@anorg.net> Message-ID: <49BF90E0.5050404@iem.at> marc widmer wrote: > hi > > my configure command looks like this: > > ./configure --with-pd=/usr/lib/pd > --with-pdp=/home/metafor/Desktop/puredata-externals/externals/pdp/ > --with-ffmpeg=/home/metafor/Desktop/puredata-externals/ffmpeg/ > two suggestions: - have you configured and built pdp? - is the ffmpeg you installed of the "correct" version? (i think the correct version is mentioned somewhere pidip's readme) mfgasr IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From marc at anorg.net Tue Mar 17 14:07:12 2009 From: marc at anorg.net (marc widmer) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 14:07:12 +0100 Subject: [PD] pidip compilation problem In-Reply-To: <49BF90E0.5050404@iem.at> References: <49BEC1D9.2050707@anorg.net> <49BF0678.2030101@gmail.com> <49BF879D.7040905@anorg.net> <49BF90E0.5050404@iem.at> Message-ID: <49BFA080.9060807@anorg.net> hi IOhannes thanks for your inputs... yes, pdp is installed an running (PDP: pure data packet version 0.12.5-darcs) ffmpeg is from cvs, but not from sourceforge, apparently ffmpeg moved to ffmpeg.org i downloaded it via svn from here: svn checkout svn://svn.ffmpeg.org/ffmpeg/trunk ffmpeg compilation went fine. but beside the note that you should compile ffmpeg from cvs, which is not available anymore (guess svn should be the right replacement), there is no special version mentioned. if you have any other suggestions, i would be really happy, as for now, i do not really know where's the problem. best marc IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: > marc widmer wrote: >> hi >> >> my configure command looks like this: >> >> ./configure --with-pd=/usr/lib/pd >> --with-pdp=/home/metafor/Desktop/puredata-externals/externals/pdp/ >> --with-ffmpeg=/home/metafor/Desktop/puredata-externals/ffmpeg/ >> > > two suggestions: > - have you configured and built pdp? > - is the ffmpeg you installed of the "correct" version? (i think the > correct version is mentioned somewhere pidip's readme) > > > mfgasr > IOhannes From errordeveloper at gmail.com Tue Mar 17 14:10:01 2009 From: errordeveloper at gmail.com (errordeveloper at gmail.com) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 13:10:01 +0000 Subject: [PD] GEM on Linux netbook In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20090317131001.GB7255@00110101.errordevlopment.0> On Mon, Mar 16, 2009 at 09:18:54AM -0500, Ben Baker-Smith wrote: > The point of looking into the netbook was as an affordable piece of hardware > that wouldn't cost me as much to replace if it got busted up / stolen at a > show. If I was looking to find the optimal system I would, of course, be > looking elsewhere. ah ..well but may be you could apply other techniques of theft prevention - like make it look on so shiny - i mean put stickers all over the place .. > > You don't think GEM will run on a netbook? Even if it's got an independent > graphics card (of course, that kinda squashes the "cheap" factor) ? > Also, do you have any experience using GEM or are you just hating? > Sorry, have to ask. Since you didn't actually offer any advice in your > response I just don't know. > > -Ben no, i'm really quite an audio person, but i know how much the graphics take. there such accelerated video cards that you can plug exteranly - those machines (like accer one or eeepc) don't have anything apart from usb (!) my friend got a decent laptop for graphics (live vj'ing he does) and that costed hi over a thousand quid (may be even 1500something). the brand is ROCK (they are no so famoust but apparently very good) that has got like 1024meg of video ram ;) you probaly don't need to get something like that unless you really can aford it ;) may be you could instead get a cheapish pc (like mini- or pico- ATX) and install good pic-express graphics card in that .. also you can make a case like these ones - http://audiopint.org/ that would prevent it from being stolen (presuming that the duedes are particularly after lappies and such stuff that looks good for a quick dodgy sale). yeah.. cause if you consider any other laptop capable for that graphics stuff, you'd have to go for a big fancy machine (like a one which would suite a gamer), and that is obviously the winner from the point of view of the thiefs! also keep in mind that good graphics need more power and better cooling :) this looks quite good - http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/NS4076168220.html i do look at small boards lately, but the market is too rapid and i'm not buying one now.. i plan to make some machines like the audiopint dude did ;) cheers, hope this helps, -- ilya d. From zmoelnig at iem.at Tue Mar 17 14:26:51 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 14:26:51 +0100 Subject: [PD] pidip compilation problem In-Reply-To: <49BFA080.9060807@anorg.net> References: <49BEC1D9.2050707@anorg.net> <49BF0678.2030101@gmail.com> <49BF879D.7040905@anorg.net> <49BF90E0.5050404@iem.at> <49BFA080.9060807@anorg.net> Message-ID: <49BFA51B.8000402@iem.at> marc widmer wrote: > hi IOhannes > > thanks for your inputs... > > yes, pdp is installed an running (PDP: pure data packet version > 0.12.5-darcs) > ffmpeg is from cvs, but not from sourceforge, apparently ffmpeg moved to > ffmpeg.org > > i downloaded it via svn from here: > > svn checkout svn://svn.ffmpeg.org/ffmpeg/trunk ffmpeg this most likely won't work. ffmpeg is changing rapidly (usually more rapidly than the application that rely on it) - so you will have to get a version that is known to work with PiDiP. in the notes it mentions ffmpeg >= 0.4.9, so you should probably get 0.4.9, and not the head of ffmpeg's repository. until you get it, i suggest trying to compile pidip without ffmpeg support. fgmasdr IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From marc at anorg.net Tue Mar 17 15:00:15 2009 From: marc at anorg.net (marc widmer) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 15:00:15 +0100 Subject: [PD] pidip compilation problem In-Reply-To: <49BFA51B.8000402@iem.at> References: <49BEC1D9.2050707@anorg.net> <49BF0678.2030101@gmail.com> <49BF879D.7040905@anorg.net> <49BF90E0.5050404@iem.at> <49BFA080.9060807@anorg.net> <49BFA51B.8000402@iem.at> Message-ID: <49BFACEF.4070503@anorg.net> hi IOhannes you are right, it compiles without ffmpeg. i moved my changed c_track object to the new pidip sources and it seems to work, i have to check it intensively in the next days. the old pidip will not compile, guess it's what yves mentioned, my imagamagick version is too new. so if my project is not running with the new pidip i guess i have to downgrade imagemagick (cross my fingers for no dependency problems here :) but i hope i do not have to do that. thanks a lot. atb marc IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: > marc widmer wrote: >> hi IOhannes >> >> thanks for your inputs... >> >> yes, pdp is installed an running (PDP: pure data packet version >> 0.12.5-darcs) >> ffmpeg is from cvs, but not from sourceforge, apparently ffmpeg moved >> to ffmpeg.org >> >> i downloaded it via svn from here: >> >> svn checkout svn://svn.ffmpeg.org/ffmpeg/trunk ffmpeg > > > this most likely won't work. > ffmpeg is changing rapidly (usually more rapidly than the application > that rely on it) - so you will have to get a version that is known to > work with PiDiP. > in the notes it mentions ffmpeg >= 0.4.9, so you should probably get > 0.4.9, and not the head of ffmpeg's repository. > > until you get it, i suggest trying to compile pidip without ffmpeg > support. > > fgmasdr > IOhannes From geoffspuredata at googlemail.com Tue Mar 17 15:28:28 2009 From: geoffspuredata at googlemail.com (Geoff) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 14:28:28 +0000 Subject: [PD] Writing you own externals in PD How to? In-Reply-To: <81FC897D-7E39-4613-B82A-B571925E3AAF@eds.org> References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <49BE13B4.4030400@mur.at> <597D53A5-9B00-40CE-8B7F-776A826E9DE2@eds.org> <200903162329.16546.dmotd@gmx.net> <81FC897D-7E39-4613-B82A-B571925E3AAF@eds.org> Message-ID: <4FC77744-D534-49FF-945E-0914D4AABC4D@gmail.com> Hi This is quite along post but I thought the background was needed for it to make sense. Background I have previous programming experience however I have been using Pure Data for several months now and am enjoying learning it. I am trying to learn DSP for myself purely out of personal interest for the subject. I bought a book on DSP and became hooked after reading it. :) From that point I have relearnt all the A-level maths I studied over 10 years ago and a few bits of physics, I have gone the the whole of Millers book on Pure Data and whilst I would be lying if I said the whole thing made sense I can certainly understand and implement alot of it. I then moved on to Julius Smiths books on digital filters and physical modelling which is where I am at the moment. And I am making slow progress there as there is alot to assimilate in that I need to not only be able to understand the topic related to Physics, Maths etc. but then know how to use Matlab and C++ and Faust which is all quite a mountain. Long Term Aim What I want to do eventually when things make more sense is to work with creating my own physical models which if I am to do it in pure data would surely need me to create externals to run the filtering all inside one object. System Mac OS 10.4.11 Macbook, Pure Data, Octave, Max/Msp, Xcode, Downloaded and installed Faust but not sure how to invoke it :( Mission What I would like to be able to do is to take the examples I am reading about in Julius Smiths books and create them as externals within Pure Data so I can use them, Play with them :) I.e. the book that I am working through 'Introduction to digital filters' contains lots of example Matlab and C code for different filters and also mentions Faust, then there is also flext to consider. http://puredata.info/Members/thomas/flext-intro.pdf Q) I want to create my own Pure data objects specifically filters starting with the examples in Julius Smiths book. What would be the most straight forward path to take to begin with given my System, lack of experience, aims ???? what I would like is the easiest route to begin with :) I.e. seem to have all these programs Octave (matlab), Faust, Xcode ,Flext, Terminal etc. which would be the best path to follow to learn to create my own externals. Tuition If there is anyone in the Cambridge England area who does one to one tuition and could teach me how to create my own externals please let me know. Guidance appreciated Geoff -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From grh at mur.at Tue Mar 17 15:41:07 2009 From: grh at mur.at (Georg Holzmann) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 15:41:07 +0100 Subject: [PD] Writing you own externals in PD How to? In-Reply-To: <4FC77744-D534-49FF-945E-0914D4AABC4D@gmail.com> References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <49BE13B4.4030400@mur.at> <597D53A5-9B00-40CE-8B7F-776A826E9DE2@eds.org> <200903162329.16546.dmotd@gmx.net> <81FC897D-7E39-4613-B82A-B571925E3AAF@eds.org> <4FC77744-D534-49FF-945E-0914D4AABC4D@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49BFB683.7030702@mur.at> Hallo! > experience, aims ???? what I would like is the easiest route to begin > with :)* First rule is always: use C/C++ only if it is _really_ necessary. (you can design most of your filters also with pd's elementary filter objects ...) If you really want DSP externals: http://pdstatic.iem.at/externals-HOWTO/ LG Georg > > I.e. seem to have all these programs Octave (matlab), Faust, Xcode > ,Flext, Terminal etc. > > which would be the best path to follow to learn to create my own externals. > > Tuition > If there is anyone in the Cambridge England area who does one to one > tuition and could teach me how to create my own externals please let me > know. > > Guidance appreciated > Geoff > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From david.doukhan at gmail.com Tue Mar 17 15:41:54 2009 From: david.doukhan at gmail.com (David Doukhan) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 15:41:54 +0100 Subject: [PD] Writing you own externals in PD How to? In-Reply-To: <4FC77744-D534-49FF-945E-0914D4AABC4D@gmail.com> References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <49BE13B4.4030400@mur.at> <597D53A5-9B00-40CE-8B7F-776A826E9DE2@eds.org> <200903162329.16546.dmotd@gmx.net> <81FC897D-7E39-4613-B82A-B571925E3AAF@eds.org> <4FC77744-D534-49FF-945E-0914D4AABC4D@gmail.com> Message-ID: maybe you could have a look to : http://pdstatic.iem.at/externals-HOWTO ... 2009/3/17 Geoff : > Hi > This is quite along post but I thought the background was needed for it to > make sense. > Background > I have previous programming experience however?I have been using Pure Data > for several months now and am enjoying learning it. I am trying to learn DSP > for myself purely out of personal interest for the subject. I bought a book > on DSP and became hooked after reading it. :) > From that point I have relearnt all the A-level maths I studied over 10 > years ago and a few bits of physics, I have gone the the whole of Millers > book on Pure Data and whilst I would be lying if I said the whole thing made > sense I can certainly understand and implement alot of it. > I then moved on to Julius Smiths books on digital filters and physical > modelling which is where I am at the moment. And I am making slow progress > there as there is alot to assimilate in that I need to not only be able to > understand the topic related to Physics, Maths etc. but then know how to use > Matlab and C++ ?and Faust ?which is all quite a mountain. > Long Term Aim > What I want to do eventually when things make more sense is to work with > creating my own physical models which if I am to do it in pure data would > surely need me to create externals to run the filtering all inside one > object. > System > Mac OS 10.4.11 Macbook, Pure Data, Octave, Max/Msp, Xcode, Downloaded and > installed Faust but not sure how to?invoke?it :( > Mission > What I would like to be able to do is to take the examples I am reading > about in Julius Smiths books and create them as externals within Pure Data > so I can use them, Play with them :) > I.e. the book that I am working through 'Introduction to digital filters' > contains lots of example Matlab and C code for different filters and also > mentions Faust, then there is also flext to consider. > http://puredata.info/Members/thomas/flext-intro.pdf > Q) I want to create my own Pure data objects specifically filters starting > with the examples in Julius Smiths book.?What would be the most straight > forward path to take to begin with given my System, lack of experience, aims > ???? what I would like is the easiest route to begin with :) > I.e. seem to have all these programs Octave (matlab), Faust, Xcode ,Flext, > Terminal etc. > which would be the best path to follow to learn to create my own externals. > Tuition > If there is anyone in the Cambridge England area who does one to one tuition > and could teach me how to create my own externals please let me know. > Guidance appreciated > Geoff > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > -- David Doukhan From nicolas_montgermont at yahoo.fr Tue Mar 17 15:52:17 2009 From: nicolas_montgermont at yahoo.fr (Nicolas Montgermont) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 15:52:17 +0100 Subject: [PD] Writing you own externals in PD How to? In-Reply-To: <4FC77744-D534-49FF-945E-0914D4AABC4D@gmail.com> References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <49BE13B4.4030400@mur.at> <597D53A5-9B00-40CE-8B7F-776A826E9DE2@eds.org> <200903162329.16546.dmotd@gmx.net> <81FC897D-7E39-4613-B82A-B571925E3AAF@eds.org> <4FC77744-D534-49FF-945E-0914D4AABC4D@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49BFB921.5020607@yahoo.fr> Hello, If you have the example in faust, there is an online compiler for puredata external: http://faust.grame.fr/compiler.php I haven't test it though. Nicolas Le 17/03/09 15:28, Geoff a ?crit : > > > *Q) I want to create my own Pure data objects specifically filters > starting with the examples in Julius Smiths book. What would be the > most straight forward path to take to begin with given my System, lack > of experience, aims ???? what I would like is the easiest route to > begin with :)* > > -- http://nim.on.free.fr -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From matju at artengine.ca Tue Mar 17 16:01:46 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 11:01:46 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] GEM on Linux netbook In-Reply-To: <20090317131001.GB7255@00110101.errordevlopment.0> References: <20090317131001.GB7255@00110101.errordevlopment.0> Message-ID: On Tue, 17 Mar 2009, errordeveloper at gmail.com wrote: > On Mon, Mar 16, 2009 at 09:18:54AM -0500, Ben Baker-Smith wrote: >> The point of looking into the netbook was as an affordable piece of hardware >> that wouldn't cost me as much to replace if it got busted up / stolen at a >> show. If I was looking to find the optimal system I would, of course, be >> looking elsewhere. > ah ..well but may be you could apply other techniques of theft > prevention - like make it look on so shiny - i mean put stickers all > over the place .. personally, I use sandpaper for that... on plastic... haven't tried on metal surfaces yet. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From padawan12 at obiwannabe.co.uk Tue Mar 17 16:32:51 2009 From: padawan12 at obiwannabe.co.uk (Andy Farnell) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 15:32:51 +0000 Subject: [PD] Writing you own externals in PD How to? In-Reply-To: <49BFB921.5020607@yahoo.fr> References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <49BE13B4.4030400@mur.at> <597D53A5-9B00-40CE-8B7F-776A826E9DE2@eds.org> <200903162329.16546.dmotd@gmx.net> <81FC897D-7E39-4613-B82A-B571925E3AAF@eds.org> <4FC77744-D534-49FF-945E-0914D4AABC4D@gmail.com> <49BFB921.5020607@yahoo.fr> Message-ID: <20090317153251.32bdf098.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> On Tue, 17 Mar 2009 15:52:17 +0100 Nicolas Montgermont wrote: > Hello, > > If you have the example in faust, there is an online compiler for > puredata external: > http://faust.grame.fr/compiler.php > I haven't test it though. It works very well. Though the question you arrive at is, do you want to think in Faust's symbolic 'DSP algebra'? It's actually very elegant, but is a cognitive island (as a further aside, it is easier to pick up if you already think in dataflow). The problem is, ordinary C and C++ code isn't easy to integrate. The code generated by the filter is tersely optimised. A temporary happy solution is to use Faust's Pd arch filter to make some ready made wrappers. Then just drop C/++ code into the main loop. It gets around the chores of building a Pd external from scratch each time. But, if you are going to start doing that sort of thing, that's what Flext is supposed to be for, though it doesn't quite work out as easy as you might hope. The idea that you can compile for VST, Max, Pd or a standalone GUI app is very appealing, for both Flext and Faust. Ultimately, the logical thing is to amplify what Georg says: Develop in Pd. For a vast majority of DSP development Pd with variable blocksize is a perfect tool if you could only work in dataflow THEN: hit "compile" ****** Pd should be able to compile its own externals ******* then you'd get an external built from a properly componentised pdlib that you can immediately include into the running patch (no having to exit Pd to flush cached classes), just continue building abstraction upon abstraction (as compiled code) this way. A nice example of this would be building filters like biquad starting with just [+~], [*~] and [z~]. Then in the second round using them to make a synthesiser. Then in the third round using those to make a stand alone musical application ... all in a days development! as Bill Hicks would say... "just planting seeds...." > > Nicolas > > Le 17/03/09 15:28, Geoff a ?crit : > > > > > > *Q) I want to create my own Pure data objects specifically filters > > starting with the examples in Julius Smiths book. What would be the > > most straight forward path to take to begin with given my System, lack > > of experience, aims ???? what I would like is the easiest route to > > begin with :)* > > > > > > -- > http://nim.on.free.fr > -- Use the source From paulfinn81 at gmail.com Tue Mar 17 16:36:13 2009 From: paulfinn81 at gmail.com (=?ISO-8859-1?B?Zu1u?=) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 15:36:13 +0000 Subject: [PD] couldnt create pdp In-Reply-To: <4f424f350903170833h58003e7fjec6aac6ea43aa8d6@mail.gmail.com> References: <4f424f350903170833h58003e7fjec6aac6ea43aa8d6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <4f424f350903170836s13efb9dbjaf58813777e3ab62@mail.gmail.com> hi all, i recently purchases an acer aspire one netbook, its running fedora 8 i installed pd=extended through yum and was ready to begin using.. for some reason it wouldnt create any of the pidip specific objects and on the irc a person asked me to create a pdp object and see what the error was, it was the follow: /usr/lib/pd/extra/pdp.pd_linux: /usr/lib/pd/extra/pdp.pd_linux: undefined symbol: pdp_metro_setup pdp ... couldn't create pure dyne willl not run on this machine. and i am desperate to get pd-extended running on this machine successfully... i would try one of the nightly builds of pd-extended but i cant figure out which package i require, ia m inexperienced with nameing structures in linux... any help greatly appreciated... Paul Finn -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From geoffspuredata at googlemail.com Tue Mar 17 17:00:32 2009 From: geoffspuredata at googlemail.com (Geoff) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 16:00:32 +0000 Subject: [PD] Writing you own externals in PD How to? In-Reply-To: <20090317153251.32bdf098.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <49BE13B4.4030400@mur.at> <597D53A5-9B00-40CE-8B7F-776A826E9DE2@eds.org> <200903162329.16546.dmotd@gmx.net> <81FC897D-7E39-4613-B82A-B571925E3AAF@eds.org> <4FC77744-D534-49FF-945E-0914D4AABC4D@gmail.com> <49BFB921.5020607@yahoo.fr> <20090317153251.32bdf098.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> Message-ID: <7BBDC2CE-243D-4C27-9A42-F1D8D422FB2C@gmail.com> > Thanks for the reply This is interesting, but I am not sure if I understand you correctly. > A nice example of this would be building filters like biquad > starting with just [+~], [*~] and [z~]. Then in the second round > using them to make a synthesiser. Then in the third round using > those to make a stand alone musical application ... all in a days > development! So I can actually build filters from smaller building blocks in PD, So things like a Delay line to simulate a string is possible where by I can actually change the filtering in the feedback and feedforward paths to simulate different conditions? I.e. using [Z~] [*] I can create things like a comb filter but then have the freedom to put other sorts of filtering in it to make it more complex i.e. simulate the end effects of strings etc. all inside a single object. I thought that this can be done in PD as a test exercise but not if I want to create something that will actually work fast enough to be usable as a synthesizer. I'm glad to have been wrong! > Develop in Pd. For a vast majority of DSP development Pd with > variable blocksize is a perfect tool if you could only work in > dataflow THEN: hit "compile" > Are there any tutorials on this any where? > ****** Pd should be able to compile its own externals ******* > > then you'd get an external built from a properly componentised pdlib Where can I find further information about this? > that you can immediately include into the running patch (no having > to exit > Pd to flush cached classes), just continue building abstraction > upon abstraction (as compiled code) this way. Cheers Geoff On 17 Mar 2009, at 15:32, Andy Farnell wrote: > On Tue, 17 Mar 2009 15:52:17 +0100 > Nicolas Montgermont wrote: > >> Hello, >> >> If you have the example in faust, there is an online compiler for >> puredata external: >> http://faust.grame.fr/compiler.php >> I haven't test it though. > > > It works very well. Though the question you arrive at is, do > you want to think in Faust's symbolic 'DSP algebra'? It's actually > very elegant, but is a cognitive island (as a further aside, > it is easier to pick up if you already think in dataflow). The problem > is, ordinary C and C++ code isn't easy to integrate. The code > generated by > the filter is tersely optimised. > > A temporary happy solution is to use Faust's Pd arch filter to make > some ready made wrappers. Then just drop C/++ code into the main loop. > It gets around the chores of building a Pd external from scratch > each time. > > But, if you are going to start doing that sort of thing, that's > what Flext is supposed to be for, though it doesn't quite work out as > easy as you might hope. > > The idea that you can compile for VST, Max, Pd or a standalone > GUI app is very appealing, for both Flext and Faust. > > Ultimately, the logical thing is to amplify what Georg says: > > Develop in Pd. For a vast majority of DSP development Pd with > variable blocksize is a perfect tool if you could only work in > dataflow THEN: hit "compile" > > ****** Pd should be able to compile its own externals ******* > > then you'd get an external built from a properly componentised pdlib > that you can immediately include into the running patch (no having > to exit > Pd to flush cached classes), just continue building abstraction > upon abstraction (as compiled code) this way. > > A nice example of this would be building filters like biquad > starting with just [+~], [*~] and [z~]. Then in the second round > using them to make a synthesiser. Then in the third round using > those to make a stand alone musical application ... all in a days > development! > > as Bill Hicks would say... "just planting seeds...." > > > > > > >> >> Nicolas >> >> Le 17/03/09 15:28, Geoff a ?crit : >>> >>> >>> *Q) I want to create my own Pure data objects specifically filters >>> starting with the examples in Julius Smiths book. What would be the >>> most straight forward path to take to begin with given my System, >>> lack >>> of experience, aims ???? what I would like is the easiest route to >>> begin with :)* >>> >>> >> >> -- >> http://nim.on.free.fr >> > > > -- > Use the source > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/ > listinfo/pd-list From mnb at martin-brinkmann.de Tue Mar 17 16:46:31 2009 From: mnb at martin-brinkmann.de (martin brinkmann) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 16:46:31 +0100 Subject: [PD] GEM on Linux netbook In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49BFC5D7.8020406@martin-brinkmann.de> Ben Baker-Smith wrote: > -Does the netbook have enough processing power for general GEM > applications? I'm usually not dealing with video files, but rather particle > generation, shape manipulation, GIF texturing, and audio-response. On my > Macbook (2.0 GHz intel processor) the CPU meter always shows below 50% usage i think you can expect a pd patch wich runs at 50 percent on a 2 ghz dualcore machine, to use about 200 precent on the atom-cpu. my patches which need about 60 percent on my old pentium m, 1.4 ghz, use 130 percent on the a110. > -Are there any other issues that you think of given this scenario? and if > so, what other affordable/really-cheap laptops are there out there that I > can run linux on? i would try to get a used intel notebook, if (small) size does not matter that much, and google if it is known to run linux well. bis denn! martin From padawan12 at obiwannabe.co.uk Tue Mar 17 17:13:38 2009 From: padawan12 at obiwannabe.co.uk (Andy Farnell) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 16:13:38 +0000 Subject: [PD] Writing you own externals in PD How to? In-Reply-To: <7BBDC2CE-243D-4C27-9A42-F1D8D422FB2C@gmail.com> References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <49BE13B4.4030400@mur.at> <597D53A5-9B00-40CE-8B7F-776A826E9DE2@eds.org> <200903162329.16546.dmotd@gmx.net> <81FC897D-7E39-4613-B82A-B571925E3AAF@eds.org> <4FC77744-D534-49FF-945E-0914D4AABC4D@gmail.com> <49BFB921.5020607@yahoo.fr> <20090317153251.32bdf098.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> <7BBDC2CE-243D-4C27-9A42-F1D8D422FB2C@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090317161338.4511bed7.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> On Tue, 17 Mar 2009 16:00:32 +0000 Geoff wrote: > > So I can actually build filters from smaller building blocks in PD, Yes, and it's great fun and very educational > I thought that this can be done in PD as a test exercise but not if I > want to create something that will actually work fast enough to be > usable as a synthesizer. I'm glad to have been wrong! Well, sorry if this is misleading. We are on the borderline of right and wrong. This is where we hit Pd limitations at the lower level of granularity. yes you can build any filter, but not as efficient as hand coding and compiling. This is the disparity between the wonders of Pd as a development tool and the reality of using its output. > > > Develop in Pd. For a vast majority of DSP development Pd with > > variable blocksize is a perfect tool if you could only work in > > dataflow THEN: hit "compile" > > > > Are there any tutorials on this any where? Only in my dreams I'm afraid. :) It's what I wish for. Right now the choice is 1) Flext - wipes your ass a bit, but still requires some arcane C++ knowledge - advantage builds for Max and Pd 2) Faust - generates fast but opaque code, very flexible platform targets, weird DSP algebra notation 3) Hand craft in C - most flexible, tedious setup of supporting structure. 4) Andy's IDE (imaginary development environment) - pros: perfect, cons: does not exist in reality. :) a. -- Use the source From geoffspuredata at googlemail.com Tue Mar 17 17:24:20 2009 From: geoffspuredata at googlemail.com (Geoff) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 16:24:20 +0000 Subject: [PD] Writing you own externals in PD How to? In-Reply-To: <20090317161338.4511bed7.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <49BE13B4.4030400@mur.at> <597D53A5-9B00-40CE-8B7F-776A826E9DE2@eds.org> <200903162329.16546.dmotd@gmx.net> <81FC897D-7E39-4613-B82A-B571925E3AAF@eds.org> <4FC77744-D534-49FF-945E-0914D4AABC4D@gmail.com> <49BFB921.5020607@yahoo.fr> <20090317153251.32bdf098.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> <7BBDC2CE-243D-4C27-9A42-F1D8D422FB2C@gmail.com> <20090317161338.4511bed7.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> Message-ID: Okay :( it was a nice dream though. I have been thinking its probably worthwhile me downloading and installing linux onto my macbook purely to download the CCRMA stack of programs including PD and then working my way through Julius Smith books and accompanying papers then hopefully I will have the right versions/builds of everything to create physical models in PD and will be working with the system there is most information about. CHeers Geoff On 17 Mar 2009, at 16:13, Andy Farnell wrote: > On Tue, 17 Mar 2009 16:00:32 +0000 > Geoff wrote: > >> >> So I can actually build filters from smaller building blocks in PD, > > > Yes, and it's great fun and very educational > >> I thought that this can be done in PD as a test exercise but not if I >> want to create something that will actually work fast enough to be >> usable as a synthesizer. I'm glad to have been wrong! > > > Well, sorry if this is misleading. We are on the borderline of > right and wrong. This is where we hit Pd limitations at the lower > level of granularity. yes you can build any filter, but not > as efficient as hand coding and compiling. > > This is the disparity between the wonders of Pd as a development > tool and the reality of using its output. > > >> >>> Develop in Pd. For a vast majority of DSP development Pd with >>> variable blocksize is a perfect tool if you could only work in >>> dataflow THEN: hit "compile" >>> >> >> Are there any tutorials on this any where? > > > Only in my dreams I'm afraid. :) > > It's what I wish for. Right now the choice is > > 1) Flext - wipes your ass a bit, but still requires some > arcane C++ knowledge - advantage builds for Max and Pd > > 2) Faust - generates fast but opaque code, very flexible > platform targets, weird DSP algebra notation > > 3) Hand craft in C - most flexible, tedious setup of > supporting structure. > > 4) Andy's IDE (imaginary development environment) - pros: > perfect, cons: does not exist in reality. > :) > > a. > > > > -- > Use the source From ingo at miamiwave.com Tue Mar 17 17:25:28 2009 From: ingo at miamiwave.com (Ingo Scherzinger) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 17:25:28 +0100 Subject: [PD] dynamic creation arguments for route Message-ID: <406F8C57E19249329CC92C420FCEA68C@meincomputer> >Is is possible to dynamically alter the creation arguments for a route >object? [maxlib/nroute] can do that. The only difference to [route] is that it doesn't eliminate the value that is routed. This is because it can be set to any location of the list that's coming in. Ingo -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From padawan12 at obiwannabe.co.uk Tue Mar 17 17:31:35 2009 From: padawan12 at obiwannabe.co.uk (Andy Farnell) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 16:31:35 +0000 Subject: [PD] Writing you own externals in PD How to? In-Reply-To: References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <49BE13B4.4030400@mur.at> <597D53A5-9B00-40CE-8B7F-776A826E9DE2@eds.org> <200903162329.16546.dmotd@gmx.net> <81FC897D-7E39-4613-B82A-B571925E3AAF@eds.org> <4FC77744-D534-49FF-945E-0914D4AABC4D@gmail.com> <49BFB921.5020607@yahoo.fr> <20090317153251.32bdf098.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> <7BBDC2CE-243D-4C27-9A42-F1D8D422FB2C@gmail.com> <20090317161338.4511bed7.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> Message-ID: <20090317163135.605dbb4a.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> And visit here for much goodness http://www.musicdsp.org/ On Tue, 17 Mar 2009 16:24:20 +0000 Geoff wrote: > Okay :( > it was a nice dream though. From kyleklip at gmail.com Tue Mar 17 17:48:54 2009 From: kyleklip at gmail.com (Kyle Klipowicz) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 11:48:54 -0500 Subject: [PD] Unified Library was Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <49BF5BF4.7060805@netpd.org> References: <614691.50386.qm@web26304.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> <161320dd0903152002v4ad053f1r56f5b8edd369fcca@mail.gmail.com> <20090316083059.GC15510@footils.org> <49BF5BF4.7060805@netpd.org> Message-ID: Yes! rjlib is really nice! I finally tried using svn, it's really simple...I guess I was intimidated by nothing. svn checkout http://svn.rjdj.me/scenes/trunk/rjlib/ So simple! But really, kudos on such a beautiful, minimal, functional, cohesive library. ~Kyle On Tue, Mar 17, 2009 at 3:14 AM, Enrique Erne wrote: > i had a look at rjlib. it's a beautiful collection. i love the fact that it > is not too big and not using any external. > > though why is there a u_sssad.pd it seems the same as the original sssad.pd > frank didn't you say once you would prefer that people don't include their > own copy of sssad? > > same with the new-fast list-drip in u_listdrip.. is it just for > naming-convention that you renamed the abstraction? > > the whole e_ and s_ part is fantastic there are some really powerful > effects and filters in there. i looked more carefully and the only phone > related one is m_touch2grid which could be useful without a phone too. > > is this the correct url? > http://svn.rjdj.me/scenes/trunk/rjlib/rj > > hm... now i've seen > http://svn.rjdj.me/scenes/trunk/rjlib/ > > this is ofcorse phone specific and what confuses me now is that there is a > copy of sssad.pd > > anyway rjlib/rj is just beautiful. what license is it released under? > i couldn't find anything about that in the wiki. > > eni > > > > > > Frank Barknecht wrote: > >> Hallo, >> hard off hat gesagt: // hard off wrote: >> >> yeah sorry frank, i should have explained more clearly. >>> >>> i also think that no GUI is the way to go for functional abstractions. >>> that >>> was the big flaw of the DIY library i did, that the function of the >>> abstractions was tied in with the gui component. i did it that way >>> because >>> i didn't want to clutter the namespace with too many abstractions, and >>> the >>> thought of one abstraction for function, and then a different one for GUI >>> was not appealing at the time. >>> >>> but now, i think that is the only way to go. like, as you said, for >>> polyphony. and then also for the many many cases in which you'd want to >>> build your own gui for custom control. >>> >> >> Yeah, basically that was all I wanted to say as well. ;) >> >> >>> i do think you guys have got a really really strong system there with >>> rjlib. but i was just saying that without the gui stuff, it doesn't >>> exactly >>> fit into being that 'all purpose building blocks' library that we are >>> discussing. >>> >> >> Yes, that's true. rjlib has its focus on audio and control abstractions to >> be >> used on mobile devices with vanilla Pd. Some of this fits into a "all >> purpose" >> library, but a lot of it doesn't. >> Ciao >> > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -- ----- ------------ ---- ----- ---- -------- - ------ http://perhapsidid.wordpress.com http://myspace.com/kyleklipowicz -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bbakersmith at gmail.com Tue Mar 17 18:18:30 2009 From: bbakersmith at gmail.com (Ben Baker-Smith) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 12:18:30 -0500 Subject: [PD] GEM on Linux netbook Message-ID: Thanks to everyone for their suggestions. I will hold off on the netbook idea for now. Actually, the AudioPint concept is really playing with my imagination. Hmmm... Gem in a box, literaly. With enough forethought, it could be awesome. -Ben -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From fbar at footils.org Tue Mar 17 18:41:13 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 18:41:13 +0100 Subject: [PD] Writing you own externals in PD How to? In-Reply-To: <7BBDC2CE-243D-4C27-9A42-F1D8D422FB2C@gmail.com> References: <49BE13B4.4030400@mur.at> <597D53A5-9B00-40CE-8B7F-776A826E9DE2@eds.org> <200903162329.16546.dmotd@gmx.net> <81FC897D-7E39-4613-B82A-B571925E3AAF@eds.org> <4FC77744-D534-49FF-945E-0914D4AABC4D@gmail.com> <49BFB921.5020607@yahoo.fr> <20090317153251.32bdf098.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> <7BBDC2CE-243D-4C27-9A42-F1D8D422FB2C@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090317174113.GA21108@footils.org> Hallo, Geoff hat gesagt: // Geoff wrote: > So I can actually build filters from smaller building blocks in PD, Yes, with the elementary filter objects you can directly input poles and zeros as Pd objects. You should definitely read Miller Puckette's book, it's fantastic and has a very good introduction to Pd's filters and will teach you to use Pd like a pro. :) Ciao -- Frank From ydegoyon at gmail.com Tue Mar 17 21:34:10 2009 From: ydegoyon at gmail.com (ydegoyon at gmail.com) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 21:34:10 +0100 Subject: [PD] pidip compilation problem In-Reply-To: <49BFA51B.8000402@iem.at> References: <49BEC1D9.2050707@anorg.net> <49BF0678.2030101@gmail.com> <49BF879D.7040905@anorg.net> <49BF90E0.5050404@iem.at> <49BFA080.9060807@anorg.net> <49BFA51B.8000402@iem.at> Message-ID: <49C00942.9080405@gmail.com> IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: > marc widmer wrote: >> hi IOhannes >> >> thanks for your inputs... >> >> yes, pdp is installed an running (PDP: pure data packet version >> 0.12.5-darcs) >> ffmpeg is from cvs, but not from sourceforge, apparently ffmpeg moved >> to ffmpeg.org >> >> i downloaded it via svn from here: >> >> svn checkout svn://svn.ffmpeg.org/ffmpeg/trunk ffmpeg > > > this most likely won't work. > ffmpeg is changing rapidly (usually more rapidly than the application > that rely on it) - so you will have to get a version that is known to > work with PiDiP. > in the notes it mentions ffmpeg >= 0.4.9, so you should probably get > 0.4.9, and not the head of ffmpeg's repository. > > until you get it, i suggest trying to compile pidip without ffmpeg > support. you're right Iohannes, good advice to get rid of ffmpeg, convert you files to .ogg with ffmpeg2theora and use pdp_theorin~, an easier way... see you in Linz, Iohannes shanti, sevy > > fgmasdr > IOhannes > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > From ydegoyon at gmail.com Tue Mar 17 21:37:34 2009 From: ydegoyon at gmail.com (ydegoyon at gmail.com) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 21:37:34 +0100 Subject: [PD] pidip compilation problem In-Reply-To: <49BFACEF.4070503@anorg.net> References: <49BEC1D9.2050707@anorg.net> <49BF0678.2030101@gmail.com> <49BF879D.7040905@anorg.net> <49BF90E0.5050404@iem.at> <49BFA080.9060807@anorg.net> <49BFA51B.8000402@iem.at> <49BFACEF.4070503@anorg.net> Message-ID: <49C00A0E.4070409@gmail.com> marc widmer wrote: > hi IOhannes > > you are right, it compiles without ffmpeg. i moved my changed c_track > object to the new pidip sources and it seems to work, i have to check > it intensively in the next days. > > the old pidip will not compile, guess it's what yves mentioned, my > imagamagick version is too new. so if my project is not running with > the new pidip i guess i have to downgrade imagemagick (cross my > fingers for no dependency problems here :) but i hope i do not have to > do that. only if you use pdp_capture which i doubt... best, sevy > > thanks a lot. > > atb > marc > > > > > IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: >> marc widmer wrote: >>> hi IOhannes >>> >>> thanks for your inputs... >>> >>> yes, pdp is installed an running (PDP: pure data packet version >>> 0.12.5-darcs) >>> ffmpeg is from cvs, but not from sourceforge, apparently ffmpeg >>> moved to ffmpeg.org >>> >>> i downloaded it via svn from here: >>> >>> svn checkout svn://svn.ffmpeg.org/ffmpeg/trunk ffmpeg >> >> >> this most likely won't work. >> ffmpeg is changing rapidly (usually more rapidly than the application >> that rely on it) - so you will have to get a version that is known to >> work with PiDiP. >> in the notes it mentions ffmpeg >= 0.4.9, so you should probably get >> 0.4.9, and not the head of ffmpeg's repository. >> >> until you get it, i suggest trying to compile pidip without ffmpeg >> support. >> >> fgmasdr >> IOhannes > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > From graeme at tseetseetsu.org Tue Mar 17 21:21:55 2009 From: graeme at tseetseetsu.org (graeme at tseetseetsu.org) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 20:21:55 -0000 (GMT) Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com Message-ID: <59292.80.192.39.16.1237321315.squirrel@tseetseetsu.org> really have to pipe up to say thanks about this! a really huge help to me, so thank you Johannes! also, this is the first time i've posted to the list so a wee hello to everyone too - i enjoy your banter :) -graeme p.s. to Hans - i sent that to you alone by accident first there, sorry about that! (mailing list amatuer) > > Looks good, a nice surprise, I didn't even realize you were writing > it. I added this to my class syllabus site, I'll let you know what > the students say. > > Koray, a PID would be a fun book to write, I am up for it! First lets > get the FLOSS manuals Pure Data book out there. > > .hc > > > On Mar 17, 2009, at 7:59 AM, Koray Tahiroglu wrote: > >> >> Congratulations Johannes, >> >> This book will definitely be a bonus teaching material together with >> Miller's book for the computer generated music course that I am >> planning to teach next autumn. I had already involved Andy's book >> for the Sound design ( + a bit physics of sound ) course. Now lets >> hope that they will add these courses in the next curriculum :) and >> I guess there is one book we are still seeking at the moment that >> focuses Physical Interaction Design, the same way as Johannes' book. >> Earlier together with Hans we developed PID course materials, and >> his latest work embedding firmata in arduino library hopefully will >> bring up more Pd examples, and maybe later we will have another >> book. What do you think about this Hans? That would be great :) >> >> >> Koray >> >> >> >> On Mar 16, 2009, at 9:42 PM, pd-list-request at iem.at wrote: >> >>> Message: 4 >>> Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 20:12:21 +0100 >>> From: Johannes Kreidler >>> Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com >>> To: pd-list at iem.at >>> Message-ID: <49BEA495.8060106 at gmx.de> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed >>> >>> hi list, >>> >>> I am pleased to announce that the big pd tutorial I wrote in the last >>> years with the help of a grant by the Music University of Freiburg / >>> Germany, is now online, in english and in german. >>> >>> It is also available as a book (paperback) at Wolke Publishing House, >>> where the "bang" book was released. >>> >>> At the moment, Amazon says that it's not available, which is strange >>> because it's definitely released, but at least it can be purchased at >>> the Publishing House itself. >>> >>> http://www.pd-tutorial.com >>> >>> http://www.wolke-verlag.de/musik_u_t/loadbang.html >>> >>> http://www.buecher-zur-musik.de/assets/s2dmain.html?http://www.buecher-zur-musik.de/53108697370a2cb3f/5310869bc400a7a02.html >>> >>> http://www.amazon.de/Loadbang-Programming-Electronic-Music-Pure/dp/3936000573/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&s=books-intl-de&qid=1235853524&sr=8-3 >>> >>> Cheers >>> Johannes >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------- >> M.Koray Tahiroglu >> Acoustics Lab / TKK >> http://mlab.taik.fi/~korayt >> http://www.acoustics.hut.fi/~ktahirog/ >> tel: +358 45 233 6272 >> >> >> >> > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > All mankind is of one author, and is one volume; when one man dies, > one chapter is not torn out of the book, but translated into a better > language; and every chapter must be so translated.... -John Donne > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > From ydegoyon at gmail.com Tue Mar 17 22:29:13 2009 From: ydegoyon at gmail.com (ydegoyon at gmail.com) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 22:29:13 +0100 Subject: [PD] pidip compilation problem In-Reply-To: <49C00A0E.4070409@gmail.com> References: <49BEC1D9.2050707@anorg.net> <49BF0678.2030101@gmail.com> <49BF879D.7040905@anorg.net> <49BF90E0.5050404@iem.at> <49BFA080.9060807@anorg.net> <49BFA51B.8000402@iem.at> <49BFACEF.4070503@anorg.net> <49C00A0E.4070409@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49C01629.5060604@gmail.com> ydegoyon at gmail.com wrote: > marc widmer wrote: >> hi IOhannes >> >> you are right, it compiles without ffmpeg. i moved my changed c_track >> object to the new pidip sources and it seems to work what are these changes anyway ? it might benefit to other people, no? sevy From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 18 00:18:16 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 23:18:16 +0000 Subject: [PD] Pd book sprint in NYC/Berlin In-Reply-To: <49BE9671.6050904@umatic.nl> References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <49BDA282.9040607@gmail.com> <2D6F62EB-0878-4205-A5EA-AB248E81A93E@eds.org> <49BDB5A3.9090606@gmail.com> <49BE10BC.4010908@umatic.nl> <49BE13B4.4030400@mur.at> <597D53A5-9B00-40CE-8B7F-776A826E9DE2@eds.org> <49BE59D6.30109@mur.at> <49BE9671.6050904@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <2A4F4DC5-9208-4405-B3CC-B7934E284796@eds.org> I think we have the space on Saturday/Sunday noon til midnight and Monday til 9am-6pm EDT, but the room is occupied 6-9pm on Monday. But wait, I think I had my time zones mixed up. 6pm in NYC would be midnight in Berlin, so that works well then. .hc On Mar 16, 2009, at 6:12 PM, Derek Holzer wrote: > I charge double for mornings ;-) > > Honestly, I don't expect anything to ever happen in Berlin before > noon, anywhere. > > Why is morning here easier to sync up with there? I don't get it.... > Should be afternoons/evenings would be easier to get during NY > daytime... > > D. > > Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >> On Mar 16, 2009, at 1:53 PM, Georg Holzmann wrote: >>> Hallo! >>> >>>> I will be in Berlin from mar27 to mar30, and I would also like to >>>> contribute to the book sprint, but it is difficult for me during >>>> week/business hours. >>> >>> Yes, this weekend would be also nice for me ;) ! >> What time are people thinking of starting in Berlin? I am trying >> to organize the space in NYC. Will this be a morning thing there? >> If so, that's easier for NYC time to sync up with. But that's not >> essential. > > > -- > ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista > ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 69: > "Feed the recording back out of the medium" ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- All information should be free. - the hacker ethic From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 18 01:48:33 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 00:48:33 +0000 Subject: [PD] couldnt create pdp In-Reply-To: <4f424f350903170836s13efb9dbjaf58813777e3ab62@mail.gmail.com> References: <4f424f350903170833h58003e7fjec6aac6ea43aa8d6@mail.gmail.com> <4f424f350903170836s13efb9dbjaf58813777e3ab62@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <7F7E0FFA-DC9F-4336-A908-4B9A1BC85307@eds.org> Hmm, that's an odd one. Did you use the planetccrma packages? I don't know how Nando built things really, it seems a file got missed. I think you asked about this on #dataflow, did you find a solution? Worst comes to worst, Pd and Pd-extended runs best on Debian-based distros like Debian, Ubuntu, pure:dyne, etc. .hc On Mar 17, 2009, at 3:36 PM, f?n wrote: > hi all, i recently purchases an acer aspire one netbook, its running > fedora 8 > > i installed pd=extended through yum and was ready to begin using.. > > for some reason it wouldnt create any of the pidip specific objects > and on the irc a person asked me to create a pdp object and see what > the error was, it was the follow: > > > /usr/lib/pd/extra/pdp.pd_ > linux: /usr/lib/pd/extra/pdp.pd_linux: undefined symbol: > pdp_metro_setup > pdp > ... couldn't create > > pure dyne willl not run on this machine. and i am desperate to get > pd-extended running on this machine successfully... > > i would try one of the nightly builds of pd-extended but i cant > figure out which package i require, ia m inexperienced with nameing > structures in linux... > > any help greatly appreciated... > > > Paul Finn > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Programs should be written for people to read, and only incidentally for machines to execute. - from Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 18 01:54:55 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 00:54:55 +0000 Subject: [PD] Problems accessing Pdlist Archives In-Reply-To: <6b61086c0903160216m79ba0ecch27b317a42038faf7@mail.gmail.com> References: <6b61086c0903160019n17d108b0gde7013ee3a69dd1a@mail.gmail.com> <49BE147A.4080709@umatic.nl> <6b61086c0903160216m79ba0ecch27b317a42038faf7@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <6BFF9E9D-C33F-4A93-8405-D2DCDE10F2A2@eds.org> Funny, perfect timing, I just added those links to that page... :) it would be good to have the official source back too... .hc On Mar 16, 2009, at 9:16 AM, Alex Lucas wrote: > Hi Derek, > > Thanks for your help, I really like markmail! > > Thanks, > Alex > > 2009/3/16 Derek Holzer > Hi Alex, > > I had the same problem yesterday. There are three alternates listed > at: > > http://puredata.info/community/lists > > Gmane, Mail Archive and Markmail. One of those should work for you. > > best! > Derek > > > Alex Lucas wrote: > Hello everyone, > > Over the last couple of days I haven't been able to access the > Pdlist Archives by following the link on this page http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > . Has anyone else had the same problem or dose anyone know of an > alternative link? > > > -- > ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista > ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 173: > "Voice your suspicions" > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- "[W]e have invented the technology to eliminate scarcity, but we are deliberately throwing it away to benefit those who profit from scarcity." -John Gilmore -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From paulfinn81 at gmail.com Wed Mar 18 02:01:02 2009 From: paulfinn81 at gmail.com (Paul Finn) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 01:01:02 +0000 Subject: [PD] couldnt create pdp In-Reply-To: <7F7E0FFA-DC9F-4336-A908-4B9A1BC85307@eds.org> References: <4f424f350903170833h58003e7fjec6aac6ea43aa8d6@mail.gmail.com> <4f424f350903170836s13efb9dbjaf58813777e3ab62@mail.gmail.com> <7F7E0FFA-DC9F-4336-A908-4B9A1BC85307@eds.org> Message-ID: <2FB31863-427C-48F7-8340-0142F761D5EA@gmail.com> I've spent a long time on it now and have come to the conclusion that it is dependancy related or a hardware problem relating to my netbook. Either way I couldn't spend any more time trying solutions and so I moved to fendora 10. It's yumming away at the moment. Pure Dyne would have solved all my problems but unfortuatly it will not run on my acer aspire. It's a known issue. I've downloaded ubuntu studio also and may try that. All I wanna do is make a ball move :( Thanks though Happy belated paddies day ~_.~*fine*~._~ On 18 Mar 2009, at 00:48, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > Hmm, that's an odd one. Did you use the planetccrma packages? I > don't know how Nando built things really, it seems a file got > missed. I think you asked about this on #dataflow, did you find a > solution? > > Worst comes to worst, Pd and Pd-extended runs best on Debian-based > distros like Debian, Ubuntu, pure:dyne, etc. > > .hc > > On Mar 17, 2009, at 3:36 PM, f?n wrote: > >> hi all, i recently purchases an acer aspire one netbook, its >> running fedora 8 >> >> i installed pd=extended through yum and was ready to begin using.. >> >> for some reason it wouldnt create any of the pidip specific objects >> and on the irc a person asked me to create a pdp object and see >> what the error was, it was the follow: >> >> >> /usr/lib/pd/extra/pdp.pd_ >> linux: /usr/lib/pd/extra/pdp.pd_linux: undefined symbol: >> pdp_metro_setup >> pdp >> ... couldn't create >> >> pure dyne willl not run on this machine. and i am desperate to get >> pd-extended running on this machine successfully... >> >> i would try one of the nightly builds of pd-extended but i cant >> figure out which package i require, ia m inexperienced with nameing >> structures in linux... >> >> any help greatly appreciated... >> >> >> Paul Finn >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > > --- > --- > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Programs should be written for people to read, and only incidentally > for machines to execute. > - from Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs > From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 18 02:01:47 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 01:01:47 +0000 Subject: [PD] from Chile greetings In-Reply-To: <254016.56845.qm@web26308.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> References: <254016.56845.qm@web26308.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <68806313-5812-4D81-9C46-50D21AB80AF2@eds.org> Hola desde Liverpool, UK, then soon on my way to Newcastle, UK, not too close to Australia or Chile. Hope to see all of you in S?o Paulo! .hc On Mar 16, 2009, at 12:59 AM, Ed Kelly wrote: > > > And... > > > your timing is impeccable...sort of. > Come to Sao Paulo in July. You won't regret it. The best art, by the > best people, and in a very best place. > > Or stay home in CHile, brain your drain! > > aaa- deadline approacheth! > > Lone Shark: Synchromatic: Out December 1st 2008 > http://www.pyramidtransmissions.com/store > Also available through the iTunes store > > > --- On Mon, 16/3/09, Amos Robinson wrote: > >> From: Amos Robinson >> Subject: Re: [PD] from Chile greetings >> To: >> Cc: pd-list at iem.at >> Date: Monday, 16 March, 2009, 12:47 AM >> On a related note, greetings from >> Newcastle, Australia. I'm wondering >> whether there are any other people from Newcastle? >> >> On Mon, Mar 16, 2009 at 11:42 AM, Jose Luis Santorcuato >> >> wrote: >>> Hi my dear friends, this is my first contact with the >> community...well i >>> like this sinergy... i try go to the convention. >>> Please visit my blog... with love >>> >>> http://arselectronicachile.blogspot.com >>> >>> see you!!!! >>> >>> Jos? Luis >>> >>> -- >>> http://arselectronicachile.blogspot.com/ >>> www.myspace.com/santorcuato >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pd-list at iem.at >> mailing list >>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >>> >>> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at >> mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- kill your television From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 18 02:05:26 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 01:05:26 +0000 Subject: [PD] Pd-extended on AMD 64 In-Reply-To: <5f57e84f0903150808v565dfe7ctfc3bae5e4cc41fff@mail.gmail.com> References: <5f57e84f0903150808v565dfe7ctfc3bae5e4cc41fff@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: At this point, its probably easiest for you to build Pd from source. There is a wiki page to help: http://puredata.info/docs/developer/64BitLinux .hc On Mar 15, 2009, at 3:08 PM, Nicanor Garcia wrote: > Hello, I'm trying to install the published .deb package for amd64 > but I'm havint trouble with the needed libs. I'm using a amd64 > machine with Studio 64 as OS. > > > When I try to install with dpkg it tells me that I need to have > liblame0 installed, but liblame0 is incompatible with libquicktime1 > which is also needed to install. > > > I'm a bit novice in linux and I don't know what to do, can anyone > help me with this?? > > > Thank you very much. > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- You can't steal a gift. Bird gave the world his music, and if you can hear it, you can have it. - Dizzy Gillespie From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 18 02:05:56 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 01:05:56 +0000 Subject: [PD] read sysex files (hex) In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903142334m2c11d345j8ce900c2f3bdf8db@mail.gmail.com> References: <161320dd0903142334m2c11d345j8ce900c2f3bdf8db@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <25976580-95AE-4B4D-BFCE-B8E917290247@eds.org> maybe binfile in mrpeach? .hc On Mar 15, 2009, at 6:34 AM, hard off wrote: > is there a way to read .syx files in pd? these are in raw hex format. > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- News is what people want to keep hidden and everything else is publicity. - Bill Moyers From porres at gmail.com Wed Mar 18 02:09:05 2009 From: porres at gmail.com (Alexandre Porres) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 22:09:05 -0300 Subject: [PD] (yet another) www.pd-tutorial.com Message-ID: <161a0b1e0903171809n309b0786g12b9ad985d211791@mail.gmail.com> Congratulations! It is certainly something we need. In Fact, I am doing a book myself :) and I am about to share it. I got it in Portuguese for now. Who wants to take a peak? :) I present topics such as: *Wavetable Synthesis - DC Offset ? Modulation (Amplitude, Ring, Frequency, Pulse Width) ? Additive/Subtractive Synthesis - Filters ? WaveShaping - Spectral Analisys (FFT/Resynthesis) - Convolution & Convolution Reverb - Vocoder, Cross Synthesis - Phase Vocoder*. Gladly, it is a different proposal, so johannes book, as well as Miller's and Floss Manuals all are complementary publications. Talking about Phase Vocoder is an attempt to make it more accessible than in Miller's book, in a sense that I wish to reach people with no Background in Computer Science. I dont emphasize much on programing and implementing things in Puredata, so books like johanes' are definately handy... I like the part on Convolution, as it is not covered in other pd books I guess. Actually, I would really like to discuss this with you people. I must say we need to improve Pdpedia and commit to this project as a comunity. I can handle the Portuguese and English part. Lets better promote Pd by publishing about it! :) Cheers -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 18 02:12:22 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 01:12:22 +0000 Subject: [PD] Pd-extended on AMD 64 In-Reply-To: References: <5f57e84f0903150808v565dfe7ctfc3bae5e4cc41fff@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <0C56E506-E90A-4A00-9655-A7E01AE95D05@eds.org> Oops, this one might be easier to follow: http://puredata.info/docs/developer/BuildingPdExtended64bitUbuntuIntrepid Try searching puredata.info for "64 bit" and you'll find things like this. .hc On Mar 18, 2009, at 1:05 AM, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > At this point, its probably easiest for you to build Pd from > source. There is a wiki page to help: > > http://puredata.info/docs/developer/64BitLinux > > .hc > > On Mar 15, 2009, at 3:08 PM, Nicanor Garcia wrote: > >> Hello, I'm trying to install the published .deb package for amd64 >> but I'm havint trouble with the needed libs. I'm using a amd64 >> machine with Studio 64 as OS. >> >> >> When I try to install with dpkg it tells me that I need to have >> liblame0 installed, but liblame0 is incompatible with libquicktime1 >> which is also needed to install. >> >> >> I'm a bit novice in linux and I don't know what to do, can anyone >> help me with this?? >> >> >> Thank you very much. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > You can't steal a gift. Bird gave the world his music, and if you > can hear it, you can have it. - Dizzy Gillespie > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- All mankind is of one author, and is one volume; when one man dies, one chapter is not torn out of the book, but translated into a better language; and every chapter must be so translated.... -John Donne From hard.off at gmail.com Wed Mar 18 03:01:40 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 11:01:40 +0900 Subject: [PD] read sysex files (hex) In-Reply-To: <25976580-95AE-4B4D-BFCE-B8E917290247@eds.org> References: <161320dd0903142334m2c11d345j8ce900c2f3bdf8db@mail.gmail.com> <25976580-95AE-4B4D-BFCE-B8E917290247@eds.org> Message-ID: <161320dd0903171901r4422e19u9715a9fa9bc60cd6@mail.gmail.com> YES! thanks hans, and thanks mr peach! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From danomatika at gmail.com Wed Mar 18 04:00:47 2009 From: danomatika at gmail.com (danomatika) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 04:00:47 +0100 Subject: [PD] GEM on Linux netbook Message-ID: <1237345247.14464.3.camel@danoT500> Thanks to everyone for their suggestions. I will hold off on the netbook idea for now. Actually, the AudioPint concept is really playing with my imagination. Hmmm... Gem in a box, literaly. With enough forethought, it could be awesome. -Ben Yes do an audio pint. Get a Mini ITX board with say a dual Atom or Core 2 Duo and an NVidia card and you should be alright. I just got a new Pico ITX board a little larger than a pack of cigarettes. It's a 1Ghz VIA with 1G ram and its running PD in realtime nicely. Don't go nano or pico ITX as you'd have they have integrated graphics and no pcie expansion slots. --- Dan Wilcox danomatika.com robotcowboy.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From santorcuato76 at gmail.com Wed Mar 18 04:28:22 2009 From: santorcuato76 at gmail.com (Jose Luis Santorcuato) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 23:28:22 -0400 Subject: [PD] from Chile greetings In-Reply-To: <68806313-5812-4D81-9C46-50D21AB80AF2@eds.org> References: <254016.56845.qm@web26308.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> <68806313-5812-4D81-9C46-50D21AB80AF2@eds.org> Message-ID: <4345df630903172028k4d9d8178t9c88551bd22a90a@mail.gmail.com> Hi, from Chile... i dont make the aplication on the format... but th deadline is on 30, i translate all my project.... jajajaja, well... i hope to see all of you in Brazil, check my litlle blog : http://arselectronicachile.blogspot.com Keep on touch!!! Jos? Luis 2009/3/17 Hans-Christoph Steiner > > Hola desde Liverpool, UK, then soon on my way to Newcastle, UK, not too > close to Australia or Chile. > > Hope to see all of you in S?o Paulo! > > .hc > > > On Mar 16, 2009, at 12:59 AM, Ed Kelly wrote: > > >> >> And... >> >> >> your timing is impeccable...sort of. >> Come to Sao Paulo in July. You won't regret it. The best art, by the best >> people, and in a very best place. >> >> Or stay home in CHile, brain your drain! >> >> aaa- deadline approacheth! >> >> Lone Shark: Synchromatic: Out December 1st 2008 >> http://www.pyramidtransmissions.com/store >> Also available through the iTunes store >> >> >> --- On Mon, 16/3/09, Amos Robinson wrote: >> >> From: Amos Robinson >>> Subject: Re: [PD] from Chile greetings >>> To: >>> Cc: pd-list at iem.at >>> Date: Monday, 16 March, 2009, 12:47 AM >>> On a related note, greetings from >>> Newcastle, Australia. I'm wondering >>> whether there are any other people from Newcastle? >>> >>> On Mon, Mar 16, 2009 at 11:42 AM, Jose Luis Santorcuato >>> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> Hi my dear friends, this is my first contact with the >>>> >>> community...well i >>> >>>> like this sinergy... i try go to the convention. >>>> Please visit my blog... with love >>>> >>>> http://arselectronicachile.blogspot.com >>>> >>>> see you!!!! >>>> >>>> Jos? Luis >>>> >>>> -- >>>> http://arselectronicachile.blogspot.com/ >>>> www.myspace.com/santorcuato >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Pd-list at iem.at >>>> >>> mailing list >>> >>>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >>>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pd-list at iem.at >>> mailing list >>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >>> >>> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > kill your television > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -- http://arselectronicachile.blogspot.com/ www.myspace.com/santorcuato -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dmotd at gmx.net Wed Mar 18 04:45:04 2009 From: dmotd at gmx.net (dmotd) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 13:45:04 +1000 Subject: [PD] Pd book sprint in NYC/Berlin In-Reply-To: <81FC897D-7E39-4613-B82A-B571925E3AAF@eds.org> References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <81FC897D-7E39-4613-B82A-B571925E3AAF@eds.org> Message-ID: <200903181345.04879.dmotd@gmx.net> i should probably avoid writing emails before bed, and my negative bias towards video-conferencing comes from a number of bad experiences and unproductive meetings. anyhow you are quite right to push this one, to converse without latency can be very productive (but equally unproductive too) - a good meeting requires a fair bit more preparation and planning than just the medium, regardless of mcluhans philosophy. incidentally i have enjoyed his musings in the past but i already find his arguments ambiguous enough with regard to psychology and technology, to retrofit his ideologies to todays baffling techno-communcications wasteland is a bit of a stretch ;) ciao, dmotd On Tuesday 17 March 2009 21:41:46 Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > Yeah, in case I came across too strong, I think that IRC is very > useful, and voice chat is too. We can have both running for this > meeting, and people can choose where they participate. IRC is great > for async communications, like asking specific questions. But I find > it takes 10-20x longer to work through difficult issues thru text-only > media like IRC, IM, email, etc. as compared to a voice conversation. > > .hc > > On Mar 16, 2009, at 7:32 PM, Jo?o Pais wrote: > > Is this a one time thing, or might happen more times? I would say > > that at least voice connection would be productive. I haven't that > > much experience with video conferencing, but a medium where people > > can react at the same time they can think would be important. > > (although after too much time, even the fingers are faster than some > > heads) > > > > How about voice connection for general talk + an irc chat for small, > > fast questions? We can also send a group foto with skype, so that > > everyone feels the warmth. > > > >> Marshall McLuhan would strongly disagree with you, as do I. The > >> medium with which you communicate has a very strong impact on the > >> conversation. That does not mean that it is the only influence. > >> There are many things that lead to a bad meeting, and from my > >> experience of having many meetings in person, on IRC, on IM, on > >> phones, on voice chat, on video chat, and many different mixes > >> above, I am a strong believer in high-bandwidth communication like > >> voice. > > --------------------------------------------------------------------------- >- > > Mistrust authority - promote decentralization. - the hacker ethic From husk00 at gmail.com Wed Mar 18 05:16:19 2009 From: husk00 at gmail.com (Husk 00) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 05:16:19 +0100 Subject: [PD] a simple counter, I'm not able to do it tonight Message-ID: Hi list, I need a little help. I'm using an up-down counter. It has a min and a max limit: 0 and 100 (for say something). I don't like my solution and i know there is a easier way to do it; but tonight I can't find it :( So, someone can help me with a rapid solution? thanks in advance Husk -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kyleklip at gmail.com Wed Mar 18 06:12:02 2009 From: kyleklip at gmail.com (Kyle Klipowicz) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 00:12:02 -0500 Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com In-Reply-To: <20090317064237.GA19437@footils.org> References: <49BEA495.8060106@gmx.de> <20090316210312.10227980.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> <20090317064237.GA19437@footils.org> Message-ID: I must say this is a nice text. However, I was hoping to see more in the department of sequencing/composition. This has great sound design elements, but I am looking for better ways to compose with Pd. Frank, I'm curious about how you use list objects in composition. I'd love to see a little etude from you about that whenever you find the time. You always make such clear, concise, and fun instructional patches. ~Kyle On Tue, Mar 17, 2009 at 1:42 AM, Frank Barknecht wrote: > Hallo, > Andy Farnell hat gesagt: // Andy Farnell wrote: > > > Congrats on finishing it Johannes. > > This looks very nice. Some people ask if my book > > focuses on sound design, and Millers book focuses on > > DSP theory, why is there not a book dedicated to > > composition in Pd? Well now there is. > > Hm, you all are so fast readers, reading a book in less than one evening. > :) > > By quickly scanning through the book and grep'ing the patches, I wonder, > why > not a single patch uses the [list] object which - not only because of the > [list]-abs - is one of my most often used objects especially for > composition? I > would expect a section on list-processing when teaching people how to > compose. > > Anyway, I haven't read it yet, maybe these topics are presented without > [list]. > > Ciao > -- > Frank > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -- ----- ------------ ---- ----- ---- -------- - ------ http://perhapsidid.wordpress.com http://myspace.com/kyleklipowicz -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From porres at gmail.com Tue Mar 17 21:34:59 2009 From: porres at gmail.com (Alexandre Porres) Date: Tue, 17 Mar 2009 17:34:59 -0300 Subject: [PD] PdCon09 (Last Call) New Deadline march 29-30 Message-ID: <161a0b1e0903171334r41505662v4dfd63fb1aae87dd@mail.gmail.com> ---------- Forwarded message ---------- From: PdCon09 3rd International Puredata Convention < pdcon09 at estudiolivre.org> Date: 2009/3/17 Subject: (Last Call) New Deadline march 29-30 Hi, we had some technical problems, and a lot of people had trouble. Attending requests, we postponed the deadline in 2 weeks. If you have work to submit, please visit http://convention.puredata.info for more details. new deadline is midnight from march 29th to 30th (sunday to monday) according to Sao Paulo time (UTC-3). Thanks ------------------ http://convention.puredata.info pdcon09 at estudiolivre.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jancsika at yahoo.com Wed Mar 18 09:01:49 2009 From: jancsika at yahoo.com (Jonathan Wilkes) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 01:01:49 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] dynamic creation arguments for route In-Reply-To: <406F8C57E19249329CC92C420FCEA68C@meincomputer> Message-ID: <64929.21454.qm@web65613.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> I built a settable route abstraction using dynamic patching. It requires [initbang], which is missing in pd-vanilla, so you'll need pd-ext if you want to use it. Let me know how it works if you try it. -Jonathan --- On Tue, 3/17/09, Ingo Scherzinger wrote: > From: Ingo Scherzinger > Subject: Re: [PD] dynamic creation arguments for route > To: pd-list at iem.at > Date: Tuesday, March 17, 2009, 5:25 PM > >Is is possible to dynamically alter the creation > arguments for a route > > >object? > > > > [maxlib/nroute] can do that. The only difference to [route] > is that it > doesn't eliminate the value that is routed. This is > because it can be set to > any location of the list that's coming in. > > > > Ingo > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: dynaroute.pd Type: application/puredata Size: 4703 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: dynaroute-help.pd Type: application/puredata Size: 1677 bytes Desc: not available URL: From fbar at footils.org Wed Mar 18 09:17:17 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 09:17:17 +0100 Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com In-Reply-To: References: <49BEA495.8060106@gmx.de> <20090316210312.10227980.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> <20090317064237.GA19437@footils.org> Message-ID: <20090318081717.GA30597@fliwatut.scifi> Hallo, Kyle Klipowicz hat gesagt: // Kyle Klipowicz wrote: > Frank, I'm curious about how you use list objects in composition. I'd love > to see a little etude from you about that whenever you find the time. You > always make such clear, concise, and fun instructional patches. That's flattering so I guess I should give an example. ;) [list] of course is useful for lots of stuff, e.g. as a general container for messages (it's central for sssad in this regard), to convert meta-messages to lists and back, etc. In composition list-operations let you encapsulate many common tasks in reusable abstractions. Johannes mentions LISP in his book, which is the mother of all list-based composition software, but you can do lots of stuff in Pd as well thanks to list. As an example attached are abstractions that do four transformations of little musical motives. The motives are stored as lists of numbers, where each number represents a scale step. In the example a major scale is used, but you can do 12-tone serialism as well and also apply the transformations to rhythm lists etc. The four operations demonstrated are: - retrograde: play a motive backwards. That's a simple [list-rev] from the [list]-abs (included) - transpose: add a number to each list-element. I used [list-map] here. - inversion: That's a bit more complicated. Quoting Wikipedia: Inverted melodies When applied to melodies, the inversion of a given melody is the melody turned upside-down. For instance, if the original melody has a rising major third (see interval), the inverted melody has a falling major third (or perhaps more likely, in tonal music, a falling minor third, or even some other falling interval). Similarly, in twelve-tone technique, the inversion of the tone row is the so-called prime series turned upside-down. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inversion_(music)#Inverted_melodies In inversion.pd this is realised by walking through the list with list-map, taking the difference between the current element and the previous element, then substracting this from the current element. The first element in a list is treated specially as it has no previous element (it's just copied). - retro-inversion: that's just a retrograde followed by an inversion. As we have abstractions for both not, just bundle them in another one. list-compose.pd show all four operations in use to transform a little motive. (This text is available online as well at: http://footils.org/cms/weblog/2009/mar/18/using-list-composition-pd/ ) Ciao -- Frank Barknecht Do You RjDj.me? _ ______footils.org__ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: list-compose.tgz Type: application/x-gtar Size: 3061 bytes Desc: not available URL: From fbar at footils.org Wed Mar 18 09:27:35 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 09:27:35 +0100 Subject: [PD] dynamic creation arguments for route In-Reply-To: <64929.21454.qm@web65613.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> References: <406F8C57E19249329CC92C420FCEA68C@meincomputer> <64929.21454.qm@web65613.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20090318082735.GA23568@footils.org> Hallo, also see [sroute] which is a hidden leftover in the [list]-abs collection. The idea is to use a one-argument [select] instead of [route]. [select] with no or one argument has an additional inlet, where you can set the thing it selects. Decorate this with some [list split 1] and [list] objects and you have a simple settable [route]. No dynamic patching or externals necessary. Ciao -- Frank Jonathan Wilkes hat gesagt: // Jonathan Wilkes wrote: > I built a settable route abstraction using dynamic patching. It requires [initbang], which is missing in pd-vanilla, so you'll need pd-ext if you want to use it. > > Let me know how it works if you try it. > > -Jonathan > > --- On Tue, 3/17/09, Ingo Scherzinger wrote: > > > From: Ingo Scherzinger > > Subject: Re: [PD] dynamic creation arguments for route > > To: pd-list at iem.at > > Date: Tuesday, March 17, 2009, 5:25 PM > > >Is is possible to dynamically alter the creation > > arguments for a route > > > > >object? > > > > > > > > [maxlib/nroute] can do that. The only difference to [route] > > is that it > > doesn't eliminate the value that is routed. This is > > because it can be set to > > any location of the list that's coming in. > > > > > > > > Ingo > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From fbar at footils.org Wed Mar 18 09:38:44 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 09:38:44 +0100 Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com In-Reply-To: <20090318081717.GA30597@fliwatut.scifi> References: <49BEA495.8060106@gmx.de> <20090316210312.10227980.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> <20090317064237.GA19437@footils.org> <20090318081717.GA30597@fliwatut.scifi> Message-ID: <20090318083844.GB23568@footils.org> Hallo, Frank Barknecht hat gesagt: // Frank Barknecht wrote: > - inversion: That's a bit more complicated. Quoting Wikipedia: > > Inverted melodies > > When applied to melodies, the inversion of a given melody is the > melody turned upside-down. For instance, if the original melody has a > rising major third (see interval), the inverted melody has a falling > major third (or perhaps more likely, in tonal music, a falling minor > third, or even some other falling interval). Similarly, in twelve-tone > technique, the inversion of the tone row is the so-called prime series > turned upside-down. > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inversion_(music)#Inverted_melodies > > In inversion.pd this is realised by walking through the list with > list-map, taking the difference between the current element and the > previous element, then substracting this from the current element. > The first element in a list is treated specially as it has no > previous element (it's just copied). Ah, sorry: The patch is correct, but my explanation is wrong. Here's an update: In inversion.pd this is realised by walking through the list with list-map. The interval to use next is calculated by taking the difference between the current element and the previous element. This interval is substracted (not added, because we are "retro"-grading) from the previous note, the resulting note is stored for the next step and inserted into the result list. The first element in a list is treated specially as it has no previous element: it's just copied and used as the starting note. Ciao -- Frank From oded at ccrma.Stanford.EDU Wed Mar 18 09:45:06 2009 From: oded at ccrma.Stanford.EDU (Oded Ben-Tal) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 01:45:06 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] variance from mapping library Message-ID: I'm not sure if it's a bug but: when using variance (from mapping library) - I get negative numbers. Since variance is supposed to be always positive and I don't see anything wrong in the way the abstraction is done, I presume there is something I'm missing. My impression is that small changes in the input translate to negative 'variance' ___________________________________________________ Oded Ben-Tal http://ccrma.stanford.edu/~oded oded at ccrma.stanford.edu From hard.off at gmail.com Wed Mar 18 10:22:58 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 18:22:58 +0900 Subject: [PD] a simple counter, I'm not able to do it tonight In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <161320dd0903180222o5ca2d137y7c395c5751721edb@mail.gmail.com> make a normal counter: [f ]x[+ 1] with the outlet of [f ] going to the LEFT inlet of [+ 1] , and the outlet of [+ 1] going to the RIGHT inlet of [f ] then, [wrap -99 100] | [abs] if your limit was 1000, you would do [wrap -999 1000] ..etc hope that works. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From fbar at footils.org Wed Mar 18 10:41:49 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 10:41:49 +0100 Subject: [PD] Unified Library was Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <49BF556B.1080404@netpd.org> References: <1237248830.25065.7.camel@danoT500> <20090317064707.GB19437@footils.org> <49BF556B.1080404@netpd.org> Message-ID: <20090318094149.GD30597@fliwatut.scifi> Hallo, Enrique Erne hat gesagt: // Enrique Erne wrote: > could you explain the polyphony example? > > doesn't each voice have the same parameter, coming from the gui? I might want to save settings even though I didn't use a GUI to set them. Settings don't necessarily come from a GUI. For example say I use an algorithm to generate settings, or I may write my settings into a textfile or a message box - there also is no GUI involved. Settings in Pd however all are manipulated by sending messages, even GUIs are just a way to generate a message. So the way to save state in Pd IMO is to intercept message, not to watch GUI elements. In regard to polyphony, it's pretty common to duplicate a synth voice many times, manually or using e.g. polypoly or rjlib's u_makepoly. There is no need to have a GUI in those hidden objects, but I still need to access their parameters to set them. So what I need is a way to peek into the abstraction and eavesdrop their messages. In rjlib that peeping hole is the rightmost inlet. [sssad] is used in a wrapper u_dispatch at that inlet that also dispatches messages coming in to local senders. So the abstractions all know their state even though most of them don't have a GUI. If I want a GUI, I just make one that produces messages for the control inlet. Maybe some OO programming language experts can say smart things about how this is related to a Model-View-Controller paradigm, where the GUI elements constitute one of many possible Views, the [textfile] is a Model and [sssad] is the controller but I'm not good at this stuff. Ciao -- Frank Barknecht Do You RjDj.me? _ ______footils.org__ From mirkom at gmx.de Wed Mar 18 10:35:57 2009 From: mirkom at gmx.de (Mirko Maier) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 10:35:57 +0100 Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com Message-ID: <20090318093557.8940@gmx.net> I just wanted to say that this tutorial is really really great, I hope that much more interested guys will enter pd by working with this tutorial. thanks johannes! -- Aufgepasst: Sind Ihre Daten beim Online-Banking auch optimal gesch?tzt? Jetzt absichern: https://homebanking.gmx.net/?mc=mail at footer.hb From zmoelnig at iem.at Wed Mar 18 10:46:45 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 10:46:45 +0100 Subject: [PD] Problems accessing Pdlist Archives In-Reply-To: <6BFF9E9D-C33F-4A93-8405-D2DCDE10F2A2@eds.org> References: <6b61086c0903160019n17d108b0gde7013ee3a69dd1a@mail.gmail.com> <49BE147A.4080709@umatic.nl> <6b61086c0903160216m79ba0ecch27b317a42038faf7@mail.gmail.com> <6BFF9E9D-C33F-4A93-8405-D2DCDE10F2A2@eds.org> Message-ID: <49C0C305.9090207@iem.at> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > Funny, perfect timing, I just added those links to that page... :) it > would be good to have the official source back too... oh, they are back again since the day before yesterday. (at least that was my impression) however, due to the archive-failure (which was part of an upgrade from etch to lenny) some emails are missing. the way to solve this right now would involve rebuilding the entire archive, which might (i'd say: 90% likelyhood), generate new filenames for most of the archived emails (or probably not most; but there are about 65000 emails archived for the Pd-list alone; maybe only have of them will get new names :-)); which is probably a bad idea if someone has stored a link toa certainemail within the archive. i'm investigating a way to rebuild only the emails for March. just to let you know. fgmasdr IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From marc at anorg.net Wed Mar 18 10:48:32 2009 From: marc at anorg.net (marc widmer) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 10:48:32 +0100 Subject: [PD] pidip compilation problem In-Reply-To: <49C01629.5060604@gmail.com> References: <49BEC1D9.2050707@anorg.net> <49BF0678.2030101@gmail.com> <49BF879D.7040905@anorg.net> <49BF90E0.5050404@iem.at> <49BFA080.9060807@anorg.net> <49BFA51B.8000402@iem.at> <49BFACEF.4070503@anorg.net> <49C00A0E.4070409@gmail.com> <49C01629.5060604@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49C0C36F.3090707@anorg.net> hi list & yves i tested my old patches and everything looks ok, beside a warning in the shell, that base64 is missing, is this important? so far everything worked. i changed c_track in the source, so that it checks not one point, but a matrix of points. at the moment all these points are with fixed offset between each other. from pd i just set the start coordinates. furthermore i do check not the color of one pixel, but of all surrounding points (9 in total) and calculate the average. i do this to avoid tracking flickering pixel noises which sometimes occur when i grap video from my surveillance color cams. at the moment this is rather a hack of your source then a proper enhancement, but maybe, if you think this could be usefull, a module lik c_track_matrix could be a goal. where one can send a list with coordinates to track and the area space surrounding that point. i haven't checked the development of pidip since a while, maybe now there is already a better way to do this. all the best marc ydegoyon at gmail.com schrieb: > ydegoyon at gmail.com wrote: >> marc widmer wrote: >>> hi IOhannes >>> >>> you are right, it compiles without ffmpeg. i moved my changed >>> c_track object to the new pidip sources and it seems to work > > what are these changes anyway ? > it might benefit to other people, no? > > sevy -- netzbarkeit: Medienservice nach Mass Marc Widmer, Bitarbeiter ADRESS: netzbarkeit, Kernstrasse 37, CH-8004 Zurich, Switzerland PHONE: +41 (0)44 400 50 45 : FAX: +41 (0)44 400 50 47 WEB: www.netzbarkeit.ch **************************************************************** NEU: emaki-Newstool www.newstool.ch Email-Newsletter-Management f?r Firmen, Institutionen und Vereine. From derek at umatic.nl Wed Mar 18 10:57:29 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 09:57:29 +0000 Subject: [PD] a simple counter, I'm not able to do it tonight In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903180222o5ca2d137y7c395c5751721edb@mail.gmail.com> References: <161320dd0903180222o5ca2d137y7c395c5751721edb@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49C0C589.5070401@umatic.nl> ah, but which [wrap]? there are several which do different things.... d. hard off wrote: > make a normal counter: > > [f ]x[+ 1] > > with the outlet of [f ] going to the LEFT inlet of [+ 1] , and the > outlet of [+ 1] going to the RIGHT inlet of [f ] > > > then, > > [wrap -99 100] > | > [abs] -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 74: "Get your neck massaged" From hard.off at gmail.com Wed Mar 18 10:58:10 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 18:58:10 +0900 Subject: [PD] Unified Library was Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <20090318094149.GD30597@fliwatut.scifi> References: <1237248830.25065.7.camel@danoT500> <20090317064707.GB19437@footils.org> <49BF556B.1080404@netpd.org> <20090318094149.GD30597@fliwatut.scifi> Message-ID: <161320dd0903180258p7c24f63cwc083f55d87cd83bb@mail.gmail.com> so are we going to go ahead with this? does anyone want to volunteer to set up a wiki? i'm terrible at any of that sort of thing. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hard.off at gmail.com Wed Mar 18 11:00:37 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 19:00:37 +0900 Subject: [PD] a simple counter, I'm not able to do it tonight In-Reply-To: <49C0C589.5070401@umatic.nl> References: <161320dd0903180222o5ca2d137y7c395c5751721edb@mail.gmail.com> <49C0C589.5070401@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <161320dd0903180300mdd38093s121b2c800463ddc5@mail.gmail.com> really? i mean the [wrap] that wraps numbers between two values. what do the other ones do? i know of the signal version of course. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From loic.kessous at gmail.com Wed Mar 18 11:03:20 2009 From: loic.kessous at gmail.com (Loic Kessous) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 11:03:20 +0100 Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com In-Reply-To: References: <49BEA495.8060106@gmx.de> Message-ID: <12F5AC76-9C7C-4242-881B-D0490F22B526@gmail.com> A french translation may be a good idea. As I intend to read the book, I may work on this too. If other french speaker want to contribute we can join efforts to do this. Lo?c On Mar 16, 2009, at 9:10 PM, Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > On Mon, 16 Mar 2009, Johannes Kreidler wrote: > >> I am pleased to announce that the big pd tutorial I wrote in the >> last years with the help of a grant by the Music University of >> Freiburg / Germany, is now online, in english and in german. > > Wow. But, are there plans for a French translation? If there were > one by the time I teach the next pd workshop, then I would make it > required reading... and if I end up not teaching, I'd get other > teachers to make it required reading... if they wouldn't already do > that. Really, I think that plenty of people in my city could enjoy > that book, and would enjoy it more if it were in French. > > _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... > | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, > Qu?bec_______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From hard.off at gmail.com Wed Mar 18 11:03:56 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 19:03:56 +0900 Subject: [PD] a simple counter, I'm not able to do it tonight In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903180300mdd38093s121b2c800463ddc5@mail.gmail.com> References: <161320dd0903180222o5ca2d137y7c395c5751721edb@mail.gmail.com> <49C0C589.5070401@umatic.nl> <161320dd0903180300mdd38093s121b2c800463ddc5@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <161320dd0903180303x301177b5v1a446f968b890672@mail.gmail.com> if it is a problem to use [wrap], this should also work: [bang( | [f 100]x[+ 1] | [mod 200] | [- 100] | [abs] -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From zmoelnig at iem.at Wed Mar 18 11:08:02 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 11:08:02 +0100 Subject: [PD] a simple counter, I'm not able to do it tonight In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903180300mdd38093s121b2c800463ddc5@mail.gmail.com> References: <161320dd0903180222o5ca2d137y7c395c5751721edb@mail.gmail.com> <49C0C589.5070401@umatic.nl> <161320dd0903180300mdd38093s121b2c800463ddc5@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49C0C802.1010804@iem.at> hard off wrote: > really? > > i mean the [wrap] that wraps numbers between two values. there are different versions of [wrap] around. the one from zexy wraps between to arbitrary boundaries. the one that comes with Pd (>0.42), behaves like [wrap~] as it only wraps between 0 and 1 (which is the default for zexy's wrap as well). there are more wrap implementations around in various other libraries. fgamsdr IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From derek at umatic.nl Wed Mar 18 11:47:57 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 10:47:57 +0000 Subject: [PD] a simple counter, I'm not able to do it tonight In-Reply-To: <49C0C802.1010804@iem.at> References: <161320dd0903180222o5ca2d137y7c395c5751721edb@mail.gmail.com> <49C0C589.5070401@umatic.nl> <161320dd0903180300mdd38093s121b2c800463ddc5@mail.gmail.com> <49C0C802.1010804@iem.at> Message-ID: <49C0D15D.80304@umatic.nl> Yes, that's what I was trying to point out. I've been bitten by different versions of [wrap] before. I guess that has been cleaned up with the 0.42 release... D. IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: > hard off wrote: >> really? >> >> i mean the [wrap] that wraps numbers between two values. > > there are different versions of [wrap] around. > the one from zexy wraps between to arbitrary boundaries. > > the one that comes with Pd (>0.42), behaves like [wrap~] as it only > wraps between 0 and 1 (which is the default for zexy's wrap as well). > > there are more wrap implementations around in various other libraries. > > fgamsdr > IOhannes -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 14: "Ask people to work against their better judgement" From jack at rybn.org Wed Mar 18 12:20:22 2009 From: jack at rybn.org (Jack) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 12:20:22 +0100 Subject: [PD] a simple counter, I'm not able to do it tonight In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <637A0870-94C1-4F7C-8945-C83F3EE0C96F@rybn.org> Hello Husk, Look at this. Hope it will help you. ++ Jack -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: counterUPandDOWN.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 453 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- Le 18 mars 09 ? 05:16, Husk 00 a ?crit : > Hi list, > I need a little help. > I'm using an up-down counter. It has a min and a max limit: 0 and > 100 (for say something). > I don't like my solution and i know there is a easier way to do it; > but tonight I can't find it :( > So, someone can help me with a rapid solution? > thanks in advance > Husk > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/ > listinfo/pd-list From jmmmpais at googlemail.com Wed Mar 18 12:49:51 2009 From: jmmmpais at googlemail.com (=?utf-8?Q?Jo=C3=A3o_Pais?=) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 11:49:51 -0000 Subject: [PD] (yet another) www.pd-tutorial.com In-Reply-To: <161a0b1e0903171809n309b0786g12b9ad985d211791@mail.gmail.com> References: <161a0b1e0903171809n309b0786g12b9ad985d211791@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Eu posso dar uma olhada, assim que tiver tempo. > Congratulations! It is certainly something we need. > In Fact, I am doing a book myself :) > > and I am about to share it. > > I got it in Portuguese for now. Who wants to take a peak? :) > > I present topics such as: *Wavetable Synthesis - DC Offset ? Modulation > (Amplitude, Ring, Frequency, Pulse Width) ? Additive/Subtractive > Synthesis - > Filters ? WaveShaping - Spectral Analisys (FFT/Resynthesis) - > Convolution & > Convolution Reverb - Vocoder, Cross Synthesis - Phase Vocoder*. > > Gladly, it is a different proposal, so johannes book, as well as Miller's > and Floss Manuals all are complementary publications. > > Talking about Phase Vocoder is an attempt to make it more accessible > than in > Miller's book, in a sense that I wish to reach people with no Background > in > Computer Science. I dont emphasize much on programing and implementing > things in Puredata, so books like johanes' are definately handy... > > I like the part on Convolution, as it is not covered in other pd books I > guess. > > Actually, I would really like to discuss this with you people. > > I must say we need to improve Pdpedia and commit to this project as a > comunity. I can handle the Portuguese and English part. > > Lets better promote Pd by publishing about it! :) > > Cheers -- Friedenstr. 58 10249 Berlin (Deutschland) Tel +49 30 42020091 | Mob +49 162 6843570 jmmmpais at googlemail.com | skype: jmmmpjmmmp From claudiusmaximus at goto10.org Wed Mar 18 12:57:29 2009 From: claudiusmaximus at goto10.org (Claude Heiland-Allen) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 11:57:29 +0000 Subject: [PD] couldnt create pdp In-Reply-To: <7F7E0FFA-DC9F-4336-A908-4B9A1BC85307@eds.org> References: <4f424f350903170833h58003e7fjec6aac6ea43aa8d6@mail.gmail.com> <4f424f350903170836s13efb9dbjaf58813777e3ab62@mail.gmail.com> <7F7E0FFA-DC9F-4336-A908-4B9A1BC85307@eds.org> Message-ID: <49C0E1A9.8010701@goto10.org> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > Worst comes to worst, Pd and Pd-extended runs best on Debian-based > distros like Debian, Ubuntu, pure:dyne, etc. > > .hc pd-extended might work on pure:dyne (after all, it's Debian with extra packages), but it won't ever be in the live distro, and installing it will remove all the supported pd externals from pure:dyne (they depend on puredata, which pd-extended conflicts with, or should if it has been packaged properly). One of the main reasonings behind Pd in pure:dyne is to package each library on its own, to avoid both the maintenance nightmares of a huge package build system and the tricky timing involved to get "all externals working at once". Each package can be tested separately and upgraded separately, increasing quality and saving bandwidth. BTW, pure:dyne has packages for pdp + friends, with no pdp_metro_setup issue: $ nm -D /usr/lib/pd/extra/pdp/pdp.pd_linux | grep metro 0000f9f0 T pdp_metro_setup So I guess the original issue is another pd-extended bug. Claude -- http://claudiusmaximus.goto10.org http://puredyne.goto10.org From johnharrisonwsu at gmail.com Wed Mar 18 14:01:14 2009 From: johnharrisonwsu at gmail.com (John Harrison) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 08:01:14 -0500 Subject: [PD] pdp_rec In-Reply-To: <48F733DC.5050308@gmail.com> References: <49712.AQNUVV0DXnY=.1224140520.squirrel@webmail.no-log.org> <48F733DC.5050308@gmail.com> Message-ID: <7aa995dd0903180601me8db830kec70a598e733f2d3@mail.gmail.com> If nobody is going to fix the jpeg codec for pdp_rec~, could that codec be removed? It gives no errors, appears to work, the frames advance, but the recordings don't come out. This email thread shows this has been a known problem for some time now and there is no intention to fix it. A student and I just lost some time working on her non-trivial patch and the problem was that she was using the jpeg codec with pdp_rec~. We didn't have a lot of clues to work with to diagnose the problem. If we do not wish to remove the codec entirely, perhaps a warning might show up on the pd console that the jpeg codec is buggy/not supported. Thanks for considering, -John On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 7:30 AM, ydegoyon wrote: > ola, > > yes, i noticed that, > only divx works now with this > &%!###%%!! libquicktime. > > it will not be fixed, not by me, > record in ogg/theora ( pdp_theorout~ ), > there you can set every parameters you like. > > saludos, > sevy > > > vincent.rioux at no-log.org wrote: > > hi, > > is there a way to set divx rate for pdp_rec object? > > i found that recording in jpeg format on pd-extended/hardy was not > working > > unfortunately. > > > > vincent > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ydegoyon at gmail.com Wed Mar 18 14:01:27 2009 From: ydegoyon at gmail.com (ydegoyon at gmail.com) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 14:01:27 +0100 Subject: [PD] pidip compilation problem In-Reply-To: <49C0C36F.3090707@anorg.net> References: <49BEC1D9.2050707@anorg.net> <49BF0678.2030101@gmail.com> <49BF879D.7040905@anorg.net> <49BF90E0.5050404@iem.at> <49BFA080.9060807@anorg.net> <49BFA51B.8000402@iem.at> <49BFACEF.4070503@anorg.net> <49C00A0E.4070409@gmail.com> <49C01629.5060604@gmail.com> <49C0C36F.3090707@anorg.net> Message-ID: <49C0F0A7.7020102@gmail.com> marc widmer wrote: > hi list & yves > > i tested my old patches and everything looks ok, beside a warning in > the shell, that base64 is missing, is this important? > so far everything worked. you need tcllib then, it is used in pdp_colorgrid to load a base64 encoded background image. of course, if you don't use pdp_colorgrid, no need for it. > > i changed c_track in the source, so that it checks not one point, but > a matrix of points. at the moment all these points > are with fixed offset between each other. from pd i just set the start > coordinates. furthermore i do check not the color > of one pixel, but of all surrounding points (9 in total) and calculate > the average. i do this to avoid tracking flickering pixel > noises which sometimes occur when i grap video from my surveillance > color cams. > scary, the name at least. > at the moment this is rather a hack of your source then a proper > enhancement, but maybe, if you think this could be usefull, > a module lik c_track_matrix could be a goal. where one can send a list > with coordinates to track and the area space > surrounding that point. well, if you can send the modified version and a proper help patch with it, i could integrate it one day.. > > i haven't checked the development of pidip since a while, maybe now > there is already a better way to do this. > there's not so much development going on in pidip, and even less in pdp. it's almost the same version than in 2004. > all the best > marc > From zmoelnig at iem.at Wed Mar 18 14:23:07 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 14:23:07 +0100 Subject: [PD] pdp_rec In-Reply-To: <7aa995dd0903180601me8db830kec70a598e733f2d3@mail.gmail.com> References: <49712.AQNUVV0DXnY=.1224140520.squirrel@webmail.no-log.org> <48F733DC.5050308@gmail.com> <7aa995dd0903180601me8db830kec70a598e733f2d3@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49C0F5BB.8080107@iem.at> John Harrison wrote: > If nobody is going to fix the jpeg codec for pdp_rec~, could that codec be > removed? It gives no errors, appears to work, the frames advance, but the > recordings don't come out. This email thread shows this has been a known > problem for some time now and there is no intention to fix it. > > A student and I just lost some time working on her non-trivial patch and the > problem was that she was using the jpeg codec with pdp_rec~. We didn't have > a lot of clues to work with to diagnose the problem. > > If we do not wish to remove the codec entirely, perhaps a warning might show > up on the pd console that the jpeg codec is buggy/not supported. > without having a full understanding of the problem, i somehow doubt that the problem is really in pdp/pidip but rather within libquicktime. putting a warning in the calling application might be even more confusing, once the codec get's fixed upstream. filtering for a certain codec can also be confusing, since the codec-names are dynamically extracted from what libquicktime offers, and thus can change by simply installing/upgrading a certain plugin. of course this doesn't help you with your problem. fga,sdr IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From ydegoyon at gmail.com Wed Mar 18 15:35:09 2009 From: ydegoyon at gmail.com (ydegoyon at gmail.com) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 15:35:09 +0100 Subject: [PD] pdp_rec In-Reply-To: <7aa995dd0903180601me8db830kec70a598e733f2d3@mail.gmail.com> References: <49712.AQNUVV0DXnY=.1224140520.squirrel@webmail.no-log.org> <48F733DC.5050308@gmail.com> <7aa995dd0903180601me8db830kec70a598e733f2d3@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49C1069D.1030703@gmail.com> ola, all we can do on that respect is to set the default codec to divx, which i did int the svn/trunk.. xiao, sevy John Harrison wrote: > If nobody is going to fix the jpeg codec for pdp_rec~, could that > codec be removed? It gives no errors, appears to work, the frames > advance, but the recordings don't come out. This email thread shows > this has been a known problem for some time now and there is no > intention to fix it. > > A student and I just lost some time working on her non-trivial patch > and the problem was that she was using the jpeg codec with pdp_rec~. > We didn't have a lot of clues to work with to diagnose the problem. > > If we do not wish to remove the codec entirely, perhaps a warning > might show up on the pd console that the jpeg codec is buggy/not > supported. > > Thanks for considering, > > -John > > On Thu, Oct 16, 2008 at 7:30 AM, ydegoyon > wrote: > > ola, > > yes, i noticed that, > only divx works now with this > &%!###%%!! libquicktime. > > it will not be fixed, not by me, > record in ogg/theora ( pdp_theorout~ ), > there you can set every parameters you like. > > saludos, > sevy > > > vincent.rioux at no-log.org wrote: > > hi, > > is there a way to set divx rate for pdp_rec object? > > i found that recording in jpeg format on pd-extended/hardy was > not working > > unfortunately. > > > > vincent > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > From matju at artengine.ca Wed Mar 18 16:24:46 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 11:24:46 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] variance from mapping library In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Wed, 18 Mar 2009, Oded Ben-Tal wrote: > when using variance (from mapping library) - I get negative numbers. > Since variance is supposed to be always positive and I don't see > anything wrong in the way the abstraction is done, I presume there is > something I'm missing. My impression is that small changes in the input > translate to negative 'variance' Is it really a negative number, or is it more like 9.74915e-05 ? In the latter case, only the exponent is negative, which means 9.74915/10/10/10/10/10 = 0.0000974915, whereas with a plus sign like 1.2e+06 would mean 1.2*10*10*10*10*10*10 = 1200000. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From kyleklip at gmail.com Wed Mar 18 16:37:28 2009 From: kyleklip at gmail.com (Kyle Klipowicz) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 10:37:28 -0500 Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com In-Reply-To: <20090318083844.GB23568@footils.org> References: <49BEA495.8060106@gmx.de> <20090316210312.10227980.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> <20090317064237.GA19437@footils.org> <20090318081717.GA30597@fliwatut.scifi> <20090318083844.GB23568@footils.org> Message-ID: Cool! I'll have fun playing with these examples. Thanks for the toot. ~Kyle On Wed, Mar 18, 2009 at 3:38 AM, Frank Barknecht wrote: > Hallo, > Frank Barknecht hat gesagt: // Frank Barknecht wrote: > > > - inversion: That's a bit more complicated. Quoting Wikipedia: > > > > Inverted melodies > > > > When applied to melodies, the inversion of a given melody is the > > melody turned upside-down. For instance, if the original melody has a > > rising major third (see interval), the inverted melody has a falling > > major third (or perhaps more likely, in tonal music, a falling minor > > third, or even some other falling interval). Similarly, in twelve-tone > > technique, the inversion of the tone row is the so-called prime series > > turned upside-down. > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inversion_(music)#Inverted_melodies > > > > In inversion.pd this is realised by walking through the list with > > list-map, taking the difference between the current element and the > > previous element, then substracting this from the current element. > > The first element in a list is treated specially as it has no > > previous element (it's just copied). > > Ah, sorry: The patch is correct, but my explanation is wrong. Here's an > update: > > > In inversion.pd this is realised by walking through the list with > list-map. The > interval to use next is calculated by taking the difference between the > current > element and the previous element. This interval is substracted (not added, > because we are "retro"-grading) from the previous note, the resulting note > is > stored for the next step and inserted into the result list. The first > element > in a list is treated specially as it has no previous element: it's just > copied > and used as the starting note. > > Ciao > -- > Frank > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -- ----- ------------ ---- ----- ---- -------- - ------ http://perhapsidid.wordpress.com http://myspace.com/kyleklipowicz -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From brbrofsvl at gmail.com Wed Mar 18 17:38:56 2009 From: brbrofsvl at gmail.com (Matt Barber) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 12:38:56 -0400 Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com Message-ID: > Ah, sorry: The patch is correct, but my explanation is wrong. Here's an update: > > > ?In inversion.pd this is realised by walking through the list with list-map. The > ?interval to use next is calculated by taking the difference between the current > ?element and the previous element. This interval is substracted (not added, > ?because we are "retro"-grading) from the previous note, the resulting note is > ?stored for the next step and inserted into the result list. The first element > ?in a list is treated specially as it has no previous element: it's just copied > ?and used as the starting note. Frank and all, Attached is an inversion.pd which is a bit simpler -- usually when inverting in pitch (rather than pitch-class) it's easier/simpler/better to invert with respect to an axis of symmetry rather than with respect to the first pitch in the series (of course you can assign the first pitch as the axis). Meanwhile, if you're doing this with pitch-class instead of pitch (in other words transposing and inverting in a mod 12 universe, which is what you would probably be doing with 12-tone rows before assigning specific registers), instead of inverting with respect to an axis of symmetry, you invert with respect to the sum of the two pitch-classes in the original and inverted row -- sometimes called the "index" of inversion. The group theory is even cleaner if you think of transposition as an addition operator and inversion as a multiplication operator (in this case multiplication by 11, mod 12). If you're doing mod 12 operations, there is one more pitch operator -- multiplication by 5 or 7 -- which maps the chromatic scale to the circle of fifths and vice-versa. Then you can think of retrogression as "order inversion," and rotation, the other standard order-position operator, as "order transposition." If you think it would be useful I can put together the standard 12-tone operators in mod 12 (or for that matter, an assignable modulus), but of course specific register information disappears. A more interesting but more difficult project would be to write a list abstraction to output the set-class of a given set of pitches, with an assignable modulus. Matt -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: inversion.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 584 bytes Desc: not available URL: From bbakersmith at gmail.com Wed Mar 18 20:38:44 2009 From: bbakersmith at gmail.com (Ben Baker-Smith) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 14:38:44 -0500 Subject: [PD] a simple counter, I'm not able to do it tonight Message-ID: So you want a counter that counts to 100 and then begins at 0 (or 1) again? If I'm understanding correctly I would do the following: [bang( | [float]X[+ 1] | [select 100] | [0( the 0 message at the end could also be a 1 depending on if you want the counter to begin on 0 or 1, it is sent to the right inlet of float. the outlet of float is, in addition to [select], also sent wherever you want the counter to be output to. here is the same patch as a subpatch (keeping in mind that the 0 message still must be connected to the right inlet of float): [inlet] | [b] | [float]X[+ 1] | \ | [outlet] | [select 100] | [0( ...of course you can always use the [counter] object. [counter 100] will probably do the trick all by itself. and finally, if i'm understanding incorrectly and you wanted it to count up and back down, use the example that was posted previously with the absolute values and [wrap], or use [counter 100] with the up/down message sent to it, you'll have to check the help file for exactly what that message is... hope something in there helps. -Ben -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From geoffspuredata at googlemail.com Wed Mar 18 20:42:08 2009 From: geoffspuredata at googlemail.com (Geoff) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 19:42:08 +0000 Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <0D76B3D8-1E30-4CDE-99BF-52AAD10B1FCA@gmail.com> A wonderful book. I have emailed the link to many. Thankyou for providing a wonderful resource Geoff From fbar at footils.org Wed Mar 18 20:53:46 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 20:53:46 +0100 Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20090318195346.GB25895@fliwatut.scifi> Hallo Matt, Matt Barber hat gesagt: // Matt Barber wrote: > Attached is an inversion.pd which is a bit simpler -- usually when > inverting in pitch (rather than pitch-class) it's > easier/simpler/better to invert with respect to an axis of symmetry > rather than with respect to the first pitch in the series (of course > you can assign the first pitch as the axis). Ah, that's much simpler indeed - and thanks a lot for your other explanations. I updated the code on http://footils.org/pkg/list-compose.tgz to include this as inversion-axis.pd and made the old inversion.pd a wrapper around this, which set the first note as the inversion axis. (I made a little change to save the multiplication by 2 by using [swap] and a loadbang.) > If you think it would be useful I can put together the standard > 12-tone operators in mod 12 (or for that matter, an assignable > modulus), but of course specific register information disappears. A > more interesting but more difficult project would be to write a list > abstraction to output the set-class of a given set of pitches, with an > assignable modulus. I think, that would be an interesting project. I took the patches in my example from my port of KHz Essl's RTC lib (in row-modus.pd). Myself I'm not *that* familiar with 12-tone theory ... Ciao -- Frank Barknecht Do You RjDj.me? _ ______footils.org__ From jancsika at yahoo.com Wed Mar 18 21:02:24 2009 From: jancsika at yahoo.com (Jonathan Wilkes) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 13:02:24 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] dynamic creation arguments for route In-Reply-To: <20090318082735.GA23568@footils.org> Message-ID: <839655.69302.qm@web65607.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Dynaroute does something different than sroute-- you can send a list to its right inlet to change any or all of the creation arguments. You could also simply change the word "route" to "select" in the guts of the abstraction and have a "dynaselect," which might be handy for quickly setting key bindings. -Jonathan --- On Wed, 3/18/09, Frank Barknecht wrote: > From: Frank Barknecht > Subject: Re: [PD] dynamic creation arguments for route > To: pd-list at iem.at > Date: Wednesday, March 18, 2009, 9:27 AM > Hallo, > > also see [sroute] which is a hidden leftover in the > [list]-abs collection. > > The idea is to use a one-argument [select] instead of > [route]. [select] with no > or one argument has an additional inlet, where you can set > the thing it > selects. Decorate this with some [list split 1] and [list] > objects and you have > a simple settable [route]. No dynamic patching or externals > necessary. > > Ciao > -- > Frank > > Jonathan Wilkes hat gesagt: // Jonathan Wilkes wrote: > > > I built a settable route abstraction using dynamic > patching. It requires [initbang], which is missing in > pd-vanilla, so you'll need pd-ext if you want to use it. > > > > Let me know how it works if you try it. > > > > -Jonathan > > > > --- On Tue, 3/17/09, Ingo Scherzinger > wrote: > > > > > From: Ingo Scherzinger > > > Subject: Re: [PD] dynamic creation arguments for > route > > > To: pd-list at iem.at > > > Date: Tuesday, March 17, 2009, 5:25 PM > > > >Is is possible to dynamically alter the > creation > > > arguments for a route > > > > > > >object? > > > > > > > > > > > > [maxlib/nroute] can do that. The only difference > to [route] > > > is that it > > > doesn't eliminate the value that is routed. > This is > > > because it can be set to > > > any location of the list that's coming in. > > > > > > > > > > > > Ingo > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > > > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > > > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From bigswift at cox.net Wed Mar 18 15:18:22 2009 From: bigswift at cox.net (bigswift at cox.net) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 10:18:22 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] pdp_rec Message-ID: <12976609.38447.1237385902988.JavaMail.bigswift@127.0.0.1> There is definitely some bug in it regardless of where it comes from. While the ."mov" plays on linux in other O/s Quicktime complains of "BAD PUBLIC ATOM" the workaround is to set pdp_rec~ to use divx pp Patrick Pagano Digital Media Engineer Digital Worlds Institute University of Florida On Wed, Mar 18, 2009 at 10:16 AM , IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: > John Harrison wrote: >> If nobody is going to fix the jpeg codec for pdp_rec~, could that >> codec be >> removed? It gives no errors, appears to work, the frames advance, but >> the >> recordings don't come out. This email thread shows this has been a >> known >> problem for some time now and there is no intention to fix it. >> >> A student and I just lost some time working on her non-trivial patch >> and the >> problem was that she was using the jpeg codec with pdp_rec~. We >> didn't have >> a lot of clues to work with to diagnose the problem. >> >> If we do not wish to remove the codec entirely, perhaps a warning >> might show >> up on the pd console that the jpeg codec is buggy/not supported. >> > > without having a full understanding of the problem, i somehow doubt > that the problem is really in pdp/pidip but rather within > libquicktime. > putting a warning in the calling application might be even more > confusing, once the codec get's fixed upstream. > filtering for a certain codec can also be confusing, since the > codec-names are dynamically extracted from what libquicktime offers, > and thus can change by simply installing/upgrading a certain plugin. > > of course this doesn't help you with your problem. > > fga,sdr > IOhannes > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From hans at eds.org Thu Mar 19 01:27:51 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 00:27:51 +0000 Subject: [PD] couldnt create pdp In-Reply-To: <49C0E1A9.8010701@goto10.org> References: <4f424f350903170833h58003e7fjec6aac6ea43aa8d6@mail.gmail.com> <4f424f350903170836s13efb9dbjaf58813777e3ab62@mail.gmail.com> <7F7E0FFA-DC9F-4336-A908-4B9A1BC85307@eds.org> <49C0E1A9.8010701@goto10.org> Message-ID: On Mar 18, 2009, at 11:57 AM, Claude Heiland-Allen wrote: > Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >> Worst comes to worst, Pd and Pd-extended runs best on Debian-based >> distros like Debian, Ubuntu, pure:dyne, etc. >> .hc > > pd-extended might work on pure:dyne (after all, it's Debian with > extra packages), but it won't ever be in the live distro, and > installing it will remove all the supported pd externals from > pure:dyne (they depend on puredata, which pd-extended conflicts > with, or should if it has been packaged properly). > > One of the main reasonings behind Pd in pure:dyne is to package each > library on its own, to avoid both the maintenance nightmares of a > huge package build system and the tricky timing involved to get "all > externals working at once". Each package can be tested separately > and upgraded separately, increasing quality and saving bandwidth. I think that's the way that Pd-extended should be packaged for Debian too. The monolithic package is not a good design, but was easy to do. We were talking a while back about merging efforts, I think it would be great to revisit that discussion. Then the next step would be getting those packages into Debian. It seems Guenter has stopped updating his Debian packages, 'puredata' is at 0.40.3, pd-externals is no longer in the repo, etc. > BTW, pure:dyne has packages for pdp + friends, with no > pdp_metro_setup issue: > > $ nm -D /usr/lib/pd/extra/pdp/pdp.pd_linux | grep metro > 0000f9f0 T pdp_metro_setup > > So I guess the original issue is another pd-extended bug. Yeah, on Fedora only though. I don't use Fedora at all so I am at a loss. PDP works fine in Pd-extended on Ubuntu and Debian. .hc > > > > Claude > -- > http://claudiusmaximus.goto10.org > http://puredyne.goto10.org ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- All mankind is of one author, and is one volume; when one man dies, one chapter is not torn out of the book, but translated into a better language; and every chapter must be so translated.... -John Donne From paulfinn81 at gmail.com Thu Mar 19 01:56:24 2009 From: paulfinn81 at gmail.com (Paul Finn) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 00:56:24 +0000 Subject: [PD] couldnt create pdp In-Reply-To: References: <4f424f350903170833h58003e7fjec6aac6ea43aa8d6@mail.gmail.com> <4f424f350903170836s13efb9dbjaf58813777e3ab62@mail.gmail.com> <7F7E0FFA-DC9F-4336-A908-4B9A1BC85307@eds.org> <49C0E1A9.8010701@goto10.org> Message-ID: <4E32747A-00E3-4BB4-B051-D24CD56471B1@gmail.com> The prognosis was meagative on my two recent fedora excursions, f8 and f10. Pd would work fine but most extended specific obects couldn't be created. I lost a lot of time figuring this out. Moved to ubuntu today. Much happier now. With this new tutorial manual there are a few total beginner things that I've learned the hard way that could be included. There is no reason not to consolidate info. Small links with basic info get lost in most scene/communities I find. My two cents. ~_.~*fine*~._~ On 19 Mar 2009, at 00:27, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > On Mar 18, 2009, at 11:57 AM, Claude Heiland-Allen wrote: > >> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >>> Worst comes to worst, Pd and Pd-extended runs best on Debian-based >>> distros like Debian, Ubuntu, pure:dyne, etc. >>> .hc >> >> pd-extended might work on pure:dyne (after all, it's Debian with >> extra packages), but it won't ever be in the live distro, and >> installing it will remove all the supported pd externals from >> pure:dyne (they depend on puredata, which pd-extended conflicts >> with, or should if it has been packaged properly). >> >> One of the main reasonings behind Pd in pure:dyne is to package >> each library on its own, to avoid both the maintenance nightmares >> of a huge package build system and the tricky timing involved to >> get "all externals working at once". Each package can be tested >> separately and upgraded separately, increasing quality and saving >> bandwidth. > > I think that's the way that Pd-extended should be packaged for > Debian too. The monolithic package is not a good design, but was > easy to do. We were talking a while back about merging efforts, I > think it would be great to revisit that discussion. > > Then the next step would be getting those packages into Debian. It > seems Guenter has stopped updating his Debian packages, 'puredata' > is at 0.40.3, pd-externals is no longer in the repo, etc. > >> BTW, pure:dyne has packages for pdp + friends, with no >> pdp_metro_setup issue: >> >> $ nm -D /usr/lib/pd/extra/pdp/pdp.pd_linux | grep metro >> 0000f9f0 T pdp_metro_setup >> >> So I guess the original issue is another pd-extended bug. > > Yeah, on Fedora only though. I don't use Fedora at all so I am at a > loss. PDP works fine in Pd-extended on Ubuntu and Debian. > > .hc > >> >> >> >> Claude >> -- >> http://claudiusmaximus.goto10.org >> http://puredyne.goto10.org > > > > > --- > --- > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > All mankind is of one author, and is one volume; when one man dies, > one chapter is not torn out of the book, but translated into a > better language; and every chapter must be so translated.... -John > Donne > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From nacho at discosinvisibles.org Wed Mar 18 07:15:57 2009 From: nacho at discosinvisibles.org (nacho at discosinvisibles.org) Date: Wed, 18 Mar 2009 02:15:57 -0400 Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com In-Reply-To: <9F9592A8-8120-4E13-BDDE-037F9C421EFC@eds.org> References: <10947_1237232807_ZZ0KGM008WN6XTG7.00_mailman.17.1237232552.26945.pd-list@iem.at> <9F9592A8-8120-4E13-BDDE-037F9C421EFC@eds.org> Message-ID: <20090318021557.oe0n4z8l8gswwgkw@www.discosinvisibles.org> Hey Johannes, is the englixh version also available for purchase? The book is great. I'll use parts of it on a Pd workshop in Tijuana next week. Saludos. Ignacio/ Quoting Hans-Christoph Steiner : > > Looks good, a nice surprise, I didn't even realize you were writing > it. I added this to my class syllabus site, I'll let you know what > the students say. > > Koray, a PID would be a fun book to write, I am up for it! First lets > get the FLOSS manuals Pure Data book out there. > > .hc > > > On Mar 17, 2009, at 7:59 AM, Koray Tahiroglu wrote: > >> >> Congratulations Johannes, >> >> This book will definitely be a bonus teaching material together >> with Miller's book for the computer generated music course that I >> am planning to teach next autumn. I had already involved Andy's >> book for the Sound design ( + a bit physics of sound ) course. Now >> lets hope that they will add these courses in the next curriculum >> :) and I guess there is one book we are still seeking at the >> moment that focuses Physical Interaction Design, the same way as >> Johannes' book. Earlier together with Hans we developed PID course >> materials, and his latest work embedding firmata in arduino >> library hopefully will bring up more Pd examples, and maybe later >> we will have another book. What do you think about this Hans? That >> would be great :) >> >> >> Koray >> >> >> >> On Mar 16, 2009, at 9:42 PM, pd-list-request at iem.at wrote: >> >>> Message: 4 >>> Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 20:12:21 +0100 >>> From: Johannes Kreidler >>> Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com >>> To: pd-list at iem.at >>> Message-ID: <49BEA495.8060106 at gmx.de> >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed >>> >>> hi list, >>> >>> I am pleased to announce that the big pd tutorial I wrote in the last >>> years with the help of a grant by the Music University of Freiburg / >>> Germany, is now online, in english and in german. >>> >>> It is also available as a book (paperback) at Wolke Publishing House, >>> where the "bang" book was released. >>> >>> At the moment, Amazon says that it's not available, which is strange >>> because it's definitely released, but at least it can be purchased at >>> the Publishing House itself. >>> >>> http://www.pd-tutorial.com >>> >>> http://www.wolke-verlag.de/musik_u_t/loadbang.html >>> >>> http://www.buecher-zur-musik.de/assets/s2dmain.html?http://www.buecher-zur-musik.de/53108697370a2cb3f/5310869bc400a7a02.html >>> >>> http://www.amazon.de/Loadbang-Programming-Electronic-Music-Pure/dp/3936000573/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&s=books-intl-de&qid=1235853524&sr=8-3 >>> >>> Cheers >>> Johannes >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------- >> M.Koray Tahiroglu >> Acoustics Lab / TKK >> http://mlab.taik.fi/~korayt >> http://www.acoustics.hut.fi/~ktahirog/ >> tel: +358 45 233 6272 >> >> >> >> > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > All mankind is of one author, and is one volume; when one man dies, > one chapter is not torn out of the book, but translated into a better > language; and every chapter must be so translated.... -John Donne From jkreidler at gmx.de Thu Mar 19 08:18:35 2009 From: jkreidler at gmx.de (Johannes Kreidler) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 08:18:35 +0100 Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial In-Reply-To: <49C1F0FA.8000602@gmx.de> References: <49C1F0FA.8000602@gmx.de> Message-ID: <49C1F1CB.4040403@gmx.de> hi Nacho, The paperback is in english and can be purchased here: http://www.buecher-zur-musik.de/assets/s2dmain.html?http://www.buecher-zur-musik.de/53108697370a2cb3f/5310869bc400a7a02.html (unfortunately the language of that book store is german; Though it is sent to Amazon, they don't update their site). Alle the Patches are available as a zip file: http://www.kreidler-net.de/pd/patches/patches.zip Cheers Johannes Johannes Kreidler wrote: > Hey Johannes, > is the englixh version also available for purchase? > The book is great. I'll use parts of it on a Pd workshop in Tijuana next > week. > Saludos. > > Ignacio/ > > > Quoting Hans-Christoph Steiner : > > > > > Looks good, a nice surprise, I didn't even realize you were writing > > it. I added this to my class syllabus site, I'll let you know what > > the students say. > > > > Koray, a PID would be a fun book to write, I am up for it! First lets > > get the FLOSS manuals Pure Data book out there. > > > > .hc > > > > > > On Mar 17, 2009, at 7:59 AM, Koray Tahiroglu wrote: > > > >> > >> Congratulations Johannes, > >> > >> This book will definitely be a bonus teaching material together > >> with Miller's book for the computer generated music course that I > >> am planning to teach next autumn. I had already involved Andy's > >> book for the Sound design ( + a bit physics of sound ) course. Now > >> lets hope that they will add these courses in the next curriculum > >> :) and I guess there is one book we are still seeking at the > >> moment that focuses Physical Interaction Design, the same way as > >> Johannes' book. Earlier together with Hans we developed PID course > >> materials, and his latest work embedding firmata in arduino > >> library hopefully will bring up more Pd examples, and maybe later > >> we will have another book. What do you think about this Hans? That > >> would be great :) > >> > >> > >> Koray > >> > >> > >> > >> On Mar 16, 2009, at 9:42 PM, pd-list-request at iem.at wrote: > >> > >>> Message: 4 > >>> Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 20:12:21 +0100 > >>> From: Johannes Kreidler > >>> Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com > >>> To: pd-list at iem.at > >>> Message-ID: <49BEA495.8060106 at gmx.de> > >>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed > >>> > >>> hi list, > >>> > >>> I am pleased to announce that the big pd tutorial I wrote in the last > >>> years with the help of a grant by the Music University of Freiburg / > >>> Germany, is now online, in english and in german. > >>> > >>> It is also available as a book (paperback) at Wolke Publishing House, > >>> where the "bang" book was released. > >>> > >>> At the moment, Amazon says that it's not available, which is strange > >>> because it's definitely released, but at least it can be purchased at > >>> the Publishing House itself. > >>> > >>> http://www.pd-tutorial.com > >>> > >>> http://www.wolke-verlag.de/musik_u_t/loadbang.html > >>> > >>> > http://www.buecher-zur-musik.de/assets/s2dmain.html?http://www.buecher-zur-musik.de/53108697370a2cb3f/5310869bc400a7a02.html > > >>> > >>> > http://www.amazon.de/Loadbang-Programming-Electronic-Music-Pure/dp/3936000573/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&s=books-intl-de&qid=1235853524&sr=8-3 > > >>> > >>> Cheers > >>> Johannes > >> > >> > >> > >> ------------------------------------- > >> M.Koray Tahiroglu > >> Acoustics Lab / TKK > >> http://mlab.taik.fi/~korayt > >> http://www.acoustics.hut.fi/~ktahirog/ > >> tel: +358 45 233 6272 > >> > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > All mankind is of one author, and is one volume; when one man dies, > > one chapter is not torn out of the book, but translated into a better > > language; and every chapter must be so translated.... -John Donne > From stffn at dibidut.dk Thu Mar 19 08:34:23 2009 From: stffn at dibidut.dk (Steffen Juul) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 08:34:23 +0100 Subject: [PD] wrap~ Message-ID: What is the largest integer not exceeding 0 (zero)? I've asked before, but I'll still like to know. Best, Steffen From hans at eds.org Thu Mar 19 09:07:15 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 08:07:15 +0000 Subject: [PD] GSoC Fwd: Thank you for your application References: <0015174c44585d0df204656ba7b6@google.com> Message-ID: Well, we didn't get accepted but now at least we do have a nice collection of projects for people to take on. http://socghop.appspot.com/program/accepted_orgs/google/gsoc2009 .hc Begin forwarded message: > From: socghop.noreply at gmail.com > Date: March 18, 2009 9:49:10 PM GMT > Subject: Thank you for your application > > Hi Hans-Christoph Steiner, > > Thank you for submitting "Pure Data (aka Pd)" organization > application to Google Summer of Code 2009. Unfortunately, we were > unable to accept your organization's application at this time. We > received many more applications for the program than we are able to > accommodate, and we would encourage you to reapply for future > instances of the program. > > Best regards, > Google Open Source Programs > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- "[T]he greatest purveyor of violence in the world today [is] my own government." - Martin Luther King, Jr. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From zmoelnig at iem.at Thu Mar 19 09:47:35 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 09:47:35 +0100 Subject: [PD] GSoC Fwd: Thank you for your application In-Reply-To: References: <0015174c44585d0df204656ba7b6@google.com> Message-ID: <49C206A7.90509@iem.at> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > Well, we didn't get accepted but now at least we do have a nice > collection of projects for people to take on. > > http://socghop.appspot.com/program/accepted_orgs/google/gsoc2009 any feedback on why? fgmadsr IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From devel at thesaddj.com Thu Mar 19 11:49:19 2009 From: devel at thesaddj.com (Marco Donnarumma) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 11:49:19 +0100 Subject: [PD] C::NTR::L - AV+physical computing processing In-Reply-To: <49BE9961.2010303@ucdavis.edu> References: <49BE9961.2010303@ucdavis.edu> Message-ID: Hi all, sorry for late reply but i'm having some day off to play a gig in Bristol. Thanks everybody for the feedback and interest. I will write personally to people interested in helping me, so we can organize. Much thanks! Meanwhile, here there is a link where to download C::NTR::L 1.2 beta: http://www.thesaddj.com/tempd/CNTRL1-2beta.zip I'm planning to publish download links and infos on my profile on Pd portal (apart from my website). Is there any other platform you could suggest me where to put C::NTR::L? What about the Pd section on SourceForge? I think an ftp structure would be the best. @Phil: the latency is 1/2ms, but it can change depending on the amplification of the instrument (it never becomes too bad). The analysis is pretty accurate, but still dirty. (this is one of the thing i would like to improve). With lower notes as you imagine, many harmonics are creating confusion in the analysis, you can still play pretty good, but you have to manage somehow this little dirtyness. and not to forget that i'm really grateful to Hardoff for his grannie-basher, reverb and distortion from his DIY library...really impressive tool. They are the core part of the audio processing. Talk soon... Marco On Mon, Mar 16, 2009 at 7:24 PM, Phil Stone wrote: > This is very impressive, Marco. What grabs me immediately is that you are > demo'ing with bass (nice Steiny or Hohner, btw) - lower-frequency > instruments are particularly difficult for pitch-detection. What is the > latency? It's hard to tell from the video, but it looks pretty responsive. > How accurate? > > I've been waiting a long time to plug my bass into my Pd stuff. I will be > happy to test anything, and also to help with the code cleanup, if it lies > within my area of competence. > > Nice work! > > > Phil Stone > www.pkstonemusic.com > > > Marco Donnarumma wrote: > >> Hi all, >> i'm really glad to share with the list my latest project, cause without >> the help of everybody here i wouldn't be able to speak about it now.. ;) >> C::NTR::L is a "software", naturally Pd-based, for audiovisual live >> performances exploiting physical computing. It transforms a standard musical >> instrument in an augmented tool to control real-time audio-video processing, >> without the need of any external device (damned expensive) or MIDI. You play >> your score and to each note is connected an audio, video or audiovisual fx, >> and you can connect whatever you want with whatever you desire. It's Pd! >> >> C::NTR::L is Cross-Platform for Mac, Linux and Windows (so far i've been >> able to keep the same patch working on all platform, too lucky...) >> By now it has been succesfully tested with electric bass guitar, guitar, >> piano (only two octaves working right now), accordion and trumpet. >> I conceived this project almost three years ago (when i was just starting >> to get aware of the existence of Pd). I was playing the bass guitar trying >> to control videos with resolume :( and sound with AudioMulch. wow.. i cannot >> figure out how! >> anyway, since my competences and passion for Pd grew up, i decided to make >> the whole project become a software for public use and to do it exclusively >> focusing on Pd. >> Today this is the result (I C::ntr::l Nature, my audiovisual performance >> for electric bass guitar and butterfly): >> >> http://vimeo.com/2225345 >> >> I sent out a call for beta-testers on the most used audiovisual-related >> forums (Pd forum too), i fixed most of the bugs and someone is planning to >> do things with my lil creature. >> Now I'm planning the public release of version 1.2 Beta in the end of >> this month (if i won't be eated by my everyday job). >> >> I'm writing to the list not only to let you know the news, but specially >> because i would like to know if there is anybody out there who has time and >> will to help me in the cleaning and further development of the code. >> Being a webdesigner, usability and accessiblity are my first aims. >> I've many ideas and many suggestions collected in my to-do list, but being >> alone, the development would be really slow, maybe even pointless. >> I would be glad to answer to all questions, technical, conceptual and >> more... and to explain more in depth how C::NTR::L is working. >> I know everybody is quite busy, infact i would be really glad also of some >> little help with some taks. >> >> I'm also developing a new interface trying to make C::NTR::L user-friendly >> for real. But this is another issue that i also would like to discuss about >> with the list. >> My idea, maybe pretty ingenuos, is to create a software for audiovisual >> performances so easy to use also for no-Pd'rs, that one would download Pd >> (and starting to familiarize with it) because of the interest towards >> C::NTR::L, or any other user-friendly software - unfortunately i don't see >> many around. >> For sure it wouldn't happen with millions of people, but maybe it could >> help in the spreading of Pd, and OS multimedia creation. >> >> further link (still have to update some contents, but....the most is >> there....) >> >> www.thesaddj.com/cntrl >> www.thesaddj.com/icontrolnature >> >> sorry for the very very long e-mail. >> best >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Marco Donnarumma aka The !S.A.D! >> >> >> >> Multimedia Artist, Live Performer >> Roma, IT >> >> LAB: http://www.thesaddj.com | http://www.flxer.net >> >> EVENT: http://www.liveperformersmeeting.net >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> >> > > > -- Marco Donnarumma aka The !S.A.D! Multimedia Artist, Live Performer Roma, IT LAB: http://www.thesaddj.com | http://www.flxer.net EVENT: http://www.liveperformersmeeting.net -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From oded at ccrma.Stanford.EDU Thu Mar 19 11:46:37 2009 From: oded at ccrma.Stanford.EDU (Oded Ben-Tal) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 03:46:37 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] variance from mapping library In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: > > Is it really a negative number, or is it more like 9.74915e-05 ? In the > latter case, only the exponent is negative, which means > 9.74915/10/10/10/10/10 = 0.0000974915, whereas with a plus sign like 1.2e+06 > would mean 1.2*10*10*10*10*10*10 = 1200000. > I am getting a negative number occasionally. Oded From oded at ccrma.Stanford.EDU Thu Mar 19 11:51:44 2009 From: oded at ccrma.Stanford.EDU (Oded Ben-Tal) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 03:51:44 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] sigmund~ env output Message-ID: should the output of: [sigmund~ env] be the same (or very similar) to the output of [env~] I think there is a typo in the help file (where env == notes). but I get pretty wild output from sigmund that bears no relation (that I can hear) to the input sound envelope. I'm using pd-extended 0.40.3 Oded ___________________________________________________ Oded Ben-Tal http://ccrma.stanford.edu/~oded oded at ccrma.stanford.edu From dmotd at gmx.net Thu Mar 19 12:13:49 2009 From: dmotd at gmx.net (dmotd) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 21:13:49 +1000 Subject: [PD] GSoC Fwd: Thank you for your application In-Reply-To: References: <0015174c44585d0df204656ba7b6@google.com> Message-ID: <200903192113.49457.dmotd@gmx.net> ahh, too bad.. this is obviously a template rejection notice, do they usually follow up this initial rejection with which criteria the organisation missed and which parts of the application need to be better addressed? it may just be the luck of the draw, but we are losing out to projects like scummvm - a virtual machine for playing video games from 1987! not that i have a problem with maniac mansion as such, but somethings gotta give! anyhow, good work to those responsible for putting the application together, i am sure with a bit of feedback and a little work, we will be a contender for next year. cheers, dmotd On Thursday 19 March 2009 18:07:15 Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > Well, we didn't get accepted but now at least we do have a nice > collection of projects for people to take on. > > http://socghop.appspot.com/program/accepted_orgs/google/gsoc2009 > > .hc > > Begin forwarded message: > > From: socghop.noreply at gmail.com > > Date: March 18, 2009 9:49:10 PM GMT > > Subject: Thank you for your application > > > > Hi Hans-Christoph Steiner, > > > > Thank you for submitting "Pure Data (aka Pd)" organization > > application to Google Summer of Code 2009. Unfortunately, we were > > unable to accept your organization's application at this time. We > > received many more applications for the program than we are able to > > accommodate, and we would encourage you to reapply for future > > instances of the program. > > > > Best regards, > > Google Open Source Programs > > --------------------------------------------------------------------------- >- > > "[T]he greatest purveyor of violence in the world today [is] my own > government." - Martin Luther King, Jr. From hans at eds.org Thu Mar 19 12:08:29 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 11:08:29 +0000 Subject: [PD] DIY GSoC: getting those projects done Message-ID: <774CBB5D-E9FE-44C6-B4A0-B37E543CC3C3@eds.org> So now we have a nice collection of projects sketched out from the GSoC application, let's encourage people to take them on. If anyone wants to get involved with Pd development, take a look at the project ideas and if you are interested, then ask about them on the list and we can get started. http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/GoogleSummerOfCodeIdeas2009 I think next time someone else should take on the GSoC application process. I'm 2 for 2 at not getting it, I've never had much luck with grants. And we have lots of well-sketched out projects. We should probably chuck the application part and start from scratch. .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- All mankind is of one author, and is one volume; when one man dies, one chapter is not torn out of the book, but translated into a better language; and every chapter must be so translated.... -John Donne From hans at eds.org Thu Mar 19 12:19:10 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 11:19:10 +0000 Subject: [PD] Pd book sprint in NYC/Berlin In-Reply-To: <200903181345.04879.dmotd@gmx.net> References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <81FC897D-7E39-4613-B82A-B571925E3AAF@eds.org> <200903181345.04879.dmotd@gmx.net> Message-ID: <976FA83E-FDBF-4B71-A814-0411C4B97942@eds.org> I have also had a number of bad voice/video meetings and some decent IRC meetings. I'd really like to experiment with the combination of all of the above. I think that a voice conference together with IRC could be a really useful combination. For example, its hard to know when someone wants to speak next in a voice conference, in a physical meeting , that kind of queuing is really well handled with eye contact, and small hand gestures, which can happen while someone is talking. I think that kind of thing could happen in IRC, like people type in "I'd like to respond", so for big chunks of talking, that would be handled over voice, then the little bits like figuring out who will speak next could be handled in IRC. For the book sprint, I think it would probably work differently. Like a constant, async, low volume chatter on IRC, then when some people want to work out an approach to a chapter or topic, they would switch to voice chat and have a discussion. .hc On Mar 18, 2009, at 3:45 AM, dmotd wrote: > i should probably avoid writing emails before bed, and my negative > bias > towards video-conferencing comes from a number of bad experiences and > unproductive meetings. anyhow you are quite right to push this one, to > converse without latency can be very productive (but equally > unproductive > too) - a good meeting requires a fair bit more preparation and > planning than > just the medium, regardless of mcluhans philosophy. incidentally i > have > enjoyed his musings in the past but i already find his arguments > ambiguous > enough with regard to psychology and technology, to retrofit his > ideologies > to todays baffling techno-communcications wasteland is a bit of a > stretch ;) > > ciao, > dmotd > > On Tuesday 17 March 2009 21:41:46 Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >> Yeah, in case I came across too strong, I think that IRC is very >> useful, and voice chat is too. We can have both running for this >> meeting, and people can choose where they participate. IRC is great >> for async communications, like asking specific questions. But I find >> it takes 10-20x longer to work through difficult issues thru text- >> only >> media like IRC, IM, email, etc. as compared to a voice conversation. >> >> .hc >> >> On Mar 16, 2009, at 7:32 PM, Jo?o Pais wrote: >>> Is this a one time thing, or might happen more times? I would say >>> that at least voice connection would be productive. I haven't that >>> much experience with video conferencing, but a medium where people >>> can react at the same time they can think would be important. >>> (although after too much time, even the fingers are faster than some >>> heads) >>> >>> How about voice connection for general talk + an irc chat for small, >>> fast questions? We can also send a group foto with skype, so that >>> everyone feels the warmth. >>> >>>> Marshall McLuhan would strongly disagree with you, as do I. The >>>> medium with which you communicate has a very strong impact on the >>>> conversation. That does not mean that it is the only influence. >>>> There are many things that lead to a bad meeting, and from my >>>> experience of having many meetings in person, on IRC, on IM, on >>>> phones, on voice chat, on video chat, and many different mixes >>>> above, I am a strong believer in high-bandwidth communication like >>>> voice. >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> - >> >> Mistrust authority - promote decentralization. - the hacker ethic > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- News is what people want to keep hidden and everything else is publicity. - Bill Moyers From zmoelnig at iem.at Thu Mar 19 13:25:34 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 13:25:34 +0100 Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com In-Reply-To: <49BEA495.8060106@gmx.de> References: <49BEA495.8060106@gmx.de> Message-ID: <49C239BE.5060508@iem.at> Johannes Kreidler wrote: > hi list, congrats > > At the moment, Amazon says that it's not available, which is strange > because it's definitely released, but at least it can be purchased at > the Publishing House itself. > http://www.amazon.de/Loadbang-Programming-Electronic-Music-Pure/dp/3936000573/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&s=books-intl-de&qid=1235853524&sr=8-3 even with amazon still filing the book as unavailable, i do love the first recension:-) : "Das Buch ist einfach toll, total spannent geschriben und gar nicht Langweilig! Man darf ja das Ende nich veraten: aber es ist echt supers??, was am Schlus passirt." ("The book is just great, grippingly written and not boring at all! I don't want to spoil the end: but its really super cute, what's happening in the end." or similar) fngasdr, IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From kyleklip at gmail.com Thu Mar 19 15:46:05 2009 From: kyleklip at gmail.com (Kyle Klipowicz) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 09:46:05 -0500 Subject: [PD] DIY GSoC: getting those projects done In-Reply-To: <774CBB5D-E9FE-44C6-B4A0-B37E543CC3C3@eds.org> References: <774CBB5D-E9FE-44C6-B4A0-B37E543CC3C3@eds.org> Message-ID: Aaaaaaaw Fooey! ~Kyle On Thu, Mar 19, 2009 at 6:08 AM, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > So now we have a nice collection of projects sketched out from the GSoC > application, let's encourage people to take them on. If anyone wants to get > involved with Pd development, take a look at the project ideas and if you > are interested, then ask about them on the list and we can get started. > > http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/GoogleSummerOfCodeIdeas2009 > > I think next time someone else should take on the GSoC application process. > I'm 2 for 2 at not getting it, I've never had much luck with grants. And > we have lots of well-sketched out projects. We should probably chuck the > application part and start from scratch. > > .hc > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > All mankind is of one author, and is one volume; when one man dies, one > chapter is not torn out of the book, but translated into a better language; > and every chapter must be so translated.... -John Donne > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -- ----- ------------ ---- ----- ---- -------- - ------ http://perhapsidid.wordpress.com http://myspace.com/kyleklipowicz -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From matju at artengine.ca Thu Mar 19 16:38:50 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 11:38:50 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] variance from mapping library In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Thu, 19 Mar 2009, Oded Ben-Tal wrote: > I am getting a negative number occasionally. Ok, i isolated an example: [metro 100] | [100000] | [variance 10] | converges to -281.6 and then changing 100000 to 0 makes the result converge to -691.2. actually, afaik, [variance] doesn't have a bug by itself. The bug is in [mean_n], which displays similar behaviour in default mode. The bug is because of algebraic assumptions that don't work with floats. With real numbers, a+b-a-b = 0, but with floats, a+b-a-b is only guaranteed to be a "small" number, that is, less than 2^24 times smaller than abs(a)+abs(b), or something like that. But 100000*100000 = 10000000000, and if you divide that by 2^24 = 16777216, you get about 596, which is an upper bound for the amount of error: so, the error is surely between -596 and +596. Then [mean_n] boosts this error to the max by adding it all together. Statistically, that error could diverge. So, the shortcut of keeping a total of a list of length N and only add the new element to it and subtract the oldest element from it, is not something that works with all floats. It's a trick that works with an int type, but with floats, it only works sometimes. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From matju at artengine.ca Thu Mar 19 17:02:16 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 12:02:16 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Wed, 18 Mar 2009, Matt Barber wrote: > If you're doing mod 12 operations, there is one more pitch operator -- > multiplication by 5 or 7 -- which maps the chromatic scale to the circle > of fifths and vice-versa. The "vice-versa" part is quite cool. Actually, apart from 1,5,7,11, all modulo-multiplications are not undoable, because they forget part of what was the original note, so, the undo would be ambiguous. 5 undoes itself because 5*5=1 in mod 12, 7 undoes itself because 7*7=1 in mod 12, but then 5=-7 and 7=-5 as well, just like 1=-11 and 11=-1. The undoability depends on whether the greatest common divisor of the modulo and of the multiplicator is 1 or not. If you use the 22 equal temperament, for example, there are 10 invertibles, and with 43 equal temperament, there are 42 of them; the proportion of undoables vs non-undoables varies greatly from modulo to modulo. I'm not into microtonal stuff, but I studied the modulo theory and I think that people who can care about microtonal music are lucky to have a nice application of that theory in their hands :) See also http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euler_phi_function _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From oded at ccrma.Stanford.EDU Thu Mar 19 17:20:34 2009 From: oded at ccrma.Stanford.EDU (Oded Ben-Tal) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 09:20:34 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] variance from mapping library In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: > and then changing 100000 to 0 makes the result converge to -691.2. > > actually, afaik, [variance] doesn't have a bug by itself. The bug is in > [mean_n], which displays similar behaviour in default mode. Yes that was my thought as well because the variance abstraction looks correct. > > The bug is because of algebraic assumptions that don't work with floats. With > real numbers, a+b-a-b = 0, but with floats, a+b-a-b is only guaranteed to be > a "small" number, that is, less than 2^24 times smaller than abs(a)+abs(b), > or something like that. But 100000*100000 = 10000000000, and if you divide > that by 2^24 = 16777216, you get about 596, which is an upper bound for the > amount of error: so, the error is surely between -596 and +596. > I trust your math here but just notice that your example converges to -691. But if I understand you correctly 'filtering' the input data through [int] should make variance error free (we hope). thanks Oded From matju at artengine.ca Thu Mar 19 17:24:06 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 12:24:06 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] wrap~ In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Thu, 19 Mar 2009, Steffen Juul wrote: > What is the largest integer not exceeding 0 (zero)? > I've asked before, but I'll still like to know. It's 0. You surely mean another question instead, but I can't guess, as there would be several possibilities. With pd floats: smallest number > 0 is 2^-149 = 1.40129846432482e-45 smallest number > 1 is 1+2^-23 = 1+1.19209289550781e-07 biggest number < 1 is 1-2^-24 = 1-5.96046447753906e-08 _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From brbrofsvl at gmail.com Thu Mar 19 17:25:19 2009 From: brbrofsvl at gmail.com (Matt Barber) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 12:25:19 -0400 Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Thu, Mar 19, 2009 at 12:02 PM, Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > On Wed, 18 Mar 2009, Matt Barber wrote: > >> If you're doing mod 12 operations, there is one more pitch operator -- >> multiplication by 5 or 7 -- which maps the chromatic scale to the circle of >> fifths and vice-versa. > > The "vice-versa" part is quite cool. Actually, apart from 1,5,7,11, all > modulo-multiplications are not undoable, because they forget part of what > was the original note, so, the undo would be ambiguous. 5 undoes itself > because 5*5=1 in mod 12, 7 undoes itself because 7*7=1 in mod 12, but then > 5=-7 and 7=-5 as well, just like 1=-11 and 11=-1. > > The undoability depends on whether the greatest common divisor of the modulo > and of the multiplicator is 1 or not. If you use the 22 equal temperament, > for example, there are 10 invertibles, and with 43 equal temperament, there > are 42 of them; the proportion of undoables vs non-undoables varies greatly > from modulo to modulo. > > I'm not into microtonal stuff, but I studied the modulo theory and I think > that people who can care about microtonal music are lucky to have a nice > application of that theory in their hands :) > > See also http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euler_phi_function > Right, in mod-12, the other multiplications are not strictly operations (there is no inverse). I used to like to joke with friends that I was "really into the multiplication by 0 mapping." Recently I've been writing music in various 19-tone equal temperaments, which, since it's prime, has a complete multiplicative group. 19 per octave is nice because you get really "pure" thirds. I've also been experimenting with 19 per perfect 12th (octave and a fifth), the smallest intervals of which work out almost exactly to standard 12-tone half-steps (check the 12th root of 2 and the 19th root of 3). In addition each modulus has strikingly different voice-leading possibilities. From matju at artengine.ca Thu Mar 19 17:50:26 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 12:50:26 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] variance from mapping library In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Thu, 19 Mar 2009, Oded Ben-Tal wrote: >> abs(a)+abs(b), or something like that. But 100000*100000 = 10000000000, and >> if you divide that by 2^24 = 16777216, you get about 596, which is an upper >> bound for the amount of error: so, the error is surely between -596 and >> +596. > I trust your math here but just notice that your example converges to -691. That's because 100000*100000 is only one value. Then, the second [mean_n] has to process + 90000*90000 + 80000*80000 + 70000*70000 + ... so the theoretical error maximum is much more than 596 but much less than 596*10. In practice, much of the individual errors are not that big and perhaps some of them cancel each other. But to find the reason for why -691 precisely, would take a long time and would not be any insightful. > But if I understand you correctly 'filtering' the input data through [int] > should make variance error free (we hope). no, it won't, because still all of the other objects process floats. The reason why ints wouldn't have that problem is because they have fixed precision, that is, the step between two adjacent numbers is 1, whereas for floats it's roughly proportional to the numbers themselves. For integers you will hit an overflow problem quite quickly, and so, for example, if you remake that abstraction using 32-bit integers (for example, using the GridFlow library) then you can already get an overflow by using random 5-digit numbers, but at least, it goes back to normal when given a more modest sequence, whereas for floats it gets stuck and needs to be reset (recreated). Using int64 you could get perfect results for most uses, but I don't recall whether the bugs in GridFlow's int64 support were fixed or not... I never quite had a use for int64 in the end. For the "mapping" library, there isn't much of a choice but to remake it with a slower algorithm, unless someone knows a magic trick for cancelling almost all of the error while not running so slow. Actually, it already runs in linear time, so it wouldn't be such a big loss if the complete sum was recomputed at every step, because it would still be linear. It would be a big loss if it could run in constant time (e.g. using an array for the queue) and had to be switched to linear time. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From matju at artengine.ca Thu Mar 19 18:09:14 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 13:09:14 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Thu, 19 Mar 2009, Matt Barber wrote: > Right, in mod-12, the other multiplications are not strictly operations > (there is no inverse). They are called operations anyway. I don't know your definition of operation. They're usually called "non-invertible operations", but in a Group (of Group Theory), all elements are invertible. Group Theory also has an operator (written as a small straight "x" in exponent) that makes a multiplication-wise group from an addition-wise group. For Z/12Z (the mod 12 integers), this gives you a group make of 1,5,7,11, which behaves like (Z/2Z)^2, which is are the 2-D vectors made of Z/2Z (mod 2 integers): 1 -> (0,0) 5 -> (0,1) 7 -> (1,0) 11 -> (1,1) > Recently I've been writing music in various 19-tone equal temperaments, > which, since it's prime, has a complete multiplicative group. yes... and as a bonus, this multiplicative group acts just like Z/18Z !!! _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From stffn at dibidut.dk Thu Mar 19 18:18:05 2009 From: stffn at dibidut.dk (Steffen Juul) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 18:18:05 +0100 Subject: [PD] wrap~ In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <00BBB756-073E-4E87-903F-4A35352B45C4@dibidut.dk> On 19/03/2009, at 17.24, Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > On Thu, 19 Mar 2009, Steffen Juul wrote: > >> What is the largest integer not exceeding 0 (zero)? >> I've asked before, but I'll still like to know. > > It's 0. Ok. It's just that when one send the 0 signal to a wrap~ instance it returns 1. (wrap~ of a negative integer is also 1.) From brbrofsvl at gmail.com Thu Mar 19 18:29:33 2009 From: brbrofsvl at gmail.com (Matt Barber) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 13:29:33 -0400 Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: mm. When I was studying music theory we used to reserve "operation" for a function that was 1 to 1 and onto; I think that usage has been pretty standard in music theory since 1987, through the work of David Lewin. Music theorists often screw up standard math terms though, so I never know what to call anything in what company, and always suspect it will be meaningless/wrong... =o) On Thu, Mar 19, 2009 at 1:09 PM, Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > On Thu, 19 Mar 2009, Matt Barber wrote: > >> Right, in mod-12, the other multiplications are not strictly operations >> (there is no inverse). > > They are called operations anyway. I don't know your definition of > operation. > > They're usually called "non-invertible operations", but in a Group (of Group > Theory), all elements are invertible. > > Group Theory also has an operator (written as a small straight "x" in > exponent) that makes a multiplication-wise group from an addition-wise > group. For Z/12Z (the mod 12 integers), this gives you a group make of > 1,5,7,11, which behaves like (Z/2Z)^2, which is are the 2-D vectors made of > Z/2Z (mod 2 integers): > > 1 ?-> (0,0) > 5 ?-> (0,1) > 7 ?-> (1,0) > 11 -> (1,1) > >> Recently I've been writing music in various 19-tone equal temperaments, >> which, since it's prime, has a complete multiplicative group. > > yes... and as a bonus, this multiplicative group acts just like Z/18Z !!! > > ?_ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... > | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From matju at artengine.ca Thu Mar 19 18:43:03 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 13:43:03 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] wrap~ In-Reply-To: <00BBB756-073E-4E87-903F-4A35352B45C4@dibidut.dk> References: <00BBB756-073E-4E87-903F-4A35352B45C4@dibidut.dk> Message-ID: On Thu, 19 Mar 2009, Steffen Juul wrote: > Ok. It's just that when one send the 0 signal to a wrap~ instance it > returns 1. (wrap~ of a negative integer is also 1.) I'd call it a bug. I'd expect wrap~ to never ever output 1, if only to be consistent with how [mod] works. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From matju at artengine.ca Thu Mar 19 18:48:23 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 13:48:23 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] www.pd-tutorial.com In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Thu, 19 Mar 2009, Matt Barber wrote: > mm. When I was studying music theory we used to reserve "operation" > for a function that was 1 to 1 and onto; I think that usage has been > pretty standard in music theory since 1987, through the work of David > Lewin. Music theorists often screw up standard math terms though, so > I never know what to call anything in what company, and always suspect > it will be meaningless/wrong... =o) Yeah, it's a tough problem, and actually mathematicians don't say it as "operation" so often, and tends to use "operator" with some special connotations too (but nothing to do with 1-to-1 and onto). It's all a big mess. No way out but to be more verbose; or else, all agree to rely on a specific glossary for all that gets said on pd-list (which is not actually doable...). _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From hans at eds.org Thu Mar 19 19:34:17 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 11:34:17 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] GSoC Fwd: Thank you for your application In-Reply-To: <200903192113.49457.dmotd@gmx.net> References: <0015174c44585d0df204656ba7b6@google.com> <200903192113.49457.dmotd@gmx.net> Message-ID: They only give feedback in the #gsoc room the day of the rejection. Or at least that's how it worked last year. That's all I got. Be sure to thank Georg too, he was a major force in putting this thing together, in case I forgot to mention that. And really, thanks everyone for contributing, it was nice to see so many people contribute. .hc On Thu, 19 Mar 2009, dmotd wrote: > ahh, too bad.. this is obviously a template rejection notice, do they usually > follow up this initial rejection with which criteria the organisation missed > and which parts of the application need to be better addressed? > > it may just be the luck of the draw, but we are losing out to projects like > scummvm - a virtual machine for playing video games from 1987! not that i > have a problem with maniac mansion as such, but somethings gotta give! > > anyhow, good work to those responsible for putting the application together, i > am sure with a bit of feedback and a little work, we will be a contender for > next year. > > cheers, > dmotd > > On Thursday 19 March 2009 18:07:15 Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >> Well, we didn't get accepted but now at least we do have a nice >> collection of projects for people to take on. >> >> http://socghop.appspot.com/program/accepted_orgs/google/gsoc2009 >> >> .hc >> >> Begin forwarded message: >>> From: socghop.noreply at gmail.com >>> Date: March 18, 2009 9:49:10 PM GMT >>> Subject: Thank you for your application >>> >>> Hi Hans-Christoph Steiner, >>> >>> Thank you for submitting "Pure Data (aka Pd)" organization >>> application to Google Summer of Code 2009. Unfortunately, we were >>> unable to accept your organization's application at this time. We >>> received many more applications for the program than we are able to >>> accommodate, and we would encourage you to reapply for future >>> instances of the program. >>> >>> Best regards, >>> Google Open Source Programs >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> - >> >> "[T]he greatest purveyor of violence in the world today [is] my own >> government." - Martin Luther King, Jr. > > zen \ \ \ From mjmogo at gmail.com Thu Mar 19 20:00:27 2009 From: mjmogo at gmail.com (Mike McGonagle) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 14:00:27 -0500 Subject: [PD] Chicago Patching Circle (Sunday, March 29th 5pm) Message-ID: <370dda580903191200w4327d89ay8325705c09ed9166@mail.gmail.com> Hello all, I would like to invite any and everyone to a patching circle at the Red Line Tap on Sunday, March 29th. ( http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=redline+tap+chicago&btnG=Google+Search&cts=1237488991368&aq=0&oq=redline+tap ) I am planning to give a short demo of the SQLite externals I have been working on. The Red Line has a nice selection of beers for those into beer, so come on out and share!!! Mike From mgrimm at syr.edu Thu Mar 19 20:27:33 2009 From: mgrimm at syr.edu (mark edward grimm) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 12:27:33 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] stop animation/motion in pd/gem Message-ID: <525535.10251.qm@web32408.mail.mud.yahoo.com> hello, i just stumbled on "toonloop": http://alexandre.quessy.net/?q=toonloop just got me interested/curious if someone has written a similar patch in pd (toonloop = processing.org).... ? thanks! mark From mortuos.plango at googlemail.com Thu Mar 19 21:35:09 2009 From: mortuos.plango at googlemail.com (Holger Ballweg) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 21:35:09 +0100 Subject: [PD] stop animation/motion in pd/gem In-Reply-To: <525535.10251.qm@web32408.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <525535.10251.qm@web32408.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <49C2AC7D.5040900@googlemail.com> > i just stumbled on "toonloop": > > http://alexandre.quessy.net/?q=toonloop > > just got me interested/curious if someone has written a similar patch in pd (toonloop = processing.org).... > examples/pdp/example12.pd from pdp does something similar, but not as sophisticated as the processing thingy (e. g. can`t delete specific frames) cheers, holger From matju at artengine.ca Thu Mar 19 21:36:31 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 16:36:31 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] stop animation/motion in pd/gem In-Reply-To: <525535.10251.qm@web32408.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <525535.10251.qm@web32408.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 19 Mar 2009, mark edward grimm wrote: > i just stumbled on "toonloop": > http://alexandre.quessy.net/?q=toonloop When, two weeks ago, my girlfriend introduced me to ToonLoop, I immediately thought about this music video made in 1986: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oMylfkSDKV0 > just got me interested/curious if someone has written a similar patch in pd (toonloop = processing.org).... Should be fairly simple. GridFlow has a nervous_video.pd patch that shows how to store a bunch of frames in a big grid... for 32 frames of 240 rows of 320 columns of 3 channels, you just make a grid of size (32 240 320 3) and that's all. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From danomatika at gmail.com Thu Mar 19 22:07:59 2009 From: danomatika at gmail.com (danomatika) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 22:07:59 +0100 Subject: [PD] GSoC Fwd: Thank you for your application Message-ID: <1237496879.13782.3.camel@danoT500> Well, we didn't get accepted but now at least we do have a nice collection of projects for people to take on. http://socghop.appspot.com/program/accepted_orgs/google/gsoc2009 .hc BZFlag? I guess PD is not a Google MicroSoft fighter ... although it's kind of annoying to see rather large, funded projects getting preference over deserving projects such as PD. Mabey they'll site a lack of developer cohesion as PD is something different for everyone involved. Bastards. --- Dan Wilcox danomatika.com robotcowboy.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jancsika at yahoo.com Thu Mar 19 23:23:57 2009 From: jancsika at yahoo.com (Jonathan Wilkes) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 15:23:57 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] GSoC Fwd: Thank you for your application In-Reply-To: <1237496879.13782.3.camel@danoT500> Message-ID: <383523.53511.qm@web65611.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Well, hindsight is 20/20, but I do have some ideas about improving upon the application itself (esp. regarding past successes/failures at GSoC). I'll be happy to contribute time for editing/touch-ups/clarifications for the next go-around. -Jonathan --- On Thu, 3/19/09, danomatika wrote: > From: danomatika > Subject: [PD] GSoC Fwd: Thank you for your application > To: "pd-list at iem.at" > Date: Thursday, March 19, 2009, 10:07 PM > Well, we didn't get accepted but now at least we do have > a > nice > collection of projects for people to take on. > > > http://socghop.appspot.com/program/accepted_orgs/google/gsoc2009 > > .hc > > > BZFlag? > > I guess PD is not a Google MicroSoft fighter ... although > it's kind of > annoying to see rather large, funded projects > getting preference over deserving projects such as PD. > Mabey they'll > site a lack of developer cohesion as PD > is something different for everyone involved. > > Bastards. > > --- > Dan Wilcox > danomatika.com > robotcowboy.com > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From kyleklip at gmail.com Fri Mar 20 01:16:15 2009 From: kyleklip at gmail.com (Kyle Klipowicz) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 19:16:15 -0500 Subject: [PD] Chicago Patching Circle (Sunday, March 29th 5pm) In-Reply-To: <370dda580903191200w4327d89ay8325705c09ed9166@mail.gmail.com> References: <370dda580903191200w4327d89ay8325705c09ed9166@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Woo hoo! ~Kyle On Thu, Mar 19, 2009 at 2:00 PM, Mike McGonagle wrote: > Hello all, > > I would like to invite any and everyone to a patching circle at the > Red Line Tap on Sunday, March 29th. ( > > http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=redline+tap+chicago&btnG=Google+Search&cts=1237488991368&aq=0&oq=redline+tap > ) > > I am planning to give a short demo of the SQLite externals I have been > working on. > > The Red Line has a nice selection of beers for those into beer, so > come on out and share!!! > > > Mike > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -- ----- ------------ ---- ----- ---- -------- - ------ http://perhapsidid.wordpress.com http://myspace.com/kyleklipowicz -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hans at eds.org Fri Mar 20 01:38:06 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 00:38:06 +0000 Subject: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( Message-ID: Here's something that I'd like to propose for the style guide, based on my teaching experience: - use [send foo] instead of [; foo( for all sends that aren't dynamically set A lot of people find the [; foo( syntax confusing, and since it is commonly used, it often gets in the way of newbies understanding the patch. While the [; foo( syntax is definitely useful for dynamic sends, I don't think there is an advantage to using for the regular sends. So for example: [dsp 1( | [send pd] instead of |; / |pd dsp 1 \ This change highlights the dataflow aspect of the messages over the text-style programming with syntax of the message box. At the very least, I think that the help patches should use this style, and I have started to use this style in my regular programming and it feels quite natural once you are used to it. I find it easier to read. (as for [s foo] versus [send foo] that's an issue I want to avoid in this discussion). .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- The arc of history bends towards justice. - Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. From hans at eds.org Fri Mar 20 02:17:04 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 01:17:04 +0000 Subject: [PD] read sysex files (hex) In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903171901r4422e19u9715a9fa9bc60cd6@mail.gmail.com> References: <161320dd0903142334m2c11d345j8ce900c2f3bdf8db@mail.gmail.com> <25976580-95AE-4B4D-BFCE-B8E917290247@eds.org> <161320dd0903171901r4422e19u9715a9fa9bc60cd6@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <26EFE750-AD8C-430A-A1A7-11E7C86CCDCF@eds.org> No problem. That would make a nice object/abstraction, a sysex parser. .hc On Mar 18, 2009, at 2:01 AM, hard off wrote: > YES! > > thanks hans, and thanks mr peach! > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Man has survived hitherto because he was too ignorant to know how to realize his wishes. Now that he can realize them, he must either change them, or perish. -William Carlos Williams -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dmotd at gmx.net Fri Mar 20 02:32:27 2009 From: dmotd at gmx.net (dmotd) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 11:32:27 +1000 Subject: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200903201132.27144.dmotd@gmx.net> hmm.. generally this could be a good idea, but message sending is most useful when initialising a number of receives ie: [loadbang] | |; init-1 6 / |; init-2 symbol foo | |; init-3 -2 \ which is far more elegant than the the trigger/send replacement, especially with more fields.. i think its important for students to recognise that this feature of messaging has a role to play, rather than trying to veil its use. in my experience people will tend to use [send foo] more often when they start pd, then begin abbreviating to [s foo] before they appreciate the msg shorthand [; foo[. but you are right it is a little confusing for new users.. perhaps this just needs clearer documenting? 'what does a semi-colon at the start of a message mean?' in the FAQ? dmotd On Friday 20 March 2009 10:38:06 Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > Here's something that I'd like to propose for the style guide, based > on my teaching experience: > > - use [send foo] instead of [; foo( for all sends that aren't > dynamically set > > A lot of people find the [; foo( syntax confusing, and since it is > commonly used, it often gets in the way of newbies understanding the > patch. While the [; foo( syntax is definitely useful for dynamic > sends, I don't think there is an advantage to using for the regular > sends. So for example: > > [dsp 1( > > [send pd] > > instead of > > |; / > |pd dsp 1 \ > > This change highlights the dataflow aspect of the messages over the > text-style programming with syntax of the message box. At the very > least, I think that the help patches should use this style, and I have > started to use this style in my regular programming and it feels quite > natural once you are used to it. I find it easier to read. > > (as for [s foo] versus [send foo] that's an issue I want to avoid in > this discussion). > > .hc > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------------- >- > > The arc of history bends towards justice. - Dr. Martin Luther > King, Jr. > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From mr_k at simultan.org Fri Mar 20 02:50:30 2009 From: mr_k at simultan.org (levente kozma // simultan) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 03:50:30 +0200 Subject: [PD] [PD-announce] Simultan - Call for video submissions // deadline 10 april Message-ID: Simultan - Call for video submissions // deadline 10 april ------------------------------------------------------------ INFO The Simultan Festival is an annual festival for video, media art, experimental electronic music and a/v projects. This year's edition runs under the theme Trans:position and will take place on 21-23 May, 2009, in Timisoara, Romania. The festival wishes to sustain and to stimulate the creative ways of the most modern visions of perceiving and recording the cultural realities in contemporary art. It presents the current processes and the way in which technology and society give rise to new forms of artistic expression by using the new media. Based on a different theme every year, the festival presents video art projections, live performances, installations, lectures. TERMS OF ENTRY Simultan is open for submissions of innovative works, which use technology in a creative, ingenious way or are based on a peculiar, unusual story. The applicants can send works which fall in one of the two categories below: - experimental video - generative visuals based on sound and image manipulations and motion graphics Those interested may apply with a maximum number of 2 works; each of them must not exceed 5 minutes in length. MORE DETAILS AND APPLICATION FORM HERE: http://www.simultan.org/en/2009/callforentry.htm The deadline for submission is: April 10, 2009 (postmark) DOCUMENTATION After the event, a DVD/catalogue will be published and documentation will also be available on our website www.simultan.org. Each of the admitted participants will receive a DVD/catalogue by the end of 2009. No entry fee! For additional information please contact: Levente Kozma, email: simultan[at]simultan.org www.simultan.org _______________________________________________ Pd-announce mailing list Pd-announce at iem.at http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-announce From babsyco at hotmail.com Fri Mar 20 03:39:40 2009 From: babsyco at hotmail.com (babsyco babsyco) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 02:39:40 +0000 Subject: [PD] does anyone know of a good Eq I can use? Message-ID: Hi guys, I was just wondering if anyone knows where I can find a decent 8-band (or greater) Eq patch? I don't need anything too fancy-I tried to make one myself, but I'm still figuring out how the lop~ and hip~ objects work and I'm in kind of a hurry. Thanks-enjoying all your emails very much. babsyco. _________________________________________________________________ Looking for a place to manage all your online stuff? Explore the new Windows Live . http://www.microsoft.com/australia/windows/windowslive/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From mgrimm at syr.edu Fri Mar 20 03:50:16 2009 From: mgrimm at syr.edu (mark edward grimm) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 19:50:16 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] stop animation/motion in pd/gem Message-ID: <68386.99652.qm@web32401.mail.mud.yahoo.com> > examples/pdp/example12.pd from pdp does something similar, thats great. i had never seen that one! thanks for pointer.... > GridFlow has a nervous_video.pd > patch that shows how to store a bunch of frames in a big > grid... that looks pretty elegant and will give it a shot on linux machine... BTW was wondering though if there are any plans to implement gridflow in extended? it would benefit our freshmen students for ease of installation/use on osx machines they now all run and i would love to demo this "nerv_vid" example... > ToonLoop, I immediately thought about this music video made > in 1986: > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oMylfkSDKV0 awesome! i dont remember ever seeing that one before.... not even in the '80's!! - mark --- On Thu, 3/19/09, Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > From: Mathieu Bouchard > Subject: Re: [PD] stop animation/motion in pd/gem > To: "mark edward grimm" > Cc: "pd_list Listserve" > Date: Thursday, March 19, 2009, 4:36 PM > On Thu, 19 Mar 2009, mark edward > grimm wrote: > > > i just stumbled on "toonloop": > > http://alexandre.quessy.net/?q=toonloop > > When, two weeks ago, my girlfriend introduced me to > ToonLoop, I immediately thought about this music video made > in 1986: > > ? ? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oMylfkSDKV0 > > > just got me interested/curious if someone has written > a similar patch in pd (toonloop = processing.org).... > > Should be fairly simple. GridFlow has a nervous_video.pd > patch that shows how to store a bunch of frames in a big > grid... for 32 frames of 240 rows of 320 columns of 3 > channels, you just make a grid of size (32 240 320 3) and > that's all. > > _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ > _____________________ ... > | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, > Qu?bec From bbakersmith at gmail.com Fri Mar 20 04:49:47 2009 From: bbakersmith at gmail.com (Ben Baker-Smith) Date: Thu, 19 Mar 2009 22:49:47 -0500 Subject: [PD] Chicago Patching Circle (Sunday, March 29th 5pm) Message-ID: Oh man, awesome! I just looked up the Red Line tap and it's literally two blocks from my apartment, can't wait. I'd actually just heard about the place and was meaning to check it out, what a great opportunity. I'm looking forward to connecting with some other chicago PDers. -Ben -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jurish at ling.uni-potsdam.de Fri Mar 20 09:44:27 2009 From: jurish at ling.uni-potsdam.de (Bryan Jurish) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 09:44:27 +0100 Subject: [PD] [PD-dev] does anyone know of a good Eq I can use? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49C3576B.8000100@ling.uni-potsdam.de> moin babysco, if you're on linux, you could use the LADSPA plugin 'Multiband EQ (1197/mbeq)'. Check if it's installed with: $ listplugins | grep mbeq Instantiate it in Pd with [plugin~ mbeq]. Send it 'control #N VAL' messages, where N is an integer between 1 and 16 (inclusive), and VAL is a dB value between -70 and 30 (inclusive) to change gain on each of the 16 bands. I've got a GUI for this hanging around if you're interested, but it probably requires a whole mess of my other abstractions and maybe even hacked externals. Still, you (or anyone elese) are welcome to it. You could also try generating a GUI yourself with my Pd::Patch perl modules, which come with a ladspa-plugin-wrapper-generator, but then you'd probably need to write your own abstraction template ;-) marmosets, Bryan On 2009-03-20 03:39:40, babsyco babsyco appears to have written: > Hi guys, > > I was just wondering if anyone knows where I can find a decent 8-band > (or greater) Eq patch? I don't need anything too fancy-I tried to make > one myself, but I'm still figuring out how the lop~ and hip~ objects > work and I'm in kind of a hurry. > > Thanks-enjoying all your emails very much. > > babsyco. > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Explore the new Windows Live. Looking for a place to manage all your > online stuff? > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-dev mailing list > Pd-dev at iem.at > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-dev -- Bryan Jurish "There is *always* one more bug." jurish at ling.uni-potsdam.de -Lubarsky's Law of Cybernetic Entomology From brbrofsvl at gmail.com Fri Mar 20 14:34:18 2009 From: brbrofsvl at gmail.com (Matt Barber) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 09:34:18 -0400 Subject: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( Message-ID: > hmm.. generally this could be a good idea, but message sending is most useful > when initialising a number of receives ie: > > [loadbang] > ?| > |; init-1 6 ? ? ? ? ?/ > |; init-2 symbol foo | > |; init-3 -2 ? ? ? ? \ > > which is far more elegant than the the trigger/send replacement, especially > with more fields.. > > i think its important for students to recognise that this feature of messaging > has a role to play, rather than trying to veil its use. in my experience > people will tend to use [send foo] more often when they start pd, then begin > abbreviating to [s foo] before they appreciate the msg shorthand [; foo[. but > you are right it is a little confusing for new users.. > Also note that some objects, e.g. [qlist], positively depend on the message sending style. My students who wanted to use them have often wondered why we hadn't covered the two ways of sending more in depth. Matt From puredata at 11h11.com Fri Mar 20 15:46:48 2009 From: puredata at 11h11.com (patrick) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 10:46:48 -0400 Subject: [PD] does anyone know of a good Eq I can use? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49C3AC58.5060509@11h11.com> hi babsyco, please only send your question to pd-list at iem.at i am using hml_shelf, in pdmtl abstractions it's fx.eq~ http://wiki.dataflow.ws/PdMtlAbstractions it's 3 bands, but i think it's very easy to modify. might be wrong. pat From hans at eds.org Fri Mar 20 17:25:37 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 16:25:37 +0000 Subject: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( In-Reply-To: <200903201132.27144.dmotd@gmx.net> References: <200903201132.27144.dmotd@gmx.net> Message-ID: I am not proposing to limit the use of dollar args in message boxes for dynamic sends, that is a very useful feature. The example you give here, though, is an example of a shortcut for typing, there is no other benefit that I can see. And at the risk of sounding pedantic, I am going to quote one of my favorite ideas relating to code: "Programs should be written for people to read, and only incidentally for machines to execute". Typing shortcuts like this message box below almost never save time when you look at the whole picture. Code is read far more times than it is written, so really we should be optimizing for reading rather than writing. In Pd, [trigger] is the central mechanism for specifying execution order. Therefore, in the interest of readability, [trigger] should be used as much as possible. Clearer documentation of the messages boxes would also be a great thing. But you almost anything without ever using a semi-colon in a message box, they are mostly used as a typing shortcut, and many people are confused by them, so I think we should really be limiting them to things like dynamic sends, since that is hard to do in other ways. .hc On Mar 20, 2009, at 1:32 AM, dmotd wrote: > hmm.. generally this could be a good idea, but message sending is > most useful > when initialising a number of receives ie: > > [loadbang] > | > |; init-1 6 / > |; init-2 symbol foo | > |; init-3 -2 \ > > which is far more elegant than the the trigger/send replacement, > especially > with more fields.. > > i think its important for students to recognise that this feature of > messaging > has a role to play, rather than trying to veil its use. in my > experience > people will tend to use [send foo] more often when they start pd, > then begin > abbreviating to [s foo] before they appreciate the msg shorthand [; > foo[. but > you are right it is a little confusing for new users.. > > perhaps this just needs clearer documenting? 'what does a semi-colon > at the > start of a message mean?' in the FAQ? > > dmotd > > On Friday 20 March 2009 10:38:06 Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >> Here's something that I'd like to propose for the style guide, based >> on my teaching experience: >> >> - use [send foo] instead of [; foo( for all sends that aren't >> dynamically set >> >> A lot of people find the [; foo( syntax confusing, and since it is >> commonly used, it often gets in the way of newbies understanding the >> patch. While the [; foo( syntax is definitely useful for dynamic >> sends, I don't think there is an advantage to using for the regular >> sends. So for example: >> >> [dsp 1( >> >> [send pd] >> >> instead of >> >> |; / >> |pd dsp 1 \ >> >> This change highlights the dataflow aspect of the messages over the >> text-style programming with syntax of the message box. At the very >> least, I think that the help patches should use this style, and I >> have >> started to use this style in my regular programming and it feels >> quite >> natural once you are used to it. I find it easier to read. >> >> (as for [s foo] versus [send foo] that's an issue I want to avoid in >> this discussion). >> >> .hc >> >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> - >> >> The arc of history bends towards justice. - Dr. Martin Luther >> King, Jr. >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Programs should be written for people to read, and only incidentally for machines to execute. - from Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs From jancsika at yahoo.com Fri Mar 20 18:51:47 2009 From: jancsika at yahoo.com (Jonathan Wilkes) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 10:51:47 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <986565.60451.qm@web65614.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> --- On Fri, 3/20/09, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > From: Hans-Christoph Steiner > Subject: Re: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( > To: "dmotd" > Cc: pd-list at iem.at > Date: Friday, March 20, 2009, 5:25 PM > I am not proposing to limit the use of dollar args in > message boxes for dynamic sends, that is a very useful > feature. The example you give here, though, is an example of > a shortcut for typing, there is no other benefit that I can > see. > > And at the risk of sounding pedantic, I am going to quote > one of my favorite ideas relating to code: "Programs > should be written for people to read, and only incidentally > for machines to execute". Typing shortcuts like this > message box below almost never save time when you look at > the whole picture. Code is read far more times than it is > written, so really we should be optimizing for reading > rather than writing. Could you give an example that is more readable than the message box below? -Jonathan > > In Pd, [trigger] is the central mechanism for specifying > execution order. Therefore, in the interest of readability, > [trigger] should be used as much as possible. > > Clearer documentation of the messages boxes would also be a > great thing. But you almost anything without ever using a > semi-colon in a message box, they are mostly used as a > typing shortcut, and many people are confused by them, so I > think we should really be limiting them to things like > dynamic sends, since that is hard to do in other ways. > > .hc > > On Mar 20, 2009, at 1:32 AM, dmotd wrote: > > > hmm.. generally this could be a good idea, but message > sending is most useful > > when initialising a number of receives ie: > > > > [loadbang] > > | > > |; init-1 6 / > > |; init-2 symbol foo | > > |; init-3 -2 \ > > > > which is far more elegant than the the trigger/send > replacement, especially > > with more fields.. > > > > i think its important for students to recognise that > this feature of messaging > > has a role to play, rather than trying to veil its > use. in my experience > > people will tend to use [send foo] more often when > they start pd, then begin > > abbreviating to [s foo] before they appreciate the msg > shorthand [; foo[. but > > you are right it is a little confusing for new users.. > > > > perhaps this just needs clearer documenting? 'what > does a semi-colon at the > > start of a message mean?' in the FAQ? > > > > dmotd > > > > On Friday 20 March 2009 10:38:06 Hans-Christoph > Steiner wrote: > >> Here's something that I'd like to propose > for the style guide, based > >> on my teaching experience: > >> > >> - use [send foo] instead of [; foo( for all sends > that aren't > >> dynamically set > >> > >> A lot of people find the [; foo( syntax confusing, > and since it is > >> commonly used, it often gets in the way of newbies > understanding the > >> patch. While the [; foo( syntax is definitely > useful for dynamic > >> sends, I don't think there is an advantage to > using for the regular > >> sends. So for example: > >> > >> [dsp 1( > >> > >> [send pd] > >> > >> instead of > >> > >> |; / > >> |pd dsp 1 \ > >> > >> This change highlights the dataflow aspect of the > messages over the > >> text-style programming with syntax of the message > box. At the very > >> least, I think that the help patches should use > this style, and I have > >> started to use this style in my regular > programming and it feels quite > >> natural once you are used to it. I find it easier > to read. > >> > >> (as for [s foo] versus [send foo] that's an > issue I want to avoid in > >> this discussion). > >> > >> .hc > >> > >> > >> > --------------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> - > >> > >> The arc of history bends towards justice. - > Dr. Martin Luther > >> King, Jr. > >> > >> > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Programs should be written for people to read, and only > incidentally for machines to execute. > - from Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From brbrofsvl at gmail.com Fri Mar 20 19:28:38 2009 From: brbrofsvl at gmail.com (Matt Barber) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 14:28:38 -0400 Subject: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( In-Reply-To: <129520C8-D5DE-4FC5-869E-4BC4F1334564@eds.org> References: <129520C8-D5DE-4FC5-869E-4BC4F1334564@eds.org> Message-ID: >> Also note that some objects, e.g. [qlist], positively depend on the >> message sending style. ?My students who wanted to use them have often >> wondered why we hadn't covered the two ways of sending more in depth. > > Can you explain with an example? ?I don't understand why you must use > message boxes semi-colons for [qlist]. ?The [qlist] help patch doesn't ?have > any message boxes with semi-colons, for example. > > .hc > Sure. A [qlist] sends messages from a file (among other things). Those messages have the same form as messages sent from message boxes: send-receive_symbol list or whatever; The only difference is that the first message in a message box is sent from its outlet rather than to a receive -- the leading semicolon you see just means "send no message from outlet" which to me makes plenty of sense and is not difficult to read at all. For instance, this: |; init-1 6 / |; init-2 symbol foo | |; init-3 -2 \ Really means: ____________ ; init-1 6; init-2 symbol foo; init-3 -2 ____________ Doesn't it? (pardon my ascii) And if you did this: ____________ bang; init-1 6; init-2 symbol foo; init-3 -2 ____________ then it would send a bang from its inlet first. So in order to have my students understand [qlist] and its files, they have found it very useful to know about the message system in message boxes... it makes the message system in Pd on the whole a lot more understandable and less confusing, and it seems to be less confusing the earlier you introduce it to them. That's all I meant. Matt From fbar at footils.org Fri Mar 20 19:53:12 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 19:53:12 +0100 Subject: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( In-Reply-To: References: <129520C8-D5DE-4FC5-869E-4BC4F1334564@eds.org> Message-ID: <20090320185312.GA31601@footils.org> Hallo, Matt Barber hat gesagt: // Matt Barber wrote: > So in order to have my students understand [qlist] and its files, they > have found it very useful to know about the message system in message > boxes... it makes the message system in Pd on the whole a lot more > understandable and less confusing, and it seems to be less confusing > the earlier you introduce it to them. And then later if you can make your students understand, that even the text in object boxes is a message to an internal receiver, they will have an easier time when they want to do some dynamic patching. I think, a style guide should take care not to over-regulate things. For example I'd rather start with making people properly left-align their patches and avoid crossing patch cords and use [trigger]s everywhere - this is very important to make patches readable and maintainable and generally learn to "think in Pd". But if at the end of an object tree there is a [s foo] or a [; foo $1( is not that important IMHO. People will get tired of typing lots of $-variables on their own. Nobody uses [; foo $1 $2 $3 $4 $5 $6 $7 $8 $9( anyway when a simple [s foo] is sufficient. Ciao -- Frank From jmmmpais at googlemail.com Fri Mar 20 21:02:08 2009 From: jmmmpais at googlemail.com (=?iso-8859-15?Q?Jo=E3o_Pais?=) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 20:02:08 -0000 Subject: [PD] data-structures short questions Message-ID: Hi, after creating a structure (object) with append, is it possible to delete it? Or just better hide it with 0 on the drawing objects? (the patch is only to display data, not to be used by the user) Jo?o -- Friedenstr. 58 10249 Berlin (Deutschland) Tel +49 30 42020091 | Mob +49 162 6843570 jmmmpais at googlemail.com | skype: jmmmpjmmmp From hans at eds.org Fri Mar 20 17:27:40 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 16:27:40 +0000 Subject: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <129520C8-D5DE-4FC5-869E-4BC4F1334564@eds.org> On Mar 20, 2009, at 1:34 PM, Matt Barber wrote: >> hmm.. generally this could be a good idea, but message sending is >> most useful >> when initialising a number of receives ie: >> >> [loadbang] >> | >> |; init-1 6 / >> |; init-2 symbol foo | >> |; init-3 -2 \ >> >> which is far more elegant than the the trigger/send replacement, >> especially >> with more fields.. >> >> i think its important for students to recognise that this feature >> of messaging >> has a role to play, rather than trying to veil its use. in my >> experience >> people will tend to use [send foo] more often when they start pd, >> then begin >> abbreviating to [s foo] before they appreciate the msg shorthand [; >> foo[. but >> you are right it is a little confusing for new users.. >> > > Also note that some objects, e.g. [qlist], positively depend on the > message sending style. My students who wanted to use them have often > wondered why we hadn't covered the two ways of sending more in depth. Can you explain with an example? I don't understand why you must use message boxes semi-colons for [qlist]. The [qlist] help patch doesn't have any message boxes with semi-colons, for example. .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- There is no way to peace, peace is the way. -A.J. Muste From matju at artengine.ca Fri Mar 20 20:52:17 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 15:52:17 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( In-Reply-To: References: <200903201132.27144.dmotd@gmx.net> Message-ID: On Fri, 20 Mar 2009, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > I am not proposing to limit the use of dollar args in message boxes for > dynamic sends, that is a very useful feature. The example you give here, > though, is an example of a shortcut for typing, there is no other > benefit that I can see. Shortcuts for typing are also usually shortcuts for reading for people who are willing to accept them. > And at the risk of sounding pedantic, I am going to quote one of my favorite > ideas relating to code: "Programs should be written for people to read, and > only incidentally for machines to execute". I'd generally agree with your position, but I think that the ?only incidentally? part is quite dismissive of the reason why programmes are written in the first place. Programming languages didn't develop significantly until there were machines to run them. At the very least it waited until that there were expectations of future machines that would be able to handle them, or expectations of future projects that would benefit from newer languages. The code doesn't really exist in a bubble. But most of all, readability doesn't necessarily mean longer code, and I'd even dare say it more often means shorter code. > In Pd, [trigger] is the central mechanism for specifying execution > order. Therefore, in the interest of readability, [trigger] should be > used as much as possible. Excuse me: by opposition to what??? > Clearer documentation of the messages boxes would also be a great thing. > But you almost anything without ever using a semi-colon in a message > box, they are mostly used as a typing shortcut, In the internals of Pd, the semicolon in messages is definitely the original feature, and [s foo] was afterwards added as a "longcut". What makes [s] the appropriate default way of doing something, such that the semicolon becomes a "mere shortcut"? > and many people are confused by them, so I think we should really be > limiting them to things like dynamic sends, since that is hard to do in > other ways. People are confused by Pd... should we be limiting everybody to some other software... because there are people who might not understand Pd. If that's not the same thing as removing features that "might be confusing", I don't see how. ? the GNOME policy is "If you find a feature, it might confuse a user, so remove it." ? -- Uncyclopedia The next version of GNOME: http://uncyclopedia.wikia.com/wiki/Image:Next-gnome.png _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From reakinator at gmail.com Fri Mar 20 21:01:59 2009 From: reakinator at gmail.com (Rich E) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 21:01:59 +0100 Subject: [PD] DIY GSoC: getting those projects done In-Reply-To: <774CBB5D-E9FE-44C6-B4A0-B37E543CC3C3@eds.org> References: <774CBB5D-E9FE-44C6-B4A0-B37E543CC3C3@eds.org> Message-ID: Of course it would be nice to do the projects regardless of funding, but in reality they just won't get the same attention to detail and thoroughness. I don't have a job except through grants like this.. I'm still all for making apython libpd module... but who knows when summer rolls around and i'm broke. Do you think it is any good to question/complain to google about not getting accepted two years in a row? I looked at some of the other project pages and not only is the pd application just as good, I think the proposed projects are much more valuable to the open source community. I don't want to name anything in specific, but I saw some well funded projects that only proposed various bug fixes, that were accepted (literally there is a project that says "go through the bugs list and fix whatever you can). regards, Rich On Thu, Mar 19, 2009 at 12:08 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > So now we have a nice collection of projects sketched out from the GSoC > application, let's encourage people to take them on. If anyone wants to get > involved with Pd development, take a look at the project ideas and if you > are interested, then ask about them on the list and we can get started. > > http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/GoogleSummerOfCodeIdeas2009 > > I think next time someone else should take on the GSoC application process. > I'm 2 for 2 at not getting it, I've never had much luck with grants. And > we have lots of well-sketched out projects. We should probably chuck the > application part and start from scratch. > > .hc > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > All mankind is of one author, and is one volume; when one man dies, one > chapter is not torn out of the book, but translated into a better language; > and every chapter must be so translated.... -John Donne > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > From matju at artengine.ca Fri Mar 20 21:05:03 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 16:05:03 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( In-Reply-To: <20090320185312.GA31601@footils.org> References: <129520C8-D5DE-4FC5-869E-4BC4F1334564@eds.org> <20090320185312.GA31601@footils.org> Message-ID: On Fri, 20 Mar 2009, Frank Barknecht wrote: > For example I'd rather start with making people properly left-align > their patches and avoid crossing patch cords well, I do my best to reduce the number of crossings, but if I have to avoid crossings completely, I'll just avoid Pd... Pd doesn't make it easy to avoid crossings. Not all crossings are even bad. Crossings that are ambiguous-looking are very bad. Too many crossings in the same area is bad, except if the crossings are very regular-looking (a line crossing a bunch of parallel lines is more orderly than a line crossing a bunch of random-angled lines). _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From jancsika at yahoo.com Fri Mar 20 21:11:41 2009 From: jancsika at yahoo.com (Jonathan Wilkes) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 13:11:41 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] data-structures short questions In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <132407.19044.qm@web65608.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> I don't think it's possible to delete a ds object unless selecting it with the mouse (or maybe with the mouse msg). Notice that if you turn off drawing instructions by using an inlet to [filledcurve], for example, all other visible data structures will flash off and on again. I think that's why someone suggested a while back to just change the color to 999 instead. But if you have a lot of ds instances that you want to hide, use the -v flag, because there is no flashing and it's faster than changing the color. -Jonathan --- On Fri, 3/20/09, Jo?o Pais wrote: > From: Jo?o Pais > Subject: [PD] data-structures short questions > To: "PD-List" > Date: Friday, March 20, 2009, 9:02 PM > Hi, > > after creating a structure (object) with append, is it > possible to delete it? Or just better hide it with 0 on the > drawing objects? > > (the patch is only to display data, not to be used by the > user) > > Jo?o > > --Friedenstr. 58 > 10249 Berlin (Deutschland) > Tel +49 30 42020091 | Mob +49 162 6843570 > jmmmpais at googlemail.com | skype: jmmmpjmmmp > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From jancsika at yahoo.com Fri Mar 20 21:38:54 2009 From: jancsika at yahoo.com (Jonathan Wilkes) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 13:38:54 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] Patch-off (Was: Re: style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( ) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <551608.65869.qm@web65604.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Ok, I'd like to propose a "patch-off." What's the cleanest, clearest way to present adsr.pd from the audio tutorials? I choose this patch because there are lots of crossed wires, plus one has to leave space for the explanatory comments of the patch. Here are two versions I could think of. -Jonathan --- On Fri, 3/20/09, Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > From: Mathieu Bouchard > Subject: Re: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( > To: "Frank Barknecht" > Cc: pd-list at iem.at > Date: Friday, March 20, 2009, 9:05 PM > On Fri, 20 Mar 2009, Frank Barknecht wrote: > > > For example I'd rather start with making people > properly left-align their patches and avoid crossing patch > cords > > well, I do my best to reduce the number of crossings, but > if I have to avoid crossings completely, I'll just avoid > Pd... > > Pd doesn't make it easy to avoid crossings. > > Not all crossings are even bad. Crossings that are > ambiguous-looking are very bad. Too many crossings in the > same area is bad, except if the crossings are very > regular-looking (a line crossing a bunch of parallel lines > is more orderly than a line crossing a bunch of > random-angled lines). > > _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ > _____________________ ... > | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, > Qu?bec_______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: adsr.pd Type: application/puredata Size: 3364 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: adsr2.pd Type: application/puredata Size: 2971 bytes Desc: not available URL: From jmmmpais at googlemail.com Fri Mar 20 22:52:40 2009 From: jmmmpais at googlemail.com (=?iso-8859-15?Q?Jo=E3o_Pais?=) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 21:52:40 -0000 Subject: [PD] data-structures short questions In-Reply-To: <132407.19044.qm@web65608.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> References: <132407.19044.qm@web65608.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: > I don't think it's possible to delete a ds object unless selecting it > with the mouse (or maybe with the mouse msg). I thought so as well. so a better choice might be to hide it. > Notice that if you turn off drawing instructions by using an inlet to > [filledcurve], for example, all other visible data structures will flash > off and on again. I think that's why someone suggested a while back to > just change the color to 999 instead. But if you have a lot of ds > instances that you want to hide, use the -v flag, because there is no > flashing and it's faster than changing the color. you mean flash when the 1/0 command comes in? I was just trying that, but didn't notice anything - it was a very simple struct. what I'm thinking uses a maximum of 64 elements, so it's not that heavy. From bigswift at cox.net Fri Mar 20 19:34:01 2009 From: bigswift at cox.net (bigswift at cox.net) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 14:34:01 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] pd extended 64 bit? Message-ID: <23093926.45460.1237574041167.JavaMail.bigswift@127.0.0.1> Hello I am looking for a version of pd- extended for 64 bit. Does something exist yet? At my job we just some Nvidia Quadro plex with 8 video outputs, but the machine is 64 bit. Also any tips on running ubuntu with one of these Nvidia monster cards [Quadro Plex] woudl be greatly appreciated currently i cannot seem to get the driver to load but i think that is more of a Linux question I have 6 displays [seperate] but i would like one huge desktop 9600x1200 pp Patrick Pagano Digital Media Engineer Digital Worlds Institute University of Florida From mpuckett at imusic1.ucsd.edu Fri Mar 20 23:11:16 2009 From: mpuckett at imusic1.ucsd.edu (Miller Puckette) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 15:11:16 -0700 Subject: [PD] sigmund~ env output In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20090320221116.GD21714@imusic1.ucsd.edu> Hmm - there shouldn't be any difference between sigmund~'s env output and that of env~. What latform are you on? Perhaps I should check this out. cheers Miller On Thu, Mar 19, 2009 at 03:51:44AM -0700, Oded Ben-Tal wrote: > should the output of: > > [sigmund~ env] > > be the same (or very similar) to the output of > [env~] > > I think there is a typo in the help file (where env == notes). but I > get pretty wild output from sigmund that bears no relation (that I can > hear) to the input sound envelope. > I'm using pd-extended 0.40.3 > > Oded > > ___________________________________________________ > Oded Ben-Tal > http://ccrma.stanford.edu/~oded > oded at ccrma.stanford.edu > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From jancsika at yahoo.com Fri Mar 20 23:39:09 2009 From: jancsika at yahoo.com (Jonathan Wilkes) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 15:39:09 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] data-structures short questions In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <472938.61656.qm@web65604.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Here's a patch to show what I mean. Even for a two-pixel drawing in a hidden subpatch, flashing happens when the visibility is toggled. So if you use any other patches with datastructures (or the same one twice as an abstraction) it will be noticeable, regardless of the drawing complexity. Btw: I notice in test.pd that if leave the first abstraction open and then close test.pd, I get two errors, like: error: .x9dd9e0: no such object error: .x9cc8a0: no such object (0.42-4, winxp sp3) -Jonathan --- On Fri, 3/20/09, Jo?o Pais wrote: > From: Jo?o Pais > Subject: Re: [PD] data-structures short questions > To: jancsika at yahoo.com, "PD-List" > Date: Friday, March 20, 2009, 10:52 PM > > I don't think it's possible to delete a ds > object unless selecting it with the mouse (or maybe with the > mouse msg). > > I thought so as well. so a better choice might be to hide > it. > > > > Notice that if you turn off drawing instructions by > using an inlet to [filledcurve], for example, all other > visible data structures will flash off and on again. I > think that's why someone suggested a while back to just > change the color to 999 instead. But if you have a lot of > ds instances that you want to hide, use the -v flag, because > there is no flashing and it's faster than changing the > color. > > you mean flash when the 1/0 command comes in? I was just > trying that, but didn't notice anything - it was a very > simple struct. > what I'm thinking uses a maximum of 64 elements, so > it's not that heavy. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: ds-flashing.zip Type: application/zip Size: 5518 bytes Desc: not available URL: From jmmmpais at googlemail.com Sat Mar 21 02:28:29 2009 From: jmmmpais at googlemail.com (=?iso-8859-15?Q?Jo=E3o_Pais?=) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 01:28:29 -0000 Subject: [PD] data-structures short questions In-Reply-To: <472938.61656.qm@web65604.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> References: <472938.61656.qm@web65604.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: ah, now I know. it never happened to me, because I never used enough to make them visible. that's a nice example patch. btw, in order to control the display of the individual elements I used -v in the definitions of the base struct (that gets taken by the array). that allows for individual control, and it should be the only example missing from your file. > Here's a patch to show what I mean. Even for a two-pixel drawing in a > hidden subpatch, flashing happens when the visibility is toggled. So if > you use any other patches with datastructures (or the same one twice as > an abstraction) it will be noticeable, regardless of the drawing > complexity. > > Btw: I notice in test.pd that if leave the first abstraction open and > then close test.pd, I get two errors, like: > > error: .x9dd9e0: no such object > error: .x9cc8a0: no such object > > (0.42-4, winxp sp3) exactly same specs here. I also notice another thing: my draw area is in a gop, and the patch is to be used as a gop. so, when using a gop ind the 2nd degree, the setting for "hide object name and arguments" of that area doesn't get saved. (no problem with the level above) From jmmmpais at googlemail.com Sat Mar 21 02:37:05 2009 From: jmmmpais at googlemail.com (=?iso-8859-15?Q?Jo=E3o_Pais?=) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 01:37:05 -0000 Subject: [PD] data-structures short questions In-Reply-To: References: <472938.61656.qm@web65604.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: sorry, forgot to ask: and there's also no way of deleting an array without deleting the whole window with "clear", is there? > ah, now I know. it never happened to me, because I never used enough to > make them visible. that's a nice example patch. > > btw, in order to control the display of the individual elements I used > -v in the definitions of the base struct (that gets taken by the array). > that allows for individual control, and it should be the only example > missing from your file. > > >> Here's a patch to show what I mean. Even for a two-pixel drawing in a >> hidden subpatch, flashing happens when the visibility is toggled. So >> if you use any other patches with datastructures (or the same one twice >> as an abstraction) it will be noticeable, regardless of the drawing >> complexity. >> >> Btw: I notice in test.pd that if leave the first abstraction open and >> then close test.pd, I get two errors, like: >> >> error: .x9dd9e0: no such object >> error: .x9cc8a0: no such object >> >> (0.42-4, winxp sp3) > > exactly same specs here. I also notice another thing: my draw area is in > a gop, and the patch is to be used as a gop. so, when using a gop ind > the 2nd degree, the setting for "hide object name and arguments" of that > area doesn't get saved. (no problem with the level above) -- Friedenstr. 58 10249 Berlin (Deutschland) Tel +49 30 42020091 | Mob +49 162 6843570 jmmmpais at googlemail.com | skype: jmmmpjmmmp From hans at eds.org Sat Mar 21 02:48:46 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 01:48:46 +0000 Subject: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( In-Reply-To: <986565.60451.qm@web65614.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> References: <986565.60451.qm@web65614.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <1B0C7CDF-C9FF-4185-B8CD-030E23CD5851@eds.org> On Mar 20, 2009, at 5:51 PM, Jonathan Wilkes wrote: > > > > > --- On Fri, 3/20/09, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > >> From: Hans-Christoph Steiner >> Subject: Re: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( >> To: "dmotd" >> Cc: pd-list at iem.at >> Date: Friday, March 20, 2009, 5:25 PM >> I am not proposing to limit the use of dollar args in >> message boxes for dynamic sends, that is a very useful >> feature. The example you give here, though, is an example of >> a shortcut for typing, there is no other benefit that I can >> see. >> >> And at the risk of sounding pedantic, I am going to quote >> one of my favorite ideas relating to code: "Programs >> should be written for people to read, and only incidentally >> for machines to execute". Typing shortcuts like this >> message box below almost never save time when you look at >> the whole picture. Code is read far more times than it is >> written, so really we should be optimizing for reading >> rather than writing. > > Could you give an example that is more readable than the message box > below? The key part is that [trigger] is the essential way in Pd to represent execution order. As Frank says: "use [trigger]s everywhere". Then by breaking out the messages into their own message boxes, you can clearly see what the messages that are being send separately from their destination. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: init.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 376 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- Having lines of text execute in top-to-bottom may be more readable for code like Java, C, etc., but Pd uses right-to-left to represent execution order, hence trigger. .hc > -Jonathan > >> >> In Pd, [trigger] is the central mechanism for specifying >> execution order. Therefore, in the interest of readability, >> [trigger] should be used as much as possible. >> >> Clearer documentation of the messages boxes would also be a >> great thing. But you almost anything without ever using a >> semi-colon in a message box, they are mostly used as a >> typing shortcut, and many people are confused by them, so I >> think we should really be limiting them to things like >> dynamic sends, since that is hard to do in other ways. >> >> .hc >> >> On Mar 20, 2009, at 1:32 AM, dmotd wrote: >> >>> hmm.. generally this could be a good idea, but message >> sending is most useful >>> when initialising a number of receives ie: >>> >>> [loadbang] >>> | >>> |; init-1 6 / >>> |; init-2 symbol foo | >>> |; init-3 -2 \ >>> >>> which is far more elegant than the the trigger/send >> replacement, especially >>> with more fields.. >>> >>> i think its important for students to recognise that >> this feature of messaging >>> has a role to play, rather than trying to veil its >> use. in my experience >>> people will tend to use [send foo] more often when >> they start pd, then begin >>> abbreviating to [s foo] before they appreciate the msg >> shorthand [; foo[. but >>> you are right it is a little confusing for new users.. >>> >>> perhaps this just needs clearer documenting? 'what >> does a semi-colon at the >>> start of a message mean?' in the FAQ? >>> >>> dmotd >>> >>> On Friday 20 March 2009 10:38:06 Hans-Christoph >> Steiner wrote: >>>> Here's something that I'd like to propose >> for the style guide, based >>>> on my teaching experience: >>>> >>>> - use [send foo] instead of [; foo( for all sends >> that aren't >>>> dynamically set >>>> >>>> A lot of people find the [; foo( syntax confusing, >> and since it is >>>> commonly used, it often gets in the way of newbies >> understanding the >>>> patch. While the [; foo( syntax is definitely >> useful for dynamic >>>> sends, I don't think there is an advantage to >> using for the regular >>>> sends. So for example: >>>> >>>> [dsp 1( >>>> >>>> [send pd] >>>> >>>> instead of >>>> >>>> |; / >>>> |pd dsp 1 \ >>>> >>>> This change highlights the dataflow aspect of the >> messages over the >>>> text-style programming with syntax of the message >> box. At the very >>>> least, I think that the help patches should use >> this style, and I have >>>> started to use this style in my regular >> programming and it feels quite >>>> natural once you are used to it. I find it easier >> to read. >>>> >>>> (as for [s foo] versus [send foo] that's an >> issue I want to avoid in >>>> this discussion). >>>> >>>> .hc >>>> >>>> >>>> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> - >>>> >>>> The arc of history bends towards justice. - >> Dr. Martin Luther >>>> King, Jr. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >>>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >>>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> >> >> >> >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> Programs should be written for people to read, and only >> incidentally for machines to execute. >> - from Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Computer science is no more related to the computer than astronomy is related to the telescope. -Edsger Dykstra From jancsika at yahoo.com Sat Mar 21 02:43:46 2009 From: jancsika at yahoo.com (Jonathan Wilkes) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 18:43:46 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] data-structures short questions In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <479003.12938.qm@web65610.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> --- On Sat, 3/21/09, Jo?o Pais wrote: > From: Jo?o Pais > Subject: Re: [PD] data-structures short questions > To: "Jonathan Wilkes" , "PD-List" > Date: Saturday, March 21, 2009, 2:37 AM > sorry, forgot to ask: and there's also no way of > deleting an array without deleting the whole window with > "clear", is there? I believe that is the case. I tested -v for the elements, and didn't notice any difference. -vs for [plot] has a bug, however: it doesn't properly erase the objects until you hide and reopen the window, as in the attached patch. Additionally, arrays with graphical elements exhibit the same flashing problem I've been talking about. If you click-drag an element you'll see that all the elements after #49 start flashing. Add another drawing instruction to the template, and it's even worse: everything after the #4 flashes. -Jonathan > > > > ah, now I know. it never happened to me, because I > never used enough to make them visible. that's a nice > example patch. > > > > btw, in order to control the display of the individual > elements I used -v in the definitions of the base struct > (that gets taken by the array). that allows for individual > control, and it should be the only example missing from > your file. > > > > > >> Here's a patch to show what I mean. Even for > a two-pixel drawing in a hidden subpatch, flashing happens > when the visibility is toggled. So if you use any other > patches with datastructures (or the same one twice as an > abstraction) it will be noticeable, regardless of the > drawing complexity. > >> > >> Btw: I notice in test.pd that if leave the first > abstraction open and then close test.pd, I get two errors, > like: > >> > >> error: .x9dd9e0: no such object > >> error: .x9cc8a0: no such object > >> > >> (0.42-4, winxp sp3) > > > > exactly same specs here. I also notice another thing: > my draw area is in a gop, and the patch is to be used as a > gop. so, when using a gop ind the 2nd degree, the setting > for "hide object name and arguments" of that area > doesn't get saved. (no problem with the level above) > > > > --Friedenstr. 58 > 10249 Berlin (Deutschland) > Tel +49 30 42020091 | Mob +49 162 6843570 > jmmmpais at googlemail.com | skype: jmmmpjmmmp -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: array-flashing.pd Type: application/puredata Size: 1244 bytes Desc: not available URL: From hans at eds.org Sat Mar 21 02:58:09 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 01:58:09 +0000 Subject: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( In-Reply-To: References: <129520C8-D5DE-4FC5-869E-4BC4F1334564@eds.org> Message-ID: On Mar 20, 2009, at 6:28 PM, Matt Barber wrote: >>> Also note that some objects, e.g. [qlist], positively depend on the >>> message sending style. My students who wanted to use them have >>> often >>> wondered why we hadn't covered the two ways of sending more in >>> depth. >> >> Can you explain with an example? I don't understand why you must use >> message boxes semi-colons for [qlist]. The [qlist] help patch >> doesn't have >> any message boxes with semi-colons, for example. >> >> .hc >> > > > Sure. A [qlist] sends messages from a file (among other things). > Those messages have the same form as messages sent from message boxes: > send-receive_symbol list or whatever; > > The only difference is that the first message in a message box is sent > from its outlet rather than to a receive -- the leading semicolon you > see just means "send no message from outlet" which to me makes plenty > of sense and is not difficult to read at all. > > For instance, this: > > |; init-1 6 / > |; init-2 symbol foo | > |; init-3 -2 \ > > > Really means: > ____________ > ; > init-1 6; > init-2 symbol foo; > init-3 -2 > ____________ > > Doesn't it? (pardon my ascii) And if you did this: > > ____________ > bang; > init-1 6; > init-2 symbol foo; > init-3 -2 > ____________ > > then it would send a bang from its inlet first. > > > So in order to have my students understand [qlist] and its files, they > have found it very useful to know about the message system in message > boxes... it makes the message system in Pd on the whole a lot more > understandable and less confusing, and it seems to be less confusing > the earlier you introduce it to them. > > That's all I meant. > > Matt Ah, ok, I get it, the text in the msg boxes is basically the same as the text in the qlist file. That makes sense, and in the context of [qlist] I think it makes sense to teach about [; foo( sends. But I don't think that [qlist] is an essential object, especially for newbies. I am not saying to avoid it, I have covered it. But personally, I almost never use it. I find it easier to use [textfile] and write my own timing code. You can be a pretty advanced Pd user and not have to use semi-colons in message boxes. IMHO, semi-colons in messages boxes are no doubt useful, but they are not essential. In the interests of spreading out the learning of the concepts in Pd into as many stages as possible, I think it makes sense to avoid using semi-colons in messages boxes except in contexts that they are indispensible. So when learning about [qlist], for example, semi-colons in message boxes should definitely be covered. Outside of those contexts, I think that overall, Pd users will be better served by avoiding their use. .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Computer science is no more related to the computer than astronomy is related to the telescope. -Edsger Dykstra From hans at eds.org Sat Mar 21 03:44:13 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 02:44:13 +0000 Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: <49B7795C.3010507@iem.at> References: <1A6ACCDE-8D0F-4094-B979-16919791C754@eds.org> <161320dd0903091945n56a19a93tcfea7c6dc17dd6e7@mail.gmail.com> <58A25F57-1CBA-4BB8-BFC4-43012B0C3F0C@eds.org> <966A603E-9392-40E3-BE65-E29731616CE0@dibidut.dk> <49B7795C.3010507@iem.at> Message-ID: On Mar 11, 2009, at 8:42 AM, IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: > Steffen Juul wrote: >> On 10/03/2009, at 18.11, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >>> (...) and the green/white toggle from [pddp/dsp]. >> I quite strongly think [cvn]'s tricks should be avoided in help >> patches, especially those default for vanilla objects. > > what are "[cnv]'s tricks"? setting their colour? > i wouldn't call it a trick, as it is one of the few things you can > actually do with a cnv. > (a trick would probably be to set the send/receive labels at > runtime; which really makes patches rather unreadably; another trick > would be to move objects around to make GOPs be polymorphic; i agree > that simple every-day objects should probably avoid such things; i > still don't see any trick in setting the colour of a canvas or the > value of a numberbox) > >> Reason being it took me quite some time before i got heads and >> tails of it. Before that, it was a total mystery. Such mysteries >> are bad for learning since it may well obstruct learning of basic >> things. There is enough syntax to get into when starting to learn Pd. > > > but myteries unveiled are good for learning. > so it boils down to in-line documentation of the mysteries used. So here's my attempt at a vanilla combination of Miller's output~, rradical/ezdac~, and pddp/dsp. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: ezoutput~-help.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 207 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: ezoutput~.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 2378 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- .hc > > > > fgmasdr > IOhannes > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- "Free software means you control what your computer does. Non-free software means someone else controls that, and to some extent controls you." - Richard M. Stallman From brbrofsvl at gmail.com Sat Mar 21 04:42:02 2009 From: brbrofsvl at gmail.com (Matt Barber) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 23:42:02 -0400 Subject: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( In-Reply-To: References: <129520C8-D5DE-4FC5-869E-4BC4F1334564@eds.org> Message-ID: > Ah, ok, I get it, the text in the msg boxes is basically the same as the > text in the qlist file. ?That makes sense, and in the context of [qlist] I > think it makes sense to teach about [; foo( sends. ?But I don't think that > [qlist] is an essential object, especially for newbies. ?I am not saying to > avoid it, I have covered it. ?But personally, I almost never use it. ?I find > it easier to use [textfile] and write my own timing code. ?You can be a > pretty advanced Pd user and not have to use semi-colons in message boxes. > > IMHO, semi-colons in messages boxes are no doubt useful, but they are not > essential. ?In the interests of spreading out the learning of the concepts > in Pd into as many stages as possible, I think it makes sense to avoid using > semi-colons in messages boxes except in contexts that they are > indispensible. ?So when learning about [qlist], for example, semi-colons in > message boxes should definitely be covered. > > Outside of those contexts, I think that overall, Pd users will be better > served by avoiding their use. I would have a hard time signing up for this program. A lot of things in Pd (and any programming language) are useful but inessential. IMO the send/receive binding in messages is essential if you want to understand how Pd is organized. A lot depends on the kind of student you're working with -- many of them don't feel comfortable with things unless they see some kind of "big picture" -- for those students, they would be comforted by the fact that message boxes can store "send" messages, as well as [qlist] files, the text in .pd files, etc. Eventually students will need to learn this stuff, so the occasional | ; / | pd dsp 1 \ serves as a handy reminder rather than a detriment to readability. Part of the problem is that [; foo( is a misnomer. It's | ; / | foo \ This is the only way the syntax is clear. My vote for style goes for which makes the most sense in (often very complex) context. Matt From jancsika at yahoo.com Sat Mar 21 04:48:02 2009 From: jancsika at yahoo.com (Jonathan Wilkes) Date: Fri, 20 Mar 2009 20:48:02 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( In-Reply-To: <1B0C7CDF-C9FF-4185-B8CD-030E23CD5851@eds.org> Message-ID: <292420.79211.qm@web65615.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> --- On Sat, 3/21/09, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > From: Hans-Christoph Steiner > Subject: Re: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( > To: jancsika at yahoo.com > Cc: "dmotd" , pd-list at iem.at > Date: Saturday, March 21, 2009, 2:48 AM > On Mar 20, 2009, at 5:51 PM, Jonathan Wilkes wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > --- On Fri, 3/20/09, Hans-Christoph Steiner > wrote: > > > >> From: Hans-Christoph Steiner > >> Subject: Re: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] > versus [; foo( > >> To: "dmotd" > >> Cc: pd-list at iem.at > >> Date: Friday, March 20, 2009, 5:25 PM > >> I am not proposing to limit the use of dollar args > in > >> message boxes for dynamic sends, that is a very > useful > >> feature. The example you give here, though, is an > example of > >> a shortcut for typing, there is no other benefit > that I can > >> see. > >> > >> And at the risk of sounding pedantic, I am going > to quote > >> one of my favorite ideas relating to code: > "Programs > >> should be written for people to read, and only > incidentally > >> for machines to execute". Typing shortcuts > like this > >> message box below almost never save time when you > look at > >> the whole picture. Code is read far more times > than it is > >> written, so really we should be optimizing for > reading > >> rather than writing. > > > > Could you give an example that is more readable than > the message box below? > > The key part is that [trigger] is the essential way in Pd > to represent execution order. As Frank says: "use > [trigger]s everywhere". Then by breaking out the > messages into their own message boxes, you can clearly see > what the messages that are being send separately from their > destination. > > > > > Having lines of text execute in top-to-bottom may be more > readable for > code like Java, C, etc., but Pd uses right-to-left to > represent > execution order, hence trigger. > > .hc Pd also uses top-to-bottom to represent execution order. Maybe I've just gotten really used to msg-boxes spanning multiple lines-- they seem perfectly readable. But I can see how a single liner like [; pd-some-window clear( might confuse a student where using a msg-box -> [send] would not. -Jonathan > > > > -Jonathan > > > >> > >> In Pd, [trigger] is the central mechanism for > specifying > >> execution order. Therefore, in the interest of > readability, > >> [trigger] should be used as much as possible. > >> > >> Clearer documentation of the messages boxes would > also be a > >> great thing. But you almost anything without ever > using a > >> semi-colon in a message box, they are mostly used > as a > >> typing shortcut, and many people are confused by > them, so I > >> think we should really be limiting them to things > like > >> dynamic sends, since that is hard to do in other > ways. > >> > >> .hc > >> > >> On Mar 20, 2009, at 1:32 AM, dmotd wrote: > >> > >>> hmm.. generally this could be a good idea, but > message > >> sending is most useful > >>> when initialising a number of receives ie: > >>> > >>> [loadbang] > >>> | > >>> |; init-1 6 / > >>> |; init-2 symbol foo | > >>> |; init-3 -2 \ > >>> > >>> which is far more elegant than the the > trigger/send > >> replacement, especially > >>> with more fields.. > >>> > >>> i think its important for students to > recognise that > >> this feature of messaging > >>> has a role to play, rather than trying to veil > its > >> use. in my experience > >>> people will tend to use [send foo] more often > when > >> they start pd, then begin > >>> abbreviating to [s foo] before they appreciate > the msg > >> shorthand [; foo[. but > >>> you are right it is a little confusing for new > users.. > >>> > >>> perhaps this just needs clearer documenting? > 'what > >> does a semi-colon at the > >>> start of a message mean?' in the FAQ? > >>> > >>> dmotd > >>> > >>> On Friday 20 March 2009 10:38:06 > Hans-Christoph > >> Steiner wrote: > >>>> Here's something that I'd like to > propose > >> for the style guide, based > >>>> on my teaching experience: > >>>> > >>>> - use [send foo] instead of [; foo( for > all sends > >> that aren't > >>>> dynamically set > >>>> > >>>> A lot of people find the [; foo( syntax > confusing, > >> and since it is > >>>> commonly used, it often gets in the way of > newbies > >> understanding the > >>>> patch. While the [; foo( syntax is > definitely > >> useful for dynamic > >>>> sends, I don't think there is an > advantage to > >> using for the regular > >>>> sends. So for example: > >>>> > >>>> [dsp 1( > >>>> > >>>> [send pd] > >>>> > >>>> instead of > >>>> > >>>> |; / > >>>> |pd dsp 1 \ > >>>> > >>>> This change highlights the dataflow aspect > of the > >> messages over the > >>>> text-style programming with syntax of the > message > >> box. At the very > >>>> least, I think that the help patches > should use > >> this style, and I have > >>>> started to use this style in my regular > >> programming and it feels quite > >>>> natural once you are used to it. I find > it easier > >> to read. > >>>> > >>>> (as for [s foo] versus [send foo] > that's an > >> issue I want to avoid in > >>>> this discussion). > >>>> > >>>> .hc > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >> > --------------------------------------------------------------------------- > >>>> - > >>>> > >>>> The arc of history bends towards justice. > - > >> Dr. Martin Luther > >>>> King, Jr. > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > >>>> > _______________________________________________ > >>>> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > >>>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > >>>> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > _______________________________________________ > >>> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > >>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> > >> Programs should be written for people to read, and > only > >> incidentally for machines to execute. > >> - from Structure and Interpretation of Computer > Programs > >> > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Computer science is no more related to the computer than > astronomy is > related to the telescope. -Edsger Dykstra From kyleklip at gmail.com Sat Mar 21 06:26:18 2009 From: kyleklip at gmail.com (Kyle Klipowicz) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 00:26:18 -0500 Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: References: <1A6ACCDE-8D0F-4094-B979-16919791C754@eds.org> <161320dd0903091945n56a19a93tcfea7c6dc17dd6e7@mail.gmail.com> <58A25F57-1CBA-4BB8-BFC4-43012B0C3F0C@eds.org> <966A603E-9392-40E3-BE65-E29731616CE0@dibidut.dk> <49B7795C.3010507@iem.at> Message-ID: I likey! Although, it would be nice to include [outlet~]s on the bottom to pass through to recording devices. ~Kyle On Fri, Mar 20, 2009 at 9:44 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > On Mar 11, 2009, at 8:42 AM, IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: > > Steffen Juul wrote: >> >>> On 10/03/2009, at 18.11, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >>> >>>> (...) and the green/white toggle from [pddp/dsp]. >>>> >>> I quite strongly think [cvn]'s tricks should be avoided in help patches, >>> especially those default for vanilla objects. >>> >> >> what are "[cnv]'s tricks"? setting their colour? >> i wouldn't call it a trick, as it is one of the few things you can >> actually do with a cnv. >> (a trick would probably be to set the send/receive labels at runtime; >> which really makes patches rather unreadably; another trick would be to move >> objects around to make GOPs be polymorphic; i agree that simple every-day >> objects should probably avoid such things; i still don't see any trick in >> setting the colour of a canvas or the value of a numberbox) >> >> Reason being it took me quite some time before i got heads and tails of >>> it. Before that, it was a total mystery. Such mysteries are bad for learning >>> since it may well obstruct learning of basic things. There is enough syntax >>> to get into when starting to learn Pd. >>> >> >> >> but myteries unveiled are good for learning. >> so it boils down to in-line documentation of the mysteries used. >> > > So here's my attempt at a vanilla combination of Miller's output~, > rradical/ezdac~, and pddp/dsp. > > > > > .hc > > > >> >> >> fgmasdr >> IOhannes >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > "Free software means you control what your computer does. Non-free software > means someone else controls that, and to some extent controls you." - > Richard M. Stallman > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > -- ----- ------------ ---- ----- ---- -------- - ------ http://perhapsidid.wordpress.com http://myspace.com/kyleklipowicz -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From stffn at dibidut.dk Sat Mar 21 08:03:55 2009 From: stffn at dibidut.dk (Steffen Juul) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 08:03:55 +0100 Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: References: <1A6ACCDE-8D0F-4094-B979-16919791C754@eds.org> <161320dd0903091945n56a19a93tcfea7c6dc17dd6e7@mail.gmail.com> <58A25F57-1CBA-4BB8-BFC4-43012B0C3F0C@eds.org> <966A603E-9392-40E3-BE65-E29731616CE0@dibidut.dk> <49B7795C.3010507@iem.at> Message-ID: On 21/03/2009, at 3.44, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > On Mar 11, 2009, at 8:42 AM, IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: >> >> but myteries unveiled are good for learning. >> so it boils down to in-line documentation of the mysteries used. Unveiled mysteries are indeed good, yes, we could almost define it as learning. But did you learn Modern Algebra before Linear Algebra? > So here's my attempt at a vanilla combination of Miller's output~, > rradical/ezdac~, and pddp/dsp. I find that quite confusing. I can't say i know how it works. From fbar at footils.org Sat Mar 21 09:30:30 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 09:30:30 +0100 Subject: [PD] ADSR variations [was: Re: Patch-off] In-Reply-To: <551608.65869.qm@web65604.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> References: <551608.65869.qm@web65604.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20090321083030.GA6180@fliwatut.scifi> Hallo, Jonathan Wilkes hat gesagt: // Jonathan Wilkes wrote: > Ok, I'd like to propose a "patch-off." > > What's the cleanest, clearest way to present adsr.pd from the audio tutorials? > > I choose this patch because there are lots of crossed wires, plus one has to leave space for the explanatory comments of the patch. > > Here are two versions I could think of. Nice idea. I wrote up two alternative aproaches to ADSRing in Pd here: http://footils.org/cms/weblog/2009/mar/21/adsr-envelopes-pd/ My patch-off is this: http://footils.org/pkg/adsr-variations.pd (For a strange reason my Iceweaselfirefox doesn't show the images for that article. My iPhone does, so they must be there. Can you see the images?) Ciao -- Frank Barknecht Do You RjDj.me? _ ______footils.org__ From oded at ccrma.Stanford.EDU Sat Mar 21 10:22:45 2009 From: oded at ccrma.Stanford.EDU (Oded Ben-Tal) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 02:22:45 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] sigmund~ env output In-Reply-To: <20090320221116.GD21714@imusic1.ucsd.edu> References: <20090320221116.GD21714@imusic1.ucsd.edu> Message-ID: > Hmm - there shouldn't be any difference between sigmund~'s env output and > that of env~. What latform are you on? Perhaps I should check this out. > This is on the winXP version. thanks Oded From fbar at footils.org Sat Mar 21 11:01:18 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 11:01:18 +0100 Subject: [PD] ADSR variations [was: Re: Patch-off] In-Reply-To: <20090321083030.GA6180@fliwatut.scifi> References: <551608.65869.qm@web65604.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> <20090321083030.GA6180@fliwatut.scifi> Message-ID: <20090321100118.GA1715@footils.org> Hallo, Frank Barknecht hat gesagt: // Frank Barknecht wrote: > (For a strange reason my Iceweaselfirefox doesn't show the images for > that article. My iPhone does, so they must be there. Can you see the > images?) Never mind: Ad(sr)-blocking gone wrong... Ciao -- Frank From zmoelnig at iem.at Sat Mar 21 13:07:22 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 13:07:22 +0100 Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: References: <1A6ACCDE-8D0F-4094-B979-16919791C754@eds.org> <161320dd0903091945n56a19a93tcfea7c6dc17dd6e7@mail.gmail.com> <58A25F57-1CBA-4BB8-BFC4-43012B0C3F0C@eds.org> <966A603E-9392-40E3-BE65-E29731616CE0@dibidut.dk> <49B7795C.3010507@iem.at> Message-ID: <49C4D87A.9010701@iem.at> Steffen Juul wrote: > > On 21/03/2009, at 3.44, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > >> >> On Mar 11, 2009, at 8:42 AM, IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: >>> >>> but myteries unveiled are good for learning. >>> so it boils down to in-line documentation of the mysteries used. > > Unveiled mysteries are indeed good, yes, we could almost define it as > learning. But did you learn Modern Algebra before Linear Algebra? i don't think i can follow you here. it seems like you want to keep people from teaching "Modern Algebra" because the students might not have learned "Linear Algebra" yet. this leaves us at learning only the most simplistic ideas, unless we can enforce people to encounter mysteries only at well defined places in their life. i think most RPG work like this. i would prefer my life to be less linear. > >> So here's my attempt at a vanilla combination of Miller's output~, >> rradical/ezdac~, and pddp/dsp. > > I find that quite confusing. I can't say i know how it works. i can only tell you that it is buggy: if you "mute" and then adjust to valume (in "mute" state), and then "mute" again it doesn't do anything. probably this makes it harder to understand. gfamrd IOhannes From hans at eds.org Sat Mar 21 13:15:21 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 12:15:21 +0000 Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: <49C4D87A.9010701@iem.at> References: <1A6ACCDE-8D0F-4094-B979-16919791C754@eds.org> <161320dd0903091945n56a19a93tcfea7c6dc17dd6e7@mail.gmail.com> <58A25F57-1CBA-4BB8-BFC4-43012B0C3F0C@eds.org> <966A603E-9392-40E3-BE65-E29731616CE0@dibidut.dk> <49B7795C.3010507@iem.at> <49C4D87A.9010701@iem.at> Message-ID: On Mar 21, 2009, at 12:07 PM, IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: > Steffen Juul wrote: >> >> On 21/03/2009, at 3.44, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >> >>> >>> On Mar 11, 2009, at 8:42 AM, IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: >>>> >>>> but myteries unveiled are good for learning. >>>> so it boils down to in-line documentation of the mysteries used. >> >> Unveiled mysteries are indeed good, yes, we could almost define it as >> learning. But did you learn Modern Algebra before Linear Algebra? > > i don't think i can follow you here. > it seems like you want to keep people from teaching "Modern Algebra" > because the students might not have learned "Linear Algebra" yet. > this leaves us at learning only the most simplistic ideas, unless we > can > enforce people to encounter mysteries only at well defined places in > their life. > > i think most RPG work like this. i would prefer my life to be less > linear. > > >> >>> So here's my attempt at a vanilla combination of Miller's output~, >>> rradical/ezdac~, and pddp/dsp. >> >> I find that quite confusing. I can't say i know how it works. > > i can only tell you that it is buggy: if you "mute" and then adjust to > valume (in "mute" state), and then "mute" again it doesn't do > anything. > probably this makes it harder to understand. Now with fixed mute and outlet~s -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: ezoutput~-help.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 318 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: ezoutput~.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 2637 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- As we enjoy great advantages from inventions of others, we should be glad of an opportunity to serve others by any invention of ours; and this we should do freely and generously. - Benjamin Franklin From husk00 at gmail.com Sat Mar 21 14:59:26 2009 From: husk00 at gmail.com (Husk 00) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 14:59:26 +0100 Subject: [PD] a simple counter, I'm not able to do it tonight In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Thank you all, but I expressed bad my necessity. I found a solution but still don't like it. I find inelgant and too much complex for what it has to do. I need a counter with two bang, first one for add one unit to the counter, second one for subtract one unit. Couter must have min and max limits, like 0 and 10 (for example). I attach my patch just like example, but as I said it's not a good solution. How should you do this? cheers Husk Ben Baker-Smith On Wed, Mar 18, 2009 at 8:38 PM, Ben Baker-Smith wrote: > So you want a counter that counts to 100 and then begins at 0 (or 1) again? > > If I'm understanding correctly I would do the following: > > [bang( > | > [float]X[+ 1] > | > [select 100] > | > [0( > > > the 0 message at the end could also be a 1 depending on if you want the > counter to begin on 0 or 1, it is sent to the right inlet of float. > > the outlet of float is, in addition to [select], also sent wherever you > want the counter to be output to. > > here is the same patch as a subpatch (keeping in mind that the 0 message > still must be connected to the right inlet of float): > > [inlet] > | > [b] > | > [float]X[+ 1] > | \ > | [outlet] > | > [select 100] > | > [0( > > ...of course you can always use the [counter] object. [counter 100] will > probably do the trick all by itself. > and finally, if i'm understanding incorrectly and you wanted it to count up > and back down, use the example that was posted previously with the absolute > values and [wrap], > or use [counter 100] with the up/down message sent to it, you'll have to > check the help file for exactly what that message is... > > hope something in there helps. > > -Ben > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: updown-counter.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 1493 bytes Desc: not available URL: From husk00 at gmail.com Sat Mar 21 15:28:30 2009 From: husk00 at gmail.com (Husk 00) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 15:28:30 +0100 Subject: [PD] Qeve - free your visualz! Message-ID: I list, i would like to share with you all my last work with PD. It is a Vj like App, developed by me and others this last year, with economic support of Catalan videomaker associacion Telenoika (telenoika.net) and Hangar - centre de producci? de arts visuals (www.hangar.org) support. IT's called Qeve (Cu-Eve), and it's still a beta (with a lot of bugs :(). I use it on all my gig with very good results; I used it in many workshop too between Italy and Spain, as a tool for introducing PD programming to not programmer Vjs. It's based on pdp and pdp_opengl. It's basically a 3 channel mixer where every channel could be one of 5 different type of players: video, 3d generator, image, paint, text. You can change player in real time mixing different kind of source. It has audio analisys and BPM master clock, and give the possibility to connect every propierty of any player to music or BPM. It still miss of documentation, i'm on it. But if you are interested I can help you to run it. This is my develop blog: http://qeve.estereotips.net I hope it could interest you. bye Husk -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From matju at artengine.ca Sat Mar 21 15:28:46 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 10:28:46 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: References: <1A6ACCDE-8D0F-4094-B979-16919791C754@eds.org> <161320dd0903091945n56a19a93tcfea7c6dc17dd6e7@mail.gmail.com> <58A25F57-1CBA-4BB8-BFC4-43012B0C3F0C@eds.org> <966A603E-9392-40E3-BE65-E29731616CE0@dibidut.dk> <49B7795C.3010507@iem.at> Message-ID: On Sat, 21 Mar 2009, Steffen Juul wrote: > Unveiled mysteries are indeed good, yes, we could almost define it as > learning. But did you learn Modern Algebra before Linear Algebra? What I recall is that the first course of Modern Algebra (Group Theory) didn't really use much of anything from Linear Algebra, but the second course did. Your university may vary... Basically, there's not much in a math degree curriculum that requires Linear Algebra to be taught first. I could very well see one that teaches Modern Algebra first, and it wouldn't be a scandal to me. There are probably universities that do, somewhere -- at least if they are as experimental as they are in compsci... some universities teach computer programming in quite wild ways. So, what's your point about unveiled mysteries? _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From kyleklip at gmail.com Sat Mar 21 16:00:39 2009 From: kyleklip at gmail.com (Kyle Klipowicz) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 10:00:39 -0500 Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: References: <1A6ACCDE-8D0F-4094-B979-16919791C754@eds.org> <161320dd0903091945n56a19a93tcfea7c6dc17dd6e7@mail.gmail.com> <58A25F57-1CBA-4BB8-BFC4-43012B0C3F0C@eds.org> <966A603E-9392-40E3-BE65-E29731616CE0@dibidut.dk> <49B7795C.3010507@iem.at> Message-ID: I took Modern Algebra as my first course in "Higher Math." Big mistake. Learning to do proofs this way is a big headache, especially if you have a curmudgeonly teacher! ~Kyle On Sat, Mar 21, 2009 at 9:28 AM, Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > On Sat, 21 Mar 2009, Steffen Juul wrote: > >> Unveiled mysteries are indeed good, yes, we could almost define it as >> learning. But did you learn Modern Algebra before Linear Algebra? >> > > What I recall is that the first course of Modern Algebra (Group Theory) > didn't really use much of anything from Linear Algebra, but the second > course did. Your university may vary... > > Basically, there's not much in a math degree curriculum that requires > Linear Algebra to be taught first. I could very well see one that teaches > Modern Algebra first, and it wouldn't be a scandal to me. There are probably > universities that do, somewhere -- at least if they are as experimental as > they are in compsci... some universities teach computer programming in quite > wild ways. > > So, what's your point about unveiled mysteries? > > _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... > | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > -- ----- ------------ ---- ----- ---- -------- - ------ http://perhapsidid.wordpress.com http://myspace.com/kyleklipowicz -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jack at rybn.org Sat Mar 21 16:05:03 2009 From: jack at rybn.org (Jack) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 16:05:03 +0100 Subject: [PD] a simple counter, I'm not able to do it tonight In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <01B0894E-89C0-48E7-8358-CAB6A7CF63A7@rybn.org> Hoping it will help you in the building of your counter. ++ Jack ? Le 21 mars 09 ? 14:59, Husk 00 a ?crit : > Thank you all, but I expressed bad my necessity. I found a solution > but still don't like it. I find inelgant and too much complex for > what it has to do. I need a counter with two bang, first one for > add one unit to the counter, second one for subtract one unit. > Couter must have min and max limits, like 0 and 10 (for example). I > attach my patch just like example, but as I said it's not a good > solution. > How should you do this? > cheers > Husk > > Ben Baker-Smith > On Wed, Mar 18, 2009 at 8:38 PM, Ben Baker-Smith > wrote: > So you want a counter that counts to 100 and then begins at 0 (or > 1) again? > > If I'm understanding correctly I would do the following: > > [bang( > | > [float]X[+ 1] > | > [select 100] > | > [0( > > > the 0 message at the end could also be a 1 depending on if you want > the counter to begin on 0 or 1, it is sent to the right inlet of > float. > > the outlet of float is, in addition to [select], also sent wherever > you want the counter to be output to. > > here is the same patch as a subpatch (keeping in mind that the 0 > message still must be connected to the right inlet of float): > > [inlet] > | > [b] > | > [float]X[+ 1] > | \ > | [outlet] > | > [select 100] > | > [0( > > ...of course you can always use the [counter] object. [counter > 100] will probably do the trick all by itself. > and finally, if i'm understanding incorrectly and you wanted it to > count up and back down, use the example that was posted previously > with the absolute values and [wrap], > or use [counter 100] with the up/down message sent to it, you'll > have to check the help file for exactly what that message is... > > hope something in there helps. > > -Ben > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/ > listinfo/pd-list > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/ > listinfo/pd-list -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: counter.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 2621 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kyleklip at gmail.com Sat Mar 21 16:08:19 2009 From: kyleklip at gmail.com (Kyle Klipowicz) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 10:08:19 -0500 Subject: [PD] ADSR variations [was: Re: Patch-off] In-Reply-To: <20090321100118.GA1715@footils.org> References: <551608.65869.qm@web65604.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> <20090321083030.GA6180@fliwatut.scifi> <20090321100118.GA1715@footils.org> Message-ID: Nice. As a side note, the ADSR variations patch of Frank's show very clearly how to use [vline~] correctly: $1=lvl, $2=attack time, $3=decay time, $4=sustain level. Go to $1 over $2 msec, go to $4 over $3 msec Could use that in the vline~ help patch! ~Kyle On Sat, Mar 21, 2009 at 5:01 AM, Frank Barknecht wrote: > Hallo, > Frank Barknecht hat gesagt: // Frank Barknecht wrote: > > (For a strange reason my Iceweaselfirefox doesn't show the images for > > that article. My iPhone does, so they must be there. Can you see the > > images?) > > Never mind: Ad(sr)-blocking gone wrong... > > Ciao > -- > Frank > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -- ----- ------------ ---- ----- ---- -------- - ------ http://perhapsidid.wordpress.com http://myspace.com/kyleklipowicz -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From husk00 at gmail.com Sat Mar 21 16:16:37 2009 From: husk00 at gmail.com (husk) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 16:16:37 +0100 Subject: [PD] a simple counter, I'm not able to do it tonight In-Reply-To: <01B0894E-89C0-48E7-8358-CAB6A7CF63A7@rybn.org> References: <01B0894E-89C0-48E7-8358-CAB6A7CF63A7@rybn.org> Message-ID: <49C504D5.3020307@gmail.com> Jack escribi?: > Hoping it will help you in the building of your counter. > ++ > > Jack The B example is perfect! thank you Jack cheers Husk From palli at pallit.lhi.is Sat Mar 21 16:22:29 2009 From: palli at pallit.lhi.is (Pall Thayer) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 15:22:29 +0000 Subject: [PD] A patch to share Message-ID: <8DDE33A5-F525-4552-B416-61A5F1BF2B61@pallit.lhi.is> I was going through some old stuff on my computer and found this patch I made a few years ago for a project called Autodrawn. The piece used to run on my server but due to my laziness in updating or even upgrading my server it's no longer running. However, the PD patch that goes with the work is interesting so I want to share it with the community. I've loosely applied the GPL to it. It might not be an interesting technical feat but rather conceptually. It plays a repeated sequence from Kraftwerk's Autobahn interspersed with live mp3 feeds of police scanners. The idea was to take the idea of the autobahn as portrayed on the original album cover, as something beautifully peaceful and positive and turn it into a more modern view of the freeway as something ominous and dangerous which has taken on an even newer meaning in recent years as a symbol of the negative impacts our fossil fuel consumption is having on the environment. Also, I just think it sounds cool. Even though it's just playing the same short sequence over and over again, it's still fun to listen to for long periods of time. So, if you find something interesting to do with it, feel free. best r. Pall Thayer #N canvas 4 98 985 512 10; #X obj 149 96 mp3amp~; #X msg 19 70 disconnect; #X floatatom 193 123 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 234 96 vsl 15 128 0 1 0 0 empty empty empty 0 -8 0 8 -262144 -1 -1 0 1; #X obj 327 108 mp3amp~; #X msg 264 86 disconnect; #X floatatom 371 135 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 412 108 vsl 15 128 0 1 0 0 empty empty empty 0 -8 0 8 -262144 -1 -1 0 1; #X obj 466 123 delread~ dc 400; #X obj 466 167 delwrite~ dc 400; #X floatatom 466 105 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 12 104 delread~ sas 400; #X obj 12 148 delwrite~ sas 400; #X obj 471 145 *~ 0.1; #X obj 17 126 *~ 0.1; #X obj 149 306 mp3amp~; #X msg 86 269 disconnect; #X floatatom 193 333 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 234 306 vsl 15 128 0 1 0 0 empty empty empty 0 -8 0 8 -262144 -1 -1 0 1; #X floatatom 322 334 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 327 374 *~ 0.1; #X obj 322 352 delread~ sw 400; #X obj 322 396 delwrite~ sw 400; #X obj 544 326 f; #X obj 615 326 + 1; #X obj 683 274 tgl 15 0 empty empty empty 0 -6 0 8 -262144 -1 -1 1 1; #X floatatom 563 378 5 0 0 0 - - -; 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#X msg 496 234 \; array103 0 68 61 0 73 66 0 0 0; #X obj 448 393 osc~; #X obj 521 414 osc~; #X obj 447 347 - 24; #X obj 486 347 - 12.1; #X obj 31 413 delwrite~ autob 450; #X obj 18 353 delread~ autob 450; #X obj 682 302 metro 300; #X obj 628 44 f; #X obj 699 44 + 1; #X obj 653 44 mod 2; #X floatatom 657 76 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 612 393 delay 5; #X obj 740 38 delay 5000; #X obj 342 53 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 0 -6 0 8 -262144 -1 -1; #X obj 361 44 delay 5000; #X obj 737 60 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 0 -6 0 8 -262144 -1 -1; #X obj 496 13 metro 300000; #X obj 657 103 route 0 1; #X obj 657 125 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 0 -6 0 8 -262144 -1 -1; #X obj 686 125 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 0 -6 0 8 -262144 -1 -1; #X obj 715 125 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 0 -6 0 8 -262144 -1 -1; #X obj 49 2 delay 5000; #X obj 126 44 delay 5000; #X obj 762 153 route 0 1; #X obj 762 175 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 0 -6 0 8 -262144 -1 -1; #X obj 791 175 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 0 -6 0 8 -262144 -1 -1; 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#X msg 872 143 auto 0; #X msg 47 23 connecturl http://74.229.4.35:4000:8000; #X msg 149 67 connecturl http://69.239.28.85:8000; #X msg 180 270 connecturl http://216.66.69.100:3074/; #X msg 369 86 connecturl http://live.scanact.net:80/live; #X text 608 -5 (c) 2004 Pall Thayer - Use as per conditions of GPL v.3; #N canvas 0 22 450 300 resothing 0; #X obj 174 155 vcf~; #X obj 173 188 bp~ 20000 40; #X obj 185 123 * 100; #X obj 173 29 inlet~; #X obj 185 50 inlet; #X obj 172 253 outlet~; #X obj 290 59 loadbang; #X msg 228 123 10; #X msg 185 77 \$1 100; #X obj 185 101 line; #X connect 0 0 1 0; #X connect 1 0 5 0; #X connect 2 0 0 1; #X connect 3 0 0 0; #X connect 4 0 8 0; #X connect 6 0 7 0; #X connect 7 0 0 2; #X connect 7 0 2 0; #X connect 8 0 9 0; #X connect 9 0 2 0; #X restore 864 445 pd resothing; #X connect 0 0 12 0; #X connect 0 0 69 0; #X connect 0 1 12 0; #X connect 0 1 69 0; #X connect 0 2 2 0; #X connect 1 0 0 0; #X connect 3 0 69 1; #X connect 4 0 9 0; #X connect 4 0 71 0; #X connect 4 1 9 0; #X connect 4 1 71 0; #X connect 4 2 6 0; #X connect 5 0 4 0; #X connect 7 0 71 1; #X connect 8 0 13 0; #X connect 10 0 8 0; #X connect 11 0 14 0; #X connect 13 0 9 0; #X connect 13 0 71 0; #X connect 14 0 12 0; #X connect 14 0 69 0; #X connect 15 0 22 0; #X connect 15 0 70 0; #X connect 15 1 22 0; #X connect 15 1 70 0; #X connect 15 2 17 0; #X connect 16 0 15 0; #X connect 18 0 70 1; #X connect 19 0 21 0; #X connect 20 0 22 0; #X connect 20 0 70 0; #X connect 21 0 20 0; #X connect 23 0 24 0; #X connect 23 0 28 0; #X connect 24 0 36 0; #X connect 25 0 44 0; #X connect 25 0 54 0; #X connect 26 0 31 0; #X connect 26 0 96 0; #X connect 26 0 40 0; #X connect 26 0 41 0; #X connect 26 0 49 0; #X connect 26 0 89 0; #X connect 28 0 35 0; #X connect 28 0 100 0; #X connect 28 0 88 0; #X connect 29 0 30 1; #X connect 30 0 42 0; #X connect 30 0 97 1; #X connect 30 0 97 0; #X connect 31 0 39 0; #X connect 32 0 33 0; #X connect 33 0 30 0; #X connect 34 0 38 0; #X connect 35 1 26 0; #X connect 36 0 23 1; #X connect 38 0 30 0; #X connect 39 0 30 0; #X connect 40 0 34 0; #X connect 41 0 32 0; #X connect 43 0 83 0; #X connect 44 0 23 0; #X connect 44 0 99 0; #X connect 45 0 46 0; #X connect 45 0 48 0; #X connect 45 0 5 0; #X connect 46 0 47 0; #X connect 47 0 45 1; #X connect 48 0 55 0; #X connect 48 0 67 0; #X connect 48 0 77 0; #X connect 49 0 84 0; #X connect 50 0 53 0; #X connect 51 0 105 0; #X connect 52 0 51 0; #X connect 53 0 92 0; #X connect 54 0 45 0; #X connect 55 0 56 0; #X connect 55 1 57 0; #X connect 55 2 58 0; #X connect 56 0 52 0; #X connect 57 0 50 0; #X connect 59 0 66 0; #X connect 60 0 68 0; #X connect 61 0 62 0; #X connect 61 1 63 0; #X connect 61 2 64 0; #X connect 62 0 60 0; #X connect 63 0 59 0; #X connect 65 0 1 0; #X connect 66 0 102 0; #X connect 67 0 61 0; #X connect 67 0 65 0; #X connect 68 0 103 0; #X connect 69 0 97 0; #X connect 69 0 99 0; #X connect 70 0 97 0; #X connect 70 0 97 1; #X connect 70 0 99 0; #X connect 71 0 97 1; #X connect 71 0 99 0; #X connect 72 0 15 0; #X connect 73 0 74 0; #X connect 73 1 75 0; #X connect 73 2 76 0; #X connect 74 0 79 0; #X connect 75 0 80 0; #X connect 77 0 73 0; #X connect 77 0 78 0; #X connect 78 0 16 0; #X connect 79 0 81 0; #X connect 80 0 82 0; #X connect 81 0 104 0; #X connect 82 0 72 0; #X connect 83 0 42 0; #X connect 83 0 97 0; #X connect 83 0 97 1; #X connect 84 0 29 0; #X connect 85 0 107 0; #X connect 86 0 9 0; #X connect 86 0 12 0; #X connect 86 0 42 0; #X connect 86 0 97 1; #X connect 86 0 97 0; #X connect 87 0 86 1; #X connect 88 0 87 0; #X connect 89 0 100 0; #X connect 90 0 107 0; #X connect 91 0 107 0; #X connect 92 0 4 0; #X connect 93 0 107 1; #X connect 94 0 95 0; #X connect 95 0 93 0; #X connect 96 0 29 0; #X connect 98 0 25 0; #X connect 98 0 101 0; #X connect 99 3 94 0; #X connect 100 0 87 0; #X connect 101 0 99 0; #X connect 102 0 0 0; #X connect 103 0 0 0; #X connect 104 0 15 0; #X connect 105 0 4 0; #X connect 107 0 86 0; -- Pall Thayer palli at pallit.lhi.is http://www.this.is/pallit From stffn at dibidut.dk Sat Mar 21 16:46:09 2009 From: stffn at dibidut.dk (Steffen Juul) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 16:46:09 +0100 Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: References: <1A6ACCDE-8D0F-4094-B979-16919791C754@eds.org> <161320dd0903091945n56a19a93tcfea7c6dc17dd6e7@mail.gmail.com> <58A25F57-1CBA-4BB8-BFC4-43012B0C3F0C@eds.org> <966A603E-9392-40E3-BE65-E29731616CE0@dibidut.dk> <49B7795C.3010507@iem.at> Message-ID: To cut a longer story short: - No i don't want everyone to live there life linearly. How could that at all be assumed. (I rather embrace the opposite.) - The Pd tutorials that Miller ship with Pd is bottom-up. That is the didactic contract with the reader. So if you want a canvas'ified-gui- volume-control with such use of canvas with graph-on-parent, it need be introduced first. That could be done in the "2.control.examples" section. From bbakersmith at gmail.com Sat Mar 21 17:38:03 2009 From: bbakersmith at gmail.com (Ben Baker-Smith) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 11:38:03 -0500 Subject: [PD] a simple counter, I'm not able to do it tonight Message-ID: Check out the attached patch, more what you're looking for? -Ben Message: 3 Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 14:59:26 +0100 From: Husk 00 Subject: Re: [PD] a simple counter, I'm not able to do it tonight To: pd list Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Thank you all, but I expressed bad my necessity. I found a solution but still don't like it. I find inelgant and too much complex for what it has to do. I need a counter with two bang, first one for add one unit to the counter, second one for subtract one unit. Couter must have min and max limits, like 0 and 10 (for example). I attach my patch just like example, but as I said it's not a good solution. How should you do this? cheers Husk -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: simplecounter.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 981 bytes Desc: not available URL: From alvaro at berlin.de Sat Mar 21 17:36:46 2009 From: alvaro at berlin.de (alvaro) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 17:36:46 +0100 Subject: [PD] OSC controlled audio file player Message-ID: <1237653406.5378.10.camel@murakami> Hi all, I just spawned a rather bombastic project, called OSCPlayer. The complete description is on http://puredata.info/Members/alvarito/OSCPlayer Here's the short version: ============= During the Radio1:1 (htp://www.radioeinszueins.de) experiment, Berlin, June to August 2006, our team decided to build a broadcasting system that would cover our special needs. As a programmer, the mayor difficulty I had to face was the lack of a player that could be controlled remotely through a standard protocol. I finally settled for writing plug-ins for the Icecast streaming server. While this worked as a temporary solution, it was apparent right from the start that we were missing a central component: a player that would take commands from a scheduler, do crossfades, switch to a life stream or streams from external sources, blend in the station jingle, do dynamic range compression, and then pipe the output to Icecast. While Puredata is not the obvious choice for building such a player, such an implementation can be an excellent prototype as well as a reference, and IMHO an interesting experiment. ============ WOW am I going to bother you with questions during the next couple of months. Any kind of input much appreciated. Best, Alvaro From fbar at footils.org Sat Mar 21 17:58:34 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 17:58:34 +0100 Subject: [PD] a simple counter, I'm not able to do it tonight In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20090321165834.GA2627@footils.org> Hallo, Husk 00 hat gesagt: // Husk 00 wrote: > Thank you all, but I expressed bad my necessity. I found a solution but > still don't like it. I find inelgant and too much complex for what it has to > do. I need a counter with two bang, first one for add one unit to the > counter, second one for subtract one unit. Couter must have min and max > limits, like 0 and 10 (for example). I attach my patch just like example, > but as I said it's not a good solution. > How should you do this? Like in the attachement for example. It uses an accumulator idiom, which is a reversed traditional counter where you exhange the [f ]x[+ 1] so it becomes this instead: [+ ]x[f ]. Then drive it with -1 and 1. It's well explained in Andy Farnells fantastic Pd tutorial: http://aspress.co.uk/ds/pdf/DesigningSound_abridged_Pure_Data_introduction.pdf Page 35. Ciao -- Frank -------------- next part -------------- #N canvas 207 35 450 300 10; #X obj 120 157 +; #X obj 167 158 f; #X msg 139 124 1; #X msg 90 124 -1; #X floatatom 120 213 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X msg 139 95 up; #X msg 90 96 down; #X obj 120 241 hradio 15 1 0 11 empty empty empty 0 -8 0 10 -262144 -1 -1 0; #X obj 120 189 clip 0 10; #X connect 0 0 8 0; #X connect 1 0 0 1; #X connect 2 0 0 0; #X connect 3 0 0 0; #X connect 4 0 7 0; #X connect 5 0 2 0; #X connect 6 0 3 0; #X connect 8 0 1 0; #X connect 8 0 4 0; From puredata at 11h11.com Sat Mar 21 17:27:43 2009 From: puredata at 11h11.com (patrick) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 12:27:43 -0400 Subject: [PD] a simple counter, I'm not able to do it tonight In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49C5157F.3010307@11h11.com> hi, in pdmtl abstractions there's [count.up&down]: http://wiki.dataflow.ws/PdMtlAbstractions video showing how to install it: http://www.vimeo.com/psc pat From fbar at footils.org Sat Mar 21 19:06:35 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 19:06:35 +0100 Subject: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( In-Reply-To: References: <129520C8-D5DE-4FC5-869E-4BC4F1334564@eds.org> <20090320185312.GA31601@footils.org> Message-ID: <20090321180635.GA2368@fliwatut.scifi> Hallo, Mathieu Bouchard hat gesagt: // Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > On Fri, 20 Mar 2009, Frank Barknecht wrote: > >> For example I'd rather start with making people properly left-align >> their patches and avoid crossing patch cords > > well, I do my best to reduce the number of crossings, but if I have to > avoid crossings completely, I'll just avoid Pd... > > Pd doesn't make it easy to avoid crossings. > > Not all crossings are even bad. Crossings that are ambiguous-looking are > very bad. Too many crossings in the same area is bad, except if the > crossings are very regular-looking (a line crossing a bunch of parallel > lines is more orderly than a line crossing a bunch of random-angled > lines). Yeah, lets not turn a style guide into a style law. Sometimes crossings are not avoidable indeed. You also have to weight crossings against other layout questions, like preferring straight vertical lines and left-alignment. I think, when laying out my patches I seem to go like that: 1) avoid crossings 2) if that doesn't work, then try to avoid patch cords crossing over objects, i.e. prefer cords crossing other cords only 3) if you really have to cross over objects, make the patch cords go in straight vertical lines (straight vertical cords are the best cords anyway) 4) even then avoid crossing over object inlets or outlets, as it is ambiguous which cords are connected. Here's a patch that shows me failing all the way up to 3), but not 4): http://footils.org/images/adsr-envelope-pipe.png Ciao -- Frank Barknecht Do You RjDj.me? _ ______footils.org__ From martin.peach at sympatico.ca Sat Mar 21 19:19:23 2009 From: martin.peach at sympatico.ca (Martin Peach) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 14:19:23 -0400 Subject: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( In-Reply-To: <20090321180635.GA2368@fliwatut.scifi> References: <129520C8-D5DE-4FC5-869E-4BC4F1334564@eds.org> <20090320185312.GA31601@footils.org> <20090321180635.GA2368@fliwatut.scifi> Message-ID: Frank Barknecht wrote: > Hallo, > Mathieu Bouchard hat gesagt: // Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > >> On Fri, 20 Mar 2009, Frank Barknecht wrote: >> >>> For example I'd rather start with making people properly left-align >>> their patches and avoid crossing patch cords >> well, I do my best to reduce the number of crossings, but if I have to >> avoid crossings completely, I'll just avoid Pd... >> >> Pd doesn't make it easy to avoid crossings. >> >> Not all crossings are even bad. Crossings that are ambiguous-looking are >> very bad. Too many crossings in the same area is bad, except if the >> crossings are very regular-looking (a line crossing a bunch of parallel >> lines is more orderly than a line crossing a bunch of random-angled >> lines). > > Yeah, lets not turn a style guide into a style law. > > Sometimes crossings are not avoidable indeed. You also have to weight > crossings against other layout questions, like preferring straight > vertical lines and left-alignment. I think, when laying out my patches > I seem to go like that: > > 1) avoid crossings > > 2) if that doesn't work, then try to avoid patch cords crossing over > objects, i.e. prefer cords crossing other cords only > > 3) if you really have to cross over objects, make the patch cords go > in straight vertical lines (straight vertical cords are the best cords > anyway) > > 4) even then avoid crossing over object inlets or outlets, as it is > ambiguous which cords are connected. > It's a fun exercise for some kinds of mind to make all the non-vertical lines either horizontal or 45 degrees, as in the attached screen grab. It's a bit like the map-colouring-using-only-4-colours problem, proving if it's always possible to do this. The patches often end up using more surface area though. (It doesn't work so well if the lines are anti-aliased, as it's too hard to tell if they are really aligned modulo 45 degrees) Martin -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: adsr_cleaned.PNG Type: image/png Size: 41188 bytes Desc: not available URL: From fbar at footils.org Sat Mar 21 19:39:05 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 19:39:05 +0100 Subject: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( In-Reply-To: References: <129520C8-D5DE-4FC5-869E-4BC4F1334564@eds.org> <20090320185312.GA31601@footils.org> <20090321180635.GA2368@fliwatut.scifi> Message-ID: <20090321183905.GA2738@footils.org> Hallo, Martin Peach hat gesagt: // Martin Peach wrote: > It's a fun exercise for some kinds of mind to make all the non-vertical > lines either horizontal or 45 degrees, as in the attached screen grab. Ha, yeah, that's really cute! Unfortunatly I clashes with another personal preference I have: avoiding horizontal lines. Ciao -- Frank From jancsika at yahoo.com Sat Mar 21 21:02:39 2009 From: jancsika at yahoo.com (Jonathan Wilkes) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 13:02:39 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] ADSR variations [was: Re: Patch-off] In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <221551.31662.qm@web65604.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> I agree. I also like the use of list in that patch to store parameters. So if you wanted to set parameters with creation arguments, would it just be a matter of using $1...$5 in the [list]s and (un)[pack]? -Jonathan --- On Sat, 3/21/09, Kyle Klipowicz wrote: > From: Kyle Klipowicz > Subject: Re: [PD] ADSR variations [was: Re: Patch-off] > To: pd-list at iem.at > Date: Saturday, March 21, 2009, 4:08 PM > Nice. As a side note, the ADSR variations patch of > Frank's show very clearly > how to use [vline~] correctly: > $1=lvl, $2=attack time, $3=decay time, $4=sustain level. > Go to $1 over $2 msec, go to $4 over $3 msec > > Could use that in the vline~ help patch! > > ~Kyle > > On Sat, Mar 21, 2009 at 5:01 AM, Frank Barknecht > wrote: > > > Hallo, > > Frank Barknecht hat gesagt: // Frank Barknecht wrote: > > > (For a strange reason my Iceweaselfirefox > doesn't show the images for > > > that article. My iPhone does, so they must be > there. Can you see the > > > images?) > > > > Never mind: Ad(sr)-blocking gone wrong... > > > > Ciao > > -- > > Frank > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > > -- > ----- > ------------ > ---- ----- > ---- -------- - ------ > http://perhapsidid.wordpress.com > http://myspace.com/kyleklipowicz > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From hans at eds.org Sat Mar 21 22:47:41 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 21:47:41 +0000 Subject: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( In-Reply-To: References: <129520C8-D5DE-4FC5-869E-4BC4F1334564@eds.org> Message-ID: On Mar 21, 2009, at 3:42 AM, Matt Barber wrote: >> Ah, ok, I get it, the text in the msg boxes is basically the same >> as the >> text in the qlist file. That makes sense, and in the context of >> [qlist] I >> think it makes sense to teach about [; foo( sends. But I don't >> think that >> [qlist] is an essential object, especially for newbies. I am not >> saying to >> avoid it, I have covered it. But personally, I almost never use >> it. I find >> it easier to use [textfile] and write my own timing code. You can >> be a >> pretty advanced Pd user and not have to use semi-colons in message >> boxes. >> >> IMHO, semi-colons in messages boxes are no doubt useful, but they >> are not >> essential. In the interests of spreading out the learning of the >> concepts >> in Pd into as many stages as possible, I think it makes sense to >> avoid using >> semi-colons in messages boxes except in contexts that they are >> indispensible. So when learning about [qlist], for example, semi- >> colons in >> message boxes should definitely be covered. >> >> Outside of those contexts, I think that overall, Pd users will be >> better >> served by avoiding their use. > > > I would have a hard time signing up for this program. A lot of things > in Pd (and any programming language) are useful but inessential. > > IMO the send/receive binding in messages is essential if you want to > understand how Pd is organized. A lot depends on the kind of student > you're working with -- many of them don't feel comfortable with things > unless they see some kind of "big picture" -- for those students, they > would be comforted by the fact that message boxes can store "send" > messages, as well as [qlist] files, the text in .pd files, etc. > Eventually students will need to learn this stuff, so the occasional > > | ; / > | pd dsp 1 \ > > serves as a handy reminder rather than a detriment to readability. I agree that we should be teaching it, but if you've never done any programming whatsoever, and haven't learned about that syntax in Pd, then it is definitely a hinderance to learning Pd. There are lots of useful concepts in Pd that are not trivial to learn. If the newbie can be more gradually introduced to them, and have a cycle of attempts and successes, then they will be more willing later on to struggle to get something working. If the newbie is hit with a stack of new concepts all at once, it makes it harder to have those successes in the beginning. I also agree with you that once you are learning about messages and [qlist] that having reminders is useful. But until then they often are a major stumbling block for newbies. So I don't think everyone needs to avoid their use, but I do think that in the documentation and reference, we should avoid their use except in the contexts where they are directly relevant. A great example is A04.line2.pd. The three big message boxes are pretty impenetrable for someone with no programming experience. Compare it to the [trigger bang anything bang] on the lower right. And one last little story that I just remembered: I didn't realize that [send pd] was even a possibility until recently. I had always seen [; pd dsp 1( and figured messages to pd had to be sent that way. .hc -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: A04.line2.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 2759 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- > Part of the problem is that [; foo( is a misnomer. It's > > | ; / > | foo \ > > This is the only way the syntax is clear. > > My vote for style goes for which makes the most sense in (often very > complex) context. > > Matt ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- As we enjoy great advantages from inventions of others, we should be glad of an opportunity to serve others by any invention of ours; and this we should do freely and generously. - Benjamin Franklin From martin.peach at sympatico.ca Sat Mar 21 23:42:45 2009 From: martin.peach at sympatico.ca (Martin Peach) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 18:42:45 -0400 Subject: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( In-Reply-To: <20090321183905.GA2738@footils.org> References: <129520C8-D5DE-4FC5-869E-4BC4F1334564@eds.org> <20090320185312.GA31601@footils.org> <20090321180635.GA2368@fliwatut.scifi> <20090321183905.GA2738@footils.org> Message-ID: Frank Barknecht wrote: > Hallo, > Martin Peach hat gesagt: // Martin Peach wrote: > >> It's a fun exercise for some kinds of mind to make all the non-vertical >> lines either horizontal or 45 degrees, as in the attached screen grab. > > Ha, yeah, that's really cute! > > Unfortunatly I clashes with another personal preference I have: avoiding > horizontal lines. My personal preference says horizontal lines are all right as long as the connections are unambiguous. If a line passes across several outlets on the way to somewhere it's only acceptable when all the outlets are connected to the same inlet, so a bunch of messages to the same inlet could all be aligned on the same horizontal or diagonal line, but not vertical because then the message inlets would appear to be connected when they're not. Martin From jancsika at yahoo.com Sun Mar 22 00:51:20 2009 From: jancsika at yahoo.com (Jonathan Wilkes) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 16:51:20 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] Horizontal Connections (Was: Re: style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( ) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <595443.78967.qm@web65607.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Hi Martin, Here's my proposal: horizontal connections should only be used when the upper object has only one outlet, and the lower object has only one inlet. Otherwise there will be always be ambiguity. With your example of all outlets pointing to the same inlet, there is still ambiguity as to whether or not all the outlets are actually connected. That's fine if your patching style is to connect them first, and only line them up after. But if someone is debugs a patch they made that includes your abstraction, they would have to click and move objects to be certain all the objects are actually connected. -Jonathan --- On Sat, 3/21/09, Martin Peach wrote: > From: Martin Peach > Subject: Re: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( > To: pd-list at iem.at > Date: Saturday, March 21, 2009, 11:42 PM > Frank Barknecht wrote: > > Hallo, > > Martin Peach hat gesagt: // Martin Peach wrote: > > > >> It's a fun exercise for some kinds of mind to > make all the non-vertical lines either horizontal or 45 > degrees, as in the attached screen grab. > > > > Ha, yeah, that's really cute! > > > > Unfortunatly I clashes with another personal > preference I have: avoiding > > horizontal lines. > > My personal preference says horizontal lines are all right > as long as the connections are unambiguous. If a line passes > across several outlets on the way to somewhere it's only > acceptable when all the outlets are connected to the same > inlet, so a bunch of messages to the same inlet could all be > aligned on the same horizontal or diagonal line, but not > vertical because then the message inlets would appear to be > connected when they're not. > > Martin > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From jancsika at yahoo.com Sun Mar 22 00:53:09 2009 From: jancsika at yahoo.com (Jonathan Wilkes) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 16:53:09 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] Horizontal Connections (Was: Re: style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( ) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <106055.30668.qm@web65605.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Hi Martin, Here's my proposal: horizontal connections should only be used when the upper object has only one outlet, and the lower object has only one inlet. Otherwise there will be always be ambiguity. With your example of all outlets pointing to the same inlet, there is still ambiguity as to whether or not all the outlets are actually connected. That's fine if your patching style is to connect them first, and only line them up after. But if someone is debugs a patch they made that includes your abstraction, they would have to spend time moving objects to be certain everything is actually connected. -Jonathan --- On Sat, 3/21/09, Martin Peach wrote: > From: Martin Peach > Subject: Re: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( > To: pd-list at iem.at > Date: Saturday, March 21, 2009, 11:42 PM > Frank Barknecht wrote: > > Hallo, > > Martin Peach hat gesagt: // Martin Peach wrote: > > > >> It's a fun exercise for some kinds of mind to > make all the non-vertical lines either horizontal or 45 > degrees, as in the attached screen grab. > > > > Ha, yeah, that's really cute! > > > > Unfortunatly I clashes with another personal > preference I have: avoiding > > horizontal lines. > > My personal preference says horizontal lines are all right > as long as the connections are unambiguous. If a line passes > across several outlets on the way to somewhere it's only > acceptable when all the outlets are connected to the same > inlet, so a bunch of messages to the same inlet could all be > aligned on the same horizontal or diagonal line, but not > vertical because then the message inlets would appear to be > connected when they're not. > > Martin > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From fbar at footils.org Sun Mar 22 02:37:27 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2009 02:37:27 +0100 Subject: [PD] ADSR variations [was: Re: Patch-off] In-Reply-To: <221551.31662.qm@web65604.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> References: <221551.31662.qm@web65604.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20090322013727.GA3429@footils.org> Hallo, Jonathan Wilkes hat gesagt: // Jonathan Wilkes wrote: > I agree. I also like the use of list in that patch to store parameters. > > So if you wanted to set parameters with creation arguments, would it just be a matter of using $1...$5 in the [list]s and (un)[pack]? Yes, almost. [list] is a shortcut for [list append] so you need to use: [list append $1 $2 $3 $4 $5] or so. Ciao -- Frank From johnharrisonwsu at gmail.com Sun Mar 22 03:03:45 2009 From: johnharrisonwsu at gmail.com (John Harrison) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 21:03:45 -0500 Subject: [PD] multiple sound cards on XP? Message-ID: <7aa995dd0903211903k12b5b0cfia00e52da4e5f0e30@mail.gmail.com> Is there a way to get Pd to use multiple sound cards on XP? I've had no problem doing this in Linux, but in XP on both Pd vanilla 0.42-4and Pd-extended 0.40.3-extended-20080721, trying to configure MMIO with multiple cards is giving me: Terminal Window: waveInOpen: The specified format is not supported or cannot be translated. Use the Capabilities function to determine the supported formats. Pd console: separate audio device choice not supported\; using sequential devices. and no input/output on both cards with one configuration. If I choose ASIO, Pd crashes instantly with this message in the terminal window: Failed to open () = 0DEV not openDEV not openDeviceIoControl STOP_ISO_STREAM com plete, success = 0 DEV not openDEV not open I have ASIO4ALL installed and did seem to have good luck with that in the past on another machine... I'd like to have multiple Griffin iMics plugged into an XP machine and all accessible with one instance of Pd. -John -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jancsika at yahoo.com Sun Mar 22 05:05:15 2009 From: jancsika at yahoo.com (Jonathan Wilkes) Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 21:05:15 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] ADSR variations [was: Re: Patch-off] In-Reply-To: <20090322013727.GA3429@footils.org> Message-ID: <109351.44216.qm@web65601.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> --- On Sun, 3/22/09, Frank Barknecht wrote: > From: Frank Barknecht > Subject: Re: [PD] ADSR variations [was: Re: Patch-off] > To: pd-list at iem.at > Date: Sunday, March 22, 2009, 2:37 AM > Hallo, > Jonathan Wilkes hat gesagt: // Jonathan Wilkes wrote: > > > I agree. I also like the use of list in that patch to > store parameters. > > > > So if you wanted to set parameters with creation > arguments, would it just be a matter of using $1...$5 in the > [list]s and (un)[pack]? > > Yes, almost. [list] is a shortcut for [list append] so you > need to use: > [list append $1 $2 $3 $4 $5] or so. Actually [list $1 $2 $3 $4 $5] seems to work in this context, but I guess that's because the first arg isn't a symbol. Is that why you're saying [list append] is needed? -Jonathan > > Ciao > -- > Frank > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From brbrofsvl at gmail.com Sun Mar 22 05:52:05 2009 From: brbrofsvl at gmail.com (Matt Barber) Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2009 00:52:05 -0400 Subject: [PD] Horizontal Connections (Was: Re: style guide idea: [send Message-ID: > Here's my proposal: horizontal connections should only be used when the upper object has only one outlet, and the lower object has only one inlet. ?Otherwise there will be always be ambiguity. > > With your example of all outlets pointing to the same inlet, there is still ambiguity as to whether or not all the outlets are actually connected. ?That's fine if your patching style is to connect them first, and only line them up after. ?But if someone is debugs a patch they made that includes your abstraction, they would have to click and move objects to be certain all the objects are actually connected. There is one way to be a little less conservative, but it requires a usage agreement: if a horizontal connection travels from left to right, it must come from the right-most outlet of the upper object and must connect to the left-most inlet of the lower object. Reverse if the connection travels from right to left. The problem is there's no good way to tell if a patch adheres to the agreement. Matt From hard.off at gmail.com Sun Mar 22 08:15:24 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2009 16:15:24 +0900 Subject: [PD] does anyone know of a good Eq I can use? In-Reply-To: <49C3AC58.5060509@11h11.com> References: <49C3AC58.5060509@11h11.com> Message-ID: <161320dd0903220015v55dfffbbm8e845c0b3d74bae4@mail.gmail.com> there are a few EQ units in my DIY library: http://puredata.hurleur.com/sujet-1982-diy2-effects-sample-players-synths-sound-synthesis -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jancsika at yahoo.com Sun Mar 22 09:00:44 2009 From: jancsika at yahoo.com (Jonathan Wilkes) Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2009 01:00:44 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] Horizontal Connections (Was: Re: style guide idea: [send In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <659635.57125.qm@web65603.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Matt, I like the usage agreement idea, as long as there's visual feedback. For example, if the inlets and outlets in pd-ext protruded one or two pixels, you'd be able to see the connection crossing over to the "wrong" outlet. -Jonathan --- On Sun, 3/22/09, Matt Barber wrote: > From: Matt Barber > Subject: [PD] Horizontal Connections (Was: Re: style guide idea: [send > To: pd-list at iem.at > Date: Sunday, March 22, 2009, 5:52 AM > > Here's my proposal: horizontal connections should > only be used when the upper object has only one outlet, and > the lower object has only one inlet. ?Otherwise there will > be always be ambiguity. > > > > With your example of all outlets pointing to the same > inlet, there is still ambiguity as to whether or not all the > outlets are actually connected. ?That's fine if your > patching style is to connect them first, and only line them > up after. ?But if someone is debugs a patch they made that > includes your abstraction, they would have to click and move > objects to be certain all the objects are actually > connected. > > > There is one way to be a little less conservative, but it > requires a > usage agreement: if a horizontal connection travels from > left to > right, it must come from the right-most outlet of the upper > object and > must connect to the left-most inlet of the lower object. > Reverse if > the connection travels from right to left. The problem is > there's no > good way to tell if a patch adheres to the agreement. > > Matt > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: twopix.png Type: image/png Size: 1298 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: fourpix.png Type: image/png Size: 1334 bytes Desc: not available URL: From fbar at footils.org Sun Mar 22 12:27:49 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2009 12:27:49 +0100 Subject: [PD] ADSR variations [was: Re: Patch-off] In-Reply-To: <109351.44216.qm@web65601.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> References: <20090322013727.GA3429@footils.org> <109351.44216.qm@web65601.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20090322112749.GA5311@footils.org> Hallo, Jonathan Wilkes hat gesagt: // Jonathan Wilkes wrote: > Actually [list $1 $2 $3 $4 $5] seems to work in this context, but I guess > that's because the first arg isn't a symbol. Is that why you're saying [list > append] is needed? The [list] object will behave differently depending on its first argument: You get to choose between [list prepend], [list append], [list split] etc. The following arguments have different meanings depending on the first argument. E.g. [list split 3] will split a list at position 3, while [list prepend 3] will add a "3" in front of your incoming list. If you create [list] without any argument it will be the same as [list append], but if you'd use [list $1] then the value of $1 will decide, which kind of list operation you get. So if $1 is "split" you get a splitter, if it's "append" then you get a [list append]. So [list $1 $2 $3 $4 $5] is *not* the same as [list append $1 $2 $3 $4 $5]! Try it by sending something into both and print the result. Ciao -- Frank From jack at rybn.org Sun Mar 22 13:12:07 2009 From: jack at rybn.org (Jack) Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2009 13:12:07 +0100 Subject: [PD] a simple counter, I'm not able to do it tonight In-Reply-To: <20090321165834.GA2627@footils.org> References: <20090321165834.GA2627@footils.org> Message-ID: <6949D2AB-7ACA-4171-91BC-474729B41820@rybn.org> Very nice ! ++ Jack Le 21 mars 09 ? 17:58, Frank Barknecht a ?crit : > Hallo, > Husk 00 hat gesagt: // Husk 00 wrote: > >> Thank you all, but I expressed bad my necessity. I found a >> solution but >> still don't like it. I find inelgant and too much complex for what >> it has to >> do. I need a counter with two bang, first one for add one unit to the >> counter, second one for subtract one unit. Couter must have min >> and max >> limits, like 0 and 10 (for example). I attach my patch just like >> example, >> but as I said it's not a good solution. >> How should you do this? > > Like in the attachement for example. It uses an accumulator idiom, > which is a > reversed traditional counter where you exhange the [f ]x[+ 1] so it > becomes > this instead: [+ ]x[f ]. Then drive it with -1 and 1. > > It's well explained in Andy Farnells fantastic Pd tutorial: > http://aspress.co.uk/ds/pdf/ > DesigningSound_abridged_Pure_Data_introduction.pdf > Page 35. > > Ciao > -- > Frank counter.pd>_______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/ > listinfo/pd-list From martin.hiendl at googlemail.com Sun Mar 22 13:30:06 2009 From: martin.hiendl at googlemail.com (Martin Hiendl) Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2009 13:30:06 +0100 Subject: [PD] Problems compiling zexy Message-ID: <1237725006.13420.0.camel@martin-laptop> Hi! I have a problem with compiling zexy. I have successfully compiled Pd-Vanilla on my Ubuntu 8.10 (amd64) and its directory is: ~/install/pd-0-42-4/ And pd also found the extras when I put the path to /usr/local/lib/pd/extra/... So I tried to install zexy and downloaded it via CVS following these instructions: http://puredata.info/Members/jb/ext-doc I got stuck after "make" receiving this error message: ath=sse -msse -c -o zexy.o zexy.c gcc -export_dynamic -shared -o zexy.pd_linux *.o -lm -lc /usr/bin/ld: warning: cannot find entry symbol xport_dynamic; defaulting to 0000000000004e10 strip --strip-unneeded zexy.pd_linux cp zexy.pd_linux .. And after "make install" I got this: xyz at xyz-laptop:~/externals/zexy/src$ sudo make install [sudo] password for xyz: gcc -export_dynamic -shared -o zexy.pd_linux *.o -lm -lc /usr/bin/ld: warning: cannot find entry symbol xport_dynamic; defaulting to 0000000000004e10 strip --strip-unneeded zexy.pd_linux cp zexy.pd_linux .. ./makealias.sh ../src/alias ../src ../reference ./makealias.sh: 24: Syntax error: "(" unexpected make: *** [alias-bin] Error 2 What can I do? Thank you! Martin From tectp at telefonica.net Sun Mar 22 13:37:28 2009 From: tectp at telefonica.net (nick burge) Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2009 13:37:28 +0100 Subject: [PD] Multiple sound cards on XP In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: I had exactly the same messages when installing my firewire interface (fireface400)and attempting to get the 8 ins and outs that should have been available. By changing the samplerate from 44.1 to 48khz in audio settings I was able to get the thing working....the system clock of the interface has to be in agreement with pd I suppose. Good luck, Nick -----Original Message----- From: pd-list-bounces at iem.at [mailto:pd-list-bounces at iem.at] On Behalf Of pd-list-request at iem.at Sent: 22 March 2009 12:00 To: pd-list at iem.at Subject: Pd-list Digest, Vol 48, Issue 110 Send Pd-list mailing list submissions to pd-list at iem.at To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to pd-list-request at iem.at You can reach the person managing the list at pd-list-owner at iem.at When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of Pd-list digest..." Today's Topics: 1. multiple sound cards on XP? (John Harrison) 2. Re: ADSR variations [was: Re: Patch-off] (Jonathan Wilkes) 3. Horizontal Connections (Was: Re: style guide idea: [send (Matt Barber) 4. Re: does anyone know of a good Eq I can use? (hard off) 5. Re: Horizontal Connections (Was: Re: style guide idea: [send (Jonathan Wilkes) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 21:03:45 -0500 From: John Harrison Subject: [PD] multiple sound cards on XP? To: PD List Message-ID: <7aa995dd0903211903k12b5b0cfia00e52da4e5f0e30 at mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Is there a way to get Pd to use multiple sound cards on XP? I've had no problem doing this in Linux, but in XP on both Pd vanilla 0.42-4and Pd-extended 0.40.3-extended-20080721, trying to configure MMIO with multiple cards is giving me: Terminal Window: waveInOpen: The specified format is not supported or cannot be translated. Use the Capabilities function to determine the supported formats. Pd console: separate audio device choice not supported\; using sequential devices. and no input/output on both cards with one configuration. If I choose ASIO, Pd crashes instantly with this message in the terminal window: Failed to open () = 0DEV not openDEV not openDeviceIoControl STOP_ISO_STREAM com plete, success = 0 DEV not openDEV not open I have ASIO4ALL installed and did seem to have good luck with that in the past on another machine... I'd like to have multiple Griffin iMics plugged into an XP machine and all accessible with one instance of Pd. -John -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 21:05:15 -0700 (PDT) From: Jonathan Wilkes Subject: Re: [PD] ADSR variations [was: Re: Patch-off] To: pd-list at iem.at, Frank Barknecht Message-ID: <109351.44216.qm at web65601.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii --- On Sun, 3/22/09, Frank Barknecht wrote: > From: Frank Barknecht > Subject: Re: [PD] ADSR variations [was: Re: Patch-off] > To: pd-list at iem.at > Date: Sunday, March 22, 2009, 2:37 AM > Hallo, > Jonathan Wilkes hat gesagt: // Jonathan Wilkes wrote: > > > I agree. I also like the use of list in that patch to > store parameters. > > > > So if you wanted to set parameters with creation > arguments, would it just be a matter of using $1...$5 in the > [list]s and (un)[pack]? > > Yes, almost. [list] is a shortcut for [list append] so you > need to use: > [list append $1 $2 $3 $4 $5] or so. Actually [list $1 $2 $3 $4 $5] seems to work in this context, but I guess that's because the first arg isn't a symbol. Is that why you're saying [list append] is needed? -Jonathan > > Ciao > -- > Frank > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2009 00:52:05 -0400 From: Matt Barber Subject: [PD] Horizontal Connections (Was: Re: style guide idea: [send To: pd-list at iem.at Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > Here's my proposal: horizontal connections should only be used when the upper object has only one outlet, and the lower object has only one inlet. ?Otherwise there will be always be ambiguity. > > With your example of all outlets pointing to the same inlet, there is still ambiguity as to whether or not all the outlets are actually connected. ?That's fine if your patching style is to connect them first, and only line them up after. ?But if someone is debugs a patch they made that includes your abstraction, they would have to click and move objects to be certain all the objects are actually connected. There is one way to be a little less conservative, but it requires a usage agreement: if a horizontal connection travels from left to right, it must come from the right-most outlet of the upper object and must connect to the left-most inlet of the lower object. Reverse if the connection travels from right to left. The problem is there's no good way to tell if a patch adheres to the agreement. Matt ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2009 16:15:24 +0900 From: hard off Subject: Re: [PD] does anyone know of a good Eq I can use? To: patrick Cc: pd-list at iem.at Message-ID: <161320dd0903220015v55dfffbbm8e845c0b3d74bae4 at mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" there are a few EQ units in my DIY library: http://puredata.hurleur.com/sujet-1982-diy2-effects-sample-players-synths-so und-synthesis -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2009 01:00:44 -0700 (PDT) From: Jonathan Wilkes Subject: Re: [PD] Horizontal Connections (Was: Re: style guide idea: [send To: pd-list at iem.at, Matt Barber Message-ID: <659635.57125.qm at web65603.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Matt, I like the usage agreement idea, as long as there's visual feedback. For example, if the inlets and outlets in pd-ext protruded one or two pixels, you'd be able to see the connection crossing over to the "wrong" outlet. -Jonathan --- On Sun, 3/22/09, Matt Barber wrote: > From: Matt Barber > Subject: [PD] Horizontal Connections (Was: Re: style guide idea: [send > To: pd-list at iem.at > Date: Sunday, March 22, 2009, 5:52 AM > > Here's my proposal: horizontal connections should > only be used when the upper object has only one outlet, and > the lower object has only one inlet. ?Otherwise there will > be always be ambiguity. > > > > With your example of all outlets pointing to the same > inlet, there is still ambiguity as to whether or not all the > outlets are actually connected. ?That's fine if your > patching style is to connect them first, and only line them > up after. ?But if someone is debugs a patch they made that > includes your abstraction, they would have to click and move > objects to be certain all the objects are actually > connected. > > > There is one way to be a little less conservative, but it > requires a > usage agreement: if a horizontal connection travels from > left to > right, it must come from the right-most outlet of the upper > object and > must connect to the left-most inlet of the lower object. > Reverse if > the connection travels from right to left. The problem is > there's no > good way to tell if a patch adheres to the agreement. > > Matt > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: twopix.png Type: image/png Size: 1298 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: fourpix.png Type: image/png Size: 1334 bytes Desc: not available URL: ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ Pd-list mailing list Pd-list at iem.at to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list End of Pd-list Digest, Vol 48, Issue 110 **************************************** From johnharrisonwsu at gmail.com Sun Mar 22 14:55:11 2009 From: johnharrisonwsu at gmail.com (John Harrison) Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2009 08:55:11 -0500 Subject: [PD] Multiple sound cards on XP In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <7aa995dd0903220655y77cfda67s821d980616067455@mail.gmail.com> Thanks. Tried that (48K sampling) but no dice. However, I did finally get it to work: - Installed ASIO4ALL - Uninstalled the Samson Softpre audio driver (which I wasn't using). I discovered that this driver was causing Pd to crash when I was choosing ASIO from Pd. - From the ASIO dialog box in Pd, chose ASIO4ALL and made the number of channels equal to the number of sound cards * 2. -John On Sun, Mar 22, 2009 at 7:37 AM, nick burge wrote: > > I had exactly the same messages when installing my firewire interface > (fireface400)and attempting to get the 8 ins and outs that should have been > available. > By changing the samplerate from 44.1 to 48khz in audio settings I was able > to get the thing working....the system clock of the interface has to be in > agreement with pd I suppose. > Good luck, Nick > > > > > -----Original Message----- > From: pd-list-bounces at iem.at [mailto:pd-list-bounces at iem.at] On Behalf Of > pd-list-request at iem.at > Sent: 22 March 2009 12:00 > To: pd-list at iem.at > Subject: Pd-list Digest, Vol 48, Issue 110 > > Send Pd-list mailing list submissions to > pd-list at iem.at > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > pd-list-request at iem.at > > You can reach the person managing the list at > pd-list-owner at iem.at > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Pd-list digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. multiple sound cards on XP? (John Harrison) > 2. Re: ADSR variations [was: Re: Patch-off] (Jonathan Wilkes) > 3. Horizontal Connections (Was: Re: style guide idea: [send > (Matt Barber) > 4. Re: does anyone know of a good Eq I can use? (hard off) > 5. Re: Horizontal Connections (Was: Re: style guide idea: [send > (Jonathan Wilkes) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 21:03:45 -0500 > From: John Harrison > Subject: [PD] multiple sound cards on XP? > To: PD List > Message-ID: > <7aa995dd0903211903k12b5b0cfia00e52da4e5f0e30 at mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > Is there a way to get Pd to use multiple sound cards on XP? I've had no > problem doing this in Linux, but in XP on both Pd vanilla 0.42-4and > Pd-extended 0.40.3-extended-20080721, trying to configure MMIO with > multiple > cards is giving me: > > Terminal Window: > > waveInOpen: The specified format is not supported or cannot be translated. > Use the Capabilities function to determine the supported formats. > > Pd console: > > separate audio device choice not supported\; using sequential devices. > > and no input/output on both cards with one configuration. > > If I choose ASIO, Pd crashes instantly with this message in the terminal > window: > Failed to open () = 0DEV not openDEV not openDeviceIoControl > STOP_ISO_STREAM > com > plete, success = 0 > DEV not openDEV not open > > I have ASIO4ALL installed and did seem to have good luck with that in the > past on another machine... > > I'd like to have multiple Griffin iMics plugged into an XP machine and all > accessible with one instance of Pd. > > -John > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: > < > http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/attachments/20090321/3ded9801/ > attachment-0001.htm > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Sat, 21 Mar 2009 21:05:15 -0700 (PDT) > From: Jonathan Wilkes > Subject: Re: [PD] ADSR variations [was: Re: Patch-off] > To: pd-list at iem.at, Frank Barknecht > Message-ID: <109351.44216.qm at web65601.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > > > > > --- On Sun, 3/22/09, Frank Barknecht wrote: > > > From: Frank Barknecht > > Subject: Re: [PD] ADSR variations [was: Re: Patch-off] > > To: pd-list at iem.at > > Date: Sunday, March 22, 2009, 2:37 AM > > Hallo, > > Jonathan Wilkes hat gesagt: // Jonathan Wilkes wrote: > > > > > I agree. I also like the use of list in that patch to > > store parameters. > > > > > > So if you wanted to set parameters with creation > > arguments, would it just be a matter of using $1...$5 in the > > [list]s and (un)[pack]? > > > > Yes, almost. [list] is a shortcut for [list append] so you > > need to use: > > [list append $1 $2 $3 $4 $5] or so. > > Actually [list $1 $2 $3 $4 $5] seems to work in this context, but I guess > that's because the first arg isn't a symbol. Is that why you're saying > [list append] is needed? > > -Jonathan > > > > > Ciao > > -- > > Frank > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2009 00:52:05 -0400 > From: Matt Barber > Subject: [PD] Horizontal Connections (Was: Re: style guide idea: > [send > To: pd-list at iem.at > Message-ID: > > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 > > > Here's my proposal: horizontal connections should only be used when the > upper object has only one outlet, and the lower object has only one inlet. > ?Otherwise there will be always be ambiguity. > > > > With your example of all outlets pointing to the same inlet, there is > still ambiguity as to whether or not all the outlets are actually > connected. > ?That's fine if your patching style is to connect them first, and only line > them up after. ?But if someone is debugs a patch they made that includes > your abstraction, they would have to click and move objects to be certain > all the objects are actually connected. > > > There is one way to be a little less conservative, but it requires a > usage agreement: if a horizontal connection travels from left to > right, it must come from the right-most outlet of the upper object and > must connect to the left-most inlet of the lower object. Reverse if > the connection travels from right to left. The problem is there's no > good way to tell if a patch adheres to the agreement. > > Matt > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2009 16:15:24 +0900 > From: hard off > Subject: Re: [PD] does anyone know of a good Eq I can use? > To: patrick > Cc: pd-list at iem.at > Message-ID: > <161320dd0903220015v55dfffbbm8e845c0b3d74bae4 at mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > there are a few EQ units in my DIY library: > > > http://puredata.hurleur.com/sujet-1982-diy2-effects-sample-players-synths-so > und-synthesis > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: > < > http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/attachments/20090322/bc542942/ > attachment-0001.htm > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 5 > Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2009 01:00:44 -0700 (PDT) > From: Jonathan Wilkes > Subject: Re: [PD] Horizontal Connections (Was: Re: style guide idea: > [send > To: pd-list at iem.at, Matt Barber > Message-ID: <659635.57125.qm at web65603.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > Matt, > I like the usage agreement idea, as long as there's visual feedback. > For example, if the inlets and outlets in pd-ext protruded one or two > pixels, you'd be able to see the connection crossing over to the "wrong" > outlet. > > -Jonathan > > --- On Sun, 3/22/09, Matt Barber wrote: > > > From: Matt Barber > > Subject: [PD] Horizontal Connections (Was: Re: style guide idea: [send > > To: pd-list at iem.at > > Date: Sunday, March 22, 2009, 5:52 AM > > > Here's my proposal: horizontal connections should > > only be used when the upper object has only one outlet, and > > the lower object has only one inlet. ?Otherwise there will > > be always be ambiguity. > > > > > > With your example of all outlets pointing to the same > > inlet, there is still ambiguity as to whether or not all the > > outlets are actually connected. ?That's fine if your > > patching style is to connect them first, and only line them > > up after. ?But if someone is debugs a patch they made that > > includes your abstraction, they would have to click and move > > objects to be certain all the objects are actually > > connected. > > > > > > There is one way to be a little less conservative, but it > > requires a > > usage agreement: if a horizontal connection travels from > > left to > > right, it must come from the right-most outlet of the upper > > object and > > must connect to the left-most inlet of the lower object. > > Reverse if > > the connection travels from right to left. The problem is > > there's no > > good way to tell if a patch adheres to the agreement. > > > > Matt > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: twopix.png > Type: image/png > Size: 1298 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: > < > http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/attachments/20090322/684da702/ > attachment-0002.png > > > -------------- next part -------------- > A non-text attachment was scrubbed... > Name: fourpix.png > Type: image/png > Size: 1334 bytes > Desc: not available > URL: > < > http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/attachments/20090322/684da702/ > attachment-0003.png > > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list mailing list > Pd-list at iem.at > to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > End of Pd-list Digest, Vol 48, Issue 110 > **************************************** > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From martin.peach at sympatico.ca Sun Mar 22 16:35:57 2009 From: martin.peach at sympatico.ca (Martin Peach) Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2009 11:35:57 -0400 Subject: [PD] Horizontal Connections (Was: Re: style guide idea: [send In-Reply-To: <659635.57125.qm@web65603.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> References: <659635.57125.qm@web65603.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Jonathan Wilkes wrote: > Matt, > I like the usage agreement idea, as long as there's visual feedback. For example, if the inlets and outlets in pd-ext protruded one or two pixels, you'd be able to see the connection crossing over to the "wrong" outlet. > Maybe better if outlets with connections were coloured differently. Martin From matju at artengine.ca Sun Mar 22 17:46:28 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2009 12:46:28 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] a simple counter, I'm not able to do it tonight In-Reply-To: <20090321165834.GA2627@footils.org> References: <20090321165834.GA2627@footils.org> Message-ID: On Sat, 21 Mar 2009, Frank Barknecht wrote: > Like in the attachement for example. It uses an accumulator idiom, which is a > reversed traditional counter where you exhange the [f ]x[+ 1] so it becomes > this instead: [+ ]x[f ]. Then drive it with -1 and 1. Actually, the latter [f] could be replaced by a [t f], as it's just a gimmick to get pd to allow the [+] to be connected to itself. a [f] in which the right-inlet is unused, is pretty much a [t f]. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From thorrific at gmail.com Sun Mar 22 19:41:07 2009 From: thorrific at gmail.com (Thor Johnson) Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2009 13:41:07 -0500 Subject: [PD] flashserver works great on one computer but not on another! Please help! Message-ID: <9e7a74e30903221141u17e68594n30452a2bebbdfdd1@mail.gmail.com> Hi, I use a MacBook Pro 2.4 Ghz Intel Core 2 Duo, OSX 10.5.4, Pd-extended 0.40.3, for my main computer. I made a thing using flashserver that I use to send variables to Flash to control stuff there, that all works great! My big problem is that I have an art show coming up, opening this Saturday March 28th, and the gallery secured two Dual 2.5 GHz PowerPC G5s for my show, (even though I told them I probably needed intel macs). I installed the latest version of Pd-extended for PowerPC Macs on these computers, and now when I go to create the flashserver object in PureData on those computers, it seemingly creates just fine, but in the output console window of PureData I get the message: "error: flashserver crossdomain.xml not implemented in Pd" and the flashserver doesn't work even though the object creates. Help!!!! Does anyone know why this problem is happening and what if anything I can do to fix it??? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jamie at postlude.co.uk Sun Mar 22 20:04:49 2009 From: jamie at postlude.co.uk (Jamie Bullock) Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2009 19:04:49 +0000 Subject: [PD] Qeve - free your visualz! In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <5842B661-82B0-4FC3-A66C-E2C9256E47E1@postlude.co.uk> On 21 Mar 2009, at 14:28, Husk 00 wrote: > I list, > i would like to share with you all my last work with PD. It is a Vj > like App, developed by me and others this last year, with economic > support of Catalan videomaker associacion Telenoika (telenoika.net) > and Hangar - centre de producci? de arts visuals (www.hangar.org) > support. > IT's called Qeve (Cu-Eve), and it's still a beta (with a lot of > bugs :(). > I use it on all my gig with very good results; I used it in many > workshop too between Italy and Spain, as a tool for introducing PD > programming to not programmer Vjs. It's based on pdp and pdp_opengl. > It's basically a 3 channel mixer where every channel could be one of > 5 different type of players: video, 3d generator, image, paint, > text. You can change player in real time mixing different kind of > source. It has audio analisys and BPM master clock, and give the > possibility to connect every propierty of any player to music or > BPM. > It still miss of documentation, i'm on it. But if you are interested > I can help you to run it. > This is my develop blog: > http://qeve.estereotips.net Congratulations! This looks like an incredible piece of Pd programming. I can't wait to try it... Will give you some feedback when I do. best, Jamie -- http://www.jamiebullock.com From jancsika at yahoo.com Sun Mar 22 21:54:58 2009 From: jancsika at yahoo.com (Jonathan Wilkes) Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2009 13:54:58 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] ADSR variations [was: Re: Patch-off] In-Reply-To: <20090322112749.GA5311@footils.org> Message-ID: <465598.32132.qm@web65605.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Hi Frank, I understand what you describe. But when the 1st creation argument is a float, [list $1] and [list append $1] print the exact same result as far as I can see. (Shaky comp sci terminology to follow...) Looking at list_new in x_list.c, if the first creation argument of [list $1 $2 etc.] is a not a symbol, the object is deemed a [list append] and the args are left alone. For [list append $1 $2 etc.] however, after "append" is matched, the argument count is decremented and the 2nd arg becomes the 1st. Consequently, the behavior of [list $1 $2 etc.] is exactly the same as [list append $1 $2 etc.] in this case. -Jonathan --- On Sun, 3/22/09, Frank Barknecht wrote: > From: Frank Barknecht > Subject: Re: [PD] ADSR variations [was: Re: Patch-off] > To: pd-list at iem.at > Date: Sunday, March 22, 2009, 12:27 PM > Hallo, > Jonathan Wilkes hat gesagt: // Jonathan Wilkes wrote: > > > Actually [list $1 $2 $3 $4 $5] seems to work in this > context, but I guess > > that's because the first arg isn't a symbol. > Is that why you're saying [list > > append] is needed? > > The [list] object will behave differently depending on its > first argument: You > get to choose between [list prepend], [list append], [list > split] etc. The > following arguments have different meanings depending on > the first argument. > > E.g. [list split 3] will split a list at position 3, while > [list prepend 3] > will add a "3" in front of your incoming list. > > If you create [list] without any argument it will be the > same as [list append], > but if you'd use [list $1] then the value of $1 will > decide, which kind of list > operation you get. So if $1 is "split" you get a > splitter, if it's "append" > then you get a [list append]. > > So [list $1 $2 $3 $4 $5] is *not* the same as [list append > $1 $2 $3 $4 $5]! > Try it by sending something into both and print the result. > > Ciao > -- > Frank > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From brbrofsvl at gmail.com Sun Mar 22 22:00:09 2009 From: brbrofsvl at gmail.com (Matt Barber) Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2009 17:00:09 -0400 Subject: [PD] list-setclass Message-ID: Hello, Attached is a list abstraction that outputs the set-class (in the music theory sense) of the incoming list taken as a set of pitches. Another name for the abstraction might be [list-primeform]. The modulus is variable and can be set by a creation argument -- it defaults to 12. It requires some form of [list-sort], which I've included from the list-abs directory. See, for instance: http://lulu.esm.rochester.edu/rdm/pdflib/set-class.table.pdf I assume there's already something like this in Pd-land, but I thought it would be fun to build one. Matt -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: list-setclass.zip Type: application/zip Size: 4103 bytes Desc: not available URL: From jancsika at yahoo.com Sun Mar 22 22:01:42 2009 From: jancsika at yahoo.com (Jonathan Wilkes) Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2009 14:01:42 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] Horizontal Connections (Was: Re: style guide idea: [send In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <6942.35334.qm@web65616.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Martin, That's a great idea. You would get visual feedback for all relevant cases. And I now realize that the protruding inlets/outlets don't resolve the ambiguity of the case you mentioned, whereas colored connections do. -Jonathan --- On Sun, 3/22/09, Martin Peach wrote: > From: Martin Peach > Subject: Re: [PD] Horizontal Connections (Was: Re: style guide idea: [send > To: "Jonathan Wilkes" > Cc: pd-list at iem.at, "Matt Barber" > Date: Sunday, March 22, 2009, 4:35 PM > Jonathan Wilkes wrote: > > Matt, > > I like the usage agreement idea, as long as > there's visual feedback. For example, if the inlets and > outlets in pd-ext protruded one or two pixels, you'd be > able to see the connection crossing over to the > "wrong" outlet. > > > > Maybe better if outlets with connections were coloured > differently. > > Martin From hans at eds.org Sun Mar 22 14:23:14 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2009 09:23:14 -0400 Subject: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( In-Reply-To: <20090321183905.GA2738@footils.org> References: <129520C8-D5DE-4FC5-869E-4BC4F1334564@eds.org> <20090320185312.GA31601@footils.org> <20090321180635.GA2368@fliwatut.scifi> <20090321183905.GA2738@footils.org> Message-ID: <8564E2D3-5B00-4597-8DE9-FBB0006BD078@eds.org> On Mar 21, 2009, at 2:39 PM, Frank Barknecht wrote: > Hallo, > Martin Peach hat gesagt: // Martin Peach wrote: > >> It's a fun exercise for some kinds of mind to make all the non- >> vertical >> lines either horizontal or 45 degrees, as in the attached screen >> grab. > > Ha, yeah, that's really cute! > > Unfortunatly I clashes with another personal preference I have: > avoiding > horizontal lines. I think avoiding horizontal lines should be pretty high up there on the no-no list. Or making lines that go up for anything but feedback/ loops. Any I can't think of any reason why you should ever cross over an inlet or outlet, i.e. Frank's #4. I made another attempt on A04.line2.pd to highlight the messages themselves: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: A04.line2.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 2836 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- .hc > > > Ciao > -- > Frank > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- http://at.or.at/hans/ From hans at eds.org Sun Mar 22 14:41:24 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2009 09:41:24 -0400 Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: References: <1A6ACCDE-8D0F-4094-B979-16919791C754@eds.org> <161320dd0903091945n56a19a93tcfea7c6dc17dd6e7@mail.gmail.com> <58A25F57-1CBA-4BB8-BFC4-43012B0C3F0C@eds.org> <966A603E-9392-40E3-BE65-E29731616CE0@dibidut.dk> <49B7795C.3010507@iem.at> Message-ID: <9C503D2B-63A4-40AF-9F0D-EACB710A6FDE@eds.org> On Mar 21, 2009, at 11:46 AM, Steffen Juul wrote: > To cut a longer story short: > > - No i don't want everyone to live there life linearly. How could > that at all be assumed. (I rather embrace the opposite.) > > - The Pd tutorials that Miller ship with Pd is bottom-up. That is > the didactic contract with the reader. So if you want a canvas'ified- > gui-volume-control with such use of canvas with graph-on-parent, it > need be introduced first. That could be done in the > "2.control.examples" section. I used to believe strongly in what you are saying as well, but my opinion has changed a bit. I definitely agree that concepts should be introduced before the are used in the tutorials. We can also rely on existing knowledge of computers, and GUI elements are pretty widely understood. I have seen lots of people who don't know that they can click and drag in the number boxes. That's not a common GUI element outside of Pd. Buttons and sliders are much more common, and few people need to have them explained. So if we are introducing the concept of objects and GUI in Pd, then I think it is safe to use GOP objects. After all, we don't expect newbies to know anything about C or Tcl, but that's under it it all. I don't think we should add an output~ to help patches that don't already have them. I just think we should have a more intuitive and usable output~. The current one already uses GOP, so that's not a change. .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- "Free software means you control what your computer does. Non-free software means someone else controls that, and to some extent controls you." - Richard M. Stallman From hans at eds.org Sun Mar 22 16:33:55 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2009 11:33:55 -0400 Subject: [PD] DIY GSoC: getting those projects done In-Reply-To: References: <774CBB5D-E9FE-44C6-B4A0-B37E543CC3C3@eds.org> Message-ID: That is indeed true. I suppose it wouldn't hurt to nag google, and it might even help. But I don't think it would change this year's outcome. I think the key to getting a grant like this is to know what they are looking for and tailor the grant to that. It would be useful if someone tried to find any materials from the successful projects and report back what they learned. I tried to do that in the past. .hc On Mar 20, 2009, at 4:01 PM, Rich E wrote: > Of course it would be nice to do the projects regardless of funding, > but in reality they just won't get the same attention to detail and > thoroughness. I don't have a job except through grants like this.. > > I'm still all for making apython libpd module... but who knows when > summer rolls around and i'm broke. > > Do you think it is any good to question/complain to google about not > getting accepted two years in a row? I looked at some of the other > project pages and not only is the pd application just as good, I think > the proposed projects are much more valuable to the open source > community. I don't want to name anything in specific, but I saw some > well funded projects that only proposed various bug fixes, that were > accepted (literally there is a project that says "go through the bugs > list and fix whatever you can). > > regards, > Rich > > On Thu, Mar 19, 2009 at 12:08 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner > wrote: >> >> So now we have a nice collection of projects sketched out from the >> GSoC >> application, let's encourage people to take them on. If anyone >> wants to get >> involved with Pd development, take a look at the project ideas and >> if you >> are interested, then ask about them on the list and we can get >> started. >> >> http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/GoogleSummerOfCodeIdeas2009 >> >> I think next time someone else should take on the GSoC application >> process. >> I'm 2 for 2 at not getting it, I've never had much luck with >> grants. And >> we have lots of well-sketched out projects. We should probably >> chuck the >> application part and start from scratch. >> >> .hc >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> All mankind is of one author, and is one volume; when one man dies, >> one >> chapter is not torn out of the book, but translated into a better >> language; >> and every chapter must be so translated.... -John Donne >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Programs should be written for people to read, and only incidentally for machines to execute. - from Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs From fbar at footils.org Sun Mar 22 23:18:23 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2009 23:18:23 +0100 Subject: [PD] ADSR variations [was: Re: Patch-off] In-Reply-To: <465598.32132.qm@web65605.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> References: <20090322112749.GA5311@footils.org> <465598.32132.qm@web65605.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20090322221823.GA6429@footils.org> Hallo Jonathan, Jonathan Wilkes hat gesagt: // Jonathan Wilkes wrote: > I understand what you describe. But when the 1st creation argument is a > float, [list $1] and [list append $1] print the exact same result as far as > I can see. > > (Shaky comp sci terminology to follow...) Looking at list_new in x_list.c, if > the first creation argument of [list $1 $2 etc.] is a not a symbol, the > object is deemed a [list append] and the args are left alone. For [list > append $1 $2 etc.] however, after "append" is matched, the argument count is > decremented and the 2nd arg becomes the 1st. Consequently, the behavior of > [list $1 $2 etc.] is exactly the same as [list append $1 $2 etc.] in this > case. Ah, indeed you're right! Thanks for pointing me to this, I was falsely assuming otherwise (and should have checked myself before tellling others to check it, sorry. :( I would prefer the more verbose form [list append $1 $2 ...] just for clarity. Ciao -- Frank From fbar at footils.org Sun Mar 22 23:22:34 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Sun, 22 Mar 2009 23:22:34 +0100 Subject: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( In-Reply-To: <8564E2D3-5B00-4597-8DE9-FBB0006BD078@eds.org> References: <129520C8-D5DE-4FC5-869E-4BC4F1334564@eds.org> <20090320185312.GA31601@footils.org> <20090321180635.GA2368@fliwatut.scifi> <20090321183905.GA2738@footils.org> <8564E2D3-5B00-4597-8DE9-FBB0006BD078@eds.org> Message-ID: <20090322222234.GB6429@footils.org> Hallo, Hans-Christoph Steiner hat gesagt: // Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > I think avoiding horizontal lines should be pretty high up there on the > no-no list. Or making lines that go up for anything but feedback/loops. I sometimes do like lines going a little bit up when things are on the same logical level so that I can have the objects themselves align next to each other as in a line of text. Like: | [* 0]\[r factor] | or in a counter of course. Ciao -- Frank From zmoelnig at iem.at Mon Mar 23 09:09:16 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 09:09:16 +0100 Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: <9C503D2B-63A4-40AF-9F0D-EACB710A6FDE@eds.org> References: <1A6ACCDE-8D0F-4094-B979-16919791C754@eds.org> <161320dd0903091945n56a19a93tcfea7c6dc17dd6e7@mail.gmail.com> <58A25F57-1CBA-4BB8-BFC4-43012B0C3F0C@eds.org> <966A603E-9392-40E3-BE65-E29731616CE0@dibidut.dk> <49B7795C.3010507@iem.at> <9C503D2B-63A4-40AF-9F0D-EACB710A6FDE@eds.org> Message-ID: <49C743AC.5020501@iem.at> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > So if we are introducing the concept of objects and GUI in Pd, then I > think it is safe to use GOP objects. After all, we don't expect newbies > to know anything about C or Tcl, but that's under it it all. I don't > think we should add an output~ to help patches that don't already have > them. I just think we should have a more intuitive and usable output~. > The current one already uses GOP, so that's not a change. > i fully agree. and would like to stress, that i am pretty sure that most users will not have a clue about gop when they first encounter the [output~] module (be it a new one or the original one). at least i cannot seem to find any documentation about gop prior to 3/A.05; nevertheless i think it is a good idea to use a gop-abstraction here. fgmasdr IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From zmoelnig at iem.at Mon Mar 23 10:42:32 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 10:42:32 +0100 Subject: [PD] Problems compiling zexy In-Reply-To: <1237725006.13420.0.camel@martin-laptop> References: <1237725006.13420.0.camel@martin-laptop> Message-ID: <49C75988.8070703@iem.at> Martin Hiendl wrote: > Hi! > > I have a problem with compiling zexy. I have successfully compiled > Pd-Vanilla on my Ubuntu 8.10 (amd64) and its directory is: > ~/install/pd-0-42-4/ > And pd also found the extras when I put the path > to /usr/local/lib/pd/extra/... > > So I tried to install zexy and downloaded it via CVS following these > instructions: > http://puredata.info/Members/jb/ext-doc this documentation is *outdated* you should chekout the sources with subversion rather than CVS (which is only there for legacy reasons) getting zexy: % svn co https://pure-data.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/pure-data/trunk/externals/zexy/ > > > I got stuck after "make" receiving this error message: > > ath=sse -msse -c -o zexy.o zexy.c > gcc -export_dynamic -shared -o zexy.pd_linux *.o -lm -lc > /usr/bin/ld: warning: cannot find entry symbol xport_dynamic; defaulting > to 0000000000004e10 > strip --strip-unneeded zexy.pd_linux > cp zexy.pd_linux .. > > > And after "make install" I got this: > > xyz at xyz-laptop:~/externals/zexy/src$ sudo make install > [sudo] password for xyz: > gcc -export_dynamic -shared -o zexy.pd_linux *.o -lm -lc > /usr/bin/ld: warning: cannot find entry symbol xport_dynamic; defaulting > to 0000000000004e10 > strip --strip-unneeded zexy.pd_linux > cp zexy.pd_linux .. > ./makealias.sh ../src/alias ../src ../reference > ./makealias.sh: 24: Syntax error: "(" unexpected > make: *** [alias-bin] Error 2 > > > What can I do? the problem is that ubuntu has switched to zsh and makealias.sh used to be a bash-script. i believe this is fixed in subversion. a hack to make it run with the old and outdated zexy is to change the first line of makealias.sh to "#!/bin/bash" but better use the subversion version. fgmasdr IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From zmoelnig at iem.at Mon Mar 23 10:57:12 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 10:57:12 +0100 Subject: [PD] Problems compiling zexy In-Reply-To: <49C75988.8070703@iem.at> References: <1237725006.13420.0.camel@martin-laptop> <49C75988.8070703@iem.at> Message-ID: <49C75CF8.60605@iem.at> IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: > > the problem is that ubuntu has switched to zsh and makealias.sh used to > be a bash-script. > i believe this is fixed in subversion. actually i found that it is not. until it is fixed, you have to manually fix the makealias.sh: > > a hack to make it run with the old and outdated zexy is to change the > first line of makealias.sh to "#!/bin/bash" and of course, you should still use the svn version... > > but better use the subversion version. > fgmasdr IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From zmoelnig at iem.at Mon Mar 23 12:50:47 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 12:50:47 +0100 Subject: [PD] [GEM] pix_video, firewire, and linux ? In-Reply-To: <49B77C50.2080104@iem.at> References: <2b3b19680903101148p67a90a3cl9d27348fe2f347da@mail.gmail.com> <616283880903102308k1bdd6eb9k8391f897cf3eab52@mail.gmail.com> <49B77C50.2080104@iem.at> Message-ID: <49C77797.3050906@iem.at> IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: > Jaime Oliver wrote: >> have you tried coriander? >> I know it is the way to make firewire cameras work in linux using >> libdc, but had no luck interfacing with gem. it is something I've >> putting off for a while, > > it seems like i don't have any device that properly works with coriander. > however, from what i read, coriander can create a videoloopback device > which can then be used by Gem as an ordinary "v4l" device. i finally got hands on a camera that is supported by coriander ("Unibrain Fire-i BCL 1.2"), and it works fine with Gem using coriander & vloopback. notes: - ubuntu does not come with vloopback modules - i was using a ubuntu/intrepid machine which has a 2.6.27 kernel installed and the debian vloopback-source module is version 1.1 which does not work with >=2.6.27; i had to install vloopback-1.2 [1] which worked - the loopback device is of fixed size and this size somehow does not get propagated to Gem correctly; i had to manually set the size to the one i knew i was using (640x480) mfg.adsr IOhannes [1] http://www.lavrsen.dk/twiki/bin/view/Motion/VideoFourLinuxLoopbackDevice > > have you tried that? > if it doesn't work, how does it fail? > > fgmadr > IOhannes > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From martin.hiendl at googlemail.com Mon Mar 23 14:01:42 2009 From: martin.hiendl at googlemail.com (Martin Hiendl) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 14:01:42 +0100 Subject: [PD] Problems compiling zexy In-Reply-To: <49C75CF8.60605@iem.at> References: <1237725006.13420.0.camel@martin-laptop> <49C75988.8070703@iem.at> <49C75CF8.60605@iem.at> Message-ID: <1237813302.25187.11.camel@martin-laptop> Thanks for your answer but unfortunately it didn't work for me. I downloaded the svn and edited the makealias.sh to "#!/bin/bash". But after "make", I received this: "[...] gcc -I. -DHAVE_CONFIG_H -DZEXY_LIBRARY -DPD -g -O2 -mms-bitfields -fPIC -mfpmath=sse -msse -c -o tabdump.o tabdump.c tabdump.c: In function ?tabdump_bang?: tabdump.c:57: error: incompatible types in assignment make: *** [tabdump.o] Error 1 martin at martin-laptop:~$" It was the same with "make everything". Then I also edited the makesource.sh to "#!/bin/bash" but it was the same result. Martin -----Original Message----- From: IOhannes m zmoelnig To: Martin Hiendl Cc: pd-list at iem.at Subject: Re: [PD] Problems compiling zexy Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 10:57:12 +0100 IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: > > the problem is that ubuntu has switched to zsh and makealias.sh used to > be a bash-script. > i believe this is fixed in subversion. actually i found that it is not. until it is fixed, you have to manually fix the makealias.sh: > > a hack to make it run with the old and outdated zexy is to change the > first line of makealias.sh to "#!/bin/bash" and of course, you should still use the svn version... > > but better use the subversion version. > fgmasdr IOhannes From chris at mccormick.cx Mon Mar 23 14:03:55 2009 From: chris at mccormick.cx (Chris McCormick) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 13:03:55 +0000 Subject: [PD] DIY GSoC: getting those projects done In-Reply-To: References: <774CBB5D-E9FE-44C6-B4A0-B37E543CC3C3@eds.org> Message-ID: <20090323130355.GA14055@mccormick.cx> Yo, IIRC, one of their complaints from last year was that our application had too many parts. Next time we should pick just one or two specific tasks and go with them. Maybe with a community vote or whatever. Also, I hate to be cynical, but I can't see any way even remotely in which Google could use Pd to make a profit. ;) Thanks for your huge effort anyway, Hans and Georg. Best, Chris. On Sun, Mar 22, 2009 at 11:33:55AM -0400, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > That is indeed true. I suppose it wouldn't hurt to nag google, and it > might even help. But I don't think it would change this year's outcome. > > I think the key to getting a grant like this is to know what they are > looking for and tailor the grant to that. It would be useful if someone > tried to find any materials from the successful projects and report back > what they learned. I tried to do that in the past. > > .hc > > On Mar 20, 2009, at 4:01 PM, Rich E wrote: > >> Of course it would be nice to do the projects regardless of funding, >> but in reality they just won't get the same attention to detail and >> thoroughness. I don't have a job except through grants like this.. >> >> I'm still all for making apython libpd module... but who knows when >> summer rolls around and i'm broke. >> >> Do you think it is any good to question/complain to google about not >> getting accepted two years in a row? I looked at some of the other >> project pages and not only is the pd application just as good, I think >> the proposed projects are much more valuable to the open source >> community. I don't want to name anything in specific, but I saw some >> well funded projects that only proposed various bug fixes, that were >> accepted (literally there is a project that says "go through the bugs >> list and fix whatever you can). >> >> regards, >> Rich >> >> On Thu, Mar 19, 2009 at 12:08 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner >> wrote: >>> >>> So now we have a nice collection of projects sketched out from the >>> GSoC >>> application, let's encourage people to take them on. If anyone >>> wants to get >>> involved with Pd development, take a look at the project ideas and >>> if you >>> are interested, then ask about them on the list and we can get >>> started. >>> >>> http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/GoogleSummerOfCodeIdeas2009 >>> >>> I think next time someone else should take on the GSoC application >>> process. >>> I'm 2 for 2 at not getting it, I've never had much luck with >>> grants. And >>> we have lots of well-sketched out projects. We should probably >>> chuck the >>> application part and start from scratch. >>> >>> .hc >>> >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> >>> All mankind is of one author, and is one volume; when one man dies, >>> one >>> chapter is not torn out of the book, but translated into a better >>> language; >>> and every chapter must be so translated.... -John Donne >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >>> > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Programs should be written for people to read, and only incidentally for > machines to execute. > - from Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ------------------- http://mccormick.cx From padawan12 at obiwannabe.co.uk Mon Mar 23 14:37:44 2009 From: padawan12 at obiwannabe.co.uk (Andy Farnell) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 13:37:44 +0000 Subject: [PD] DIY GSoC: getting those projects done In-Reply-To: <20090323130355.GA14055@mccormick.cx> References: <774CBB5D-E9FE-44C6-B4A0-B37E543CC3C3@eds.org> <20090323130355.GA14055@mccormick.cx> Message-ID: <20090323133744.13f06dc9.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> On Mon, 23 Mar 2009 13:03:55 +0000 Chris McCormick wrote: > Also, I hate to be cynical, but > I can't see any way even remotely in which Google could use Pd to make a > profit. ;) Profit aside, you can make a fundamental partition in computing between forward looking systems (predictive, generative, hypothetical, AI, imaginative type systems) and backward looking (retrospective, analytical, indexing, organising, sort, search, existing value based systems). A bit like left and right brain faculties. Most problems involve elements of both, but Google's domain (search) really falls more into the latter, while applications of Pd are constructive and fall better into the former. -- Use the source From zmoelnig at iem.at Mon Mar 23 14:41:05 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 14:41:05 +0100 Subject: [PD] Problems compiling zexy In-Reply-To: <1237813302.25187.11.camel@martin-laptop> References: <1237725006.13420.0.camel@martin-laptop> <49C75988.8070703@iem.at> <49C75CF8.60605@iem.at> <1237813302.25187.11.camel@martin-laptop> Message-ID: <49C79171.8060401@iem.at> Martin Hiendl wrote: > Thanks for your answer but unfortunately it didn't work for me. > > I downloaded the svn and edited the makealias.sh to "#!/bin/bash". > But after "make", I received this: i just noticed that i was a bit too paranoid when doing checks for the used Pd-version: it required at least 0.42 i have fixed it now to only require Pd 0.41 (and yes, this means that you must use Pd-0.41 for compilation of zexy on 64bit; you don't want anything lower when running on a 64bit machine anyhow) please update your working copy of zexy by running "svn up" mfd IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From matju at artengine.ca Mon Mar 23 15:19:21 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 10:19:21 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] ADSR variations [was: Re: Patch-off] In-Reply-To: <20090322221823.GA6429@footils.org> References: <20090322112749.GA5311@footils.org> <465598.32132.qm@web65605.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> <20090322221823.GA6429@footils.org> Message-ID: On Sun, 22 Mar 2009, Frank Barknecht wrote: > Hallo Jonathan, >> Consequently, the behavior of [list $1 $2 etc.] is exactly the same as >> [list append $1 $2 etc.] in this case. > I would prefer the more verbose form [list append $1 $2 ...] just for clarity. It's not for clarity that you should want "append" to be there, it's so that $1 can be a symbol if need appears for it. Otherwise, it just takes you a minute to learn that [list] with a float $1 is a shortcut of [list append] and it's not much harder to remember than any other shortcuts, especially if you already know that [list] is a shortcut of [list append]. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From dmotd at gmx.net Mon Mar 23 15:20:08 2009 From: dmotd at gmx.net (dmotd) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 00:20:08 +1000 Subject: [PD] DIY GSoC: getting those projects done In-Reply-To: <20090323130355.GA14055@mccormick.cx> References: <774CBB5D-E9FE-44C6-B4A0-B37E543CC3C3@eds.org> <20090323130355.GA14055@mccormick.cx> Message-ID: <200903240020.09720.dmotd@gmx.net> hmm.. now i would have thought that with google investing a great many resources into mobile technology, ie. their first real attempt at killing off the competition (apple) with their phone architecture (android), and with the relative success of rjdj for the (apple) iphone, they would be rushing at the opportunity to port a 'killer app' to their gadget and supporting the environment that harbours this app (pd). afterall the frivolous world of consumer gadgets requires that users have access to lovely toys that do the things which make those consumers like the gadget enough to warant spending the cash in the first place (no decent software, no gadget, no matter how 'cool', nerdy or utilitarian the thing is in the first place). to be even more cynical, i would suggest that if the application was rewritten to suggest a focussed effort at making pd/rjdj support android and that the 'other' modifications fell under this umbrella project we may have stood a better chance. but this is all rather hypothetical and would require playing silly games with a corporate monolith. or perhaps a company that relies so heavily on string manipulation considered pd useless? ;) ciao dmotd On Monday 23 March 2009 23:03:55 Chris McCormick wrote: > Yo, > > IIRC, one of their complaints from last year was that our application had > too many parts. Next time we should pick just one or two specific tasks and > go with them. Maybe with a community vote or whatever. Also, I hate to be > cynical, but I can't see any way even remotely in which Google could use Pd > to make a profit. ;) Thanks for your huge effort anyway, Hans and Georg. > > Best, > > Chris. From martin.peach at sympatico.ca Mon Mar 23 16:40:19 2009 From: martin.peach at sympatico.ca (martin.peach at sympatico.ca) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 15:40:19 +0000 Subject: [PD] DIY GSoC: getting those projects done In-Reply-To: <20090323133744.13f06dc9.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> References: <774CBB5D-E9FE-44C6-B4A0-B37E543CC3C3@eds.org> <20090323130355.GA14055@mccormick.cx> <20090323133744.13f06dc9.padawan12@obiwannabe.co.uk> Message-ID: padawan12 wrote: > Chris McCormick wrote: > > > Also, I hate to be cynical, but > > I can't see any way even remotely in which Google could use Pd to make a > > profit. ;) > > > Profit aside, you can make a fundamental partition in computing > between forward looking systems (predictive, generative, > hypothetical, AI, imaginative type systems) and backward > looking (retrospective, analytical, indexing, organising, > sort, search, existing value based systems). A bit like left > and right brain faculties. Most problems involve elements of > both, but Google's domain (search) really falls more into the > latter, while applications of Pd are constructive and fall > better into the former. > Hmmm, maybe a project to find and install any Pd external missing from a patch... Martin -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kyleklip at gmail.com Mon Mar 23 17:53:19 2009 From: kyleklip at gmail.com (Kyle Klipowicz) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 11:53:19 -0500 Subject: [PD] A patch to share In-Reply-To: <8DDE33A5-F525-4552-B416-61A5F1BF2B61@pallit.lhi.is> References: <8DDE33A5-F525-4552-B416-61A5F1BF2B61@pallit.lhi.is> Message-ID: Neat! ~Kyle On Sat, Mar 21, 2009 at 10:22 AM, Pall Thayer wrote: > I was going through some old stuff on my computer and found this patch I > made a few years ago for a project called Autodrawn. The piece used to run > on my server but due to my laziness in updating or even upgrading my server > it's no longer running. However, the PD patch that goes with the work is > interesting so I want to share it with the community. I've loosely applied > the GPL to it. It might not be an interesting technical feat but rather > conceptually. It plays a repeated sequence from Kraftwerk's Autobahn > interspersed with live mp3 feeds of police scanners. The idea was to take > the idea of the autobahn as portrayed on the original album cover, as > something beautifully peaceful and positive and turn it into a more modern > view of the freeway as something ominous and dangerous which has taken on an > even newer meaning in recent years as a symbol of the negative impacts our > fossil fuel consumption is having on the environment. Also, I just think it > sounds cool. Even though it's just playing the same short sequence over and > over again, it's still fun to listen to for long periods of time. > > So, if you find something interesting to do with it, feel free. > > best r. > Pall Thayer > > > #N canvas 4 98 985 512 10; > #X obj 149 96 mp3amp~; > #X msg 19 70 disconnect; > #X floatatom 193 123 5 0 0 0 - - -; > #X obj 234 96 vsl 15 128 0 1 0 0 empty empty empty 0 -8 0 8 -262144 > -1 -1 0 1; > #X obj 327 108 mp3amp~; > #X msg 264 86 disconnect; > #X floatatom 371 135 5 0 0 0 - - -; > #X obj 412 108 vsl 15 128 0 1 0 0 empty empty empty 0 -8 0 8 -262144 > -1 -1 0 1; > #X obj 466 123 delread~ dc 400; > #X obj 466 167 delwrite~ dc 400; > #X floatatom 466 105 5 0 0 0 - - -; > #X obj 12 104 delread~ sas 400; > #X obj 12 148 delwrite~ sas 400; > #X obj 471 145 *~ 0.1; > #X obj 17 126 *~ 0.1; > #X obj 149 306 mp3amp~; > #X msg 86 269 disconnect; > #X floatatom 193 333 5 0 0 0 - - -; > #X obj 234 306 vsl 15 128 0 1 0 0 empty empty empty 0 -8 0 8 -262144 > -1 -1 0 1; > #X floatatom 322 334 5 0 0 0 - - -; > #X obj 327 374 *~ 0.1; > #X obj 322 352 delread~ sw 400; > #X obj 322 396 delwrite~ sw 400; > #X obj 544 326 f; > #X obj 615 326 + 1; > #X obj 683 274 tgl 15 0 empty empty empty 0 -6 0 8 -262144 -1 -1 1 > 1; > #X floatatom 563 378 5 0 0 0 - - -; > #N canvas 0 22 450 300 (subpatch) 0; > #X array array103 100 float 1; > #A 0 68 61 0 73 66 0 0 0 0 75.7258 75.7258 75.7258 73.1658 68.0458 > 65.4858 65.4858 66.3391 67.1925 68.0458 68.0458 68.0458 62.9258 61.6458 > 60.3658 57.8058 55.2458 52.6858 50.1258 47.5658 45.0058 42.4458 39.8857 > 38.1791 36.4724 34.7658 33.0591 31.3524 29.6457 27.0857 24.5257 21.9657 > 19.4057 18.1257 16.8457 16.8457 14.2857 14.2857 9.16572 4.04571 1.50713 > 1.54285 45.082 50.202 47.642 47.642 47.642 47.642 47.642 48.4953 49.3486 > 50.202 51.0553 51.9086 52.762 54.042 55.322 56.602 57.882 59.162 60.442 > 61.722 63.002 64.282 65.562 66.842 68.122 68.122 68.122 68.122 80.922 > -0.385712 -0.414283 -0.45714 -0.499997 -0.528568 -0.585711 -0.599997 > -0.614282 0 100 50 78 54 0 0 0 0 0 0 0; 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> #X msg 186 85 connect localhost 8000; > #X obj 58 237 dac~; > #X text 306 17 The mp3cast stuff is old \, here for posterity; > #X connect 0 0 8 0; > #X connect 2 0 1 0; > #X connect 3 0 1 0; > #X connect 4 0 1 0; > #X connect 5 0 1 0; > #X connect 6 0 8 1; > #X connect 7 0 1 0; > #X restore 42 226 pd mp3send; > #X obj 872 20 loadbang; > #X obj 845 190 fiddle~ 2048 1 20 3; > #X msg 830 382 0.55; > #X msg 872 143 auto 0; > #X msg 47 23 connecturl http://74.229.4.35:4000:8000; > #X msg 149 67 connecturl http://69.239.28.85:8000; > #X msg 180 270 connecturl http://216.66.69.100:3074/; > #X msg 369 86 connecturl http://live.scanact.net:80/live; > #X text 608 -5 (c) 2004 Pall Thayer - Use as per conditions of GPL > v.3; > #N canvas 0 22 450 300 resothing 0; > #X obj 174 155 vcf~; > #X obj 173 188 bp~ 20000 40; > #X obj 185 123 * 100; > #X obj 173 29 inlet~; > #X obj 185 50 inlet; > #X obj 172 253 outlet~; > #X obj 290 59 loadbang; > #X msg 228 123 10; > #X msg 185 77 \$1 100; > #X obj 185 101 line; 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> #X connect 83 0 97 1; > #X connect 84 0 29 0; > #X connect 85 0 107 0; > #X connect 86 0 9 0; > #X connect 86 0 12 0; > #X connect 86 0 42 0; > #X connect 86 0 97 1; > #X connect 86 0 97 0; > #X connect 87 0 86 1; > #X connect 88 0 87 0; > #X connect 89 0 100 0; > #X connect 90 0 107 0; > #X connect 91 0 107 0; > #X connect 92 0 4 0; > #X connect 93 0 107 1; > #X connect 94 0 95 0; > #X connect 95 0 93 0; > #X connect 96 0 29 0; > #X connect 98 0 25 0; > #X connect 98 0 101 0; > #X connect 99 3 94 0; > #X connect 100 0 87 0; > #X connect 101 0 99 0; > #X connect 102 0 0 0; > #X connect 103 0 0 0; > #X connect 104 0 15 0; > #X connect 105 0 4 0; > #X connect 107 0 86 0; > > -- > Pall Thayer > palli at pallit.lhi.is > http://www.this.is/pallit > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -- ----- ------------ ---- ----- ---- -------- - ------ http://perhapsidid.wordpress.com http://myspace.com/kyleklipowicz -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr Mon Mar 23 19:12:43 2009 From: cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr (cyrille henry) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 19:12:43 +0100 Subject: [PD] variance from mapping library In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49C7D11B.60706@la-kitchen.fr> the mapping lib is optimized to work with number from -1 to 1. do you still have error using this kind of number? Cyrille Mathieu Bouchard a ?crit : > On Thu, 19 Mar 2009, Oded Ben-Tal wrote: > >>> abs(a)+abs(b), or something like that. But 100000*100000 = >>> 10000000000, and if you divide that by 2^24 = 16777216, you get about >>> 596, which is an upper bound for the amount of error: so, the error >>> is surely between -596 and +596. >> I trust your math here but just notice that your example converges to >> -691. > > That's because 100000*100000 is only one value. Then, the second > [mean_n] has to process + 90000*90000 + 80000*80000 + 70000*70000 + ... > so the theoretical error maximum is much more than 596 but much less > than 596*10. In practice, much of the individual errors are not that big > and perhaps some of them cancel each other. > > But to find the reason for why -691 precisely, would take a long time > and would not be any insightful. > >> But if I understand you correctly 'filtering' the input data through >> [int] should make variance error free (we hope). > > no, it won't, because still all of the other objects process floats. The > reason why ints wouldn't have that problem is because they have fixed > precision, that is, the step between two adjacent numbers is 1, whereas > for floats it's roughly proportional to the numbers themselves. For > integers you will hit an overflow problem quite quickly, and so, for > example, if you remake that abstraction using 32-bit integers (for > example, using the GridFlow library) then you can already get an > overflow by using random 5-digit numbers, but at least, it goes back to > normal when given a more modest sequence, whereas for floats it gets > stuck and needs to be reset (recreated). > > Using int64 you could get perfect results for most uses, but I don't > recall whether the bugs in GridFlow's int64 support were fixed or not... > I never quite had a use for int64 in the end. > > For the "mapping" library, there isn't much of a choice but to remake it > with a slower algorithm, unless someone knows a magic trick for > cancelling almost all of the error while not running so slow. Actually, > it already runs in linear time, so it wouldn't be such a big loss if the > complete sum was recomputed at every step, because it would still be > linear. It would be a big loss if it could run in constant time (e.g. > using an array for the queue) and had to be switched to linear time. > > _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... > | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From tedthetrumpet at gmail.com Mon Mar 23 20:41:17 2009 From: tedthetrumpet at gmail.com (J. Simon van der Walt) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 19:41:17 +0000 Subject: [PD] pd-tutorial.com patches won't open? Message-ID: Back to playing with Pd after a long break with, partly inspired by the new book at pd-tutorial.com... problem is, none of the patches which go with the book will open. Either by double clicking or opening from within the application, nothing happens. The files I've downloaded seem perfectly fine, I can open them in a text editor, it's just Pd won't do anything with them. Any ideas what could be wrong here? Mac OSX 10.4.11, Pd-extended 0.39.3 Thanks, -- J. Simon van der Walt ----- Composer From matju at artengine.ca Mon Mar 23 20:56:33 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 15:56:33 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] variance from mapping library In-Reply-To: <49C7D11B.60706@la-kitchen.fr> References: <49C7D11B.60706@la-kitchen.fr> Message-ID: On Mon, 23 Mar 2009, cyrille henry wrote: > the mapping lib is optimized to work with number from -1 to 1. > do you still have error using this kind of number? Well, yes, of course: because float precision is relative, this behaviour would happen for any scale of number, except in case of underflow, but then, in case of underflow, the result can't be accurate anymore anyway. You can send simple repeated sequences to [mapping/variance] to show that not only it can drift in the negative values almost endlessly, but it doesn't even compute the variance of N values. This is because there is a moving average of something involving another moving average. This makes a global moving average of 2N-1 values instead of N, and then the window isn't rectangular anymore, it's triangular, because different values are counted different number of times depending on how old they are. That's why I added extra zeroes in the messagebox. Remove them one at a time and you'll see this second phenomenon in addition to the first one. #N canvas 425 84 450 300 10; #X obj 83 33 tgl 15 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -24198 -1 -1 1 1; #X obj 83 69 t b b; #X obj 83 107 f; #X obj 83 126 nbx 12 14 -1e+37 1e+37 0 0 empty empty empty 0 -8 0 10 -225271 -1 -1 -0.000188258 256; #X obj 83 50 metro 1; #X msg 113 88 1 \, 1 \, 0 \, 0 \, 0 \, 0 \, 0 \, 0 \, 0 \, 0 \, 0; #X obj 114 107 variance 5; #X connect 0 0 4 0; #X connect 1 0 2 0; #X connect 1 1 5 0; #X connect 2 0 3 0; #X connect 4 0 1 0; #X connect 5 0 6 0; #X connect 6 0 2 1; _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From matju at artengine.ca Mon Mar 23 21:04:22 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 16:04:22 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] variance from mapping library In-Reply-To: References: <49C7D11B.60706@la-kitchen.fr> Message-ID: On Mon, 23 Mar 2009, Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > You can send simple repeated sequences to [mapping/variance] to show > that not only it can drift in the negative values almost endlessly, but > it doesn't even compute the variance of N values. This is because there > is a moving average of something involving another moving average. This > makes a global moving average of 2N-1 values instead of N, and then the > window isn't rectangular anymore, it's triangular, because different > values are counted different number of times depending on how old they > are. errata: i mean that a moving average of a moving average is another moving average with a different window (the convolution of the two windows), but the case of [mapping/variance] is more complicated because of the extra operations being done, and so there is no easy way to describe it, but you can see that it uses too many values in the same way that the moving average of the moving average does. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From oded at ccrma.Stanford.EDU Mon Mar 23 21:06:24 2009 From: oded at ccrma.Stanford.EDU (Oded Ben-Tal) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 13:06:24 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] variance from mapping library In-Reply-To: <49C7D11B.60706@la-kitchen.fr> References: <49C7D11B.60706@la-kitchen.fr> Message-ID: > the mapping lib is optimized to work with number from -1 to 1. > do you still have error using this kind of number? It seems that not. I do get negative numbers even with input of ~200 (no need to get to 100000) and once it gets into negative territory it settles into negative numbers whenever the input is constant (i.e. 0 variance). Oded From matju at artengine.ca Mon Mar 23 21:10:52 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 16:10:52 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] variance from mapping library In-Reply-To: References: <49C7D11B.60706@la-kitchen.fr> Message-ID: On Mon, 23 Mar 2009, Oded Ben-Tal wrote: >> the mapping lib is optimized to work with number from -1 to 1. >> do you still have error using this kind of number? > > It seems that not. Try again harder. Look at the two mails I've just sent about this subject. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr Mon Mar 23 21:26:33 2009 From: cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr (cyrille henry) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 21:26:33 +0100 Subject: [PD] variance from mapping library In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49C7F079.2010901@la-kitchen.fr> Mathieu Bouchard a ?crit : > On Thu, 19 Mar 2009, Oded Ben-Tal wrote: ... > > For the "mapping" library, there isn't much of a choice but to remake it > with a slower algorithm, unless someone knows a magic trick for > cancelling almost all of the error while not running so slow. no need to remake an other mean_n object using a beter but slower algorythm. you just have to send a [mode 1< message to mean_n : it does switch the internal algo used to a more accurate one. i just add this message to the variance object... Cyrille From matju at artengine.ca Mon Mar 23 21:44:25 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 16:44:25 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] variance from mapping library In-Reply-To: References: <49C7D11B.60706@la-kitchen.fr> Message-ID: On Mon, 23 Mar 2009, Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > You can send simple repeated sequences to [mapping/variance] to show that not > only it can drift in the negative values almost endlessly, but it doesn't > even compute the variance of N values. Here is another patch. I call it [mapping/variance2]. It computes a moving variance using exactly the $1 last values and not any more than that. It has more rounding error, but it doesn't have any unwanted delay between the two moving averages used in computing variance. #N canvas 744 170 273 272 10; #X obj 39 33 inlet; #X obj 39 184 outlet; #X obj 39 52 t f f; #X obj 39 165 -; #X obj 39 83 t f f; #X obj 39 111 *; #X obj 39 130 mean_n \$1; #X obj 114 81 mean_n \$1; #X obj 114 101 t f f; #X obj 114 129 *; #X connect 0 0 2 0; #X connect 2 0 4 0; #X connect 2 1 7 0; #X connect 3 0 1 0; #X connect 4 0 5 0; #X connect 4 1 5 1; #X connect 5 0 6 0; #X connect 6 0 3 0; #X connect 7 0 8 0; #X connect 8 0 9 0; #X connect 8 1 9 1; #X connect 9 0 3 1; _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From matju at artengine.ca Mon Mar 23 22:36:55 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 17:36:55 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] variance from mapping library In-Reply-To: References: <49C7D11B.60706@la-kitchen.fr> Message-ID: On Mon, 23 Mar 2009, Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > Here is another patch. I call it [mapping/variance2]. It computes a moving > variance using exactly the $1 last values and not any more than that. It has > more rounding error, but it doesn't have any unwanted delay between the two > moving averages used in computing variance. Well actually, my [mapping/variance2] also doesn't have the same drift characteristics (nor other error characteristics) as [mapping/variance], so, my examples about [mapping/variance] don't drift when remade with [mapping/variance2], but some other examples (that I didn't show) are worse with [mapping/variance2]. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From matju at artengine.ca Mon Mar 23 22:42:03 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 17:42:03 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] Horizontal Connections (Was: Re: style guide idea: [send In-Reply-To: References: <659635.57125.qm@web65603.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Sun, 22 Mar 2009, Martin Peach wrote: >> I like the usage agreement idea, as long as there's visual feedback. >> For example, if the inlets and outlets in pd-ext protruded one or two >> pixels, you'd be able to see the connection crossing over to the "wrong" >> outlet. > Maybe better if outlets with connections were coloured differently. Why not just colour the wire itself! Even if you connect the other outlets in various horizontal ways, you'll still be able to see the one wire crossing over a bunch of outlets... if it's only one wire. If you need to see several wires... they could be coloured using random colours. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From hans at eds.org Mon Mar 23 22:49:55 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 17:49:55 -0400 Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: <49C743AC.5020501@iem.at> References: <1A6ACCDE-8D0F-4094-B979-16919791C754@eds.org> <161320dd0903091945n56a19a93tcfea7c6dc17dd6e7@mail.gmail.com> <58A25F57-1CBA-4BB8-BFC4-43012B0C3F0C@eds.org> <966A603E-9392-40E3-BE65-E29731616CE0@dibidut.dk> <49B7795C.3010507@iem.at> <9C503D2B-63A4-40AF-9F0D-EACB710A6FDE@eds.org> <49C743AC.5020501@iem.at> Message-ID: <84C8EF4C-2D12-4EB7-A9B4-ACBA8674FF11@eds.org> On Mar 23, 2009, at 4:09 AM, IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: > Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > >> So if we are introducing the concept of objects and GUI in Pd, then >> I think it is safe to use GOP objects. After all, we don't expect >> newbies to know anything about C or Tcl, but that's under it it >> all. I don't think we should add an output~ to help patches that >> don't already have them. I just think we should have a more >> intuitive and usable output~. The current one already uses GOP, so >> that's not a change. > > i fully agree. > and would like to stress, that i am pretty sure that most users will > not have a clue about gop when they first encounter the [output~] > module (be it a new one or the original one). > > at least i cannot seem to find any documentation about gop prior to > 3/A.05; nevertheless i think it is a good idea to use a gop- > abstraction here. > > fgmasdr > IOhannes Anyone else want to weigh in on this? I'd like to lobby Miller to get this included in 'extra' at least, then also used in the help and docmentation. .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Man has survived hitherto because he was too ignorant to know how to realize his wishes. Now that he can realize them, he must either change them, or perish. -William Carlos Williams From martin.peach at sympatico.ca Mon Mar 23 23:55:22 2009 From: martin.peach at sympatico.ca (Martin Peach) Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 18:55:22 -0400 Subject: [PD] Horizontal Connections (Was: Re: style guide idea: [send In-Reply-To: References: <659635.57125.qm@web65603.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > On Sun, 22 Mar 2009, Martin Peach wrote: > >>> I like the usage agreement idea, as long as there's visual >>> feedback. For example, if the inlets and outlets in pd-ext protruded >>> one or two pixels, you'd be able to see the connection crossing over >>> to the "wrong" outlet. >> Maybe better if outlets with connections were coloured differently. > > Why not just colour the wire itself! > > Even if you connect the other outlets in various horizontal ways, you'll > still be able to see the one wire crossing over a bunch of outlets... if > it's only one wire. > > If you need to see several wires... they could be coloured using random > colours. > Exactly. I already proposed a patch to do that a couple of years ago but it didn't get picked up. Martin From martin.hiendl at googlemail.com Tue Mar 24 00:56:01 2009 From: martin.hiendl at googlemail.com (Martin Hiendl) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 00:56:01 +0100 Subject: [PD] Problems compiling zexy In-Reply-To: <49C79171.8060401@iem.at> References: <1237725006.13420.0.camel@martin-laptop> <49C75988.8070703@iem.at> <49C75CF8.60605@iem.at> <1237813302.25187.11.camel@martin-laptop> <49C79171.8060401@iem.at> Message-ID: <1237852561.14203.20.camel@martin-laptop> Sorry again, but it didn't work for me. So, I already use Pd 0.42-4. But anyway, I tried it then with 0.41-0 and also with the "#!/bin/bash" with the same result: The whole process always stops after 'make' with this error: "gcc -I. -DHAVE_CONFIG_H -DZEXY_LIBRARY -DPD -g -O2 -mms-bitfields -fPIC -mfpmath=sse -msse -c -o tabdump.o tabdump.c tabdump.c: In function ?tabdump_bang?: tabdump.c:57: error: incompatible types in assignment make: *** [tabdump.o] Error 1 xyz at xyz:~/install/zexy/src$" I updated my copy to this: "At revision 10894." Should I post the whole log after "autoconf", "./configure" and "make"...? Thanks, Martin -----Original Message----- From: IOhannes m zmoelnig To: Martin Hiendl Cc: pd-list at iem.at Subject: Re: [PD] Problems compiling zexy Date: Mon, 23 Mar 2009 14:41:05 +0100 Martin Hiendl wrote: > Thanks for your answer but unfortunately it didn't work for me. > > I downloaded the svn and edited the makealias.sh to "#!/bin/bash". > But after "make", I received this: i just noticed that i was a bit too paranoid when doing checks for the used Pd-version: it required at least 0.42 i have fixed it now to only require Pd 0.41 (and yes, this means that you must use Pd-0.41 for compilation of zexy on 64bit; you don't want anything lower when running on a 64bit machine anyhow) please update your working copy of zexy by running "svn up" mfd IOhannes From dmotd at gmx.net Tue Mar 24 03:16:06 2009 From: dmotd at gmx.net (dmotd) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 12:16:06 +1000 Subject: [PD] [equalizer] / [lowshelf] / [highshelf] in purepd! Message-ID: <200903241216.06587.dmotd@gmx.net> hi folks, here are some purepd representations of the [equalizer] [lowshelf] and [highshelf] objects for calculating eq biquad filter coefficients. i put these together as ggee was the only external lib dependency for a project which used these fairly extensively. the code is almost logic identical to the equivelent C internals, and i have avoided using [expr], so the math may look a little confusing. i only ported the code for the objects i was using, but i will add the other eq-cookbook filters when i next get a chance. ciao, dmotd -------------- next part -------------- #N canvas 266 16 753 711 10; #X obj 106 12 inlet; #X obj 475 193 inlet; #X obj 628 127 inlet; #X obj 176 609 outlet; #X text 129 166 freq; #X text 223 181 rate; #X text 519 192 gain; #X text 674 129 bw; #X obj 618 172 * 0.01; #N canvas 350 419 450 300 e_A 0; #X obj 145 134 pow; #X obj 147 32 inlet; #X obj 179 87 / 40; #X obj 148 58 t b f; #X msg 132 84 10; #X obj 144 173 outlet; #X text 191 34 gain; #X connect 0 0 5 0; #X connect 1 0 3 0; #X connect 2 0 0 1; #X connect 3 0 4 0; #X connect 3 1 2 0; #X connect 4 0 0 0; #X restore 447 252 pd e_A; #N canvas 598 23 450 300 e_omega 0; #N canvas 0 0 450 300 pi 0; #X obj 108 54 inlet; #X obj 158 127 * 4; #X obj 158 106 atan 1; #X msg 158 85 1; #X obj 109 187 outlet; #X obj 158 51 loadbang; #X obj 107 157 f; #X connect 0 0 6 0; #X connect 1 0 6 1; #X connect 2 0 1 0; #X connect 3 0 2 0; #X connect 5 0 3 0; #X connect 6 0 4 0; #X restore 141 124 pd pi; #X obj 109 15 inlet; #X obj 228 86 inlet; #X obj 206 117 /; #X obj 89 161 *; #X msg 85 102 2; #X obj 109 44 t b b f; #X obj 119 202 *; #X obj 119 237 outlet; #X text 156 14 freq; #X text 272 88 rate; #X connect 0 0 4 1; #X connect 1 0 6 0; #X connect 2 0 3 1; #X connect 3 0 7 1; #X connect 4 0 7 0; #X connect 5 0 4 0; #X connect 6 0 5 0; #X connect 6 1 0 0; #X connect 6 2 3 0; #X connect 7 0 8 0; #X restore 177 256 pd e_omega; #X obj 446 226 f; #X obj 339 36 t b b b b; #X obj 339 12 loadbang; #X obj 26 69 f \$1; #X obj 436 191 f \$2; #X obj 591 129 f \$3; #X obj 55 114 > 0; #X obj 25 115 t f; #X obj 25 139 spigot; #X obj 25 91 t f f; #X obj 100 165 f; #X msg 259 178 44100; #N canvas 88 11 435 376 e_beta 0; #X obj 265 155 inlet; #X obj 86 39 inlet; #X obj 118 325 outlet; #X text 131 38 a; #X text 309 156 S; #X obj 116 295 sqrt; #X obj 115 249 -; #X obj 98 64 t f f; #X obj 191 86 - 1; #X obj 199 113 t f f; #X obj 200 145 *; #X obj 96 103 t f f; #X obj 96 133 *; #X obj 94 163 + 1; #X obj 93 189 /; #X connect 0 0 14 1; #X connect 1 0 7 0; #X connect 5 0 2 0; #X connect 6 0 5 0; #X connect 7 0 11 0; #X connect 7 1 8 0; #X connect 8 0 9 0; #X connect 9 0 10 0; #X connect 9 1 10 1; #X connect 10 0 6 1; #X connect 11 0 12 0; #X connect 11 1 12 1; #X connect 12 0 13 0; #X connect 13 0 14 0; #X connect 14 0 6 0; #X restore 557 345 pd e_beta; #X obj 420 306 t f f; #X text 342 530 b0; #X text 444 532 b2; #X text 500 532 a0; #X text 290 531 a2; #X text 388 530 b1; #X text 237 530 a1; #N canvas 0 39 788 682 check_stability 0; #X obj 163 27 inlet; #X obj 335 46 inlet; #X obj 385 46 inlet; #X obj 435 46 inlet; #X obj 485 46 inlet; #X obj 535 46 inlet; #X obj 585 46 inlet; #X obj 351 132 f; #X obj 442 129 f; #X text 363 151 b0; #X obj 389 130 f; #X obj 228 124 f; #X text 463 145 b2; #X obj 537 125 f; #X obj 286 128 f; #X text 550 148 a0; #X text 292 148 a2; #X text 406 150 b1; #X text 234 145 a1; #X obj 164 82 t b b b b b b; #X obj 361 234 /; #X obj 314 232 /; #X obj 230 194 * -1; #X obj 282 197 * -1; #X text 311 253 fb1; #X text 356 256 fb2; #X obj 86 293 t f f; #X obj 92 321 *; #X obj 105 345 + 4; #X obj 126 369 *; #X text 25 397 discriminant; #X obj 133 473 >= -1; #X obj 131 454 f; #X obj 126 396 < 0; #X obj 126 418 select 1; #X obj 131 497 select 1; #X text 63 510 stable ->; #X obj 198 260 t f f f; #X obj 326 272 t f f f f; #X obj 311 448 bang; #X text 245 487 stable ->; #X obj 549 261 pack f f f f f f; #X obj 519 261 f; #X obj 548 646 outlet; #X msg 242 571 filter unstable -> resetting; #X obj 242 595 print equ; #N canvas 0 0 677 568 real 0; #X obj 75 59 inlet; #X obj 186 58 inlet; #X obj 324 52 inlet; #X text 226 56 fb1; #X text 373 52 fb2; #X obj 71 320 <= 2; #X obj 149 320 >= -2; #X obj 146 158 f; #X obj 366 158 f; #X msg 237 275 1; #X obj 237 297 -; #X obj 255 325 -; #X obj 237 249 t b f; #X obj 78 111 t b b; #X obj 249 348 >= 0; #X msg 362 279 1; #X obj 380 329 -; #X obj 362 253 t b f; #X obj 373 351 >= 0; #X obj 362 301 +; #X obj 249 390 +; #X obj 148 408 +; #X obj 75 427 +; #X obj 75 450 == 4; #X obj 127 187 t f f f f; #X obj 386 190 t f f; #X obj 71 479 select 1; #X obj 71 516 outlet; #X text 123 521 pass; #X obj 199 516 bang; #X obj 199 538 outlet; #X text 251 539 fail; #X connect 0 0 13 0; #X connect 1 0 7 1; #X connect 2 0 8 1; #X connect 5 0 22 0; #X connect 6 0 21 0; #X connect 7 0 24 0; #X connect 8 0 25 0; #X connect 9 0 10 0; #X connect 10 0 11 0; #X connect 11 0 14 0; #X connect 12 0 9 0; #X connect 12 1 10 1; #X connect 13 0 7 0; #X connect 13 1 8 0; #X connect 14 0 20 0; #X connect 15 0 19 0; #X connect 16 0 18 0; #X connect 17 0 15 0; #X connect 17 1 19 1; #X connect 18 0 20 1; #X connect 19 0 16 0; #X connect 20 0 21 1; #X connect 21 0 22 1; #X connect 22 0 23 0; #X connect 23 0 26 0; #X connect 24 0 5 0; #X connect 24 1 6 0; #X connect 24 2 12 0; #X connect 24 3 17 0; #X connect 25 0 11 1; #X connect 25 1 16 1; #X connect 26 0 27 0; #X connect 26 1 29 0; #X connect 29 0 30 0; #X restore 311 472 pd real roots; #X msg 240 619 0 0 1 0 0 1; #X text 193 510 <- unstable; #X text 408 485 <- unstable; #X obj 188 549 t b b; #X obj 227 167 t f f; #X obj 285 163 t f f; #X floatatom 411 268 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X floatatom 274 289 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 215 485 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1; #X obj 674 392 >= -1; #X floatatom 670 358 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X floatatom 664 433 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 585 574 expr; #X connect 0 0 19 0; #X connect 1 0 11 1; #X connect 2 0 14 1; #X connect 3 0 7 1; #X connect 4 0 10 1; #X connect 5 0 8 1; #X connect 6 0 13 1; #X connect 7 0 41 2; #X connect 8 0 41 4; #X connect 10 0 41 3; #X connect 11 0 51 0; #X connect 13 0 20 1; #X connect 13 0 21 1; #X connect 13 0 41 5; #X connect 14 0 52 0; #X connect 19 0 11 0; #X connect 19 1 14 0; #X connect 19 2 7 0; #X connect 19 3 10 0; #X connect 19 4 8 0; #X connect 19 5 13 0; #X connect 20 0 38 0; #X connect 20 0 53 0; #X connect 21 0 37 0; #X connect 21 0 54 0; #X connect 22 0 21 0; #X connect 23 0 20 0; #X connect 26 0 27 0; #X connect 26 1 27 1; #X connect 27 0 28 0; #X connect 28 0 29 0; #X connect 29 0 33 0; #X connect 31 0 35 0; #X connect 32 0 31 0; #X connect 33 0 34 0; #X connect 34 0 32 0; #X connect 34 1 39 0; #X connect 35 0 42 0; #X connect 35 1 50 0; #X connect 35 1 55 0; #X connect 37 0 26 0; #X connect 37 1 46 1; #X connect 38 0 29 1; #X connect 38 1 32 1; #X connect 38 2 46 2; #X connect 39 0 46 0; #X connect 41 0 43 0; #X connect 42 0 41 0; #X connect 44 0 45 0; #X connect 46 0 42 0; #X connect 46 1 50 0; #X connect 47 0 43 0; #X connect 50 0 47 0; #X connect 50 1 44 0; #X connect 51 0 22 0; #X connect 51 1 42 1; #X connect 52 0 23 0; #X connect 52 1 41 1; #X connect 56 0 58 0; #X connect 57 0 56 0; #X restore 181 549 pd check_stability -------------------------; #X obj 292 310 sin; #X obj 179 308 cos; #X obj 94 195 t b f b; #X obj 179 277 t f f; #N canvas 0 58 450 346 b0 0; #X obj 86 67 inlet; #X obj 167 68 inlet; #X obj 243 70 inlet; #X obj 330 115 inlet; #X text 376 114 beta; #X text 286 70 A; #X text 137 70 CS; #X text 209 67 SN; #X obj 279 206 *; #X obj 221 111 t f f f; #X text 307 205 beta*sn; #X obj 219 293 *; #X obj 140 130 - 1; #X obj 194 186 + 1; #X obj 119 154 *; #X obj 220 324 outlet; #X obj 128 207 f; #X obj 121 179 t b f; #X obj 166 232 -; #X obj 199 254 +; #X connect 0 0 14 0; #X connect 1 0 8 0; #X connect 2 0 9 0; #X connect 3 0 8 1; #X connect 8 0 19 1; #X connect 9 0 12 0; #X connect 9 1 13 0; #X connect 9 2 11 1; #X connect 11 0 15 0; #X connect 12 0 14 1; #X connect 13 0 16 1; #X connect 14 0 17 0; #X connect 16 0 18 0; #X connect 17 0 16 0; #X connect 17 1 18 1; #X connect 18 0 19 0; #X connect 19 0 11 0; #X restore 320 463 pd b0; #N canvas 313 57 469 421 b1 0; #X obj 86 67 inlet; #X obj 243 70 inlet; #X text 286 70 A; #X text 137 70 CS; #X obj 221 111 t f f f; #X obj 219 288 *; #X obj 119 194 *; #X obj 221 386 outlet; #X obj 220 319 t b f; #X obj 223 366 *; #X obj 140 170 + 1; #X obj 219 184 - 1; #X msg 221 342 2; #X obj 173 261 -; #X obj 124 241 f; #X obj 123 216 t b f; #X connect 0 0 6 0; #X connect 1 0 4 0; #X connect 4 0 10 0; #X connect 4 1 11 0; #X connect 4 2 5 1; #X connect 5 0 8 0; #X connect 6 0 15 0; #X connect 8 0 12 0; #X connect 8 1 9 1; #X connect 9 0 7 0; #X connect 10 0 6 1; #X connect 11 0 14 1; #X connect 12 0 9 0; #X connect 13 0 5 0; #X connect 14 0 13 0; #X connect 15 0 14 0; #X connect 15 1 13 1; #X restore 378 464 pd b1; #N canvas 12 81 450 346 b2 0; #X obj 56 25 inlet; #X obj 137 26 inlet; #X obj 213 28 inlet; #X obj 300 73 inlet; #X text 346 72 beta; #X text 256 28 A; #X text 107 28 CS; #X text 179 25 SN; #X obj 243 157 *; #X obj 191 69 t f f f; #X text 278 158 beta*sn; #X obj 193 262 *; #X obj 110 98 - 1; #X obj 164 154 + 1; #X obj 89 122 *; #X obj 193 297 outlet; #X obj 162 235 -; #X obj 120 205 -; #X obj 109 180 f; #X obj 106 144 t b f; #X connect 0 0 14 0; #X connect 1 0 8 0; #X connect 2 0 9 0; #X connect 3 0 8 1; #X connect 8 0 16 1; #X connect 9 0 12 0; #X connect 9 1 13 0; #X connect 9 2 11 1; #X connect 11 0 15 0; #X connect 12 0 14 1; #X connect 13 0 18 1; #X connect 14 0 19 0; #X connect 16 0 11 0; #X connect 17 0 16 0; #X connect 18 0 17 0; #X connect 19 0 18 0; #X connect 19 1 17 1; #X restore 436 464 pd b2; #N canvas 98 350 450 346 a0 0; #X obj 86 67 inlet; #X obj 167 68 inlet; #X obj 243 70 inlet; #X obj 330 115 inlet; #X text 376 114 beta; #X text 286 70 A; #X text 137 70 CS; #X text 209 67 SN; #X obj 210 258 *; #X text 243 257 beta*sn; #X obj 140 140 - 1; #X obj 210 193 + 1; #X obj 119 164 *; #X obj 167 323 outlet; #X obj 221 111 t f f; #X obj 150 219 f; #X obj 152 192 t b f; #X obj 172 289 +; #X obj 168 244 +; #X connect 0 0 12 0; #X connect 1 0 8 0; #X connect 2 0 14 0; #X connect 3 0 8 1; #X connect 8 0 17 1; #X connect 10 0 12 1; #X connect 11 0 15 1; #X connect 12 0 16 0; #X connect 14 0 10 0; #X connect 14 1 11 0; #X connect 15 0 18 0; #X connect 16 0 15 0; #X connect 16 1 18 1; #X connect 17 0 13 0; #X connect 18 0 17 0; #X restore 490 463 pd a0; #N canvas 13 109 469 421 a1 0; #X obj 86 67 inlet; #X obj 243 70 inlet; #X text 286 70 A; #X text 137 70 CS; #X obj 119 194 *; #X obj 171 379 outlet; #X obj 170 312 t b f; #X obj 173 359 *; #X obj 140 170 + 1; #X obj 194 226 - 1; #X obj 221 111 t f f; #X obj 135 219 t b f; #X obj 144 255 f; #X msg 171 335 -2; #X obj 165 291 +; #X connect 0 0 4 0; #X connect 1 0 10 0; #X connect 4 0 11 0; #X connect 6 0 13 0; #X connect 6 1 7 1; #X connect 7 0 5 0; #X connect 8 0 4 1; #X connect 9 0 12 1; #X connect 10 0 8 0; #X connect 10 1 9 0; #X connect 11 0 12 0; #X connect 11 1 14 1; #X connect 12 0 14 0; #X connect 13 0 7 0; #X connect 14 0 6 0; #X restore 203 464 pd a1; #N canvas 389 0 450 346 a2 0; #X obj 86 67 inlet; #X obj 167 68 inlet; #X obj 243 70 inlet; #X obj 330 115 inlet; #X text 376 114 beta; #X text 286 70 A; #X text 137 70 CS; #X text 209 67 SN; #X obj 264 228 *; #X text 292 227 beta*sn; #X obj 140 130 - 1; #X obj 210 203 + 1; #X obj 119 154 *; #X obj 181 318 outlet; #X obj 221 111 t f f; #X obj 150 229 f; #X obj 153 195 t b f; #X obj 178 286 -; #X obj 168 254 +; #X connect 0 0 12 0; #X connect 1 0 8 0; #X connect 2 0 14 0; #X connect 3 0 8 1; #X connect 8 0 17 1; #X connect 10 0 12 1; #X connect 11 0 15 1; #X connect 12 0 16 0; #X connect 14 0 10 0; #X connect 14 1 11 0; #X connect 15 0 18 0; #X connect 16 0 15 0; #X connect 16 1 18 1; #X connect 17 0 13 0; #X connect 18 0 17 0; #X restore 266 462 pd a2; #N canvas 794 50 401 396 output-stable-biquad 0; #X obj 136 40 inlet; #X obj 216 199 /; #X obj 179 201 /; #X obj 132 199 /; #X obj 261 199 /; #X obj 304 201 /; #X obj 48 153 * -1; #X obj 107 157 * -1; #X obj 148 302 pack f f f f f; #X text 141 221 fb1; #X text 182 224 fb2; #X text 220 224 ff1; #X text 261 224 ff2; #X text 301 224 ff3; #X obj 138 73 unpack f f f f f f; #X text 183 41 a1 a2 b0 b1 b2 a0; #X obj 147 332 outlet; #X connect 0 0 14 0; #X connect 1 0 8 2; #X connect 2 0 8 1; #X connect 3 0 8 0; #X connect 4 0 8 3; #X connect 5 0 8 4; #X connect 6 0 3 0; #X connect 7 0 2 0; #X connect 8 0 16 0; #X connect 14 0 6 0; #X connect 14 1 7 0; #X connect 14 2 1 0; #X connect 14 3 4 0; #X connect 14 4 5 0; #X connect 14 5 5 1; #X connect 14 5 4 1; #X connect 14 5 1 1; #X connect 14 5 2 1; #X connect 14 5 3 1; #X restore 181 573 pd output-stable-biquad; #X obj 104 42 route float list; #X obj 154 67 unpack f f f; #X text 247 69 (handle list input); #X text 312 611 based on lowshelf from ggee library by guenter geiger \, using biquad math by robert bristow-johnston: http://www.musicdsp.org/files/Audio-EQ-Cookbook.txt ** port to purepd by dmotd; #X connect 0 0 43 0; #X connect 1 0 11 1; #X connect 2 0 8 0; #X connect 8 0 23 1; #X connect 9 0 24 0; #X connect 10 0 35 0; #X connect 11 0 9 0; #X connect 12 0 14 0; #X connect 12 1 22 0; #X connect 12 2 15 0; #X connect 12 3 16 0; #X connect 13 0 12 0; #X connect 14 0 20 0; #X connect 15 0 11 1; #X connect 16 0 8 0; #X connect 17 0 19 1; #X connect 18 0 19 0; #X connect 19 0 21 0; #X connect 20 0 18 0; #X connect 20 1 17 0; #X connect 21 0 34 0; #X connect 22 0 10 1; #X connect 23 0 36 3; #X connect 23 0 38 3; #X connect 23 0 39 3; #X connect 23 0 41 3; #X connect 24 0 36 2; #X connect 24 0 37 1; #X connect 24 0 38 2; #X connect 24 0 39 2; #X connect 24 0 40 1; #X connect 24 0 41 2; #X connect 24 1 23 0; #X connect 31 0 42 0; #X connect 32 0 36 1; #X connect 32 0 38 1; #X connect 32 0 39 1; #X connect 32 0 41 1; #X connect 33 0 36 0; #X connect 33 0 37 0; #X connect 33 0 38 0; #X connect 33 0 39 0; #X connect 33 0 40 0; #X connect 33 0 41 0; #X connect 34 0 31 0; #X connect 34 1 10 0; #X connect 34 2 11 0; #X connect 35 0 33 0; #X connect 35 1 32 0; #X connect 36 0 31 3; #X connect 37 0 31 4; #X connect 38 0 31 5; #X connect 39 0 31 6; #X connect 40 0 31 1; #X connect 41 0 31 2; #X connect 42 0 3 0; #X connect 43 0 21 0; #X connect 43 1 44 0; #X connect 44 0 21 0; #X connect 44 1 11 1; #X connect 44 2 8 0; -------------- next part -------------- #N canvas 48 0 753 711 10; #X obj 104 21 inlet; #X obj 475 203 inlet; #X obj 578 127 inlet; #X obj 176 609 outlet; #X text 129 166 freq; #X text 223 181 rate; #X text 519 202 gain; #X text 624 129 bw; #X obj 370 158 * 0.01; #N canvas 371 421 450 300 e_A 0; #X obj 145 134 pow; #X obj 147 32 inlet; #X obj 179 87 / 40; #X obj 148 58 t b f; #X msg 132 84 10; #X obj 144 173 outlet; #X text 191 34 gain; #X connect 0 0 5 0; #X connect 1 0 3 0; #X connect 2 0 0 1; #X connect 3 0 4 0; #X connect 3 1 2 0; #X connect 4 0 0 0; #X restore 447 262 pd e_A; #N canvas 598 23 450 300 e_omega 0; #N canvas 0 0 450 300 pi 0; #X obj 108 54 inlet; #X obj 158 127 * 4; #X obj 158 106 atan 1; #X msg 158 85 1; #X obj 109 187 outlet; #X obj 158 51 loadbang; #X obj 107 157 f; #X connect 0 0 6 0; #X connect 1 0 6 1; #X connect 2 0 1 0; #X connect 3 0 2 0; #X connect 5 0 3 0; #X connect 6 0 4 0; #X restore 141 124 pd pi; #X obj 109 15 inlet; #X obj 228 86 inlet; #X obj 206 117 /; #X obj 89 161 *; #X msg 85 102 2; #X obj 109 44 t b b f; #X obj 119 202 *; #X obj 119 237 outlet; #X text 156 14 freq; #X text 272 88 rate; #X connect 0 0 4 1; #X connect 1 0 6 0; #X connect 2 0 3 1; #X connect 3 0 7 1; #X connect 4 0 7 0; #X connect 5 0 4 0; #X connect 6 0 5 0; #X connect 6 1 0 0; #X connect 6 2 3 0; #X connect 7 0 8 0; #X restore 177 256 pd e_omega; #X obj 446 236 f; #N canvas 629 114 445 467 e_alpha 0; #X obj 361 72 inlet; #X obj 86 39 inlet; #X obj 51 198 sin; #N canvas 0 0 450 300 sinh 0; #X obj 71 138 exp; #X obj 125 142 exp; #X obj 124 103 * -1; #X obj 71 79 t f f; #X obj 89 175 -; #X obj 83 202 / 2; #X obj 70 46 inlet; #X obj 94 227 outlet; #X connect 0 0 4 0; #X connect 1 0 4 1; #X connect 2 0 1 0; #X connect 3 0 0 0; #X connect 3 1 2 0; #X connect 4 0 5 0; #X connect 5 0 7 0; #X connect 6 0 3 0; #X restore 250 340 pd sinh; #X obj 180 254 *; #X text 404 73 bw; #X text 131 38 omega; #X obj 224 143 sin; #X obj 204 182 /; #X obj 249 312 *; #X obj 132 383 *; #X obj 134 413 outlet; #X obj 106 110 t f b f f; #N canvas 0 0 450 300 log2/2 0; #X obj 150 154 log; #X msg 149 125 2; #X obj 146 185 / 2; #X obj 122 52 inlet; #X obj 166 97 loadbang; #X obj 134 212 f; #X obj 138 242 outlet; #X connect 0 0 2 0; #X connect 1 0 0 0; #X connect 2 0 5 1; #X connect 3 0 5 0; #X connect 4 0 1 0; #X connect 5 0 6 0; #X restore 112 207 pd log2/2; #X connect 0 0 9 1; #X connect 1 0 12 0; #X connect 2 0 10 0; #X connect 3 0 10 1; #X connect 4 0 9 0; #X connect 7 0 8 1; #X connect 8 0 4 1; #X connect 9 0 3 0; #X connect 10 0 11 0; #X connect 12 0 2 0; #X connect 12 1 13 0; #X connect 12 2 8 0; #X connect 12 3 7 0; #X connect 13 0 4 0; #X restore 293 297 pd e_alpha; #X obj 397 384 *; #X obj 191 458 *; 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#X obj 373 351 >= 0; #X obj 362 301 +; #X obj 249 390 +; #X obj 148 408 +; #X obj 75 427 +; #X obj 75 450 == 4; #X obj 127 187 t f f f f; #X obj 386 190 t f f; #X obj 71 479 select 1; #X obj 71 516 outlet; #X text 123 521 pass; #X obj 199 516 bang; #X obj 199 538 outlet; #X text 251 539 fail; #X connect 0 0 13 0; #X connect 1 0 7 1; #X connect 2 0 8 1; #X connect 5 0 22 0; #X connect 6 0 21 0; #X connect 7 0 24 0; #X connect 8 0 25 0; #X connect 9 0 10 0; #X connect 10 0 11 0; #X connect 11 0 14 0; #X connect 12 0 9 0; #X connect 12 1 10 1; #X connect 13 0 7 0; #X connect 13 1 8 0; #X connect 14 0 20 0; #X connect 15 0 19 0; #X connect 16 0 18 0; #X connect 17 0 15 0; #X connect 17 1 19 1; #X connect 18 0 20 1; #X connect 19 0 16 0; #X connect 20 0 21 1; #X connect 21 0 22 1; #X connect 22 0 23 0; #X connect 23 0 26 0; #X connect 24 0 5 0; #X connect 24 1 6 0; #X connect 24 2 12 0; #X connect 24 3 17 0; #X connect 25 0 11 1; #X connect 25 1 16 1; #X connect 26 0 27 0; #X connect 26 1 29 0; #X connect 29 0 30 0; #X restore 311 472 pd real roots; #X msg 240 619 0 0 1 0 0 1; #X text 193 510 <- unstable; #X text 408 485 <- unstable; #X obj 188 549 t b b; #X obj 227 167 t f f; #X obj 285 163 t f f; #X connect 0 0 19 0; #X connect 1 0 11 1; #X connect 2 0 14 1; #X connect 3 0 7 1; #X connect 4 0 10 1; #X connect 5 0 8 1; #X connect 6 0 13 1; #X connect 7 0 41 2; #X connect 8 0 41 4; #X connect 10 0 41 3; #X connect 11 0 51 0; #X connect 13 0 20 1; #X connect 13 0 21 1; #X connect 13 0 41 5; #X connect 14 0 52 0; #X connect 19 0 11 0; #X connect 19 1 14 0; #X connect 19 2 7 0; #X connect 19 3 10 0; #X connect 19 4 8 0; #X connect 19 5 13 0; #X connect 20 0 38 0; #X connect 21 0 37 0; #X connect 22 0 21 0; #X connect 23 0 20 0; #X connect 26 0 27 0; #X connect 26 1 27 1; #X connect 27 0 28 0; #X connect 28 0 29 0; #X connect 29 0 33 0; #X connect 31 0 35 0; #X connect 32 0 31 0; #X connect 33 0 34 0; #X connect 34 0 32 0; #X connect 34 1 39 0; #X connect 35 0 42 0; #X connect 35 1 50 0; #X connect 37 0 26 0; #X connect 37 1 46 1; #X connect 38 0 29 1; #X connect 38 1 32 1; #X connect 38 2 46 2; #X connect 39 0 46 0; #X connect 41 0 43 0; #X connect 42 0 41 0; #X connect 44 0 45 0; #X connect 46 0 42 0; #X connect 46 1 50 0; #X connect 47 0 43 0; #X connect 50 0 47 0; #X connect 50 1 44 0; #X connect 51 0 22 0; #X connect 51 1 42 1; #X connect 52 0 23 0; #X connect 52 1 41 1; #X restore 181 549 pd check_stability --------; #X text 312 611 based on equalizer from ggee library by guenter geiger \, using biquad math by robert bristow-johnston: http://www.musicdsp.org/files/Audio-EQ-Cookbook.txt ** port to purepd by dmotd; #X obj 104 42 route float list; #X obj 154 67 unpack f f f; #X text 247 69 (handle list input); #N canvas 794 50 401 396 output-stable-biquad 0; #X obj 136 40 inlet; #X obj 216 199 /; #X obj 179 201 /; #X obj 132 199 /; #X obj 261 199 /; #X obj 304 201 /; #X obj 48 153 * -1; #X obj 107 157 * -1; #X obj 148 302 pack f f f f f; #X text 141 221 fb1; #X text 182 224 fb2; #X text 220 224 ff1; #X text 261 224 ff2; #X text 301 224 ff3; #X obj 138 73 unpack f f f f f f; #X text 183 41 a1 a2 b0 b1 b2 a0; #X obj 147 332 outlet; #X connect 0 0 14 0; #X connect 1 0 8 2; #X connect 2 0 8 1; #X connect 3 0 8 0; #X connect 4 0 8 3; #X connect 5 0 8 4; #X connect 6 0 3 0; #X connect 7 0 2 0; #X connect 8 0 16 0; #X connect 14 0 6 0; #X connect 14 1 7 0; #X connect 14 2 1 0; #X connect 14 3 4 0; #X connect 14 4 5 0; #X connect 14 5 5 1; #X connect 14 5 4 1; #X connect 14 5 1 1; #X connect 14 5 2 1; #X connect 14 5 3 1; #X restore 181 573 pd output-stable-biquad; #X connect 0 0 46 0; #X connect 1 0 11 1; #X connect 2 0 8 0; #X connect 8 0 12 1; #X connect 9 0 13 1; #X connect 9 0 22 1; #X connect 9 0 36 1; #X connect 10 0 23 0; #X connect 11 0 9 0; #X connect 12 0 36 0; #X connect 12 0 13 0; #X connect 12 0 22 0; #X connect 13 0 19 0; #X connect 14 0 44 1; #X connect 14 0 44 4; #X connect 15 0 14 0; #X connect 16 0 44 3; #X connect 17 0 44 5; #X connect 18 0 16 0; #X connect 19 0 18 0; #X connect 19 1 20 0; #X connect 19 2 16 1; #X connect 19 3 17 1; #X connect 20 0 17 0; #X connect 21 0 27 0; #X connect 22 0 37 0; #X connect 23 0 25 0; #X connect 23 1 12 0; #X connect 24 0 44 0; #X connect 24 1 10 0; #X connect 24 2 11 0; #X connect 25 0 15 0; #X connect 25 1 26 0; #X connect 26 0 14 1; #X connect 27 0 44 6; #X connect 28 0 30 0; #X connect 28 1 43 0; #X connect 28 2 31 0; #X connect 28 3 32 0; #X connect 29 0 28 0; #X connect 30 0 41 0; #X connect 31 0 11 1; #X connect 32 0 8 0; #X connect 33 0 34 0; #X connect 34 0 44 2; #X connect 35 0 33 0; #X connect 35 1 34 1; #X connect 36 0 35 0; #X connect 37 0 21 0; #X connect 37 1 27 1; #X connect 38 0 40 1; #X connect 39 0 40 0; #X connect 40 0 42 0; #X connect 41 0 39 0; #X connect 41 1 38 0; #X connect 42 0 24 0; #X connect 43 0 10 1; #X connect 44 0 49 0; #X connect 46 0 42 0; #X connect 46 1 47 0; #X connect 47 0 42 0; #X connect 47 1 11 1; #X connect 47 2 8 0; #X connect 49 0 3 0; -------------- next part -------------- #N canvas 155 3 753 711 10; #X obj 103 16 inlet; #X obj 475 193 inlet; #X obj 628 127 inlet; #X obj 176 609 outlet; #X text 129 166 freq; #X text 223 181 rate; #X text 519 192 gain; #X text 674 129 bw; #X obj 618 172 * 0.01; #N canvas 350 419 450 300 e_A 0; #X obj 145 134 pow; #X obj 147 32 inlet; #X obj 179 87 / 40; #X obj 148 58 t b f; #X msg 132 84 10; #X obj 144 173 outlet; #X text 191 34 gain; #X connect 0 0 5 0; #X connect 1 0 3 0; #X connect 2 0 0 1; #X connect 3 0 4 0; #X connect 3 1 2 0; #X connect 4 0 0 0; #X restore 447 252 pd e_A; #N canvas 598 23 450 300 e_omega 0; #N canvas 0 0 450 300 pi 0; #X obj 108 54 inlet; #X obj 158 127 * 4; #X obj 158 106 atan 1; #X msg 158 85 1; #X obj 109 187 outlet; #X obj 158 51 loadbang; #X obj 107 157 f; #X connect 0 0 6 0; #X connect 1 0 6 1; #X connect 2 0 1 0; #X connect 3 0 2 0; #X connect 5 0 3 0; #X connect 6 0 4 0; #X restore 141 124 pd pi; #X obj 109 15 inlet; #X obj 228 86 inlet; #X obj 206 117 /; #X obj 89 161 *; #X msg 85 102 2; #X obj 109 44 t b b f; #X obj 119 202 *; #X obj 119 237 outlet; #X text 156 14 freq; #X text 272 88 rate; #X connect 0 0 4 1; #X connect 1 0 6 0; #X connect 2 0 3 1; #X connect 3 0 7 1; #X connect 4 0 7 0; #X connect 5 0 4 0; #X connect 6 0 5 0; #X connect 6 1 0 0; #X connect 6 2 3 0; #X connect 7 0 8 0; #X restore 177 256 pd e_omega; #X obj 446 226 f; #X obj 339 36 t b b b b; #X obj 339 12 loadbang; #X obj 26 69 f \$1; #X obj 450 169 f \$2; #X obj 601 106 f \$3; #X obj 55 114 > 0; #X obj 25 115 t f; #X obj 25 139 spigot; #X obj 25 91 t f f; #X obj 100 165 f; #X msg 259 178 44100; #N canvas 88 11 435 376 e_beta 0; #X obj 265 155 inlet; #X obj 86 39 inlet; #X obj 118 325 outlet; #X text 131 38 a; #X text 309 156 S; #X obj 116 295 sqrt; #X obj 115 249 -; #X obj 98 64 t f f; #X obj 191 86 - 1; #X obj 199 113 t f f; #X obj 200 145 *; #X obj 96 103 t f f; #X obj 96 133 *; #X obj 94 163 + 1; #X obj 93 189 /; #X connect 0 0 14 1; #X connect 1 0 7 0; #X connect 5 0 2 0; #X connect 6 0 5 0; #X connect 7 0 11 0; #X connect 7 1 8 0; #X connect 8 0 9 0; #X connect 9 0 10 0; #X connect 9 1 10 1; #X connect 10 0 6 1; #X connect 11 0 12 0; #X connect 11 1 12 1; #X connect 12 0 13 0; #X connect 13 0 14 0; #X connect 14 0 6 0; #X restore 557 345 pd e_beta; #X obj 420 306 t f f; #X text 342 530 b0; #X text 444 532 b2; #X text 500 532 a0; #X text 290 531 a2; #X text 388 530 b1; #X text 237 530 a1; #N canvas 0 39 788 682 check_stability 0; #X obj 163 27 inlet; #X obj 335 46 inlet; #X obj 385 46 inlet; #X obj 435 46 inlet; #X obj 485 46 inlet; #X obj 535 46 inlet; #X obj 585 46 inlet; #X obj 351 132 f; #X obj 442 129 f; #X text 363 151 b0; #X obj 389 130 f; #X obj 228 124 f; #X text 463 145 b2; #X obj 537 125 f; #X obj 286 128 f; #X text 550 148 a0; #X text 292 148 a2; #X text 406 150 b1; #X text 234 145 a1; #X obj 164 82 t b b b b b b; #X obj 361 234 /; #X obj 314 232 /; #X obj 230 194 * -1; #X obj 282 197 * -1; #X text 311 253 fb1; #X text 356 256 fb2; #X obj 86 293 t f f; #X obj 92 321 *; #X obj 105 345 + 4; #X obj 126 369 *; #X text 25 397 discriminant; #X obj 133 473 >= -1; #X obj 131 454 f; #X obj 126 396 < 0; #X obj 126 418 select 1; #X obj 131 497 select 1; #X text 63 510 stable ->; #X obj 198 260 t f f f; #X obj 326 272 t f f f f; #X obj 311 448 bang; #X text 245 487 stable ->; #X obj 549 261 pack f f f f f f; #X obj 519 261 f; #X obj 548 646 outlet; #X msg 242 571 filter unstable -> resetting; #X obj 242 595 print equ; #N canvas 0 0 677 568 real 0; #X obj 75 59 inlet; #X obj 186 58 inlet; #X obj 324 52 inlet; #X text 226 56 fb1; #X text 373 52 fb2; #X obj 71 320 <= 2; #X obj 149 320 >= -2; #X obj 146 158 f; #X obj 366 158 f; #X msg 237 275 1; #X obj 237 297 -; #X obj 255 325 -; #X obj 237 249 t b f; #X obj 78 111 t b b; #X obj 249 348 >= 0; #X msg 362 279 1; #X obj 380 329 -; #X obj 362 253 t b f; #X obj 373 351 >= 0; #X obj 362 301 +; #X obj 249 390 +; #X obj 148 408 +; #X obj 75 427 +; #X obj 75 450 == 4; #X obj 127 187 t f f f f; #X obj 386 190 t f f; #X obj 71 479 select 1; #X obj 71 516 outlet; #X text 123 521 pass; #X obj 199 516 bang; #X obj 199 538 outlet; #X text 251 539 fail; #X connect 0 0 13 0; #X connect 1 0 7 1; #X connect 2 0 8 1; #X connect 5 0 22 0; #X connect 6 0 21 0; #X connect 7 0 24 0; #X connect 8 0 25 0; #X connect 9 0 10 0; #X connect 10 0 11 0; #X connect 11 0 14 0; #X connect 12 0 9 0; #X connect 12 1 10 1; #X connect 13 0 7 0; #X connect 13 1 8 0; #X connect 14 0 20 0; #X connect 15 0 19 0; #X connect 16 0 18 0; #X connect 17 0 15 0; #X connect 17 1 19 1; #X connect 18 0 20 1; #X connect 19 0 16 0; #X connect 20 0 21 1; #X connect 21 0 22 1; #X connect 22 0 23 0; #X connect 23 0 26 0; #X connect 24 0 5 0; #X connect 24 1 6 0; #X connect 24 2 12 0; #X connect 24 3 17 0; #X connect 25 0 11 1; #X connect 25 1 16 1; #X connect 26 0 27 0; #X connect 26 1 29 0; #X connect 29 0 30 0; #X restore 311 472 pd real roots; #X msg 240 619 0 0 1 0 0 1; #X text 193 510 <- unstable; #X text 408 485 <- unstable; #X obj 188 549 t b b; #X obj 227 167 t f f; #X obj 285 163 t f f; #X floatatom 411 268 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X floatatom 274 289 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 215 485 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1; #X obj 674 392 >= -1; #X floatatom 670 358 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X floatatom 664 433 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 585 574 expr; #X connect 0 0 19 0; #X connect 1 0 11 1; #X connect 2 0 14 1; #X connect 3 0 7 1; #X connect 4 0 10 1; #X connect 5 0 8 1; #X connect 6 0 13 1; #X connect 7 0 41 2; #X connect 8 0 41 4; #X connect 10 0 41 3; #X connect 11 0 51 0; #X connect 13 0 20 1; #X connect 13 0 21 1; #X connect 13 0 41 5; #X connect 14 0 52 0; #X connect 19 0 11 0; #X connect 19 1 14 0; #X connect 19 2 7 0; #X connect 19 3 10 0; #X connect 19 4 8 0; #X connect 19 5 13 0; #X connect 20 0 38 0; #X connect 20 0 53 0; #X connect 21 0 37 0; #X connect 21 0 54 0; #X connect 22 0 21 0; #X connect 23 0 20 0; #X connect 26 0 27 0; #X connect 26 1 27 1; #X connect 27 0 28 0; #X connect 28 0 29 0; #X connect 29 0 33 0; #X connect 31 0 35 0; #X connect 32 0 31 0; #X connect 33 0 34 0; #X connect 34 0 32 0; #X connect 34 1 39 0; #X connect 35 0 42 0; #X connect 35 1 50 0; #X connect 35 1 55 0; #X connect 37 0 26 0; #X connect 37 1 46 1; #X connect 38 0 29 1; #X connect 38 1 32 1; #X connect 38 2 46 2; #X connect 39 0 46 0; #X connect 41 0 43 0; #X connect 42 0 41 0; #X connect 44 0 45 0; #X connect 46 0 42 0; #X connect 46 1 50 0; #X connect 47 0 43 0; #X connect 50 0 47 0; #X connect 50 1 44 0; #X connect 51 0 22 0; #X connect 51 1 42 1; #X connect 52 0 23 0; #X connect 52 1 41 1; #X connect 56 0 58 0; #X connect 57 0 56 0; #X restore 181 549 pd check_stability -------------------------; #X obj 292 310 sin; #X obj 179 308 cos; #X obj 94 195 t b f b; #X obj 179 277 t f f; #N canvas 48 39 450 346 b0 0; #X obj 86 67 inlet; #X obj 167 68 inlet; #X obj 243 70 inlet; #X obj 330 115 inlet; #X text 376 114 beta; #X text 286 70 A; #X text 137 70 CS; #X text 209 67 SN; #X obj 279 206 *; #X obj 221 111 t f f f; #X obj 199 254 +; #X text 307 205 beta*sn; #X obj 219 293 *; #X obj 140 130 - 1; #X obj 194 186 + 1; #X obj 119 154 *; #X obj 163 212 +; #X obj 220 324 outlet; #X connect 0 0 15 0; #X connect 1 0 8 0; #X connect 2 0 9 0; #X connect 3 0 8 1; #X connect 8 0 10 1; #X connect 9 0 13 0; #X connect 9 1 14 0; #X connect 9 2 12 1; #X connect 10 0 12 0; #X connect 12 0 17 0; #X connect 13 0 15 1; #X connect 14 0 16 1; #X connect 15 0 16 0; #X connect 16 0 10 0; #X restore 320 463 pd b0; #N canvas 658 123 469 421 b1 0; #X obj 86 67 inlet; #X obj 243 70 inlet; #X text 286 70 A; #X text 137 70 CS; #X obj 221 111 t f f f; #X obj 219 288 *; #X obj 119 194 *; #X obj 163 252 +; #X obj 221 386 outlet; #X obj 220 319 t b f; #X obj 223 366 *; #X msg 221 342 -2; #X obj 140 170 + 1; #X obj 194 226 - 1; #X connect 0 0 6 0; #X connect 1 0 4 0; #X connect 4 0 12 0; #X connect 4 1 13 0; #X connect 4 2 5 1; #X connect 5 0 9 0; #X connect 6 0 7 0; #X connect 7 0 5 0; #X connect 9 0 11 0; #X connect 9 1 10 1; #X connect 10 0 8 0; #X connect 11 0 10 0; #X connect 12 0 6 1; #X connect 13 0 7 1; #X restore 378 464 pd b1; #N canvas 66 191 450 346 b2 0; #X obj 86 67 inlet; #X obj 167 68 inlet; #X obj 243 70 inlet; #X obj 330 115 inlet; #X text 376 114 beta; #X text 286 70 A; #X text 137 70 CS; #X text 209 67 SN; #X obj 273 199 *; #X obj 221 111 t f f f; #X text 308 200 beta*sn; #X obj 219 288 *; #X obj 140 140 - 1; #X obj 194 196 + 1; #X obj 119 164 *; #X obj 163 222 +; #X obj 220 324 outlet; #X obj 198 255 -; #X connect 0 0 14 0; #X connect 1 0 8 0; #X connect 2 0 9 0; #X connect 3 0 8 1; #X connect 8 0 17 1; #X connect 9 0 12 0; #X connect 9 1 13 0; #X connect 9 2 11 1; #X connect 11 0 16 0; #X connect 12 0 14 1; #X connect 13 0 15 1; #X connect 14 0 15 0; #X connect 15 0 17 0; #X connect 17 0 11 0; #X restore 436 464 pd b2; #N canvas 69 380 450 346 a0 0; #X obj 86 67 inlet; #X obj 167 68 inlet; #X obj 243 70 inlet; #X obj 330 115 inlet; #X text 376 114 beta; #X text 286 70 A; #X text 137 70 CS; #X text 209 67 SN; #X obj 210 258 *; #X text 243 257 beta*sn; #X obj 140 140 - 1; #X obj 210 193 + 1; #X obj 119 164 *; #X obj 167 323 outlet; #X obj 221 111 t f f; #X obj 168 244 -; #X obj 150 219 f; #X obj 152 192 t b f; #X obj 172 289 +; #X connect 0 0 12 0; #X connect 1 0 8 0; #X connect 2 0 14 0; #X connect 3 0 8 1; #X connect 8 0 18 1; #X connect 10 0 12 1; #X connect 11 0 16 1; #X connect 12 0 17 0; #X connect 14 0 10 0; #X connect 14 1 11 0; #X connect 15 0 18 0; #X connect 16 0 15 0; #X connect 17 0 16 0; #X connect 17 1 15 1; #X connect 18 0 13 0; #X restore 490 463 pd a0; #N canvas 0 60 469 421 a1 0; #X obj 86 67 inlet; #X obj 243 70 inlet; #X text 286 70 A; #X text 137 70 CS; #X obj 119 194 *; #X obj 171 379 outlet; #X obj 170 312 t b f; #X obj 173 359 *; #X obj 140 170 + 1; #X obj 194 226 - 1; #X obj 221 111 t f f; #X obj 168 284 -; #X obj 135 219 t b f; #X obj 144 255 f; #X msg 171 335 2; #X connect 0 0 4 0; #X connect 1 0 10 0; #X connect 4 0 12 0; #X connect 6 0 14 0; #X connect 6 1 7 1; #X connect 7 0 5 0; #X connect 8 0 4 1; #X connect 9 0 13 1; #X connect 10 0 8 0; #X connect 10 1 9 0; #X connect 11 0 6 0; #X connect 12 0 13 0; #X connect 12 1 11 1; #X connect 13 0 11 0; #X connect 14 0 7 0; #X restore 203 464 pd a1; #N canvas 71 12 450 346 a2 0; #X obj 86 67 inlet; #X obj 167 68 inlet; #X obj 243 70 inlet; #X obj 330 115 inlet; #X text 376 114 beta; #X text 286 70 A; #X text 137 70 CS; #X text 209 67 SN; #X obj 264 228 *; #X text 292 227 beta*sn; #X obj 140 130 - 1; #X obj 210 203 + 1; #X obj 119 154 *; #X obj 181 318 outlet; #X obj 221 111 t f f; #X obj 168 254 -; #X obj 150 229 f; #X obj 153 195 t b f; #X obj 178 286 -; #X connect 0 0 12 0; #X connect 1 0 8 0; #X connect 2 0 14 0; #X connect 3 0 8 1; #X connect 8 0 18 1; #X connect 10 0 12 1; #X connect 11 0 16 1; #X connect 12 0 17 0; #X connect 14 0 10 0; #X connect 14 1 11 0; #X connect 15 0 18 0; #X connect 16 0 15 0; #X connect 17 0 16 0; #X connect 17 1 15 1; #X connect 18 0 13 0; #X restore 266 462 pd a2; #X text 312 611 based on highshelf from ggee library by guenter geiger \, using biquad math by robert bristow-johnston: http://www.musicdsp.org/files/Audio-EQ-Cookbook.txt ** port to purepd by dmotd; #X obj 104 42 route float list; #X obj 154 67 unpack f f f; #X text 247 69 (handle list input); #N canvas 794 50 401 396 output-stable-biquad 0; #X obj 136 40 inlet; #X obj 216 199 /; #X obj 179 201 /; #X obj 132 199 /; #X obj 261 199 /; #X obj 304 201 /; #X obj 48 153 * -1; #X obj 107 157 * -1; #X obj 148 302 pack f f f f f; #X text 141 221 fb1; #X text 182 224 fb2; #X text 220 224 ff1; #X text 261 224 ff2; #X text 301 224 ff3; #X obj 138 73 unpack f f f f f f; #X text 183 41 a1 a2 b0 b1 b2 a0; #X obj 147 332 outlet; #X connect 0 0 14 0; #X connect 1 0 8 2; #X connect 2 0 8 1; #X connect 3 0 8 0; #X connect 4 0 8 3; #X connect 5 0 8 4; #X connect 6 0 3 0; #X connect 7 0 2 0; #X connect 8 0 16 0; #X connect 14 0 6 0; #X connect 14 1 7 0; #X connect 14 2 1 0; #X connect 14 3 4 0; #X connect 14 4 5 0; #X connect 14 5 5 1; #X connect 14 5 4 1; #X connect 14 5 1 1; #X connect 14 5 2 1; #X connect 14 5 3 1; #X restore 181 573 pd output-stable-biquad; #X connect 0 0 43 0; #X connect 1 0 11 1; #X connect 2 0 8 0; #X connect 8 0 23 1; #X connect 9 0 24 0; #X connect 10 0 35 0; #X connect 11 0 9 0; #X connect 12 0 14 0; #X connect 12 1 22 0; #X connect 12 2 15 0; #X connect 12 3 16 0; #X connect 13 0 12 0; #X connect 14 0 20 0; #X connect 15 0 11 1; #X connect 16 0 8 0; #X connect 17 0 19 1; #X connect 18 0 19 0; #X connect 19 0 21 0; #X connect 20 0 18 0; #X connect 20 1 17 0; #X connect 21 0 34 0; #X connect 22 0 10 1; #X connect 23 0 36 3; #X connect 23 0 38 3; #X connect 23 0 39 3; #X connect 23 0 41 3; #X connect 24 0 36 2; #X connect 24 0 37 1; #X connect 24 0 38 2; #X connect 24 0 39 2; #X connect 24 0 40 1; #X connect 24 0 41 2; #X connect 24 1 23 0; #X connect 31 0 46 0; #X connect 32 0 36 1; #X connect 32 0 38 1; #X connect 32 0 39 1; #X connect 32 0 41 1; #X connect 33 0 36 0; #X connect 33 0 37 0; #X connect 33 0 38 0; #X connect 33 0 39 0; #X connect 33 0 40 0; #X connect 33 0 41 0; #X connect 34 0 31 0; #X connect 34 1 10 0; #X connect 34 2 11 0; #X connect 35 0 33 0; #X connect 35 1 32 0; #X connect 36 0 31 3; #X connect 37 0 31 4; #X connect 38 0 31 5; #X connect 39 0 31 6; #X connect 40 0 31 1; #X connect 41 0 31 2; #X connect 43 0 21 0; #X connect 43 1 44 0; #X connect 44 0 21 0; #X connect 44 1 11 1; #X connect 44 2 8 0; #X connect 46 0 3 0; From hard.off at gmail.com Tue Mar 24 04:54:48 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 12:54:48 +0900 Subject: [PD] [equalizer] / [lowshelf] / [highshelf] in purepd! In-Reply-To: <200903241216.06587.dmotd@gmx.net> References: <200903241216.06587.dmotd@gmx.net> Message-ID: <161320dd0903232054k4fb5e2cchaa6090071efd66a7@mail.gmail.com> cheers. very useful! silly question probably, but is biquad~ 100% vanilla? or is it sort of 'caramel' like expr ?? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hans at eds.org Tue Mar 24 05:18:44 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 00:18:44 -0400 Subject: [PD] [import]ing libdirs from places other than extra/? In-Reply-To: <7aaf8bb90809180424h13eda0c9w6360b6fcd17f66fa@mail.gmail.com> References: <7aaf8bb90809180424h13eda0c9w6360b6fcd17f66fa@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Its quite appalling that I didn't see this until now. I was super busy back in Sept and I guess i never saw this again until now. Anyway, I fixed it, so the fix will be included in the nightly builds: http://pure-data.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/pure-data?view=rev&revision=10895 For future reference, feel free to nag me on this kind of thing. .hc On Sep 18, 2008, at 7:24 AM, Luke Iannini wrote: > Hi hans/all, > I'm trying to switch my entire library of patches over to [import] and > removing everything from my path to decrease loading time of my very > nested patches. > > Everything worked great for the libdirs in extra (in the > Pd-extended.app bundle), but I'm not having any luck [import]ing from > anywhere else (i.e. my personal patch collection). According to > http://puredata.info/docs/faq/how-do-i-install-externals-and-help-files-with-pd-extended > , I was under the impression I could add libdirs (which I have added > -meta.pd files to) to ~/Library/Pd or /Library/Pd and [import] would > find them. > > But, I'm unable to instantiate any of the patches in my libdirs after > doing this and [import]ing them. > > [import] does not, at least, complain, when I instantiate it > (i.e. I get "libdir_loader: added 'Concepts' to the canvas-local > objectclass path" rather than "error: [import]: ERROR: can't load > library in 'Concepttt'") > so, something is working. > > Moving my directories into extra/ fixes the problem, but I'd rather > not do that! > > Also, is it defined at a source level that ~/Library/Pd and > /Library/Pd are the only places libdirs can be loaded from (I couldn't > find it i so)? Or, is is just that every folder in the global path is > searched for libdirs (or, at least, is that how it's meant to be)? > > Cheers > Luke > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- "[W]e have invented the technology to eliminate scarcity, but we are deliberately throwing it away to benefit those who profit from scarcity." -John Gilmore From matju at artengine.ca Tue Mar 24 07:12:39 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 02:12:39 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] Horizontal Connections (Was: Re: style guide idea: [send In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Sun, 22 Mar 2009, Matt Barber wrote: > must connect to the left-most inlet of the lower object. Reverse if > the connection travels from right to left. The problem is there's no > good way to tell if a patch adheres to the agreement. There's never a good way to do that. I remember losing an hour or so trying to debug a patch to finally realise I had two identical objects exactly on top of each other and that my patch was using the first's inlets and the second's outlet. No wonder no message got sent through. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From fbar at footils.org Tue Mar 24 08:03:31 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 08:03:31 +0100 Subject: [PD] [equalizer] / [lowshelf] / [highshelf] in purepd! In-Reply-To: <200903241216.06587.dmotd@gmx.net> References: <200903241216.06587.dmotd@gmx.net> Message-ID: <20090324070331.GA14255@fliwatut.scifi> Hallo, dmotd hat gesagt: // dmotd wrote: > here are some purepd representations of the [equalizer] [lowshelf] and > [highshelf] objects for calculating eq biquad filter coefficients. i put > these together as ggee was the only external lib dependency for a project > which used these fairly extensively. the code is almost logic identical to > the equivelent C internals, and i have avoided using [expr], so the math may > look a little confusing. > > i only ported the code for the objects i was using, but i will add the other > eq-cookbook filters when i next get a chance. Very nice. Actually these three cookbook filters are the three that I didn't yet port to purepd, so they are very welcome! :) The others are included in the rjdj library as u_lowpass, u_lowpassq, u_highpass, u_highpassq, u_bandpass1, u_bandpass1q, u_bandpass2 and u_bandpass2q. There also is a signal biquad~ as e_beequad available (which just does linear interpolation of parameters, so it's of course not really correct if you do larger jumps). Ciao -- Frank Barknecht Do You RjDj.me? _ ______footils.org__ From fbar at footils.org Tue Mar 24 08:04:05 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 08:04:05 +0100 Subject: [PD] [equalizer] / [lowshelf] / [highshelf] in purepd! In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903232054k4fb5e2cchaa6090071efd66a7@mail.gmail.com> References: <200903241216.06587.dmotd@gmx.net> <161320dd0903232054k4fb5e2cchaa6090071efd66a7@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090324070405.GB14255@fliwatut.scifi> Hallo, hard off hat gesagt: // hard off wrote: > cheers. very useful! > > silly question probably, but is biquad~ 100% vanilla? or is it sort of > 'caramel' like expr ?? biquad~ is a full builtin object. Ciao -- Frank Barknecht Do You RjDj.me? _ ______footils.org__ From jancsika at yahoo.com Tue Mar 24 08:41:44 2009 From: jancsika at yahoo.com (Jonathan Wilkes) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 00:41:44 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: <84C8EF4C-2D12-4EB7-A9B4-ACBA8674FF11@eds.org> Message-ID: <315916.1753.qm@web65611.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Why not use Miller's output~ as the default in pd-ext? I like the fact that the tutorials have both an abstraction and a subpatch for output, and it might be nice to have another gop that uses a slider as in your proposed abstraction. I think it would additionally be nice to have something like the attached somewhere in the tutorials, which is just a clone of your ezoutput~ using data structures. It would helpful when someone gets to the ds tutorial to be able to have an abstraction they've already been using to show as an example. The ds stuff is separated from the rest of the patch for that reason, though maybe something simpler would make a better example (at least as much as possible without using abstractions). -Jonathan --- On Mon, 3/23/09, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > From: Hans-Christoph Steiner > Subject: Re: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended > To: "IOhannes m zmoelnig" > Cc: "Pd List" > Date: Monday, March 23, 2009, 10:49 PM > On Mar 23, 2009, at 4:09 AM, IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: > > > Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > > >> So if we are introducing the concept of objects > and GUI in Pd, then I think it is safe to use GOP objects. > After all, we don't expect newbies to know anything > about C or Tcl, but that's under it it all. I don't > think we should add an output~ to help patches that > don't already have them. I just think we should have a > more intuitive and usable output~. The current one already > uses GOP, so that's not a change. > > > > i fully agree. > > and would like to stress, that i am pretty sure that > most users will not have a clue about gop when they first > encounter the [output~] module (be it a new one or the > original one). > > > > at least i cannot seem to find any documentation about > gop prior to 3/A.05; nevertheless i think it is a good idea > to use a gop-abstraction here. > > > > fgmasdr > > IOhannes > > > Anyone else want to weigh in on this? I'd like to > lobby Miller to get this included in 'extra' at > least, then also used in the help and docmentation. > > > .hc > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Man has survived hitherto because he was too ignorant to > know how to realize his wishes. Now that he can realize > them, he must either change them, or perish. -William > Carlos Williams > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: ezdac~.pd Type: application/puredata Size: 10006 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: ezdac~-help.pd Type: application/puredata Size: 854 bytes Desc: not available URL: From contact at metalab.fr Tue Mar 24 12:23:34 2009 From: contact at metalab.fr (MetaLab Project) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 12:23:34 +0100 Subject: [PD] [PD-announce] Initiation PD Lyon, Rencontre / MetaLab-Lyon Message-ID: <3097DA22-7068-44E9-B9D9-94FB6378B9F9@metalab.fr> Bonjour ? tous, Plus d'infos sur notre site si besoin. Cycle de rencontres Processus cr?atifs et outils num?riques [Etape 1 : Les cr?ateurs num?riques entrent en sc?ne - Ecriture, spectacle vivant et outils interactifs / M?diath?que de Vaise 16 avril, 17h3019h30, Lyon] Artistes convi?s : Pj Pargas - www.pjpargas.com Adrien Mondot - www.adrienm.net Joris Mathieu -www.compagnie-haut-et-court.org Damien Depannemaecker - http://spectacle.insense.free.fr/ [Atelier d'Initiation Pure Data ] week end du 11 et 12 avril 2009, 10h13h/14h17h, Lyon 5, rue Pizay, 69001 Lyon Merci de nous contacter rapidement pour les inscriptions Intervenant : Jean-Marie Boyer http://www.rybn.org A voir actuellement ? l'IMAL de Bruxelles : Participation personnelle par jour : 40E, 25E tarif r?duit (nous contacter) A bient?t ! -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: LogoMetaLabCourrierPetit.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 4527 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- Igor Deschamps // Coordination Admi. et Art. METALAB 5, rue Pizay 69001 Lyon 00 33 (0) 6 21 21 41 33 www.metalab.fr -------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ Pd-announce mailing list Pd-announce at iem.at http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-announce From vboehm at gmx.ch Tue Mar 24 11:56:13 2009 From: vboehm at gmx.ch (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?volker_b=F6hm?=) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 11:56:13 +0100 Subject: [PD] steep filter? In-Reply-To: References: <161320dd0903151037u6caa3f54p3ac85c7f5546d303@mail.gmail.com> <161320dd0903151102s1346f4d2kdfb0f94593ea8e28@mail.gmail.com> <20090316082528.GB15510@footils.org> Message-ID: <09F4BF18-F737-4473-BC61-B05177A97466@gmx.ch> On 16 Mar 2009, at 17:58, Jo?o Pais wrote: > of course I would be interested in the filter, as well as the rest > of the community should be. don't make any rush because of me, > because it can happen that after a while I don't need it anymore > (in case you're too busy with something else). but if you want to > join your code to pd-ext, everyone will be happy. (and windows > compatible, please) for anyone still insterested in this, i made a pd version of the chebyshev filter, called vb_cheby~. (prefix vb_ to avoid name clashes - popular theme...) you can get it from here: http://www.esbasel.ch/Downloads/MaxMSP-Objects.htm included is a compiled version for osx, standard makefile and source code. it also compiles fine on my linux machine - no idea about windows though. please feel free to send me your comments/complaints/suggestions. volker. From kimm.furt at googlemail.com Tue Mar 24 12:58:25 2009 From: kimm.furt at googlemail.com (kimm furt) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 12:58:25 +0100 Subject: [PD] sending string via osc Message-ID: <0D194C05-8852-469D-8823-404299DD11CC@googlemail.com> hello, i need to send ip-address and port i want to recieve osc-messages on to another app. the other app can only deal with strings. is it possible to send strings with [sendOSC] or sth. similar? i don't know how to convert the portNUMBER to a string. thanks, florian From martin.peach at sympatico.ca Tue Mar 24 14:10:37 2009 From: martin.peach at sympatico.ca (Martin Peach) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 09:10:37 -0400 Subject: [PD] sending string via osc In-Reply-To: <0D194C05-8852-469D-8823-404299DD11CC@googlemail.com> References: <0D194C05-8852-469D-8823-404299DD11CC@googlemail.com> Message-ID: kimm furt wrote: > hello, > > i need to send ip-address and port i want to recieve osc-messages on to > another app. the other app can only deal with strings. > is it possible to send strings with [sendOSC] or sth. similar? > i don't know how to convert the portNUMBER to a string. > You can do it with [mrpeach/packOSC]. Use the [sendtyped( selector to force a number to be sent as a string. Martin From jmmmpais at googlemail.com Tue Mar 24 14:26:07 2009 From: jmmmpais at googlemail.com (=?iso-8859-15?Q?Jo=E3o_Pais?=) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 13:26:07 -0000 Subject: [PD] steep filter? In-Reply-To: <09F4BF18-F737-4473-BC61-B05177A97466@gmx.ch> References: <161320dd0903151037u6caa3f54p3ac85c7f5546d303@mail.gmail.com> <161320dd0903151102s1346f4d2kdfb0f94593ea8e28@mail.gmail.com> <20090316082528.GB15510@footils.org> <09F4BF18-F737-4473-BC61-B05177A97466@gmx.ch> Message-ID: I have a question: are your externals included in pd-ext? that is, can they be downloaded with the latest nightly builds? I would advise you to get them into "the system", so that it's garanteed that (almost) everyone has them automatically. > > On 16 Mar 2009, at 17:58, Jo?o Pais wrote: >> of course I would be interested in the filter, as well as the rest of >> the community should be. don't make any rush because of me, because it >> can happen that after a while I don't need it anymore (in case you're >> too busy with something else). but if you want to join your code to >> pd-ext, everyone will be happy. (and windows compatible, please) > > for anyone still insterested in this, i made a pd version of the > chebyshev filter, called vb_cheby~. > (prefix vb_ to avoid name clashes - popular theme...) > > you can get it from here: > http://www.esbasel.ch/Downloads/MaxMSP-Objects.htm > > included is a compiled version for osx, standard makefile and source > code. > it also compiles fine on my linux machine - no idea about windows though. > > > please feel free to send me your comments/complaints/suggestions. > volker. > > -- Friedenstr. 58 10249 Berlin (Deutschland) Tel +49 30 42020091 | Mob +49 162 6843570 jmmmpais at googlemail.com | skype: jmmmpjmmmp From cgclepper at gmail.com Tue Mar 24 15:02:32 2009 From: cgclepper at gmail.com (chris clepper) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 10:02:32 -0400 Subject: [PD] steep filter? In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903151037u6caa3f54p3ac85c7f5546d303@mail.gmail.com> References: <161320dd0903151037u6caa3f54p3ac85c7f5546d303@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Are there any FIR filters in Pd? Those can have really steep slopes like 96dB per octave. On Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 1:37 PM, hard off wrote: > it's not possible to filter without ANY roll-off as far as i know. > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hans at eds.org Tue Mar 24 18:10:17 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 13:10:17 -0400 Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: <315916.1753.qm@web65611.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> References: <315916.1753.qm@web65611.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <57ABEF4C-6A65-4DF1-AB87-E55A027347E8@eds.org> The current [output~] is not easy to use, lots of people have trouble with it. Scrolling in a number box is not a standard GUI interaction, and not particularly intuitive. .hc On Mar 24, 2009, at 3:41 AM, Jonathan Wilkes wrote: > Why not use Miller's output~ as the default in pd-ext? > > I like the fact that the tutorials have both an abstraction and a > subpatch for output, and it might be nice to have another gop that > uses a slider as in your proposed abstraction. > > I think it would additionally be nice to have something like the > attached somewhere in the tutorials, which is just a clone of your > ezoutput~ using data structures. It would helpful when someone gets > to the ds tutorial to be able to have an abstraction they've already > been using to show as an example. The ds stuff is separated from > the rest of the patch for that reason, though maybe something > simpler would make a better example (at least as much as possible > without using abstractions). > > -Jonathan > > > --- On Mon, 3/23/09, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > >> From: Hans-Christoph Steiner >> Subject: Re: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended >> To: "IOhannes m zmoelnig" >> Cc: "Pd List" >> Date: Monday, March 23, 2009, 10:49 PM >> On Mar 23, 2009, at 4:09 AM, IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: >> >>> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >>> >>>> So if we are introducing the concept of objects >> and GUI in Pd, then I think it is safe to use GOP objects. >> After all, we don't expect newbies to know anything >> about C or Tcl, but that's under it it all. I don't >> think we should add an output~ to help patches that >> don't already have them. I just think we should have a >> more intuitive and usable output~. The current one already >> uses GOP, so that's not a change. >>> >>> i fully agree. >>> and would like to stress, that i am pretty sure that >> most users will not have a clue about gop when they first >> encounter the [output~] module (be it a new one or the >> original one). >>> >>> at least i cannot seem to find any documentation about >> gop prior to 3/A.05; nevertheless i think it is a good idea >> to use a gop-abstraction here. >>> >>> fgmasdr >>> IOhannes >> >> >> Anyone else want to weigh in on this? I'd like to >> lobby Miller to get this included in 'extra' at >> least, then also used in the help and docmentation. >> >> >> .hc >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> Man has survived hitherto because he was too ignorant to >> know how to realize his wishes. Now that he can realize >> them, he must either change them, or perish. -William >> Carlos Williams >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- I spent 33 years and four months in active military service and during that period I spent most of my time as a high class muscle man for Big Business, for Wall Street and the bankers. - General Smedley Butler From vincent.rioux at no-log.org Tue Mar 24 19:27:46 2009 From: vincent.rioux at no-log.org (Vincent Rioux) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 19:27:46 +0100 Subject: [PD] [Ardour-Users] Pd /Gem - Ardour & jack_transport In-Reply-To: References: <492A8DD2.1050908@iem.at> <492C08BC.7060001@no-log.org> <492FC991.9090209@no-log.org> Message-ID: <49C92622.7060100@no-log.org> dear all, here is a very simple patch i recently used to synch Ardour and Pd/Gem for a video soundtrack work. http://puredata.info/Members/vrioux best regards, vincent From geoffspuredata at googlemail.com Tue Mar 24 19:35:38 2009 From: geoffspuredata at googlemail.com (Geoff) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 18:35:38 +0000 Subject: [PD] Faust and PD Message-ID: Hi I have been going through the examples in the faust library and it seems nice and straight forward :) The only part that confuses me at the moment is how to use the compiled objects in PD and wether the PD objects faust creates are only usable in linux. I am using PD extended on an intel mac osx10.4. For example when I compile the band pass filter example found here : http://faust.grame.fr/catalog.php I end up with 7 files bandfilter.pd bandfilter~.pd_linux faust-control.pd faust.gate.pd faust-r.pd faust-s.pd faust-timer.pd I have put them in a place where the Path of PD searches and all the objects work except the main one. bandfilter~.pd_linux Am I correct in assuming that although Faust to PD works it only works for LINUX users and that it can't be used by me in OSX? Cheers Geoff www.kgw.tu-berlin.de/~lac2007/papers/lac07_graef.pdf -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From zmoelnig at iem.at Tue Mar 24 20:09:38 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?IOhannes_m_zm=F6lnig?=) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 20:09:38 +0100 Subject: [PD] Faust and PD In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49C92FF2.8060607@iem.at> Geoff wrote: > I have put them in a place where the Path of PD searches and all the > objects work except the main one. > bandfilter~.pd_linux that's because the .pd_linux is not searched by Pd on OSX. > Am I correct in assuming that although Faust to PD works it only works, > for LINUX users and that it can't be used by me in OSX? unlikely but possible. however, it might very well be that the generator-template just produced the a file with the wrong extensions. try renaming the file to bandfilter~.pd_darwin and see whether it works. (btw, it is really unlikely that you have cross-compiled a linux-binary) fgamsdr IOhannes From geoffspuredata at googlemail.com Tue Mar 24 20:24:17 2009 From: geoffspuredata at googlemail.com (Geoff) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 19:24:17 +0000 Subject: [PD] Faust and PD In-Reply-To: <49C92FF2.8060607@iem.at> References: <49C92FF2.8060607@iem.at> Message-ID: <19BFA5E5-7597-409C-B542-AB1B8B0C0765@gmail.com> > try renaming the file to bandfilter~.pd_darwin and see whether it > works. Tried it but alas no joy There are no options in FAUST to compile to PD linux/pd osx etc. Only one option compile to PD. Thanks for the suggestion geoff On 24 Mar 2009, at 19:09, IOhannes m zm?lnig wrote: > Geoff wrote: > >> I have put them in a place where the Path of PD searches and all the >> objects work except the main one. >> bandfilter~.pd_linux > > that's because the .pd_linux is not searched by Pd on OSX. > >> Am I correct in assuming that although Faust to PD works it only >> works, >> for LINUX users and that it can't be used by me in OSX? > > unlikely but possible. > however, it might very well be that the generator-template just > produced > the a file with the wrong extensions. > try renaming the file to bandfilter~.pd_darwin and see whether it > works. > > (btw, it is really unlikely that you have cross-compiled a linux- > binary) > > fgamsdr > IOhannes > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/ > listinfo/pd-list From fbar at footils.org Tue Mar 24 20:27:00 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 20:27:00 +0100 Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: <57ABEF4C-6A65-4DF1-AB87-E55A027347E8@eds.org> References: <315916.1753.qm@web65611.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> <57ABEF4C-6A65-4DF1-AB87-E55A027347E8@eds.org> Message-ID: <20090324192700.GA13513@footils.org> Hallo, Hans-Christoph Steiner hat gesagt: // Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > Scrolling in a number box is not a standard GUI interaction, and not > particularly intuitive. Should we stop using the number box in Pd? Ciao -- Frank From mjmogo at gmail.com Tue Mar 24 20:27:51 2009 From: mjmogo at gmail.com (Mike McGonagle) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 14:27:51 -0500 Subject: [PD] Faust and PD In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <370dda580903241227m18561693q418ded4d7aca3795@mail.gmail.com> http://ccrma.stanford.edu/realsimple/faust/faust.html Geoff, I looked at the Faust website a while ago, and for the same reason, didn't go much further than having a look. I believe at that time it only generated Linux binaries. If you are into it a bit, and want to learn how to deal with the lower level stuff, try the link above. Julius Smith knows what he is talking about... You might also want to look at their literature, I saw a paper on Pd and Faust, but have not looked at it yet. Mike On Tue, Mar 24, 2009 at 1:35 PM, Geoff wrote: > Hi > I have been going through the examples in the faust library and it seems > nice and straight forward :) > The only part that confuses me at the moment is how to use the compiled > objects in PD and?wether the PD objects faust creates are only usable in > linux. > I am using PD extended on an intel mac osx10.4. > For example when I compile the band pass filter example found here > :?http://faust.grame.fr/catalog.php > I end up with 7 files > bandfilter.pd > bandfilter~.pd_linux > faust-control.pd > faust.gate.pd > faust-r.pd > faust-s.pd > faust-timer.pd > I have put them in a place where the Path of PD searches and all the objects > work except the main one. > bandfilter~.pd_linux > Am I correct in assuming that although Faust to PD works it only works for > LINUX users and that it can't be used by me in OSX? > Cheers > Geoff > www.kgw.tu-berlin.de/~lac2007/papers/lac07_graef.pdf > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > -- Isaac Asimov - "I do not fear computers. I fear the lack of them." From zmoelnig at iem.at Tue Mar 24 20:30:35 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?IOhannes_m_zm=F6lnig?=) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 20:30:35 +0100 Subject: [PD] Faust and PD In-Reply-To: <19BFA5E5-7597-409C-B542-AB1B8B0C0765@gmail.com> References: <49C92FF2.8060607@iem.at> <19BFA5E5-7597-409C-B542-AB1B8B0C0765@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49C934DB.7020201@iem.at> Geoff wrote: >> try renaming the file to bandfilter~.pd_darwin and see whether it works. > Tried it but alas no joy > > There are no options in FAUST to compile to PD linux/pd osx etc. > Only one option compile to PD. did you use an online generator, or have you compiled the faust-code to pd on your machine? what does % file bandfilter~.pd_linux tell you (in the commandline, and at the correct path) about the file? mgfsdr IOhannes From zmoelnig at iem.at Tue Mar 24 20:34:49 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?IOhannes_m_zm=F6lnig?=) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 20:34:49 +0100 Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: <20090324192700.GA13513@footils.org> References: <315916.1753.qm@web65611.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> <57ABEF4C-6A65-4DF1-AB87-E55A027347E8@eds.org> <20090324192700.GA13513@footils.org> Message-ID: <49C935D9.6090708@iem.at> Frank Barknecht wrote: > Hallo, > Hans-Christoph Steiner hat gesagt: // Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > >> Scrolling in a number box is not a standard GUI interaction, and not >> particularly intuitive. > > Should we stop using the number box in Pd? why not? people are way more used to spinners (or however they are called). and shadows. gmdr IOhannes From ico.bukvic at gmail.com Tue Mar 24 20:30:40 2009 From: ico.bukvic at gmail.com (Ivica Ico Bukvic) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 15:30:40 -0400 Subject: [PD] latency spikes on linux when sending wiimote's rumble and LED messages Message-ID: Greetings all, Has anyone encountered issues with the wiimote external (pd-extended 0.42 on 8.10 Ubuntu 2.6.29-rc6-rt kernel) when using "rumble" and/or LED commands? The system appears to be rock solid in terms of audio latency (thanks to the rt kernel) until I use one (or both) of the aforesaid features. As soon as rumble and/or LED are enabled, I get xruns practically every other millisecond reported by Pd (red button on the main Pd window). JACK shows no xruns. The wiimote has a few other minor bugs (e.g. disabling accelerometer monitoring does not actually work which is I guess no biggie). I guess I could try to run wiimote in an non-rt instance of Pd next to the rt instance processing audio, but before I take that route I was wondering if I had possibly missed something or if there is a simpler way. Best wishes, Ivica Ico Bukvic, D.M.A. Composition, Music Technology Director, DISIS Interactive Sound & Intermedia Studio Assistant Co-Director, CCTAD CHCI, CS, and Art (by courtesy) Virginia Tech Dept. of Music - 0240 Blacksburg, VA 24061 (540) 231-6139 (540) 231-5034 (fax) ico at vt.edu http://www.music.vt.edu/faculty/bukvic/ From geoffspuredata at googlemail.com Tue Mar 24 21:19:55 2009 From: geoffspuredata at googlemail.com (Geoff) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 20:19:55 +0000 Subject: [PD] Faust and PD In-Reply-To: <49C934DB.7020201@iem.at> References: <49C92FF2.8060607@iem.at> <19BFA5E5-7597-409C-B542-AB1B8B0C0765@gmail.com> <49C934DB.7020201@iem.at> Message-ID: <0B8AAED0-C628-4989-84FA-0FD45948AE0A@gmail.com> I used the online generator. It seems thats maybe where my problems lie i.e. its setup to generate for linux However I have downloaded faust to user with osx but after going through the make, su, make install process when I tried further commands nothing then worked so I went to the online solution :) what does > % file bandfilter~.pd_linux > tell you (in the commandline, and at the correct path) about the file? bandfilter~.pd_linux: ELF 32-bit LSB shared object, Intel 80386, version 1 (SYSV), not stripped cheers Geoff On 24 Mar 2009, at 19:30, IOhannes m zm?lnig wrote: > Geoff wrote: >>> try renaming the file to bandfilter~.pd_darwin and see whether it >>> works. >> Tried it but alas no joy >> >> There are no options in FAUST to compile to PD linux/pd osx etc. >> Only one option compile to PD. > > did you use an online generator, or have you compiled the faust- > code to > pd on your machine? > > what does > % file bandfilter~.pd_linux > tell you (in the commandline, and at the correct path) about the file? > > mgfsdr > IOhannes From matju at artengine.ca Tue Mar 24 22:10:49 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 17:10:49 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: <20090324192700.GA13513@footils.org> References: <315916.1753.qm@web65611.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> <57ABEF4C-6A65-4DF1-AB87-E55A027347E8@eds.org> <20090324192700.GA13513@footils.org> Message-ID: On Tue, 24 Mar 2009, Frank Barknecht wrote: > Hans-Christoph Steiner hat gesagt: // Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >> Scrolling in a number box is not a standard GUI interaction, and not >> particularly intuitive. > Should we stop using the number box in Pd? Patching is not a standard GUI interaction, and not particularly intuitive. Should we stop using Pd? What's that kind of talking anyway? After two minutes of trying to use a number box, it becomes intuitive. Intuition improves itself by learning. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 25 02:07:24 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 21:07:24 -0400 Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: References: <315916.1753.qm@web65611.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> <57ABEF4C-6A65-4DF1-AB87-E55A027347E8@eds.org> <20090324192700.GA13513@footils.org> Message-ID: On Mar 24, 2009, at 5:10 PM, Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > On Tue, 24 Mar 2009, Frank Barknecht wrote: >> Hans-Christoph Steiner hat gesagt: // Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >>> Scrolling in a number box is not a standard GUI interaction, and >>> not >>> particularly intuitive. >> Should we stop using the number box in Pd? > > Patching is not a standard GUI interaction, and not particularly > intuitive. > > Should we stop using Pd? > > What's that kind of talking anyway? > > After two minutes of trying to use a number box, it becomes > intuitive. Intuition improves itself by learning. > > _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... > | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, > Qu?bec_______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list Should we let snarkiness end this discussion? I thought it was actually pretty productive til this little bit... .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Computer science is no more related to the computer than astronomy is related to the telescope. -Edsger Dykstra From john.harrison at alum.mit.edu Tue Mar 24 20:35:21 2009 From: john.harrison at alum.mit.edu (John Harrison) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 14:35:21 -0500 Subject: [PD] still struggling with basic understanding of Gem dataflow Message-ID: <49C935F9.5080100@alum.mit.edu> Attached is a small example patch of how I just don't get Gem...still... [pix_rtx] has a steady wave that normally flows from left to right. I would have thought that the attached patch shows me rotating the image first, then applying [pix_rtx]. So it would stand to reason in my mind I would see a rotated image with [pix_rtx] flowing from left to right. But that isn't the result I see. The patch has [pix_rtx] flowing from right to left now. It is as if [pix_rtx] is applied *before* the rotation instead of *after* as I would have expected. Grasping at straws, I have tried [pix_separator] between just about every object, but that makes no difference. What am I misunderstanding that makes the behavior of the patch make sense? And...how would I get [pix_rtx] to flow from left to right on a mirrored image? -John P.S. Are questions like this better on the Gem-dev list? That's a developer list but at the same time I feel a bit awkward putting too many Gem questions on a Pd list -------------- next part -------------- An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: rtx-reverse.pd URL: From jancsika at yahoo.com Wed Mar 25 03:04:57 2009 From: jancsika at yahoo.com (Jonathan Wilkes) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 19:04:57 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: <57ABEF4C-6A65-4DF1-AB87-E55A027347E8@eds.org> Message-ID: <261896.16309.qm@web65604.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> After playing with ezoutput~, I have a few thoughts: 1. A [change] after [route dsp] in the dsp logic subpatch. At least on windows, the slider motion is sluggish because of constant color messages to the tgl. 2. Allow the slider to go to zero, maybe with a [- 0.01] between the slider and the [pack]. 3. I think a label for the mute button would be nice (could just be my own personal preference, though). -Jonathan --- On Tue, 3/24/09, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > From: Hans-Christoph Steiner > Subject: Re: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended > To: "Jonathan Wilkes" > Cc: "IOhannes m zmoelnig" , "Pd List" > Date: Tuesday, March 24, 2009, 6:10 PM > The current [output~] is not easy to use, lots of people > have trouble with it. Scrolling in a number box is not a > standard GUI interaction, and not particularly intuitive. > > .hc > > On Mar 24, 2009, at 3:41 AM, Jonathan Wilkes wrote: > > > Why not use Miller's output~ as the default in > pd-ext? > > > > I like the fact that the tutorials have both an > abstraction and a subpatch for output, and it might be nice > to have another gop that uses a slider as in your proposed > abstraction. > > > > I think it would additionally be nice to have > something like the attached somewhere in the tutorials, > which is just a clone of your ezoutput~ using data > structures. It would helpful when someone gets to the ds > tutorial to be able to have an abstraction they've > already been using to show as an example. The ds stuff is > separated from the rest of the patch for that reason, though > maybe something simpler would make a better example (at > least as much as possible without using abstractions). > > > > -Jonathan > > > > > > --- On Mon, 3/23/09, Hans-Christoph Steiner > wrote: > > > >> From: Hans-Christoph Steiner > >> Subject: Re: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended > >> To: "IOhannes m zmoelnig" > > >> Cc: "Pd List" > >> Date: Monday, March 23, 2009, 10:49 PM > >> On Mar 23, 2009, at 4:09 AM, IOhannes m zmoelnig > wrote: > >> > >>> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > >>> > >>>> So if we are introducing the concept of > objects > >> and GUI in Pd, then I think it is safe to use GOP > objects. > >> After all, we don't expect newbies to know > anything > >> about C or Tcl, but that's under it it all. I > don't > >> think we should add an output~ to help patches > that > >> don't already have them. I just think we > should have a > >> more intuitive and usable output~. The current > one already > >> uses GOP, so that's not a change. > >>> > >>> i fully agree. > >>> and would like to stress, that i am pretty > sure that > >> most users will not have a clue about gop when > they first > >> encounter the [output~] module (be it a new one or > the > >> original one). > >>> > >>> at least i cannot seem to find any > documentation about > >> gop prior to 3/A.05; nevertheless i think it is a > good idea > >> to use a gop-abstraction here. > >>> > >>> fgmasdr > >>> IOhannes > >> > >> > >> Anyone else want to weigh in on this? I'd > like to > >> lobby Miller to get this included in > 'extra' at > >> least, then also used in the help and > docmentation. > >> > >> > >> .hc > >> > >> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> > >> Man has survived hitherto because he was too > ignorant to > >> know how to realize his wishes. Now that he can > realize > >> them, he must either change them, or perish. > -William > >> Carlos Williams > >> > >> > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > I spent 33 years and four months in active military service > and during that period I spent most of my time as a high > class muscle man for Big Business, for Wall Street and the > bankers. - General Smedley Butler From matju at artengine.ca Wed Mar 25 03:29:54 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 22:29:54 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: References: <315916.1753.qm@web65611.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> <57ABEF4C-6A65-4DF1-AB87-E55A027347E8@eds.org> <20090324192700.GA13513@footils.org> Message-ID: On Tue, 24 Mar 2009, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > Should we let snarkiness end this discussion? I thought it was actually > pretty productive til this little bit... You can still work around my comments, and continue this discussion, but what I'm trying to say is that you can't necessarily just wave some word like "intuitive" and explain nothing about why you use it and expect people to just nod and call it productive. Go be productive with your intuitivity if you will, but when I make a comment like that, it's because I'm concerned that something is going the wrong way. I don't mock for the sake of mocking. If there can't be any disapproval of your ways, then why do you look like you want to get some approval at all? You can simply change the numberbox in pd-extended so as to suit your fancy and that would be the end of the story. Now if you could simply present your reasons to believe that a numberbox may be unintuitive to beginners in a way so significant that it warrants avoiding it, ... it sounds curious, so, I'm curious. Do you think sliders are nonintuitive as well? Pd's sliders are pretty nonstandard as far as UIs go. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 25 03:33:28 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 22:33:28 -0400 Subject: [PD] still struggling with basic understanding of Gem dataflow In-Reply-To: <49C935F9.5080100@alum.mit.edu> References: <49C935F9.5080100@alum.mit.edu> Message-ID: I think this is an appropriate place to discuss gem. In the Help browser, check out: examples -> Gem -> 04.video -> 04.videoRTX.pd I had to do some trickery to get it working OK. Check the archives for details, I remember some discussion about all the separators. .hc On Mar 24, 2009, at 3:35 PM, John Harrison wrote: > Attached is a small example patch of how I just don't get > Gem...still... > > [pix_rtx] has a steady wave that normally flows from left to right. > > I would have thought that the attached patch shows me rotating the > image first, then applying [pix_rtx]. So it would stand to reason in > my mind I would see a rotated image with [pix_rtx] flowing from left > to right. > > But that isn't the result I see. The patch has [pix_rtx] flowing > from right to left now. It is as if [pix_rtx] is applied *before* > the rotation instead of *after* as I would have expected. > > Grasping at straws, I have tried [pix_separator] between just about > every object, but that makes no difference. > > What am I misunderstanding that makes the behavior of the patch make > sense? And...how would I get [pix_rtx] to flow from left to right on > a mirrored image? > > -John > > P.S. Are questions like this better on the Gem-dev list? That's a > developer list but at the same time I feel a bit awkward putting too > many Gem questions on a Pd list > > #N canvas 962 171 305 227 10; > #X obj 29 -58 gemhead; > #X obj 29 -35 pix_video; > #X obj 29 44 pix_texture; > #X obj 28 72 rectangle 4 3; > #X obj 159 9 gemwin; > #X msg 136 -34 create \, 1; > #X msg 214 -33 destroy; > #X obj 135 -57 loadbang; > #X obj 29 17 pix_rtx; > #X obj 29 -10 rotateXYZ 0 180 0; > #X connect 0 0 1 0; > #X connect 1 0 9 0; > #X connect 2 0 3 0; > #X connect 5 0 4 0; > #X connect 6 0 4 0; > #X connect 7 0 5 0; > #X connect 8 0 2 0; > #X connect 9 0 8 0; > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- There is no way to peace, peace is the way. -A.J. Muste From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 25 03:37:38 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 22:37:38 -0400 Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: References: <315916.1753.qm@web65611.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> <57ABEF4C-6A65-4DF1-AB87-E55A027347E8@eds.org> <20090324192700.GA13513@footils.org> Message-ID: <2F61993D-6697-46C8-A97D-3A0A27B9D751@eds.org> On Mar 24, 2009, at 10:29 PM, Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > On Tue, 24 Mar 2009, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >> >> Should we let snarkiness end this discussion? I thought it was >> actually pretty productive til this little bit... > > You can still work around my comments, and continue this discussion, > but what I'm trying to say is that you can't necessarily just wave > some word like "intuitive" and explain nothing about why you use it > and expect people to just nod and call it productive. > > Go be productive with your intuitivity if you will, but when I make > a comment like that, it's because I'm concerned that something is > going the wrong way. I don't mock for the sake of mocking. > > If there can't be any disapproval of your ways, then why do you look > like you want to get some approval at all? You can simply change the > numberbox in pd-extended so as to suit your fancy and that would be > the end of the story. > > Now if you could simply present your reasons to believe that a > numberbox may be unintuitive to beginners in a way so significant > that it warrants avoiding it, ... it sounds curious, so, I'm > curious. Do you think sliders are nonintuitive as well? Pd's sliders > are pretty nonstandard as far as UIs go. I've taught Pd quite a bit at this point, and I have watched many people not understand the number boxes as a interactive GUI element. Its based on my experience, that's all. There is no scientific process behind it. It is also based on my experience learning Pd, back in the day. I remember it took me a while before I could get the examples working, and I had been working with Csound, Cmix, MusicKit and others before, so I was quite familiar with the concepts. .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Access to computers should be unlimited and total. - the hacker ethic From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 25 03:56:37 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 22:56:37 -0400 Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: <261896.16309.qm@web65604.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> References: <261896.16309.qm@web65604.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <144A8B76-2C3C-4506-BE83-874E6FA4D1F9@eds.org> On Mar 24, 2009, at 10:04 PM, Jonathan Wilkes wrote: > > After playing with ezoutput~, I have a few thoughts: > 1. A [change] after [route dsp] in the dsp logic subpatch. At least > on windows, the slider motion is sluggish because of constant color > messages to the tgl. > 2. Allow the slider to go to zero, maybe with a [- 0.01] between the > slider and the [pack]. Good ideas. Done! -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: ezoutput~.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 2686 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- > 3. I think a label for the mute button would be nice (could just be > my own personal preference, though). I tried, but the font just seemed too small, especially on Pd-vanilla. .hc > > > -Jonathan > > > --- On Tue, 3/24/09, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > >> From: Hans-Christoph Steiner >> Subject: Re: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended >> To: "Jonathan Wilkes" >> Cc: "IOhannes m zmoelnig" , "Pd List" > > >> Date: Tuesday, March 24, 2009, 6:10 PM >> The current [output~] is not easy to use, lots of people >> have trouble with it. Scrolling in a number box is not a >> standard GUI interaction, and not particularly intuitive. >> >> .hc >> >> On Mar 24, 2009, at 3:41 AM, Jonathan Wilkes wrote: >> >>> Why not use Miller's output~ as the default in >> pd-ext? >>> >>> I like the fact that the tutorials have both an >> abstraction and a subpatch for output, and it might be nice >> to have another gop that uses a slider as in your proposed >> abstraction. >>> >>> I think it would additionally be nice to have >> something like the attached somewhere in the tutorials, >> which is just a clone of your ezoutput~ using data >> structures. It would helpful when someone gets to the ds >> tutorial to be able to have an abstraction they've >> already been using to show as an example. The ds stuff is >> separated from the rest of the patch for that reason, though >> maybe something simpler would make a better example (at >> least as much as possible without using abstractions). >>> >>> -Jonathan >>> >>> >>> --- On Mon, 3/23/09, Hans-Christoph Steiner >> wrote: >>> >>>> From: Hans-Christoph Steiner >>>> Subject: Re: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended >>>> To: "IOhannes m zmoelnig" >> >>>> Cc: "Pd List" >>>> Date: Monday, March 23, 2009, 10:49 PM >>>> On Mar 23, 2009, at 4:09 AM, IOhannes m zmoelnig >> wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> So if we are introducing the concept of >> objects >>>> and GUI in Pd, then I think it is safe to use GOP >> objects. >>>> After all, we don't expect newbies to know >> anything >>>> about C or Tcl, but that's under it it all. I >> don't >>>> think we should add an output~ to help patches >> that >>>> don't already have them. I just think we >> should have a >>>> more intuitive and usable output~. The current >> one already >>>> uses GOP, so that's not a change. >>>>> >>>>> i fully agree. >>>>> and would like to stress, that i am pretty >> sure that >>>> most users will not have a clue about gop when >> they first >>>> encounter the [output~] module (be it a new one or >> the >>>> original one). >>>>> >>>>> at least i cannot seem to find any >> documentation about >>>> gop prior to 3/A.05; nevertheless i think it is a >> good idea >>>> to use a gop-abstraction here. >>>>> >>>>> fgmasdr >>>>> IOhannes >>>> >>>> >>>> Anyone else want to weigh in on this? I'd >> like to >>>> lobby Miller to get this included in >> 'extra' at >>>> least, then also used in the help and >> docmentation. >>>> >>>> >>>> .hc >>>> >>>> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> >>>> Man has survived hitherto because he was too >> ignorant to >>>> know how to realize his wishes. Now that he can >> realize >>>> them, he must either change them, or perish. >> -William >>>> Carlos Williams >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >>>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >>>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> I spent 33 years and four months in active military service >> and during that period I spent most of my time as a high >> class muscle man for Big Business, for Wall Street and the >> bankers. - General Smedley Butler > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Looking at things from a more basic level, you can come up with a more direct solution... It may sound small in theory, but it in practice, it can change entire economies. - Amy Smith From brbrofsvl at gmail.com Wed Mar 25 05:38:16 2009 From: brbrofsvl at gmail.com (Matt Barber) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 00:38:16 -0400 Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended Message-ID: > Intuition improves itself by learning. > This is my most beloved pedagogical principle. I must constantly disabuse my composition students of the notion that "composing systematically" and "composing by ear" are entirely different activities, as though "The Ear" were totally disconnected from "The Mind" (of course, the ear is the more romantic homunculus in this scenario). I say, the best time to look for constraints on your freedom is when you feel the most intuitively "free..." it's possible someone else is doing the thinking for you (see ProTools), and the constraints that are there are really the ones that are your own and haven't inspected yet. This is something that learning addresses. Matt From stffn at dibidut.dk Wed Mar 25 07:48:17 2009 From: stffn at dibidut.dk (Steffen Juul) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 07:48:17 +0100 Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: <57ABEF4C-6A65-4DF1-AB87-E55A027347E8@eds.org> References: <315916.1753.qm@web65611.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> <57ABEF4C-6A65-4DF1-AB87-E55A027347E8@eds.org> Message-ID: On 24/03/2009, at 18.10, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > Scrolling in a number box is not a standard GUI interaction, and > not particularly intuitive. So thats the initial reason. Chancing the numberbox to a slider could live together with not making the colour changes i opposed to (- i shall not repeat it). Also I've meet Pd sliders i could not recognize as sliders for a while. As a total it took me longer to learn sliders then numberboxes, since the looks of sliders can be altered so much. I rest my case, I don't think i get through. Happy hacking. From jancsika at yahoo.com Wed Mar 25 07:51:36 2009 From: jancsika at yahoo.com (Jonathan Wilkes) Date: Tue, 24 Mar 2009 23:51:36 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <708026.72044.qm@web65614.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> --- On Wed, 3/25/09, Matt Barber wrote: > From: Matt Barber > Subject: Re: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended > To: pd-list at iem.at > Date: Wednesday, March 25, 2009, 5:38 AM > > Intuition improves itself by learning. > > > > This is my most beloved pedagogical principle. > > I must constantly disabuse my composition students of the > notion that > "composing systematically" and "composing by > ear" are entirely > different activities, as though "The Ear" were > totally disconnected > from "The Mind" (of course, the ear is the more > romantic homunculus in > this scenario). I've never actually heard the phrase "composing by ear." I have heard composers from a certain generation describe their process as "intuitive," but I've always taken that as code for, "I'm a decent human being, and, unlike some, I won't take the tiny bit of power entrusted to me by this lecture to blather on shamelessly like a used-car salesman in some awful alternate universe where the customer leaves the lot not with a car, but with the memory of a dry, uninspired post-serialist compositional process." But if you press the "intuitive" composer for some details, I've found they'll usually give them. And in a clear and concise manner, which is always a bonus. -Jonathan > > I say, the best time to look for constraints on your > freedom is when > you feel the most intuitively "free..." it's > possible someone else is > doing the thinking for you (see ProTools), and the > constraints that > are there are really the ones that are your own and > haven't inspected > yet. This is something that learning addresses. > > Matt > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From jancsika at yahoo.com Wed Mar 25 08:03:00 2009 From: jancsika at yahoo.com (Jonathan Wilkes) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 00:03:00 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <670595.19095.qm@web65604.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> --- On Wed, 3/25/09, Steffen Juul wrote: > From: Steffen Juul > Subject: Re: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended > To: "Pd List" > Date: Wednesday, March 25, 2009, 7:48 AM > On 24/03/2009, at 18.10, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > > Scrolling in a number box is not a standard GUI > interaction, and not particularly intuitive. > > So thats the initial reason. Chancing the numberbox to a > slider could live together with not making the colour > changes i opposed to (- i shall not repeat it). Actually, could you repeat it? I searched the thread and couldn't find any remarks about the color. If your point is that the tutorials are completely black and white, and that having a gop abstraction with colored gui's would be distracting-- I've thought about that, too. But if that turns out to be the case it's a simple fix of just changing the slider and bng back to white (but maybe leaving the dsp-indicator green so you can quickly see if it's on or not). > > Also I've meet Pd sliders i could not recognize as > sliders for a while. As a total it took me longer to learn > sliders then numberboxes, since the looks of sliders can be > altered so much. > > I rest my case, I don't think i get through. > > Happy hacking. > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From johnharrisonwsu at gmail.com Wed Mar 25 13:00:49 2009 From: johnharrisonwsu at gmail.com (John Harrison) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 07:00:49 -0500 Subject: [PD] still struggling with basic understanding of Gem dataflow In-Reply-To: References: <49C935F9.5080100@alum.mit.edu> Message-ID: <7aa995dd0903250500l58526c7dq9109cad9c6ba85a4@mail.gmail.com> Thanks Hans. I know the example patch already and I have [pix_rtx] working fine inasfar as I can get it to do what the example patch already shows. I think my question is more about data flow and Gem. My patch and [pix_rtx} are just an example of a more basic misunderstanding I believe I have which has not been cleared up despite many hours of work in Gem. Could somebody explain to me my [pix_rtx] in my example patch appears to be processed before the rotation instead of after? -John On Tue, Mar 24, 2009 at 9:33 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > I think this is an appropriate place to discuss gem. In the Help browser, > check out: > > examples -> Gem -> 04.video -> 04.videoRTX.pd > > I had to do some trickery to get it working OK. Check the archives for > details, I remember some discussion about all the separators. > > .hc > > > On Mar 24, 2009, at 3:35 PM, John Harrison wrote: > > Attached is a small example patch of how I just don't get Gem...still... >> >> [pix_rtx] has a steady wave that normally flows from left to right. >> >> I would have thought that the attached patch shows me rotating the image >> first, then applying [pix_rtx]. So it would stand to reason in my mind I >> would see a rotated image with [pix_rtx] flowing from left to right. >> >> But that isn't the result I see. The patch has [pix_rtx] flowing from >> right to left now. It is as if [pix_rtx] is applied *before* the rotation >> instead of *after* as I would have expected. >> >> Grasping at straws, I have tried [pix_separator] between just about every >> object, but that makes no difference. >> >> What am I misunderstanding that makes the behavior of the patch make >> sense? And...how would I get [pix_rtx] to flow from left to right on a >> mirrored image? >> >> -John >> >> P.S. Are questions like this better on the Gem-dev list? That's a >> developer list but at the same time I feel a bit awkward putting too many >> Gem questions on a Pd list >> >> #N canvas 962 171 305 227 10; >> #X obj 29 -58 gemhead; >> #X obj 29 -35 pix_video; >> #X obj 29 44 pix_texture; >> #X obj 28 72 rectangle 4 3; >> #X obj 159 9 gemwin; >> #X msg 136 -34 create \, 1; >> #X msg 214 -33 destroy; >> #X obj 135 -57 loadbang; >> #X obj 29 17 pix_rtx; >> #X obj 29 -10 rotateXYZ 0 180 0; >> #X connect 0 0 1 0; >> #X connect 1 0 9 0; >> #X connect 2 0 3 0; >> #X connect 5 0 4 0; >> #X connect 6 0 4 0; >> #X connect 7 0 5 0; >> #X connect 8 0 2 0; >> #X connect 9 0 8 0; >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > There is no way to peace, peace is the way. -A.J. Muste > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alvaro at berlin.de Wed Mar 25 13:15:47 2009 From: alvaro at berlin.de (Alvaro) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 13:15:47 +0100 (CET) Subject: [PD] OSCX or mrpeach/osc ? Message-ID: <1237983347.182230-15391@marvin6.daybyday.de> Hi, I'm working on a new patch that uses OSC. I've been using OSCX so far, but then I came accross a page on pdpedia that claims OSCX is no longer maintained, and that I should use mrpeach's objects instead. SVN history seems to confirm this, but then OSCX worksforme, is well documented, and there are plenty of examples. So, I don't want to step on anybody's toes, but what is the right choice for a new project? The alternative, to build an abstraction layer, would mean a lot of extra work. mrpeach are you there? alvarito From john.harrison at alum.mit.edu Wed Mar 25 14:07:07 2009 From: john.harrison at alum.mit.edu (John Harrison) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 08:07:07 -0500 Subject: [PD] still struggling with basic understanding of Gem dataflow In-Reply-To: <7aa995dd0903250500l58526c7dq9109cad9c6ba85a4@mail.gmail.com> References: <49C935F9.5080100@alum.mit.edu> <7aa995dd0903250500l58526c7dq9109cad9c6ba85a4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49CA2C7B.9080801@alum.mit.edu> I'm pretty determined to work through this! :-) I thought I'd write a workaround to keep this conversation moving: My plan was to write the video to a buffer with [pix_buffer], then read one frame later and apply [pix_rtx]. I've done this workaround before for similar situations. But I got stuck before I even got to [pix_rtx]. Please see the attached patch. In the patch you'll see 3 toggles, all of which I would have expected to show a rotated image textured onto a rectangle. Only one of them does. They are numbered right to left. Box 1 shows the output of [pix_buffer_write]. That shows a rotated image. Fine so far. Box 2 shows the output of [rotateXYZ] before [pix_buffer_write]. That shows a rotated white box with no image textured. Why? Box 3 shows the output of [pix_buffer_read]. That shows an image but no rotation. Why? This one is especially troublesome to me. I'm trying to make my questions as specific as possible. Please understand I have looked at plenty of examples of [rotateXYZ] and I understand the object and have made full use of it. And I have previously read about [pix_separator] and know the archives that refer to it. There's something else going on here about dataflow with Gem that I don't get. I can make up 10 other examples with 10 other objects if I have to. -John John Harrison wrote: > Thanks Hans. I know the example patch already and I have [pix_rtx] > working fine inasfar as I can get it to do what the example patch > already shows. I think my question is more about data flow and Gem. My > patch and [pix_rtx} are just an example of a more basic > misunderstanding I believe I have which has not been cleared up > despite many hours of work in Gem. > > Could somebody explain to me my [pix_rtx] in my example patch appears > to be processed before the rotation instead of after? > > -John > > On Tue, Mar 24, 2009 at 9:33 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner > wrote: > > > I think this is an appropriate place to discuss gem. In the Help > browser, check out: > > examples -> Gem -> 04.video -> 04.videoRTX.pd > > I had to do some trickery to get it working OK. Check the > archives for details, I remember some discussion about all the > separators. > > .hc > > > On Mar 24, 2009, at 3:35 PM, John Harrison wrote: > > Attached is a small example patch of how I just don't get > Gem...still... > > [pix_rtx] has a steady wave that normally flows from left to > right. > > I would have thought that the attached patch shows me rotating > the image first, then applying [pix_rtx]. So it would stand to > reason in my mind I would see a rotated image with [pix_rtx] > flowing from left to right. > > But that isn't the result I see. The patch has [pix_rtx] > flowing from right to left now. It is as if [pix_rtx] is > applied *before* the rotation instead of *after* as I would > have expected. > > Grasping at straws, I have tried [pix_separator] between just > about every object, but that makes no difference. > > What am I misunderstanding that makes the behavior of the > patch make sense? And...how would I get [pix_rtx] to flow from > left to right on a mirrored image? > > -John > > P.S. Are questions like this better on the Gem-dev list? > That's a developer list but at the same time I feel a bit > awkward putting too many Gem questions on a Pd list > > #N canvas 962 171 305 227 10; > #X obj 29 -58 gemhead; > #X obj 29 -35 pix_video; > #X obj 29 44 pix_texture; > #X obj 28 72 rectangle 4 3; > #X obj 159 9 gemwin; > #X msg 136 -34 create \, 1; > #X msg 214 -33 destroy; > #X obj 135 -57 loadbang; > #X obj 29 17 pix_rtx; > #X obj 29 -10 rotateXYZ 0 180 0; > #X connect 0 0 1 0; > #X connect 1 0 9 0; > #X connect 2 0 3 0; > #X connect 5 0 4 0; > #X connect 6 0 4 0; > #X connect 7 0 5 0; > #X connect 8 0 2 0; > #X connect 9 0 8 0; > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > There is no way to peace, peace is the way. -A.J. Muste > > > -- John Harrison http://alumni.media.mit.edu/~harrison -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: video-rotate.pd URL: From martin.peach at sympatico.ca Wed Mar 25 14:07:38 2009 From: martin.peach at sympatico.ca (Martin Peach) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 09:07:38 -0400 Subject: [PD] OSCX or mrpeach/osc ? In-Reply-To: <1237983347.182230-15391@marvin6.daybyday.de> References: <1237983347.182230-15391@marvin6.daybyday.de> Message-ID: Alvaro wrote: > Hi, > > I'm working on a new patch that uses OSC. I've been using OSCX so far, but then I came accross a page on pdpedia > that claims OSCX is no longer maintained, and that I should use mrpeach's objects instead. SVN history seems to confirm this, but then OSCX worksforme, is well documented, and there are plenty of examples. > So, I don't want to step on anybody's toes, but what is the right choice for a new project? The alternative, to build an abstraction layer, would mean a lot of extra work. mrpeach are you there? > Well you can use whatever you like. OSCX is probably easier for basic stuff. The mrpeach versions also allow you to force the type of each argument, route dynamically, use timestamps, broadcast, and send OSC over TCP or serial instead of UDP. Martin From matohawk at gmail.com Wed Mar 25 15:33:15 2009 From: matohawk at gmail.com (thomas thiery) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 15:33:15 +0100 Subject: [PD] Trouble PD 0.42 - Gem 0.91.3 Tigital - mac osX 10.5.6 Message-ID: <18d6a40d0903250733i4b8b7a30wce9d29fb109c2a74@mail.gmail.com> Hello pd-list, I use a little patch with an object pix_video (lib Gem) on mac osX 10.5.6 2.8 Ghz Quad-Core Intel Xeon I test it with Pd 0.42-4 ang Gem 0.91.3 we don't see anything, my webcam doesn't appear and I test it with pd 0.41-4 ang Gem 0.91.3 it works Do you have any solutions? Is it a bug or I must do something special with pd 0.42-4? Anyone can help me with this? Cheers Thomas -- Matohawk production http://matohawkitongroup.free.fr -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From marius.schebella at gmail.com Wed Mar 25 16:01:58 2009 From: marius.schebella at gmail.com (marius schebella) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 16:01:58 +0100 Subject: [PD] Trouble PD 0.42 - Gem 0.91.3 Tigital - mac osX 10.5.6 In-Reply-To: <18d6a40d0903250733i4b8b7a30wce9d29fb109c2a74@mail.gmail.com> References: <18d6a40d0903250733i4b8b7a30wce9d29fb109c2a74@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Hi, do you see error messages in the console during start up? like do you see a printout about Gem loading correctly? do you see any errors when you load the patch? are the objects created without problems? an issue could be that Gem has to be compiled for 0.42, but that is just a guess. marius. 2009/3/25 thomas thiery : > Hello pd-list, > > I use a little patch with an object pix_video (lib Gem) on mac osX 10.5.6 > 2.8 Ghz Quad-Core Intel Xeon > > I test it with Pd 0.42-4 ang Gem 0.91.3 we don't see anything, my webcam > doesn't appear > and > I test it with pd 0.41-4 ang Gem 0.91.3 it works > > Do you have any solutions? Is it a bug or I must do something special with > pd 0.42-4? > > Anyone can help me with this? > > Cheers Thomas > > -- > Matohawk production > http://matohawkitongroup.free.fr > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > From marius.schebella at gmail.com Wed Mar 25 16:22:07 2009 From: marius.schebella at gmail.com (marius schebella) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 16:22:07 +0100 Subject: [PD] still struggling with basic understanding of Gem dataflow In-Reply-To: <49C935F9.5080100@alum.mit.edu> References: <49C935F9.5080100@alum.mit.edu> Message-ID: hi john, I just looked at your patches, here's what I think: 1) pix_buffer_write seems to copy and clear the pix buffer. so if your pix_video is connected to pix_buffer_write it is gone and you don't see it anymore (rectangle stays white). I am not sure if this is a bug, it seems strange to me, too. but as soon as you disconnect the pix_buffer_write the image will be shown on the rotated rectangle. 2) the rotateXYZ does not rotate the pixels, but only the geometry that this texture is mapped to (the rectangle). so in your left example you go from gemhead through buffer_read, texture to the rectangle. in that line no rotationXYZ is applied to the rectangle. marius. 2009/3/24 John Harrison : > Attached is a small example patch of how I just don't get Gem...still... > > [pix_rtx] has a steady wave that normally flows from left to right. > > I would have thought that the attached patch shows me rotating the image > first, then applying [pix_rtx]. So it would stand to reason in my mind I > would see a rotated image with [pix_rtx] flowing from left to right. > > But that isn't the result I see. The patch has [pix_rtx] flowing from right > to left now. It is as if [pix_rtx] is applied *before* the rotation instead > of *after* as I would have expected. > > Grasping at straws, I have tried [pix_separator] between just about every > object, but that makes no difference. > > What am I misunderstanding that makes the behavior of the patch make sense? > And...how would I get [pix_rtx] to flow from left to right on a mirrored > image? > > -John > > P.S. Are questions like this better on the Gem-dev list? That's a developer > list but at the same time I feel a bit awkward putting too many Gem > questions on a Pd list > > > #N canvas 962 171 305 227 10; > #X obj 29 -58 gemhead; > #X obj 29 -35 pix_video; > #X obj 29 44 pix_texture; > #X obj 28 72 rectangle 4 3; > #X obj 159 9 gemwin; > #X msg 136 -34 create \, 1; > #X msg 214 -33 destroy; > #X obj 135 -57 loadbang; > #X obj 29 17 pix_rtx; > #X obj 29 -10 rotateXYZ 0 180 0; > #X connect 0 0 1 0; > #X connect 1 0 9 0; > #X connect 2 0 3 0; > #X connect 5 0 4 0; > #X connect 6 0 4 0; > #X connect 7 0 5 0; > #X connect 8 0 2 0; > #X connect 9 0 8 0; > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > From matju at artengine.ca Wed Mar 25 16:28:01 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 11:28:01 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: <2F61993D-6697-46C8-A97D-3A0A27B9D751@eds.org> References: <315916.1753.qm@web65611.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> <57ABEF4C-6A65-4DF1-AB87-E55A027347E8@eds.org> <20090324192700.GA13513@footils.org> <2F61993D-6697-46C8-A97D-3A0A27B9D751@eds.org> Message-ID: On Tue, 24 Mar 2009, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > I've taught Pd quite a bit at this point, and I have watched many people > not understand the number boxes as a interactive GUI element. Its based > on my experience, that's all. There is no scientific process behind it. > It is also based on my experience learning Pd, back in the day. I > remember it took me a while before I could get the examples working, and > I had been working with Csound, Cmix, MusicKit and others before, so I > was quite familiar with the concepts. Ok. My next question is then: why isn't numberbox taught before any [output~] is introduced, in tutorials and courses that it's intended to go in? And then, if they shouldn't learn the numberbox at the beginning, then when should they?... the numberbox is pretty much all over the place, and its behaviour (compared to spinboxes and such) is not something that was done randomly... well, understanding the creative process, then maybe it's been done randomly, but it certainly wasn't kept randomly! ergonomically it makes sense: it gives faster control on a number, than a spinbox does. I'd even say it didn't go far enough. There is no sensitivity control for dragging ("scrolling") into numberboxes. The [nbx] (IEMGUI) class has the log-height feature, but of course it only works in log mode. With the sensitivity control, the numberbox would be a clearer winner, but not as much as if it actually had the spinbox's arrow. That's especially feasible in the [nbx] class, which wastes a lot of space that could be recycled as buttons. Now, about scientific processes... it's not all to have a scientific process or not... you get to different conclusions (scientific processes or not) depending on what you aim for. This is a part that I don't see many people talking about. One's aims determine assumptions about the research, assumptions that might be implicit or else often worded like they are only ones worth using. But usability studies are funded by companies who have a mass diffusion model. Those companies live by selling new licenses of software. Those licenses of software tend to be more sold to beginners than to experimented users, if the userbase is in vast expansion compared to the rate of license renewal. As the usability studies are ordered by the marketing operations, the assumptions will be as beginner-oriented as the marketing department is. This is why user interfaces are geared towards what the first impression will be like, at the expense of the following years of use, with a tendency to ignore the fact that people learn, because that learning only occurs after the license is bought. This is IMHO why usability studies and famous UI guideline books have to be approached with suspicion, regardless of how tight their scientific and statistical standards are. Free, community-oriented software isn't necessarily different. Rationally, it depends on their score-keeping: if they are mainly motivated by getting new beginner users, they will just do the same as companies that are mainly selling licenses to new beginner users. Non-rationally, a project could have any other userbase goals but still act like they're aiming for beginners, because they follow UI advice designed for new beginner users without questioning whether it really applies. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From matju at artengine.ca Wed Mar 25 16:44:57 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 11:44:57 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: References: <1A6ACCDE-8D0F-4094-B979-16919791C754@eds.org> <161320dd0903091945n56a19a93tcfea7c6dc17dd6e7@mail.gmail.com> <58A25F57-1CBA-4BB8-BFC4-43012B0C3F0C@eds.org> <966A603E-9392-40E3-BE65-E29731616CE0@dibidut.dk> <49B7795C.3010507@iem.at> Message-ID: On Sat, 21 Mar 2009, Kyle Klipowicz wrote: > I took Modern Algebra as my first course in "Higher Math." Big mistake. > Learning to do proofs this way is a big headache, especially if you have > a curmudgeonly teacher! I don't know what kind of prof you had, but Group Theory tends to need proofs that start from the very scratch. You can hardly skip any step or make any assumptions. Making proofs at this level is very akin to programming in low-level languages like machine language and assembly language: you need to go in the little details, and all you have are little details put together. Fortunately, other courses (and perhaps other parts of the same course) are higher-level than that: I don't need to re-prove every little thing. But it's often not very clear in what level of detail I have to go. As a really bored student, I constantly tested the limits of what I can submit in an exam, and I'd say that they were quite tolerant of my terse proofs. For your learning process, perhaps it has more to do with the teacher being curmudgeonly than about the actual topic that you use for learning how to prove things. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From matohawk at gmail.com Wed Mar 25 16:46:25 2009 From: matohawk at gmail.com (thomas thiery) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 16:46:25 +0100 Subject: [PD] Trouble PD 0.42 - Gem 0.91.3 Tigital - mac osX 10.5.6 In-Reply-To: References: <18d6a40d0903250733i4b8b7a30wce9d29fb109c2a74@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <18d6a40d0903250846o12e52dci4c8abf975e3c3e81@mail.gmail.com> Thank you Marius for your answer, here you can find some documentation I test with pd 0.42-0 this is the same problem I don't want to try to compile Gem from scratch but if anyone do this I can test the binary files on my system. I don't see anything in the documentation about this trouble so... When I loading my patch error: [pix_videoNEW]: do video for this OS ... you might be able to track this down from the Find menu. ---------------------------------- This is the loading message warning: old method 'width' for class 'curve' renamed 'width_aliased' warning: old method 'draw' for class 'curve' renamed 'draw_aliased' warning: old method 'draw' for class 'curve3d' renamed 'draw_aliased' warning: old method 'open' for class 'fragment_program' renamed 'open_aliased' warning: old method 'print' for class 'fragment_program' renamed 'print_aliased' warning: old method 'open' for class 'glsl_fragment' renamed 'open_aliased' warning: old method 'print' for class 'glsl_fragment' renamed 'print_aliased' warning: old method 'gem_state' for class 'pix_filmDarwin' renamed 'gem_state_aliased' warning: old method 'open' for class 'pix_filmDarwin' renamed 'open_aliased' warning: old method 'img_num' for class 'pix_filmDarwin' renamed 'img_num_aliased' warning: old method 'auto' for class 'pix_filmDarwin' renamed 'auto_aliased' warning: class 'pix_film' overwritten\; old one renamed 'pix_film_aliased' warning: old method 'gem_state' for class 'pix_filmQT' renamed 'gem_state_aliased' warning: old method 'open' for class 'pix_filmQT' renamed 'open_aliased' warning: old method 'img_num' for class 'pix_filmQT' renamed 'img_num_aliased' warning: old method 'auto' for class 'pix_filmQT' renamed 'auto_aliased' warning: old method 'gem_state' for class 'pix_videoDarwin' renamed 'gem_state_aliased' warning: old method 'dialog' for class 'pix_videoDarwin' renamed 'dialog_aliased' warning: old method 'colorspace' for class 'pix_videoDarwin' renamed 'colorspace_aliased' warning: class 'pix_video' overwritten\; old one renamed 'pix_video_aliased' warning: old method 'width' for class 'polygon' renamed 'width_aliased' warning: old method 'draw' for class 'polygon' renamed 'draw_aliased' warning: old method 'draw' for class 'primTri' renamed 'draw_aliased' warning: old method 'width' for class 'scopeXYZ' renamed 'width_aliased' warning: old method 'draw' for class 'scopeXYZ' renamed 'draw_aliased' GEM: Graphics Environment for Multimedia GEM: ver: 0.91.3 'tigital' GEM: compiled: Jan 22 2009 GEM: maintained by IOhannes m zmoelnig GEM: Authors : Mark Danks (original version) GEM: Chris Clepper GEM: James Tittle GEM: IOhannes m zmoelnig GEM: with help by Guenter Geiger, Daniel Heckenberg, Cyrille Henry, et al. GEM: found a bug? miss a feature? please report it: GEM: homepage http://gem.iem.at/ GEM: bug-tracker http://sourceforge.net/projects/pd-gem/ GEM: mailing-list http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/gem-dev/ GEM: compiled for SIMD architecture: SSE2 MMX GEM: using SSE2 optimization 2009/3/25 marius schebella > Hi, > do you see error messages in the console during start up? like do you > see a printout about Gem loading correctly? do you see any errors when > you load the patch? are the objects created without problems? > an issue could be that Gem has to be compiled for 0.42, but that is > just a guess. > marius. > > 2009/3/25 thomas thiery : > > Hello pd-list, > > > > I use a little patch with an object pix_video (lib Gem) on mac osX 10.5.6 > > 2.8 Ghz Quad-Core Intel Xeon > > > > I test it with Pd 0.42-4 ang Gem 0.91.3 we don't see anything, my webcam > > doesn't appear > > and > > I test it with pd 0.41-4 ang Gem 0.91.3 it works > > > > Do you have any solutions? Is it a bug or I must do something special > with > > pd 0.42-4? > > > > Anyone can help me with this? > > > > Cheers Thomas > > > > -- > > Matohawk production > > http://matohawkitongroup.free.fr > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > -- Matohawk production http://matohawkitongroup.free.fr -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From bbakersmith at gmail.com Wed Mar 25 16:48:03 2009 From: bbakersmith at gmail.com (Ben Baker-Smith) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 10:48:03 -0500 Subject: [PD] What font does PD use? Message-ID: I'm working on some graphics for PdCon09 to potentially use for promotional materials. Could someone tell me what font PD uses? Or at least a close approximation? If it's not a regular font, does someone have a copy of the font file? Thanks, -Ben -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From matohawk at gmail.com Wed Mar 25 16:50:41 2009 From: matohawk at gmail.com (thomas thiery) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 16:50:41 +0100 Subject: [PD] Trouble PD 0.42 - Gem 0.91.3 Tigital - mac osX 10.5.6 In-Reply-To: <18d6a40d0903250846o12e52dci4c8abf975e3c3e81@mail.gmail.com> References: <18d6a40d0903250733i4b8b7a30wce9d29fb109c2a74@mail.gmail.com> <18d6a40d0903250846o12e52dci4c8abf975e3c3e81@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <18d6a40d0903250850t158a3b27taa75227bd486a3b1@mail.gmail.com> Oh I find this note Current release: Gem 0.91.3 Released 22/01/2009 ? tested with pd 0.40, pd 0.41 So I test with pd 0.42 and Gem have some but If I have time I will try to make a compliation for Mac with pd 0.42 to test in the best condition Thomas 2009/3/25 thomas thiery > Thank you Marius for your answer, here you can find some documentation > > I test with pd 0.42-0 this is the same problem > I don't want to try to compile Gem from scratch but if anyone do this I can > test the binary files on my system. > > I don't see anything in the documentation about this trouble so... > > When I loading my patch > > error: [pix_videoNEW]: do video for this OS > ... you might be able to track this down from the Find menu. > > > ---------------------------------- > > This is the loading message > > warning: old method 'width' for class 'curve' renamed 'width_aliased' > warning: old method 'draw' for class 'curve' renamed 'draw_aliased' > warning: old method 'draw' for class 'curve3d' renamed 'draw_aliased' > warning: old method 'open' for class 'fragment_program' renamed > 'open_aliased' > warning: old method 'print' for class 'fragment_program' renamed > 'print_aliased' > warning: old method 'open' for class 'glsl_fragment' renamed 'open_aliased' > warning: old method 'print' for class 'glsl_fragment' renamed > 'print_aliased' > warning: old method 'gem_state' for class 'pix_filmDarwin' renamed > 'gem_state_aliased' > warning: old method 'open' for class 'pix_filmDarwin' renamed > 'open_aliased' > warning: old method 'img_num' for class 'pix_filmDarwin' renamed > 'img_num_aliased' > warning: old method 'auto' for class 'pix_filmDarwin' renamed > 'auto_aliased' > warning: class 'pix_film' overwritten\; old one renamed 'pix_film_aliased' > warning: old method 'gem_state' for class 'pix_filmQT' renamed > 'gem_state_aliased' > warning: old method 'open' for class 'pix_filmQT' renamed 'open_aliased' > warning: old method 'img_num' for class 'pix_filmQT' renamed > 'img_num_aliased' > warning: old method 'auto' for class 'pix_filmQT' renamed 'auto_aliased' > warning: old method 'gem_state' for class 'pix_videoDarwin' renamed > 'gem_state_aliased' > warning: old method 'dialog' for class 'pix_videoDarwin' renamed > 'dialog_aliased' > warning: old method 'colorspace' for class 'pix_videoDarwin' renamed > 'colorspace_aliased' > warning: class 'pix_video' overwritten\; old one renamed > 'pix_video_aliased' > warning: old method 'width' for class 'polygon' renamed 'width_aliased' > warning: old method 'draw' for class 'polygon' renamed 'draw_aliased' > warning: old method 'draw' for class 'primTri' renamed 'draw_aliased' > warning: old method 'width' for class 'scopeXYZ' renamed 'width_aliased' > warning: old method 'draw' for class 'scopeXYZ' renamed 'draw_aliased' > GEM: Graphics Environment for Multimedia > GEM: ver: 0.91.3 'tigital' > GEM: compiled: Jan 22 2009 > GEM: maintained by IOhannes m zmoelnig > GEM: Authors : Mark Danks (original version) > GEM: Chris Clepper > GEM: James Tittle > GEM: IOhannes m zmoelnig > GEM: with help by Guenter Geiger, Daniel Heckenberg, Cyrille Henry, et al. > GEM: found a bug? miss a feature? please report it: > GEM: homepage http://gem.iem.at/ > GEM: bug-tracker http://sourceforge.net/projects/pd-gem/ > GEM: mailing-list http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/gem-dev/ > GEM: compiled for SIMD architecture: SSE2 MMX > GEM: using SSE2 optimization > > 2009/3/25 marius schebella > > Hi, >> do you see error messages in the console during start up? like do you >> see a printout about Gem loading correctly? do you see any errors when >> you load the patch? are the objects created without problems? >> an issue could be that Gem has to be compiled for 0.42, but that is >> just a guess. >> marius. >> >> 2009/3/25 thomas thiery : >> > Hello pd-list, >> > >> > I use a little patch with an object pix_video (lib Gem) on mac osX >> 10.5.6 >> > 2.8 Ghz Quad-Core Intel Xeon >> > >> > I test it with Pd 0.42-4 ang Gem 0.91.3 we don't see anything, my webcam >> > doesn't appear >> > and >> > I test it with pd 0.41-4 ang Gem 0.91.3 it works >> > >> > Do you have any solutions? Is it a bug or I must do something special >> with >> > pd 0.42-4? >> > >> > Anyone can help me with this? >> > >> > Cheers Thomas >> > >> > -- >> > Matohawk production >> > http://matohawkitongroup.free.fr >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> > >> > >> > > > > -- > Matohawk production > http://matohawkitongroup.free.fr > -- Matohawk production http://matohawkitongroup.free.fr -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From johnharrisonwsu at gmail.com Wed Mar 25 17:08:19 2009 From: johnharrisonwsu at gmail.com (John Harrison) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 11:08:19 -0500 Subject: [PD] still struggling with basic understanding of Gem dataflow In-Reply-To: References: <49C935F9.5080100@alum.mit.edu> Message-ID: <7aa995dd0903250908r469991d7s32b9dc5739a8d1df@mail.gmail.com> On Wed, Mar 25, 2009 at 10:22 AM, marius schebella < marius.schebella at gmail.com> wrote: > hi john, > I just looked at your patches, here's what I think: > 1) pix_buffer_write seems to copy and clear the pix buffer. so if your > pix_video is connected to pix_buffer_write it is gone and you don't > see it anymore (rectangle stays white). I am not sure if this is a > bug, it seems strange to me, too. but as soon as you disconnect the > pix_buffer_write the image will be shown on the rotated rectangle. Yes I also noticed that disconnecting the [pix_buffer_write] fixes the problem. i see that sort of thing in Gem all the time ([pix_mix] for example.) But wouldn't a [pix_separator] fix this then? It doesn't... > > 2) the rotateXYZ does not rotate the pixels, but only the geometry > that this texture is mapped to (the rectangle). so in your left > example you go from gemhead through buffer_read, texture to the > rectangle. in that line no rotationXYZ is applied to the rectangle. > marius. So why does the right example work? Because the rotation happens after the [pix_buffer_write] even though [pix_buffer_write] is later in the rendering chain? Or perhaps the rotation is ignored by [pix_buffer_write]? And at the same time [pix_buffer_write] sends the output of the rotation as a "passthrough" on its outlet? And also you are saying it would be normal and expected for the output of [pix_buffer_write] to be different than what [pix_buffer_write] is actually storing? If that isn't the case, example 1 and example 3 should produce the same results. Perhaps I need some rules about how Gem is different than Pd in terms of dataflow. So far it seems to me that a rendering chain in Gem shows conections but does not reveal the order in which these connections are processed i.e. if 3 objects are all connected to each other in a rendering chain in Gem i.e. [Gemhead] | [object 1] | [object 2] | [object 3] we cannot conclude that the output of [object 1] feeds the input of [object 2] and the output of [object 2] feeds the input of [object 3]. We only know that the data will be processed by objects 1, 2 and 3 but not in what order they will be processed. Further perhaps we cannot conclude that the output of an object is actually the result of the object having processed the data. Demonstrating this: in my patch example, [pix_buffer_write] outputs different data than it stores, or examples 1 and 3 would be the same. And this leads me to a more general statement of my original question: how can I determine the order in which objects are processed in Gem? And my specific example which started this thread: how would one apply a rotation to an image, then apply [pix_rtx] to the rotated image? -John > > > 2009/3/24 John Harrison : > > Attached is a small example patch of how I just don't get > Gem...still... > > > > [pix_rtx] has a steady wave that normally flows from left to right. > > > > I would have thought that the attached patch shows me rotating the image > > first, then applying [pix_rtx]. So it would stand to reason in my mind I > > would see a rotated image with [pix_rtx] flowing from left to right. > > > > But that isn't the result I see. The patch has [pix_rtx] flowing from > right > > to left now. It is as if [pix_rtx] is applied *before* the rotation > instead > > of *after* as I would have expected. > > > > Grasping at straws, I have tried [pix_separator] between just about every > > object, but that makes no difference. > > > > What am I misunderstanding that makes the behavior of the patch make > sense? > > And...how would I get [pix_rtx] to flow from left to right on a mirrored > > image? > > > > -John > > > > P.S. Are questions like this better on the Gem-dev list? That's a > developer > > list but at the same time I feel a bit awkward putting too many Gem > > questions on a Pd list > > > > > > #N canvas 962 171 305 227 10; > > #X obj 29 -58 gemhead; > > #X obj 29 -35 pix_video; > > #X obj 29 44 pix_texture; > > #X obj 28 72 rectangle 4 3; > > #X obj 159 9 gemwin; > > #X msg 136 -34 create \, 1; > > #X msg 214 -33 destroy; > > #X obj 135 -57 loadbang; > > #X obj 29 17 pix_rtx; > > #X obj 29 -10 rotateXYZ 0 180 0; > > #X connect 0 0 1 0; > > #X connect 1 0 9 0; > > #X connect 2 0 3 0; > > #X connect 5 0 4 0; > > #X connect 6 0 4 0; > > #X connect 7 0 5 0; > > #X connect 8 0 2 0; > > #X connect 9 0 8 0; > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From matohawk at gmail.com Wed Mar 25 17:08:33 2009 From: matohawk at gmail.com (thomas thiery) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 17:08:33 +0100 Subject: [PD] Trouble PD 0.42 - Gem 0.91.3 Tigital - mac osX 10.5.6 In-Reply-To: <18d6a40d0903250850t158a3b27taa75227bd486a3b1@mail.gmail.com> References: <18d6a40d0903250733i4b8b7a30wce9d29fb109c2a74@mail.gmail.com> <18d6a40d0903250846o12e52dci4c8abf975e3c3e81@mail.gmail.com> <18d6a40d0903250850t158a3b27taa75227bd486a3b1@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <18d6a40d0903250908s51a0ab53n3c09884a4b1570c0@mail.gmail.com> I make a binary from scratch of Gem for Mac osx 10.5.6 and pd 0.42-4 but I have the same problem. So for the moment I use pd 0.41-4 and that's ok 2009/3/25 thomas thiery > Oh I find this note > Current release: Gem 0.91.3 > > Released 22/01/2009 ? tested with pd 0.40, pd 0.41 > > So I test with pd 0.42 and Gem have some but If I have time I will try to > make a compliation for Mac with pd 0.42 to test in the best condition > > > Thomas > > > > 2009/3/25 thomas thiery > >> Thank you Marius for your answer, here you can find some documentation >> >> I test with pd 0.42-0 this is the same problem >> I don't want to try to compile Gem from scratch but if anyone do this I >> can test the binary files on my system. >> >> I don't see anything in the documentation about this trouble so... >> >> When I loading my patch >> >> error: [pix_videoNEW]: do video for this OS >> ... you might be able to track this down from the Find menu. >> >> >> ---------------------------------- >> >> This is the loading message >> >> warning: old method 'width' for class 'curve' renamed 'width_aliased' >> warning: old method 'draw' for class 'curve' renamed 'draw_aliased' >> warning: old method 'draw' for class 'curve3d' renamed 'draw_aliased' >> warning: old method 'open' for class 'fragment_program' renamed >> 'open_aliased' >> warning: old method 'print' for class 'fragment_program' renamed >> 'print_aliased' >> warning: old method 'open' for class 'glsl_fragment' renamed >> 'open_aliased' >> warning: old method 'print' for class 'glsl_fragment' renamed >> 'print_aliased' >> warning: old method 'gem_state' for class 'pix_filmDarwin' renamed >> 'gem_state_aliased' >> warning: old method 'open' for class 'pix_filmDarwin' renamed >> 'open_aliased' >> warning: old method 'img_num' for class 'pix_filmDarwin' renamed >> 'img_num_aliased' >> warning: old method 'auto' for class 'pix_filmDarwin' renamed >> 'auto_aliased' >> warning: class 'pix_film' overwritten\; old one renamed 'pix_film_aliased' >> warning: old method 'gem_state' for class 'pix_filmQT' renamed >> 'gem_state_aliased' >> warning: old method 'open' for class 'pix_filmQT' renamed 'open_aliased' >> warning: old method 'img_num' for class 'pix_filmQT' renamed >> 'img_num_aliased' >> warning: old method 'auto' for class 'pix_filmQT' renamed 'auto_aliased' >> warning: old method 'gem_state' for class 'pix_videoDarwin' renamed >> 'gem_state_aliased' >> warning: old method 'dialog' for class 'pix_videoDarwin' renamed >> 'dialog_aliased' >> warning: old method 'colorspace' for class 'pix_videoDarwin' renamed >> 'colorspace_aliased' >> warning: class 'pix_video' overwritten\; old one renamed >> 'pix_video_aliased' >> warning: old method 'width' for class 'polygon' renamed 'width_aliased' >> warning: old method 'draw' for class 'polygon' renamed 'draw_aliased' >> warning: old method 'draw' for class 'primTri' renamed 'draw_aliased' >> warning: old method 'width' for class 'scopeXYZ' renamed 'width_aliased' >> warning: old method 'draw' for class 'scopeXYZ' renamed 'draw_aliased' >> GEM: Graphics Environment for Multimedia >> GEM: ver: 0.91.3 'tigital' >> GEM: compiled: Jan 22 2009 >> GEM: maintained by IOhannes m zmoelnig >> GEM: Authors : Mark Danks (original version) >> GEM: Chris Clepper >> GEM: James Tittle >> GEM: IOhannes m zmoelnig >> GEM: with help by Guenter Geiger, Daniel Heckenberg, Cyrille Henry, et al. >> GEM: found a bug? miss a feature? please report it: >> GEM: homepage http://gem.iem.at/ >> GEM: bug-tracker http://sourceforge.net/projects/pd-gem/ >> GEM: mailing-list http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/gem-dev/ >> GEM: compiled for SIMD architecture: SSE2 MMX >> GEM: using SSE2 optimization >> >> 2009/3/25 marius schebella >> >> Hi, >>> do you see error messages in the console during start up? like do you >>> see a printout about Gem loading correctly? do you see any errors when >>> you load the patch? are the objects created without problems? >>> an issue could be that Gem has to be compiled for 0.42, but that is >>> just a guess. >>> marius. >>> >>> 2009/3/25 thomas thiery : >>> > Hello pd-list, >>> > >>> > I use a little patch with an object pix_video (lib Gem) on mac osX >>> 10.5.6 >>> > 2.8 Ghz Quad-Core Intel Xeon >>> > >>> > I test it with Pd 0.42-4 ang Gem 0.91.3 we don't see anything, my >>> webcam >>> > doesn't appear >>> > and >>> > I test it with pd 0.41-4 ang Gem 0.91.3 it works >>> > >>> > Do you have any solutions? Is it a bug or I must do something special >>> with >>> > pd 0.42-4? >>> > >>> > Anyone can help me with this? >>> > >>> > Cheers Thomas >>> > >>> > -- >>> > Matohawk production >>> > http://matohawkitongroup.free.fr >>> > >>> > _______________________________________________ >>> > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >>> > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >>> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >>> > >>> > >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Matohawk production >> http://matohawkitongroup.free.fr >> > > > > -- > Matohawk production > http://matohawkitongroup.free.fr > -- Matohawk production http://matohawkitongroup.free.fr -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From matju at artengine.ca Wed Mar 25 17:22:36 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 12:22:36 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( In-Reply-To: <20090321180635.GA2368@fliwatut.scifi> References: <129520C8-D5DE-4FC5-869E-4BC4F1334564@eds.org> <20090320185312.GA31601@footils.org> <20090321180635.GA2368@fliwatut.scifi> Message-ID: On Sat, 21 Mar 2009, Frank Barknecht wrote: > Yeah, lets not turn a style guide into a style law. > Sometimes crossings are not avoidable indeed. Well, I don't just mean that. I also mean that sometimes crossings are clearer than any replacement for them. Often a simple X of wires is much more expressive than a [s]/[r] pair made only for the sake of following an unpractically stringent standard about crossings. > I seem to go like that: > 1) avoid crossings Although, when I think my patch is messy, I first try to remove excess crossings, I can't possibly put avoiding crossings above everything else all of the time. You have to make exceptions for what I was calling "cross-connect" and "side-cross-connect" in PdCon04; that is, respectively, crossing wires from two outlets of one object to two inlets of another, and from one outlet of each of two objects, to one inlet of the other. It would look very silly avoiding that crossing using a [s]/[r] pair. There are other variations of the same, using more wires. For example, see seq_fold-help.pd in GridFlow for a version with three wires. > 3) if you really have to cross over objects, make the patch cords go > in straight vertical lines (straight vertical cords are the best cords > anyway) > 4) even then avoid crossing over object inlets or outlets, as it is > ambiguous which cords are connected. I'd put (4) over (3), really. But those efforts are foiled by font issues and by the fact that Pd never stores the object width in the case of plain objectboxes. So if you change the font you can get a different positioning of outlets. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From matju at artengine.ca Wed Mar 25 17:32:41 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 12:32:41 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( In-Reply-To: <8564E2D3-5B00-4597-8DE9-FBB0006BD078@eds.org> References: <129520C8-D5DE-4FC5-869E-4BC4F1334564@eds.org> <20090320185312.GA31601@footils.org> <20090321180635.GA2368@fliwatut.scifi> <20090321183905.GA2738@footils.org> <8564E2D3-5B00-4597-8DE9-FBB0006BD078@eds.org> Message-ID: On Sun, 22 Mar 2009, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > Or making lines that go up for anything but feedback/loops. Well, if you first make sure that most lines are as short as possible, then there's not much need to worry about lines going up. A single-outlet object connected to a single-inlet object that doesn't get connected anywhere else, can have a 2-pixel line. After that, wires going up is a minor trouble and/or simply a necessity. I do lots of lines that go up, especially to an object at the same height, so, object-wise, it's a kind of horizontal connection, but the rendering goes up because outlets are at the bottom of boxes and inlets are at the top. > Any I can't think of any reason why you should ever cross over an inlet or > outlet, i.e. Frank's #4. Because the font changed after the patch was made. Which is probably an issue for all of Pd these days...? _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From ico.bukvic at gmail.com Wed Mar 25 17:33:46 2009 From: ico.bukvic at gmail.com (Ivica Ico Bukvic) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 12:33:46 -0400 Subject: [PD] [OT] RME HDSP Multiface (1st gen), PCMCIA cardbus (1st gen), and PCI-to-PCMCIA cardbus (for desktop) for sale Message-ID: Barely used. If interested, please email me your offer. Originally this thing cost ~$1,200 (with the PCI-to-PCMCIA cardbus for the desktop connectivity). Been used on Linux and Windows. Ivica Ico Bukvic, D.M.A. Composition, Music Technology Director, DISIS Interactive Sound & Intermedia Studio Assistant Co-Director, CCTAD CHCI, CS, and Art (by courtesy) Virginia Tech Dept. of Music - 0240 Blacksburg, VA 24061 (540) 231-6139 (540) 231-5034 (fax) ico at vt.edu http://www.music.vt.edu/faculty/bukvic/ From zmoelnig at iem.at Wed Mar 25 17:46:33 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (=?windows-1252?Q?IOhannes_m_zm=F6lnig?=) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 17:46:33 +0100 Subject: [PD] Trouble PD 0.42 - Gem 0.91.3 Tigital - mac osX 10.5.6 In-Reply-To: <18d6a40d0903250908s51a0ab53n3c09884a4b1570c0@mail.gmail.com> References: <18d6a40d0903250733i4b8b7a30wce9d29fb109c2a74@mail.gmail.com> <18d6a40d0903250846o12e52dci4c8abf975e3c3e81@mail.gmail.com> <18d6a40d0903250850t158a3b27taa75227bd486a3b1@mail.gmail.com> <18d6a40d0903250908s51a0ab53n3c09884a4b1570c0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49CA5FE9.5090305@iem.at> thomas thiery wrote: > I make a binary from scratch of Gem for Mac osx 10.5.6 and pd 0.42-4 but > I have the same problem. did you compile the 0.91.3 sources, or fresh from svn? please file a bug-report at http://sf.net/projects/pd-gem mfga.sdr IOhannes From matju at artengine.ca Wed Mar 25 17:48:47 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 12:48:47 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( In-Reply-To: References: <129520C8-D5DE-4FC5-869E-4BC4F1334564@eds.org> Message-ID: On Sat, 21 Mar 2009, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > And one last little story that I just remembered: I didn't realize that > [send pd] was even a possibility until recently. I had always seen [; pd dsp > 1( and figured messages to pd had to be sent that way. So is this a sign that this part of Pd is difficult, or a sign that you didn't learn it at the beginning? What if I teach that thing at the very beginning of a course? The beginners may get themselves to think that it's a very basic concept of pd, and won't understand your recommendation to get it removed. Btw, it's in pd/doc/2.control.examples/10.more.messages.pd , and I'd have trouble considering anything in that folder as being non-basic. The problem with removing unneeded words and concepts from a course is that it doesn't prepare the students for the world, it prepares the students for an exam (or for anything else that happens within the class). Which means that once they try to handle patches made outside of this little world, it reveals those holes in their knowledge. Once that I giving some kind of crash course on pd, I said that outlets are linked to inlets using lines, connections, wires, cords or patchcords. Later I was told by a teacher that it's wrong to do so and that I should only be stating one word and use it consistently. Well, I disagree a lot. I don't want to cultivate students in a bubble. If they try to search mailing-list archives for something related to patchcords, they really do have to search for those five words in order to find everything, and then if they talk to anyone outside of the course they have to be able to communicate. It's the same deal for semicolons imho. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From algoritmia at labormedia.cl Wed Mar 25 17:48:22 2009 From: algoritmia at labormedia.cl (Correa Diego) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 12:48:22 -0400 Subject: [PD] [PD-announce] Taller de Algoritmia Abril 2009 Message-ID: <6c92874b0903250948g70519a8ap83d0d43036a48cb9@mail.gmail.com> A la comunidad de Pure Data, Est?n abiertas las inscripciones al Taller de Algoritmia Abril 2009, en Santiago de Chile. Resumen de la actividad: La orientaci?n del taller es la integraci?n de conocimientos pr?cticos de programaci?n visual en dos lineas de trabajo: t?cnicas en arquitectura gen?tica y uso de la herramienta Pure Data (Pd)*. El taller est? compuesto por cuatro m?dulos de cuatro alumnos. Dos de estos m?dulos se especializar?n en introducci?n y t?cnicas de algoritmos para la arquitectura gen?tica y los otros dos en el uso de la herramienta Pure Data para la aplicaci?n en m?sica y video-performance. Estos m?dulos abarcan competencias complementarias. El m?todo formativo utilizado (esquema CUATRO) consta de sesiones intensivas de una hora y media en m?dulos de cuatro alumnos y un expositor gu?a. El expositor gu?a los primeros 45 minutos de cada sesi?n al estudio representativo de la t?cnica para luego practicar el m?todo durante los siguientes 45 minutos en la construcci?n de una obra. - Lugar: d?j? ??. Valenzuela Castillo 1269-B, Providencia, Santiago de Chile. - Inscripciones: al correo algoritmia at labormedia.cl o al tel?fono (562) 8805476. Sobre el expositor gu?a: Diego Correa T. ha promovido una profunda curiosidad por las plataformas que dan pie a proyectos relacionados con la concepci?n y experimentaci?n tanto en m?sica y arte como en matem?ticas. Desde los inicios en 2003 del trabajo en modelado de agentes con programaci?n convexa, mientras era alumno de econom?a, su inter?s por el uso de herramientas para el modelado matem?tico se ha desarrollado. En 2004 en el Centro de M?sica y Tecnolog?a (CMT), actual Laboratorio Arcis de Inform?tica Musical (LAIM), en Santiago de Chile, se instruy? para el aprendizaje en interpretaci?n musical y multimedial por medio de software libre desarrollado en el instituto de investigaci?n y coordinaci?n ac?stico/musical (IRCAM) de Francia. Entre el 2006 y el 2008 desempe?? labores de producci?n e investigaci?n para el Laboratorio de Medios de la Universidad Cat?lica de Chile (MDLB UC), fundado por el neurobi?logo y artista de medios de la Universidad de Nueva York (NYU), Jos? Miguel Tagle. Desde entonces ha estado desarrollando modelos de adaptaci?n de herramientas digitales al uso en ?reas no solo matem?ticas y ac?stico/musicales, sino tambi?n en econom?a, cibern?tica, inteligencia artificial, neurociencia te?rica y teor?a de la informaci?n. Las inscripciones estar?n abiertas hasta el d?a viernes 3 de abril. saludos cordiales, Diego Correa T. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ Pd-announce mailing list Pd-announce at iem.at http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-announce From matju at artengine.ca Wed Mar 25 18:01:16 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 13:01:16 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] DIY GSoC: getting those projects done In-Reply-To: <20090323130355.GA14055@mccormick.cx> References: <774CBB5D-E9FE-44C6-B4A0-B37E543CC3C3@eds.org> <20090323130355.GA14055@mccormick.cx> Message-ID: On Mon, 23 Mar 2009, Chris McCormick wrote: > IIRC, one of their complaints from last year was that our application > had too many parts. Next time we should pick just one or two specific > tasks and go with them. Maybe with a community vote or whatever. Also, I > hate to be cynical, but I can't see any way even remotely in which > Google could use Pd to make a profit. ;) Thanks for your huge effort > anyway, Hans and Georg. It's not just that, it's that Pd is still relatively non-mainstream. I can imagine plenty (or even most) of programmers being allergic to Pd and thinking it's messy, difficult to program with, and generally an exercise in contorsion. I mean, what do you do with a language that has no builtin [demux] (that's called an if-else anywhere else), in which hot-vs-cold is troublesome (else [expr] wouldn't be *so* attractive), etc.; if programmers that don't use pd had a better opinion of pd, some things like this could have more of a chance. That's when supposing Google is trying to stay neutral and not selecting for profit. Else it's an ever harder game, I suppose. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From matju at artengine.ca Wed Mar 25 18:08:51 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 13:08:51 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] DIY GSoC: getting those projects done In-Reply-To: <200903240020.09720.dmotd@gmx.net> References: <774CBB5D-E9FE-44C6-B4A0-B37E543CC3C3@eds.org> <20090323130355.GA14055@mccormick.cx> <200903240020.09720.dmotd@gmx.net> Message-ID: On Tue, 24 Mar 2009, dmotd wrote: > or perhaps a company that relies so heavily on string manipulation > considered pd useless? ;) Yeah. It doesn't even have to be deliberate. A search engine company will be populated by the kind of computer programmers who are very very string-centric. Those guys might not even realise that they are being string-centric. At the other end of the spectrum, Pd users might not realise how much non-string-centric they are, or even, string-avoidant. Pd is the most string-averse language I've touched since ColorLOGO: http://www.trs-80.com/covers/book-colorlogo(1982)(micropi).jpg But that was a 8k ROM that also had to implement multithreading from scratch and had to do graphics and math on a CPU that not only had no FPU but also no division operator either. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From bbakersmith at gmail.com Wed Mar 25 18:17:26 2009 From: bbakersmith at gmail.com (Ben Baker-Smith) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 12:17:26 -0500 Subject: [PD] still struggling with basic understanding of Gem dataflow Message-ID: Hi John, You are correct. Gem does not follow the normal top to bottom rules of PD. I believe its render chain has more to do with the rules of OpenGL than with PD. Sorry I can't give you an easy way of figuring which objects will be processed first. If there is one then I've never heard/read it. Keep experimenting. For more information on this, I recommend looking up the "a flawed Gem" thread in the PD-List archives (and whatever thread that came out of). It'll give you some more information about Gem's relation to OpenGL and some users frustration with similar situations as yours. I love using Gem, it's the environment I primarily work in when using PD. However, it's a bit of a wild beast (at least to a non-programmer like myself). Best of luck, -Ben >[Gemhead] >| >[object 1] >| >[object 2] >| >[object 3] > >we cannot conclude that the output of [object 1] feeds the input of [object >2] and the output of [object 2] feeds the input of [object 3]. We only know >that the data will be processed by objects 1, 2 and 3 but not in what order >they will be processed. > >Further perhaps we cannot conclude that the output of an object is actually >the result of the object having processed the data. Demonstrating this: in >my patch example, [pix_buffer_write] outputs different data than it stores, >or examples 1 and 3 would be the same. > >And this leads me to a more general statement of my original question: how >can I determine the order in which objects are processed in Gem? > >And my specific example which started this thread: how would one apply a >rotation to an image, then apply [pix_rtx] to the rotated image? > >-John -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From errordeveloper at gmail.com Wed Mar 25 18:18:45 2009 From: errordeveloper at gmail.com (error developer) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 17:18:45 +0000 Subject: [PD] DIY GSoC: getting those projects done In-Reply-To: <774CBB5D-E9FE-44C6-B4A0-B37E543CC3C3@eds.org> References: <774CBB5D-E9FE-44C6-B4A0-B37E543CC3C3@eds.org> Message-ID: <4ccc82330903251018h34e8b2c5g3aa53971f691f728@mail.gmail.com> i bet if we icluded 'musical data mining' or such thing in there ..we'd win ;) however may be no one will ever get far with this - it's seems to be that kindda target that is set by them for groups to research on and never get far out and be too occupid .. eh.. whatever, might them hear this, they no already but i think we should get these done ;) our new TODO list perfectly set out ;) prove that we don't actually need that much of "their support" and can be self-organzed to reach these targets :] i'd like to work on a multi-platform installer mmodular pd-extended installer scrit, which would basically install pd into /opt/pd with all deps and chosen extenals//abstaction sets -- ilya .d From errordeveloper at gmail.com Wed Mar 25 18:34:55 2009 From: errordeveloper at gmail.com (error developer) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 17:34:55 +0000 Subject: [PD] DIY GSoC: getting those projects done In-Reply-To: References: <774CBB5D-E9FE-44C6-B4A0-B37E543CC3C3@eds.org> <20090323130355.GA14055@mccormick.cx> Message-ID: <4ccc82330903251034r7f794872ne4b24de550643eb2@mail.gmail.com> hm .. i think it's not appropriate to compare pd to programmng languges we do call it a languge, but it's rather more corect to call it like and visual engeneering environment whch hase a set of object or something like that, if you could at least compile them into some sort of binaries - that would be a bit more comparable ..and pd is not a virtual machine either .. may be it is in some way, but all these VM thing is inapropriate anyway, that way you are putting it in the row with Java and dot.net ..and that is not were ost of us wanna be .. you can put pd (max and perhaps reactor) into the row with LABVIEW and Simulink(mayb), and those are rather engenering environmnts then languages as such, i think the langueges should be rather limited to those you code with in a tet editor.. anyhow these disscussions are inappropriate cause they don't make any difference - i just wanted to give my poiint, as Mathieu said about [demux] .. that leads to flae wars like between tclers and lispers ..but to me both are actually quite simpatic ;)) and i can see my self coding in both one day .. and once again - i don't see them programmers using software like pd or max or labview - those are more for engeneers yeah some people are proper engeneers and progammers at the same time, but they are not the majority.. if we all where great at both things everything be working much better and much moreusable perhaps .. ;) On 25/03/2009, Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > On Mon, 23 Mar 2009, Chris McCormick wrote: > > > > IIRC, one of their complaints from last year was that our application had > too many parts. Next time we should pick just one or two specific tasks and > go with them. Maybe with a community vote or whatever. Also, I hate to be > cynical, but I can't see any way even remotely in which Google could use Pd > to make a profit. ;) Thanks for your huge effort anyway, Hans and Georg. > > > > It's not just that, it's that Pd is still relatively non-mainstream. I can > imagine plenty (or even most) of programmers being allergic to Pd and > thinking it's messy, difficult to program with, and generally an exercise in > contorsion. I mean, what do you do with a language that has no builtin > [demux] (that's called an if-else anywhere else), in which hot-vs-cold is > troublesome (else [expr] wouldn't be *so* attractive), etc.; if programmers > that don't use pd had a better opinion of pd, some things like this could > have more of a chance. That's when supposing Google is trying to stay > neutral and not selecting for profit. Else it's an ever harder game, I > suppose. > > _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... > | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 25 18:35:50 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 13:35:50 -0400 Subject: [PD] agenda for upcoming book sprint? Message-ID: <8DCD65A4-2A60-4E09-8AD0-14BCE8C147E0@eds.org> Hey all, I hope I am not jumping the gun or stepping on anyone's toes. I just wanted to open up the discussion about what people are planning on working on during the upcoming book sprint. Currently, I am pretty open to topics, but I was thinking that Gem/PDP/Gridflow could really use a section. There are lots of examples for them, but they lack a good intro to the concepts. .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- News is what people want to keep hidden and everything else is publicity. - Bill Moyers From cgclepper at gmail.com Wed Mar 25 18:45:17 2009 From: cgclepper at gmail.com (chris clepper) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 13:45:17 -0400 Subject: [PD] still struggling with basic understanding of Gem dataflow In-Reply-To: <7aa995dd0903250908r469991d7s32b9dc5739a8d1df@mail.gmail.com> References: <49C935F9.5080100@alum.mit.edu> <7aa995dd0903250908r469991d7s32b9dc5739a8d1df@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: There are two types of objects in GEM: pix and OpenGL. Pix objects do work in the top to bottom manner like Pd DSP objects. One thing to keep in mind is that the pix_ objects use 'in place' processing which means that the pixel data is overwritten by each object. For most types of processing this works fine, but it you want to apply two different processes to the same pixels then you need pix_separator. pix_separator copies the pixels to a new buffer for further processing. The OpenGL objects mostly map to some GL operation (rotate or translate) or create a piece of geometry (cube). The GL pipeline has its own rules, but in general it works like back to front rendering. Each pixel drawn is put on top of what is already there. For example, the default state of GEM fills the entire view with black pixels. After that any geometry renders on top of those black pixels (alpha blending will give a mixture of the existing and new pixel). Objects like rotate and translate manipulate various GL matrices and those matrices are used by the graphics card to render the geometry in the correct orientation. Matrices are reset for each frame and the processes are additive (translate) or multiplicative (scale) to the existing values. Texturing bridges the pix_ and GL objects together allowing for the image pixels to be applied to the geometry. The convention in GEM is to put the GL objects after the pix_ ones showing that once the pix_ processes are done on the CPU it is time for the GL processes on the GPU to start. You can place GL objects before the pix_ ones and still have it work. For example, the rotateXYZ can be right after the gemhead and before pix_ objects as it just sets a matrix transform up for all of the GL rendering after it and the pix_ objects have nothing to do with it. There are lots of exceptions to Pd rules in GEM and there is really no way around them. It is kind of like learning English - I before E except after C, excepting all of those words that ignore the rule. On Wed, Mar 25, 2009 at 12:08 PM, John Harrison wrote: > > Perhaps I need some rules about how Gem is different than Pd in terms of > dataflow. So far it seems to me that a rendering chain in Gem shows > conections but does not reveal the order in which these connections are > processed i.e. if 3 objects are all connected to each other in a rendering > chain in Gem i.e. > > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From matju at artengine.ca Wed Mar 25 20:40:40 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 15:40:40 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] DIY GSoC: getting those projects done In-Reply-To: <4ccc82330903251034r7f794872ne4b24de550643eb2@mail.gmail.com> References: <774CBB5D-E9FE-44C6-B4A0-B37E543CC3C3@eds.org> <20090323130355.GA14055@mccormick.cx> <4ccc82330903251034r7f794872ne4b24de550643eb2@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 25 Mar 2009, error developer wrote: > i think it's not appropriate to compare pd to programmng languges I believe that even if we try to refrain to compare pd to programming languages, and refrain from calling it a programming language, it still will be compared to programming languages simply because it's used in the same way that programming languages are and is in direct competition with programming languages when deciding which tools to pick to do a certain job. Teaching Pd leads to the same kind of challenges as does any other programming language if you teach Pd for what it's good for. > we do call it a languge, but it's rather more corect to call it like and > visual engeneering environment whch hase a set of object or something > like that, There's nothing more correct in that, except perhaps politically correct, if that's what correctness is. That correctness is all about avoiding comparisons and doesn't lead to anything useful. > if you could at least compile them into some sort of binaries > - that would be a bit more comparable No, there are *plenty* of languages for which there is either no compilation involved, or the compilation process is completely hidden from the user, such that you never have to deal with compilation directly. (Pd's DSP has an almost-hidden compilation step, for example.) > ..and pd is not a virtual machine either This concept of compiling a programme to a certain kind of format in which the instructions are written down in a way similar to traditional machine languages... this is only incidental to what a programming language is, it doesn't make a programming language more real or anything. It's just a strategy for achieving the goal of running the programme... or more exactly, to run it more quickly than by using more obvious ways of executing a programme (that is, an interpreter). > that leads to flae wars like between tclers and lispers ..but to me both > are actually quite simpatic ;)) and i can see my self coding in both one > day .. If you know Tcl and Lisp and Perl and Ruby and Python and such, you know that the compilation aspect and the virtual machine stuff is very secondary. It's not shoved in your face like it is with C++ and Java. Yet those are true programming languages because of the degree of flexibility that they offer in solving problems. Then Pd is not much different from them... well, it is, and surely it's less flexible than those languages, but it's far above the threshold at which you start to have much more flexibility than using things that are not considered programming languages at all. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 25 19:28:50 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 14:28:50 -0400 Subject: [PD] OSCX or mrpeach/osc ? In-Reply-To: <1237983347.182230-15391@marvin6.daybyday.de> References: <1237983347.182230-15391@marvin6.daybyday.de> Message-ID: <9A0ABF11-EDCA-4A0C-AFCF-5D636DC6CAC8@eds.org> I'd use the mrpeach objects. oscx is much more limited and unmaintained, unless you want to maintain it :) .hc On Mar 25, 2009, at 8:15 AM, Alvaro wrote: > Hi, > > I'm working on a new patch that uses OSC. I've been using OSCX so > far, but then I came accross a page on pdpedia > that claims OSCX is no longer maintained, and that I should use > mrpeach's objects instead. SVN history seems to confirm this, but > then OSCX worksforme, is well documented, and there are plenty of > examples. > So, I don't want to step on anybody's toes, but what is the right > choice for a new project? The alternative, to build an abstraction > layer, would mean a lot of extra work. mrpeach are you there? > > alvarito > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- "It is convenient to imagine a power beyond us because that means we don't have to examine our own lives.", from "The Idols of Environmentalism", by Curtis White From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 25 19:27:50 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 14:27:50 -0400 Subject: [PD] What font does PD use? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <1B9FA9C5-EED1-47F0-9FCB-556EFCBF032F@eds.org> The classic is Courier bold. Pd-extended since 0.39.3 uses a normal weight font that is either Bitstream Vera Sans Mono on Windows and GNU/ Linux, and Monaco on Mac OS X. .hc On Mar 25, 2009, at 11:48 AM, Ben Baker-Smith wrote: > I'm working on some graphics for PdCon09 to potentially use for > promotional materials. > > Could someone tell me what font PD uses? Or at least a close > approximation? > > If it's not a regular font, does someone have a copy of the font file? > > Thanks, > -Ben > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- If you are not part of the solution, you are part of the problem. From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 25 19:25:32 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 14:25:32 -0400 Subject: [PD] still struggling with basic understanding of Gem dataflow In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: It would be great to have some of this documented better. I mentioned in the book sprint email that there are lots of Gem examples, but there isn't really any text that I could find that introduces these concepts of Gem. So if you do figure this stuff out, please join us for the book sprint, or point us to your findings so someone can write it up! .hc On Mar 25, 2009, at 1:17 PM, Ben Baker-Smith wrote: > Hi John, > > You are correct. Gem does not follow the normal top to bottom rules > of PD. I believe its render chain has more to do with the rules of > OpenGL than with PD. > > Sorry I can't give you an easy way of figuring which objects will be > processed first. If there is one then I've never heard/read it. > Keep experimenting. > > For more information on this, I recommend looking up the "a flawed > Gem" thread in the PD-List archives (and whatever thread that came > out of). > It'll give you some more information about Gem's relation to OpenGL > and some users frustration with similar situations as yours. > > I love using Gem, it's the environment I primarily work in when > using PD. However, it's a bit of a wild beast (at least to a non- > programmer like myself). > > Best of luck, > -Ben > > > > >[Gemhead] > >| > >[object 1] > >| > >[object 2] > >| > >[object 3] > > > >we cannot conclude that the output of [object 1] feeds the input of > [object > >2] and the output of [object 2] feeds the input of [object 3]. We > only know > >that the data will be processed by objects 1, 2 and 3 but not in > what order > >they will be processed. > > > >Further perhaps we cannot conclude that the output of an object is > actually > >the result of the object having processed the data. Demonstrating > this: in > >my patch example, [pix_buffer_write] outputs different data than it > stores, > >or examples 1 and 3 would be the same. > > > >And this leads me to a more general statement of my original > question: how > >can I determine the order in which objects are processed in Gem? > > > >And my specific example which started this thread: how would one > apply a > >rotation to an image, then apply [pix_rtx] to the rotated image? > > > >-John > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Programs should be written for people to read, and only incidentally for machines to execute. - from Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 25 19:38:37 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 14:38:37 -0400 Subject: [PD] words for style guide: rewind and reset Message-ID: Hey, I just went thru a bunch of interfaces and noticed a good pattern in wording. I propose to make this part of the style guide: rewind - go back to the beginning of a chunk of data (used in: textfile, binfile, msgfile, etc.) reset - clear the data from a container; or, go back to the initial state (used in: zexy/index, cyclone/MouseState, maxlib, etc.) .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- "[T]he greatest purveyor of violence in the world today [is] my own government." - Martin Luther King, Jr. From jancsika at yahoo.com Wed Mar 25 21:01:21 2009 From: jancsika at yahoo.com (Jonathan Wilkes) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 13:01:21 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <608206.73190.qm@web65606.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> --- On Wed, 3/25/09, Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > From: Mathieu Bouchard > Subject: Re: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( > To: "Hans-Christoph Steiner" > Cc: "Matt Barber" , pd-list at iem.at > Date: Wednesday, March 25, 2009, 5:48 PM > On Sat, 21 Mar 2009, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > > And one last little story that I just remembered: I > didn't realize that [send pd] was even a possibility > until recently. I had always seen [; pd dsp 1( and figured > messages to pd had to be sent that way. > > So is this a sign that this part of Pd is difficult, or a > sign that you didn't learn it at the beginning? What if > I teach that thing at the very beginning of a course? The > beginners may get themselves to think that it's a very > basic concept of pd, and won't understand your > recommendation to get it removed. > > Btw, it's in > pd/doc/2.control.examples/10.more.messages.pd , and I'd > have trouble considering anything in that folder as being > non-basic. > > The problem with removing unneeded words and concepts from > a course is that it doesn't prepare the students for the > world, it prepares the students for an exam (or for anything > else that happens within the class). Which means that once > they try to handle patches made outside of this little > world, it reveals those holes in their knowledge. > > Once that I giving some kind of crash course on pd, I said > that outlets are linked to inlets using lines, connections, > wires, cords or patchcords. Later I was told by a teacher > that it's wrong to do so and that I should only be > stating one word and use it consistently. Well, I disagree a > lot. I don't want to cultivate students in a bubble. If > they try to search mailing-list archives for something > related to patchcords, they really do have to search for > those five words in order to find everything, and then if > they talk to anyone outside of the course they have to be > able to communicate. It's the same deal for semicolons > imho. I understand the point of making that information available, but once you start describing a particular pd concept, don't you stick to one term for the sake of clarity? > > _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ > _____________________ ... > | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, > Qu?bec_______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From matju at artengine.ca Wed Mar 25 21:15:30 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 16:15:30 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( In-Reply-To: <608206.73190.qm@web65606.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> References: <608206.73190.qm@web65606.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 25 Mar 2009, Jonathan Wilkes wrote: > I understand the point of making that information available, but once > you start describing a particular pd concept, don't you stick to one > term for the sake of clarity? Well, ideally, perhaps... but I think that it's somewhat hard to do. Perhaps more so when teaching in French (or any other language apart from English), because then you have to deal both with the synonyms in French and the synonyms in English at the same time. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From matju at artengine.ca Wed Mar 25 21:27:41 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 16:27:41 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] stop animation/motion in pd/gem In-Reply-To: <68386.99652.qm@web32401.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <68386.99652.qm@web32401.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 19 Mar 2009, mark edward grimm wrote: > that looks pretty elegant and will give it a shot on linux machine... > BTW was wondering though if there are any plans to implement gridflow in > extended? it would benefit our freshmen students for ease of > installation/use on osx machines they now all run and i would love to > demo this "nerv_vid" example... That was planned and then postponed and in the end I don't know when it can happen. About debugging anything on OSX, I don't personally run anything else than Linux myself... it would be best if someone else could handle the OSX port of it. In the end, it would also be better if someone else could handle the inclusion in pd-extended, but it's more likely that I work on that one soon, than on OSX fixes. I could include any OSX fixes given to me on the gridflow-dev mailing-list or give commit access to people who want to make many contributions. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From lukexipd at gmail.com Wed Mar 25 22:16:28 2009 From: lukexipd at gmail.com (Luke Iannini) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 14:16:28 -0700 Subject: [PD] words for style guide: rewind and reset In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <7aaf8bb90903251416g5f007117t9c2b0765455b473e@mail.gmail.com> On Wed, Mar 25, 2009 at 11:38 AM, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > Hey, > > I just went thru a bunch of interfaces and noticed a good pattern in > wording. ?I propose to make this part of the style guide: > > rewind - go back to the beginning of a chunk of data > (used in: textfile, binfile, msgfile, etc.) > > reset - clear the data from a container; or, go back to the initial state > (used in: zexy/index, cyclone/MouseState, maxlib, etc.) thanx, agreed & noted! > > > .hc > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > "[T]he greatest purveyor of violence in the world today [is] my own > government." - Martin Luther King, Jr. > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > From marius.schebella at gmail.com Wed Mar 25 22:33:55 2009 From: marius.schebella at gmail.com (marius schebella) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 22:33:55 +0100 Subject: [PD] words for style guide: rewind and reset In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49CAA343.4090105@gmail.com> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > Hey, > > I just went thru a bunch of interfaces and noticed a good pattern in > wording. I propose to make this part of the style guide: > > rewind - go back to the beginning of a chunk of data > (used in: textfile, binfile, msgfile, etc.) > > reset - clear the data from a container; or, go back to the initial state > (used in: zexy/index, cyclone/MouseState, maxlib, etc.) "reset" should not be confused with "clear"... what about open vs. read vs. load? marius. From fbar at footils.org Wed Mar 25 22:37:33 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 22:37:33 +0100 Subject: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( In-Reply-To: References: <129520C8-D5DE-4FC5-869E-4BC4F1334564@eds.org> Message-ID: <20090325213733.GB16910@footils.org> Hallo, Mathieu Bouchard hat gesagt: // Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > Btw, it's in pd/doc/2.control.examples/10.more.messages.pd , and I'd have > trouble considering anything in that folder as being non-basic. I must say, when thinking about the time when I learned Pd that there is a lot to swallow at the beginning. I never could attend a workshop, so I learned by doing Pd, reading stuff and from help on this list. Now it's easier as there are many workshops all over, but I guess the "old timers" like me or Hans all learned Pd without a teacher. And 2.control.examples is not as much fun as 3.audio.examples, so the value of that directory wasn't clear to me immediatly. But what I did was simple: I read all the docs over and over. Again and again, and repeated that once every year at least. And with docs I explicitely include the html-docs, which is something many people seem to skip or only skim through once. Just like Hans it took me a while to understand the concept behind semicolon senders and how they are equivalent to [s something] and how ";pd dsp" is the same as [s pd] ... But once I got that, it opened up all kinds of neat patching tricks and made certain things much easier to do and to understand that I was struggling with before. Ciao -- Frank From marius.schebella at gmail.com Wed Mar 25 22:58:55 2009 From: marius.schebella at gmail.com (marius schebella) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 22:58:55 +0100 Subject: [PD] agenda for upcoming book sprint? In-Reply-To: <8DCD65A4-2A60-4E09-8AD0-14BCE8C147E0@eds.org> References: <8DCD65A4-2A60-4E09-8AD0-14BCE8C147E0@eds.org> Message-ID: <49CAA91F.5050109@gmail.com> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > Hey all, > > I hope I am not jumping the gun or stepping on anyone's toes. I just > wanted to open up the discussion about what people are planning on > working on during the upcoming book sprint. Currently, I am pretty open > to topics, but I was thinking that Gem/PDP/Gridflow could really use a > section. There are lots of examples for them, but they lack a good > intro to the concepts. I am in for a gem sprint. marius. > > .hc > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > News is what people want to keep hidden and everything else is > publicity. - Bill Moyers > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > From matju at artengine.ca Wed Mar 25 23:24:52 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 18:24:52 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( In-Reply-To: <20090325213733.GB16910@footils.org> References: <129520C8-D5DE-4FC5-869E-4BC4F1334564@eds.org> <20090325213733.GB16910@footils.org> Message-ID: On Wed, 25 Mar 2009, Frank Barknecht wrote: > Mathieu Bouchard hat gesagt: // Mathieu Bouchard wrote: >> Btw, it's in pd/doc/2.control.examples/10.more.messages.pd , and I'd have >> trouble considering anything in that folder as being non-basic. > I must say, when thinking about the time when I learned Pd that there is a lot > to swallow at the beginning. I never could attend a workshop, so I learned by > doing Pd, reading stuff and from help on this list. Now it's easier as there > are many workshops all over, but I guess the "old timers" like me or Hans all > learned Pd without a teacher. Well, I all learned without a teacher either... but then I had a strange path. In my first encounter with Pd, I started trying to port a large external library. Then a year later, I started trying Pd itself a bit. Then the following year I started reading the source code. And then I realised that I should really force myself to read the manual a bit. It makes it harder to relate to students for sure. Well, I don't think it's an all-or-nothing proposition. Section 2 is not there as something that must be finished learning before going somewhere else. Everybody will yawn at one part or another of that section, and eventually they figure out that they have to refresh themselves a bit. It's much easier to remember things that you can imagine having a use for, and so if you can't, then you need to develop that imagination so that you can help yourself remember more. (this is yet another example of why I needed to escape the math dept) > And 2.control.examples is not as much fun as 3.audio.examples, This is something that I hardly notice, as a programming languages theory enthusiast... even though pd is full of holes, it's so much different from everything else, that there's much that can be said about it and thought about it. And then my personal interest in music composition faded not long before I started to use Pd, and I've never quite been able to reconnect the two... so, that tends to tip the balance in direction of section 2... but I know what you mean. When I started a degree in computer programming, I couldn't understand why so few people thought it could be a good idea to learn programming by generating graphics. > But what I did was simple: I read all the docs over and over. Again and again, > and repeated that once every year at least. I should have read this part of your mail before replying above. I'm kinda repeating you. > Just like Hans it took me a while to understand the concept behind > semicolon senders and how they are equivalent to [s something] and how > ";pd dsp" is the same as [s pd] ... But once I got that, it opened up > all kinds of neat patching tricks and made certain things much easier to > do and to understand that I was struggling with before. It's not just that, it's also how that semicolon relates to the semicolons in [netsend], [qlist], the .pd file format, and dynamic patching. It all fits together. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 25 23:50:33 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 18:50:33 -0400 Subject: [PD] stop animation/motion in pd/gem In-Reply-To: References: <68386.99652.qm@web32401.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Mar 25, 2009, at 4:27 PM, Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > On Thu, 19 Mar 2009, mark edward grimm wrote: > >> that looks pretty elegant and will give it a shot on linux >> machine... BTW was wondering though if there are any plans to >> implement gridflow in extended? it would benefit our freshmen >> students for ease of installation/use on osx machines they now all >> run and i would love to demo this "nerv_vid" example... > > That was planned and then postponed and in the end I don't know when > it can happen. About debugging anything on OSX, I don't personally > run anything else than Linux myself... it would be best if someone > else could handle the OSX port of it. In the end, it would also be > better if someone else could handle the inclusion in pd-extended, > but it's more likely that I work on that one soon, than on OSX > fixes. I could include any OSX fixes given to me on the gridflow-dev > mailing-list or give commit access to people who want to make many > contributions. If you need an Mac OS X box to work on, send me an ssh key and I'll give you access to the build farm machine. A great and easier first start would be to release gridflow as a binary libdir for GNU/Linux and Mac OS X. .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- I have the audacity to believe that peoples everywhere can have three meals a day for their bodies, education and culture for their minds, and dignity, equality and freedom for their spirits. - Martin Luther King, Jr. From jancsika at yahoo.com Thu Mar 26 02:42:08 2009 From: jancsika at yahoo.com (Jonathan Wilkes) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 18:42:08 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <718787.81854.qm@web65615.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> --- On Wed, 3/25/09, Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > From: Mathieu Bouchard > Subject: Re: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( > To: "Jonathan Wilkes" > Cc: "Hans-Christoph Steiner" , "Matt Barber" , pd-list at iem.at > Date: Wednesday, March 25, 2009, 9:15 PM > On Wed, 25 Mar 2009, Jonathan Wilkes wrote: > > > I understand the point of making that information > available, but once you start describing a particular pd > concept, don't you stick to one term for the sake of > clarity? > > Well, ideally, perhaps... but I think that it's > somewhat hard to do. Perhaps more so when teaching in French > (or any other language apart from English), because then you > have to deal both with the synonyms in French and the > synonyms in English at the same time. At least in English, which is all I've taught in, it's merely a practical matter of using one consistent term instead of using many interchangeably. -Jonathan > > _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ > _____________________ ... > | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, > Qu?bec From matju at artengine.ca Thu Mar 26 03:07:05 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 22:07:05 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( In-Reply-To: <718787.81854.qm@web65615.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> References: <718787.81854.qm@web65615.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Wed, 25 Mar 2009, Jonathan Wilkes wrote: > --- On Wed, 3/25/09, Mathieu Bouchard wrote: >> Well, ideally, perhaps... but I think that it's >> somewhat hard to do. Perhaps more so when teaching in French >> (or any other language apart from English), because then you >> have to deal both with the synonyms in French and the >> synonyms in English at the same time. > At least in English, which is all I've taught in, it's merely a > practical matter of using one consistent term instead of using many > interchangeably. I know, but when using various materials that are using various different conventions, or when answering questions that have been asked using different words, it's hard to keep using the same word over and over. I see myself correcting students on the uses of words like objects vs classes, but that's not for the same reason at all, as this is for resolving the nameclash between "object" the synonym of "class" and "object" the other meanings of it. Since the synonyms for connections are not clashing with much of anything else in a significant way (perhaps "line" is...) it's not the same reason for correcting speech and I'm not quite used to that. OTOH, the upside to using words interchangeably is that people get used to the synonyms that they will have to use in real situations... even if I only accidentally use them. If I made a tutorial or a set of tutorials, I'd probably end up calling it by just one name, but if I'm using other people's tutorials together with mine, I'm probably not going to search and replace. Perhaps it's just that pd-list, pd-dev and #dataflow are extreme cases of people coming together with different words, and that I don't recall enough the last real course I taught... it's been a while. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From jancsika at yahoo.com Thu Mar 26 03:57:30 2009 From: jancsika at yahoo.com (Jonathan Wilkes) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 19:57:30 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <669447.24389.qm@web65614.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> --- On Thu, 3/26/09, Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > From: Mathieu Bouchard > Subject: Re: [PD] style guide idea: [send foo] versus [; foo( > To: "Jonathan Wilkes" > Cc: "Hans-Christoph Steiner" , "Matt Barber" , pd-list at iem.at > Date: Thursday, March 26, 2009, 3:07 AM > On Wed, 25 Mar 2009, Jonathan Wilkes wrote: > > > --- On Wed, 3/25/09, Mathieu Bouchard > wrote: > >> Well, ideally, perhaps... but I think that > it's > >> somewhat hard to do. Perhaps more so when teaching > in French > >> (or any other language apart from English), > because then you > >> have to deal both with the synonyms in French and > the > >> synonyms in English at the same time. > > At least in English, which is all I've taught in, > it's merely a practical matter of using one consistent > term instead of using many interchangeably. > > I know, but when using various materials that are using > various different conventions, or when answering questions > that have been asked using different words, it's hard to > keep using the same word over and over. I see myself > correcting students on the uses of words like objects vs > classes, but that's not for the same reason at all, as > this is for resolving the nameclash between > "object" the synonym of "class" and > "object" the other meanings of it. Since the > synonyms for connections are not clashing with much of > anything else in a significant way (perhaps "line" > is...) it's not the same reason for correcting speech > and I'm not quite used to that. > > OTOH, the upside to using words interchangeably is that > people get used to the synonyms that they will have to use > in real situations... even if I only accidentally use them. I'm responding mostly to your use of the term "crash course." In that context I think it's preferable to restrict terminology so that things like execution order, cold vs. hot inlet, etc. may take precedence. Getting used to synonyms is a trivial and common task that can be gleaned from looking at a list of synonyms, whereas the other concepts are specific to learning Pd and difficult to grasp. In fact, if there were a list of synonyms for common features/concepts in Pd, I think it would be as trivial as putting a link on a handout for the student. Then if people need to search the mailinglist later, they can just go to the list and simply try each possibility until they find what they're looking for. Is there something like this already? If not, I can start making one. -Jonathan > > If I made a tutorial or a set of tutorials, I'd > probably end up calling it by just one name, but if I'm > using other people's tutorials together with mine, > I'm probably not going to search and replace. > > Perhaps it's just that pd-list, pd-dev and #dataflow > are extreme cases of people coming together with different > words, and that I don't recall enough the last real > course I taught... it's been a while. > > _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ > _____________________ ... > | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, > Qu?bec From john.harrison at alum.mit.edu Thu Mar 26 02:07:08 2009 From: john.harrison at alum.mit.edu (John Harrison) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 20:07:08 -0500 Subject: [PD] still struggling with basic understanding of Gem dataflow In-Reply-To: References: <49C935F9.5080100@alum.mit.edu> <7aa995dd0903250908r469991d7s32b9dc5739a8d1df@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49CAD53C.1080702@alum.mit.edu> This is extremely helpful. I'm starting to "get" it. Comments/questions inline. chris clepper wrote: > There are two types of objects in GEM: pix and OpenGL. > > Pix objects do work in the top to bottom manner like Pd DSP objects. would [pix_coordinate] be an exception to this? I've been playing with it and it seems to behave the way you have described OpenGL objects and not GEM objects. I read the help patch about [pix_texture] reassigning the coordinate values, but that still didn't explain all the behavior I was seeing. > The convention in GEM is to put the GL objects after the pix_ ones > showing that once the pix_ processes are done on the CPU it is time > for the GL processes on the GPU to start. I understand you to be saying that the GL processes will always be applied after the pix_ processes. If that is the case, then it sounds like there is no way to have [rotateXYZ] applied before [pix_rtx]. Makes sense. For the more general case, is it correct that there is no way in GEM to give an arbitrary rotation of an image as input to a pix_ object since there is no Gem pix_ object with arbitrary rotation function? Figuring that might be the case, I tried to build [pix_rotate] using [pix_coordinate]...and this led me to the question about about [pix_coordinate] Using pdp_rotate, pix_2gem and gem2pdp, I did successfully build a pix_ rotator. On the chance it might be helpful to see, I attached a demo patch which feeds a rotated video stream to [pix_rtx] then rotates the stream back to the way it was. While it more-or-less works it seems a bit scabby. Is there a better way? > > > There are lots of exceptions to Pd rules in GEM and there is really no > way around them. It is kind of like learning English - I before E > except after C, excepting all of those words that ignore the rule. As long as I can make sense of what the rules are, which objects break them, and some rough idea as to why, I'm cool with that. Thank you again for your help. As Hans suggests, I'd like to find a way to help organize, then share this information, whether it be on the wiki or in some other meaningful way. -John -------------- next part -------------- An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: rotate-rtx-rotate.pd URL: From purengo at gmail.com Thu Mar 26 04:17:31 2009 From: purengo at gmail.com (Nicanor Garcia) Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 22:17:31 -0500 Subject: [PD] Darwiin Remote OSC and PD, on Mac Message-ID: <5f57e84f0903252017n316ca6al7570f3bae27f32f4@mail.gmail.com> Hello. I need some help trying to connect Darwiinremote ( http://code.google.com/p/darwiinosc/downloads/list) Mac program to PD in a friend's computer. I'm tryining to connect it through OSC, but I can't get the PD to receive anything. I set up the same port in both programs, but I think I'm missing the address. In Linux, which I use in my computer, I had to use "localhost" as the address but I don't know what to use in Mac. I already googled and found nothing quickly and I'm really in a hurry as I have to set up that for a very important project. Thank you very much and sorry about my english as is not my first language. Nicanor. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From marius.schebella at gmail.com Thu Mar 26 04:55:26 2009 From: marius.schebella at gmail.com (marius schebella) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 04:55:26 +0100 Subject: [PD] Darwiin Remote OSC and PD, on Mac In-Reply-To: <5f57e84f0903252017n316ca6al7570f3bae27f32f4@mail.gmail.com> References: <5f57e84f0903252017n316ca6al7570f3bae27f32f4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49CAFCAE.6030607@gmail.com> you can connect to localhost on port 3333 for example. try [dumpOSC 3333] inside pd and connect a [print] to it to see if you receive your values. marius. Nicanor Garcia wrote: > Hello. > > I need some help trying to connect Darwiinremote > (http://code.google.com/p/darwiinosc/downloads/list) Mac program to PD > in a friend's computer. > > I'm tryining to connect it through OSC, but I can't get the PD to > receive anything. > > I set up the same port in both programs, but I think I'm missing the > address. > > In Linux, which I use in my computer, I had to use "localhost" as the > address but I don't know what to use in Mac. > > I already googled and found nothing quickly and I'm really in a hurry as > I have to set up that for a very important project. > > Thank you very much and sorry about my english as is not my first language. > > Nicanor. > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From marius.schebella at gmail.com Thu Mar 26 05:46:02 2009 From: marius.schebella at gmail.com (marius schebella) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 05:46:02 +0100 Subject: [PD] still struggling with basic understanding of Gem dataflow In-Reply-To: <49CAD53C.1080702@alum.mit.edu> References: <49C935F9.5080100@alum.mit.edu> <7aa995dd0903250908r469991d7s32b9dc5739a8d1df@mail.gmail.com> <49CAD53C.1080702@alum.mit.edu> Message-ID: <49CB088A.8040103@gmail.com> hi, I think your pix_coordinate idea was not that bad (see attached patch). but that is probably not what you want?? on the other hand, using pdp_rotate and converting twice is really eating up a lot of cpu. pdp is a different world again and the bridge between pdp and gem is buggy (your patch crashed my computer for example). but again, as chris said. there is a difference between rotating the content of the pix data and rotating the geometry that this data is mapped to. so the second patch shows, what I think you really want. rotate an image and then feed this into your pix_rtx. marius. John Harrison wrote: > This is extremely helpful. I'm starting to "get" it. Comments/questions > inline. > > chris clepper wrote: >> There are two types of objects in GEM: pix and OpenGL. >> Pix objects do work in the top to bottom manner like Pd DSP objects. > would [pix_coordinate] be an exception to this? I've been playing with > it and it seems to behave the way you have described OpenGL objects and > not GEM objects. I read the help patch about [pix_texture] reassigning > the coordinate values, but that still didn't explain all the behavior I > was seeing. >> The convention in GEM is to put the GL objects after the pix_ ones >> showing that once the pix_ processes are done on the CPU it is time >> for the GL processes on the GPU to start. > I understand you to be saying that the GL processes will always be > applied after the pix_ processes. If that is the case, then it sounds > like there is no way to have [rotateXYZ] applied before [pix_rtx]. Makes > sense. > > For the more general case, is it correct that there is no way in GEM to > give an arbitrary rotation of an image as input to a pix_ object since > there is no Gem pix_ object with arbitrary rotation function? > > Figuring that might be the case, I tried to build [pix_rotate] using > [pix_coordinate]...and this led me to the question about about > [pix_coordinate] > > Using pdp_rotate, pix_2gem and gem2pdp, I did successfully build a pix_ > rotator. On the chance it might be helpful to see, I attached a demo > patch which feeds a rotated video stream to [pix_rtx] then rotates the > stream back to the way it was. While it more-or-less works it seems a > bit scabby. Is there a better way? >> >> >> There are lots of exceptions to Pd rules in GEM and there is really no >> way around them. It is kind of like learning English - I before E >> except after C, excepting all of those words that ignore the rule. > As long as I can make sense of what the rules are, which objects break > them, and some rough idea as to why, I'm cool with that. > > Thank you again for your help. As Hans suggests, I'd like to find a way > to help organize, then share this information, whether it be on the wiki > or in some other meaningful way. > > -John > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: rtx_sch.pd Type: application/x-extension-pd Size: 4177 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: rtx_sch2.pd Type: application/x-extension-pd Size: 1566 bytes Desc: not available URL: From Simon.Kilshaw at rwcmd.ac.uk Thu Mar 26 08:09:06 2009 From: Simon.Kilshaw at rwcmd.ac.uk (Simon Kilshaw) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 07:09:06 -0000 Subject: [PD] Darwiin Remote OSC and PD, on Mac References: Message-ID: Hey, For my part, when I use Darwiinmote OSC on the mac it kicks out on port 5600. So I use the object DumpOSC 5600. Happy to share patch if you like. puredata at rwcmd.ac.uk Simon Kilshaw Lecturer in Music Technology RWCMD Message: 4 Date: Wed, 25 Mar 2009 22:17:31 -0500 From: Nicanor Garcia Subject: [PD] Darwiin Remote OSC and PD, on Mac To: pd-list at iem.at Message-ID: <5f57e84f0903252017n316ca6al7570f3bae27f32f4 at mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Hello. I need some help trying to connect Darwiinremote ( http://code.google.com/p/darwiinosc/downloads/list) Mac program to PD in a friend's computer. I'm tryining to connect it through OSC, but I can't get the PD to receive anything. I set up the same port in both programs, but I think I'm missing the address. In Linux, which I use in my computer, I had to use "localhost" as the address but I don't know what to use in Mac. I already googled and found nothing quickly and I'm really in a hurry as I have to set up that for a very important project. Thank you very much and sorry about my english as is not my first language. Nicanor. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 04:55:26 +0100 From: marius schebella Subject: Re: [PD] Darwiin Remote OSC and PD, on Mac To: Nicanor Garcia Cc: pd-list at iem.at Message-ID: <49CAFCAE.6030607 at gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed you can connect to localhost on port 3333 for example. try [dumpOSC 3333] inside pd and connect a [print] to it to see if you receive your values. marius. Nicanor Garcia wrote: > Hello. > > I need some help trying to connect Darwiinremote > (http://code.google.com/p/darwiinosc/downloads/list) Mac program to PD > in a friend's computer. > > I'm tryining to connect it through OSC, but I can't get the PD to > receive anything. > > I set up the same port in both programs, but I think I'm missing the > address. > > In Linux, which I use in my computer, I had to use "localhost" as the > address but I don't know what to use in Mac. > > I already googled and found nothing quickly and I'm really in a hurry as > I have to set up that for a very important project. > > Thank you very much and sorry about my english as is not my first language. > > Nicanor. > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ------------------------------ Message: 6 Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 05:46:02 +0100 From: marius schebella Subject: Re: [PD] still struggling with basic understanding of Gem dataflow To: John Harrison Cc: pd-list , John Harrison Message-ID: <49CB088A.8040103 at gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"; Format="flowed" hi, I think your pix_coordinate idea was not that bad (see attached patch). but that is probably not what you want?? on the other hand, using pdp_rotate and converting twice is really eating up a lot of cpu. pdp is a different world again and the bridge between pdp and gem is buggy (your patch crashed my computer for example). but again, as chris said. there is a difference between rotating the content of the pix data and rotating the geometry that this data is mapped to. so the second patch shows, what I think you really want. rotate an image and then feed this into your pix_rtx. marius. John Harrison wrote: > This is extremely helpful. I'm starting to "get" it. Comments/questions > inline. > > chris clepper wrote: >> There are two types of objects in GEM: pix and OpenGL. >> Pix objects do work in the top to bottom manner like Pd DSP objects. > would [pix_coordinate] be an exception to this? I've been playing with > it and it seems to behave the way you have described OpenGL objects and > not GEM objects. I read the help patch about [pix_texture] reassigning > the coordinate values, but that still didn't explain all the behavior I > was seeing. >> The convention in GEM is to put the GL objects after the pix_ ones >> showing that once the pix_ processes are done on the CPU it is time >> for the GL processes on the GPU to start. > I understand you to be saying that the GL processes will always be > applied after the pix_ processes. If that is the case, then it sounds > like there is no way to have [rotateXYZ] applied before [pix_rtx]. Makes > sense. > > For the more general case, is it correct that there is no way in GEM to > give an arbitrary rotation of an image as input to a pix_ object since > there is no Gem pix_ object with arbitrary rotation function? > > Figuring that might be the case, I tried to build [pix_rotate] using > [pix_coordinate]...and this led me to the question about about > [pix_coordinate] > > Using pdp_rotate, pix_2gem and gem2pdp, I did successfully build a pix_ > rotator. On the chance it might be helpful to see, I attached a demo > patch which feeds a rotated video stream to [pix_rtx] then rotates the > stream back to the way it was. While it more-or-less works it seems a > bit scabby. Is there a better way? >> >> >> There are lots of exceptions to Pd rules in GEM and there is really no >> way around them. It is kind of like learning English - I before E >> except after C, excepting all of those words that ignore the rule. > As long as I can make sense of what the rules are, which objects break > them, and some rough idea as to why, I'm cool with that. > > Thank you again for your help. As Hans suggests, I'd like to find a way > to help organize, then share this information, whether it be on the wiki > or in some other meaningful way. > > -John > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: rtx_sch.pd Type: application/x-extension-pd Size: 4177 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: rtx_sch2.pd Type: application/x-extension-pd Size: 1566 bytes Desc: not available URL: ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ Pd-list mailing list Pd-list at iem.at to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list End of Pd-list Digest, Vol 48, Issue 131 **************************************** -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: application/ms-tnef Size: 5858 bytes Desc: not available URL: From jancsika at yahoo.com Thu Mar 26 08:58:48 2009 From: jancsika at yahoo.com (Jonathan Wilkes) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 00:58:48 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] DIY GSoC: getting those projects done In-Reply-To: Message-ID: <475768.89279.qm@web65603.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> --- On Wed, 3/25/09, Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > From: Mathieu Bouchard > Subject: Re: [PD] DIY GSoC: getting those projects done > To: "Chris McCormick" > Cc: "Pd List" > Date: Wednesday, March 25, 2009, 6:01 PM > On Mon, 23 Mar 2009, Chris McCormick wrote: > > > IIRC, one of their complaints from last year was that > our application had too many parts. Next time we should pick > just one or two specific tasks and go with them. Maybe with > a community vote or whatever. Also, I hate to be cynical, > but I can't see any way even remotely in which Google > could use Pd to make a profit. ;) Thanks for your huge > effort anyway, Hans and Georg. > > It's not just that, it's that Pd is still > relatively non-mainstream. I can imagine plenty (or even > most) of programmers being allergic to Pd and thinking > it's messy, difficult to program with, and generally an > exercise in contorsion. I mean, what do you do with a > language that has no builtin [demux] (that's called an > if-else anywhere else) Does [expr~ if ( $f2 == 0, $v1, 0 ); etc.] fill that role? (If so, it certainly strengthens your following point.) -Jonathan , in which hot-vs-cold is troublesome > (else [expr] wouldn't be *so* attractive), etc.; if > programmers that don't use pd had a better opinion of > pd, some things like this could have more of a chance. > That's when supposing Google is trying to stay neutral > and not selecting for profit. Else it's an ever harder > game, I suppose. > > _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ > _____________________ ... > | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, > Qu?bec_______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From matohawk at gmail.com Thu Mar 26 10:43:51 2009 From: matohawk at gmail.com (thomas thiery) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 10:43:51 +0100 Subject: [PD] Gem-0.91-3 pd 0.42-4 Message-ID: <18d6a40d0903260243l70b72bc3u19f84be85a6cc11a@mail.gmail.com> Hello IOhannes, I use this source of Gem, is it the last? http://downloads.sourceforge.net/pd-gem/gem-0.91-3.tar.gz?use_mirror=heanet Cheers Thomas -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From purengo at gmail.com Thu Mar 26 12:03:16 2009 From: purengo at gmail.com (Nicanor Garcia) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 06:03:16 -0500 Subject: [PD] Darwiin Remote OSC and PD, on Mac In-Reply-To: <49CAFCAE.6030607@gmail.com> References: <5f57e84f0903252017n316ca6al7570f3bae27f32f4@mail.gmail.com> <49CAFCAE.6030607@gmail.com> Message-ID: <5f57e84f0903260403g305d3ac6ke94b006dedda4ebd@mail.gmail.com> 2009/3/25 marius schebella > you can connect to localhost on port 3333 for example. try [dumpOSC 3333] > inside pd and connect a [print] to it to see if you receive your values. > marius. > I tried that with port 2222 but aparently it didn't work, but I'm not sure if I checked well. I'm going to check again today. But I would like to know if there is any other problem. Thank you very much. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From martin.peach at sympatico.ca Thu Mar 26 14:08:47 2009 From: martin.peach at sympatico.ca (Martin Peach) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 09:08:47 -0400 Subject: [PD] Darwiin Remote OSC and PD, on Mac In-Reply-To: <5f57e84f0903260403g305d3ac6ke94b006dedda4ebd@mail.gmail.com> References: <5f57e84f0903252017n316ca6al7570f3bae27f32f4@mail.gmail.com> <49CAFCAE.6030607@gmail.com> <5f57e84f0903260403g305d3ac6ke94b006dedda4ebd@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Nicanor Garcia wrote: > 2009/3/25 marius schebella > > > you can connect to localhost on port 3333 for example. try [dumpOSC > 3333] inside pd and connect a [print] to it to see if you receive > your values. > marius. > > I tried that with port 2222 but aparently it didn't work, but I'm not > sure if I checked well. > I'm going to check again today. But I would like to know if there is any > other problem. Well obviously you also need to know the IP address of the computer you are sending to. (On the receiving machine, try /sbin/ifconfig in a terminal, or look in System Preferences->Network.) Martin From john.harrison at alum.mit.edu Thu Mar 26 13:05:40 2009 From: john.harrison at alum.mit.edu (John Harrison) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 07:05:40 -0500 Subject: [PD] still struggling with basic understanding of Gem dataflow In-Reply-To: <49CB088A.8040103@gmail.com> References: <49C935F9.5080100@alum.mit.edu> <7aa995dd0903250908r469991d7s32b9dc5739a8d1df@mail.gmail.com> <49CAD53C.1080702@alum.mit.edu> <49CB088A.8040103@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49CB6F94.1030806@alum.mit.edu> This is fantastic! Thank you Marius for taking the time to build these patches. rtx_sch2.pd exactly answered my question and shows beautifully how to perform a set of OpenGL operations on the content of some pix_ data before applying more pix_ operations. The patch makes total sense. I'm still playing with it to make sure I fully grasp all parts. I really appreciate this help. -John marius schebella wrote: > hi, > I think your pix_coordinate idea was not that bad (see attached patch). > but that is probably not what you want?? > on the other hand, using pdp_rotate and converting twice is really > eating up a lot of cpu. pdp is a different world again and the bridge > between pdp and gem is buggy (your patch crashed my computer for > example). > but again, as chris said. there is a difference between rotating the > content of the pix data and rotating the geometry that this data is > mapped to. > so the second patch shows, what I think you really want. rotate an > image and then feed this into your pix_rtx. > marius. > > John Harrison wrote: >> This is extremely helpful. I'm starting to "get" it. >> Comments/questions inline. >> >> chris clepper wrote: >>> There are two types of objects in GEM: pix and OpenGL. >>> Pix objects do work in the top to bottom manner like Pd DSP objects. >> would [pix_coordinate] be an exception to this? I've been playing >> with it and it seems to behave the way you have described OpenGL >> objects and not GEM objects. I read the help patch about >> [pix_texture] reassigning the coordinate values, but that still >> didn't explain all the behavior I was seeing. >>> The convention in GEM is to put the GL objects after the pix_ ones >>> showing that once the pix_ processes are done on the CPU it is time >>> for the GL processes on the GPU to start. >> I understand you to be saying that the GL processes will always be >> applied after the pix_ processes. If that is the case, then it sounds >> like there is no way to have [rotateXYZ] applied before [pix_rtx]. >> Makes sense. >> >> For the more general case, is it correct that there is no way in GEM >> to give an arbitrary rotation of an image as input to a pix_ object >> since there is no Gem pix_ object with arbitrary rotation function? >> >> Figuring that might be the case, I tried to build [pix_rotate] using >> [pix_coordinate]...and this led me to the question about about >> [pix_coordinate] >> >> Using pdp_rotate, pix_2gem and gem2pdp, I did successfully build a >> pix_ rotator. On the chance it might be helpful to see, I attached a >> demo patch which feeds a rotated video stream to [pix_rtx] then >> rotates the stream back to the way it was. While it more-or-less >> works it seems a bit scabby. Is there a better way? >>> >>> >>> There are lots of exceptions to Pd rules in GEM and there is really >>> no way around them. It is kind of like learning English - I before >>> E except after C, excepting all of those words that ignore the rule. >> As long as I can make sense of what the rules are, which objects >> break them, and some rough idea as to why, I'm cool with that. >> >> Thank you again for your help. As Hans suggests, I'd like to find a >> way to help organize, then share this information, whether it be on >> the wiki or in some other meaningful way. >> >> -John >> > From zmoelnig at iem.at Thu Mar 26 15:14:07 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?IOhannes_m_zm=F6lnig?=) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 15:14:07 +0100 Subject: [PD] Gem-0.91-3 pd 0.42-4 In-Reply-To: <18d6a40d0903260243l70b72bc3u19f84be85a6cc11a@mail.gmail.com> References: <18d6a40d0903260243l70b72bc3u19f84be85a6cc11a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49CB8DAF.5080906@iem.at> thomas thiery wrote: > Hello IOhannes, > > I use this source of Gem, is it the last? > http://downloads.sourceforge.net/pd-gem/gem-0.91-3.tar.gz?use_mirror=heanet > it's the last official release (which does not take the peculiarities of 0.42 into account) however, the latest and greatest sources are always available via our version control system (subversion https://pd-gem.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/pd-gem/trunk/Gem) mfga.sdr IOhannes From matohawk at gmail.com Thu Mar 26 15:36:46 2009 From: matohawk at gmail.com (thomas thiery) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 15:36:46 +0100 Subject: [PD] Gem-0.91-3 pd 0.42-4 In-Reply-To: <49CB8DAF.5080906@iem.at> References: <18d6a40d0903260243l70b72bc3u19f84be85a6cc11a@mail.gmail.com> <49CB8DAF.5080906@iem.at> Message-ID: <18d6a40d0903260736kbea3fb7r80ed9a191dd09c26@mail.gmail.com> Thank you, I test the compilation and I have this error when I compile g++ -c -g -O2 -fPIC -freg-struct-return -Os -falign-loops=32 -falign-functions=32 -falign-jumps=32 -funroll-loops -ffast-math -mmmx -fpascal-strings -I.. -I/Applications/Pd-0.42-4.app/Contents/Resources/src glew.cpp -o ../Objects/glew.o glew.cpp: In function ?void* NSGLGetProcAddress(const GLubyte*)?: glew.cpp:80: warning: ?NSAddImage? is deprecated (declared at /usr/include/mach-o/dyld.h:230) glew.cpp:80: warning: ?NSAddImage? is deprecated (declared at /usr/include/mach-o/dyld.h:230) glew.cpp:83: error: invalid conversion from ?void*? to ?char*? glew.cpp:89: warning: ?NSLookupSymbolInImage? is deprecated (declared at /usr/include/mach-o/dyld.h:182) glew.cpp:89: warning: ?NSLookupSymbolInImage? is deprecated (declared at /usr/include/mach-o/dyld.h:182) glew.cpp:91: warning: ?NSAddressOfSymbol? is deprecated (declared at /usr/include/mach-o/dyld.h:188) glew.cpp:91: warning: ?NSAddressOfSymbol? is deprecated (declared at /usr/include/mach-o/dyld.h:188) make[1]: *** [glew.o] Error 1 make: *** [Base] Error 2 I can't make an interpretation of this 2009/3/26 IOhannes m zm?lnig > thomas thiery wrote: > > Hello IOhannes, > > > > I use this source of Gem, is it the last? > > > http://downloads.sourceforge.net/pd-gem/gem-0.91-3.tar.gz?use_mirror=heanet > > > > it's the last official release (which does not take the peculiarities of > 0.42 into account) > > however, the latest and greatest sources are always available via our > version control system (subversion > https://pd-gem.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/pd-gem/trunk/Gem) > > mfga.sdr > IOhannes > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -- Matohawk production http://matohawkitongroup.free.fr -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From matju at artengine.ca Thu Mar 26 15:42:25 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 10:42:25 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] DIY GSoC: getting those projects done In-Reply-To: <475768.89279.qm@web65603.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> References: <475768.89279.qm@web65603.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: On Thu, 26 Mar 2009, Jonathan Wilkes wrote: > --- On Wed, 3/25/09, Mathieu Bouchard wrote: >> I mean, what do you do with a language that has no builtin [demux] >> (that's called an if-else anywhere else) > Does [expr~ if ( $f2 == 0, $v1, 0 ); etc.] fill that role? When processing just pd signals, a real conditional execution is done by [switch~] or [block~] and can only be applied on full subpatches. The [expr~ if] does compute both clauses of the "if", and then discards one of the results. This means that if a clause whose result gets discarded would cause an error, it will. The only difference between that and just multiplying one of the results by 0, is when one of the clauses is "infinite" or "NaN", then multiplying it by 0 won't cancel it. And then, that if() can only happen inside of [expr~]'s world, and so has no direct impact on other objects. But I was more thinking of the message-system. In that case, [spigot] is an if-statement in which execution is really conditional: a "block of code" being a connection from an outlet to a bunch of objects that do something when you send them a message, then [spigot] decides whether something happens or not, in a generic way. [select], [route] and [moses] are special-case if-statements. The if-else statements require a pair of [spigot]s and a [==]. This could be put in an abstraction, a total of six objects, and named demux2.pd or spigot2.pd, but no, Pd bundles absolutely no abstractions, and though the code for this very common case is just a few lines away from [spigot], Pd is still without it. > (If so, it certainly strengthens your following point.) >> , in which hot-vs-cold is troublesome (else [expr] wouldn't be *so* >> attractive), etc. No, this was about how [expr] can be a replacement for even a small network of objects. If you make an abstraction that does ($f1-$f2)*($f5-$f4)/($f3-$f2)+$f4, with just [+] [-] [*] [/] for example, then if you change some things in the cold inlets, the changes might not propagate to the bottom. This means you have to add a [pack 0 0 0 0 0] of the whole thing and [unpack 0 0 0 0 0] to ensure every hot-inlet is retriggered in the proper order. Actually, in this pack/unpack dance, maybe you can skip the hot-inlet of the abstraction (?), but apart from that, you're pretty stuck using pack/unpack if you want life to be simple. Else you can weave a mess of [t b f] objects like a spider on caffeine. That's what I mean. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From fbar at footils.org Thu Mar 26 15:58:51 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 15:58:51 +0100 Subject: [PD] DIY GSoC: getting those projects done In-Reply-To: References: <475768.89279.qm@web65603.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20090326145851.GA19965@footils.org> Hallo, Mathieu Bouchard hat gesagt: // Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > The if-else statements require a pair of [spigot]s and a [==]. A bit shorter, less effective and because of list-conversion not fully transparent, but still handy is this idiom: [list prepend 0] | [route 0 1] Send 0 and 1 to the prepend's right inlet to switch outlets. It becomes more useful with more choices. Ciao -- Frank From vboehm at gmx.ch Thu Mar 26 16:10:47 2009 From: vboehm at gmx.ch (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?volker_b=F6hm?=) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 16:10:47 +0100 Subject: [PD] steep filter? In-Reply-To: References: <161320dd0903151037u6caa3f54p3ac85c7f5546d303@mail.gmail.com> <161320dd0903151102s1346f4d2kdfb0f94593ea8e28@mail.gmail.com> <20090316082528.GB15510@footils.org> <09F4BF18-F737-4473-BC61-B05177A97466@gmx.ch> Message-ID: On 24 Mar 2009, at 14:26, Jo?o Pais wrote: > I have a question: are your externals included in pd-ext? that is, > can they be downloaded with the latest nightly builds? I would > advise you to get them into "the system", so that it's garanteed > that (almost) everyone has them automatically. hm, i'm certainly not against this idea, as i'm not opposed to sharing what i've done, if it is interesting for others. but i don't use pd-extended myself a a lot and actually i don't know the process of "getting externals into the system". also, i don't know about the policy of pd-extended or where it's aiming at, but i guess that the externals that get in there, must have somehow proven to be useful to many users. volker. From matju at artengine.ca Thu Mar 26 16:55:17 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 11:55:17 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] DIY GSoC: getting those projects done In-Reply-To: <20090326145851.GA19965@footils.org> References: <475768.89279.qm@web65603.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> <20090326145851.GA19965@footils.org> Message-ID: On Thu, 26 Mar 2009, Frank Barknecht wrote: > A bit shorter, less effective and because of list-conversion not fully > transparent, but still handy is this idiom: > [list prepend 0] > | > [route 0 1] > Send 0 and 1 to the prepend's right inlet to switch outlets. It becomes more > useful with more choices. Interesting, but I very very much expect a demuxer to be generic enough to apply uniformly to all selectors even "list". This disqualifies pretty much everything with [list] and [route] in them, as both have special cases for list-selectors that are hard to compensate for. I definitely don't want to be programming like that. When I think about getting the a message to the right place, I want to do so without having to think about the content of the message... especially for something as common as a list selector. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From matohawk at gmail.com Thu Mar 26 17:43:07 2009 From: matohawk at gmail.com (thomas thiery) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 17:43:07 +0100 Subject: [PD] Gem-0.91-3 pd 0.42-4 In-Reply-To: References: <18d6a40d0903260243l70b72bc3u19f84be85a6cc11a@mail.gmail.com> <49CB8DAF.5080906@iem.at> <18d6a40d0903260736kbea3fb7r80ed9a191dd09c26@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <18d6a40d0903260943m456fb24g4a23a3f760beb9a4@mail.gmail.com> no I have this line 2009/3/26 Matthias Neuenhofer > in the glew.ccp line 83 the (char*) is missing before malloc > > symbolName = (char*)malloc(strlen((const char*)name) + 2); > > > matthias > Am 26.03.2009 um 15:36 schrieb thomas thiery: > > Thank you, > I test the compilation and I have this error when I compile > > g++ -c -g -O2 -fPIC -freg-struct-return -Os -falign-loops=32 > -falign-functions=32 -falign-jumps=32 -funroll-loops -ffast-math -mmmx > -fpascal-strings -I.. > -I/Applications/Pd-0.42-4.app/Contents/Resources/src glew.cpp -o > ../Objects/glew.o > glew.cpp: In function ?void* NSGLGetProcAddress(const GLubyte*)?: > glew.cpp:80: warning: ?NSAddImage? is deprecated (declared at > /usr/include/mach-o/dyld.h:230) > glew.cpp:80: warning: ?NSAddImage? is deprecated (declared at > /usr/include/mach-o/dyld.h:230) > glew.cpp:83: error: invalid conversion from ?void*? to ?char*? > glew.cpp:89: warning: ?NSLookupSymbolInImage? is deprecated (declared at > /usr/include/mach-o/dyld.h:182) > glew.cpp:89: warning: ?NSLookupSymbolInImage? is deprecated (declared at > /usr/include/mach-o/dyld.h:182) > glew.cpp:91: warning: ?NSAddressOfSymbol? is deprecated (declared at > /usr/include/mach-o/dyld.h:188) > glew.cpp:91: warning: ?NSAddressOfSymbol? is deprecated (declared at > /usr/include/mach-o/dyld.h:188) > make[1]: *** [glew.o] Error 1 > make: *** [Base] Error 2 > > > I can't make an interpretation of this > > 2009/3/26 IOhannes m zm?lnig > >> thomas thiery wrote: >> > Hello IOhannes, >> > >> > I use this source of Gem, is it the last? >> > >> http://downloads.sourceforge.net/pd-gem/gem-0.91-3.tar.gz?use_mirror=heanet >> > >> >> it's the last official release (which does not take the peculiarities of >> 0.42 into account) >> >> however, the latest and greatest sources are always available via our >> version control system (subversion >> https://pd-gem.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/pd-gem/trunk/Gem) >> >> mfga.sdr >> IOhannes >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> > > > > -- > Matohawk production > http://matohawkitongroup.free.fr > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > -- Matohawk production http://matohawkitongroup.free.fr -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From matthias at neuenhofer.de Thu Mar 26 17:33:05 2009 From: matthias at neuenhofer.de (Matthias Neuenhofer) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 17:33:05 +0100 Subject: [PD] Gem-0.91-3 pd 0.42-4 In-Reply-To: <18d6a40d0903260736kbea3fb7r80ed9a191dd09c26@mail.gmail.com> References: <18d6a40d0903260243l70b72bc3u19f84be85a6cc11a@mail.gmail.com> <49CB8DAF.5080906@iem.at> <18d6a40d0903260736kbea3fb7r80ed9a191dd09c26@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: in the glew.ccp line 83 the (char*) is missing before malloc symbolName = (char*)malloc(strlen((const char*)name) + 2); matthias Am 26.03.2009 um 15:36 schrieb thomas thiery: > Thank you, > I test the compilation and I have this error when I compile > > g++ -c -g -O2 -fPIC -freg-struct-return -Os -falign-loops=32 - > falign-functions=32 -falign-jumps=32 -funroll-loops -ffast-math - > mmmx -fpascal-strings -I.. -I/Applications/Pd-0.42-4.app/Contents/ > Resources/src glew.cpp -o ../Objects/glew.o > glew.cpp: In function ?void* NSGLGetProcAddress(const GLubyte*)?: > glew.cpp:80: warning: ?NSAddImage? is deprecated (declared at /usr/ > include/mach-o/dyld.h:230) > glew.cpp:80: warning: ?NSAddImage? is deprecated (declared at /usr/ > include/mach-o/dyld.h:230) > glew.cpp:83: error: invalid conversion from ?void*? to ?char*? > glew.cpp:89: warning: ?NSLookupSymbolInImage? is deprecated > (declared at /usr/include/mach-o/dyld.h:182) > glew.cpp:89: warning: ?NSLookupSymbolInImage? is deprecated > (declared at /usr/include/mach-o/dyld.h:182) > glew.cpp:91: warning: ?NSAddressOfSymbol? is deprecated (declared > at /usr/include/mach-o/dyld.h:188) > glew.cpp:91: warning: ?NSAddressOfSymbol? is deprecated (declared > at /usr/include/mach-o/dyld.h:188) > make[1]: *** [glew.o] Error 1 > make: *** [Base] Error 2 > > > I can't make an interpretation of this > > 2009/3/26 IOhannes m zm?lnig > thomas thiery wrote: > > Hello IOhannes, > > > > I use this source of Gem, is it the last? > > http://downloads.sourceforge.net/pd-gem/gem-0.91-3.tar.gz?use_mirror=heanet > > > > it's the last official release (which does not take the > peculiarities of > 0.42 into account) > > however, the latest and greatest sources are always available via our > version control system (subversion > https://pd-gem.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/pd-gem/trunk/Gem) > > mfga.sdr > IOhannes > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > -- > Matohawk production > http://matohawkitongroup.free.fr > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From james.n.murray at gmail.com Thu Mar 26 17:52:38 2009 From: james.n.murray at gmail.com (james murray) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 11:52:38 -0500 Subject: [PD] Purple/Green Flickering With GEM Message-ID: <975e007b0903260952h4f84dbbds6b81b92274d716c0@mail.gmail.com> Hello List.... I've got a two screen GEM piece running on Plasma displays that has recently started to, on reboot, begin flickering the GEM screen in a neon purple/green mode. I'm wondering about whether the video card in my G5 tower is on the way out, and as a result, this glitch is occurring... It seems more prone to enter into this green/purple rave when the computer reboots, and less/never has occurred if we do a hard shutdown followed by startup. Any ideas? Confirmations? Counter-arguments... this is a new one for me, and insight would be grand. J -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From matohawk at gmail.com Thu Mar 26 17:53:55 2009 From: matohawk at gmail.com (thomas thiery) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 17:53:55 +0100 Subject: [PD] Gem-0.91-3 pd 0.42-4 In-Reply-To: <18d6a40d0903260943m456fb24g4a23a3f760beb9a4@mail.gmail.com> References: <18d6a40d0903260243l70b72bc3u19f84be85a6cc11a@mail.gmail.com> <49CB8DAF.5080906@iem.at> <18d6a40d0903260736kbea3fb7r80ed9a191dd09c26@mail.gmail.com> <18d6a40d0903260943m456fb24g4a23a3f760beb9a4@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <18d6a40d0903260953x49ca4209i8eed887b3f744664@mail.gmail.com> Sorry it's true thank you. the compilation passed without problems npw I will test Gem with pd 0.42-4 Thomas 2009/3/26 thomas thiery > no I have this line > > > > 2009/3/26 Matthias Neuenhofer > > in the glew.ccp line 83 the (char*) is missing before malloc >> >> symbolName = (char*)malloc(strlen((const char*)name) + 2); >> >> >> matthias >> Am 26.03.2009 um 15:36 schrieb thomas thiery: >> >> Thank you, >> I test the compilation and I have this error when I compile >> >> g++ -c -g -O2 -fPIC -freg-struct-return -Os -falign-loops=32 >> -falign-functions=32 -falign-jumps=32 -funroll-loops -ffast-math -mmmx >> -fpascal-strings -I.. >> -I/Applications/Pd-0.42-4.app/Contents/Resources/src glew.cpp -o >> ../Objects/glew.o >> glew.cpp: In function ?void* NSGLGetProcAddress(const GLubyte*)?: >> glew.cpp:80: warning: ?NSAddImage? is deprecated (declared at >> /usr/include/mach-o/dyld.h:230) >> glew.cpp:80: warning: ?NSAddImage? is deprecated (declared at >> /usr/include/mach-o/dyld.h:230) >> glew.cpp:83: error: invalid conversion from ?void*? to ?char*? >> glew.cpp:89: warning: ?NSLookupSymbolInImage? is deprecated (declared at >> /usr/include/mach-o/dyld.h:182) >> glew.cpp:89: warning: ?NSLookupSymbolInImage? is deprecated (declared at >> /usr/include/mach-o/dyld.h:182) >> glew.cpp:91: warning: ?NSAddressOfSymbol? is deprecated (declared at >> /usr/include/mach-o/dyld.h:188) >> glew.cpp:91: warning: ?NSAddressOfSymbol? is deprecated (declared at >> /usr/include/mach-o/dyld.h:188) >> make[1]: *** [glew.o] Error 1 >> make: *** [Base] Error 2 >> >> >> I can't make an interpretation of this >> >> 2009/3/26 IOhannes m zm?lnig >> >>> thomas thiery wrote: >>> > Hello IOhannes, >>> > >>> > I use this source of Gem, is it the last? >>> > >>> http://downloads.sourceforge.net/pd-gem/gem-0.91-3.tar.gz?use_mirror=heanet >>> > >>> >>> it's the last official release (which does not take the peculiarities of >>> 0.42 into account) >>> >>> however, the latest and greatest sources are always available via our >>> version control system (subversion >>> https://pd-gem.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/pd-gem/trunk/Gem) >>> >>> mfga.sdr >>> IOhannes >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> Matohawk production >> http://matohawkitongroup.free.fr >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> >> >> > > > -- > Matohawk production > http://matohawkitongroup.free.fr > -- Matohawk production http://matohawkitongroup.free.fr -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From matohawk at gmail.com Thu Mar 26 18:00:30 2009 From: matohawk at gmail.com (thomas thiery) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 18:00:30 +0100 Subject: [PD] Gem-0.91-3 pd 0.42-4 In-Reply-To: <18d6a40d0903260953x49ca4209i8eed887b3f744664@mail.gmail.com> References: <18d6a40d0903260243l70b72bc3u19f84be85a6cc11a@mail.gmail.com> <49CB8DAF.5080906@iem.at> <18d6a40d0903260736kbea3fb7r80ed9a191dd09c26@mail.gmail.com> <18d6a40d0903260943m456fb24g4a23a3f760beb9a4@mail.gmail.com> <18d6a40d0903260953x49ca4209i8eed887b3f744664@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <18d6a40d0903261000x2b48af2fv9cf54ddf13e06f34@mail.gmail.com> Ok pix_video works with Gem 0.91-3 version trunk with pd 0.42-4 on Mac OSx 10.5.6 Gem source : however, the latest and greatest sources are always available via our version control system (subversion https://pd-gem.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/pd-gem/trunk/Gem) Thank you for your help 2009/3/26 thomas thiery > Sorry it's true thank you. > > the compilation passed without problems npw I will test Gem with pd 0.42-4 > > Thomas > > 2009/3/26 thomas thiery > > no I have this line >> >> >> >> 2009/3/26 Matthias Neuenhofer >> >> in the glew.ccp line 83 the (char*) is missing before malloc >>> >>> symbolName = (char*)malloc(strlen((const char*)name) + 2); >>> >>> >>> matthias >>> Am 26.03.2009 um 15:36 schrieb thomas thiery: >>> >>> Thank you, >>> I test the compilation and I have this error when I compile >>> >>> g++ -c -g -O2 -fPIC -freg-struct-return -Os -falign-loops=32 >>> -falign-functions=32 -falign-jumps=32 -funroll-loops -ffast-math -mmmx >>> -fpascal-strings -I.. >>> -I/Applications/Pd-0.42-4.app/Contents/Resources/src glew.cpp -o >>> ../Objects/glew.o >>> glew.cpp: In function ?void* NSGLGetProcAddress(const GLubyte*)?: >>> glew.cpp:80: warning: ?NSAddImage? is deprecated (declared at >>> /usr/include/mach-o/dyld.h:230) >>> glew.cpp:80: warning: ?NSAddImage? is deprecated (declared at >>> /usr/include/mach-o/dyld.h:230) >>> glew.cpp:83: error: invalid conversion from ?void*? to ?char*? >>> glew.cpp:89: warning: ?NSLookupSymbolInImage? is deprecated (declared at >>> /usr/include/mach-o/dyld.h:182) >>> glew.cpp:89: warning: ?NSLookupSymbolInImage? is deprecated (declared at >>> /usr/include/mach-o/dyld.h:182) >>> glew.cpp:91: warning: ?NSAddressOfSymbol? is deprecated (declared at >>> /usr/include/mach-o/dyld.h:188) >>> glew.cpp:91: warning: ?NSAddressOfSymbol? is deprecated (declared at >>> /usr/include/mach-o/dyld.h:188) >>> make[1]: *** [glew.o] Error 1 >>> make: *** [Base] Error 2 >>> >>> >>> I can't make an interpretation of this >>> >>> 2009/3/26 IOhannes m zm?lnig >>> >>>> thomas thiery wrote: >>>> > Hello IOhannes, >>>> > >>>> > I use this source of Gem, is it the last? >>>> > >>>> http://downloads.sourceforge.net/pd-gem/gem-0.91-3.tar.gz?use_mirror=heanet >>>> > >>>> >>>> it's the last official release (which does not take the peculiarities of >>>> 0.42 into account) >>>> >>>> however, the latest and greatest sources are always available via our >>>> version control system (subversion >>>> https://pd-gem.svn.sourceforge.net/svnroot/pd-gem/trunk/Gem) >>>> >>>> mfga.sdr >>>> IOhannes >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >>>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >>>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Matohawk production >>> http://matohawkitongroup.free.fr >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >>> >>> >>> >> >> >> -- >> Matohawk production >> http://matohawkitongroup.free.fr >> > > > > -- > Matohawk production > http://matohawkitongroup.free.fr > -- Matohawk production http://matohawkitongroup.free.fr -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cgclepper at gmail.com Thu Mar 26 18:18:58 2009 From: cgclepper at gmail.com (chris clepper) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 13:18:58 -0400 Subject: [PD] Purple/Green Flickering With GEM In-Reply-To: <975e007b0903260952h4f84dbbds6b81b92274d716c0@mail.gmail.com> References: <975e007b0903260952h4f84dbbds6b81b92274d716c0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Need some more info: Video card model, what the piece uses in GEM, does any other app have problems? Maybe post a pic or video of the screens too. On Thu, Mar 26, 2009 at 12:52 PM, james murray wrote: > Hello List.... > I've got a two screen GEM piece running on Plasma displays that has > recently started to, on reboot, begin flickering the GEM screen in a neon > purple/green mode. I'm wondering about whether the video card in my G5 > tower is on the way out, and as a result, this glitch is occurring... It > seems more prone to enter into this green/purple rave when the computer > reboots, and less/never has occurred if we do a hard shutdown followed by > startup. Any ideas? Confirmations? Counter-arguments... this is a new one > for me, and insight would be grand. > > J > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From crinimal at gmx.net Thu Mar 26 19:18:58 2009 From: crinimal at gmx.net (Martin Schied) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 19:18:58 +0100 Subject: [PD] latency spikes on linux when sending wiimote's rumble and LED messages In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49CBC712.7090206@gmx.net> Hi! I can confirm this on ubuntu 8.10 (intrepid), 2.6.27-11-generic sorry for being late with this... Martin > Has anyone encountered issues with the wiimote external (pd-extended 0.42 on > 8.10 Ubuntu 2.6.29-rc6-rt kernel) when using "rumble" and/or LED commands? > The system appears to be rock solid in terms of audio latency (thanks to the > rt kernel) until I use one (or both) of the aforesaid features. As soon as > rumble and/or LED are enabled, I get xruns practically every other > millisecond reported by Pd (red button on the main Pd window). From zmoelnig at iem.at Thu Mar 26 19:25:04 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (=?windows-1252?Q?IOhannes_m_zm=F6lnig?=) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 19:25:04 +0100 Subject: [PD] Gem-0.91-3 pd 0.42-4 In-Reply-To: <18d6a40d0903260736kbea3fb7r80ed9a191dd09c26@mail.gmail.com> References: <18d6a40d0903260243l70b72bc3u19f84be85a6cc11a@mail.gmail.com> <49CB8DAF.5080906@iem.at> <18d6a40d0903260736kbea3fb7r80ed9a191dd09c26@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49CBC880.5000409@iem.at> thomas thiery wrote: > Thank you, > I test the compilation and I have this error when I compile > make: *** [Base] Error 2 > > > I can't make an interpretation of this i have fixed this now in svn (just update your working copy) fgmadr IOhannes From zmoelnig at iem.at Thu Mar 26 19:23:32 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (=?windows-1252?Q?IOhannes_m_zm=F6lnig?=) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 19:23:32 +0100 Subject: [PD] Gem-0.91-3 pd 0.42-4 In-Reply-To: <18d6a40d0903260736kbea3fb7r80ed9a191dd09c26@mail.gmail.com> References: <18d6a40d0903260243l70b72bc3u19f84be85a6cc11a@mail.gmail.com> <49CB8DAF.5080906@iem.at> <18d6a40d0903260736kbea3fb7r80ed9a191dd09c26@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49CBC824.7090707@iem.at> thomas thiery wrote: > Thank you, > I test the compilation and I have this error when I compile > make: *** [Base] Error 2 > > > I can't make an interpretation of this i have fixed this now in svn (just update your working copy) fgmadr IOhannes From athos.bacchiocchi at tin.it Thu Mar 26 21:45:26 2009 From: athos.bacchiocchi at tin.it (Athos Bacchiocchi) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 21:45:26 +0100 Subject: [PD] experiments with fiddle~ Message-ID: <49CBE966.7020407@tin.it> i'm trying to experiment and learn how [fiddle~] works, using it to control the pitch and the envelope of a sawtooth oscillator through an electric guitar directly plugged into my soundcard (an edirol fa-101 with preamplifiers). I read the help i made experiments, but i still have doubts on some issues. For example how the low and high thresholds work? The explanation was a bit obscure to me. I guess that: - the low threshold is the one at which raw pitch/amplitude output becomes different than zero, showing the value of both. - the high threshold is the one at which cooked output is changed, and a bang is sent out from the bang outlet. But i noticed that if the high threshold is less than the low one, i get a never stopping sequence of bangs. Why? Is it an issue of fiddle~ ? I would also like to understand better the use of vibrato and reattack, the help was not clear to me. Then, i tried to find a way to send a "release note" signal (so i can make synth note emulate the duration of guitar note) to the envelope generator: i'm using vline~ with two possible "in" messages, a ramp up banged by the bang outlet of fiddle, and a ramp down banged when the raw amplitude output becomes zero. I think this will create problems when i will try to recognize polyponic notes. But also for monophonic purposes, i still have some troubles: if i take the pitch information from the cooked output, as soon as i get the bang the envelope attacks, but there is a recognizable delay time for cooked pitch output to change from old value to new, leading to a disturbing pitch switching attack. Instead, if i use the raw pitch output, no problem with attack, but if i set a too long release time, i can hear the pitch going to zero before the sound has disappeared. Is there a more elegant solution for this? In the end, i would like the velocity of the synth note be proportional to the level of incoming guitar note. My first idea is to snapshot the value of raw amplitude output few milliseconds after the note-on bang. Is it a good idea or, again is there a more elegant solution? thanks, athos From derek at umatic.nl Thu Mar 26 22:32:51 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 22:32:51 +0100 Subject: [PD] agenda for upcoming book sprint?[GEM sprint] In-Reply-To: <49CAA91F.5050109@gmail.com> References: <8DCD65A4-2A60-4E09-8AD0-14BCE8C147E0@eds.org> <49CAA91F.5050109@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49CBF483.50404@umatic.nl> Hi guys, As the "facilitator" of this project, I will post a list of sprint targets quite soon. GEM section is definitely on my list, however I do want to keep to things which are both included in PD-Extended and are cross platform. For now, this excludes PDP and Gridflow. Maybe if someone wanted to make a separate section which includes installation/configuration info (following the template in the Install chapters of the existing Pd FLOSS Manual), then a section on one of these might be relevant. But as they are both essentially Linux only, by virtue of either being uncompilable or nearly unusable on other platforms, I'd rather keep focus someplace else. As for GEM, I'd like to see some stuff on the following (in order of priority): 1) Basic VJ mixer (2 x [gemhead]-[pix_film]-[alpha]-[colorRGB]-[pix_texture]-[rectangle] with an alpha-crossfader)(+ platform specific codec info) 2) Live camera input (same as VJ mixer but with [pix_video], with platform specific info on USB/firewire inputs--what works & what doesn't) 3) VJ effects (using the various pix objects) 4) Basic 3D (that actually does something interesting, rather than just show a sphere or a cube) 5) Basic movement tracking w/ [pix_blob] 6) GEM/video optimization/troubleshooting tips (see Troubleshooting section of existing Pd FLOSS Manual)(Chris Clepper, are you in the house?) I have some tutorial patches which could be used as the basis for most of this, let me know if you are interested. Full target list coming soon, I'll make sure to include this GEM section. best, Derek marius schebella wrote: > Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >> >> Hey all, >> >> I hope I am not jumping the gun or stepping on anyone's toes. I just >> wanted to open up the discussion about what people are planning on >> working on during the upcoming book sprint. Currently, I am pretty >> open to topics, but I was thinking that Gem/PDP/Gridflow could really >> use a section. There are lots of examples for them, but they lack a >> good intro to the concepts. > > I am in for a gem sprint. > marius. -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 65: "Emphasize differences" From crinimal at gmx.net Thu Mar 26 22:49:09 2009 From: crinimal at gmx.net (Martin Schied) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 22:49:09 +0100 Subject: [PD] [lrshift~] inlet doesn't accept floats (any more?) Message-ID: <49CBF855.4040600@gmx.net> Hi, just to be sure before sending another "false" bug report. I was looking at lrshift~-help.pd, there's an example of a float box going into [lrshift~]'s signal inlet, but changing this float values causes an error post: error: lrshift~: no method for 'float' Pd version 0.41-4extended-20090323 compiled 11:51:58 Mar 23 2009 thanks, Martin From bjoarn at gmail.com Thu Mar 26 23:59:06 2009 From: bjoarn at gmail.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Bj=F8rn_Nielsen?=) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 23:59:06 +0100 Subject: [PD] Delay effect without clicks Message-ID: Hey PD list This is my first mail to the list and I am a newbie in PD, so please bear with me. I am trying to make a patch that simulates the delay effects I use as a stompbox for my guitar. I.e. a signal delay line, with a parameter of feedback and a parameter of delay time. While changing the delay time parameter the ongoing sampled part should change pitch. My first attempt (as in the attached patch) is to use delread~/delwrite~, but changing the lenght of the sampled part in delread~ makes a lot of clicks noises (which can be fun, but not what I intended) and it do not change pitch. My max/msp friend said I should instead of clipping the sample, make it run faster. So I tried to figure if that was possible with delread~, vd~ or using arrays instead with tabread(4)~, but I have not found the golden key yet. I would be very happy if somebody could lead me in right direction. Thanks, Bj?rn -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: delayeffect.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 592 bytes Desc: not available URL: From oded at ccrma.Stanford.EDU Fri Mar 27 00:02:56 2009 From: oded at ccrma.Stanford.EDU (Oded Ben-Tal) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 16:02:56 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] experiments with fiddle~ In-Reply-To: <49CBE966.7020407@tin.it> References: <49CBE966.7020407@tin.it> Message-ID: > i'm trying to experiment and learn how [fiddle~] works, using it to control You should probably use [sigmund~] instead. It's not working perfectly yet but is the future. One thing to keep in mind when trying to use pitch and envelope tracking for synthesis control is that the automatic process (fiddle or any other) will never get it 100% correct. So you'll have to develop strategies for musically applying this incomplete analysis. As for some technical solutions to event detection the work of Nick Collins (mostly supercollieder and matlab I believe) has some good methods www.informatics.sussex.ac.uk/users/nc81/researchml.php > > I read the help i made experiments, but i still have doubts on some issues. > > For example how the low and high thresholds work? The explanation was a bit > obscure to me. I guess that: > > - the low threshold is the one at which raw pitch/amplitude output becomes > different than zero, showing the value of both. > - the high threshold is the one at which cooked output is changed, and a bang > is sent out from the bang outlet. > > But i noticed that if the high threshold is less than the low one, i get a > never stopping sequence of bangs. Why? Is it an issue of fiddle~ ? > > I would also like to understand better the use of vibrato and reattack, the > help was not clear to me. > > > > Then, i tried to find a way to send a "release note" signal (so i can make > synth note emulate the duration of guitar note) to the envelope generator: > i'm using vline~ with two possible "in" messages, a ramp up banged by the > bang outlet of fiddle, and a ramp down banged when the raw amplitude output > becomes zero. > > I think this will create problems when i will try to recognize polyponic > notes. But also for monophonic purposes, i still have some troubles: > > if i take the pitch information from the cooked output, as soon as i get the > bang the envelope attacks, but there is a recognizable delay time for cooked > pitch output to change from old value to new, leading to a disturbing pitch > switching attack. Instead, if i use the raw pitch output, no problem with > attack, but if i set a too long release time, i can hear the pitch going to > zero before the sound has disappeared. > > Is there a more elegant solution for this? > > In the end, i would like the velocity of the synth note be proportional to > the level of incoming guitar note. My first idea is to snapshot the value of > raw amplitude output few milliseconds after the note-on bang. Is it a good > idea or, again is there a more elegant solution? > > thanks, > athos > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > From marius.schebella at gmail.com Fri Mar 27 00:13:50 2009 From: marius.schebella at gmail.com (marius schebella) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 00:13:50 +0100 Subject: [PD] Delay effect without clicks In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49CC0C2E.4060304@gmail.com> hi Bj?rn, maybe vd~ (variable delay) is what you're looking for? marius. Bj?rn Nielsen wrote: > Hey PD list > This is my first mail to the list and I am a newbie in PD, so please > bear with me. > > I am trying to make a patch that simulates the delay effects I use as > a stompbox for my guitar. I.e. a signal delay line, with a parameter > of feedback and a parameter of delay time. While changing the delay > time parameter the ongoing sampled part should change pitch. > > My first attempt (as in the attached patch) is to use > delread~/delwrite~, but changing the lenght of the sampled part in > delread~ makes a lot of clicks noises (which can be fun, but not what > I intended) and it do not change pitch. My max/msp friend said I > should instead of clipping the sample, make it run faster. So I tried > to figure if that was possible with delread~, vd~ or using arrays > instead with tabread(4)~, but I have not found the golden key yet. > > I would be very happy if somebody could lead me in right direction. > Thanks, Bj?rn > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From bjoarn at gmail.com Fri Mar 27 00:42:39 2009 From: bjoarn at gmail.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Bj=F8rn_Nielsen?=) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 00:42:39 +0100 Subject: [PD] Delay effect without clicks In-Reply-To: <49CC0C2E.4060304@gmail.com> References: <49CC0C2E.4060304@gmail.com> Message-ID: Hey Marius Thanks for the quick reply. I have now tried vd~, but I still encounter clicks noises when I change delay time. audiosignal | [delwrite testname 2000] delaytime | [sig~] | [vd~ testname] | audioout+back to delwrite Do the click noises has something to do with the samplelength in delwrite~? (and can it at all be changed on the fly?) /Bj?rn On Fri, Mar 27, 2009 at 00:13, marius schebella wrote: > hi Bj?rn, > maybe vd~ (variable delay) is what you're looking for? > marius. > > Bj?rn Nielsen wrote: >> >> Hey PD list >> This is my first mail to the list and I am a newbie in PD, so please >> bear with me. >> >> I am trying to make a patch that simulates the delay effects I use as >> a stompbox for my guitar. I.e. a signal delay line, with a parameter >> of feedback and a parameter of delay time. While changing the delay >> time parameter the ongoing sampled part should change pitch. >> >> My first attempt (as in the attached patch) is to use >> delread~/delwrite~, but changing the lenght of the sampled part in >> delread~ makes a lot of clicks noises (which can be fun, but not what >> I intended) and it do not change pitch. My max/msp friend said I >> should instead of clipping the sample, make it run faster. So I tried >> to figure if that was possible with delread~, vd~ or using arrays >> instead with tabread(4)~, but I have not found the golden key yet. >> >> I would be very happy if somebody could lead me in right direction. >> Thanks, Bj?rn >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > From hans at eds.org Fri Mar 27 00:49:58 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 19:49:58 -0400 Subject: [PD] Purple/Green Flickering With GEM In-Reply-To: References: <975e007b0903260952h4f84dbbds6b81b92274d716c0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <0B015B25-FFB4-47D3-977E-075EE7A7D2BA@eds.org> Yeah, its pretty common. If you are using [pix_movie], try using: [pix_film] | [pix_texture] .hc On Mar 26, 2009, at 1:18 PM, chris clepper wrote: > Need some more info: > > Video card model, what the piece uses in GEM, does any other app > have problems? Maybe post a pic or video of the screens too. > > On Thu, Mar 26, 2009 at 12:52 PM, james murray > wrote: > Hello List.... > > I've got a two screen GEM piece running on Plasma displays that has > recently started to, on reboot, begin flickering the GEM screen in a > neon purple/green mode. I'm wondering about whether the video card > in my G5 tower is on the way out, and as a result, this glitch is > occurring... It seems more prone to enter into this green/purple > rave when the computer reboots, and less/never has occurred if we do > a hard shutdown followed by startup. Any ideas? Confirmations? > Counter-arguments... this is a new one for me, and insight would be > grand. > > J > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- News is what people want to keep hidden and everything else is publicity. - Bill Moyers -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hans at eds.org Fri Mar 27 00:52:56 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 19:52:56 -0400 Subject: [PD] words for style guide: rewind and reset In-Reply-To: <49CAA343.4090105@gmail.com> References: <49CAA343.4090105@gmail.com> Message-ID: On Mar 25, 2009, at 5:33 PM, marius schebella wrote: > Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >> Hey, >> I just went thru a bunch of interfaces and noticed a good pattern >> in wording. I propose to make this part of the style guide: >> rewind - go back to the beginning of a chunk of data >> (used in: textfile, binfile, msgfile, etc.) >> reset - clear the data from a container; or, go back to the initial >> state >> (used in: zexy/index, cyclone/MouseState, maxlib, etc.) > > "reset" should not be confused with "clear"... Hmm, what's the difference? I think I remember seeing [clear( and thinking that it should ahve been [reset(. > what about open vs. read vs. load? That probably should be documented. Make a proposal! .hc > > marius. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- As we enjoy great advantages from inventions of others, we should be glad of an opportunity to serve others by any invention of ours; and this we should do freely and generously. - Benjamin Franklin From fbar at footils.org Fri Mar 27 00:57:15 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 00:57:15 +0100 Subject: [PD] Delay effect without clicks In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20090326235715.GA20958@footils.org> Hallo, Bj?rn Nielsen hat gesagt: // Bj?rn Nielsen wrote: > This is my first mail to the list and I am a newbie in PD, so please > bear with me. We're going to stompbox you hard! No, of course not, welcome on board! ;) > I am trying to make a patch that simulates the delay effects I use as > a stompbox for my guitar. I.e. a signal delay line, with a parameter > of feedback and a parameter of delay time. While changing the delay > time parameter the ongoing sampled part should change pitch. > > My first attempt (as in the attached patch) is to use > delread~/delwrite~, but changing the lenght of the sampled part in > delread~ makes a lot of clicks noises (which can be fun, but not what > I intended) and it do not change pitch. So you want to use the delay effect as a pitchshifter. Pitchshifting with a delay works by constantly changing the delay time, i.e. making it continously become slower or faster. (Using a not changing, constant delay would not change pitch, it just delays the signal.) For that you should drive your delay reader with an audio signal, otherwise you don't get constant pitch shifting, but jumps which are audible as clicks. The object to use when you want variable delay times is called [vd~], it takes a signal input. To get a constantly growing delay time, you could for example drive it by a [phasor~], multiplied by some scalign factor. But now at some point in time the phasor~ will wrap around and restart at 0 or you may even reach the end of the delay buffer. To work against that you can use overlapping and windowed phasors which you make by adding 0.5 to a phasor~ and applying [wrap~] to that signal path to get a second phasor~-like signal that is half out ouf phase to the original. Then you drive two [vd~] objects with these phasor~s and add them together. With the correct windowing they sound almost like one delay. This procedure is implemented in the example 3.audio.examples/G09.pitchshift.pd and a more verbose explanation is in Miller Puckette's book (which also explains the strange-looking multiplication by 0.05776 in the example.) See http://crca.ucsd.edu/~msp/techniques/latest/book-html/node115.html and http://crca.ucsd.edu/~msp/techniques/latest/book-html/node125.html Ciao -- Frank From fbar at footils.org Fri Mar 27 01:02:15 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 01:02:15 +0100 Subject: [PD] words for style guide: rewind and reset In-Reply-To: References: <49CAA343.4090105@gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090327000215.GB20958@footils.org> Hallo, Hans-Christoph Steiner hat gesagt: // Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >> "reset" should not be confused with "clear"... > > Hmm, what's the difference? I think I remember seeing [clear( and > thinking that it should ahve been [reset(. "clear" is used in [pipe]. I guess "clear" is used here because there are two ways to "reset" a [pipe]: One is a reset with outputting all scheduled delays, the other is a "mute" resetting with discarding scheduled delays. The former is called "flush" with [pipe], the latter is called "clear". With [delay] the "reset" method is called "stop" which sounds natural to me. Ciao -- Frank From jmmmpais at googlemail.com Fri Mar 27 01:41:06 2009 From: jmmmpais at googlemail.com (=?iso-8859-15?Q?Jo=E3o_Pais?=) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 01:41:06 +0100 Subject: [PD] steep filter? In-Reply-To: References: <161320dd0903151037u6caa3f54p3ac85c7f5546d303@mail.gmail.com> <161320dd0903151102s1346f4d2kdfb0f94593ea8e28@mail.gmail.com> <20090316082528.GB15510@footils.org> <09F4BF18-F737-4473-BC61-B05177A97466@gmx.ch> Message-ID: > hm, i'm certainly not against this idea, as i'm not opposed to sharing > what i've done, if it is interesting for others. > but i don't use pd-extended myself a a lot and actually i don't know the > process of "getting externals into the system". that is quite easy: contact directly H-C Steiner to get a svn account, then upload your code - or ask him more about how to do it. > also, i don't know about the policy of pd-extended or where it's aiming > at, > but i guess that the externals that get in there, must have somehow > proven to be useful to many users. ahhh, there's no policy. anyone who manifests interest in joining in joins in, I guess. there's also no admittance test, so everyone just puts in the code he wants (sometimes even buggy code). which makes the whole a thing not really totally ?bersichtlich (one of the GSC projects was to organize and catalog the externals on pd-ext). but pd-ext is quite used (only hardcore people/code developers prefer pd-van), and it's the easiest way to make the code available to everyone. of course it can happen that no one notices it's there, because there are around 2000+ files in the /extra folder of pd-ext. From pkstone at ucdavis.edu Fri Mar 27 02:23:58 2009 From: pkstone at ucdavis.edu (Phil Stone) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 18:23:58 -0700 Subject: [PD] pd-extended font paths Message-ID: <49CC2AAE.4060605@ucdavis.edu> Do there really need to be eight different font-related entries in the path list for Pd-extended on OS X? If so, why? Phil From pkstone at ucdavis.edu Fri Mar 27 05:12:38 2009 From: pkstone at ucdavis.edu (Phil Stone) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 21:12:38 -0700 Subject: [PD] pd-extended font paths In-Reply-To: <88AF9256-F194-4FD0-BDB0-19C73722D83C@eds.org> References: <49CC2AAE.4060605@ucdavis.edu> <88AF9256-F194-4FD0-BDB0-19C73722D83C@eds.org> Message-ID: <49CC5236.4000308@ucdavis.edu> Oh, Gem, of course. So when I'm not using Gem, I can safely do without those eight path elements, then? Also, while I'm being a whinging pest...it's impossible to add a path element that lives inside the pd-extended.app "folder" using the path dialog. This is because OS X makes the .app package not look like a folder, I suppose, but it's unfortunate nevertheless. Off to edit the .plist, I go. Thanks, Hans. Phil Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > Well, it makes it easier to find fonts. That's the reason. I suppose > most people aren't using fonts much with Pd. If [declare -path] works > for Gem fonts, then I would consider removing some from the default > prefs. > > .hc > > On Mar 26, 2009, at 9:23 PM, Phil Stone wrote: > >> Do there really need to be eight different font-related entries in >> the path list for Pd-extended on OS X? If so, why? >> >> >> Phil >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > Computer science is no more related to the computer than astronomy is > related to the telescope. -Edsger Dykstra > > > From ydegoyon at gmail.com Fri Mar 27 05:56:30 2009 From: ydegoyon at gmail.com (ydegoyon at gmail.com) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 05:56:30 +0100 Subject: [PD] agenda for upcoming book sprint?[GEM sprint] In-Reply-To: <49CBF483.50404@umatic.nl> References: <8DCD65A4-2A60-4E09-8AD0-14BCE8C147E0@eds.org> <49CAA91F.5050109@gmail.com> <49CBF483.50404@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <49CC5C7E.7050007@gmail.com> that's where the joke is, that floss manuals cover software that should also run on windows yes, you've always been a joker man, you know that xiaoo, sevy Derek Holzer wrote: > Hi guys, > > As the "facilitator" of this project, I will post a list of sprint > targets quite soon. > > GEM section is definitely on my list, however I do want to keep to > things which are both included in PD-Extended and are cross platform. > For now, this excludes PDP and Gridflow. Maybe if someone wanted to make > a separate section which includes installation/configuration info > (following the template in the Install chapters of the existing Pd FLOSS > Manual), then a section on one of these might be relevant. But as they > are both essentially Linux only, by virtue of either being uncompilable > or nearly unusable on other platforms, I'd rather keep focus someplace > else. > > As for GEM, I'd like to see some stuff on the following (in order of > priority): > > 1) Basic VJ mixer (2 x > [gemhead]-[pix_film]-[alpha]-[colorRGB]-[pix_texture]-[rectangle] with > an alpha-crossfader)(+ platform specific codec info) > 2) Live camera input (same as VJ mixer but with [pix_video], with > platform specific info on USB/firewire inputs--what works & what doesn't) > 3) VJ effects (using the various pix objects) > 4) Basic 3D (that actually does something interesting, rather than just > show a sphere or a cube) > 5) Basic movement tracking w/ [pix_blob] > 6) GEM/video optimization/troubleshooting tips (see Troubleshooting > section of existing Pd FLOSS Manual)(Chris Clepper, are you in the > house?) > > I have some tutorial patches which could be used as the basis for most > of this, let me know if you are interested. > > Full target list coming soon, I'll make sure to include this GEM section. > > best, > Derek > > marius schebella wrote: >> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >>> >>> Hey all, >>> >>> I hope I am not jumping the gun or stepping on anyone's toes. I just >>> wanted to open up the discussion about what people are planning on >>> working on during the upcoming book sprint. Currently, I am pretty >>> open to topics, but I was thinking that Gem/PDP/Gridflow could >>> really use a section. There are lots of examples for them, but they >>> lack a good intro to the concepts. >> >> I am in for a gem sprint. >> marius. > > > From john.harrison at alum.mit.edu Fri Mar 27 05:34:43 2009 From: john.harrison at alum.mit.edu (John Harrison) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 23:34:43 -0500 Subject: [PD] Delay effect without clicks In-Reply-To: References: <49CC0C2E.4060304@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49CC5763.5080804@alum.mit.edu> I think what you are talking about is zipper noise --- when you change the value sent to [vd~] what you are hearing is a discontinuity in the audio caused by the discontinuity between the new value and the previous value sent to [vd~]. Smooth your "trip" between the values with [line~]. Try something like this: delaytime | [$1 100( | [line~] | [vd~ testname] Play with the 2nd parameter in the message sent to line (shown as 100 above). I don't know how much "doppler effect" you are going to want to replace your clicks. -John Bj?rn Nielsen wrote: > Hey Marius > Thanks for the quick reply. > > I have now tried vd~, but I still encounter clicks noises when I > change delay time. > > audiosignal > | > [delwrite testname 2000] > > delaytime > | > [sig~] > | > [vd~ testname] > | > audioout+back to delwrite > > Do the click noises has something to do with the samplelength in > delwrite~? (and can it at all be changed on the fly?) > > /Bj?rn > > > On Fri, Mar 27, 2009 at 00:13, marius schebella > wrote: > >> hi Bj?rn, >> maybe vd~ (variable delay) is what you're looking for? >> marius. >> >> Bj?rn Nielsen wrote: >> >>> Hey PD list >>> This is my first mail to the list and I am a newbie in PD, so please >>> bear with me. >>> >>> I am trying to make a patch that simulates the delay effects I use as >>> a stompbox for my guitar. I.e. a signal delay line, with a parameter >>> of feedback and a parameter of delay time. While changing the delay >>> time parameter the ongoing sampled part should change pitch. >>> >>> My first attempt (as in the attached patch) is to use >>> delread~/delwrite~, but changing the lenght of the sampled part in >>> delread~ makes a lot of clicks noises (which can be fun, but not what >>> I intended) and it do not change pitch. My max/msp friend said I >>> should instead of clipping the sample, make it run faster. So I tried >>> to figure if that was possible with delread~, vd~ or using arrays >>> instead with tabread(4)~, but I have not found the golden key yet. >>> >>> I would be very happy if somebody could lead me in right direction. >>> Thanks, Bj?rn >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >>> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > -- John Harrison http://alumni.media.mit.edu/~harrison -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hans at eds.org Fri Mar 27 04:56:36 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 23:56:36 -0400 Subject: [PD] pd-extended font paths In-Reply-To: <49CC2AAE.4060605@ucdavis.edu> References: <49CC2AAE.4060605@ucdavis.edu> Message-ID: <88AF9256-F194-4FD0-BDB0-19C73722D83C@eds.org> Well, it makes it easier to find fonts. That's the reason. I suppose most people aren't using fonts much with Pd. If [declare -path] works for Gem fonts, then I would consider removing some from the default prefs. .hc On Mar 26, 2009, at 9:23 PM, Phil Stone wrote: > Do there really need to be eight different font-related entries in > the path list for Pd-extended on OS X? If so, why? > > > Phil > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Computer science is no more related to the computer than astronomy is related to the telescope. -Edsger Dykstra From hans at eds.org Fri Mar 27 04:54:34 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Thu, 26 Mar 2009 23:54:34 -0400 Subject: [PD] Purple/Green Flickering With GEM In-Reply-To: <975e007b0903262039x4e51dfdbv4dcf27cdc909a816@mail.gmail.com> References: <975e007b0903260952h4f84dbbds6b81b92274d716c0@mail.gmail.com> <0B015B25-FFB4-47D3-977E-075EE7A7D2BA@eds.org> <975e007b0903262039x4e51dfdbv4dcf27cdc909a816@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: I don't know the details, but I remember hearing its related to buggy video card drivers. Things that work fine on some cards cause this on others. Check the archives for details, I think there are also a bug report that migh tbe related, if so, you should add your details there: https://sourceforge.net/tracker/?func=detail&aid=1839973&group_id=64325&atid=507079 .hc On Mar 26, 2009, at 11:39 PM, james murray wrote: > Common? Really? Is there any sort of good explanation for this? > After testing it for a few hours it's definitely only occurring > after I select restart and never happening when I shut the computer > down and then restart manually.... I guess I'm curious about why > this would be happening, and is there anything out there more > informative than the pd forums for snafus like this? I spent a good > chunk of my day trying to find different ways to describe the error > but could get no useful search results in there... > > Thanks so much for the input Hans-Christoph, it's really > appreciated, I'll give the workaround you suggested a shot in the > morning and see what happens. > > J > > On Thu, Mar 26, 2009 at 6:49 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner > wrote: > > Yeah, its pretty common. If you are using [pix_movie], try using: > > [pix_film] > | > [pix_texture] > > .hc > > On Mar 26, 2009, at 1:18 PM, chris clepper wrote: > >> Need some more info: >> >> Video card model, what the piece uses in GEM, does any other app >> have problems? Maybe post a pic or video of the screens too. >> >> On Thu, Mar 26, 2009 at 12:52 PM, james murray > > wrote: >> Hello List.... >> >> I've got a two screen GEM piece running on Plasma displays that has >> recently started to, on reboot, begin flickering the GEM screen in >> a neon purple/green mode. I'm wondering about whether the video >> card in my G5 tower is on the way out, and as a result, this glitch >> is occurring... It seems more prone to enter into this green/purple >> rave when the computer reboots, and less/never has occurred if we >> do a hard shutdown followed by startup. Any ideas? Confirmations? >> Counter-arguments... this is a new one for me, and insight would be >> grand. >> >> J >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > News is what people want to keep hidden and everything else is > publicity. - Bill Moyers > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- News is what people want to keep hidden and everything else is publicity. - Bill Moyers -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ydegoyon at gmail.com Fri Mar 27 07:05:06 2009 From: ydegoyon at gmail.com (ydegoyon at gmail.com) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 07:05:06 +0100 Subject: [PD] agenda for upcoming book sprint?[GEM sprint] In-Reply-To: <49CC5C7E.7050007@gmail.com> References: <8DCD65A4-2A60-4E09-8AD0-14BCE8C147E0@eds.org> <49CAA91F.5050109@gmail.com> <49CBF483.50404@umatic.nl> <49CC5C7E.7050007@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49CC6C92.8040802@gmail.com> ydegoyon at gmail.com wrote: > that's where the joke is, > that floss manuals cover > software that should also run on windows > > yes, you've always been a joker man, > you know that sorry i that seemed agressive, i just meant you're a reactionary force, cos don't document ardour, supercollider and others if they don't run on windblows ... anyway i wouldn't read it gute nacht! sevy > > > xiaoo, > sevy > > Derek Holzer wrote: >> Hi guys, >> >> As the "facilitator" of this project, I will post a list of sprint >> targets quite soon. >> >> GEM section is definitely on my list, however I do want to keep to >> things which are both included in PD-Extended and are cross platform. >> For now, this excludes PDP and Gridflow. Maybe if someone wanted to make >> a separate section which includes installation/configuration info >> (following the template in the Install chapters of the existing Pd FLOSS >> Manual), then a section on one of these might be relevant. But as they >> are both essentially Linux only, by virtue of either being uncompilable >> or nearly unusable on other platforms, I'd rather keep focus >> someplace else. >> >> As for GEM, I'd like to see some stuff on the following (in order of >> priority): >> >> 1) Basic VJ mixer (2 x >> [gemhead]-[pix_film]-[alpha]-[colorRGB]-[pix_texture]-[rectangle] with >> an alpha-crossfader)(+ platform specific codec info) >> 2) Live camera input (same as VJ mixer but with [pix_video], with >> platform specific info on USB/firewire inputs--what works & what >> doesn't) >> 3) VJ effects (using the various pix objects) >> 4) Basic 3D (that actually does something interesting, rather than just >> show a sphere or a cube) >> 5) Basic movement tracking w/ [pix_blob] >> 6) GEM/video optimization/troubleshooting tips (see Troubleshooting >> section of existing Pd FLOSS Manual)(Chris Clepper, are you in the >> house?) >> >> I have some tutorial patches which could be used as the basis for most >> of this, let me know if you are interested. >> >> Full target list coming soon, I'll make sure to include this GEM >> section. >> >> best, >> Derek >> >> marius schebella wrote: >>> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >>>> >>>> Hey all, >>>> >>>> I hope I am not jumping the gun or stepping on anyone's toes. I >>>> just wanted to open up the discussion about what people are >>>> planning on working on during the upcoming book sprint. Currently, >>>> I am pretty open to topics, but I was thinking that >>>> Gem/PDP/Gridflow could really use a section. There are lots of >>>> examples for them, but they lack a good intro to the concepts. >>> >>> I am in for a gem sprint. >>> marius. >> >> >> > > From bjoarn at gmail.com Fri Mar 27 11:09:25 2009 From: bjoarn at gmail.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Bj=F8rn_Nielsen?=) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 11:09:25 +0100 Subject: [PD] Delay effect without clicks In-Reply-To: <49CC6D4A.1010206@gmail.com> References: <49CC0C2E.4060304@gmail.com> <49CC6D4A.1010206@gmail.com> Message-ID: Thanks Marius, Frank & John I got rid of the click noises now by doing this [numberbox\ | [pack $f1 50] | [line~] | [vd~ testreadname] But the pitch shifting it does while changing delay time is quite weird, so I think I will look into Franks example of doing this. / Bj?rn On Fri, Mar 27, 2009 at 07:08, marius schebella wrote: > hi again, > vd~ allows you to be controlled via a dsp signal (as opposed to a message > inlet which only gets updated every 1,6 ms or so) and thus allows you to > smoothly change the delay time. but you have to do do an interpolation > between the messages you are feeding into it, and the best way to do this is > with [line~]. > > [numberbox\ > ?| > [line $1 100( > ?| > [vd~ del] > > marius. > > > Bj?rn Nielsen wrote: >> >> Hey Marius >> Thanks for the quick reply. >> >> I have now tried vd~, but I still encounter clicks noises when I >> change delay time. >> >> audiosignal >> | >> [delwrite testname 2000] >> >> delaytime >> | >> ?[sig~] >> | >> [vd~ testname] >> | >> audioout+back to delwrite >> >> Do the click noises has something to do with the samplelength in >> delwrite~? (and can it at all be changed on the fly?) >> >> /Bj?rn >> >> >> On Fri, Mar 27, 2009 at 00:13, marius schebella >> wrote: >>> >>> hi Bj?rn, >>> maybe vd~ (variable delay) is what you're looking for? >>> marius. >>> >>> Bj?rn Nielsen wrote: >>>> >>>> Hey PD list >>>> This is my first mail to the list and I am a newbie in PD, so please >>>> bear with me. >>>> >>>> I am trying to make a patch that simulates the delay effects I use as >>>> a stompbox for my guitar. I.e. a signal delay line, with a parameter >>>> of feedback and a parameter of delay time. While changing the delay >>>> time parameter the ongoing sampled part should change pitch. >>>> >>>> My first attempt (as in the attached patch) is to use >>>> delread~/delwrite~, but changing the lenght of the sampled part in >>>> delread~ makes a lot of clicks noises (which can be fun, but not what >>>> I intended) and it do not change pitch. My max/msp friend said I >>>> should instead of clipping the sample, make it run faster. So I tried >>>> to figure if that was possible with delread~, vd~ or using arrays >>>> instead with tabread(4)~, but I have not found the golden key yet. >>>> >>>> I would be very happy if somebody could lead me in right direction. >>>> Thanks, Bj?rn >>>> >>>> >>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >>>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >>>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >>> >> > > From marius.schebella at gmail.com Fri Mar 27 07:08:10 2009 From: marius.schebella at gmail.com (marius schebella) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 07:08:10 +0100 Subject: [PD] Delay effect without clicks In-Reply-To: References: <49CC0C2E.4060304@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49CC6D4A.1010206@gmail.com> hi again, vd~ allows you to be controlled via a dsp signal (as opposed to a message inlet which only gets updated every 1,6 ms or so) and thus allows you to smoothly change the delay time. but you have to do do an interpolation between the messages you are feeding into it, and the best way to do this is with [line~]. [numberbox\ | [line $1 100( | [vd~ del] marius. Bj?rn Nielsen wrote: > Hey Marius > Thanks for the quick reply. > > I have now tried vd~, but I still encounter clicks noises when I > change delay time. > > audiosignal > | > [delwrite testname 2000] > > delaytime > | > [sig~] > | > [vd~ testname] > | > audioout+back to delwrite > > Do the click noises has something to do with the samplelength in > delwrite~? (and can it at all be changed on the fly?) > > /Bj?rn > > > On Fri, Mar 27, 2009 at 00:13, marius schebella > wrote: >> hi Bj?rn, >> maybe vd~ (variable delay) is what you're looking for? >> marius. >> >> Bj?rn Nielsen wrote: >>> Hey PD list >>> This is my first mail to the list and I am a newbie in PD, so please >>> bear with me. >>> >>> I am trying to make a patch that simulates the delay effects I use as >>> a stompbox for my guitar. I.e. a signal delay line, with a parameter >>> of feedback and a parameter of delay time. While changing the delay >>> time parameter the ongoing sampled part should change pitch. >>> >>> My first attempt (as in the attached patch) is to use >>> delread~/delwrite~, but changing the lenght of the sampled part in >>> delread~ makes a lot of clicks noises (which can be fun, but not what >>> I intended) and it do not change pitch. My max/msp friend said I >>> should instead of clipping the sample, make it run faster. So I tried >>> to figure if that was possible with delread~, vd~ or using arrays >>> instead with tabread(4)~, but I have not found the golden key yet. >>> >>> I would be very happy if somebody could lead me in right direction. >>> Thanks, Bj?rn >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> > From vboehm at gmx.ch Fri Mar 27 12:18:15 2009 From: vboehm at gmx.ch (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?volker_b=F6hm?=) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 12:18:15 +0100 Subject: [PD] steep filter? In-Reply-To: References: <161320dd0903151037u6caa3f54p3ac85c7f5546d303@mail.gmail.com> <161320dd0903151102s1346f4d2kdfb0f94593ea8e28@mail.gmail.com> <20090316082528.GB15510@footils.org> <09F4BF18-F737-4473-BC61-B05177A97466@gmx.ch> Message-ID: On 27 Mar 2009, at 01:41, Jo?o Pais wrote: >> hm, i'm certainly not against this idea, as i'm not opposed to >> sharing what i've done, if it is interesting for others. >> but i don't use pd-extended myself a a lot and actually i don't >> know the process of "getting externals into the system". > > that is quite easy: contact directly H-C Steiner to get a svn > account, then upload your code - or ask him more about how to do it. > > >> also, i don't know about the policy of pd-extended or where it's >> aiming at, >> but i guess that the externals that get in there, must have >> somehow proven to be useful to many users. > > ahhh, there's no policy. anyone who manifests interest in joining > in joins in, I guess. there's also no admittance test, so everyone > just puts in the code he wants (sometimes even buggy code). which > makes the whole a thing not really totally ?bersichtlich (one of > the GSC projects was to organize and catalog the externals on pd-ext). > but pd-ext is quite used (only hardcore people/code developers > prefer pd-van), and it's the easiest way to make the code available > to everyone. of course it can happen that no one notices it's > there, because there are around 2000+ files in the /extra folder of > pd-ext. "not really totally ?bersichtlich", yeah i had that impression, too :) anyway, thanks for your comments, jo?o. i'll think about it. volker. From bjoarn at gmail.com Fri Mar 27 13:35:30 2009 From: bjoarn at gmail.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Bj=F8rn_Nielsen?=) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 13:35:30 +0100 Subject: [PD] Delay effect without clicks In-Reply-To: <49CCC252.7030807@alum.mit.edu> References: <49CC0C2E.4060304@gmail.com> <49CC6D4A.1010206@gmail.com> <49CCC252.7030807@alum.mit.edu> Message-ID: > from your first email, it sounds like you are expecting a pitch shift. So > how does the pitch shift you are hearing differ from what you are expecting > i.e. define "weird." I take it you tried different numbers where the 50 is > i.e. 500 etc.? Still weird? Yeah I tried different line ramp numbers, and it change the pitch shifting to deeper frequencies the longer the line ramp is. And the longer the ramp is it feels more unresponsive, since the long ramp. But the thing that really differs from an analog delays (with tapes) is that it is only changing pitch when you change the delaytime value at the same time as a sound come through. If you makes a short note, pass it through the delay with a 1sec delay and in the pause between to delayed notes change the delay time to 1/2 sec, it won't change pitch. The sound while it change pitch do not sound very smoothly. It has a definitely digital sound, like a whammy effect. I would like it to have as much analog feeling as possible. > It seemed to me that Frank thought you wanted to build a pitch shifter using > the delay effect. Maybe he did? But I find the example interesting, because my max/msp friend said that he had made an delay effect that changed delay time smoothly but without pitch change, also with shifting between to delay chains. So I will see if can tweak it around for my purpose. :-) Bj?rn > Bj?rn Nielsen wrote: > > Thanks Marius, Frank & John > > I got rid of the click noises now by doing this > > [numberbox\ > | > [pack $f1 50] > | > [line~] > | > [vd~ testreadname] > > But the pitch shifting it does while changing delay time is quite > weird, so I think I will look into Franks example of doing this. > > / Bj?rn > > On Fri, Mar 27, 2009 at 07:08, marius schebella > wrote: > > > hi again, > vd~ allows you to be controlled via a dsp signal (as opposed to a message > inlet which only gets updated every 1,6 ms or so) and thus allows you to > smoothly change the delay time. but you have to do do an interpolation > between the messages you are feeding into it, and the best way to do this is > with [line~]. > > [numberbox\ > ?| > [line $1 100( > ?| > [vd~ del] > > marius. > > > Bj?rn Nielsen wrote: > > > Hey Marius > Thanks for the quick reply. > > I have now tried vd~, but I still encounter clicks noises when I > change delay time. > > audiosignal > | > [delwrite testname 2000] > > delaytime > | > ?[sig~] > | > [vd~ testname] > | > audioout+back to delwrite > > Do the click noises has something to do with the samplelength in > delwrite~? (and can it at all be changed on the fly?) > > /Bj?rn > > > On Fri, Mar 27, 2009 at 00:13, marius schebella > wrote: > > > hi Bj?rn, > maybe vd~ (variable delay) is what you're looking for? > marius. > > Bj?rn Nielsen wrote: > > > Hey PD list > This is my first mail to the list and I am a newbie in PD, so please > bear with me. > > I am trying to make a patch that simulates the delay effects I use as > a stompbox for my guitar. I.e. a signal delay line, with a parameter > of feedback and a parameter of delay time. While changing the delay > time parameter the ongoing sampled part should change pitch. > > My first attempt (as in the attached patch) is to use > delread~/delwrite~, but changing the lenght of the sampled part in > delread~ makes a lot of clicks noises (which can be fun, but not what > I intended) and it do not change pitch. My max/msp friend said I > should instead of clipping the sample, make it run faster. So I tried > to figure if that was possible with delread~, vd~ or using arrays > instead with tabread(4)~, but I have not found the golden key yet. > > I would be very happy if somebody could lead me in right direction. > Thanks, Bj?rn > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > -- > John Harrison > http://alumni.media.mit.edu/~harrison > > From john.harrison at alum.mit.edu Fri Mar 27 13:10:58 2009 From: john.harrison at alum.mit.edu (John Harrison) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 07:10:58 -0500 Subject: [PD] Delay effect without clicks In-Reply-To: References: <49CC0C2E.4060304@gmail.com> <49CC6D4A.1010206@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49CCC252.7030807@alum.mit.edu> from your first email, it sounds like you are expecting a pitch shift. So how does the pitch shift you are hearing differ from what you are expecting i.e. define "weird." I take it you tried different numbers where the 50 is i.e. 500 etc.? Still weird? It seemed to me that Frank thought you wanted to build a pitch shifter using the delay effect. -John Bj?rn Nielsen wrote: > Thanks Marius, Frank & John > > I got rid of the click noises now by doing this > > [numberbox\ > | > [pack $f1 50] > | > [line~] > | > [vd~ testreadname] > > But the pitch shifting it does while changing delay time is quite > weird, so I think I will look into Franks example of doing this. > > / Bj?rn > > On Fri, Mar 27, 2009 at 07:08, marius schebella > wrote: > >> hi again, >> vd~ allows you to be controlled via a dsp signal (as opposed to a message >> inlet which only gets updated every 1,6 ms or so) and thus allows you to >> smoothly change the delay time. but you have to do do an interpolation >> between the messages you are feeding into it, and the best way to do this is >> with [line~]. >> >> [numberbox\ >> | >> [line $1 100( >> | >> [vd~ del] >> >> marius. >> >> >> Bj?rn Nielsen wrote: >> >>> Hey Marius >>> Thanks for the quick reply. >>> >>> I have now tried vd~, but I still encounter clicks noises when I >>> change delay time. >>> >>> audiosignal >>> | >>> [delwrite testname 2000] >>> >>> delaytime >>> | >>> [sig~] >>> | >>> [vd~ testname] >>> | >>> audioout+back to delwrite >>> >>> Do the click noises has something to do with the samplelength in >>> delwrite~? (and can it at all be changed on the fly?) >>> >>> /Bj?rn >>> >>> >>> On Fri, Mar 27, 2009 at 00:13, marius schebella >>> wrote: >>> >>>> hi Bj?rn, >>>> maybe vd~ (variable delay) is what you're looking for? >>>> marius. >>>> >>>> Bj?rn Nielsen wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hey PD list >>>>> This is my first mail to the list and I am a newbie in PD, so please >>>>> bear with me. >>>>> >>>>> I am trying to make a patch that simulates the delay effects I use as >>>>> a stompbox for my guitar. I.e. a signal delay line, with a parameter >>>>> of feedback and a parameter of delay time. While changing the delay >>>>> time parameter the ongoing sampled part should change pitch. >>>>> >>>>> My first attempt (as in the attached patch) is to use >>>>> delread~/delwrite~, but changing the lenght of the sampled part in >>>>> delread~ makes a lot of clicks noises (which can be fun, but not what >>>>> I intended) and it do not change pitch. My max/msp friend said I >>>>> should instead of clipping the sample, make it run faster. So I tried >>>>> to figure if that was possible with delread~, vd~ or using arrays >>>>> instead with tabread(4)~, but I have not found the golden key yet. >>>>> >>>>> I would be very happy if somebody could lead me in right direction. >>>>> Thanks, Bj?rn >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>>>> >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >>>>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >>>>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >>>>> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > -- John Harrison http://alumni.media.mit.edu/~harrison -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From matju at artengine.ca Fri Mar 27 15:03:57 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 10:03:57 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] pd-extended font paths In-Reply-To: <49CC5236.4000308@ucdavis.edu> References: <49CC2AAE.4060605@ucdavis.edu> <88AF9256-F194-4FD0-BDB0-19C73722D83C@eds.org> <49CC5236.4000308@ucdavis.edu> Message-ID: On Thu, 26 Mar 2009, Phil Stone wrote: > Oh, Gem, of course. So when I'm not using Gem, I can safely do without > those eight path elements, then? Also, while I'm being a whinging > pest...it's impossible to add a path element that lives inside the > pd-extended.app "folder" using the path dialog. This is because OS X > makes the .app package not look like a folder, I suppose, but it's > unfortunate nevertheless. Off to edit the .plist, I go. If Pd-Extended is GPL'd, then it could use some code that I wrote some years ago (mid-2006?) for editing pdrc: http://artengine.ca/desiredata/gallery/pdrc_6.png Except that it would be made to work with Pd's path system instead of reading/writing .pd files. If that part of Pd-Extended is not GPL'd, this is a tiny piece of quite ordinary code really, so, much any adaptation of it will look like it was made by someone else... copyright applies better on bigger or more original chunks of code. So, the "add" button opens a folder-selection dialogue box for adding a path at the bottom of the list. The "remove" button removes the currently selected row in the listbox. "up" and "down" move the currently selected entry up or down in the list, swapping position with the entry in that direction (to change path priorities). There is no known limit to the number of entries in that listbox. The 2nd listbox could be done away with if Pd-extended doesn't want a dialogue for -helppath. The rest of the dialogue can be ignored, you can do it the way you want. (the example in the screenshot is obsolete... loading that lib now automatically modifies the -path and -helppath in an implicit way) _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr Fri Mar 27 16:26:31 2009 From: cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr (cyrille henry) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 16:26:31 +0100 Subject: [PD] [equalizer] / [lowshelf] / [highshelf] in purepd! In-Reply-To: <20090324070331.GA14255@fliwatut.scifi> References: <200903241216.06587.dmotd@gmx.net> <20090324070331.GA14255@fliwatut.scifi> Message-ID: <49CCF027.9050704@la-kitchen.fr> hello, Frank Barknecht a ?crit : ... > > The others are included in the rjdj library as u_lowpass, u_lowpassq, > u_highpass, u_highpassq, u_bandpass1, u_bandpass1q, u_bandpass2 and > u_bandpass2q. There also is a signal biquad~ as e_beequad available > (which just does linear interpolation of parameters, so it's of course > not really correct if you do larger jumps). > it certainly is obvious, but where can i find them? cyrille > Ciao From fbar at footils.org Fri Mar 27 19:20:07 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 19:20:07 +0100 Subject: [PD] Delay effect without clicks In-Reply-To: References: <49CC0C2E.4060304@gmail.com> <49CC6D4A.1010206@gmail.com> <49CCC252.7030807@alum.mit.edu> Message-ID: <20090327182007.GC24694@footils.org> Hallo, Bj?rn Nielsen hat gesagt: // Bj?rn Nielsen wrote: > But the thing that really differs from an analog delays (with tapes) > is that it is only changing pitch when you change the delaytime value > at the same time as a sound come through. If you makes a short note, > pass it through the delay with a 1sec delay and in the pause between > to delayed notes change the delay time to 1/2 sec, it won't change > pitch. Yeah, that's actually how pitch shifting and delays work. If the delay time is not changing, you also don't hear a pitch change. Only while the delay time changes you get a pitchshifting effect. That's the Doppler effect: If you sit in a police car, you don't hear a pitch change of the horn, but if it passes you, the time the signal needs to reach you is changing with the distance, and that makes the Doppler sound. If you want pitchshifting, check out the example patch, it should do what you want. Ciao -- Frank From fbar at footils.org Fri Mar 27 19:23:14 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 19:23:14 +0100 Subject: [PD] [equalizer] / [lowshelf] / [highshelf] in purepd! In-Reply-To: <49CCF027.9050704@la-kitchen.fr> References: <200903241216.06587.dmotd@gmx.net> <20090324070331.GA14255@fliwatut.scifi> <49CCF027.9050704@la-kitchen.fr> Message-ID: <20090327182314.GD24694@footils.org> Hallo, cyrille henry hat gesagt: // cyrille henry wrote: > Frank Barknecht a ?crit : > ... >> >> The others are included in the rjdj library as u_lowpass, u_lowpassq, >> u_highpass, u_highpassq, u_bandpass1, u_bandpass1q, u_bandpass2 and >> u_bandpass2q. There also is a signal biquad~ as e_beequad available >> (which just does linear interpolation of parameters, so it's of course >> not really correct if you do larger jumps). >> > > it certainly is obvious, but where can i find them? Here's their home page: http://trac.rjdj.me/wiki/RjLibnew rsp. $ svn co http://svn.rjdj.me/scenes/trunk/rjlib/ (They are GPL, but not yet tagged correctly) Ciao -- Frank From rorywalsh at ear.ie Fri Mar 27 20:03:08 2009 From: rorywalsh at ear.ie (Rory Walsh) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 19:03:08 +0000 Subject: [PD] Delay effect without clicks In-Reply-To: <20090327182007.GC24694@footils.org> References: <49CC0C2E.4060304@gmail.com> <49CC6D4A.1010206@gmail.com> <49CCC252.7030807@alum.mit.edu> <20090327182007.GC24694@footils.org> Message-ID: <80ace1a10903271203h58e637e5x97af7338d8d95c49@mail.gmail.com> Are you suggesting that you've spent a lot of time in police cars thinking about this! 2009/3/27 Frank Barknecht : > Hallo, > Bj?rn Nielsen hat gesagt: // Bj?rn Nielsen wrote: > >> But the thing that really differs from an analog delays (with tapes) >> is that it is only changing pitch when you change the delaytime value >> at the same time as a sound come through. If you makes a short note, >> pass it through the delay with a 1sec delay and in the pause between >> to delayed notes change the delay time to 1/2 sec, it won't change >> pitch. From fbar at footils.org Fri Mar 27 20:18:06 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 20:18:06 +0100 Subject: [PD] Delay effect without clicks In-Reply-To: <80ace1a10903271203h58e637e5x97af7338d8d95c49@mail.gmail.com> References: <49CC0C2E.4060304@gmail.com> <49CC6D4A.1010206@gmail.com> <49CCC252.7030807@alum.mit.edu> <20090327182007.GC24694@footils.org> <80ace1a10903271203h58e637e5x97af7338d8d95c49@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090327191806.GA24983@footils.org> Hallo, Rory Walsh hat gesagt: // Rory Walsh wrote: > Are you suggesting that you've spent a lot of time in police cars > thinking about this! Uhm, well, let's not talk about that. ;) Ciao -- Frank From athos.bacchiocchi at tin.it Fri Mar 27 21:39:50 2009 From: athos.bacchiocchi at tin.it (Athos Bacchiocchi) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 21:39:50 +0100 Subject: [PD] experiments with fiddle~ In-Reply-To: References: <49CBE966.7020407@tin.it> Message-ID: <49CD3996.2090904@tin.it> Oded Ben-Tal ha scritto: >> i'm trying to experiment and learn how [fiddle~] works, using it to >> control > > You should probably use [sigmund~] instead. It's not working perfectly > yet but is the future. thanks, i had a look and it seems nice, i will try using it. > As for some technical solutions to event detection the work of Nick > Collins (mostly supercollieder and matlab I believe) has some good > methods > www.informatics.sussex.ac.uk/users/nc81/researchml.php This stuff seems to go deep, maybe too much for me in this period. Saved in bookmarks, and i hope i will have time to read it soon. thanks a lot! athos From hans at eds.org Sat Mar 28 00:10:40 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 19:10:40 -0400 Subject: [PD] agenda for upcoming book sprint?[GEM sprint] In-Reply-To: <49CC5C7E.7050007@gmail.com> References: <8DCD65A4-2A60-4E09-8AD0-14BCE8C147E0@eds.org> <49CAA91F.5050109@gmail.com> <49CBF483.50404@umatic.nl> <49CC5C7E.7050007@gmail.com> Message-ID: I think we definitely should document PDP/PiDIP and Gridflow as well. Do you want to participate and help out? If there aren't any PDP or Gridflow people joining in, then I think it makes the most sense to focus on Gem since it is the most widespread. .hc On Mar 27, 2009, at 12:56 AM, ydegoyon at gmail.com wrote: > that's where the joke is, > that floss manuals cover > software that should also run on windows > > yes, you've always been a joker man, > you know that > > > xiaoo, > sevy > > Derek Holzer wrote: >> Hi guys, >> >> As the "facilitator" of this project, I will post a list of sprint >> targets quite soon. >> >> GEM section is definitely on my list, however I do want to keep to >> things which are both included in PD-Extended and are cross platform. >> For now, this excludes PDP and Gridflow. Maybe if someone wanted to >> make >> a separate section which includes installation/configuration info >> (following the template in the Install chapters of the existing Pd >> FLOSS >> Manual), then a section on one of these might be relevant. But as >> they >> are both essentially Linux only, by virtue of either being >> uncompilable >> or nearly unusable on other platforms, I'd rather keep focus >> someplace else. >> >> As for GEM, I'd like to see some stuff on the following (in order of >> priority): >> >> 1) Basic VJ mixer (2 x >> [gemhead]-[pix_film]-[alpha]-[colorRGB]-[pix_texture]-[rectangle] >> with >> an alpha-crossfader)(+ platform specific codec info) >> 2) Live camera input (same as VJ mixer but with [pix_video], with >> platform specific info on USB/firewire inputs--what works & what >> doesn't) >> 3) VJ effects (using the various pix objects) >> 4) Basic 3D (that actually does something interesting, rather than >> just >> show a sphere or a cube) >> 5) Basic movement tracking w/ [pix_blob] >> 6) GEM/video optimization/troubleshooting tips (see Troubleshooting >> section of existing Pd FLOSS Manual)(Chris Clepper, are you in the >> house?) >> >> I have some tutorial patches which could be used as the basis for >> most >> of this, let me know if you are interested. >> >> Full target list coming soon, I'll make sure to include this GEM >> section. >> >> best, >> Derek >> >> marius schebella wrote: >>> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >>>> >>>> Hey all, >>>> >>>> I hope I am not jumping the gun or stepping on anyone's toes. I >>>> just wanted to open up the discussion about what people are >>>> planning on working on during the upcoming book sprint. >>>> Currently, I am pretty open to topics, but I was thinking that >>>> Gem/PDP/Gridflow could really use a section. There are lots of >>>> examples for them, but they lack a good intro to the concepts. >>> >>> I am in for a gem sprint. >>> marius. >> >> >> > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Access to computers should be unlimited and total. - the hacker ethic From babsyco at hotmail.com Sat Mar 28 00:13:17 2009 From: babsyco at hotmail.com (babsyco babsyco) Date: Fri, 27 Mar 2009 23:13:17 +0000 Subject: [PD] can you help me with this vocoder? Message-ID: Hi guys, What an amazing resource this list is! Very exciting to me. Anyway, I'm after some help with Miller Puckette's vocoder patch. I've used vocoders before, but I can't see any of the recognizable features in this patch. What I wanna do is use an [adc~] as a modulator signal, a white noise generator as a carrier signal, and simply have a mix slider. I've tried the vocoder help patch, but it didn't help me very much. Anything you guys can offer me would be greatly appreciated-I've attached both patches. Babsyco. _________________________________________________________________ Need a new place to rent, share or buy? Let ninemsn property help. http://a.ninemsn.com.au/b.aspx?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fninemsn%2Edomain%2Ecom%2Eau%2F%3Fs%5Fcid%3DFDMedia%3ANineMSN%5FHotmail%5FTagline&_t=774152450&_r=Domain_tagline&_m=EXT -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: fx.vocoder~.pd URL: -------------- next part -------------- An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: fx.vocoder~-help.pd URL: From reduzierer at yahoo.de Sat Mar 28 01:18:24 2009 From: reduzierer at yahoo.de (Roman Haefeli) Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2009 01:18:24 +0100 Subject: [PD] Delay effect without clicks In-Reply-To: References: <49CC0C2E.4060304@gmail.com> <49CC6D4A.1010206@gmail.com> <49CCC252.7030807@alum.mit.edu> Message-ID: <1238199504.13471.13.camel@yoyo2> On Fri, 2009-03-27 at 13:35 +0100, Bj?rn Nielsen wrote: > > from your first email, it sounds like you are expecting a pitch shift. So > > how does the pitch shift you are hearing differ from what you are expecting > > i.e. define "weird." I take it you tried different numbers where the 50 is > > i.e. 500 etc.? Still weird? > > Yeah I tried different line ramp numbers, and it change the pitch > shifting to deeper frequencies the longer the line ramp is. And the > longer the ramp is it feels more unresponsive, since the long ramp. > > But the thing that really differs from an analog delays (with tapes) > is that it is only changing pitch when you change the delaytime value > at the same time as a sound come through. If you makes a short note, > pass it through the delay with a 1sec delay and in the pause between > to delayed notes change the delay time to 1/2 sec, it won't change > pitch. i guess, there is no conceptual difference between analog and digital delay lines. they both work pretty much the same. while the delay is changing, there is a pitchshift. probably the only difference between tape delays and digital delays is, that you probably rather switch between several playheads instead of changing the position of one singleplayhead in a tape delay. in digital domain, it is very easy to do one or the other or both. however, many tape delays have multiple heads anyway and you can switch them on and off as you need them. it's not very difficult to do the same in pd. you just need a [delwrite~] feeding several [delread~]s. you could also build a pitchshifting-less 'delay switcher' with to [delread~]s by fading the first [delread~] out, while the second [delread~] is faded in. so whenever you change delay time, one comes in and the other fades out, alternatingly. > The sound while it change pitch do not sound very smoothly. It has a > definitely digital sound, like a whammy effect. I would like it to > have as much analog feeling as possible. if you are decreasing the delay time, the sound is pitched up and depending on the frequency spectrum of the signal and how fast you decrease the time, you get more or less aliasing effects. roman ___________________________________________________________ Telefonate ohne weitere Kosten vom PC zum PC: http://messenger.yahoo.de From derek at umatic.nl Sat Mar 28 01:56:37 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2009 01:56:37 +0100 Subject: [PD] agenda for upcoming book sprint?[GEM sprint] In-Reply-To: References: <8DCD65A4-2A60-4E09-8AD0-14BCE8C147E0@eds.org> <49CAA91F.5050109@gmail.com> <49CBF483.50404@umatic.nl> <49CC5C7E.7050007@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49CD75C5.4090401@umatic.nl> My thoughts exactly...document what people actually use most, in a way which helps them to use it. As I said, if someone wants to go through all the trouble of making a separate install guide for PDP or Gridflow, I'd consider including it. As it stands, however, both of these can change at any moment depending on distros and dependencies.... on top of the fact that they only run well on Linux + x86 architecture (PDP) or cannot be compiled at all except on Linux (Gridflow). For me to accept them into the FLOSS manual, the installation process must be completely and reliably documented as well. No lazy "just compile it and cry to the mailing list if it doesn't work" instructions which leave newbies lost. Free software is only really free when you don't have to be a computer programmer to get it working. As it stands, I want to focus on accessibility first off. So cross-platform + Pd Extended is the baseline for the FLOSS Manual, as it has been from the beginning. D. Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > I think it makes the most sense to focus on Gem since it is the most widespread. -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 30: "Change specifics to ambiguities" From hans at eds.org Sat Mar 28 06:11:43 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2009 01:11:43 -0400 Subject: [PD] agenda for upcoming book sprint?[GEM sprint] In-Reply-To: <49CD75C5.4090401@umatic.nl> References: <8DCD65A4-2A60-4E09-8AD0-14BCE8C147E0@eds.org> <49CAA91F.5050109@gmail.com> <49CBF483.50404@umatic.nl> <49CC5C7E.7050007@gmail.com> <49CD75C5.4090401@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <8FEA44D2-7E5E-4A41-9644-5E993367AC5C@eds.org> For what its worth, PDP/PiDiP has been included in Mac OS X and GNU/ Linux Pd-extended since 0.39.3, so no compilation instructions needed. We do still need someone to write the docs. I don't think I know enough to write more than a paragraph. Same goes with Gridflow, in my book. .hc On Mar 27, 2009, at 8:56 PM, Derek Holzer wrote: > My thoughts exactly...document what people actually use most, in a > way which helps them to use it. As I said, if someone wants to go > through all the trouble of making a separate install guide for PDP > or Gridflow, I'd consider including it. > > As it stands, however, both of these can change at any moment > depending on distros and dependencies.... on top of the fact that > they only run well on Linux + x86 architecture (PDP) or cannot be > compiled at all except on Linux (Gridflow). For me to accept them > into the FLOSS manual, the installation process must be completely > and reliably documented as well. No lazy "just compile it and cry to > the mailing list if it doesn't work" instructions which leave > newbies lost. Free software is only really free when you don't have > to be a computer programmer to get it working. > > As it stands, I want to focus on accessibility first off. So cross- > platform + Pd Extended is the baseline for the FLOSS Manual, as it > has been from the beginning. > > D. > > Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > >> I think it makes the most sense to focus on Gem since it is the >> most widespread. > > -- > ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista > ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 30: > "Change specifics to ambiguities" > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- If you are not part of the solution, you are part of the problem. From chris at mccormick.cx Sat Mar 28 10:32:09 2009 From: chris at mccormick.cx (Chris McCormick) Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2009 09:32:09 +0000 Subject: [PD] [OT] Re: DIY GSoC: getting those projects done In-Reply-To: References: <475768.89279.qm@web65603.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <20090328093208.GA24532@mccormick.cx> On Thu, Mar 26, 2009 at 10:42:25AM -0400, Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > No, this was about how [expr] can be a replacement for even a small > network of objects. If you make an abstraction that does > ($f1-$f2)*($f5-$f4)/($f3-$f2)+$f4, with just [+] [-] [*] [/] for example, > then if you change some things in the cold inlets, the changes might not > propagate to the bottom. This means you have to add a [pack 0 0 0 0 0] of > the whole thing and [unpack 0 0 0 0 0] to ensure every hot-inlet is > retriggered in the proper order. Actually, in this pack/unpack dance, > maybe you can skip the hot-inlet of the abstraction (?), but apart from > that, you're pretty stuck using pack/unpack if you want life to be > simple. Else you can weave a mess of [t b f] objects like a spider on > caffeine. That's what I mean. When I was thinking about writing a general purpose dataflow programming language which addresses some of Pd's shortcomings, I did a lot of thinking about the hot and cold inlet paradigm. What I came up with was the following scheme: * Hot inlets are red * Cold inlets are blue * Neutral inlets are grey * A class has a default hot/cold/neutral inlet configuration defined by the author. * The UI allows the user to change the hot/cold/neutral status of inlets. * An instance's 'run' method is executed when any of the following conditions are met: * Every cold inlet has been pinged (receives data) * Any hot inlet has been pinged (receives data) * Inlets cache their last received data if no new data arrives. In Pd, DSP inlets act like the 'cold' inlets above, message inlets which aren't the leftmost message inlet [usually] act like 'neutral' inlets above, and the leftmost inlet [usually] acts like 'hot' inlets above. I like the idea of this behaviour being defined by the class author, but (re)configurable by the user. Best, Chris. ------------------- http://mccormick.cx From adam at xs4all.nl Sat Mar 28 10:32:24 2009 From: adam at xs4all.nl (adam hyde) Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2009 09:32:24 +0000 Subject: [PD] agenda for upcoming book sprint?[GEM sprint] In-Reply-To: <8FEA44D2-7E5E-4A41-9644-5E993367AC5C@eds.org> References: <8DCD65A4-2A60-4E09-8AD0-14BCE8C147E0@eds.org> <49CAA91F.5050109@gmail.com> <49CBF483.50404@umatic.nl> <49CC5C7E.7050007@gmail.com> <49CD75C5.4090401@umatic.nl> <8FEA44D2-7E5E-4A41-9644-5E993367AC5C@eds.org> Message-ID: <1238232744.7459.220.camel@esetera> hey I can document pdp/pidip installation. it contains the packages i have used the most so happy to help if you think its within the scope of the manual Derek. It might be however, that we should focus first on the basics. One issue that might prevent this is if we get too ambitious for this first round and make the scope of the manual too broad. so, while i'd love to see pdp/pidip included in the first full release, i think first we should bite of a chunk we know we can finish in 3 days...the rest can be included in another sprint thoughts? adam On Sat, 2009-03-28 at 01:11 -0400, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > For what its worth, PDP/PiDiP has been included in Mac OS X and GNU/ > Linux Pd-extended since 0.39.3, so no compilation instructions > needed. We do still need someone to write the docs. I don't think I > know enough to write more than a paragraph. Same goes with Gridflow, > in my book. > > .hc > > On Mar 27, 2009, at 8:56 PM, Derek Holzer wrote: > > > My thoughts exactly...document what people actually use most, in a > > way which helps them to use it. As I said, if someone wants to go > > through all the trouble of making a separate install guide for PDP > > or Gridflow, I'd consider including it. > > > > As it stands, however, both of these can change at any moment > > depending on distros and dependencies.... on top of the fact that > > they only run well on Linux + x86 architecture (PDP) or cannot be > > compiled at all except on Linux (Gridflow). For me to accept them > > into the FLOSS manual, the installation process must be completely > > and reliably documented as well. No lazy "just compile it and cry to > > the mailing list if it doesn't work" instructions which leave > > newbies lost. Free software is only really free when you don't have > > to be a computer programmer to get it working. > > > > As it stands, I want to focus on accessibility first off. So cross- > > platform + Pd Extended is the baseline for the FLOSS Manual, as it > > has been from the beginning. > > > > D. > > > > Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > > >> I think it makes the most sense to focus on Gem since it is the > >> most widespread. > > > > -- > > ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista > > ::: > > ---Oblique Strategy # 30: > > "Change specifics to ambiguities" > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > If you are not part of the solution, you are part of the problem. > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > From derek at umatic.nl Sat Mar 28 11:10:06 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2009 11:10:06 +0100 Subject: [PD] agenda for upcoming book sprint?[GEM sprint] In-Reply-To: <1238232744.7459.220.camel@esetera> References: <8DCD65A4-2A60-4E09-8AD0-14BCE8C147E0@eds.org> <49CAA91F.5050109@gmail.com> <49CBF483.50404@umatic.nl> <49CC5C7E.7050007@gmail.com> <49CD75C5.4090401@umatic.nl> <8FEA44D2-7E5E-4A41-9644-5E993367AC5C@eds.org> <1238232744.7459.220.camel@esetera> Message-ID: <49CDF77E.1030506@umatic.nl> Hi Adam, My thoughts: 1) As HC mentioned, PDP is in Pd Extended already, although it doesn't always run out of the box on OSX 2) Complete install instructions should include how to get it running on OSX (X11 must be installed, maybe some other things) 3) PiDiP could be more complicated, as it requires specific versions of Quicktime and perhaps some other libs, IIRC. Someone would need to check its dependencies on OSX before writing the install guide. And because this seems to change often, that person would need to stay on top of changes which would affect PiDiP's usability. I don't know if this has been taken account of in Pd-Extended, maybe HC can answer that. 4) Even if PDP is able to run on OSX, it runs very poorly in comparison to on x86 Linux. It also runs poorly on PPC Linux, dues to its code being highly optimized for the x86 architecture. This should be mentioned in the install instructions as well. 5) We'd still need someone to write some useful tutorials. I agree at need for documentation, as the help files and docs which come with PDP are some of the most cryptic I've ever seen! PiDiP docs make sense, OTOH, but some realworld application of some of this stuff would be nice. ---->side note to HC: is X11 a prerequisite for GEM on OSX Pd Extended now? I saw some people at my last workshop had some missing libs with newer Pd Extended installers... D. adam hyde wrote: > hey > > I can document pdp/pidip installation. it contains the packages i have > used the most so happy to help if you think its within the scope of the > manual Derek. > > It might be however, that we should focus first on the basics. One issue > that might prevent this is if we get too ambitious for this first round > and make the scope of the manual too broad. > > so, while i'd love to see pdp/pidip included in the first full release, > i think first we should bite of a chunk we know we can finish in 3 > days...the rest can be included in another sprint > > thoughts? > > adam > > > > On Sat, 2009-03-28 at 01:11 -0400, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >> For what its worth, PDP/PiDiP has been included in Mac OS X and GNU/ >> Linux Pd-extended since 0.39.3, so no compilation instructions >> needed. We do still need someone to write the docs. I don't think I >> know enough to write more than a paragraph. Same goes with Gridflow, >> in my book. >> >> .hc >> >> On Mar 27, 2009, at 8:56 PM, Derek Holzer wrote: >> >>> My thoughts exactly...document what people actually use most, in a >>> way which helps them to use it. As I said, if someone wants to go >>> through all the trouble of making a separate install guide for PDP >>> or Gridflow, I'd consider including it. >>> >>> As it stands, however, both of these can change at any moment >>> depending on distros and dependencies.... on top of the fact that >>> they only run well on Linux + x86 architecture (PDP) or cannot be >>> compiled at all except on Linux (Gridflow). For me to accept them >>> into the FLOSS manual, the installation process must be completely >>> and reliably documented as well. No lazy "just compile it and cry to >>> the mailing list if it doesn't work" instructions which leave >>> newbies lost. Free software is only really free when you don't have >>> to be a computer programmer to get it working. >>> >>> As it stands, I want to focus on accessibility first off. So cross- >>> platform + Pd Extended is the baseline for the FLOSS Manual, as it >>> has been from the beginning. >>> >>> D. >>> >>> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >>> >>>> I think it makes the most sense to focus on Gem since it is the >>>> most widespread. >>> -- >>> ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista >>> ::: >>> ---Oblique Strategy # 30: >>> "Change specifics to ambiguities" >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> If you are not part of the solution, you are part of the problem. >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> > > -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 205: "First work alone, then work in unusual pairs." From chris at mccormick.cx Sat Mar 28 11:28:23 2009 From: chris at mccormick.cx (Chris McCormick) Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2009 10:28:23 +0000 Subject: [PD] Looking for a gig in Barcelona Message-ID: <20090328102823.GA8542@mccormick.cx> Hi All, Forgive me if this should be marked [OT], but I use Pd for my live stuff so I guess it's not. :) I'm going to be in Barcelona for two weeks starting Monday, and I'd love to play a live set while there. Maybe someone who knows the electronic music scene in Bcn. can help me out? Best, Chris. ------------------- http://mccormick.cx From fbar at footils.org Sat Mar 28 12:34:12 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2009 12:34:12 +0100 Subject: [PD] bonk~ license issue Message-ID: <20090328113412.GF27094@fliwatut.scifi> Hallo, To Whom It May Concern: bonk~.c in Pd sources prior to version 0.42 has a little license issue. Old versions, e.g. http://tinyurl.com/cz6s95 include this section: 2 (tapel at ucsd.edu). Permission is granted to use this software for any 3 noncommercial purpose. For commercial licensing please contact the UCSD 4 Technology Transfer Office. which obviously is not compatible with pd-extended, Debian etc. This issue is fixed in the current versions of bonk~.c were we find the usual "Standard Improved BSD License" clause, see e.g.: http://tinyurl.com/ceotxv If you distribute Pd with bonk~, you probably want to update your sources. You get new features, too. Ciao -- Frank Barknecht Do You RjDj.me? _ ______footils.org__ From cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr Sat Mar 28 13:14:03 2009 From: cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr (cyrille henry) Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2009 13:14:03 +0100 Subject: [PD] rjdj, was : Re: [equalizer] / [lowshelf] / [highshelf] in purepd! In-Reply-To: <20090327182314.GD24694@footils.org> References: <200903241216.06587.dmotd@gmx.net> <20090324070331.GA14255@fliwatut.scifi> <49CCF027.9050704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090327182314.GD24694@footils.org> Message-ID: <49CE148B.6020402@la-kitchen.fr> hello Frank, nice to see all of this good stuff in pure vanilla pd. i've got some questions : -why this is not available in pd-extended / in pd svn? -did you benchmark e_beequad~ regarding to bequad~ specially when cutoff / band is change frequently) -have you noticed that in svn/nusmuk/osc you can find lot's better bl saw that you can use (ok, it use expr~, but you can easily remove it). this bl oscillator use a personal enhancement of miller technique. cyrille Frank Barknecht a ?crit : > Hallo, > cyrille henry hat gesagt: // cyrille henry wrote: > >> Frank Barknecht a ?crit : >> ... >>> The others are included in the rjdj library as u_lowpass, u_lowpassq, >>> u_highpass, u_highpassq, u_bandpass1, u_bandpass1q, u_bandpass2 and >>> u_bandpass2q. There also is a signal biquad~ as e_beequad available >>> (which just does linear interpolation of parameters, so it's of course >>> not really correct if you do larger jumps). >>> >> it certainly is obvious, but where can i find them? > > Here's their home page: http://trac.rjdj.me/wiki/RjLibnew rsp. > $ svn co http://svn.rjdj.me/scenes/trunk/rjlib/ > (They are GPL, but not yet tagged correctly) > > Ciao From cgclepper at gmail.com Sat Mar 28 15:01:38 2009 From: cgclepper at gmail.com (chris clepper) Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2009 10:01:38 -0400 Subject: [PD] agenda for upcoming book sprint?[GEM sprint] In-Reply-To: <49CDF77E.1030506@umatic.nl> References: <8DCD65A4-2A60-4E09-8AD0-14BCE8C147E0@eds.org> <49CAA91F.5050109@gmail.com> <49CBF483.50404@umatic.nl> <49CC5C7E.7050007@gmail.com> <49CD75C5.4090401@umatic.nl> <8FEA44D2-7E5E-4A41-9644-5E993367AC5C@eds.org> <1238232744.7459.220.camel@esetera> <49CDF77E.1030506@umatic.nl> Message-ID: On Sat, Mar 28, 2009 at 6:10 AM, Derek Holzer wrote: > > ---->side note to HC: is X11 a prerequisite for GEM on OSX Pd Extended > now? I saw some people at my last workshop had some missing libs with newer > Pd Extended installers... Nothing in the GEM code relies on X11, but I think the extended build is using it for freetype and/or FTGL. Those can be statically built into the binary like we have done for GEM releases on OSX in the past. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cgclepper at gmail.com Sat Mar 28 15:04:34 2009 From: cgclepper at gmail.com (chris clepper) Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2009 10:04:34 -0400 Subject: [PD] agenda for upcoming book sprint?[GEM sprint] In-Reply-To: References: <8DCD65A4-2A60-4E09-8AD0-14BCE8C147E0@eds.org> <49CAA91F.5050109@gmail.com> <49CBF483.50404@umatic.nl> <49CC5C7E.7050007@gmail.com> <49CD75C5.4090401@umatic.nl> <8FEA44D2-7E5E-4A41-9644-5E993367AC5C@eds.org> <1238232744.7459.220.camel@esetera> <49CDF77E.1030506@umatic.nl> Message-ID: On Sat, Mar 28, 2009 at 10:01 AM, chris clepper wrote: > > Nothing in the GEM code relies on X11, > That should read 'Nothing in the GEM OSX code relies on X11'. Obviously, Linux uses X11 for window and event handling. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From fbar at footils.org Sat Mar 28 15:37:56 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2009 15:37:56 +0100 Subject: [PD] rjdj, was : Re: [equalizer] / [lowshelf] / [highshelf] in purepd! In-Reply-To: <49CE148B.6020402@la-kitchen.fr> References: <200903241216.06587.dmotd@gmx.net> <20090324070331.GA14255@fliwatut.scifi> <49CCF027.9050704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090327182314.GD24694@footils.org> <49CE148B.6020402@la-kitchen.fr> Message-ID: <20090328143756.GA27685@footils.org> Hallo, cyrille henry hat gesagt: // cyrille henry wrote: > nice to see all of this good stuff in pure vanilla pd. > > i've got some questions : -why this is not available in pd-extended / in pd > svn? The rjdj-svn is the canonical location for rj-lib, but of course as it's GPL/BSD it can be copied anywhere. For contributions we can only accept stuff that either is BSD or transfers copyright to Reality Jockey as we want to avoid legal problems as a distributor of rjlib to others ("others" currently includes Apple, so we have to be extra-extra cautious about this.) > -did you benchmark e_beequad~ regarding to bequad~ specially when cutoff / > band is change frequently) Do you mean to "biquad~" or what is "bequad~"? biquad~ in Pd should be a lot faster, but I didn't benchmark it. > -have you noticed that in svn/nusmuk/osc you can find lot's better bl saw > that you can use (ok, it use expr~, but you can easily remove it). this bl > oscillator use a personal enhancement of miller technique. No, I hadn't seen this. It doesn't seem to need the [samphold~] which would be cool to avoid anyway. Could you elaborate the algorithm a bit and how it's better? I think, currently it's probably a bit slower because of the sin(), but maybe that could be put into a tabread~. Ciao -- Frank From lluisgomez at hangar.org Sat Mar 28 15:08:51 2009 From: lluisgomez at hangar.org (lluis gomez i bigorda) Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2009 15:08:51 +0100 Subject: [PD] Looking for a gig in Barcelona In-Reply-To: <20090328102823.GA8542@mccormick.cx> References: <20090328102823.GA8542@mccormick.cx> Message-ID: <49CE2F73.2030202@hangar.org> hi Chris, we use to organize an "open workgroup" (just as relaxed sessions) of pd in hangar http://hangar.org/drupal/?q=content/general-information http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=es&geocode=&time=&date=&ttype=&q=hangar&sll=41.37329,2.166978&sspn=0.005048,0.010782&ie=UTF8&ll=41.408183,2.197094&spn=0.005045,0.010782&t=h&z=17&iwlo every thursday starting arround 19:30, you are welcome, I'm personally more focussed on video stuff but I'm forwarding this message to other musicians of the group ... best, ll. En/na Chris McCormick ha escrit: > Hi All, > > Forgive me if this should be marked [OT], but I use Pd for my live stuff so I > guess it's not. :) I'm going to be in Barcelona for two weeks starting Monday, > and I'd love to play a live set while there. Maybe someone who knows the > electronic music scene in Bcn. can help me out? > > Best, > > Chris. > > ------------------- > http://mccormick.cx > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > From abonnements at revolwear.com Sat Mar 28 17:52:39 2009 From: abonnements at revolwear.com (Max) Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2009 17:52:39 +0100 Subject: [PD] GEM pix_write bugs (timelapse) Message-ID: <143F6FC6-8E45-4097-9379-B08AD6E72E64@revolwear.com> hi list, i've thrown together this tiny gem patch which makes a timelapse slideshow. i have encountered a few issues with it. configuration: Pd version 0.41.4-extended-20090223 GEM: ver: 0.91.3 'tigital' GEM: compiled: Feb 23 2009 OS X 10.5.6 the issues: 1. pix_write doesn't interpret the file path correctly. it seems it can't understand relative paths at all. 2. pix_write accepts a message [file [](. it creates files with a .jpg ending if the type is >0. But in reality it still is a TIFF. no matter what value you write. 3. pix_write creates files with an acending number 0...9999 this conflicts with how other objects like pix_multiimage do it (00000...99999) just submitted that to the gem bugtracker. and the patch: put this to / because of the bug in pix_write to make it work. put a folder called "frames" beside it. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: timelapse.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 2854 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- beware: this patch will also eat up all the memory and will crash pd. this isn't pix_writes problem though - i'll try to find out why this is now. max -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: PGP.sig Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 194 bytes Desc: Signierter Teil der Nachricht URL: From ico.bukvic at gmail.com Sat Mar 28 17:59:59 2009 From: ico.bukvic at gmail.com (Ivica Ico Bukvic) Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2009 12:59:59 -0400 Subject: [PD] pd-gui stops updating after a while in visually busy patches Message-ID: <7cc710c20903280959j6c1e32d7sd2cd118e78279756@mail.gmail.com> Hi all, This pertains to pd-extended 0.40.3. It appears that when a patch has a very busy GUI (as is the case with wiimote help file), after a while the GUI stops being responsive. The objects can be still moved and even atoms can be written into, but when one presses "return" to update atom value or when an atom or a slider needs to change due to automated update (e.g. via metro) nothing happens until pd is restarted. The sound engine and control mechanisms running through these still work and are responsive, it is just that gui remains totally frozen. Not sure if this only pertains to the wiimote object or other busy patches as well. Any ideas? Ico -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr Sat Mar 28 18:21:39 2009 From: cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr (cyrille henry) Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2009 18:21:39 +0100 Subject: [PD] rjdj, was : Re: [equalizer] / [lowshelf] / [highshelf] in purepd! In-Reply-To: <20090328143756.GA27685@footils.org> References: <200903241216.06587.dmotd@gmx.net> <20090324070331.GA14255@fliwatut.scifi> <49CCF027.9050704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090327182314.GD24694@footils.org> <49CE148B.6020402@la-kitchen.fr> <20090328143756.GA27685@footils.org> Message-ID: <49CE5CA3.1090704@la-kitchen.fr> hello Frank Barknecht a ?crit : > Hallo, > cyrille henry hat gesagt: // cyrille henry wrote: > >> nice to see all of this good stuff in pure vanilla pd. >> >> i've got some questions : -why this is not available in pd-extended / in pd >> svn? > > The rjdj-svn is the canonical location for rj-lib, but of course as it's > GPL/BSD it can be copied anywhere. For contributions we can only accept stuff > that either is BSD or transfers copyright to Reality Jockey as we want to avoid > legal problems as a distributor of rjlib to others ("others" currently includes > Apple, so we have to be extra-extra cautious about this.) ok. > >> -did you benchmark e_beequad~ regarding to bequad~ specially when cutoff / >> band is change frequently) > > Do you mean to "biquad~" or what is "bequad~"? biquad~ in Pd should be a lot > faster, but I didn't benchmark it. yep, tipo, i mean biquad~. of course biquad~ look faster, but i'm wondering how many times... i'll have to look at performance when i'll have more time. > >> -have you noticed that in svn/nusmuk/osc you can find lot's better bl saw >> that you can use (ok, it use expr~, but you can easily remove it). this bl >> oscillator use a personal enhancement of miller technique. > > No, I hadn't seen this. It doesn't seem to need the [samphold~] which would be > cool to avoid anyway. Could you elaborate the algorithm a bit and how it's > better? it's sound lot's better! isn't that the aim? (i think it is almost perfect, and can easily be enhanced) try to fft's it if you're not convinced. i think i would take me 1/2h to explain in french exactly what i made. so i really can't explain it in a mail in english. in miller algorythm, the quick transition of the saw is replaced with a softer transition. this is fine. but the switch from saw~ to the soft transition is causing problem. in "my" algo the transition is based on sinus cardinal (is that the english name?) and last for a whole period of the waveform. if you need more explanation, you'll have to ask some math geek. (mathieu maybe?) > > I think, currently it's probably a bit slower because of the sin(), but maybe > that could be put into a tabread~. i think the sin object is doing a linear interpolation in a 512 point table. (don't know how it is done in expr~, but expr~ is not used for rjlib because of it's licence, right?) Cyrille > > Ciao From ydegoyon at gmail.com Sat Mar 28 19:01:31 2009 From: ydegoyon at gmail.com (ydegoyon at gmail.com) Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2009 19:01:31 +0100 Subject: [PD] agenda for upcoming book sprint?[GEM sprint] In-Reply-To: <49CDF77E.1030506@umatic.nl> References: <8DCD65A4-2A60-4E09-8AD0-14BCE8C147E0@eds.org> <49CAA91F.5050109@gmail.com> <49CBF483.50404@umatic.nl> <49CC5C7E.7050007@gmail.com> <49CD75C5.4090401@umatic.nl> <8FEA44D2-7E5E-4A41-9644-5E993367AC5C@eds.org> <1238232744.7459.220.camel@esetera> <49CDF77E.1030506@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <49CE65FB.3090700@gmail.com> ola, > > 3) PiDiP could be more complicated, as it requires specific versions > of Quicktime and perhaps some other libs, IIRC. not true, it uses libquicktime like PDP and so if you have it installed with PDP it's ok, and it uses LibQuicktime only for the camera input like Gem, so i never heard of specific version needed. > Someone would need to check its dependencies on OSX before writing the > install guide. And because this seems to change often even more surprising as the development of PiDiP is almost 0 since 2 years, i use only text for visuals , not video... xiaoo, sevy From derek at umatic.nl Sat Mar 28 19:06:31 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2009 19:06:31 +0100 Subject: [PD] agenda for upcoming book sprint?[GEM sprint] In-Reply-To: <49CE65FB.3090700@gmail.com> References: <8DCD65A4-2A60-4E09-8AD0-14BCE8C147E0@eds.org> <49CAA91F.5050109@gmail.com> <49CBF483.50404@umatic.nl> <49CC5C7E.7050007@gmail.com> <49CD75C5.4090401@umatic.nl> <8FEA44D2-7E5E-4A41-9644-5E993367AC5C@eds.org> <1238232744.7459.220.camel@esetera> <49CDF77E.1030506@umatic.nl> <49CE65FB.3090700@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49CE6727.3030504@umatic.nl> Thanks for clarification. I remembered different issues coming up on the list before, thus these concerns. D. ydegoyon at gmail.com wrote: > ola, >> >> 3) PiDiP could be more complicated, as it requires specific versions >> of Quicktime and perhaps some other libs, IIRC. > not true, it uses libquicktime like PDP > and so if you have it installed with PDP it's ok, > and it uses LibQuicktime only for the camera > input like Gem, > so i never heard of specific version needed. >> Someone would need to check its dependencies on OSX before writing the >> install guide. And because this seems to change often > even more surprising as the development > of PiDiP is almost 0 since 2 years, > i use only text for visuals , not video... > > xiaoo, > sevy > -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 93: "Into the impossible" From ydegoyon at gmail.com Sat Mar 28 19:37:09 2009 From: ydegoyon at gmail.com (ydegoyon at gmail.com) Date: Sat, 28 Mar 2009 19:37:09 +0100 Subject: [PD] agenda for upcoming book sprint?[GEM sprint] In-Reply-To: <49CE6727.3030504@umatic.nl> References: <8DCD65A4-2A60-4E09-8AD0-14BCE8C147E0@eds.org> <49CAA91F.5050109@gmail.com> <49CBF483.50404@umatic.nl> <49CC5C7E.7050007@gmail.com> <49CD75C5.4090401@umatic.nl> <8FEA44D2-7E5E-4A41-9644-5E993367AC5C@eds.org> <1238232744.7459.220.camel@esetera> <49CDF77E.1030506@umatic.nl> <49CE65FB.3090700@gmail.com> <49CE6727.3030504@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <49CE6E55.1050907@gmail.com> ola, to make it even clearer, 2 persons ( lluis gomez i bigorda and sergi lario ) keep developping some things for pdp/pidip, and also for gem, like the opencv bindings for pd that you might see in pd convention : http://www.hangar.org/wikis/lab/doku.php?id=start:puredata_opencv but they are not included in pd-extended and are delivered as specific packages xiaoo, sevy Derek Holzer wrote: > Thanks for clarification. I remembered different issues coming up on > the list before, thus these concerns. > > D. > > ydegoyon at gmail.com wrote: >> ola, >>> >>> 3) PiDiP could be more complicated, as it requires specific versions >>> of Quicktime and perhaps some other libs, IIRC. >> not true, it uses libquicktime like PDP >> and so if you have it installed with PDP it's ok, >> and it uses LibQuicktime only for the camera >> input like Gem, >> so i never heard of specific version needed. >>> Someone would need to check its dependencies on OSX before writing >>> the install guide. And because this seems to change often >> even more surprising as the development >> of PiDiP is almost 0 since 2 years, >> i use only text for visuals , not video... >> >> xiaoo, >> sevy >> > From hans at eds.org Sun Mar 29 06:38:42 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 00:38:42 -0400 Subject: [PD] agenda for upcoming book sprint?[GEM sprint] In-Reply-To: References: <8DCD65A4-2A60-4E09-8AD0-14BCE8C147E0@eds.org> <49CAA91F.5050109@gmail.com> <49CBF483.50404@umatic.nl> <49CC5C7E.7050007@gmail.com> <49CD75C5.4090401@umatic.nl> <8FEA44D2-7E5E-4A41-9644-5E993367AC5C@eds.org> <1238232744.7459.220.camel@esetera> <49CDF77E.1030506@umatic.nl> Message-ID: On Mar 28, 2009, at 10:01 AM, chris clepper wrote: > On Sat, Mar 28, 2009 at 6:10 AM, Derek Holzer wrote: > > ---->side note to HC: is X11 a prerequisite for GEM on OSX Pd > Extended now? I saw some people at my last workshop had some missing > libs with newer Pd Extended installers... > > Nothing in the GEM code relies on X11, but I think the extended > build is using it for freetype and/or FTGL. Those can be statically > built into the binary like we have done for GEM releases on OSX in > the past. Gem gets linked against Apple's freetype, which is part of the X11 package, so that's where the requirement comes from. It would be possible to make Gem use the Fink freetype. Mac OS X 10.5 now comes with X11 installed, so this issue only applies to 10.4. There is a decent FAQ entry on how to install X11 for people with 10.4: http://puredata.info/docs/faq/macosx .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Access to computers should be unlimited and total. - the hacker ethic -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From fbar at footils.org Sun Mar 29 11:57:35 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 11:57:35 +0200 Subject: [PD] pd-gui stops updating after a while in visually busy patches In-Reply-To: <7cc710c20903280959j6c1e32d7sd2cd118e78279756@mail.gmail.com> References: <7cc710c20903280959j6c1e32d7sd2cd118e78279756@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090329095735.GA30542@footils.org> Hallo, Ivica Ico Bukvic hat gesagt: // Ivica Ico Bukvic wrote: > This pertains to pd-extended 0.40.3. It appears that when a patch has a very > busy GUI (as is the case with wiimote help file), after a while the GUI > stops being responsive. The objects can be still moved and even atoms can be > written into, but when one presses "return" to update atom value or when an > atom or a slider needs to change due to automated update (e.g. via metro) > nothing happens until pd is restarted. The sound engine and control > mechanisms running through these still work and are responsive, it is just > that gui remains totally frozen. Not sure if this only pertains to the > wiimote object or other busy patches as well. It can happen in general. Updating GUI objects too often (i.e. faster than the eye can see) should be avoided in general. Passing messages through GUI sliders even is buggy in Pd: sliders may change the incoming values so what comes out is not the same as what came in (there is an open bug report regarding this on SF.) So while a better GUI handling would be nice, it's currently better to stay defensive and change the patch to limit updates with something like change, metro, speedlim and/or RjDj's m_speedlimit. Ciao -- Frank From fbar at footils.org Sun Mar 29 12:53:26 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 12:53:26 +0200 Subject: [PD] rjdj, was : Re: [equalizer] / [lowshelf] / [highshelf] in purepd! In-Reply-To: <49CE5CA3.1090704@la-kitchen.fr> References: <200903241216.06587.dmotd@gmx.net> <20090324070331.GA14255@fliwatut.scifi> <49CCF027.9050704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090327182314.GD24694@footils.org> <49CE148B.6020402@la-kitchen.fr> <20090328143756.GA27685@footils.org> <49CE5CA3.1090704@la-kitchen.fr> Message-ID: <20090329105326.GB8572@fliwatut.scifi> Hallo, cyrille henry hat gesagt: // cyrille henry wrote: >> I think, currently it's probably a bit slower because of the sin(), but maybe >> that could be put into a tabread~. > i think the sin object is doing a linear interpolation in a 512 point table. > (don't know how it is done in expr~, but expr~ is not used for rjlib because of it's licence, right?) Attached is an expr-less version of saw~ which from a quick glance at the scope looks and sounds the same. It is vanilla in that it uses [abs~] and [>~] which are part of 0.42 (and thus RjDj). On older Pd versions you can use for example the purepd abstractions for both from the SVN in abstractions/purepd Ciao -- Frank Barknecht Do You RjDj.me? _ ______footils.org__ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: saw2~.pd Type: application/puredata Size: 1571 bytes Desc: not available URL: From derek at umatic.nl Sun Mar 29 13:13:11 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 13:13:11 +0200 Subject: [PD] agenda for upcoming book sprint?[GEM sprint] In-Reply-To: References: <8DCD65A4-2A60-4E09-8AD0-14BCE8C147E0@eds.org> <49CAA91F.5050109@gmail.com> <49CBF483.50404@umatic.nl> <49CC5C7E.7050007@gmail.com> <49CD75C5.4090401@umatic.nl> <8FEA44D2-7E5E-4A41-9644-5E993367AC5C@eds.org> <1238232744.7459.220.camel@esetera> <49CDF77E.1030506@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <49CF57C7.4050907@umatic.nl> OK, then this needs to be added to the install instructions. D. Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > On Mar 28, 2009, at 10:01 AM, chris clepper wrote: > >> On Sat, Mar 28, 2009 at 6:10 AM, Derek Holzer > > wrote: >> >> >> ---->side note to HC: is X11 a prerequisite for GEM on OSX Pd >> Extended now? I saw some people at my last workshop had some >> missing libs with newer Pd Extended installers... >> >> >> Nothing in the GEM code relies on X11, but I think the extended build >> is using it for freetype and/or FTGL. Those can be statically built >> into the binary like we have done for GEM releases on OSX in the past. > > Gem gets linked against Apple's freetype, which is part of the X11 > package, so that's where the requirement comes from. It would be > possible to make Gem use the Fink freetype. Mac OS X 10.5 now comes > with X11 installed, so this issue only applies to 10.4. There is a > decent FAQ entry on how to install X11 for people with 10.4: > > http://puredata.info/docs/faq/macosx > > .hc > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Access to computers should be unlimited and total. - the hacker ethic > > -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 189: "You are an engineer" From cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr Sun Mar 29 13:31:17 2009 From: cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr (cyrille henry) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 13:31:17 +0200 Subject: [PD] bl oscillator, was : Re: rjdj, was : Re: [equalizer] / [lowshelf] / [highshelf] in purepd! In-Reply-To: <20090329105326.GB8572@fliwatut.scifi> References: <200903241216.06587.dmotd@gmx.net> <20090324070331.GA14255@fliwatut.scifi> <49CCF027.9050704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090327182314.GD24694@footils.org> <49CE148B.6020402@la-kitchen.fr> <20090328143756.GA27685@footils.org> <49CE5CA3.1090704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090329105326.GB8572@fliwatut.scifi> Message-ID: <49CF5C05.7030502@la-kitchen.fr> wow, this version is almost 2 time faster than the original. i did not know that expr~ was so slow... do you mind if use this version to replace mine? thanks Cyrille Frank Barknecht a ?crit : > Hallo, > cyrille henry hat gesagt: // cyrille henry wrote: >>> I think, currently it's probably a bit slower because of the sin(), but maybe >>> that could be put into a tabread~. >> i think the sin object is doing a linear interpolation in a 512 point table. >> (don't know how it is done in expr~, but expr~ is not used for rjlib because of it's licence, right?) > > Attached is an expr-less version of saw~ which from a quick glance at > the scope looks and sounds the same. It is vanilla in that it uses > [abs~] and [>~] which are part of 0.42 (and thus RjDj). On older Pd > versions you can use for example the purepd abstractions for both from > the SVN in abstractions/purepd > > Ciao > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From enrique at netpd.org Sun Mar 29 13:41:40 2009 From: enrique at netpd.org (Enrique Erne) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 13:41:40 +0200 Subject: [PD] rjdj, was : Re: [equalizer] / [lowshelf] / [highshelf] in purepd! In-Reply-To: <20090329105326.GB8572@fliwatut.scifi> References: <200903241216.06587.dmotd@gmx.net> <20090324070331.GA14255@fliwatut.scifi> <49CCF027.9050704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090327182314.GD24694@footils.org> <49CE148B.6020402@la-kitchen.fr> <20090328143756.GA27685@footils.org> <49CE5CA3.1090704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090329105326.GB8572@fliwatut.scifi> Message-ID: <49CF5E74.5080002@netpd.org> unfortunately <~ is still missing in pd-0.42 "5.1. release notes New pow~, log~, exp~, abs~, and 'wrap' objects." Frank Barknecht wrote: > Hallo, > cyrille henry hat gesagt: // cyrille henry wrote: >>> I think, currently it's probably a bit slower because of the sin(), but maybe >>> that could be put into a tabread~. >> i think the sin object is doing a linear interpolation in a 512 point table. >> (don't know how it is done in expr~, but expr~ is not used for rjlib because of it's licence, right?) > > Attached is an expr-less version of saw~ which from a quick glance at > the scope looks and sounds the same. It is vanilla in that it uses > [abs~] and [>~] which are part of 0.42 (and thus RjDj). On older Pd > versions you can use for example the purepd abstractions for both from > the SVN in abstractions/purepd > > Ciao > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From derek at umatic.nl Sun Mar 29 13:46:30 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 13:46:30 +0200 Subject: [PD] rjdj, was : Re: [equalizer] / [lowshelf] / [highshelf] in purepd! In-Reply-To: <49CF5E74.5080002@netpd.org> References: <200903241216.06587.dmotd@gmx.net> <20090324070331.GA14255@fliwatut.scifi> <49CCF027.9050704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090327182314.GD24694@footils.org> <49CE148B.6020402@la-kitchen.fr> <20090328143756.GA27685@footils.org> <49CE5CA3.1090704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090329105326.GB8572@fliwatut.scifi> <49CF5E74.5080002@netpd.org> Message-ID: <49CF5F96.6080904@umatic.nl> And I am still forced to use [expr~] equivalents on many OSX and Windows systems I encounter because the > or < character cannot be used as a filename. This has actually changed between versions of Pd Extended, so I'm not sure where exactly the problem lies. D. Enrique Erne wrote: > unfortunately <~ is still missing in pd-0.42 > > "5.1. release notes > New pow~, log~, exp~, abs~, and 'wrap' objects." -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 9: "Adding on" From cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr Sun Mar 29 14:08:21 2009 From: cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr (cyrille henry) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 14:08:21 +0200 Subject: [PD] rjdj, was : Re: [equalizer] / [lowshelf] / [highshelf] in purepd! In-Reply-To: <49CF5E74.5080002@netpd.org> References: <200903241216.06587.dmotd@gmx.net> <20090324070331.GA14255@fliwatut.scifi> <49CCF027.9050704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090327182314.GD24694@footils.org> <49CE148B.6020402@la-kitchen.fr> <20090328143756.GA27685@footils.org> <49CE5CA3.1090704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090329105326.GB8572@fliwatut.scifi> <49CF5E74.5080002@netpd.org> Message-ID: <49CF64B5.3060604@la-kitchen.fr> ok.here is a version using [pow~ -1] to replace [>~ 0] it should work with vanilla pd version >= 0.42 and with rjdj. and certainly with pd-extended. cyrille Enrique Erne a ?crit : > unfortunately <~ is still missing in pd-0.42 > > "5.1. release notes > New pow~, log~, exp~, abs~, and 'wrap' objects." > > > > > > Frank Barknecht wrote: >> Hallo, >> cyrille henry hat gesagt: // cyrille henry wrote: >>>> I think, currently it's probably a bit slower because of the sin(), >>>> but maybe >>>> that could be put into a tabread~. >>> i think the sin object is doing a linear interpolation in a 512 point >>> table. >>> (don't know how it is done in expr~, but expr~ is not used for rjlib >>> because of it's licence, right?) >> >> Attached is an expr-less version of saw~ which from a quick glance at >> the scope looks and sounds the same. It is vanilla in that it uses >> [abs~] and [>~] which are part of 0.42 (and thus RjDj). On older Pd >> versions you can use for example the purepd abstractions for both from >> the SVN in abstractions/purepd >> >> Ciao >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -------------- next part -------------- An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: saw3~.pd URL: From fbar at footils.org Sun Mar 29 14:16:14 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 14:16:14 +0200 Subject: [PD] rjdj, was : Re: [equalizer] / [lowshelf] / [highshelf] in purepd! In-Reply-To: <49CF64B5.3060604@la-kitchen.fr> References: <200903241216.06587.dmotd@gmx.net> <20090324070331.GA14255@fliwatut.scifi> <49CCF027.9050704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090327182314.GD24694@footils.org> <49CE148B.6020402@la-kitchen.fr> <20090328143756.GA27685@footils.org> <49CE5CA3.1090704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090329105326.GB8572@fliwatut.scifi> <49CF5E74.5080002@netpd.org> <49CF64B5.3060604@la-kitchen.fr> Message-ID: <20090329121614.GB30730@footils.org> Hallo, cyrille henry hat gesagt: // cyrille henry wrote: > ok.here is a version using [pow~ -1] to replace [>~ 0] > it should work with vanilla pd version >= 0.42 and with rjdj. > and certainly with pd-extended. I also did one which replaces >~ with the tabread lookup from Enrique's [>~] embedded. Ciao -- Frank -------------- next part -------------- #N canvas 232 120 725 608 10; #X obj 105 96 phasor~; #X obj 173 131 -~ 0.5; #X obj 421 192 *~ 2; #X obj 328 217 wrap~; #X obj 329 243 *~ 2; #X obj 329 268 -~ 1; #X obj 459 191 /~; #X obj 458 146 sig~ 22050; #X obj 421 219 *~; #X obj 422 241 abs~; #X obj 421 263 +~ 1.8955; #X obj 106 49 inlet~; #X obj 87 542 outlet~; #X obj 458 97 samplerate~; #X obj 458 74 loadbang; #X obj 458 120 * 0.5; #X obj 174 427 +~; #N canvas 104 42 701 480 sin(x)/x 0; #X obj 220 229 cos~; #X obj 221 204 -~ 0.25; #X msg 288 90 1; #X floatatom 288 162 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 288 116 atan; #X obj 288 137 * 8; #X obj 220 181 /~ 6.238; #X obj 288 67 loadbang; #X obj 221 148 inlet~; #X obj 219 291 outlet~; #X obj 220 255 /~; #X connect 0 0 10 0; #X connect 1 0 0 0; #X connect 2 0 4 0; #X connect 3 0 6 1; #X connect 4 0 5 0; #X connect 5 0 3 0; #X connect 6 0 1 0; #X connect 7 0 2 0; #X connect 8 0 6 0; #X connect 8 0 10 1; #X connect 10 0 9 0; #X restore 421 293 pd sin(x)/x; #X obj 330 392 *~; #X text 357 387 v2*sin(v4)/v4; #X text 208 426 + v3; #X obj 87 482 -~; #X obj 557 476 loadbang; #X obj 557 539 table \$0-lookup 2; #X obj 175 333 tabread~ \$0-lookup; #X obj 174 311 +~ 1; #X obj 557 518 s \$0-lookup; #X msg 557 497 0 0 1; #X connect 0 0 1 0; #X connect 0 0 21 1; #X connect 1 0 2 0; #X connect 1 0 3 0; #X connect 1 0 25 0; #X connect 2 0 8 0; #X connect 3 0 4 0; #X connect 4 0 5 0; #X connect 5 0 18 0; #X connect 6 0 8 1; #X connect 7 0 6 0; #X connect 8 0 9 0; #X connect 9 0 10 0; #X connect 10 0 17 0; #X connect 11 0 0 0; #X connect 11 0 6 1; #X connect 13 0 15 0; #X connect 14 0 13 0; #X connect 15 0 7 0; #X connect 16 0 21 0; #X connect 17 0 18 1; #X connect 18 0 16 1; #X connect 21 0 12 0; #X connect 22 0 27 0; #X connect 24 0 16 0; #X connect 25 0 24 0; #X connect 27 0 26 0; From fbar at footils.org Sun Mar 29 14:19:34 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 14:19:34 +0200 Subject: [PD] bl oscillator, was : Re: rjdj, was : Re: [equalizer] / [lowshelf] / [highshelf] in purepd! In-Reply-To: <49CF5C05.7030502@la-kitchen.fr> References: <200903241216.06587.dmotd@gmx.net> <20090324070331.GA14255@fliwatut.scifi> <49CCF027.9050704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090327182314.GD24694@footils.org> <49CE148B.6020402@la-kitchen.fr> <20090328143756.GA27685@footils.org> <49CE5CA3.1090704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090329105326.GB8572@fliwatut.scifi> <49CF5C05.7030502@la-kitchen.fr> Message-ID: <20090329121934.GC30730@footils.org> Hallo, cyrille henry hat gesagt: // cyrille henry wrote: > wow, this version is almost 2 time faster than the original. > i did not know that expr~ was so slow... Yeah, expr-objects are slower than their builtin counterparts - so avoiding them in rjlib is also a kind of optimization. Feel free to use it instead (preferable the updated version without >~. Ciao -- Frank From cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr Sun Mar 29 14:28:02 2009 From: cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr (cyrille henry) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 14:28:02 +0200 Subject: [PD] rjdj, was : Re: [equalizer] / [lowshelf] / [highshelf] in purepd! In-Reply-To: <20090329121614.GB30730@footils.org> References: <200903241216.06587.dmotd@gmx.net> <20090324070331.GA14255@fliwatut.scifi> <49CCF027.9050704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090327182314.GD24694@footils.org> <49CE148B.6020402@la-kitchen.fr> <20090328143756.GA27685@footils.org> <49CE5CA3.1090704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090329105326.GB8572@fliwatut.scifi> <49CF5E74.5080002@netpd.org> <49CF64B5.3060604@la-kitchen.fr> <20090329121614.GB30730@footils.org> Message-ID: <49CF6952.3020109@la-kitchen.fr> Frank Barknecht a ?crit : > Hallo, > cyrille henry hat gesagt: // cyrille henry wrote: > >> ok.here is a version using [pow~ -1] to replace [>~ 0] >> it should work with vanilla pd version >= 0.42 and with rjdj. >> and certainly with pd-extended. > > I also did one which replaces >~ with the tabread lookup from Enrique's [>~] embedded. yep, this is a more clever vay to do this. thx. c > > Ciao > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From vboehm at gmx.ch Sun Mar 29 13:43:43 2009 From: vboehm at gmx.ch (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?volker_b=F6hm?=) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 13:43:43 +0200 Subject: [PD] rjdj, was : Re: [equalizer] / [lowshelf] / [highshelf] in purepd! In-Reply-To: <20090329105326.GB8572@fliwatut.scifi> References: <200903241216.06587.dmotd@gmx.net> <20090324070331.GA14255@fliwatut.scifi> <49CCF027.9050704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090327182314.GD24694@footils.org> <49CE148B.6020402@la-kitchen.fr> <20090328143756.GA27685@footils.org> <49CE5CA3.1090704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090329105326.GB8572@fliwatut.scifi> Message-ID: On 29 Mar 2009, at 12:53, Frank Barknecht wrote: > Hallo, > cyrille henry hat gesagt: // cyrille henry wrote: >>> I think, currently it's probably a bit slower because of the sin >>> (), but maybe >>> that could be put into a tabread~. >> i think the sin object is doing a linear interpolation in a 512 >> point table. >> (don't know how it is done in expr~, but expr~ is not used for >> rjlib because of it's licence, right?) > > Attached is an expr-less version of saw~ which from a quick glance at > the scope looks and sounds the same. It is vanilla in that it uses > [abs~] and [>~] which are part of 0.42 (and thus RjDj). On older Pd > versions you can use for example the purepd abstractions for both from > the SVN in abstractions/purepd thanks for posting this. for certain freqs i hear a noticeable periodic "zipping" in the sound (try 230 hz e.g.). since the algorithm is based on the sinc function (sin(x)/x), i wonder how pd handles divide by zero in the signal domain. wouldn't you have to check for that in the code/patch? volker. From fbar at footils.org Sun Mar 29 14:54:20 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 14:54:20 +0200 Subject: [PD] rjdj, was : Re: [equalizer] / [lowshelf] / [highshelf] in purepd! In-Reply-To: References: <200903241216.06587.dmotd@gmx.net> <20090324070331.GA14255@fliwatut.scifi> <49CCF027.9050704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090327182314.GD24694@footils.org> <49CE148B.6020402@la-kitchen.fr> <20090328143756.GA27685@footils.org> <49CE5CA3.1090704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090329105326.GB8572@fliwatut.scifi> Message-ID: <20090329125420.GA30945@footils.org> Hallo, volker b?hm hat gesagt: // volker b?hm wrote: > thanks for posting this. > for certain freqs i hear a noticeable periodic "zipping" in the sound > (try 230 hz e.g.). Hm, I don't hear it, but that may be my ears. > since the algorithm is based on the sinc function (sin(x)/x), i wonder > how pd handles divide by zero in the signal domain. wouldn't you have to > check for that in the code/patch? A [/~] with no signal in the right inlet in Pd gives 0 as output. In saw~.pd x never becomes zero, it's always at least 1.8955. :) Ciao -- Frank From cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr Sun Mar 29 15:01:11 2009 From: cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr (cyrille henry) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 15:01:11 +0200 Subject: [PD] rjdj, was : Re: [equalizer] / [lowshelf] / [highshelf] in purepd! In-Reply-To: <20090329125420.GA30945@footils.org> References: <200903241216.06587.dmotd@gmx.net> <20090324070331.GA14255@fliwatut.scifi> <49CCF027.9050704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090327182314.GD24694@footils.org> <49CE148B.6020402@la-kitchen.fr> <20090328143756.GA27685@footils.org> <49CE5CA3.1090704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090329105326.GB8572@fliwatut.scifi> <20090329125420.GA30945@footils.org> Message-ID: <49CF7117.6010100@la-kitchen.fr> Frank Barknecht a ?crit : > Hallo, > volker b?hm hat gesagt: // volker b?hm wrote: > >> thanks for posting this. >> for certain freqs i hear a noticeable periodic "zipping" in the sound >> (try 230 hz e.g.). > > Hm, I don't hear it, but that may be my ears. don't hear it also. > >> since the algorithm is based on the sinc function (sin(x)/x), i wonder >> how pd handles divide by zero in the signal domain. wouldn't you have to >> check for that in the code/patch? > > A [/~] with no signal in the right inlet in Pd gives 0 as output. > In saw~.pd x never becomes zero, it's always at least 1.8955. :) yep c > > Ciao From derek at umatic.nl Sun Mar 29 16:28:06 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 16:28:06 +0200 Subject: [PD] Pure Data FLOSS Manual Book Sprint 4-6 April 2009 in NYC and Berlin Message-ID: <49CF8576.8050105@umatic.nl> FLOSS Manuals is proud to announce a three day book sprint for the Pure Data FLOSS Manual. This sprint will take place simultaneously in New York City and Berlin from Saturday 4 April to Monday 6 April. The Pure Data FLOSS Manual: http://en.flossmanuals.net/puredata There are possibilities to participate in person by coming to one of the locations below, or remotely via the IRC interface built into the FLOSS Manuals editing interface. Video conferencing may take place between the venues as well. To participate, create a login at the PD FLOSS Manuals page: http://en.flossmanuals.net/bin/login/TWiki/WebHome?origurl=/bin/view/PureData/Introduction&skin=floss2 Discussion may also take place in the Pure Data mailing list: http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list If you are in New York or Berlin, please join us at these locations! ---NEW YORK CITY * Contact: Hans-Christoph Steiner: hans at eds.org 718 360 4872 * Location (bring ID, you'll need to sign in): ITP/NYU Conference Room 721 Broadway, 4th Floor NY, NY, USA email me or call in case you can get past security: 718 360 4872 * Schedule: Saturday: noon-midnight Sunday: 10am-midnight Monday: 9am-5:30pm (if we go later, we'll be in a different room) ---BERLIN * Contacts Derek Holzer: derek at umatic.nl +49 176 2812 5845 Adam Hyde: adam at flossmanuals.net +49 15 2230 54563 NK ElsenStr. 52 (2.Hof) Berlin, Germany +49 176 20626386 http://www.myspace.com/enka52 * Schedule: Saturday: noon-late Sunday: noon-late Monday: noon-late SOME BASIC GUIDELINES: * This manual should address the widest possible user-base. Therefore, objects which are cross-platform and in Pd Extended should have priority over other solutions. * Tone should be neutral and informative. Remember that humor doesn't always translate well! ;-) * Our readers are assumed to have little to no background in either computer programming or digital signal processing, which much of the existing documentation takes for granted. That's why this manual is necessary! Please keep this in mind when explaining things. * Please use existing the Audio Tutorials, Installing and Getting Started chapters as a style guide. * Keep the chapters small and self-contained. Ideally, chapters from this manual could even be "remixed" into other FLOSS Manuals. * Explain any jargon or technical terminology in-line the first time you use it, and direct the reader to appropriate other chapters/manuals when necessary. * Please enter any new technical terms in the Glossary (we need to agree on global format for glossary terms!). * Screenshots: ---Resolution? (Adam and I will work on this on Monday) ---Please upload any complex patches, and make sure to label screenshot with appropriate filename (see Audio Tutorials for examples) ---Please keep explanatory text in the manual rather than only in the screenshot, so that it can be text-searched by readers. ---Please use anti-aliased fonts! * All the chapters are moderated by Derek Holzer & Adam Hyde. Your contributions will only be visible in the editing section until they meet these guidelines, and after that they can be published to the main page. Please let us know when your chapter(s) are ready for publishing and we'll look them over. EXISTING CHAPTERS WHICH NEED HELP: # DataflowTutorials ---this section needs a lot of help in terms of style and content!!!!! Tone is very informal, which doesn't help convey the information. ---give titles to screenshots so that readers can tell which patches match which images (some do this, some don't...) ---"Math": examples/discussion of [expr]??? ---"Order of connecting and [trigger]": explain the patches in-line, rather than only in comments in screenshots (so that text is searchable, copy/pasteable..) ---Luka's screencaps are very aliased, to the point where you can't read the ~ in the object names. Should they be redone at new resolution or with antialiasing? ---Possible janitors: Derek Holzer, Adam Hyde # PureGlossary ---format of object names = [italics in square brackets], must be formatted correctly ---format of glossary words in general text: we don't have one yet. Bold on first use in chapter maybe? Needs formatting all through text. # ListofObjects ---incomplete, please add more libs ---maybe more discussion of externals needed as well ---formatting of object names? # PureLinks ---always welcome MORE CHAPTERS/SECTIONS TO DO (+ suggestions?): * GEM (in order of importance)(Derek can provide example patches for much of this) ---Basic VJ mixer (2 x [gemhead]-[pix_film]-[alpha]-[colorRGB]-[pix_texture]-[rectangle] with an alpha-crossfader)(+ platform specific codec info) ---Live camera input (same as VJ mixer but with [pix_video], with platform specific info on USB/firewire inputs--what works & what doesn't) ---VJ effects (using the various pix objects) ---Basic 3D (that actually does something interesting, rather than just show a sphere or a cube) ---Basic movement tracking w/ [pix_blob] ---GEM/video optimization/troubleshooting tips (see Troubleshooting section of existing Pd FLOSS Manual) * MIDI tutorial ---hardware:keyboards, sliders, etc, ---objects: all MIDI objects ---routing: input + output to/from devices or other programs * Patching strategies ---Reusable abstractions ($0 etc) ---GoP + other GUI creation strategies ---Preset saving systems (Frank?) * Audiofile manipulation (Derek can provide examples, possibly also work with www.pd-tutorial.com with permission?) ---sfread, readsf, sfplay, etc ---tables + tabplay, tabread, etc ---oneshot playback without/with pitch shifting ---looping without/with pitchshifting ---granulation without/with pitchshifting ---Extended objects ([xplay~], [xgroove~]...are these stable? In my experience, no...) * Realtime audio effects tutorial ---delays: single tap, multitap, pitch-shifting, tuned comb filter, etc ---filters: [hip~], [lop~], [bp~], [moog~], IEM lib filters [vcf~]/[bp],[hp],[lp], difference between audio signal and message controlled, building with ggee objects [bandpass],[llowpass],[highpass] or [biquad~] (resources for coefficients?) * Sensor tutorial (HC?) ---[hid]/[hidin]/[pduino] ---simple circuit diagrams + photos (voltage divider examples: potentiometer, photoresistor, etc)(hacked gamepads) * Networked data ---netsend/netreceive ---OSC ---flash server ---shell ---python externals ---others? * PDP/PiDiP ---configuration info for OSX (+ poor performance disclaimer!) ---basic VJ ---networked streaming etc * Procedural Audio tutorial? (Andy?) * RJDJ tutorial? (Frank and the gang?) -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 142: "Shut the door and listen from outside" From derek at umatic.nl Sun Mar 29 16:28:29 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 16:28:29 +0200 Subject: [PD] [PD-announce] Pure Data FLOSS Manual Book Sprint 4-6 April 2009 in NYC and Berlin Message-ID: <49CF858D.9030909@umatic.nl> FLOSS Manuals is proud to announce a three day book sprint for the Pure Data FLOSS Manual. This sprint will take place simultaneously in New York City and Berlin from Saturday 4 April to Monday 6 April. The Pure Data FLOSS Manual: http://en.flossmanuals.net/puredata There are possibilities to participate in person by coming to one of the locations below, or remotely via the IRC interface built into the FLOSS Manuals editing interface. Video conferencing may take place between the venues as well. To participate, create a login at the PD FLOSS Manuals page: http://en.flossmanuals.net/bin/login/TWiki/WebHome?origurl=/bin/view/PureData/Introduction&skin=floss2 Discussion may also take place in the Pure Data mailing list: http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list If you are in New York or Berlin, please join us at these locations! ---NEW YORK CITY * Contact: Hans-Christoph Steiner: hans at eds.org 718 360 4872 * Location (bring ID, you'll need to sign in): ITP/NYU Conference Room 721 Broadway, 4th Floor NY, NY, USA email me or call in case you can get past security: 718 360 4872 * Schedule: Saturday: noon-midnight Sunday: 10am-midnight Monday: 9am-5:30pm (if we go later, we'll be in a different room) ---BERLIN * Contacts Derek Holzer: derek at umatic.nl +49 176 2812 5845 Adam Hyde: adam at flossmanuals.net +49 15 2230 54563 NK ElsenStr. 52 (2.Hof) Berlin, Germany +49 176 20626386 http://www.myspace.com/enka52 * Schedule: Saturday: noon-late Sunday: noon-late Monday: noon-late SOME BASIC GUIDELINES: * This manual should address the widest possible user-base. Therefore, objects which are cross-platform and in Pd Extended should have priority over other solutions. * Tone should be neutral and informative. Remember that humor doesn't always translate well! ;-) * Our readers are assumed to have little to no background in either computer programming or digital signal processing, which much of the existing documentation takes for granted. That's why this manual is necessary! Please keep this in mind when explaining things. * Please use existing the Audio Tutorials, Installing and Getting Started chapters as a style guide. * Keep the chapters small and self-contained. Ideally, chapters from this manual could even be "remixed" into other FLOSS Manuals. * Explain any jargon or technical terminology in-line the first time you use it, and direct the reader to appropriate other chapters/manuals when necessary. * Please enter any new technical terms in the Glossary (we need to agree on global format for glossary terms!). * Screenshots: ---Resolution? (Adam and I will work on this on Monday) ---Please upload any complex patches, and make sure to label screenshot with appropriate filename (see Audio Tutorials for examples) ---Please keep explanatory text in the manual rather than only in the screenshot, so that it can be text-searched by readers. ---Please use anti-aliased fonts! * All the chapters are moderated by Derek Holzer & Adam Hyde. Your contributions will only be visible in the editing section until they meet these guidelines, and after that they can be published to the main page. Please let us know when your chapter(s) are ready for publishing and we'll look them over. EXISTING CHAPTERS WHICH NEED HELP: # DataflowTutorials ---this section needs a lot of help in terms of style and content!!!!! Tone is very informal, which doesn't help convey the information. ---give titles to screenshots so that readers can tell which patches match which images (some do this, some don't...) ---"Math": examples/discussion of [expr]??? ---"Order of connecting and [trigger]": explain the patches in-line, rather than only in comments in screenshots (so that text is searchable, copy/pasteable..) ---Luka's screencaps are very aliased, to the point where you can't read the ~ in the object names. Should they be redone at new resolution or with antialiasing? ---Possible janitors: Derek Holzer, Adam Hyde # PureGlossary ---format of object names = [italics in square brackets], must be formatted correctly ---format of glossary words in general text: we don't have one yet. Bold on first use in chapter maybe? Needs formatting all through text. # ListofObjects ---incomplete, please add more libs ---maybe more discussion of externals needed as well ---formatting of object names? # PureLinks ---always welcome MORE CHAPTERS/SECTIONS TO DO (+ suggestions?): * GEM (in order of importance)(Derek can provide example patches for much of this) ---Basic VJ mixer (2 x [gemhead]-[pix_film]-[alpha]-[colorRGB]-[pix_texture]-[rectangle] with an alpha-crossfader)(+ platform specific codec info) ---Live camera input (same as VJ mixer but with [pix_video], with platform specific info on USB/firewire inputs--what works & what doesn't) ---VJ effects (using the various pix objects) ---Basic 3D (that actually does something interesting, rather than just show a sphere or a cube) ---Basic movement tracking w/ [pix_blob] ---GEM/video optimization/troubleshooting tips (see Troubleshooting section of existing Pd FLOSS Manual) * MIDI tutorial ---hardware:keyboards, sliders, etc, ---objects: all MIDI objects ---routing: input + output to/from devices or other programs * Patching strategies ---Reusable abstractions ($0 etc) ---GoP + other GUI creation strategies ---Preset saving systems (Frank?) * Audiofile manipulation (Derek can provide examples, possibly also work with www.pd-tutorial.com with permission?) ---sfread, readsf, sfplay, etc ---tables + tabplay, tabread, etc ---oneshot playback without/with pitch shifting ---looping without/with pitchshifting ---granulation without/with pitchshifting ---Extended objects ([xplay~], [xgroove~]...are these stable? In my experience, no...) * Realtime audio effects tutorial ---delays: single tap, multitap, pitch-shifting, tuned comb filter, etc ---filters: [hip~], [lop~], [bp~], [moog~], IEM lib filters [vcf~]/[bp],[hp],[lp], difference between audio signal and message controlled, building with ggee objects [bandpass],[llowpass],[highpass] or [biquad~] (resources for coefficients?) * Sensor tutorial (HC?) ---[hid]/[hidin]/[pduino] ---simple circuit diagrams + photos (voltage divider examples: potentiometer, photoresistor, etc)(hacked gamepads) * Networked data ---netsend/netreceive ---OSC ---flash server ---shell ---python externals ---others? * PDP/PiDiP ---configuration info for OSX (+ poor performance disclaimer!) ---basic VJ ---networked streaming etc * Procedural Audio tutorial? (Andy?) * RJDJ tutorial? (Frank and the gang?) -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 142: "Shut the door and listen from outside" _______________________________________________ Pd-announce mailing list Pd-announce at iem.at http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-announce From fbar at footils.org Sun Mar 29 16:33:41 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 16:33:41 +0200 Subject: [PD] bl oscillator, was : Re: rjdj, was : Re: [equalizer] / [lowshelf] / [highshelf] in purepd! In-Reply-To: <49CF5C05.7030502@la-kitchen.fr> References: <200903241216.06587.dmotd@gmx.net> <20090324070331.GA14255@fliwatut.scifi> <49CCF027.9050704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090327182314.GD24694@footils.org> <49CE148B.6020402@la-kitchen.fr> <20090328143756.GA27685@footils.org> <49CE5CA3.1090704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090329105326.GB8572@fliwatut.scifi> <49CF5C05.7030502@la-kitchen.fr> Message-ID: <20090329143341.GA31212@footils.org> Hallo, okay, attached is the pwm~ as well. Ciao -- Frank cyrille henry hat gesagt: // cyrille henry wrote: > wow, this version is almost 2 time faster than the original. > i did not know that expr~ was so slow... > > do you mind if use this version to replace mine? > > thanks > Cyrille > > > Frank Barknecht a ?crit : >> Hallo, >> cyrille henry hat gesagt: // cyrille henry wrote: >>>> I think, currently it's probably a bit slower because of the sin(), but maybe >>>> that could be put into a tabread~. >>> i think the sin object is doing a linear interpolation in a 512 point table. >>> (don't know how it is done in expr~, but expr~ is not used for rjlib because of it's licence, right?) >> >> Attached is an expr-less version of saw~ which from a quick glance at >> the scope looks and sounds the same. It is vanilla in that it uses >> [abs~] and [>~] which are part of 0.42 (and thus RjDj). On older Pd >> versions you can use for example the purepd abstractions for both from >> the SVN in abstractions/purepd >> >> Ciao >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -------------- next part -------------- #N canvas 268 49 728 707 10; #X obj 65 122 phasor~; #X obj 66 59 inlet~; #X obj 238 172 +~; #X obj 255 64 inlet~; #X obj 237 198 wrap~; #X obj 334 327 sig~ 22050; #X obj 334 284 samplerate~; #X obj 334 232 loadbang; #X obj 334 307 * 0.5; #X obj 67 505 -~; #X obj 67 533 outlet~; #X obj 475 432 loadbang; #X obj 475 495 table \$0-lookup 2; #X obj 475 474 s \$0-lookup; #X msg 475 453 0 0 1; #X obj 67 471 +~ -0.5; #X obj 239 470 +~ -0.5; #X msg 344 257 bang; #N canvas 315 401 852 607 sinc-phasor 0; #X obj 173 131 -~ 0.5; #X obj 421 192 *~ 2; #X obj 459 191 /~; #X obj 421 219 *~; #X obj 422 241 abs~; #X obj 421 263 +~ 1.8955; #X obj 174 427 +~; #N canvas 104 42 701 480 sin(x)/x 0; #X obj 220 229 cos~; #X obj 221 204 -~ 0.25; #X msg 288 90 1; #X floatatom 288 162 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 288 116 atan; #X obj 288 137 * 8; #X obj 220 181 /~ 6.238; #X obj 288 67 loadbang; #X obj 221 148 inlet~; #X obj 219 291 outlet~; #X obj 220 255 /~; #X connect 0 0 10 0; #X connect 1 0 0 0; #X connect 2 0 4 0; #X connect 3 0 6 1; #X connect 4 0 5 0; #X connect 5 0 3 0; #X connect 6 0 1 0; #X connect 7 0 2 0; #X connect 8 0 6 0; #X connect 8 0 10 1; #X connect 10 0 9 0; #X restore 421 293 pd sin(x)/x; #X text 208 426 + v3; #X obj 175 333 tabread~ \$0-lookup; #X obj 174 311 +~ 1; #X obj 127 78 inlet~; #X text 123 53 phasor~; #X obj 433 71 inlet~; #X obj 510 72 inlet~; #X text 506 47 SR; #X text 429 46 freq; #X obj 109 486 outlet~; #X obj 328 217 wrap~; #X obj 329 243 *~ 2; #X obj 329 268 -~ 1; #X obj 330 392 *~; #X text 357 387 v2*sin(v4)/v4; #X obj 110 460 -~; #X connect 0 0 1 0; #X connect 0 0 10 0; #X connect 0 0 18 0; #X connect 1 0 3 0; #X connect 2 0 3 1; #X connect 3 0 4 0; #X connect 4 0 5 0; #X connect 5 0 7 0; #X connect 6 0 23 0; #X connect 7 0 21 1; #X connect 9 0 6 0; #X connect 10 0 9 0; #X connect 11 0 0 0; #X connect 11 0 23 1; #X connect 13 0 2 1; #X connect 14 0 2 0; #X connect 18 0 19 0; #X connect 19 0 20 0; #X connect 20 0 21 0; #X connect 21 0 6 1; #X connect 23 0 17 0; #X restore 238 446 pd sinc-phasor; #N canvas 315 401 852 607 sinc-phasor 0; #X obj 173 131 -~ 0.5; #X obj 421 192 *~ 2; #X obj 459 191 /~; #X obj 421 219 *~; #X obj 422 241 abs~; #X obj 421 263 +~ 1.8955; #X obj 174 427 +~; #N canvas 104 42 701 480 sin(x)/x 0; #X obj 220 229 cos~; #X obj 221 204 -~ 0.25; #X msg 288 90 1; #X floatatom 288 162 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 288 116 atan; #X obj 288 137 * 8; #X obj 220 181 /~ 6.238; #X obj 288 67 loadbang; #X obj 221 148 inlet~; #X obj 219 291 outlet~; #X obj 220 255 /~; #X connect 0 0 10 0; #X connect 1 0 0 0; #X connect 2 0 4 0; #X connect 3 0 6 1; #X connect 4 0 5 0; #X connect 5 0 3 0; #X connect 6 0 1 0; #X connect 7 0 2 0; #X connect 8 0 6 0; #X connect 8 0 10 1; #X connect 10 0 9 0; #X restore 421 293 pd sin(x)/x; #X text 208 426 + v3; #X obj 175 333 tabread~ \$0-lookup; #X obj 174 311 +~ 1; #X obj 127 78 inlet~; #X text 123 53 phasor~; #X obj 433 71 inlet~; #X obj 510 72 inlet~; #X text 506 47 SR; #X text 429 46 freq; #X obj 109 486 outlet~; #X obj 328 217 wrap~; #X obj 329 243 *~ 2; #X obj 329 268 -~ 1; #X obj 330 392 *~; #X text 357 387 v2*sin(v4)/v4; #X obj 110 460 -~; #X connect 0 0 1 0; #X connect 0 0 10 0; #X connect 0 0 18 0; #X connect 1 0 3 0; #X connect 2 0 3 1; #X connect 3 0 4 0; #X connect 4 0 5 0; #X connect 5 0 7 0; #X connect 6 0 23 0; #X connect 7 0 21 1; #X connect 9 0 6 0; #X connect 10 0 9 0; #X connect 11 0 0 0; #X connect 11 0 23 1; #X connect 13 0 2 1; #X connect 14 0 2 0; #X connect 18 0 19 0; #X connect 19 0 20 0; #X connect 20 0 21 0; #X connect 21 0 6 1; #X connect 23 0 17 0; #X restore 66 443 pd sinc-phasor; #X connect 0 0 2 0; #X connect 0 0 19 0; #X connect 1 0 0 0; #X connect 1 0 18 1; #X connect 1 0 19 1; #X connect 2 0 4 0; #X connect 3 0 2 1; #X connect 4 0 18 0; #X connect 5 0 18 2; #X connect 5 0 19 2; #X connect 6 0 8 0; #X connect 7 0 6 0; #X connect 8 0 5 0; #X connect 9 0 10 0; #X connect 11 0 14 0; #X connect 14 0 13 0; #X connect 15 0 9 0; #X connect 16 0 9 1; #X connect 17 0 6 0; #X connect 18 0 16 0; #X connect 19 0 15 0; From fbar at footils.org Sun Mar 29 16:44:19 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 16:44:19 +0200 Subject: [PD] abs~ and exp~ fixes [was: rjdj] In-Reply-To: <880E8039-FF84-43FA-BEE6-11899A8798E9@gmx.ch> References: <20090324070331.GA14255@fliwatut.scifi> <49CCF027.9050704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090327182314.GD24694@footils.org> <49CE148B.6020402@la-kitchen.fr> <20090328143756.GA27685@footils.org> <49CE5CA3.1090704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090329105326.GB8572@fliwatut.scifi> <20090329125420.GA30945@footils.org> <880E8039-FF84-43FA-BEE6-11899A8798E9@gmx.ch> Message-ID: <20090329144419.GA31264@footils.org> Hallo Volker, ah, there's a bug in d_math.c Actually there are two: on is reported as "exp~ broken/fixed - ID: 2638371", but the same issue affects abs, too. Patch for both is attached. (I hadn't recognized this because it seems I was using a different [abs~]. Freakying object aliassing...) Ciao -- Frank volker b?hm hat gesagt: // volker b?hm wrote: > for some reason my mails to the list take ages until they arrive, which > makes a discussion a little difficult... > > ok, something weird going on here. abs~ is not doing what i would think > it should be doing - calculating the absolute value of the incoming > signal. instead it simply seems to pass input to output (no errors in pd > window). > > > if i replace abs~ with an abstraction then it works and the zipping is > gone. > this happens here with pd vanilla 0.42-4. > > just tried pd-extended and there it works with abs~. > > what could be wrong with my vanilla abs~? > > > > > On 29 Mar 2009, at 14:54, Frank Barknecht wrote: >> Hallo, >> volker b?hm hat gesagt: // volker b?hm wrote: >> >>> thanks for posting this. >>> for certain freqs i hear a noticeable periodic "zipping" in the sound >>> (try 230 hz e.g.). >> >> Hm, I don't hear it, but that may be my ears. >> >>> since the algorithm is based on the sinc function (sin(x)/x), i >>> wonder >>> how pd handles divide by zero in the signal domain. wouldn't you >>> have to >>> check for that in the code/patch? >> >> A [/~] with no signal in the right inlet in Pd gives 0 as output. >> In saw~.pd x never becomes zero, it's always at least 1.8955. :) >> >> Ciao >> -- >> Frank >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/ >> listinfo/pd-list > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: d_math_fix.diff Type: text/x-diff Size: 461 bytes Desc: not available URL: From vboehm at gmx.ch Sun Mar 29 16:29:22 2009 From: vboehm at gmx.ch (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?volker_b=F6hm?=) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 16:29:22 +0200 Subject: [PD] rjdj, was : Re: [equalizer] / [lowshelf] / [highshelf] in purepd! In-Reply-To: <20090329125420.GA30945@footils.org> References: <200903241216.06587.dmotd@gmx.net> <20090324070331.GA14255@fliwatut.scifi> <49CCF027.9050704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090327182314.GD24694@footils.org> <49CE148B.6020402@la-kitchen.fr> <20090328143756.GA27685@footils.org> <49CE5CA3.1090704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090329105326.GB8572@fliwatut.scifi> <20090329125420.GA30945@footils.org> Message-ID: <880E8039-FF84-43FA-BEE6-11899A8798E9@gmx.ch> for some reason my mails to the list take ages until they arrive, which makes a discussion a little difficult... ok, something weird going on here. abs~ is not doing what i would think it should be doing - calculating the absolute value of the incoming signal. instead it simply seems to pass input to output (no errors in pd window). -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: pastedGraphic.tiff Type: image/tiff Size: 136654 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- if i replace abs~ with an abstraction then it works and the zipping is gone. this happens here with pd vanilla 0.42-4. just tried pd-extended and there it works with abs~. what could be wrong with my vanilla abs~? On 29 Mar 2009, at 14:54, Frank Barknecht wrote: > Hallo, > volker b?hm hat gesagt: // volker b?hm wrote: > >> thanks for posting this. >> for certain freqs i hear a noticeable periodic "zipping" in the sound >> (try 230 hz e.g.). > > Hm, I don't hear it, but that may be my ears. > >> since the algorithm is based on the sinc function (sin(x)/x), i >> wonder >> how pd handles divide by zero in the signal domain. wouldn't you >> have to >> check for that in the code/patch? > > A [/~] with no signal in the right inlet in Pd gives 0 as output. > In saw~.pd x never becomes zero, it's always at least 1.8955. :) > > Ciao > -- > Frank > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/ > listinfo/pd-list From zmoelnig at iem.at Sun Mar 29 17:41:05 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 17:41:05 +0200 Subject: [PD] rjdj, was : Re: [equalizer] / [lowshelf] / [highshelf] in purepd! In-Reply-To: <880E8039-FF84-43FA-BEE6-11899A8798E9@gmx.ch> References: <200903241216.06587.dmotd@gmx.net> <20090324070331.GA14255@fliwatut.scifi> <49CCF027.9050704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090327182314.GD24694@footils.org> <49CE148B.6020402@la-kitchen.fr> <20090328143756.GA27685@footils.org> <49CE5CA3.1090704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090329105326.GB8572@fliwatut.scifi> <20090329125420.GA30945@footils.org> <880E8039-FF84-43FA-BEE6-11899A8798E9@gmx.ch> Message-ID: <49CF9691.7040100@iem.at> volker b?hm wrote: > for some reason my mails to the list take ages until they arrive, which > makes a discussion a little difficult... hmm, please bear in mind that "email" is an asynchronous medium. this medium was designed to make discussions with people who might be online only a few times a week. and i don't have the feeling that your mails takes "ages" (at least in this thread you have been able to reply indirectly to yourself within 3 hours) if you feel that an asynchronous medium is not the right choice to lead a discussion, why not try IRC? > > ok, something weird going on here. abs~ is not doing what i would think > it should be doing - calculating the absolute value of the incoming > signal. instead it simply seems to pass input to output (no errors in pd > window). yes, this is a known bug of [abs~] in Pd-0.42. see frank's other mails. mfdsr IOhannes From vboehm at gmx.ch Sun Mar 29 17:41:13 2009 From: vboehm at gmx.ch (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?volker_b=F6hm?=) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 17:41:13 +0200 Subject: [PD] abs~ and exp~ fixes [was: rjdj] In-Reply-To: <20090329144419.GA31264@footils.org> References: <20090324070331.GA14255@fliwatut.scifi> <49CCF027.9050704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090327182314.GD24694@footils.org> <49CE148B.6020402@la-kitchen.fr> <20090328143756.GA27685@footils.org> <49CE5CA3.1090704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090329105326.GB8572@fliwatut.scifi> <20090329125420.GA30945@footils.org> <880E8039-FF84-43FA-BEE6-11899A8798E9@gmx.ch> <20090329144419.GA31264@footils.org> Message-ID: <79735E52-3DCD-4EF1-A252-11537E0FB1D3@gmx.ch> On 29 Mar 2009, at 16:44, Frank Barknecht wrote: > Hallo Volker, > > ah, there's a bug in d_math.c > > Actually there are two: on is reported as "exp~ broken/fixed - ID: > 2638371", > but the same issue affects abs, too. Patch for both is attached. > > (I hadn't recognized this because it seems I was using a different > [abs~]. > Freakying object aliassing...) aha, yes, i can see the bug in the source. thanks for pointing this out. however i never succeeded in building pd vanilla on osx myself (anyone?). so it seems i can't apply the fix myself, but have to wait for a new version. vb From hans at eds.org Sun Mar 29 18:57:20 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 12:57:20 -0400 Subject: [PD] pd-gui stops updating after a while in visually busy patches In-Reply-To: <7cc710c20903280959j6c1e32d7sd2cd118e78279756@mail.gmail.com> References: <7cc710c20903280959j6c1e32d7sd2cd118e78279756@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <8DE09A69-612C-491A-9972-4782768F2F16@eds.org> I think that this is a known bug that was fixed in Pd-vanilla 0.42. A backport might be a possibility. Try 0.42 and see if it fixes your problem. .hc On Mar 28, 2009, at 12:59 PM, Ivica Ico Bukvic wrote: > Hi all, > > This pertains to pd-extended 0.40.3. It appears that when a patch > has a very busy GUI (as is the case with wiimote help file), after a > while the GUI stops being responsive. The objects can be still moved > and even atoms can be written into, but when one presses "return" to > update atom value or when an atom or a slider needs to change due to > automated update (e.g. via metro) nothing happens until pd is > restarted. The sound engine and control mechanisms running through > these still work and are responsive, it is just that gui remains > totally frozen. Not sure if this only pertains to the wiimote object > or other busy patches as well. > > Any ideas? > > Ico > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Programs should be written for people to read, and only incidentally for machines to execute. - from Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs From fbar at footils.org Sun Mar 29 19:09:58 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 19:09:58 +0200 Subject: [PD] abs~ and exp~ fixes [was: rjdj] In-Reply-To: <79735E52-3DCD-4EF1-A252-11537E0FB1D3@gmx.ch> References: <20090327182314.GD24694@footils.org> <49CE148B.6020402@la-kitchen.fr> <20090328143756.GA27685@footils.org> <49CE5CA3.1090704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090329105326.GB8572@fliwatut.scifi> <20090329125420.GA30945@footils.org> <880E8039-FF84-43FA-BEE6-11899A8798E9@gmx.ch> <20090329144419.GA31264@footils.org> <79735E52-3DCD-4EF1-A252-11537E0FB1D3@gmx.ch> Message-ID: <20090329170958.GA31490@footils.org> Hallo, volker b?hm hat gesagt: // volker b?hm wrote: > however i never succeeded in building pd vanilla on osx myself > (anyone?). > so it seems i can't apply the fix myself, but have to wait for a new > version. You could copy over some abs~.pd_darwin from pd-extended, pd-0.42 will happily use that instead. Ciao -- Frank From hans at eds.org Sun Mar 29 19:26:27 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 13:26:27 -0400 Subject: [PD] [OT] Re: DIY GSoC: getting those projects done In-Reply-To: <20090328093208.GA24532@mccormick.cx> References: <475768.89279.qm@web65603.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> <20090328093208.GA24532@mccormick.cx> Message-ID: <77490995-FD2B-43A7-82E5-93F35C8BAE92@eds.org> On Mar 28, 2009, at 5:32 AM, Chris McCormick wrote: > On Thu, Mar 26, 2009 at 10:42:25AM -0400, Mathieu Bouchard wrote: >> No, this was about how [expr] can be a replacement for even a small >> network of objects. If you make an abstraction that does >> ($f1-$f2)*($f5-$f4)/($f3-$f2)+$f4, with just [+] [-] [*] [/] for >> example, >> then if you change some things in the cold inlets, the changes >> might not >> propagate to the bottom. This means you have to add a [pack 0 0 0 0 >> 0] of >> the whole thing and [unpack 0 0 0 0 0] to ensure every hot-inlet is >> retriggered in the proper order. Actually, in this pack/unpack dance, >> maybe you can skip the hot-inlet of the abstraction (?), but apart >> from >> that, you're pretty stuck using pack/unpack if you want life to be >> simple. Else you can weave a mess of [t b f] objects like a spider on >> caffeine. That's what I mean. > > When I was thinking about writing a general purpose dataflow > programming > language which addresses some of Pd's shortcomings, I did a lot of > thinking > about the hot and cold inlet paradigm. What I came up with was the > following > scheme: > > * Hot inlets are red > * Cold inlets are blue > * Neutral inlets are grey > > * A class has a default hot/cold/neutral inlet configuration defined > by the > author. > * The UI allows the user to change the hot/cold/neutral status of > inlets. > * An instance's 'run' method is executed when any of the following > conditions > are met: > * Every cold inlet has been pinged (receives data) > * Any hot inlet has been pinged (receives data) > * Inlets cache their last received data if no new data arrives. > > In Pd, DSP inlets act like the 'cold' inlets above, message inlets > which aren't > the leftmost message inlet [usually] act like 'neutral' inlets > above, and the > leftmost inlet [usually] acts like 'hot' inlets above. > > I like the idea of this behaviour being defined by the class author, > but > (re)configurable by the user. Sounds like an interesting idea, its something more like how vvvv works. For me, I make sense of vvvv by thinking of it as Pd with only tilde objects, no message objects. .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ?El pueblo unido jam?s ser? vencido! From matju at artengine.ca Sun Mar 29 20:13:31 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 14:13:31 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] rjdj, was : Re: [equalizer] / [lowshelf] / [highshelf] in purepd! In-Reply-To: <20090329125420.GA30945@footils.org> References: <200903241216.06587.dmotd@gmx.net> <20090324070331.GA14255@fliwatut.scifi> <49CCF027.9050704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090327182314.GD24694@footils.org> <49CE148B.6020402@la-kitchen.fr> <20090328143756.GA27685@footils.org> <49CE5CA3.1090704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090329105326.GB8572@fliwatut.scifi> <20090329125420.GA30945@footils.org> Message-ID: On Sun, 29 Mar 2009, Frank Barknecht wrote: > volker b?hm hat gesagt: // volker b?hm wrote: >> thanks for posting this. >> for certain freqs i hear a noticeable periodic "zipping" in the sound >> (try 230 hz e.g.). > Hm, I don't hear it, but that may be my ears. >> since the algorithm is based on the sinc function (sin(x)/x), i wonder >> how pd handles divide by zero in the signal domain. wouldn't you have to >> check for that in the code/patch? > A [/~] with no signal in the right inlet in Pd gives 0 as output. > In saw~.pd x never becomes zero, it's always at least 1.8955. :) Well, if divide-by-zero happens any often in there, it would be worthwhile to do an explicit check for divide-by-zero in the patch, because in this case 0/0 is expected to give 1, as all neighbouring values of sin(x)/x are getting closer to 1 as x gets closer to 0: that's what you need to make sin(x)/x a smooth function. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From stffn at dibidut.dk Sun Mar 29 21:20:07 2009 From: stffn at dibidut.dk (Steffen Juul) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 21:20:07 +0200 Subject: [PD] building vanilla on os x (Was: Re: abs~ and exp~ fixes [was: rjdj]) In-Reply-To: <79735E52-3DCD-4EF1-A252-11537E0FB1D3@gmx.ch> References: <20090324070331.GA14255@fliwatut.scifi> <49CCF027.9050704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090327182314.GD24694@footils.org> <49CE148B.6020402@la-kitchen.fr> <20090328143756.GA27685@footils.org> <49CE5CA3.1090704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090329105326.GB8572@fliwatut.scifi> <20090329125420.GA30945@footils.org> <880E8039-FF84-43FA-BEE6-11899A8798E9@gmx.ch> <20090329144419.GA31264@footils.org> <79735E52-3DCD-4EF1-A252-11537E0FB1D3@gmx.ch> Message-ID: On 29/03/2009, at 17.41, volker b?hm wrote: > however i never succeeded in building pd vanilla on osx myself > (anyone?). No, not with the makefile shipped with vanilla. It would be nice to know who Miller actually builds it. From fbar at footils.org Sun Mar 29 22:11:42 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 22:11:42 +0200 Subject: [PD] abs~ and exp~ fixes [was: rjdj] In-Reply-To: <20090329170958.GA31490@footils.org> References: <49CE148B.6020402@la-kitchen.fr> <20090328143756.GA27685@footils.org> <49CE5CA3.1090704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090329105326.GB8572@fliwatut.scifi> <20090329125420.GA30945@footils.org> <880E8039-FF84-43FA-BEE6-11899A8798E9@gmx.ch> <20090329144419.GA31264@footils.org> <79735E52-3DCD-4EF1-A252-11537E0FB1D3@gmx.ch> <20090329170958.GA31490@footils.org> Message-ID: <20090329201142.GA31789@footils.org> Hallo, Frank Barknecht hat gesagt: // Frank Barknecht wrote: > Hallo, > volker b?hm hat gesagt: // volker b?hm wrote: > > > however i never succeeded in building pd vanilla on osx myself > > (anyone?). > > so it seems i can't apply the fix myself, but have to wait for a new > > version. > > You could copy over some abs~.pd_darwin from pd-extended, pd-0.42 will happily > use that instead. Or use Enrique's table idiom instead. I attached it applied to abs~. (You can get sgn~ from it as well) Ciao -- Frank -------------- next part -------------- #N canvas 0 0 694 381 10; #X obj 158 194 absolute~; #N canvas 0 0 450 300 (subpatch) 0; #X array \$0-s 100 float 0; #X coords 0 1 99 -1 200 140 1; #X restore 294 154 graph; #X obj 157 277 tabwrite~ \$0-s; #X obj 187 256 metro 100; #X obj 187 232 tgl 15 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1 1 1; #X obj 159 148 osc~ 220; #X connect 0 0 2 0; #X connect 3 0 2 0; #X connect 4 0 3 0; #X connect 5 0 0 0; -------------- next part -------------- #N canvas 213 92 514 325 10; #X obj 240 36 loadbang; #X obj 240 78 s \$0-sgn; #X obj 240 99 table \$0-sgn 2; #X msg 240 57 0 -1 1; #X obj 75 100 tabread~ \$0-sgn; #X obj 74 63 +~ 1; #X obj 58 170 *~; #X obj 59 194 outlet~; #X obj 57 33 inlet~; #X text 95 124 <= sign of input; #X text 127 195 <= abs of input; #X connect 0 0 3 0; #X connect 3 0 1 0; #X connect 4 0 6 1; #X connect 5 0 4 0; #X connect 6 0 7 0; #X connect 8 0 5 0; #X connect 8 0 6 0; From hans at eds.org Mon Mar 30 00:31:54 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Sun, 29 Mar 2009 18:31:54 -0400 Subject: [PD] building vanilla on os x (Was: Re: abs~ and exp~ fixes [was: rjdj]) In-Reply-To: References: <20090324070331.GA14255@fliwatut.scifi> <49CCF027.9050704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090327182314.GD24694@footils.org> <49CE148B.6020402@la-kitchen.fr> <20090328143756.GA27685@footils.org> <49CE5CA3.1090704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090329105326.GB8572@fliwatut.scifi> <20090329125420.GA30945@footils.org> <880E8039-FF84-43FA-BEE6-11899A8798E9@gmx.ch> <20090329144419.GA31264@footils.org> <79735E52-3DCD-4EF1-A252-11537E0FB1D3@gmx.ch> Message-ID: <4DEFC672-6F2D-435F-984A-6CD3A3FB1DCF@eds.org> On Mar 29, 2009, at 3:20 PM, Steffen Juul wrote: > > On 29/03/2009, at 17.41, volker b?hm wrote: > >> however i never succeeded in building pd vanilla on osx myself >> (anyone?). > > No, not with the makefile shipped with vanilla. It would be nice to > know who Miller actually builds it. You can build it with the Pd-extended build system. You just have to remove the --enable-jack or use the old version of JackOSX. .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- ?El pueblo unido jam?s ser? vencido! From vboehm at gmx.ch Mon Mar 30 12:04:04 2009 From: vboehm at gmx.ch (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?volker_b=F6hm?=) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 12:04:04 +0200 Subject: [PD] abs~ and exp~ fixes [was: rjdj] In-Reply-To: <20090329170958.GA31490@footils.org> References: <20090327182314.GD24694@footils.org> <49CE148B.6020402@la-kitchen.fr> <20090328143756.GA27685@footils.org> <49CE5CA3.1090704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090329105326.GB8572@fliwatut.scifi> <20090329125420.GA30945@footils.org> <880E8039-FF84-43FA-BEE6-11899A8798E9@gmx.ch> <20090329144419.GA31264@footils.org> <79735E52-3DCD-4EF1-A252-11537E0FB1D3@gmx.ch> <20090329170958.GA31490@footils.org> Message-ID: <6B8BDB69-4C23-481E-88BD-AEA3F1AF18C4@gmx.ch> On 29 Mar 2009, at 19:09, Frank Barknecht wrote: >> >> > > You could copy over some abs~.pd_darwin from pd-extended, pd-0.42 > will happily > use that instead. > i tried that, but here pd vanilla always prefers its own internal abs~. sticking the external abs~ into /Contents/Resources/extra/ didn't help. neither did creating an extra folder (with abs~ inside) and adding its path to pd's path preferences (this normally works for adding my own externals). where would i put the external, to overrule the internal? as i understand from the recent discussions this process is rather convoluted, but is it also unpredictable? vb From fbar at footils.org Mon Mar 30 12:23:43 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 12:23:43 +0200 Subject: [PD] abs~ and exp~ fixes [was: rjdj] In-Reply-To: <6B8BDB69-4C23-481E-88BD-AEA3F1AF18C4@gmx.ch> References: <20090328143756.GA27685@footils.org> <49CE5CA3.1090704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090329105326.GB8572@fliwatut.scifi> <20090329125420.GA30945@footils.org> <880E8039-FF84-43FA-BEE6-11899A8798E9@gmx.ch> <20090329144419.GA31264@footils.org> <79735E52-3DCD-4EF1-A252-11537E0FB1D3@gmx.ch> <20090329170958.GA31490@footils.org> <6B8BDB69-4C23-481E-88BD-AEA3F1AF18C4@gmx.ch> Message-ID: <20090330102343.GA1890@footils.org> Hallo, volker b?hm hat gesagt: // volker b?hm wrote: > i tried that, but here pd vanilla always prefers its own internal abs~. > sticking the external abs~ into /Contents/Resources/extra/ didn't help. > neither did creating an extra folder (with abs~ inside) and adding its > path to pd's path preferences (this normally works for adding my own > externals). > > where would i put the external, to overrule the internal? > as i understand from the recent discussions this process is rather > convoluted, but is it also unpredictable? It's "strange" and in the opinion of several other developers like IOhannes (and I think me, too) buggy by design, too. But if you load the abs~.pd_darwin with "-lib abs~" then that should override the internal. However it's better for now to replace the [abs~] with the tabread~ solution I posted as "absolute~.pd" yesterday. Just embed it into the patch. Ciao -- Frank From vboehm at gmx.ch Mon Mar 30 12:51:53 2009 From: vboehm at gmx.ch (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?volker_b=F6hm?=) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 12:51:53 +0200 Subject: [PD] abs~ and exp~ fixes [was: rjdj] In-Reply-To: <20090330102343.GA1890@footils.org> References: <20090328143756.GA27685@footils.org> <49CE5CA3.1090704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090329105326.GB8572@fliwatut.scifi> <20090329125420.GA30945@footils.org> <880E8039-FF84-43FA-BEE6-11899A8798E9@gmx.ch> <20090329144419.GA31264@footils.org> <79735E52-3DCD-4EF1-A252-11537E0FB1D3@gmx.ch> <20090329170958.GA31490@footils.org> <6B8BDB69-4C23-481E-88BD-AEA3F1AF18C4@gmx.ch> <20090330102343.GA1890@footils.org> Message-ID: <325F517D-6428-422D-B503-D05863789A26@gmx.ch> On 30 Mar 2009, at 12:23, Frank Barknecht wrote: > However it's better for now to replace the [abs~] with the tabread~ > solution I > posted as "absolute~.pd" yesterday. Just embed it into the patch. yes, thanks. vb From vboehm at gmx.ch Mon Mar 30 12:52:09 2009 From: vboehm at gmx.ch (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?volker_b=F6hm?=) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 12:52:09 +0200 Subject: [PD] building vanilla on os x (Was: Re: abs~ and exp~ fixes [was: rjdj]) In-Reply-To: <4DEFC672-6F2D-435F-984A-6CD3A3FB1DCF@eds.org> References: <20090324070331.GA14255@fliwatut.scifi> <49CCF027.9050704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090327182314.GD24694@footils.org> <49CE148B.6020402@la-kitchen.fr> <20090328143756.GA27685@footils.org> <49CE5CA3.1090704@la-kitchen.fr> <20090329105326.GB8572@fliwatut.scifi> <20090329125420.GA30945@footils.org> <880E8039-FF84-43FA-BEE6-11899A8798E9@gmx.ch> <20090329144419.GA31264@footils.org> <79735E52-3DCD-4EF1-A252-11537E0FB1D3@gmx.ch> <4DEFC672-6F2D-435F-984A-6CD3A3FB1DCF@eds.org> Message-ID: On 30 Mar 2009, at 00:31, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > On Mar 29, 2009, at 3:20 PM, Steffen Juul wrote: > >> >> On 29/03/2009, at 17.41, volker b?hm wrote: >> >>> however i never succeeded in building pd vanilla on osx myself >>> (anyone?). >> >> No, not with the makefile shipped with vanilla. It would be nice >> to know who Miller actually builds it. > > > You can build it with the Pd-extended build system. You just have > to remove the --enable-jack or use the old version of JackOSX. thanks hc, i remember you mentioned that before. i did try it some time ago, but didn't get very far either. didn't spend much time on this, so no complaints. it probably works that way. but i remember downloading a lot of files (part of which i didn't actually want), trying to compile a huge amount of code and finally stranding in some chaotic/confused state ;) i thought that the documentation to end up with a simple vanilla build wasn't particulary clear. (if it's useful, i could go into greater detail here) what remains is the impression that it shouldn't be so complicated (compared to a simple linux build!). but obviously osx doesn't play well in this respect. vb From lukexipd at gmail.com Mon Mar 30 14:01:35 2009 From: lukexipd at gmail.com (Luke Iannini) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 05:01:35 -0700 Subject: [PD] building vanilla on os x (Was: Re: abs~ and exp~ fixes [was: rjdj]) In-Reply-To: References: <20090324070331.GA14255@fliwatut.scifi> <20090329105326.GB8572@fliwatut.scifi> <20090329125420.GA30945@footils.org> <880E8039-FF84-43FA-BEE6-11899A8798E9@gmx.ch> <20090329144419.GA31264@footils.org> <79735E52-3DCD-4EF1-A252-11537E0FB1D3@gmx.ch> <4DEFC672-6F2D-435F-984A-6CD3A3FB1DCF@eds.org> Message-ID: <7aaf8bb90903300501r7dec3111uba9e48aa81583a89@mail.gmail.com> On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 3:52 AM, volker b?hm wrote: > > On 30 Mar 2009, at 00:31, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >> >> On Mar 29, 2009, at 3:20 PM, Steffen Juul wrote: >> >>> >>> On 29/03/2009, at 17.41, volker b?hm wrote: >>> >>>> however i never succeeded in building pd vanilla on osx myself >>>> (anyone?). >>> >>> No, not with the makefile shipped with vanilla. It would be nice to know >>> who Miller actually builds it. Hmm.. I build Pd on OS X all the time! I don't think I've done anything special but perhaps I did long ago. Of course, I don't know the process by which Miller assembles the Pd app bundle, but I simply build the pd binary and drop it in to the latest Pd.app from Miller's site. Where is it failing? Best Luke >> >> >> You can build it with the Pd-extended build system. ?You just have to >> remove the --enable-jack or use the old version of JackOSX. > > thanks hc, i remember you mentioned that before. > i did try it some time ago, but didn't get very far either. > didn't spend much time on this, so no complaints. it probably works that > way. > but i remember downloading a lot of files (part of which i didn't actually > want), trying to compile a huge amount of code and finally stranding in some > chaotic/confused state ;) > i thought that the documentation to end up with a simple vanilla build > wasn't particulary clear. > (if it's useful, i could go into greater detail here) > > what remains is the impression that it shouldn't be so complicated (compared > to a simple linux build!). > but obviously osx doesn't play well in this respect. > > vb > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > From bbakersmith at gmail.com Mon Mar 30 16:21:02 2009 From: bbakersmith at gmail.com (Ben Baker-Smith) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 09:21:02 -0500 Subject: [PD] GEM on the web? Message-ID: Hello list, I've been hearing bits and pieces recently about using PD across networks and the internet. I believe some people were actually working on developing a website where multiple users could upload and manipulate the same PD patch in close-to realtime. What I'm wondering is this: Is it possible, or could it be possible, to display an active Gemwindow on a website? Ideally, visitors to the site would be able to interact with the patch, either through microphone input on their computer or keystrokes, etc. However, I'd even be happy with a way to run an ongoing, non-interactive patch. I know basically nothing about the networking side of PD, and I'm sure this is over my head right now, but I'd really appreciate any feedback. Thanks, -Ben From porres at gmail.com Mon Mar 30 16:35:24 2009 From: porres at gmail.com (Alexandre Porres) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 11:35:24 -0300 Subject: [PD] pd book sprint In-Reply-To: <49D0D533.1000802@umatic.nl> References: <49D0D533.1000802@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <161a0b1e0903300735g182e469cn479fcc16767e36da@mail.gmail.com> Hi, I am really interested in helping! I actually have some stuff I wanted to "corrrect", or bring some attention to, like the DC OFFSET. You dont cover it, and when you show how to get a Square Wave, the DC Offset is not properly adjusted. thanks cheers On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 11:20 AM, Derek Holzer wrote: > Hey Alexandre, > > I just posted the announcement of the Pd FLOSS Manuals Book Sprint: > > http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/2009-03/069107.html > > I was wondering if you'd be interested to help out next weekend? It > shouldn't be a problem to contribute remotely, and it would really help > build up the momentum to finish this manual. > > Have a look over the topics and see if there is anything you'd like to > cover and let me know. > > Best! > Derek > > -- > ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: > http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 11: > "Always first steps" > > > -- Alexandre Torres Porres cel. (11)8179-6226 Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From derek at umatic.nl Mon Mar 30 16:43:05 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 16:43:05 +0200 Subject: [PD] pd book sprint In-Reply-To: <161a0b1e0903300735g182e469cn479fcc16767e36da@mail.gmail.com> References: <49D0D533.1000802@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300735g182e469cn479fcc16767e36da@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49D0DA79.7010205@umatic.nl> Alexandre, Yes please, get on board! In the case of the square wave chapter, I had assumed that doing it with digital logic would result in either 0 (no amplitude) or 1 (full amplitude). So there shouldn't be any DC offset when it's at 0. Of course, there are some other real-world problems with those patches, namely that there is also no antialiasing. Since the FLOSS Manuals are "modular", they can be remixed as needed for any kind of workshop, class or curriculum, including or leaving out sections from all the different FLOSS Manuals as needed. So my suggestion to you would be to write a short chapter on DC offset which can then be referred to in the square wave tutorial, or in any other tutorial or manual where such a situation might arise. Likewise, I'd love it if someone could do a single chapter on the different antialiasing methods (Miller's, Frank's...). The idea would be to simplify the explanations so that one doesn't need a background in DSP or computer science in order to understand them. Would you be interested to do either of those? D. Alexandre Porres wrote: > Hi, I am really interested in helping! > > I actually have some stuff I wanted to "corrrect", or bring some > attention to, like the DC OFFSET. You dont cover it, and when you show > how to get a Square Wave, the DC Offset is not properly adjusted. > > thanks > > cheers > > On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 11:20 AM, Derek Holzer > wrote: > > Hey Alexandre, > > I just posted the announcement of the Pd FLOSS Manuals Book Sprint: > > http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/2009-03/069107.html > > I was wondering if you'd be interested to help out next weekend? It > shouldn't be a problem to contribute remotely, and it would really help > build up the momentum to finish this manual. > > Have a look over the topics and see if there is anything you'd like to > cover and let me know. > > Best! > Derek > > -- > ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: > http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 11: > "Always first steps" > > > > > > -- > Alexandre Torres Porres > cel. (11)8179-6226 > Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home > http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres > -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 109: "Lost in useless territory" From sballmada at googlemail.com Mon Mar 30 16:43:27 2009 From: sballmada at googlemail.com (Simon Ball) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 15:43:27 +0100 Subject: [PD] Background Colour... Message-ID: <31da0ae00903300743i5727b152w73e2e99b6b9723fa@mail.gmail.com> Hi there, simple question... How do I change the background colour of the window? I'm still learning, obviously. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From porres at gmail.com Mon Mar 30 16:50:16 2009 From: porres at gmail.com (Alexandre Porres) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 11:50:16 -0300 Subject: [PD] pd book sprint In-Reply-To: <49D0DA79.7010205@umatic.nl> References: <49D0D533.1000802@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300735g182e469cn479fcc16767e36da@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DA79.7010205@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <161a0b1e0903300750o7df7de1k2ebf911d6dfd0139@mail.gmail.com> sure, I could do both. But I think it would be inportant to start just after - AUDIO TUTORIALS - SimpleSynthIntroduction and before the oscilators with the Short DC offset chapter. Then edit and correct the oscilator patches with values from -1 to 1 I also can create and put in the oscilator chapter a Triangle wave oscilator made with phasor what do you say? Cheers On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 11:43 AM, Derek Holzer wrote: > Alexandre, > > Yes please, get on board! > > In the case of the square wave chapter, I had assumed that doing it with > digital logic would result in either 0 (no amplitude) or 1 (full amplitude). > So there shouldn't be any DC offset when it's at 0. Of course, there are > some other real-world problems with those patches, namely that there is also > no antialiasing. > > Since the FLOSS Manuals are "modular", they can be remixed as needed for > any kind of workshop, class or curriculum, including or leaving out sections > from all the different FLOSS Manuals as needed. > > So my suggestion to you would be to write a short chapter on DC offset > which can then be referred to in the square wave tutorial, or in any other > tutorial or manual where such a situation might arise. > > Likewise, I'd love it if someone could do a single chapter on the different > antialiasing methods (Miller's, Frank's...). The idea would be to simplify > the explanations so that one doesn't need a background in DSP or computer > science in order to understand them. > > Would you be interested to do either of those? > > D. > > Alexandre Porres wrote: > >> Hi, I am really interested in helping! >> >> I actually have some stuff I wanted to "corrrect", or bring some attention >> to, like the DC OFFSET. You dont cover it, and when you show how to get a >> Square Wave, the DC Offset is not properly adjusted. >> >> thanks >> >> cheers >> >> On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 11:20 AM, Derek Holzer > derek at umatic.nl>> wrote: >> >> Hey Alexandre, >> >> I just posted the announcement of the Pd FLOSS Manuals Book Sprint: >> >> http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/2009-03/069107.html >> >> I was wondering if you'd be interested to help out next weekend? It >> shouldn't be a problem to contribute remotely, and it would really help >> build up the momentum to finish this manual. >> >> Have a look over the topics and see if there is anything you'd like to >> cover and let me know. >> >> Best! >> Derek >> >> -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: >> http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: >> ---Oblique Strategy # 11: >> "Always first steps" >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Alexandre Torres Porres >> cel. (11)8179-6226 >> Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home >> http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres >> >> > -- > ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: > http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 109: > "Lost in useless territory" > -- Alexandre Torres Porres cel. (11)8179-6226 Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From porres at gmail.com Mon Mar 30 16:54:45 2009 From: porres at gmail.com (Alexandre Porres) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 11:54:45 -0300 Subject: [PD] pd book sprint In-Reply-To: <161a0b1e0903300750o7df7de1k2ebf911d6dfd0139@mail.gmail.com> References: <49D0D533.1000802@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300735g182e469cn479fcc16767e36da@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DA79.7010205@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300750o7df7de1k2ebf911d6dfd0139@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <161a0b1e0903300754g6d8af6dei6d99759297d9da61@mail.gmail.com> well, for instance inside the Squarewaves and Logic chapter the DC Offset could be easilly built inside the EXPR object, either in the one that is already there, or in an object right after to make the visualization easier. I could edit all thos patches that need to adjust the DC offset. On this case, it would also be nice to have the Tables just a bit larger that -1 - 1, (1.1 or 1.2) so we can better see the Square Waves. cheers On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 11:50 AM, Alexandre Porres wrote: > sure, I could do both. > But I think it would be inportant to start just after > > > - AUDIO TUTORIALS > - SimpleSynthIntroduction > > > and before the oscilators with the Short DC offset chapter. > > Then edit and correct the oscilator patches with values from -1 to 1 > > I also can create and put in the oscilator chapter a Triangle wave > oscilator made with phasor > > what do you say? > > Cheers > > > On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 11:43 AM, Derek Holzer wrote: > >> Alexandre, >> >> Yes please, get on board! >> >> In the case of the square wave chapter, I had assumed that doing it with >> digital logic would result in either 0 (no amplitude) or 1 (full amplitude). >> So there shouldn't be any DC offset when it's at 0. Of course, there are >> some other real-world problems with those patches, namely that there is also >> no antialiasing. >> >> Since the FLOSS Manuals are "modular", they can be remixed as needed for >> any kind of workshop, class or curriculum, including or leaving out sections >> from all the different FLOSS Manuals as needed. >> >> So my suggestion to you would be to write a short chapter on DC offset >> which can then be referred to in the square wave tutorial, or in any other >> tutorial or manual where such a situation might arise. >> >> Likewise, I'd love it if someone could do a single chapter on the >> different antialiasing methods (Miller's, Frank's...). The idea would be to >> simplify the explanations so that one doesn't need a background in DSP or >> computer science in order to understand them. >> >> Would you be interested to do either of those? >> >> D. >> >> Alexandre Porres wrote: >> >>> Hi, I am really interested in helping! >>> >>> I actually have some stuff I wanted to "corrrect", or bring some >>> attention to, like the DC OFFSET. You dont cover it, and when you show how >>> to get a Square Wave, the DC Offset is not properly adjusted. >>> >>> thanks >>> >>> cheers >>> >>> On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 11:20 AM, Derek Holzer >> derek at umatic.nl>> wrote: >>> >>> Hey Alexandre, >>> >>> I just posted the announcement of the Pd FLOSS Manuals Book Sprint: >>> >>> http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/2009-03/069107.html >>> >>> I was wondering if you'd be interested to help out next weekend? It >>> shouldn't be a problem to contribute remotely, and it would really >>> help >>> build up the momentum to finish this manual. >>> >>> Have a look over the topics and see if there is anything you'd like to >>> cover and let me know. >>> >>> Best! >>> Derek >>> >>> -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: >>> http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: >>> ---Oblique Strategy # 11: >>> "Always first steps" >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Alexandre Torres Porres >>> cel. (11)8179-6226 >>> Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home >>> http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres >>> >>> >> -- >> ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: >> http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: >> ---Oblique Strategy # 109: >> "Lost in useless territory" >> > > > > -- > Alexandre Torres Porres > cel. (11)8179-6226 > Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home > http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres > > -- Alexandre Torres Porres cel. (11)8179-6226 Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From derek at umatic.nl Mon Mar 30 16:56:05 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 16:56:05 +0200 Subject: [PD] pd book sprint In-Reply-To: <161a0b1e0903300750o7df7de1k2ebf911d6dfd0139@mail.gmail.com> References: <49D0D533.1000802@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300735g182e469cn479fcc16767e36da@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DA79.7010205@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300750o7df7de1k2ebf911d6dfd0139@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49D0DD85.2080303@umatic.nl> Actually, DC offset could be covered in "What is Digital Audio", since it is a concept that needs explaining. Then, my suggestion still is to include it after the basics of the Square Waves. I'd like to keep the patches there as simple as possible, and since the DC Offset can be done at the end, why not have it there? Triangle wave would also be good. Write it first and we'll see where exactly to put it. D. Alexandre Porres wrote: > sure, I could do both. > > But I think it would be inportant to start just after > > > * AUDIO TUTORIALS > * SimpleSynthIntroduction > > > > and before the oscilators with the Short DC offset chapter. > > Then edit and correct the oscilator patches with values from -1 to 1 > > I also can create and put in the oscilator chapter a Triangle wave > oscilator made with phasor > > what do you say? > > Cheers > > > On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 11:43 AM, Derek Holzer > wrote: > > Alexandre, > > Yes please, get on board! > > In the case of the square wave chapter, I had assumed that doing it > with digital logic would result in either 0 (no amplitude) or 1 > (full amplitude). So there shouldn't be any DC offset when it's at > 0. Of course, there are some other real-world problems with those > patches, namely that there is also no antialiasing. > > Since the FLOSS Manuals are "modular", they can be remixed as needed > for any kind of workshop, class or curriculum, including or leaving > out sections from all the different FLOSS Manuals as needed. > > So my suggestion to you would be to write a short chapter on DC > offset which can then be referred to in the square wave tutorial, or > in any other tutorial or manual where such a situation might arise. > > Likewise, I'd love it if someone could do a single chapter on the > different antialiasing methods (Miller's, Frank's...). The idea > would be to simplify the explanations so that one doesn't need a > background in DSP or computer science in order to understand them. > > Would you be interested to do either of those? > > D. > > Alexandre Porres wrote: > > Hi, I am really interested in helping! > > I actually have some stuff I wanted to "corrrect", or bring some > attention to, like the DC OFFSET. You dont cover it, and when > you show how to get a Square Wave, the DC Offset is not properly > adjusted. > > thanks > > cheers > > On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 11:20 AM, Derek Holzer >> wrote: > > Hey Alexandre, > > I just posted the announcement of the Pd FLOSS Manuals Book > Sprint: > > http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/2009-03/069107.html > > I was wondering if you'd be interested to help out next > weekend? It > shouldn't be a problem to contribute remotely, and it would > really help > build up the momentum to finish this manual. > > Have a look over the topics and see if there is anything > you'd like to > cover and let me know. > > Best! > Derek > > -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: > http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 11: > "Always first steps" > > > > > > -- > Alexandre Torres Porres > cel. (11)8179-6226 > Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home > http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres > > > -- > ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: > http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 109: > "Lost in useless territory" > > > > > -- > Alexandre Torres Porres > cel. (11)8179-6226 > Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home > http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres > -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 67: "Emphasize the flaws" From derek at umatic.nl Mon Mar 30 16:57:49 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 16:57:49 +0200 Subject: [PD] pd book sprint In-Reply-To: <161a0b1e0903300754g6d8af6dei6d99759297d9da61@mail.gmail.com> References: <49D0D533.1000802@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300735g182e469cn479fcc16767e36da@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DA79.7010205@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300750o7df7de1k2ebf911d6dfd0139@mail.gmail.com> <161a0b1e0903300754g6d8af6dei6d99759297d9da61@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49D0DDED.4000800@umatic.nl> I've noticed that some systems actually don't create [>~] or [<~], so I was thinking to redo those sections with [expr~] anyways. If you'd like to jump in and do all that, it could work. The main part of that chapter is that it is also covering digital logic, so I wanted to stick with values of 0 and 1 for clarity. Do you see any way we can work this out? D. Alexandre Porres wrote: > well, for instance > > inside the Squarewaves and Logic chapter > > the DC Offset could be easilly built inside the EXPR object, either in > the one that is already there, or in an object right after to make the > visualization easier. I could edit all thos patches that need to adjust > the DC offset. > > On this case, it would also be nice to have the Tables just a bit larger > that -1 - 1, (1.1 or 1.2) so we can better see the Square Waves. > > cheers > > > On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 11:50 AM, Alexandre Porres > wrote: > > sure, I could do both. > > But I think it would be inportant to start just after > > > * AUDIO TUTORIALS > * SimpleSynthIntroduction > > > > and before the oscilators with the Short DC offset chapter. > > Then edit and correct the oscilator patches with values from -1 to 1 > > I also can create and put in the oscilator chapter a Triangle wave > oscilator made with phasor > > what do you say? > > Cheers > > > On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 11:43 AM, Derek Holzer > wrote: > > Alexandre, > > Yes please, get on board! > > In the case of the square wave chapter, I had assumed that doing > it with digital logic would result in either 0 (no amplitude) or > 1 (full amplitude). So there shouldn't be any DC offset when > it's at 0. Of course, there are some other real-world problems > with those patches, namely that there is also no antialiasing. > > Since the FLOSS Manuals are "modular", they can be remixed as > needed for any kind of workshop, class or curriculum, including > or leaving out sections from all the different FLOSS Manuals as > needed. > > So my suggestion to you would be to write a short chapter on DC > offset which can then be referred to in the square wave > tutorial, or in any other tutorial or manual where such a > situation might arise. > > Likewise, I'd love it if someone could do a single chapter on > the different antialiasing methods (Miller's, Frank's...). The > idea would be to simplify the explanations so that one doesn't > need a background in DSP or computer science in order to > understand them. > > Would you be interested to do either of those? > > D. > > Alexandre Porres wrote: > > Hi, I am really interested in helping! > > I actually have some stuff I wanted to "corrrect", or bring > some attention to, like the DC OFFSET. You dont cover it, > and when you show how to get a Square Wave, the DC Offset is > not properly adjusted. > > thanks > > cheers > > On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 11:20 AM, Derek Holzer > > >> wrote: > > Hey Alexandre, > > I just posted the announcement of the Pd FLOSS Manuals > Book Sprint: > > > http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/2009-03/069107.html > > I was wondering if you'd be interested to help out next > weekend? It > shouldn't be a problem to contribute remotely, and it > would really help > build up the momentum to finish this manual. > > Have a look over the topics and see if there is anything > you'd like to > cover and let me know. > > Best! > Derek > > -- ::: derek holzer ::: > http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: > http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 11: > "Always first steps" > > > > > > -- > Alexandre Torres Porres > cel. (11)8179-6226 > Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home > http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres > > > -- > ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: > http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 109: > "Lost in useless territory" > > > > > -- > Alexandre Torres Porres > cel. (11)8179-6226 > Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home > http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres > > > > > -- > Alexandre Torres Porres > cel. (11)8179-6226 > Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home > http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres > -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 176: "What context would look right?" From claudiusmaximus at goto10.org Mon Mar 30 17:02:16 2009 From: claudiusmaximus at goto10.org (Claude Heiland-Allen) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 16:02:16 +0100 Subject: [PD] pd book sprint In-Reply-To: <161a0b1e0903300750o7df7de1k2ebf911d6dfd0139@mail.gmail.com> References: <49D0D533.1000802@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300735g182e469cn479fcc16767e36da@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DA79.7010205@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300750o7df7de1k2ebf911d6dfd0139@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49D0DEF8.1080605@goto10.org> Alexandre Porres wrote: > and before the oscilators with the Short DC offset chapter. [hip~ 1] > I also can create and put in the oscilator chapter a Triangle wave oscilator > made with phasor [phasor~] [r~ shape] [expr~ if($v1<$v2,$v1/$v2,(1-$v1)/(1-$v2))] Claude -- http://claudiusmaximus.goto10.org From derek at umatic.nl Mon Mar 30 17:07:42 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 17:07:42 +0200 Subject: [PD] pd book sprint In-Reply-To: <49D0DEF8.1080605@goto10.org> References: <49D0D533.1000802@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300735g182e469cn479fcc16767e36da@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DA79.7010205@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300750o7df7de1k2ebf911d6dfd0139@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DEF8.1080605@goto10.org> Message-ID: <49D0E03E.4050901@umatic.nl> Hello Claude, Claude Heiland-Allen wrote: > Alexandre Porres wrote: >> and before the oscilators with the Short DC offset chapter. > > [hip~ 1] Yes, my thought also, just take care of it with [hip~]. But also, I think the problem of the digital logic system I've created isn't so big, as it can be scaled later, at the end of the whole signal chain: [*~ 2] | [-~ 1] with the [hip] for extra "protection" if needed. No need to completely rewrite the chapter. There is more than one "right way" to do things in Pd ;-) > >> I also can create and put in the oscilator chapter a Triangle wave >> oscilator >> made with phasor > > [phasor~] [r~ shape] > [expr~ if($v1<$v2,$v1/$v2,(1-$v1)/(1-$v2))] Ah, but can you explain in non-technical English why this works? Remember our reader base aren't mathematicians like Miller ;-) best, D. -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 22: "Be less critical more often" From bbakersmith at gmail.com Mon Mar 30 17:18:45 2009 From: bbakersmith at gmail.com (Ben Baker-Smith) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 10:18:45 -0500 Subject: [PD] Chicago Patching Circle (Sunday, March 29th 5pm) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Thanks to Mike for organizing the Chicago meeting yesterday, and to Kyle for also showing up. It was good to connect with some other PD users here, and totally interesting to see what you've been working on / have worked on. Even (or especially) when it was over my head. I'd like to do it again some time, assuming that you both haven't gotten completely jaded and stopped using PD completely ;) I'll be sure to bring some of my own material. -Ben From fbar at footils.org Mon Mar 30 17:27:53 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 17:27:53 +0200 Subject: [PD] pd book sprint In-Reply-To: <49D0E03E.4050901@umatic.nl> References: <49D0D533.1000802@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300735g182e469cn479fcc16767e36da@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DA79.7010205@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300750o7df7de1k2ebf911d6dfd0139@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DEF8.1080605@goto10.org> <49D0E03E.4050901@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <20090330152753.GA2639@footils.org> Hallo, Derek Holzer hat gesagt: // Derek Holzer wrote: >> [phasor~] [r~ shape] >> [expr~ if($v1<$v2,$v1/$v2,(1-$v1)/(1-$v2))] > > Ah, but can you explain in non-technical English why this works? > Remember our reader base aren't mathematicians like Miller ;-) A past post by me describes a different algorithm (without skew) but it shows the generation of a triangle from a phasor using a message analogy: http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/2006-11/044253.html which I find quite intuitive. Ciao -- Frank From matju at artengine.ca Mon Mar 30 17:28:40 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 11:28:40 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] [OT] Re: DIY GSoC: getting those projects done In-Reply-To: <20090328093208.GA24532@mccormick.cx> References: <475768.89279.qm@web65603.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> <20090328093208.GA24532@mccormick.cx> Message-ID: On Sat, 28 Mar 2009, Chris McCormick wrote: > When I was thinking about writing a general purpose dataflow programming > language which addresses some of Pd's shortcomings, I did a lot of thinking > about the hot and cold inlet paradigm. What I came up with was the following > scheme: > * Hot inlets are red > * Cold inlets are blue > * Neutral inlets are grey > * A class has a default hot/cold/neutral inlet configuration defined by the > author. > * The UI allows the user to change the hot/cold/neutral status of inlets. > * An instance's 'run' method is executed when any of the following conditions Well, it would be cool to have a way to configure that in Pd using a uniform syntax all over Pd, or using Pd's GUI. Even without that, I think that it would be important to introduce the "run" concept anyway, because it could help structuring the documentation; I mean it could be introduced at the documentation level first. For implementation, it's currently harder, especially in GridFlow where the implementation currently uses the hot/cold asymmetry to optimise. > * A class has a default hot/cold/neutral inlet configuration defined by > the author. > * The UI allows the user to change the hot/cold/neutral status of > inlets. > * An instance's 'run' method is executed when any of the following > conditions are met: > * Every cold inlet has been pinged (receives data) > * Any hot inlet has been pinged (receives data) > * Inlets cache their last received data if no new data arrives. > In Pd, DSP inlets act like the 'cold' inlets above Well, perhaps you should rename 'neutral' inlets to 'cold' and find another name for what you call 'cold'. Even then, DSP inlets still don't work like your 'cold' inlets because of how they combine together a fan-in (several wires to one inlet) and because of how they handle a non-connected inlet. > I like the idea of this behaviour being defined by the class author, but > (re)configurable by the user. Then this would need a special 'run' method to be defined in t_class, preferably outside of the normal method-list. At first thought I think I'm in favour of reconfigurable inlets, but I'd like to see a proof-of-concept first. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec 5B From vboehm at gmx.ch Mon Mar 30 16:31:12 2009 From: vboehm at gmx.ch (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?volker_b=F6hm?=) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 16:31:12 +0200 Subject: [PD] building vanilla on os x (Was: Re: abs~ and exp~ fixes [was: rjdj]) In-Reply-To: <7aaf8bb90903300501r7dec3111uba9e48aa81583a89@mail.gmail.com> References: <20090324070331.GA14255@fliwatut.scifi> <20090329105326.GB8572@fliwatut.scifi> <20090329125420.GA30945@footils.org> <880E8039-FF84-43FA-BEE6-11899A8798E9@gmx.ch> <20090329144419.GA31264@footils.org> <79735E52-3DCD-4EF1-A252-11537E0FB1D3@gmx.ch> <4DEFC672-6F2D-435F-984A-6CD3A3FB1DCF@eds.org> <7aaf8bb90903300501r7dec3111uba9e48aa81583a89@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <8C5765A2-D2EB-4971-B78D-0318647A0363@gmx.ch> On 30 Mar 2009, at 14:01, Luke Iannini wrote: > On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 3:52 AM, volker b?hm wrote: >> >> On 30 Mar 2009, at 00:31, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >>> >>> On Mar 29, 2009, at 3:20 PM, Steffen Juul wrote: >>> >>>> >>>> On 29/03/2009, at 17.41, volker b?hm wrote: >>>> >>>>> however i never succeeded in building pd vanilla on osx myself >>>>> (anyone?). >>>> >>>> No, not with the makefile shipped with vanilla. It would be nice >>>> to know >>>> who Miller actually builds it. > Hmm.. I build Pd on OS X all the time! I don't think I've done > anything special but perhaps I did long ago. Of course, I don't know > the process by which Miller assembles the Pd app bundle, but I simply > build the pd binary and drop it in to the latest Pd.app from Miller's > site. aha, that's interesting - thanks, luke, this works indeed! i'm still on ppc and had to run ./configure with "--disable-fat" to make the compilation work. so far so good. i had already found that during my earlier attempts to build pd. doing this i end up with libPdTcl.dylib, pd, pd-watchdog, pd.tk, pdreceive, pdsend in the /bin folder. BUT i wrongly assumed, i could start pd on osx just (as under linux) directly from the bin folder by typing ./pd this turned out to not work, giving me a pd window, but a nonfunctional app (menus not filled, no reaction to key strokes, indicating "wish" instead of "pd" etc.). but replacing the pd bin in an old application bundle by the freshly compiled pd binary did the trick. (and now abs~ is performing fine!) actually i have just tried with an old copy of pd-0.37-1 for osx and there it works by starting pd directly from /bin - something obviously changed in between. i would be interested in knowing what's the startup sequence when double clicking on the app bundle. (and how one can build the app bundle after all). thanks, vb From fbar at footils.org Mon Mar 30 17:39:24 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 17:39:24 +0200 Subject: [PD] pd book sprint In-Reply-To: <20090330152753.GA2639@footils.org> References: <49D0D533.1000802@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300735g182e469cn479fcc16767e36da@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DA79.7010205@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300750o7df7de1k2ebf911d6dfd0139@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DEF8.1080605@goto10.org> <49D0E03E.4050901@umatic.nl> <20090330152753.GA2639@footils.org> Message-ID: <20090330153924.GB2639@footils.org> Hallo, Frank Barknecht hat gesagt: // Frank Barknecht wrote: > Hallo, > Derek Holzer hat gesagt: // Derek Holzer wrote: > > >> [phasor~] [r~ shape] > >> [expr~ if($v1<$v2,$v1/$v2,(1-$v1)/(1-$v2))] > > > > Ah, but can you explain in non-technical English why this works? > > Remember our reader base aren't mathematicians like Miller ;-) > > A past post by me describes a different algorithm (without skew) but it > shows the generation of a triangle from a phasor using a message analogy: > http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/2006-11/044253.html > which I find quite intuitive. Ups: Use that instead: http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/2006-11/044256.html Ciao -- Frank From abonnements at revolwear.com Mon Mar 30 17:39:56 2009 From: abonnements at revolwear.com (Max) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 17:39:56 +0200 Subject: [PD] Background Colour... In-Reply-To: <31da0ae00903300743i5727b152w73e2e99b6b9723fa@mail.gmail.com> References: <31da0ae00903300743i5727b152w73e2e99b6b9723fa@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: hi simon, since your previos posts are about Gem i recon you are talking about the gem window. please refer to the help patch for [gemwin], then see the subpatch [pd lighting and fog] since color perception is needs lighting i guess it somehow makes sense to look for it there. you will find there that by simply sending a [color 0 1 1( message to gemwin you can set the background color of it. hope tht helps. Am 30.03.2009 um 16:43 schrieb Simon Ball: > Hi there, simple question... > > How do I change the background colour of the window? > > I'm still learning, obviously. > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: PGP.sig Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 194 bytes Desc: Signierter Teil der Nachricht URL: From porres at gmail.com Mon Mar 30 17:43:27 2009 From: porres at gmail.com (Alexandre Porres) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 12:43:27 -0300 Subject: [PD] pd book sprint In-Reply-To: <49D0DD85.2080303@umatic.nl> References: <49D0D533.1000802@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300735g182e469cn479fcc16767e36da@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DA79.7010205@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300750o7df7de1k2ebf911d6dfd0139@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DD85.2080303@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <161a0b1e0903300843l42ff30eaqe441a2eaac5c9dad@mail.gmail.com> Hi D. Yeah, DC Offset could be covered in what is digital Audio, or maybe briefly mentioned. The thing is that it needs patches to explain and show how adjusting the DC Offset works. I know things must be kept as simple as possible, but not simpler than that, because it could be misleading. I had that problem myself when teaching with Floss Manuals, students had doubts why the square and sawtooth oscilators were different, or "wrong". The DC Offset is an extremely important parameter that should be a part of the synthesizer section of Floss Manuals. It could also be a part of the Amplitude Modulation Examples. Actually, changing DC Offset is all it needs to change from an Amplitude Modulation to a Ring Modulation. So having a DC Offset parameter there can explain the differences between the two. For instance, I find the osc7.pd example really misleading. At first, it is supposed to be a Ring Modulation instead of an Amplitude Modulation, since there is no DC offset in the modulator sigal. But, as the sawtooth wave oscilator has a DC Offset (that shouldnt be tghere anyway, and it is not even mentioned), it is actually an Amplitude modulation after all, with the Remark that the Carrier signal has the role of the Modulator signal, and Not the carrier signal itself. So, in any way (either presenting it as a Ring Modulation or Amplitude Modulation) corrections should be made. So I dont see a way of not editing these patches, because it could be even more confusing if we would write a disconected chapter that complements and gives the tools to correct things that could have been presented before. I just don't see how simplicity here compensates the misleading way the theory is presented. The DC Offset is the main problem I see in Floss Manuals. And I actually give my students an altered version of Floss Manuals to work with because of that. I am developing a book of my own that complements well with the Floss Manuals, but I still need to do make this Remark. I could show my book, but it is in Portuguese only, so far... by the way, we have people in Brazil who would like to collaborate and translate this to portuguese. I can send you a triangle wave oscilator right away. cheers alex On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 11:56 AM, Derek Holzer wrote: > Actually, DC offset could be covered in "What is Digital Audio", since it > is a concept that needs explaining. Then, my suggestion still is to include > it after the basics of the Square Waves. I'd like to keep the patches there > as simple as possible, and since the DC Offset can be done at the end, why > not have it there? > > Triangle wave would also be good. Write it first and we'll see where > exactly to put it. > > D. > > > Alexandre Porres wrote: > >> sure, I could do both. >> >> But I think it would be inportant to start just after >> >> * AUDIO TUTORIALS >> * SimpleSynthIntroduction >> >> >> >> and before the oscilators with the Short DC offset chapter. >> >> Then edit and correct the oscilator patches with values from -1 to 1 >> >> I also can create and put in the oscilator chapter a Triangle wave >> oscilator made with phasor >> >> what do you say? >> >> Cheers >> >> >> On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 11:43 AM, Derek Holzer > derek at umatic.nl>> wrote: >> >> Alexandre, >> >> Yes please, get on board! >> >> In the case of the square wave chapter, I had assumed that doing it >> with digital logic would result in either 0 (no amplitude) or 1 >> (full amplitude). So there shouldn't be any DC offset when it's at >> 0. Of course, there are some other real-world problems with those >> patches, namely that there is also no antialiasing. >> >> Since the FLOSS Manuals are "modular", they can be remixed as needed >> for any kind of workshop, class or curriculum, including or leaving >> out sections from all the different FLOSS Manuals as needed. >> >> So my suggestion to you would be to write a short chapter on DC >> offset which can then be referred to in the square wave tutorial, or >> in any other tutorial or manual where such a situation might arise. >> >> Likewise, I'd love it if someone could do a single chapter on the >> different antialiasing methods (Miller's, Frank's...). The idea >> would be to simplify the explanations so that one doesn't need a >> background in DSP or computer science in order to understand them. >> >> Would you be interested to do either of those? >> >> D. >> >> Alexandre Porres wrote: >> >> Hi, I am really interested in helping! >> >> I actually have some stuff I wanted to "corrrect", or bring some >> attention to, like the DC OFFSET. You dont cover it, and when >> you show how to get a Square Wave, the DC Offset is not properly >> adjusted. >> >> thanks >> >> cheers >> >> On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 11:20 AM, Derek Holzer > > >> >> wrote: >> >> Hey Alexandre, >> >> I just posted the announcement of the Pd FLOSS Manuals Book >> Sprint: >> >> >> http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/2009-03/069107.html >> >> I was wondering if you'd be interested to help out next >> weekend? It >> shouldn't be a problem to contribute remotely, and it would >> really help >> build up the momentum to finish this manual. >> >> Have a look over the topics and see if there is anything >> you'd like to >> cover and let me know. >> >> Best! >> Derek >> >> -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista::: >> http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: >> ---Oblique Strategy # 11: >> "Always first steps" >> >> >> >> >> >> -- Alexandre Torres Porres >> cel. (11)8179-6226 >> Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home >> http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres >> >> >> -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: >> http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: >> ---Oblique Strategy # 109: >> "Lost in useless territory" >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Alexandre Torres Porres >> cel. (11)8179-6226 >> Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home >> http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres >> >> > -- > ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: > http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 67: > "Emphasize the flaws" > -- Alexandre Torres Porres cel. (11)8179-6226 Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From derek at umatic.nl Mon Mar 30 17:45:44 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 17:45:44 +0200 Subject: [PD] pd book sprint In-Reply-To: <161a0b1e0903300843l42ff30eaqe441a2eaac5c9dad@mail.gmail.com> References: <49D0D533.1000802@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300735g182e469cn479fcc16767e36da@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DA79.7010205@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300750o7df7de1k2ebf911d6dfd0139@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DD85.2080303@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300843l42ff30eaqe441a2eaac5c9dad@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49D0E928.7070205@umatic.nl> Could you post the adjusted patches, I'd like to see where your corrections are before I agree to change stuff that is already there. best! D. Alexandre Porres wrote: > Hi D. > > Yeah, DC Offset could be covered in what is digital Audio, or maybe > briefly mentioned. The thing is that it needs patches to explain and > show how adjusting the DC Offset works. > > I know things must be kept as simple as possible, but not simpler than > that, because it could be misleading. I had that problem myself when > teaching with Floss Manuals, students had doubts why the square and > sawtooth oscilators were different, or "wrong". > > The DC Offset is an extremely important parameter that should be a part > of the synthesizer section of Floss Manuals. It could also be a part of > the Amplitude Modulation Examples. Actually, changing DC Offset is all > it needs to change from an Amplitude Modulation to a Ring Modulation. So > having a DC Offset parameter there can explain the differences between > the two. > > For instance, I find the osc7.pd example really misleading. At first, it > is supposed to be a Ring Modulation instead of an Amplitude Modulation, > since there is no DC offset in the modulator sigal. But, as the sawtooth > wave oscilator has a DC Offset (that shouldnt be tghere anyway, and it > is not even mentioned), it is actually an Amplitude modulation after > all, with the Remark that the Carrier signal has the role of the > Modulator signal, and Not the carrier signal itself. So, in any way > (either presenting it as a Ring Modulation or Amplitude Modulation) > corrections should be made. > > So I dont see a way of not editing these patches, because it could be > even more confusing if we would write a disconected chapter that > complements and gives the tools to correct things that could have been > presented before. > > I just don't see how simplicity here compensates the misleading way the > theory is presented. > > The DC Offset is the main problem I see in Floss Manuals. And I actually > give my students an altered version of Floss Manuals to work with > because of that. I am developing a book of my own that complements well > with the Floss Manuals, but I still need to do make this Remark. > > I could show my book, but it is in Portuguese only, so far... > > by the way, we have people in Brazil who would like to collaborate and > translate this to portuguese. > > I can send you a triangle wave oscilator right away. > > cheers > alex > > > On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 11:56 AM, Derek Holzer > wrote: > > Actually, DC offset could be covered in "What is Digital Audio", > since it is a concept that needs explaining. Then, my suggestion > still is to include it after the basics of the Square Waves. I'd > like to keep the patches there as simple as possible, and since the > DC Offset can be done at the end, why not have it there? > > Triangle wave would also be good. Write it first and we'll see where > exactly to put it. > > D. > > > Alexandre Porres wrote: > > sure, I could do both. > > But I think it would be inportant to start just after > > * AUDIO TUTORIALS > * SimpleSynthIntroduction > > > > > and before the oscilators with the Short DC offset chapter. > > Then edit and correct the oscilator patches with values from -1 to 1 > > I also can create and put in the oscilator chapter a Triangle > wave oscilator made with phasor > > what do you say? > > Cheers > > > On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 11:43 AM, Derek Holzer >> wrote: > > Alexandre, > > Yes please, get on board! > > In the case of the square wave chapter, I had assumed that > doing it > with digital logic would result in either 0 (no amplitude) or 1 > (full amplitude). So there shouldn't be any DC offset when > it's at > 0. Of course, there are some other real-world problems with those > patches, namely that there is also no antialiasing. > > Since the FLOSS Manuals are "modular", they can be remixed as > needed > for any kind of workshop, class or curriculum, including or > leaving > out sections from all the different FLOSS Manuals as needed. > > So my suggestion to you would be to write a short chapter on DC > offset which can then be referred to in the square wave > tutorial, or > in any other tutorial or manual where such a situation might > arise. > > Likewise, I'd love it if someone could do a single chapter on the > different antialiasing methods (Miller's, Frank's...). The idea > would be to simplify the explanations so that one doesn't need a > background in DSP or computer science in order to understand > them. > > Would you be interested to do either of those? > > D. > > Alexandre Porres wrote: > > Hi, I am really interested in helping! > > I actually have some stuff I wanted to "corrrect", or > bring some > attention to, like the DC OFFSET. You dont cover it, and when > you show how to get a Square Wave, the DC Offset is not > properly > adjusted. > > thanks > > cheers > > On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 11:20 AM, Derek Holzer > > > > > > >>> wrote: > > Hey Alexandre, > > I just posted the announcement of the Pd FLOSS Manuals > Book > Sprint: > > > http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/2009-03/069107.html > > I was wondering if you'd be interested to help out next > weekend? It > shouldn't be a problem to contribute remotely, and it > would > really help > build up the momentum to finish this manual. > > Have a look over the topics and see if there is anything > you'd like to > cover and let me know. > > Best! > Derek > > -- ::: derek holzer ::: > http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: > http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 11: > "Always first steps" > > > > > > -- Alexandre Torres Porres > cel. (11)8179-6226 > Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home > http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres > > > -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: > http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 109: > "Lost in useless territory" > > > > > -- > Alexandre Torres Porres > cel. (11)8179-6226 > Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home > http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres > > > -- > ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: > http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 67: > "Emphasize the flaws" > > > > > -- > Alexandre Torres Porres > cel. (11)8179-6226 > Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home > http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres > -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 110: "Lowest common denominator" From porres at gmail.com Mon Mar 30 18:10:35 2009 From: porres at gmail.com (Alexandre Porres) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 13:10:35 -0300 Subject: [PD] pd book sprint In-Reply-To: <49D0DEF8.1080605@goto10.org> References: <49D0D533.1000802@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300735g182e469cn479fcc16767e36da@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DA79.7010205@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300750o7df7de1k2ebf911d6dfd0139@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DEF8.1080605@goto10.org> Message-ID: <161a0b1e0903300910y2e73a46chdc4121bf2c1aea56@mail.gmail.com> On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 12:02 PM, Claude Heiland-Allen < claudiusmaximus at goto10.org> wrote: > > > [phasor~] [r~ shape] > [expr~ if($v1<$v2,$v1/$v2,(1-$v1)/(1-$v2))] > > I tried that, but it didnt actually worked, I just get actual sawtooths, and no real triangles. here is what I got. [phasor~] [expr~ (min($v1, 1 - $v1) * 4) -1] this is explained step by step with boxes and commentaries for the non matematicians (like me). I tried to send the patch as text to this message, hope it works. ------------------------- #N canvas 233 52 823 501 10; #X obj 385 316 phasor~ 200; #X obj 125 92 *~ -1; #X obj 125 114 +~ 1; #X obj 104 159 min~; #X obj 385 337 expr~ (min($v1 \, 1 - $v1) * 4) - 1; #X obj 145 333 tgl 15 0 empty empty empty 0 -6 0 10 -262144 -1 -1 0 1; #X obj 130 352 *~; #X obj 114 59 phasor~ 220; #X obj 104 264 *~ 4; #X obj 104 301 -~ 1; #X obj 130 373 dac~; #X text 163 102 Inverts to Ramp Down generator (1 - 0); #X text 202 59 Ramp Generator (0 - 1); #X text 139 159 compares ramp up and ramp down and passes the smaller value.; #X text 123 205 This creates a Triangle wave with DC offset and gain from (0 - 0.5). Now we need to adjust the gaind and DC ofsset; #X text 379 290 Expr Version; #X text 136 264 Normalize values to (0 -2); #X text 141 303 corrects DC Offset; #X obj 409 383 tgl 15 0 empty empty empty 0 -6 0 10 -262144 -1 -1 0 1; #X obj 394 402 *~; #X obj 394 423 dac~; #X connect 0 0 4 0; #X connect 1 0 2 0; #X connect 2 0 3 1; #X connect 3 0 8 0; #X connect 4 0 19 0; #X connect 5 0 6 1; #X connect 6 0 10 0; #X connect 7 0 1 0; #X connect 7 0 3 0; #X connect 8 0 9 0; #X connect 9 0 6 0; #X connect 18 0 19 1; #X connect 19 0 20 0; -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kyleklip at gmail.com Mon Mar 30 18:12:39 2009 From: kyleklip at gmail.com (Kyle Klipowicz) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 11:12:39 -0500 Subject: [PD] Chicago Patching Circle (Sunday, March 29th 5pm) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Yeah it was fun to share some meat-space with fellow geeks. We'll have to plan another one soon, and try to promote it a bit more. ~Kyle On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 10:18 AM, Ben Baker-Smith wrote: > Thanks to Mike for organizing the Chicago meeting yesterday, and to > Kyle for also showing up. > > It was good to connect with some other PD users here, and totally > interesting to see what you've been working on / have worked on. Even > (or especially) when it was over my head. > > I'd like to do it again some time, assuming that you both haven't > gotten completely jaded and stopped using PD completely ;) > I'll be sure to bring some of my own material. > > -Ben > -- ----- ------------ ---- ----- ---- -------- - ------ http://perhapsidid.wordpress.com http://myspace.com/kyleklipowicz -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From porres at gmail.com Mon Mar 30 18:23:24 2009 From: porres at gmail.com (Alexandre Porres) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 13:23:24 -0300 Subject: [PD] triangle Message-ID: <161a0b1e0903300923n40d7a8a3waec1b27568300319@mail.gmail.com> did it go? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: triangle.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 1143 bytes Desc: not available URL: From claudiusmaximus at goto10.org Mon Mar 30 18:25:05 2009 From: claudiusmaximus at goto10.org (Claude Heiland-Allen) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 17:25:05 +0100 Subject: [PD] pd book sprint In-Reply-To: <161a0b1e0903300910y2e73a46chdc4121bf2c1aea56@mail.gmail.com> References: <49D0D533.1000802@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300735g182e469cn479fcc16767e36da@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DA79.7010205@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300750o7df7de1k2ebf911d6dfd0139@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DEF8.1080605@goto10.org> <161a0b1e0903300910y2e73a46chdc4121bf2c1aea56@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49D0F261.9080709@goto10.org> Alexandre Porres wrote: > On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 12:02 PM, Claude Heiland-Allen < > claudiusmaximus at goto10.org> wrote: >> >> [phasor~] [r~ shape] >> [expr~ if($v1<$v2,$v1/$v2,(1-$v1)/(1-$v2))] >> >> > I tried that, but it didnt actually worked, I just get actual sawtooths, and > no real triangles. Sorry for the shortness/lack of explanation, 0 0.0 <= output <= 1.0 (rising ramp) shape <= input <= 1.0 ~> 1.0 >= output >= 0.0 (falling ramp) Hope this helps, Claude -- http://claudiusmaximus.goto10.org From porres at gmail.com Mon Mar 30 18:38:51 2009 From: porres at gmail.com (Alexandre Porres) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 13:38:51 -0300 Subject: [PD] pd book sprint In-Reply-To: <49D0F261.9080709@goto10.org> References: <49D0D533.1000802@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300735g182e469cn479fcc16767e36da@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DA79.7010205@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300750o7df7de1k2ebf911d6dfd0139@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DEF8.1080605@goto10.org> <161a0b1e0903300910y2e73a46chdc4121bf2c1aea56@mail.gmail.com> <49D0F261.9080709@goto10.org> Message-ID: <161a0b1e0903300938q6db1a6fah69d98e478afdaf50@mail.gmail.com> I tried again, and now it works much better than before... so I guess there was something wrong before. Well Claude, it seems it almost works as the [triangle~] object. Do you guys know about this one? It comes in some external library. Were you who did it anyway Claude? :) [triangle~] works in a similar fashion, it goes smoothly from inverse sawtooth to triangle and the sawtooth depending on the parameter (from 0 to 1). The thing is that Triangle corrects the DC Offset, which could easily be done in the expr. But now I may start to sound like an obssessed DC Offset maniac. Cheers Alex On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 1:25 PM, Claude Heiland-Allen < claudiusmaximus at goto10.org> wrote: > Alexandre Porres wrote: > >> On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 12:02 PM, Claude Heiland-Allen < >> claudiusmaximus at goto10.org> wrote: >> >>> >>> [phasor~] [r~ shape] >>> [expr~ if($v1<$v2,$v1/$v2,(1-$v1)/(1-$v2))] >>> >>> >>> I tried that, but it didnt actually worked, I just get actual sawtooths, >> and >> no real triangles. >> > > Sorry for the shortness/lack of explanation, 0 0.5 for triangle, 0 for backwards phasor. > > considering shape as a constant, obviously you get weird results if you > modulate it, but that's half the fun: > > 0.0 <= input <= shape ~> 0.0 <= output <= 1.0 (rising ramp) > shape <= input <= 1.0 ~> 1.0 >= output >= 0.0 (falling ramp) > > Hope this helps, > > > > Claude > -- > http://claudiusmaximus.goto10.org > -- Alexandre Torres Porres cel. (11)8179-6226 Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jmmmpais at googlemail.com Mon Mar 30 18:38:55 2009 From: jmmmpais at googlemail.com (=?iso-8859-15?Q?Jo=E3o_Pais?=) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 18:38:55 +0200 Subject: [PD] Pure Data FLOSS Manual Book Sprint 4-6 April 2009 in NYC and Berlin In-Reply-To: <49CF8576.8050105@umatic.nl> References: <49CF8576.8050105@umatic.nl> Message-ID: Hi, I can go as well. Don't know yet exactly how much time, but should be able to be there each day. Some details: - is the information below about guidelines / chapters in a wiki somewhere? should it be? It might be better to people to organise themselves before the sprint starts. So that at the time of the sprint, the only thing to do is to run. - I can proof things, and give the "newbie with not so much pacience for things that don't work" point of view - specially for ubuntu - I can bring some documentation, in case necessary: Roads' Tutorial, Csound book, microsound, ... (didn't look at the floss pages yet, don't know if that's important) - I can do some portuguese desserts - I'm not bad at proofing things and making them more presentable, I guess. at least I don't dislike it. - and whatever Jo?o > FLOSS Manuals is proud to announce a three day book sprint for the Pure > Data FLOSS Manual. This sprint will take place simultaneously in New > York City and Berlin from Saturday 4 April to Monday 6 April. > > The Pure Data FLOSS Manual: > > http://en.flossmanuals.net/puredata > > There are possibilities to participate in person by coming to one of the > locations below, or remotely via the IRC interface built into the FLOSS > Manuals editing interface. Video conferencing may take place between the > venues as well. > > To participate, create a login at the PD FLOSS Manuals page: > > http://en.flossmanuals.net/bin/login/TWiki/WebHome?origurl=/bin/view/PureData/Introduction&skin=floss2 > > Discussion may also take place in the Pure Data mailing list: > > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > If you are in New York or Berlin, please join us at these locations! > > ---NEW YORK CITY > > * Contact: > > Hans-Christoph Steiner: hans at eds.org 718 360 4872 > > * Location (bring ID, you'll need to sign in): > > ITP/NYU Conference Room > 721 Broadway, 4th Floor > NY, NY, USA > email me or call in case you can get past security: 718 360 4872 > > * Schedule: > Saturday: noon-midnight > Sunday: 10am-midnight > Monday: 9am-5:30pm (if we go later, we'll be in a different room) > > ---BERLIN > > * Contacts > > Derek Holzer: derek at umatic.nl +49 176 2812 5845 > Adam Hyde: adam at flossmanuals.net +49 15 2230 54563 > > NK > ElsenStr. 52 (2.Hof) > Berlin, Germany > +49 176 20626386 > http://www.myspace.com/enka52 > > * Schedule: > Saturday: noon-late > Sunday: noon-late > Monday: noon-late > > > SOME BASIC GUIDELINES: > > * This manual should address the widest possible user-base. Therefore, > objects which are cross-platform and in Pd Extended should have priority > over other solutions. > * Tone should be neutral and informative. Remember that humor doesn't > always translate well! ;-) > * Our readers are assumed to have little to no background in either > computer programming or digital signal processing, which much of the > existing documentation takes for granted. That's why this manual is > necessary! Please keep this in mind when explaining things. > * Please use existing the Audio Tutorials, Installing and Getting > Started chapters as a style guide. > * Keep the chapters small and self-contained. Ideally, chapters from > this manual could even be "remixed" into other FLOSS Manuals. > * Explain any jargon or technical terminology in-line the first time you > use it, and direct the reader to appropriate other chapters/manuals when > necessary. > * Please enter any new technical terms in the Glossary (we need to agree > on global format for glossary terms!). > * Screenshots: > ---Resolution? (Adam and I will work on this on Monday) > ---Please upload any complex patches, and make sure to label screenshot > with appropriate filename (see Audio Tutorials for examples) > ---Please keep explanatory text in the manual rather than only in the > screenshot, so that it can be text-searched by readers. > ---Please use anti-aliased fonts! > * All the chapters are moderated by Derek Holzer & Adam Hyde. Your > contributions will only be visible in the editing section until they > meet these guidelines, and after that they can be published to the main > page. Please let us know when your chapter(s) are ready for publishing > and we'll look them over. > > > EXISTING CHAPTERS WHICH NEED HELP: > > # DataflowTutorials > > ---this section needs a lot of help in terms of style and content!!!!! > Tone is very informal, which doesn't help convey the information. > ---give titles to screenshots so that readers can tell which patches > match which images (some do this, some don't...) > ---"Math": examples/discussion of [expr]??? > ---"Order of connecting and [trigger]": explain the patches in-line, > rather than only in comments in screenshots (so that text is searchable, > copy/pasteable..) > ---Luka's screencaps are very aliased, to the point where you can't read > the ~ in the object names. Should they be redone at new resolution or > with antialiasing? > ---Possible janitors: Derek Holzer, Adam Hyde > > # PureGlossary > > ---format of object names = [italics in square brackets], must be > formatted correctly > ---format of glossary words in general text: we don't have one yet. Bold > on first use in chapter maybe? Needs formatting all through text. > > # ListofObjects > > ---incomplete, please add more libs > ---maybe more discussion of externals needed as well > ---formatting of object names? > > # PureLinks > > ---always welcome > > MORE CHAPTERS/SECTIONS TO DO (+ suggestions?): > > * GEM (in order of importance)(Derek can provide example patches for > much of this) > ---Basic VJ mixer (2 x > [gemhead]-[pix_film]-[alpha]-[colorRGB]-[pix_texture]-[rectangle] with > an alpha-crossfader)(+ platform specific codec info) > ---Live camera input (same as VJ mixer but with [pix_video], with > platform specific info on USB/firewire inputs--what works & what doesn't) > ---VJ effects (using the various pix objects) > ---Basic 3D (that actually does something interesting, rather than just > show a sphere or a cube) > ---Basic movement tracking w/ [pix_blob] > ---GEM/video optimization/troubleshooting tips (see Troubleshooting > section of existing Pd FLOSS Manual) > > * MIDI tutorial > ---hardware:keyboards, sliders, etc, > ---objects: all MIDI objects > ---routing: input + output to/from devices or other programs > > * Patching strategies > ---Reusable abstractions ($0 etc) > ---GoP + other GUI creation strategies > ---Preset saving systems (Frank?) > > * Audiofile manipulation (Derek can provide examples, possibly also work > with www.pd-tutorial.com with permission?) > ---sfread, readsf, sfplay, etc > ---tables + tabplay, tabread, etc > ---oneshot playback without/with pitch shifting > ---looping without/with pitchshifting > ---granulation without/with pitchshifting > ---Extended objects ([xplay~], [xgroove~]...are these stable? In my > experience, no...) > > * Realtime audio effects tutorial > ---delays: single tap, multitap, pitch-shifting, tuned comb filter, etc > ---filters: [hip~], [lop~], [bp~], [moog~], IEM lib filters > [vcf~]/[bp],[hp],[lp], difference between audio signal and message > controlled, building with ggee objects [bandpass],[llowpass],[highpass] > or [biquad~] (resources for coefficients?) > > * Sensor tutorial (HC?) > ---[hid]/[hidin]/[pduino] > ---simple circuit diagrams + photos (voltage divider examples: > potentiometer, photoresistor, etc)(hacked gamepads) > > * Networked data > ---netsend/netreceive > ---OSC > ---flash server > ---shell > ---python externals > ---others? > > * PDP/PiDiP > ---configuration info for OSX (+ poor performance disclaimer!) > ---basic VJ > ---networked streaming etc > > * Procedural Audio tutorial? (Andy?) > > * RJDJ tutorial? (Frank and the gang?) > > -- Friedenstr. 58 10249 Berlin (Deutschland) Tel +49 30 42020091 | Mob +49 162 6843570 jmmmpais at googlemail.com | skype: jmmmpjmmmp From mgrimm at syr.edu Mon Mar 30 18:50:58 2009 From: mgrimm at syr.edu (mark edward grimm) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 09:50:58 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [PD] GEM pix_write bugs (timelapse) Message-ID: <436636.46451.qm@web32405.mail.mud.yahoo.com> hey thats pretty nice!! much nicer than my poor gem attempt last month... > and the patch: > put this to / because of the bug in pix_write to make it > work. put a folder called "frames" beside it. yeah this is weird huh? ? --- On Sat, 3/28/09, Max wrote: > From: Max > Subject: [PD] GEM pix_write bugs (timelapse) > To: pd-list at iem.at > Date: Saturday, March 28, 2009, 12:52 PM > hi list, > > i've thrown together this tiny gem patch which makes a > timelapse slideshow. > i have encountered a few issues with it. > > configuration: > Pd version 0.41.4-extended-20090223 > GEM: ver: 0.91.3 'tigital' > GEM: compiled: Feb 23 2009 > OS X 10.5.6 > > the issues: > 1. pix_write doesn't interpret the file path correctly. it > seems it can't understand relative paths at all. > > 2. pix_write accepts a message [file > [](. it creates files with a .jpg ending if the > type is >0. But in reality it still is a TIFF. no matter > what value you write. > > 3. pix_write creates files with an acending number 0...9999 > this conflicts with how other objects like pix_multiimage do > it (00000...99999) > > just submitted that to the gem bugtracker. > > > and the patch: > put this to / because of the bug in pix_write to make it > work. put a folder called "frames" beside it. > > > > > > > beware: this patch will also eat up all the memory and will > crash pd. this isn't pix_writes problem though - i'll try to > find out why this is now. > > max > -----Inline Attachment Follows----- > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at > mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > From fbar at footils.org Mon Mar 30 19:03:35 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 19:03:35 +0200 Subject: [PD] pd book sprint In-Reply-To: <161a0b1e0903300938q6db1a6fah69d98e478afdaf50@mail.gmail.com> References: <49D0D533.1000802@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300735g182e469cn479fcc16767e36da@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DA79.7010205@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300750o7df7de1k2ebf911d6dfd0139@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DEF8.1080605@goto10.org> <161a0b1e0903300910y2e73a46chdc4121bf2c1aea56@mail.gmail.com> <49D0F261.9080709@goto10.org> <161a0b1e0903300938q6db1a6fah69d98e478afdaf50@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090330170335.GA2888@footils.org> Hallo, Alexandre Porres hat gesagt: // Alexandre Porres wrote: > I tried again, and now it works much better than before... so I guess there > was something wrong before. > > Well Claude, it seems it almost works as the [triangle~] object. > > Do you guys know about this one? It comes in some external library. Hm, it's pretty common name for a triangle-wave abstraction. We also have one included in s_osc.pd which is the standard multiwaveform oscillator for synth building in rjlib and does sine, tri, pwm-square and saw (the latter two bandlimited). > [triangle~] works in a similar fashion, it goes smoothly from inverse > sawtooth to triangle and the sawtooth depending on the parameter (from 0 to > 1). > > The thing is that Triangle corrects the DC Offset, which could easily be > done in the expr. But now I may start to sound like an obssessed DC Offset > maniac. While the oscillators in s_osc.pd all go from -1 to 1, I don't really see why a triangle wave should not go from 0-1 as well. This may even be useful in certain applications. All it takes to convert it is a multiply-add. And isn't differentiating between ring modulation and amplitude modulation according to where the DC is old school analog thinking? ;) In Pd I prefer to think just about multiplications of one signal with another one. Ciao -- Frank From claudiusmaximus at goto10.org Mon Mar 30 19:36:04 2009 From: claudiusmaximus at goto10.org (Claude Heiland-Allen) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 18:36:04 +0100 Subject: [PD] [OT] Re: DIY GSoC: getting those projects done In-Reply-To: References: <475768.89279.qm@web65603.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> <20090328093208.GA24532@mccormick.cx> Message-ID: <49D10304.1010602@goto10.org> Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > At first thought I think > I'm in favour of reconfigurable inlets, but I'd like to see a > proof-of-concept first. IIRC the [lexpr] pdlua example has reconfigurable hot/cold inlets, but that's implemented "by hand". Not sure I like the idea of a "run" method, what if there's more than one reasonable run action? Claude -- http://claudiusmaximus.goto10.org From marius.schebella at gmail.com Mon Mar 30 19:47:09 2009 From: marius.schebella at gmail.com (marius schebella) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 19:47:09 +0200 Subject: [PD] Pure Data FLOSS Manual Book Sprint 4-6 April 2009 in NYC and Berlin In-Reply-To: <49CF8576.8050105@umatic.nl> References: <49CF8576.8050105@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <49D1059D.6050507@gmail.com> Hi, I'd like to participate remotely somehow. I understand that you also want to cover Gem(?), so I'd like to propose a chapter on video tracking. motion tracking, background subtraction, showing how to do alpha masking, color tracking, I also would like to include some documentation of pix_opencv, unless someone else is already doing that, for example face tracking, but also other possibilities of opencv (pattern recognition). I also think the TUIO stuff should go there (with references to touchlib or touch?), and multiblob. AFAIK there is no gem section yet, so I don't know if it is possible to do just one chapter without a general introduction to gem?? Btw, there are tons of other topics to cover... marius. Derek Holzer wrote: > FLOSS Manuals is proud to announce a three day book sprint for the Pure > Data FLOSS Manual. This sprint will take place simultaneously in New > York City and Berlin from Saturday 4 April to Monday 6 April. > > The Pure Data FLOSS Manual: > > http://en.flossmanuals.net/puredata > > There are possibilities to participate in person by coming to one of the > locations below, or remotely via the IRC interface built into the FLOSS > Manuals editing interface. Video conferencing may take place between the > venues as well. > > To participate, create a login at the PD FLOSS Manuals page: > > http://en.flossmanuals.net/bin/login/TWiki/WebHome?origurl=/bin/view/PureData/Introduction&skin=floss2 > > > Discussion may also take place in the Pure Data mailing list: > > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > If you are in New York or Berlin, please join us at these locations! > > ---NEW YORK CITY > > * Contact: > > Hans-Christoph Steiner: hans at eds.org 718 360 4872 > > * Location (bring ID, you'll need to sign in): > > ITP/NYU Conference Room > 721 Broadway, 4th Floor > NY, NY, USA > email me or call in case you can get past security: 718 360 4872 > > * Schedule: > Saturday: noon-midnight > Sunday: 10am-midnight > Monday: 9am-5:30pm (if we go later, we'll be in a different room) > > ---BERLIN > > * Contacts > > Derek Holzer: derek at umatic.nl +49 176 2812 5845 > Adam Hyde: adam at flossmanuals.net +49 15 2230 54563 > > NK > ElsenStr. 52 (2.Hof) > Berlin, Germany > +49 176 20626386 > http://www.myspace.com/enka52 > > * Schedule: > Saturday: noon-late > Sunday: noon-late > Monday: noon-late > > > SOME BASIC GUIDELINES: > > * This manual should address the widest possible user-base. Therefore, > objects which are cross-platform and in Pd Extended should have priority > over other solutions. > * Tone should be neutral and informative. Remember that humor doesn't > always translate well! ;-) > * Our readers are assumed to have little to no background in either > computer programming or digital signal processing, which much of the > existing documentation takes for granted. That's why this manual is > necessary! Please keep this in mind when explaining things. > * Please use existing the Audio Tutorials, Installing and Getting > Started chapters as a style guide. > * Keep the chapters small and self-contained. Ideally, chapters from > this manual could even be "remixed" into other FLOSS Manuals. > * Explain any jargon or technical terminology in-line the first time you > use it, and direct the reader to appropriate other chapters/manuals when > necessary. > * Please enter any new technical terms in the Glossary (we need to agree > on global format for glossary terms!). > * Screenshots: > ---Resolution? (Adam and I will work on this on Monday) > ---Please upload any complex patches, and make sure to label screenshot > with appropriate filename (see Audio Tutorials for examples) > ---Please keep explanatory text in the manual rather than only in the > screenshot, so that it can be text-searched by readers. > ---Please use anti-aliased fonts! > * All the chapters are moderated by Derek Holzer & Adam Hyde. Your > contributions will only be visible in the editing section until they > meet these guidelines, and after that they can be published to the main > page. Please let us know when your chapter(s) are ready for publishing > and we'll look them over. > > > EXISTING CHAPTERS WHICH NEED HELP: > > # DataflowTutorials > > ---this section needs a lot of help in terms of style and content!!!!! > Tone is very informal, which doesn't help convey the information. > ---give titles to screenshots so that readers can tell which patches > match which images (some do this, some don't...) > ---"Math": examples/discussion of [expr]??? > ---"Order of connecting and [trigger]": explain the patches in-line, > rather than only in comments in screenshots (so that text is searchable, > copy/pasteable..) > ---Luka's screencaps are very aliased, to the point where you can't read > the ~ in the object names. Should they be redone at new resolution or > with antialiasing? > ---Possible janitors: Derek Holzer, Adam Hyde > > # PureGlossary > > ---format of object names = [italics in square brackets], must be > formatted correctly > ---format of glossary words in general text: we don't have one yet. Bold > on first use in chapter maybe? Needs formatting all through text. > > # ListofObjects > > ---incomplete, please add more libs > ---maybe more discussion of externals needed as well > ---formatting of object names? > > # PureLinks > > ---always welcome > > MORE CHAPTERS/SECTIONS TO DO (+ suggestions?): > > * GEM (in order of importance)(Derek can provide example patches for > much of this) > ---Basic VJ mixer (2 x > [gemhead]-[pix_film]-[alpha]-[colorRGB]-[pix_texture]-[rectangle] with > an alpha-crossfader)(+ platform specific codec info) > ---Live camera input (same as VJ mixer but with [pix_video], with > platform specific info on USB/firewire inputs--what works & what doesn't) > ---VJ effects (using the various pix objects) > ---Basic 3D (that actually does something interesting, rather than just > show a sphere or a cube) > ---Basic movement tracking w/ [pix_blob] > ---GEM/video optimization/troubleshooting tips (see Troubleshooting > section of existing Pd FLOSS Manual) > > * MIDI tutorial > ---hardware:keyboards, sliders, etc, > ---objects: all MIDI objects > ---routing: input + output to/from devices or other programs > > * Patching strategies > ---Reusable abstractions ($0 etc) > ---GoP + other GUI creation strategies > ---Preset saving systems (Frank?) > > * Audiofile manipulation (Derek can provide examples, possibly also work > with www.pd-tutorial.com with permission?) > ---sfread, readsf, sfplay, etc > ---tables + tabplay, tabread, etc > ---oneshot playback without/with pitch shifting > ---looping without/with pitchshifting > ---granulation without/with pitchshifting > ---Extended objects ([xplay~], [xgroove~]...are these stable? In my > experience, no...) > > * Realtime audio effects tutorial > ---delays: single tap, multitap, pitch-shifting, tuned comb filter, etc > ---filters: [hip~], [lop~], [bp~], [moog~], IEM lib filters > [vcf~]/[bp],[hp],[lp], difference between audio signal and message > controlled, building with ggee objects [bandpass],[llowpass],[highpass] > or [biquad~] (resources for coefficients?) > > * Sensor tutorial (HC?) > ---[hid]/[hidin]/[pduino] > ---simple circuit diagrams + photos (voltage divider examples: > potentiometer, photoresistor, etc)(hacked gamepads) > > * Networked data > ---netsend/netreceive > ---OSC > ---flash server > ---shell > ---python externals > ---others? > > * PDP/PiDiP > ---configuration info for OSX (+ poor performance disclaimer!) > ---basic VJ > ---networked streaming etc > > * Procedural Audio tutorial? (Andy?) > > * RJDJ tutorial? (Frank and the gang?) > > From derek at umatic.nl Mon Mar 30 20:01:25 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 20:01:25 +0200 Subject: [PD] Pure Data FLOSS Manual Book Sprint 4-6 April 2009 in NYC and Berlin In-Reply-To: <49D1059D.6050507@gmail.com> References: <49CF8576.8050105@umatic.nl> <49D1059D.6050507@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49D108F5.3040607@umatic.nl> Hey Marius, yes we will need an introduction to GEM. My priorities are to do simple stuff first. I know that might be boring, and the temptation is to run ahead to the more interesting stuff, but really the basics need to be there before anything fancy. And in a simple, introductory form. I'm even temped to give an arbitrary limit of no more than 10 objects/atoms per example ;-) So I'd prefer to get you moving on some basics. There are a collection of patches that Chris Clepper sent as well as ones which I have used in my workshops for years that could be written up. Only after these are finished can we move on to project specific stuff like motion tracking. best! Derek marius schebella wrote: > Hi, > > I'd like to participate remotely somehow. I understand that you also > want to cover Gem(?), so I'd like to propose a chapter on video > tracking. motion tracking, background subtraction, showing how to do > alpha masking, color tracking, I also would like to include some > documentation of pix_opencv, unless someone else is already doing that, > for example face tracking, but also other possibilities of opencv > (pattern recognition). > I also think the TUIO stuff should go there (with references to touchlib > or touch?), and multiblob. > > AFAIK there is no gem section yet, so I don't know if it is possible to > do just one chapter without a general introduction to gem?? > > Btw, there are tons of other topics to cover... > > marius. > > > Derek Holzer wrote: >> FLOSS Manuals is proud to announce a three day book sprint for the >> Pure Data FLOSS Manual. This sprint will take place simultaneously in >> New York City and Berlin from Saturday 4 April to Monday 6 April. >> >> The Pure Data FLOSS Manual: >> >> http://en.flossmanuals.net/puredata >> >> There are possibilities to participate in person by coming to one of >> the locations below, or remotely via the IRC interface built into the >> FLOSS Manuals editing interface. Video conferencing may take place >> between the venues as well. >> >> To participate, create a login at the PD FLOSS Manuals page: >> >> http://en.flossmanuals.net/bin/login/TWiki/WebHome?origurl=/bin/view/PureData/Introduction&skin=floss2 >> >> >> Discussion may also take place in the Pure Data mailing list: >> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> >> If you are in New York or Berlin, please join us at these locations! >> >> ---NEW YORK CITY >> >> * Contact: >> >> Hans-Christoph Steiner: hans at eds.org 718 360 4872 >> >> * Location (bring ID, you'll need to sign in): >> >> ITP/NYU Conference Room >> 721 Broadway, 4th Floor >> NY, NY, USA >> email me or call in case you can get past security: 718 360 4872 >> >> * Schedule: >> Saturday: noon-midnight >> Sunday: 10am-midnight >> Monday: 9am-5:30pm (if we go later, we'll be in a different room) >> >> ---BERLIN >> >> * Contacts >> >> Derek Holzer: derek at umatic.nl +49 176 2812 5845 >> Adam Hyde: adam at flossmanuals.net +49 15 2230 54563 >> >> NK >> ElsenStr. 52 (2.Hof) >> Berlin, Germany >> +49 176 20626386 >> http://www.myspace.com/enka52 >> >> * Schedule: >> Saturday: noon-late >> Sunday: noon-late >> Monday: noon-late >> >> >> SOME BASIC GUIDELINES: >> >> * This manual should address the widest possible user-base. Therefore, >> objects which are cross-platform and in Pd Extended should have >> priority over other solutions. >> * Tone should be neutral and informative. Remember that humor doesn't >> always translate well! ;-) >> * Our readers are assumed to have little to no background in either >> computer programming or digital signal processing, which much of the >> existing documentation takes for granted. That's why this manual is >> necessary! Please keep this in mind when explaining things. >> * Please use existing the Audio Tutorials, Installing and Getting >> Started chapters as a style guide. >> * Keep the chapters small and self-contained. Ideally, chapters from >> this manual could even be "remixed" into other FLOSS Manuals. >> * Explain any jargon or technical terminology in-line the first time >> you use it, and direct the reader to appropriate other >> chapters/manuals when necessary. >> * Please enter any new technical terms in the Glossary (we need to >> agree on global format for glossary terms!). >> * Screenshots: >> ---Resolution? (Adam and I will work on this on Monday) >> ---Please upload any complex patches, and make sure to label >> screenshot with appropriate filename (see Audio Tutorials for examples) >> ---Please keep explanatory text in the manual rather than only in the >> screenshot, so that it can be text-searched by readers. >> ---Please use anti-aliased fonts! >> * All the chapters are moderated by Derek Holzer & Adam Hyde. Your >> contributions will only be visible in the editing section until they >> meet these guidelines, and after that they can be published to the >> main page. Please let us know when your chapter(s) are ready for >> publishing and we'll look them over. >> >> >> EXISTING CHAPTERS WHICH NEED HELP: >> >> # DataflowTutorials >> >> ---this section needs a lot of help in terms of style and content!!!!! >> Tone is very informal, which doesn't help convey the information. >> ---give titles to screenshots so that readers can tell which patches >> match which images (some do this, some don't...) >> ---"Math": examples/discussion of [expr]??? >> ---"Order of connecting and [trigger]": explain the patches in-line, >> rather than only in comments in screenshots (so that text is >> searchable, copy/pasteable..) >> ---Luka's screencaps are very aliased, to the point where you can't >> read the ~ in the object names. Should they be redone at new >> resolution or with antialiasing? >> ---Possible janitors: Derek Holzer, Adam Hyde >> >> # PureGlossary >> >> ---format of object names = [italics in square brackets], must be >> formatted correctly >> ---format of glossary words in general text: we don't have one yet. >> Bold on first use in chapter maybe? Needs formatting all through text. >> >> # ListofObjects >> >> ---incomplete, please add more libs >> ---maybe more discussion of externals needed as well >> ---formatting of object names? >> >> # PureLinks >> >> ---always welcome >> >> MORE CHAPTERS/SECTIONS TO DO (+ suggestions?): >> >> * GEM (in order of importance)(Derek can provide example patches for >> much of this) >> ---Basic VJ mixer (2 x >> [gemhead]-[pix_film]-[alpha]-[colorRGB]-[pix_texture]-[rectangle] with >> an alpha-crossfader)(+ platform specific codec info) >> ---Live camera input (same as VJ mixer but with [pix_video], with >> platform specific info on USB/firewire inputs--what works & what doesn't) >> ---VJ effects (using the various pix objects) >> ---Basic 3D (that actually does something interesting, rather than >> just show a sphere or a cube) >> ---Basic movement tracking w/ [pix_blob] >> ---GEM/video optimization/troubleshooting tips (see Troubleshooting >> section of existing Pd FLOSS Manual) >> >> * MIDI tutorial >> ---hardware:keyboards, sliders, etc, >> ---objects: all MIDI objects >> ---routing: input + output to/from devices or other programs >> >> * Patching strategies >> ---Reusable abstractions ($0 etc) >> ---GoP + other GUI creation strategies >> ---Preset saving systems (Frank?) >> >> * Audiofile manipulation (Derek can provide examples, possibly also >> work with www.pd-tutorial.com with permission?) >> ---sfread, readsf, sfplay, etc >> ---tables + tabplay, tabread, etc >> ---oneshot playback without/with pitch shifting >> ---looping without/with pitchshifting >> ---granulation without/with pitchshifting >> ---Extended objects ([xplay~], [xgroove~]...are these stable? In my >> experience, no...) >> >> * Realtime audio effects tutorial >> ---delays: single tap, multitap, pitch-shifting, tuned comb filter, etc >> ---filters: [hip~], [lop~], [bp~], [moog~], IEM lib filters >> [vcf~]/[bp],[hp],[lp], difference between audio signal and message >> controlled, building with ggee objects >> [bandpass],[llowpass],[highpass] or [biquad~] (resources for >> coefficients?) >> >> * Sensor tutorial (HC?) >> ---[hid]/[hidin]/[pduino] >> ---simple circuit diagrams + photos (voltage divider examples: >> potentiometer, photoresistor, etc)(hacked gamepads) >> >> * Networked data >> ---netsend/netreceive >> ---OSC >> ---flash server >> ---shell >> ---python externals >> ---others? >> >> * PDP/PiDiP >> ---configuration info for OSX (+ poor performance disclaimer!) >> ---basic VJ >> ---networked streaming etc >> >> * Procedural Audio tutorial? (Andy?) >> >> * RJDJ tutorial? (Frank and the gang?) >> >> > > -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 110: "Lowest common denominator" From derek at umatic.nl Mon Mar 30 20:02:58 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 20:02:58 +0200 Subject: [PD] pd book sprint In-Reply-To: <161a0b1e0903300938q6db1a6fah69d98e478afdaf50@mail.gmail.com> References: <49D0D533.1000802@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300735g182e469cn479fcc16767e36da@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DA79.7010205@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300750o7df7de1k2ebf911d6dfd0139@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DEF8.1080605@goto10.org> <161a0b1e0903300910y2e73a46chdc4121bf2c1aea56@mail.gmail.com> <49D0F261.9080709@goto10.org> <161a0b1e0903300938q6db1a6fah69d98e478afdaf50@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49D10952.4050907@umatic.nl> Is it really DC offset when the value goes from 0 to 1 instead of -1 to 1? I mean, that's the way [phasor~] comes right out of the box. D. Alexandre Porres wrote: > > I tried again, and now it works much better than before... so I guess > there was something wrong before. > > Well Claude, it seems it almost works as the [triangle~] object. > > Do you guys know about this one? It comes in some external library. > > Were you who did it anyway Claude? :) > > [triangle~] works in a similar fashion, it goes smoothly from inverse > sawtooth to triangle and the sawtooth depending on the parameter (from 0 > to 1). > > The thing is that Triangle corrects the DC Offset, which could easily be > done in the expr. But now I may start to sound like an obssessed DC > Offset maniac. > > Cheers > Alex > > > On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 1:25 PM, Claude Heiland-Allen > > wrote: > > Alexandre Porres wrote: > > On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 12:02 PM, Claude Heiland-Allen < > claudiusmaximus at goto10.org > > wrote: > > > [phasor~] [r~ shape] > [expr~ if($v1<$v2,$v1/$v2,(1-$v1)/(1-$v2))] > > > I tried that, but it didnt actually worked, I just get actual > sawtooths, and > no real triangles. > > > Sorry for the shortness/lack of explanation, 0 phasor, 0.5 for triangle, 0 for backwards phasor. > > considering shape as a constant, obviously you get weird results if > you modulate it, but that's half the fun: > > 0.0 <= input <= shape ~> 0.0 <= output <= 1.0 (rising ramp) > shape <= input <= 1.0 ~> 1.0 >= output >= 0.0 (falling ramp) > > Hope this helps, > > > > Claude > -- > http://claudiusmaximus.goto10.org > > > > > -- > Alexandre Torres Porres > cel. (11)8179-6226 > Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home > http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres > -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 35: "Consider transitions" From derek at umatic.nl Mon Mar 30 20:04:19 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 20:04:19 +0200 Subject: [PD] pd book sprint In-Reply-To: <20090330170335.GA2888@footils.org> References: <49D0D533.1000802@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300735g182e469cn479fcc16767e36da@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DA79.7010205@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300750o7df7de1k2ebf911d6dfd0139@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DEF8.1080605@goto10.org> <161a0b1e0903300910y2e73a46chdc4121bf2c1aea56@mail.gmail.com> <49D0F261.9080709@goto10.org> <161a0b1e0903300938q6db1a6fah69d98e478afdaf50@mail.gmail.com> <20090330170335.GA2888@footils.org> Message-ID: <49D109A3.1030407@umatic.nl> I have to agree with Frank on this one. Luckily, unless we are completely pedantic engineer types, we can all be correct! ;-) D. Frank Barknecht wrote: > While the oscillators in s_osc.pd all go from -1 to 1, I don't really see why a > triangle wave should not go from 0-1 as well. This may even be useful in > certain applications. All it takes to convert it is a multiply-add. And isn't > differentiating between ring modulation and amplitude modulation according to > where the DC is old school analog thinking? ;) In Pd I prefer to think just > about multiplications of one signal with another one. -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 202: "Back up a few steps. What else could you have done?" From porres at gmail.com Mon Mar 30 20:18:23 2009 From: porres at gmail.com (Alexandre Porres) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 15:18:23 -0300 Subject: [PD] pd book sprint In-Reply-To: <49D10952.4050907@umatic.nl> References: <49D0D533.1000802@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300735g182e469cn479fcc16767e36da@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DA79.7010205@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300750o7df7de1k2ebf911d6dfd0139@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DEF8.1080605@goto10.org> <161a0b1e0903300910y2e73a46chdc4121bf2c1aea56@mail.gmail.com> <49D0F261.9080709@goto10.org> <161a0b1e0903300938q6db1a6fah69d98e478afdaf50@mail.gmail.com> <49D10952.4050907@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <161a0b1e0903301118j6f3f7385obe4c2b8bffe08350@mail.gmail.com> you know, yeah, but the thing is that phasor is not actually an oscilator at all !!! the name actually refers to phase, and not sawtooth. Apart from [osc~], oscilators in puredata are basically wavetable oscilators. You have objects such as [tabosc4~] and that is it. What [phasor~] was designed to do is to indicate the phase of the waveform on a table. So you have to adjust phsor to be compatible with the table size. You do that simply by multiplying phasor (wich ramps up to one) to the table size. So what it is meant to do is tell the position (or "phase") in a table. That is why it goes from 0 to 1. If it did go from -1 to 1, as an ocilator, then it wouldnt work that way. So there is a misconception of [phasor~] being a sawtooth wave generator that can be misleading. As an oscilator, [phasor~] has a DC Offset. In order to [phasor~] became an oscilator with no DC Offset, we have to correct it. Maybe it is nice to be explicit about it in Floss Manuals, and say that Pd mostly works out with Table lookup oscilators, and that [osc~] is a special and unique object that is meant to be a Cosine wave oscilator. Then, when explaining how to get other kinds of wavefroms on Pd, such as sawtooth, square, triangle, we could emphasize that we are creating them, and building them up with the objects we have. Thast also makes it implicit that there is more than one way to di it, and that there is no official or built in Square wave, for instance. I actually talk a lot about that on my book. And I present examples on how to get a triangle waveform on a table using the sinesum comand, that is, by summing up harmonics. Cheers Alex On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 3:02 PM, Derek Holzer wrote: > Is it really DC offset when the value goes from 0 to 1 instead of -1 to 1? > I mean, that's the way [phasor~] comes right out of the box. > > D. > > Alexandre Porres wrote: > >> >> I tried again, and now it works much better than before... so I guess >> there was something wrong before. >> >> Well Claude, it seems it almost works as the [triangle~] object. >> >> Do you guys know about this one? It comes in some external library. >> >> Were you who did it anyway Claude? :) >> >> [triangle~] works in a similar fashion, it goes smoothly from inverse >> sawtooth to triangle and the sawtooth depending on the parameter (from 0 to >> 1). >> >> The thing is that Triangle corrects the DC Offset, which could easily be >> done in the expr. But now I may start to sound like an obssessed DC Offset >> maniac. >> >> Cheers >> Alex >> >> >> On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 1:25 PM, Claude Heiland-Allen < >> claudiusmaximus at goto10.org > wrote: >> >> Alexandre Porres wrote: >> >> On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 12:02 PM, Claude Heiland-Allen < >> claudiusmaximus at goto10.org > >> wrote: >> >> >> [phasor~] [r~ shape] >> [expr~ if($v1<$v2,$v1/$v2,(1-$v1)/(1-$v2))] >> >> >> I tried that, but it didnt actually worked, I just get actual >> sawtooths, and >> no real triangles. >> >> >> Sorry for the shortness/lack of explanation, 0> phasor, 0.5 for triangle, 0 for backwards phasor. >> >> considering shape as a constant, obviously you get weird results if >> you modulate it, but that's half the fun: >> >> 0.0 <= input <= shape ~> 0.0 <= output <= 1.0 (rising ramp) >> shape <= input <= 1.0 ~> 1.0 >= output >= 0.0 (falling ramp) >> >> Hope this helps, >> >> >> >> Claude >> -- http://claudiusmaximus.goto10.org >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Alexandre Torres Porres >> cel. (11)8179-6226 >> Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home >> http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres >> >> > -- > ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: > http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 35: > "Consider transitions" > -- Alexandre Torres Porres cel. (11)8179-6226 Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From porres at gmail.com Mon Mar 30 20:28:30 2009 From: porres at gmail.com (Alexandre Porres) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 15:28:30 -0300 Subject: [PD] dc offset Message-ID: <161a0b1e0903301128p6c0ebf2lb9658a0573b5c316@mail.gmail.com> > Is it really DC offset when the value goes from 0 to 1 instead of -1 to 1? just to be clear and straightforward. when the midpoint is not zero, there is a DC Offset, which means you introduce energy in the spectrum at 0Hz, so the maximum positive value must be equal to the absolute negative value (-0.5 to 05 , -0.25 to 0.25, etc). In the case the way phasor comes out of the box, midpoint is 0.5, and not zero... cheers alex On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 3:02 PM, Derek Holzer wrote: > Is it really DC offset when the value goes from 0 to 1 instead of -1 to 1? > I mean, that's the way [phasor~] comes right out of the box. > > D. > > Alexandre Porres wrote: > >> >> I tried again, and now it works much better than before... so I guess >> there was something wrong before. >> >> Well Claude, it seems it almost works as the [triangle~] object. >> >> Do you guys know about this one? It comes in some external library. >> >> Were you who did it anyway Claude? :) >> >> [triangle~] works in a similar fashion, it goes smoothly from inverse >> sawtooth to triangle and the sawtooth depending on the parameter (from 0 to >> 1). >> >> The thing is that Triangle corrects the DC Offset, which could easily be >> done in the expr. But now I may start to sound like an obssessed DC Offset >> maniac. >> >> Cheers >> Alex >> >> >> On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 1:25 PM, Claude Heiland-Allen < >> claudiusmaximus at goto10.org > wrote: >> >> Alexandre Porres wrote: >> >> On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 12:02 PM, Claude Heiland-Allen < >> claudiusmaximus at goto10.org > >> wrote: >> >> >> [phasor~] [r~ shape] >> [expr~ if($v1<$v2,$v1/$v2,(1-$v1)/(1-$v2))] >> >> >> I tried that, but it didnt actually worked, I just get actual >> sawtooths, and >> no real triangles. >> >> >> Sorry for the shortness/lack of explanation, 0> phasor, 0.5 for triangle, 0 for backwards phasor. >> >> considering shape as a constant, obviously you get weird results if >> you modulate it, but that's half the fun: >> >> 0.0 <= input <= shape ~> 0.0 <= output <= 1.0 (rising ramp) >> shape <= input <= 1.0 ~> 1.0 >= output >= 0.0 (falling ramp) >> >> Hope this helps, >> >> >> >> Claude >> -- http://claudiusmaximus.goto10.org >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Alexandre Torres Porres >> cel. (11)8179-6226 >> Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home >> http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres >> >> > -- > ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: > http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 35: > "Consider transitions" > -- Alexandre Torres Porres cel. (11)8179-6226 Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From derek at umatic.nl Mon Mar 30 20:29:05 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 20:29:05 +0200 Subject: [PD] pd book sprint In-Reply-To: <161a0b1e0903301118j6f3f7385obe4c2b8bffe08350@mail.gmail.com> References: <49D0D533.1000802@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300735g182e469cn479fcc16767e36da@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DA79.7010205@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300750o7df7de1k2ebf911d6dfd0139@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DEF8.1080605@goto10.org> <161a0b1e0903300910y2e73a46chdc4121bf2c1aea56@mail.gmail.com> <49D0F261.9080709@goto10.org> <161a0b1e0903300938q6db1a6fah69d98e478afdaf50@mail.gmail.com> <49D10952.4050907@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903301118j6f3f7385obe4c2b8bffe08350@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49D10F71.5030709@umatic.nl> I agree with the principles of this approach, but perhaps not the complexity. The FLOSS Manual doesn't exist as a way to teach DSP. That's what Miller's stuff is for. It exists as a way to get people who are put off by the existing documentation, which is very very heavy in math, DSP and computer science. These are the people I get in my workshops every time. They just want to get an idea of how to do things and not be intimidated. Thus the emphasis on simple solutions rather than "correct" ones. If people are ready for a deeper understanding of DSP, that's where Miller's book, and pd-tutorial.com and the Roads CMT book and all the rest come in. And perhaps your Portuguese one as well. I don't want this book to step into a niche which already has many options, I want it to fill a niche which is still wide open: Pd for absolute beginners, no prerequisites required. D. Alexandre Porres wrote: > you know, yeah, but the thing is that phasor is not actually an > oscilator at all !!! > > the name actually refers to phase, and not sawtooth. > > Apart from [osc~], oscilators in puredata are basically wavetable > oscilators. You have objects such as [tabosc4~] and that is it. > > What [phasor~] was designed to do is to indicate the phase of the > waveform on a table. So you have to adjust phsor to be compatible with > the table size. You do that simply by multiplying phasor (wich ramps up > to one) to the table size. So what it is meant to do is tell the > position (or "phase") in a table. That is why it goes from 0 to 1. If it > did go from -1 to 1, as an ocilator, then it wouldnt work that way. > > So there is a misconception of [phasor~] being a sawtooth wave generator > that can be misleading. As an oscilator, [phasor~] has a DC Offset. In > order to [phasor~] became an oscilator with no DC Offset, we have to > correct it. > > Maybe it is nice to be explicit about it in Floss Manuals, and say that > Pd mostly works out with Table lookup oscilators, and that [osc~] is a > special and unique object that is meant to be a Cosine wave oscilator. > > Then, when explaining how to get other kinds of wavefroms on Pd, such as > sawtooth, square, triangle, we could emphasize that we are creating > them, and building them up with the objects we have. Thast also makes it > implicit that there is more than one way to di it, and that there is no > official or built in Square wave, for instance. > > I actually talk a lot about that on my book. And I present examples on > how to get a triangle waveform on a table using the sinesum comand, that > is, by summing up harmonics. > > Cheers > Alex > > On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 3:02 PM, Derek Holzer > wrote: > > Is it really DC offset when the value goes from 0 to 1 instead of -1 > to 1? I mean, that's the way [phasor~] comes right out of the box. > > D. > > Alexandre Porres wrote: > > > I tried again, and now it works much better than before... so I > guess there was something wrong before. > > Well Claude, it seems it almost works as the [triangle~] object. > > Do you guys know about this one? It comes in some external library. > > Were you who did it anyway Claude? :) > > [triangle~] works in a similar fashion, it goes smoothly from > inverse sawtooth to triangle and the sawtooth depending on the > parameter (from 0 to 1). > > The thing is that Triangle corrects the DC Offset, which could > easily be done in the expr. But now I may start to sound like an > obssessed DC Offset maniac. > > Cheers > Alex > > > On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 1:25 PM, Claude Heiland-Allen > > >> wrote: > > Alexandre Porres wrote: > > On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 12:02 PM, Claude Heiland-Allen < > claudiusmaximus at goto10.org > > >> > > wrote: > > > [phasor~] [r~ shape] > [expr~ if($v1<$v2,$v1/$v2,(1-$v1)/(1-$v2))] > > > I tried that, but it didnt actually worked, I just get actual > sawtooths, and > no real triangles. > > > Sorry for the shortness/lack of explanation, 0 1 for > phasor, 0.5 for triangle, 0 for backwards phasor. > > considering shape as a constant, obviously you get weird > results if > you modulate it, but that's half the fun: > > 0.0 <= input <= shape ~> 0.0 <= output <= 1.0 (rising ramp) > shape <= input <= 1.0 ~> 1.0 >= output >= 0.0 (falling ramp) > > Hope this helps, > > > > Claude > -- http://claudiusmaximus.goto10.org > > > > > -- > Alexandre Torres Porres > cel. (11)8179-6226 > Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home > http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres > > > -- > ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: > http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 35: > "Consider transitions" > > > > > -- > Alexandre Torres Porres > cel. (11)8179-6226 > Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home > http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres > -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 87: "Imagine the music as a moving chain or caterpillar" From porres at gmail.com Mon Mar 30 20:41:56 2009 From: porres at gmail.com (Alexandre Porres) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 15:41:56 -0300 Subject: [PD] pd book sprint In-Reply-To: <49D10F71.5030709@umatic.nl> References: <49D0D533.1000802@umatic.nl> <49D0DA79.7010205@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300750o7df7de1k2ebf911d6dfd0139@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DEF8.1080605@goto10.org> <161a0b1e0903300910y2e73a46chdc4121bf2c1aea56@mail.gmail.com> <49D0F261.9080709@goto10.org> <161a0b1e0903300938q6db1a6fah69d98e478afdaf50@mail.gmail.com> <49D10952.4050907@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903301118j6f3f7385obe4c2b8bffe08350@mail.gmail.com> <49D10F71.5030709@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <161a0b1e0903301141q272d4432uf801934415ce5834@mail.gmail.com> well, I totally agree with you, and that is why my stuff does not fill in the niche of Miller's and others at all. My stuff is for people who really had never seen anything like this, which is practically everybody in brazil :) I try to put some stuff in miller's book more accessible, but most of it I dont even bother to attempt that at all! Just the basics... The stuff is kinda in between Floss Manuals and Miller's book. But I dont wish to inject the things I wrote about inside Floss Manuals at all. it would even be smart to repeat some stuff redundantly. But the theory in DSP we are discussing here is really minimum, and the math could not be any simpler, which is just the procedure of using a [+] object, as complex as adjusting the gain with [*]. Since it is that basic, I dont find it intimidating at all. But I really hope we could all share our thoughts and ideas, and create different materials that complement each other, and that are also coherent with each other. So sorry if I looked too technical, but I still believe it could be simply presented, and that the material could benefit from it. You see, DC Offset is also important to create Synthesis Control, like in the Amplitude Modulation example. If you want to do an AM synth with [osc], you need to adjust DC. But the procedure is really really simple. I will work on the examples and send it to you as soon as i can. thanks alex On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 3:29 PM, Derek Holzer wrote: > I agree with the principles of this approach, but perhaps not the > complexity. The FLOSS Manual doesn't exist as a way to teach DSP. That's > what Miller's stuff is for. It exists as a way to get people who are put off > by the existing documentation, which is very very heavy in math, DSP and > computer science. These are the people I get in my workshops every time. > They just want to get an idea of how to do things and not be intimidated. > Thus the emphasis on simple solutions rather than "correct" ones. > > If people are ready for a deeper understanding of DSP, that's where > Miller's book, and pd-tutorial.com and the Roads CMT book and all the rest > come in. And perhaps your Portuguese one as well. I don't want this book to > step into a niche which already has many options, I want it to fill a niche > which is still wide open: Pd for absolute beginners, no prerequisites > required. > > D. > > Alexandre Porres wrote: > >> you know, yeah, but the thing is that phasor is not actually an oscilator >> at all !!! >> >> the name actually refers to phase, and not sawtooth. >> >> Apart from [osc~], oscilators in puredata are basically wavetable >> oscilators. You have objects such as [tabosc4~] and that is it. >> What [phasor~] was designed to do is to indicate the phase of the waveform >> on a table. So you have to adjust phsor to be compatible with the table >> size. You do that simply by multiplying phasor (wich ramps up to one) to the >> table size. So what it is meant to do is tell the position (or "phase") in a >> table. That is why it goes from 0 to 1. If it did go from -1 to 1, as an >> ocilator, then it wouldnt work that way. >> >> So there is a misconception of [phasor~] being a sawtooth wave generator >> that can be misleading. As an oscilator, [phasor~] has a DC Offset. In order >> to [phasor~] became an oscilator with no DC Offset, we have to correct it. >> >> Maybe it is nice to be explicit about it in Floss Manuals, and say that Pd >> mostly works out with Table lookup oscilators, and that [osc~] is a special >> and unique object that is meant to be a Cosine wave oscilator. >> >> Then, when explaining how to get other kinds of wavefroms on Pd, such as >> sawtooth, square, triangle, we could emphasize that we are creating them, >> and building them up with the objects we have. Thast also makes it implicit >> that there is more than one way to di it, and that there is no official or >> built in Square wave, for instance. >> >> I actually talk a lot about that on my book. And I present examples on how >> to get a triangle waveform on a table using the sinesum comand, that is, by >> summing up harmonics. >> >> Cheers >> Alex >> >> On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 3:02 PM, Derek Holzer > derek at umatic.nl>> wrote: >> >> Is it really DC offset when the value goes from 0 to 1 instead of -1 >> to 1? I mean, that's the way [phasor~] comes right out of the box. >> >> D. >> >> Alexandre Porres wrote: >> >> >> I tried again, and now it works much better than before... so I >> guess there was something wrong before. >> >> Well Claude, it seems it almost works as the [triangle~] object. >> >> Do you guys know about this one? It comes in some external library. >> >> Were you who did it anyway Claude? :) >> >> [triangle~] works in a similar fashion, it goes smoothly from >> inverse sawtooth to triangle and the sawtooth depending on the >> parameter (from 0 to 1). >> >> The thing is that Triangle corrects the DC Offset, which could >> easily be done in the expr. But now I may start to sound like an >> obssessed DC Offset maniac. >> >> Cheers >> Alex >> >> >> On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 1:25 PM, Claude Heiland-Allen >> >> > >> wrote: >> >> Alexandre Porres wrote: >> >> On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 12:02 PM, Claude Heiland-Allen < >> claudiusmaximus at goto10.org >> >> > >> >> >> >> wrote: >> >> >> [phasor~] [r~ shape] >> [expr~ if($v1<$v2,$v1/$v2,(1-$v1)/(1-$v2))] >> >> >> I tried that, but it didnt actually worked, I just get >> actual >> sawtooths, and >> no real triangles. >> >> >> Sorry for the shortness/lack of explanation, 0> 1 for >> phasor, 0.5 for triangle, 0 for backwards phasor. >> >> considering shape as a constant, obviously you get weird >> results if >> you modulate it, but that's half the fun: >> >> 0.0 <= input <= shape ~> 0.0 <= output <= 1.0 (rising ramp) >> shape <= input <= 1.0 ~> 1.0 >= output >= 0.0 (falling >> ramp) >> >> Hope this helps, >> >> >> >> Claude >> -- http://claudiusmaximus.goto10.org >> >> >> >> >> -- Alexandre Torres Porres >> cel. (11)8179-6226 >> Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home >> http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres >> >> >> -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: >> http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: >> ---Oblique Strategy # 35: >> "Consider transitions" >> >> >> >> >> -- >> Alexandre Torres Porres >> cel. (11)8179-6226 >> Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home >> http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres >> >> > -- > ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: > http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 87: > "Imagine the music as a moving chain or caterpillar" > -- Alexandre Torres Porres cel. (11)8179-6226 Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From porres at gmail.com Mon Mar 30 20:43:15 2009 From: porres at gmail.com (Alexandre Porres) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 15:43:15 -0300 Subject: [PD] pd book sprint In-Reply-To: <161a0b1e0903301141q272d4432uf801934415ce5834@mail.gmail.com> References: <49D0D533.1000802@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300750o7df7de1k2ebf911d6dfd0139@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DEF8.1080605@goto10.org> <161a0b1e0903300910y2e73a46chdc4121bf2c1aea56@mail.gmail.com> <49D0F261.9080709@goto10.org> <161a0b1e0903300938q6db1a6fah69d98e478afdaf50@mail.gmail.com> <49D10952.4050907@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903301118j6f3f7385obe4c2b8bffe08350@mail.gmail.com> <49D10F71.5030709@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903301141q272d4432uf801934415ce5834@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <161a0b1e0903301143q33748a24u2c0d92b931f34cb0@mail.gmail.com> errata" it wouldnt even be smart to repeat some stuff redundantly. On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 3:41 PM, Alexandre Porres wrote: > well, I totally agree with you, and that is why my stuff does not fill in > the niche of Miller's and others at all. > My stuff is for people who really had never seen anything like this, which > is practically everybody in brazil :) > > I try to put some stuff in miller's book more accessible, but most of it I > dont even bother to attempt that at all! Just the basics... > > The stuff is kinda in between Floss Manuals and Miller's book. But I dont > wish to inject the things I wrote about inside Floss Manuals at all. it > would even be smart to repeat some stuff redundantly. > > But the theory in DSP we are discussing here is really minimum, and the > math could not be any simpler, which is just the procedure of using a [+] > object, as complex as adjusting the gain with [*]. > > Since it is that basic, I dont find it intimidating at all. > > But I really hope we could all share our thoughts and ideas, and create > different materials that complement each other, and that are also coherent > with each other. > > So sorry if I looked too technical, but I still believe it could be simply > presented, and that the material could benefit from it. > > You see, DC Offset is also important to create Synthesis Control, like in > the Amplitude Modulation example. If you want to do an AM synth with [osc], > you need to adjust DC. But the procedure is really really simple. I will > work on the examples and send it to you as soon as i can. > > thanks > alex > > > On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 3:29 PM, Derek Holzer wrote: > >> I agree with the principles of this approach, but perhaps not the >> complexity. The FLOSS Manual doesn't exist as a way to teach DSP. That's >> what Miller's stuff is for. It exists as a way to get people who are put off >> by the existing documentation, which is very very heavy in math, DSP and >> computer science. These are the people I get in my workshops every time. >> They just want to get an idea of how to do things and not be intimidated. >> Thus the emphasis on simple solutions rather than "correct" ones. >> >> If people are ready for a deeper understanding of DSP, that's where >> Miller's book, and pd-tutorial.com and the Roads CMT book and all the >> rest come in. And perhaps your Portuguese one as well. I don't want this >> book to step into a niche which already has many options, I want it to fill >> a niche which is still wide open: Pd for absolute beginners, no >> prerequisites required. >> >> D. >> >> Alexandre Porres wrote: >> >>> you know, yeah, but the thing is that phasor is not actually an oscilator >>> at all !!! >>> >>> the name actually refers to phase, and not sawtooth. >>> >>> Apart from [osc~], oscilators in puredata are basically wavetable >>> oscilators. You have objects such as [tabosc4~] and that is it. >>> What [phasor~] was designed to do is to indicate the phase of the >>> waveform on a table. So you have to adjust phsor to be compatible with the >>> table size. You do that simply by multiplying phasor (wich ramps up to one) >>> to the table size. So what it is meant to do is tell the position (or >>> "phase") in a table. That is why it goes from 0 to 1. If it did go from -1 >>> to 1, as an ocilator, then it wouldnt work that way. >>> >>> So there is a misconception of [phasor~] being a sawtooth wave generator >>> that can be misleading. As an oscilator, [phasor~] has a DC Offset. In order >>> to [phasor~] became an oscilator with no DC Offset, we have to correct it. >>> >>> Maybe it is nice to be explicit about it in Floss Manuals, and say that >>> Pd mostly works out with Table lookup oscilators, and that [osc~] is a >>> special and unique object that is meant to be a Cosine wave oscilator. >>> >>> Then, when explaining how to get other kinds of wavefroms on Pd, such as >>> sawtooth, square, triangle, we could emphasize that we are creating them, >>> and building them up with the objects we have. Thast also makes it implicit >>> that there is more than one way to di it, and that there is no official or >>> built in Square wave, for instance. >>> >>> I actually talk a lot about that on my book. And I present examples on >>> how to get a triangle waveform on a table using the sinesum comand, that is, >>> by summing up harmonics. >>> >>> Cheers >>> Alex >>> >>> On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 3:02 PM, Derek Holzer >> derek at umatic.nl>> wrote: >>> >>> Is it really DC offset when the value goes from 0 to 1 instead of -1 >>> to 1? I mean, that's the way [phasor~] comes right out of the box. >>> >>> D. >>> >>> Alexandre Porres wrote: >>> >>> >>> I tried again, and now it works much better than before... so I >>> guess there was something wrong before. >>> >>> Well Claude, it seems it almost works as the [triangle~] object. >>> >>> Do you guys know about this one? It comes in some external >>> library. >>> >>> Were you who did it anyway Claude? :) >>> >>> [triangle~] works in a similar fashion, it goes smoothly from >>> inverse sawtooth to triangle and the sawtooth depending on the >>> parameter (from 0 to 1). >>> >>> The thing is that Triangle corrects the DC Offset, which could >>> easily be done in the expr. But now I may start to sound like an >>> obssessed DC Offset maniac. >>> >>> Cheers >>> Alex >>> >>> >>> On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 1:25 PM, Claude Heiland-Allen >>> >>> >> >> wrote: >>> >>> Alexandre Porres wrote: >>> >>> On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 12:02 PM, Claude Heiland-Allen < >>> claudiusmaximus at goto10.org >>> >>> >> >>> >> >>> >>> wrote: >>> >>> >>> [phasor~] [r~ shape] >>> [expr~ if($v1<$v2,$v1/$v2,(1-$v1)/(1-$v2))] >>> >>> >>> I tried that, but it didnt actually worked, I just get >>> actual >>> sawtooths, and >>> no real triangles. >>> >>> >>> Sorry for the shortness/lack of explanation, 0>> 1 for >>> phasor, 0.5 for triangle, 0 for backwards phasor. >>> >>> considering shape as a constant, obviously you get weird >>> results if >>> you modulate it, but that's half the fun: >>> >>> 0.0 <= input <= shape ~> 0.0 <= output <= 1.0 (rising >>> ramp) >>> shape <= input <= 1.0 ~> 1.0 >= output >= 0.0 (falling >>> ramp) >>> >>> Hope this helps, >>> >>> >>> >>> Claude >>> -- http://claudiusmaximus.goto10.org >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- Alexandre Torres Porres >>> cel. (11)8179-6226 >>> Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home >>> http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres >>> >>> >>> -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: >>> http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: >>> ---Oblique Strategy # 35: >>> "Consider transitions" >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Alexandre Torres Porres >>> cel. (11)8179-6226 >>> Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home >>> http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres >>> >>> >> -- >> ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: >> http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: >> ---Oblique Strategy # 87: >> "Imagine the music as a moving chain or caterpillar" >> > > > > -- > Alexandre Torres Porres > cel. (11)8179-6226 > Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home > http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres > > -- Alexandre Torres Porres cel. (11)8179-6226 Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From derek at umatic.nl Mon Mar 30 20:44:16 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 20:44:16 +0200 Subject: [PD] pd book sprint In-Reply-To: <161a0b1e0903301141q272d4432uf801934415ce5834@mail.gmail.com> References: <49D0D533.1000802@umatic.nl> <49D0DA79.7010205@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300750o7df7de1k2ebf911d6dfd0139@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DEF8.1080605@goto10.org> <161a0b1e0903300910y2e73a46chdc4121bf2c1aea56@mail.gmail.com> <49D0F261.9080709@goto10.org> <161a0b1e0903300938q6db1a6fah69d98e478afdaf50@mail.gmail.com> <49D10952.4050907@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903301118j6f3f7385obe4c2b8bffe08350@mail.gmail.com> <49D10F71.5030709@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903301141q272d4432uf801934415ce5834@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49D11300.8010508@umatic.nl> Cool then, I'll hold off on further comments until I've seen your examples. Thanks for taking your time to explain all this. I think the more often it gets explained, the smoother the explanation becomes. best, D. Alexandre Porres wrote: > well, I totally agree with you, and that is why my stuff does not fill > in the niche of Miller's and others at all. > > My stuff is for people who really had never seen anything like this, > which is practically everybody in brazil :) > > I try to put some stuff in miller's book more accessible, but most of it > I dont even bother to attempt that at all! Just the basics... > > The stuff is kinda in between Floss Manuals and Miller's book. But I > dont wish to inject the things I wrote about inside Floss Manuals at > all. it would even be smart to repeat some stuff redundantly. > > But the theory in DSP we are discussing here is really minimum, and the > math could not be any simpler, which is just the procedure of using a > [+] object, as complex as adjusting the gain with [*]. > > Since it is that basic, I dont find it intimidating at all. > > But I really hope we could all share our thoughts and ideas, and create > different materials that complement each other, and that are also > coherent with each other. > > So sorry if I looked too technical, but I still believe it could be > simply presented, and that the material could benefit from it. > > You see, DC Offset is also important to create Synthesis Control, like > in the Amplitude Modulation example. If you want to do an AM synth with > [osc], you need to adjust DC. But the procedure is really really simple. > I will work on the examples and send it to you as soon as i can. > > thanks > alex > > > On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 3:29 PM, Derek Holzer > wrote: > > I agree with the principles of this approach, but perhaps not the > complexity. The FLOSS Manual doesn't exist as a way to teach DSP. > That's what Miller's stuff is for. It exists as a way to get people > who are put off by the existing documentation, which is very very > heavy in math, DSP and computer science. These are the people I get > in my workshops every time. They just want to get an idea of how to > do things and not be intimidated. Thus the emphasis on simple > solutions rather than "correct" ones. > > If people are ready for a deeper understanding of DSP, that's where > Miller's book, and pd-tutorial.com and the > Roads CMT book and all the rest come in. And perhaps your Portuguese > one as well. I don't want this book to step into a niche which > already has many options, I want it to fill a niche which is still > wide open: Pd for absolute beginners, no prerequisites required. > > D. > > Alexandre Porres wrote: > > you know, yeah, but the thing is that phasor is not actually an > oscilator at all !!! > > the name actually refers to phase, and not sawtooth. > > Apart from [osc~], oscilators in puredata are basically > wavetable oscilators. You have objects such as [tabosc4~] and > that is it. > What [phasor~] was designed to do is to indicate the phase of > the waveform on a table. So you have to adjust phsor to be > compatible with the table size. You do that simply by > multiplying phasor (wich ramps up to one) to the table size. So > what it is meant to do is tell the position (or "phase") in a > table. That is why it goes from 0 to 1. If it did go from -1 to > 1, as an ocilator, then it wouldnt work that way. > > So there is a misconception of [phasor~] being a sawtooth wave > generator that can be misleading. As an oscilator, [phasor~] has > a DC Offset. In order to [phasor~] became an oscilator with no > DC Offset, we have to correct it. > > Maybe it is nice to be explicit about it in Floss Manuals, and > say that Pd mostly works out with Table lookup oscilators, and > that [osc~] is a special and unique object that is meant to be a > Cosine wave oscilator. > > Then, when explaining how to get other kinds of wavefroms on Pd, > such as sawtooth, square, triangle, we could emphasize that we > are creating them, and building them up with the objects we > have. Thast also makes it implicit that there is more than one > way to di it, and that there is no official or built in Square > wave, for instance. > > I actually talk a lot about that on my book. And I present > examples on how to get a triangle waveform on a table using the > sinesum comand, that is, by summing up harmonics. > > Cheers > Alex > > On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 3:02 PM, Derek Holzer >> wrote: > > Is it really DC offset when the value goes from 0 to 1 > instead of -1 > to 1? I mean, that's the way [phasor~] comes right out of the > box. > > D. > > Alexandre Porres wrote: > > > I tried again, and now it works much better than > before... so I > guess there was something wrong before. > > Well Claude, it seems it almost works as the [triangle~] > object. > > Do you guys know about this one? It comes in some > external library. > > Were you who did it anyway Claude? :) > > [triangle~] works in a similar fashion, it goes smoothly from > inverse sawtooth to triangle and the sawtooth depending > on the > parameter (from 0 to 1). > > The thing is that Triangle corrects the DC Offset, which > could > easily be done in the expr. But now I may start to sound > like an > obssessed DC Offset maniac. > > Cheers > Alex > > > On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 1:25 PM, Claude Heiland-Allen > > > > > > >>> wrote: > > Alexandre Porres wrote: > > On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 12:02 PM, Claude > Heiland-Allen < > claudiusmaximus at goto10.org > > > > > > >>> > > wrote: > > > [phasor~] [r~ shape] > [expr~ if($v1<$v2,$v1/$v2,(1-$v1)/(1-$v2))] > > > I tried that, but it didnt actually worked, I just > get actual > sawtooths, and > no real triangles. > > > Sorry for the shortness/lack of explanation, > 0 1 for > phasor, 0.5 for triangle, 0 for backwards phasor. > > considering shape as a constant, obviously you get weird > results if > you modulate it, but that's half the fun: > > 0.0 <= input <= shape ~> 0.0 <= output <= 1.0 > (rising ramp) > shape <= input <= 1.0 ~> 1.0 >= output >= 0.0 > (falling ramp) > > Hope this helps, > > > > Claude > -- http://claudiusmaximus.goto10.org > > > > > -- Alexandre Torres Porres > cel. (11)8179-6226 > Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home > http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres > > > -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: > http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 35: > "Consider transitions" > > > > > -- > Alexandre Torres Porres > cel. (11)8179-6226 > Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home > http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres > > > -- > ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: > http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 87: > "Imagine the music as a moving chain or caterpillar" > > > > > -- > Alexandre Torres Porres > cel. (11)8179-6226 > Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home > http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres > -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 178: "What is the simplest solution?" From stffn at dibidut.dk Mon Mar 30 21:34:42 2009 From: stffn at dibidut.dk (Steffen Juul) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 21:34:42 +0200 Subject: [PD] building vanilla on os x (Was: Re: abs~ and exp~ fixes [was: rjdj]) In-Reply-To: <7aaf8bb90903300501r7dec3111uba9e48aa81583a89@mail.gmail.com> References: <20090324070331.GA14255@fliwatut.scifi> <20090329105326.GB8572@fliwatut.scifi> <20090329125420.GA30945@footils.org> <880E8039-FF84-43FA-BEE6-11899A8798E9@gmx.ch> <20090329144419.GA31264@footils.org> <79735E52-3DCD-4EF1-A252-11537E0FB1D3@gmx.ch> <4DEFC672-6F2D-435F-984A-6CD3A3FB1DCF@eds.org> <7aaf8bb90903300501r7dec3111uba9e48aa81583a89@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <0EE9894B-8639-4B78-A773-613C08D83964@dibidut.dk> On 30/03/2009, at 14.01, Luke Iannini wrote: > On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 3:52 AM, volker b?hm wrote: >> >> On 30 Mar 2009, at 00:31, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >>> >>> On Mar 29, 2009, at 3:20 PM, Steffen Juul wrote: >>> >>>> >>>> On 29/03/2009, at 17.41, volker b?hm wrote: >>>> >>>>> however i never succeeded in building pd vanilla on osx myself >>>>> (anyone?). >>>> >>>> No, not with the makefile shipped with vanilla. It would be nice >>>> to know >>>> who Miller actually builds it. > Hmm.. I build Pd on OS X all the time! I don't think I've done > anything special but perhaps I did long ago. Of course, I don't know > the process by which Miller assembles the Pd app bundle, but I simply > build the pd binary and drop it in to the latest Pd.app from Miller's > site. Ah ok. Thanks for sharing that tip. Maybe Miller actually make the .app that way. That could explain why the CFBundleVersion tag in Info.plist still is set to 0.38. Side note: I think Marius found that to be the problem with newer versions not being the standard for opening Pd patches. > Where is it failing? It didn't really fail. IT just doesn't assemble a .app - as Volker described. From stffn at dibidut.dk Mon Mar 30 21:36:24 2009 From: stffn at dibidut.dk (Steffen Juul) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 21:36:24 +0200 Subject: [PD] building vanilla on os x (Was: Re: abs~ and exp~ fixes [was: rjdj]) In-Reply-To: <8C5765A2-D2EB-4971-B78D-0318647A0363@gmx.ch> References: <20090324070331.GA14255@fliwatut.scifi> <20090329105326.GB8572@fliwatut.scifi> <20090329125420.GA30945@footils.org> <880E8039-FF84-43FA-BEE6-11899A8798E9@gmx.ch> <20090329144419.GA31264@footils.org> <79735E52-3DCD-4EF1-A252-11537E0FB1D3@gmx.ch> <4DEFC672-6F2D-435F-984A-6CD3A3FB1DCF@eds.org> <7aaf8bb90903300501r7dec3111uba9e48aa81583a89@mail.gmail.com> <8C5765A2-D2EB-4971-B78D-0318647A0363@gmx.ch> Message-ID: <3D3D7232-A98E-403A-AAD5-EC9FA3AAEE45@dibidut.dk> On 30/03/2009, at 16.31, volker b?hm wrote: > i would be interested in knowing what's the startup sequence when > double clicking on the app bundle. I think Hans has documented exactly that. Maybe you can find the appropriate thread on the pd-dev list. From stffn at dibidut.dk Mon Mar 30 22:01:17 2009 From: stffn at dibidut.dk (Steffen Juul) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 22:01:17 +0200 Subject: [PD] pd book sprint In-Reply-To: <49D10F71.5030709@umatic.nl> References: <49D0D533.1000802@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300735g182e469cn479fcc16767e36da@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DA79.7010205@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300750o7df7de1k2ebf911d6dfd0139@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DEF8.1080605@goto10.org> <161a0b1e0903300910y2e73a46chdc4121bf2c1aea56@mail.gmail.com> <49D0F261.9080709@goto10.org> <161a0b1e0903300938q6db1a6fah69d98e478afdaf50@mail.gmail.com> <49D10952.4050907@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903301118j6f3f7385obe4c2b8bffe08350@mail.gmail.com> <49D10F71.5030709@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <46AB9CD3-DF1A-4AD2-8DD3-3BBB5E5E2203@dibidut.dk> On 30/03/2009, at 20.29, Derek Holzer wrote: > If people are ready for a deeper understanding of DSP, that's where > Miller's book, and pd-tutorial.com and the Roads CMT book and all > the rest come in. And perhaps your Portuguese one as well. I don't > want this book to step into a niche which already has many options, > I want it to fill a niche which is still wide open: Pd for absolute > beginners, no prerequisites required. As i understood it, that is also the (at least intended) scope of 'Programming Electronic Music in Pd' aka pd-tutorial.com. - Not that you shouldn't carry on. From porres at gmail.com Mon Mar 30 22:09:23 2009 From: porres at gmail.com (Alexandre Porres) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 17:09:23 -0300 Subject: [PD] pd book sprint In-Reply-To: <46AB9CD3-DF1A-4AD2-8DD3-3BBB5E5E2203@dibidut.dk> References: <49D0D533.1000802@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300750o7df7de1k2ebf911d6dfd0139@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DEF8.1080605@goto10.org> <161a0b1e0903300910y2e73a46chdc4121bf2c1aea56@mail.gmail.com> <49D0F261.9080709@goto10.org> <161a0b1e0903300938q6db1a6fah69d98e478afdaf50@mail.gmail.com> <49D10952.4050907@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903301118j6f3f7385obe4c2b8bffe08350@mail.gmail.com> <49D10F71.5030709@umatic.nl> <46AB9CD3-DF1A-4AD2-8DD3-3BBB5E5E2203@dibidut.dk> Message-ID: <161a0b1e0903301309u4e742175o34a82c23320f4766@mail.gmail.com> yeah, well, as I say, care must be taken not to repeat or get redundant. I hope we could gather the available publications somehow, and write notes on the aims of each of them. This is certainly nice for those who want to get started, they can know what there is around, and choose what to read, and in what order... I surely see pd-tutorial as a step further than Floss Manuals. And I am working on something that is even further, and in between Miller's that is cool right? cheers On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 5:01 PM, Steffen Juul wrote: > > On 30/03/2009, at 20.29, Derek Holzer wrote: > > If people are ready for a deeper understanding of DSP, that's where >> Miller's book, and pd-tutorial.com and the Roads CMT book and all the >> rest come in. And perhaps your Portuguese one as well. I don't want this >> book to step into a niche which already has many options, I want it to fill >> a niche which is still wide open: Pd for absolute beginners, no >> prerequisites required. >> > > > As i understood it, that is also the (at least intended) scope of > 'Programming Electronic Music in Pd' aka pd-tutorial.com. - Not that you > shouldn't carry on. > -- Alexandre Torres Porres cel. (11)8179-6226 Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From abonnements at revolwear.com Mon Mar 30 22:53:42 2009 From: abonnements at revolwear.com (Max) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 22:53:42 +0200 Subject: [PD] Pure Data FLOSS Manual Book Sprint 4-6 April 2009 in NYC and Berlin In-Reply-To: <49D1059D.6050507@gmail.com> References: <49CF8576.8050105@umatic.nl> <49D1059D.6050507@gmail.com> Message-ID: <574A1E8D-22BE-43B1-BB3C-3CA2528958BB@revolwear.com> hey marius, derek + list, i've done some of that already. maybe you can recycle what i've done for some classes. files are here: http://damm-net.org/wiki/index.php?title=Bewegungsmelder i'm glad if i can help, let me know. m. Am 30.03.2009 um 19:47 schrieb marius schebella: > Hi, > > I'd like to participate remotely somehow. I understand that you also > want to cover Gem(?), so I'd like to propose a chapter on video > tracking. motion tracking, background subtraction, showing how to do > alpha masking, color tracking, I also would like to include some > documentation of pix_opencv, unless someone else is already doing > that, for example face tracking, but also other possibilities of > opencv (pattern recognition). > I also think the TUIO stuff should go there (with references to > touchlib or touch?), and multiblob. > > AFAIK there is no gem section yet, so I don't know if it is possible > to do just one chapter without a general introduction to gem?? > > Btw, there are tons of other topics to cover... > > marius. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: PGP.sig Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 194 bytes Desc: Signierter Teil der Nachricht URL: From philip.g.potter at gmail.com Mon Mar 30 23:24:11 2009 From: philip.g.potter at gmail.com (Philip Potter) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 22:24:11 +0100 Subject: [PD] Pdpedia and random generation Message-ID: <91dd35300903301424k59299277rf6516509436e83f5@mail.gmail.com> Hi all, First post to the list, very new to pd, hello to all. I have a few questions: 1) Is pdpedia a serious project? It seems like there was a lot of activity some time ago, but the people there got burned out and now is a target for spammers (particularly the "myobject" and "help patch" pages). I have done some updating of it but if noone else is doing anything to it then maybe I should be looking for other pd resources. 2) I had a look at pd-tutorial.com and tried to do their exercise on random number generation such that no two sequential numbers are equal: http://pd-tutorial.com/english/ch02s02.html#id411951 I came up with the attached file, which I feel is better than the original solution. What do you think? Are there advantages to the original which I haven't considered? 3) Someone mentioned on the list a [pack 0 0 0 0 0] idiom for building large trees of maths in order to avoid weaving many [t b f] objects to cold inlets. How does this idiom work? TIA, Philip -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: random-no-repeat.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 744 bytes Desc: not available URL: From marius.schebella at gmail.com Mon Mar 30 23:46:13 2009 From: marius.schebella at gmail.com (marius schebella) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 23:46:13 +0200 Subject: [PD] Pdpedia and random generation In-Reply-To: <91dd35300903301424k59299277rf6516509436e83f5@mail.gmail.com> References: <91dd35300903301424k59299277rf6516509436e83f5@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49D13DA5.7070307@gmail.com> Philip Potter wrote: > Hi all, > > First post to the list, very new to pd, hello to all. I have a few questions: > > 1) Is pdpedia a serious project? It seems like there was a lot of > activity some time ago, but the people there got burned out and now is > a target for spammers (particularly the "myobject" and "help patch" > pages). I have done some updating of it but if noone else is doing > anything to it then maybe I should be looking for other pd resources. hi philip, afaik, pdpedia is poorly maintained at the moment. I think there will be a better solution in the future to get rid of spam and optimize searching and contributions. for now, your observation of burnout seems correct. marius. From matju at artengine.ca Tue Mar 31 00:17:18 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 18:17:18 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] Pdpedia and random generation In-Reply-To: <91dd35300903301424k59299277rf6516509436e83f5@mail.gmail.com> References: <91dd35300903301424k59299277rf6516509436e83f5@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Mon, 30 Mar 2009, Philip Potter wrote: > 3) Someone mentioned on the list a [pack 0 0 0 0 0] idiom for building > large trees of maths in order to avoid weaving many [t b f] objects to > cold inlets. How does this idiom work? It doesn't eliminate the [t b f], it makes them more manageable. it's just a bunch of [inlets] connected to a [pack 0 0 0 0 0] then to an [unpack 0 0 0 0 0]. This causes recomputation of the complete tree of maths every time something is sent to the hot inlet of the abstraction, but it doesn't fix anything arising from crossing wires in ways that would usually cause a delay: for example if you use [t f f] with crossed wires to an object, instead of using [swap], this causes a delay (intentional or not) due to order of operations. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From matju at artengine.ca Tue Mar 31 00:30:34 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 18:30:34 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] [OT] Re: DIY GSoC: getting those projects done In-Reply-To: <49D10304.1010602@goto10.org> References: <475768.89279.qm@web65603.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> <20090328093208.GA24532@mccormick.cx> <49D10304.1010602@goto10.org> Message-ID: On Mon, 30 Mar 2009, Claude Heiland-Allen wrote: > Not sure I like the idea of a "run" method, what if there's more than > one reasonable run action? When inlets are called "hot" and "cold", it's always because there is only one thing you can call the run-action in an ordinary object: the thing that is done by sending a value in the first inlet, and the thing that is not done by the "set" method of the first inlet, nor by sending a value in any other inlet. But if any other inlet could be hot, then there would be a need to have a "set" method anywhere. And then "bang" and "set" are considered as lists by [list]. I wonder whether anything can be done to improve Pd about it without opening a can of worms or two. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From anarch at silcom.com Tue Mar 31 01:15:30 2009 From: anarch at silcom.com (Brendan) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 16:15:30 -0700 Subject: [PD] Vertical text with GEM Message-ID: <8EF09085-FDA0-44F5-83B6-FF268776A3D0@silcom.com> I want to render vertical text in GEM, i.e. T E X T Any suggestions? I haven't found an example and my effort to do it in PD is turning out ridiculously complex and difficult. I'm OK with writing externals, but I haven't looked into how GEM works yet. PDP is all right too, but preferably GEM. From matju at artengine.ca Tue Mar 31 02:41:42 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 20:41:42 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] [OT] Re: DIY GSoC: getting those projects done In-Reply-To: <77490995-FD2B-43A7-82E5-93F35C8BAE92@eds.org> References: <475768.89279.qm@web65603.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> <20090328093208.GA24532@mccormick.cx> <77490995-FD2B-43A7-82E5-93F35C8BAE92@eds.org> Message-ID: On Sun, 29 Mar 2009, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > On Mar 28, 2009, at 5:32 AM, Chris McCormick wrote: >> I like the idea of this behaviour being defined by the class author, but >> (re)configurable by the user. > Sounds like an interesting idea, its something more like how vvvv works. For > me, I make sense of vvvv by thinking of it as Pd with only tilde objects, no > message objects. He doesn't mean to have everything work like the DSP. In that case there wouldn't be hot inlets nor cold inlets and so you wouldn't need them to be reconfigurable. He's talking about making them configurable. If you make everything work like the DSP (that is, one message per block, or one message per sample, whichever), then there are quite a few things you can't do anymore or have to do in different ways: can't avoid sending a message during a tick, and can't send more than one message during a tick, and can't recurse in any way, even to a cold inlet (you can't sum the values in a signal using just [+~] connected to itself...). _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From hans at eds.org Tue Mar 31 03:22:03 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Mon, 30 Mar 2009 21:22:03 -0400 Subject: [PD] Pdpedia and random generation In-Reply-To: <49D13DA5.7070307@gmail.com> References: <91dd35300903301424k59299277rf6516509436e83f5@mail.gmail.com> <49D13DA5.7070307@gmail.com> Message-ID: <70942222-64DD-4B3B-AB82-171172C951FA@eds.org> On Mar 30, 2009, at 5:46 PM, marius schebella wrote: > Philip Potter wrote: >> Hi all, >> First post to the list, very new to pd, hello to all. I have a few >> questions: >> 1) Is pdpedia a serious project? It seems like there was a lot of >> activity some time ago, but the people there got burned out and now >> is >> a target for spammers (particularly the "myobject" and "help patch" >> pages). I have done some updating of it but if noone else is doing >> anything to it then maybe I should be looking for other pd resources. > > hi philip, > afaik, pdpedia is poorly maintained at the moment. I think there > will be a better solution in the future to get rid of spam and > optimize searching and contributions. for now, your observation of > burnout seems correct. > marius. I think pdpedia has a lot of potential, but it needs someone to take ownership of it. Its really open to anyone who wants to take it on. It is useful now for searching based on keywords. I use it to find objects based on key words. .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- If you are not part of the solution, you are part of the problem. From abonnements at revolwear.com Tue Mar 31 07:49:02 2009 From: abonnements at revolwear.com (Max) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 07:49:02 +0200 Subject: [PD] GEM pix_write bugs (timelapse) In-Reply-To: <436636.46451.qm@web32405.mail.mud.yahoo.com> References: <436636.46451.qm@web32405.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <0D453A90-CA1E-42C2-BF7B-8EA0036561F3@revolwear.com> here is the same thing with pix_multiimage instead. it will crash pd a little bit later than the version with pix_image. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: timelapse_multiimage.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 2889 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- Am 30.03.2009 um 18:50 schrieb mark edward grimm: > > hey thats pretty nice!! > > much nicer than my poor gem attempt last month... > >> and the patch: >> put this to / because of the bug in pix_write to make it >> work. put a folder called "frames" beside it. > > yeah this is weird huh? > > > > > --- On Sat, 3/28/09, Max wrote: > >> From: Max >> Subject: [PD] GEM pix_write bugs (timelapse) >> To: pd-list at iem.at >> Date: Saturday, March 28, 2009, 12:52 PM >> hi list, >> >> i've thrown together this tiny gem patch which makes a >> timelapse slideshow. >> i have encountered a few issues with it. >> >> configuration: >> Pd version 0.41.4-extended-20090223 >> GEM: ver: 0.91.3 'tigital' >> GEM: compiled: Feb 23 2009 >> OS X 10.5.6 >> >> the issues: >> 1. pix_write doesn't interpret the file path correctly. it >> seems it can't understand relative paths at all. >> >> 2. pix_write accepts a message [file >> [](. it creates files with a .jpg ending if the >> type is >0. But in reality it still is a TIFF. no matter >> what value you write. >> >> 3. pix_write creates files with an acending number 0...9999 >> this conflicts with how other objects like pix_multiimage do >> it (00000...99999) >> >> just submitted that to the gem bugtracker. >> >> >> and the patch: >> put this to / because of the bug in pix_write to make it >> work. put a folder called "frames" beside it. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> beware: this patch will also eat up all the memory and will >> crash pd. this isn't pix_writes problem though - i'll try to >> find out why this is now. >> >> max >> -----Inline Attachment Follows----- >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at >> mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: PGP.sig Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 194 bytes Desc: Signierter Teil der Nachricht URL: From grh at mur.at Tue Mar 31 09:07:15 2009 From: grh at mur.at (Georg Holzmann) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 09:07:15 +0200 Subject: [PD] Pdpedia and random generation In-Reply-To: <70942222-64DD-4B3B-AB82-171172C951FA@eds.org> References: <91dd35300903301424k59299277rf6516509436e83f5@mail.gmail.com> <49D13DA5.7070307@gmail.com> <70942222-64DD-4B3B-AB82-171172C951FA@eds.org> Message-ID: <49D1C123.6000403@mur.at> Hallo! >> afaik, pdpedia is poorly maintained at the moment. I think there will >> be a better solution in the future to get rid of spam and optimize >> searching and contributions. for now, your observation of burnout >> seems correct. >> marius. > > I think pdpedia has a lot of potential, but it needs someone to take > ownership of it. Its really open to anyone who wants to take it on. It > is useful now for searching based on keywords. I use it to find objects > based on key words. Silly question: but why don't you just use captchas did get rid of all these massive spam attacks ? (However, I don't know if this is difficult to install on this system - otherwise maybe have to use user accounts ...) LG Georg From fbar at footils.org Tue Mar 31 10:34:12 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 10:34:12 +0200 Subject: [PD] pd book sprint In-Reply-To: <161a0b1e0903301118j6f3f7385obe4c2b8bffe08350@mail.gmail.com> References: <49D0D533.1000802@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300735g182e469cn479fcc16767e36da@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DA79.7010205@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300750o7df7de1k2ebf911d6dfd0139@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DEF8.1080605@goto10.org> <161a0b1e0903300910y2e73a46chdc4121bf2c1aea56@mail.gmail.com> <49D0F261.9080709@goto10.org> <161a0b1e0903300938q6db1a6fah69d98e478afdaf50@mail.gmail.com> <49D10952.4050907@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903301118j6f3f7385obe4c2b8bffe08350@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090331083412.GA5393@footils.org> Hallo, Alexandre Porres hat gesagt: // Alexandre Porres wrote: > you know, yeah, but the thing is that phasor is not actually an oscilator at > all !!! > the name actually refers to phase, and not sawtooth. And a [triangle~] may be used as a ping-pong looping [phasor~]. The objects Pd provides are building blocks - they generally are designed on a level that allows and encourages multiple uses. A square wave going from 0 to 1 can be used as a logical signal that switches another signal on and off. In fact, a trivial square or saw without bandlimit should generally not be used as an "oscillator" in the analog synth sense - it should be bandlimited first, and while you do that you may as well make them have a DC of 0. (Bandlimiting triangle waves is not *that* urgent, as corners don't add so many alias components.) Ciao -- Frank From philip.g.potter at gmail.com Tue Mar 31 10:49:29 2009 From: philip.g.potter at gmail.com (Philip Potter) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 09:49:29 +0100 Subject: [PD] Pdpedia and random generation In-Reply-To: <49D1C123.6000403@mur.at> References: <91dd35300903301424k59299277rf6516509436e83f5@mail.gmail.com> <49D13DA5.7070307@gmail.com> <70942222-64DD-4B3B-AB82-171172C951FA@eds.org> <49D1C123.6000403@mur.at> Message-ID: <91dd35300903310149u4dd2a930y4c1f389bb93164a5@mail.gmail.com> 2009/3/31 Georg Holzmann : > Hallo! > >>> afaik, pdpedia is poorly maintained at the moment. I think there will be >>> a better solution in the future to get rid of spam and optimize searching >>> and contributions. for now, your observation of burnout seems correct. >>> marius. >> >> I think pdpedia has a lot of potential, but it needs someone to take >> ownership of it. ?Its really open to anyone who wants to take it on. ?It is >> useful now for searching based on keywords. ?I use it to find objects based >> on key words. I quite agree, and I have written for some articles to make them more useful (FIR~, multiplex~, and tabwrite) but I feel lonely doing so. I'm the only user to have made any changes to pdpedia content in the last 30 days; there has been some spamfighting by Hans and lots of spam from anonymous IPs but if noone else is updating the actual content I don't see why I am doing it. > Silly question: but why don't you just use captchas did get rid of all these > massive spam attacks ? > (However, I don't know if this is difficult to install on this system - > otherwise maybe have to use user accounts ...) http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:SpamBlacklist is something that could be considered. It prevents any edit to a page which inserts a URL matching a list of regexes. Philip -- "I have always wished for my computer to be as easy to use as my telephone; my wish has come true because I can no longer figure out how to use my telephone." --Bjarne Stroustrup From mathsman at libero.it Tue Mar 31 12:44:00 2009 From: mathsman at libero.it (mathsman at libero.it) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 12:44:00 +0200 Subject: [PD] Smooth motion with GEM Message-ID: Hi list, I'm using the patch below on Pd-extended 0.40.3 on a MacBook Pro, MacOsX10.4.11, to test the best setting for the [gemwin] initialization. Even with a simple 4/3 [rectangle] I can't get smooth motions: if I increase/decrease its dimensions with a [line] (let's say increasing dimensions from 3 to 4 in 10000 milliseconds) the motion is not fluid, it changes by little visible steps. I've tried also to limit the amount of data from the [line] till 40 values per second without significative results. Any suggestion? Thanks a lot! marco #N canvas 595 22 579 178 10; #X obj 78 38 gemhead; #X obj 64 123 rectangle 4 3; #X obj 357 115 gemwin; #X msg 258 47 create \, 1; #X msg 349 48 destroy; #X floatatom 157 28 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 139 98 * 0.865; #X obj 139 75 line; #X obj 139 54 pack f f; #X floatatom 206 29 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X msg 414 69 frame \$1; #X floatatom 414 48 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X msg 8 61 draw fill; #X obj 78 17 tgl 15 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1 1 1 ; #X connect 0 0 1 0; #X connect 3 0 2 0; #X connect 4 0 2 0; #X connect 5 0 8 0; #X connect 6 0 1 2; #X connect 7 0 6 0; #X connect 7 0 1 1; #X connect 8 0 7 0; #X connect 9 0 8 1; #X connect 10 0 2 0; #X connect 11 0 10 0; #X connect 12 0 1 0; #X connect 13 0 0 0; From marius.schebella at gmail.com Tue Mar 31 13:13:52 2009 From: marius.schebella at gmail.com (marius schebella) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 13:13:52 +0200 Subject: [PD] Smooth motion with GEM In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: sending the gemwin a message FSAA 2 (or 4...) before you create it will enhance the smoothness a little bit. marius. 2009/3/31 mathsman at libero.it : > > Hi list, > > I'm using the patch below on Pd-extended 0.40.3 on a MacBook Pro, MacOsX10.4.11, to test the best setting for the [gemwin] initialization. > > Even with a simple 4/3 [rectangle] I can't get smooth motions: if I increase/decrease its dimensions with a [line] (let's say increasing dimensions from 3 to 4 in 10000 milliseconds) the motion is not fluid, it changes by little visible steps. I've tried also to limit the amount of data from the [line] till 40 values per second without significative results. > > Any suggestion? Thanks a lot! marco > > > #N canvas 595 22 579 178 10; > #X obj 78 38 gemhead; > #X obj 64 123 rectangle 4 3; > #X obj 357 115 gemwin; > #X msg 258 47 create \, 1; > #X msg 349 48 destroy; > #X floatatom 157 28 5 0 0 0 - - -; > #X obj 139 98 * 0.865; > #X obj 139 75 line; > #X obj 139 54 pack f f; > #X floatatom 206 29 5 0 0 0 - - -; > #X msg 414 69 frame \$1; > #X floatatom 414 48 5 0 0 0 - - -; > #X msg 8 61 draw fill; > #X obj 78 17 tgl 15 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1 1 1 > ; > #X connect 0 0 1 0; > #X connect 3 0 2 0; > #X connect 4 0 2 0; > #X connect 5 0 8 0; > #X connect 6 0 1 2; > #X connect 7 0 6 0; > #X connect 7 0 1 1; > #X connect 8 0 7 0; > #X connect 9 0 8 1; > #X connect 10 0 2 0; > #X connect 11 0 10 0; > #X connect 12 0 1 0; > #X connect 13 0 0 0; > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > From cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr Tue Mar 31 13:19:47 2009 From: cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr (cyrille henry) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 13:19:47 +0200 Subject: [PD] Smooth motion with GEM In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49D1FC53.4010901@la-kitchen.fr> setting framerate to 50 with the frame massage on your patch make the display very fluid. 50fps correspond to 20ms between frame, and that's exactly the default output rate of line. so everything is fine in your patch. once correctly configured it works perfectly. at least on my computer. Cyrille mathsman at libero.it a ?crit : > Hi list, > > I'm using the patch below on Pd-extended 0.40.3 on a MacBook Pro, MacOsX10.4.11, to test the best setting for the [gemwin] initialization. > > Even with a simple 4/3 [rectangle] I can't get smooth motions: if I increase/decrease its dimensions with a [line] (let's say increasing dimensions from 3 to 4 in 10000 milliseconds) the motion is not fluid, it changes by little visible steps. I've tried also to limit the amount of data from the [line] till 40 values per second without significative results. > > Any suggestion? Thanks a lot! marco > > > #N canvas 595 22 579 178 10; > #X obj 78 38 gemhead; > #X obj 64 123 rectangle 4 3; > #X obj 357 115 gemwin; > #X msg 258 47 create \, 1; > #X msg 349 48 destroy; > #X floatatom 157 28 5 0 0 0 - - -; > #X obj 139 98 * 0.865; > #X obj 139 75 line; > #X obj 139 54 pack f f; > #X floatatom 206 29 5 0 0 0 - - -; > #X msg 414 69 frame \$1; > #X floatatom 414 48 5 0 0 0 - - -; > #X msg 8 61 draw fill; > #X obj 78 17 tgl 15 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1 1 1 > ; > #X connect 0 0 1 0; > #X connect 3 0 2 0; > #X connect 4 0 2 0; > #X connect 5 0 8 0; > #X connect 6 0 1 2; > #X connect 7 0 6 0; > #X connect 7 0 1 1; > #X connect 8 0 7 0; > #X connect 9 0 8 1; > #X connect 10 0 2 0; > #X connect 11 0 10 0; > #X connect 12 0 1 0; > #X connect 13 0 0 0; > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > From porres at gmail.com Tue Mar 31 13:59:24 2009 From: porres at gmail.com (Alexandre Porres) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 08:59:24 -0300 Subject: [PD] Pdpedia and random generation Message-ID: <161a0b1e0903310459v1fdd1635s416fe523946ec8ca@mail.gmail.com> Hi, welll, so "someone" needs to take over? I would definately be interested on this. I do, nevertheless, feel I bit clueless as I dont know the way to the source of all objects. And cant really be an expert on things other than audio/music. I also consider rather unfair to be the work of only one ho has taken over. I do believe in forming a team, things like that. Anyway, with the convention this year and all, I hope to bring this issue into round tables and discussions, make some noise on the list to see if a small group would move a bit their asses to launch this out. I could kinda take it over this way. I could definately make the commitment. But I cant be the one and only. I am not even a Native Speaker/Writer of English. So please help me out here, I also need a partner to guide me and help me not getting so bit clueless. Cheers Alex -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From marius.schebella at gmail.com Tue Mar 31 14:46:11 2009 From: marius.schebella at gmail.com (marius schebella) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 14:46:11 +0200 Subject: [PD] Pdpedia and random generation In-Reply-To: <161a0b1e0903310459v1fdd1635s416fe523946ec8ca@mail.gmail.com> References: <161a0b1e0903310459v1fdd1635s416fe523946ec8ca@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: the "someone" would be in charge of the server space and the maintainance of the mediawiki (accounts, updates, spam, search functionality, synchronization with other documentations). this could also be done by several people, but usually the responsibility is with one person. all the rest can easily be done by a group of admins or even be totally open to the public. I guess the work that is missing at the moment is not so much about writing all the articles. marius. 2009/3/31 Alexandre Porres : > Hi, welll, so "someone" needs to take over? > I would definately be interested on this. I do, nevertheless, feel I bit > clueless as I dont know the way to the source of all objects. And cant > really be an expert on things other than audio/music. > I also consider rather unfair to be the work of only one ho has taken over. > I do believe in forming a team, things like that. > Anyway, with the convention this year and all, I hope to bring this issue > into round tables and discussions, make some noise on the list to see if a > small group would move a bit their asses to launch this out. > I could kinda take it over this way. I could definately make the commitment. > But I cant be the one and only. I am not even a Native Speaker/Writer of > English. > So please help me out here, I also need a partner to guide me and help me > not getting so bit clueless. > Cheers > Alex > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > From derek at umatic.nl Tue Mar 31 16:36:46 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 16:36:46 +0200 Subject: [PD] recursive video feedback in GEM or PDP? Message-ID: <49D22A7E.4030901@umatic.nl> The other night I watched a very nice lecture from Paul Prudence (dataisnature.com). He uses VVVV to make audio-responsive video feedback, where a single shape (a square) is recursively displayed, causing very complex structures to arise. The relevant parts of the lecture are here: http://www.vimeo.com/2930699 http://www.vimeo.com/3003040 although I would encourage people to go through the whole thing (11 parts on Vimeo) if they have time + interest. I'd at a loss to think of how something similar, i.e. the recursive feedback, could be done in GEM or PDP. Any suggestions? best! Derek -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 8: "Accretion" From cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr Tue Mar 31 16:53:27 2009 From: cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr (cyrille henry) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 16:53:27 +0200 Subject: [PD] recursive video feedback in GEM or PDP? In-Reply-To: <49D22A7E.4030901@umatic.nl> References: <49D22A7E.4030901@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <49D22E67.4040703@la-kitchen.fr> look at gem exemple 07.feedback in 07.texture directory and also at "self similar" performance by Ben bogart (2004) : http://www.ekran.org/ben/wp/?page_id=101 ++ c Derek Holzer a ?crit : > The other night I watched a very nice lecture from Paul Prudence > (dataisnature.com). He uses VVVV to make audio-responsive video > feedback, where a single shape (a square) is recursively displayed, > causing very complex structures to arise. The relevant parts of the > lecture are here: > > http://www.vimeo.com/2930699 > http://www.vimeo.com/3003040 > > although I would encourage people to go through the whole thing (11 > parts on Vimeo) if they have time + interest. > > I'd at a loss to think of how something similar, i.e. the recursive > feedback, could be done in GEM or PDP. Any suggestions? > > best! > Derek > From derek at umatic.nl Tue Mar 31 17:16:08 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 17:16:08 +0200 Subject: [PD] recursive video feedback in GEM or PDP? In-Reply-To: <49D22E67.4040703@la-kitchen.fr> References: <49D22A7E.4030901@umatic.nl> <49D22E67.4040703@la-kitchen.fr> Message-ID: <49D233B8.5080307@umatic.nl> Thanks much! [pix_snap2tex] is exactly the starting point I needed. D. cyrille henry wrote: > look at gem exemple 07.feedback in 07.texture directory > and also at "self similar" performance by Ben bogart (2004) : > http://www.ekran.org/ben/wp/?page_id=101 > > ++ > c > > Derek Holzer a ?crit : >> The other night I watched a very nice lecture from Paul Prudence >> (dataisnature.com). He uses VVVV to make audio-responsive video >> feedback, where a single shape (a square) is recursively displayed, >> causing very complex structures to arise. The relevant parts of the >> lecture are here: >> >> http://www.vimeo.com/2930699 >> http://www.vimeo.com/3003040 >> >> although I would encourage people to go through the whole thing (11 >> parts on Vimeo) if they have time + interest. >> >> I'd at a loss to think of how something similar, i.e. the recursive >> feedback, could be done in GEM or PDP. Any suggestions? >> >> best! >> Derek >> > -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 145: "Slow preparation, fast execution" From cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr Tue Mar 31 17:26:30 2009 From: cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr (cyrille henry) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 17:26:30 +0200 Subject: [PD] recursive video feedback in GEM or PDP? In-Reply-To: <49D233B8.5080307@umatic.nl> References: <49D22A7E.4030901@umatic.nl> <49D22E67.4040703@la-kitchen.fr> <49D233B8.5080307@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <49D23626.6020703@la-kitchen.fr> this was the old way to do (but still working fine). i think it can be faster to render in a framebuffer, and use this framebuffer as a texture to draw in a 2nd framebuffer. and drawing back to the 1st. etc. there are also some example in the glsl section. jack also send a simple exemple somwhere recently. ++ c Derek Holzer a ?crit : > Thanks much! [pix_snap2tex] is exactly the starting point I needed. > > D. > > cyrille henry wrote: >> look at gem exemple 07.feedback in 07.texture directory >> and also at "self similar" performance by Ben bogart (2004) : >> http://www.ekran.org/ben/wp/?page_id=101 >> >> ++ >> c >> >> Derek Holzer a ?crit : >>> The other night I watched a very nice lecture from Paul Prudence >>> (dataisnature.com). He uses VVVV to make audio-responsive video >>> feedback, where a single shape (a square) is recursively displayed, >>> causing very complex structures to arise. The relevant parts of the >>> lecture are here: >>> >>> http://www.vimeo.com/2930699 >>> http://www.vimeo.com/3003040 >>> >>> although I would encourage people to go through the whole thing (11 >>> parts on Vimeo) if they have time + interest. >>> >>> I'd at a loss to think of how something similar, i.e. the recursive >>> feedback, could be done in GEM or PDP. Any suggestions? >>> >>> best! >>> Derek >>> >> > From sesselastronaut at googlemail.com Tue Mar 31 17:27:11 2009 From: sesselastronaut at googlemail.com (olsen wolf) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 17:27:11 +0200 Subject: [PD] Pdpedia and random generation In-Reply-To: References: <161a0b1e0903310459v1fdd1635s416fe523946ec8ca@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <52bc3f2b0903310827p32a785b5jcb95c5228198c180@mail.gmail.com> the server space & the maintenance is currently done by claudio the sys-admin at the school here in z?rich where the wiki is hostet atm. so far he's been trying to maintain it as much as possible - sometimes certain request take more time - queuing up on other things that need to be done. but so far ev'rything should be on the line. recently php-admin was installed for user management &?should be up & functional. the spam issue we've discussed on the list & i got the consensus to clean up the mess by hand. So if there's any lack regarding the hosting or enhancements please let me know &?i'll forward it. olsen On Tue, Mar 31, 2009 at 2:46 PM, marius schebella wrote: > the "someone" would be in charge of the server space and the > maintainance of the mediawiki (accounts, updates, spam, search > functionality, synchronization with other documentations). this could > also be done by several people, but usually the responsibility is with > one person. all the rest can easily be done by a group of admins or > even be totally open to the public. > > I guess the work that is missing at the moment is not so much about > writing all the articles. > marius. > > 2009/3/31 Alexandre Porres : >> Hi, welll, so "someone" needs to take over? >> I would definately be interested on this. I do, nevertheless, feel I bit >> clueless as I dont know the way to the source of all objects. And cant >> really be an expert on things other than audio/music. >> I also consider rather unfair to be the work of only one ho has taken over. >> I do believe in forming a team, things like that. >> Anyway, with the convention this year and all, I hope to bring this issue >> into round tables and discussions, make some noise on the list to see if a >> small group would move a bit their asses to launch this out. >> I could kinda take it over this way. I could definately make the commitment. >> But I cant be the one and only. I am not even a Native Speaker/Writer of >> English. >> So please help me out here, I also need a partner to guide me and help me >> not getting so bit clueless. >> Cheers >> Alex >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -- Planet Pluto bleibt! From derek at umatic.nl Tue Mar 31 17:30:07 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 17:30:07 +0200 Subject: [PD] recursive video feedback in GEM or PDP? In-Reply-To: <49D23626.6020703@la-kitchen.fr> References: <49D22A7E.4030901@umatic.nl> <49D22E67.4040703@la-kitchen.fr> <49D233B8.5080307@umatic.nl> <49D23626.6020703@la-kitchen.fr> Message-ID: <49D236FF.5060706@umatic.nl> which objects could be used to make this framebuffer? d. cyrille henry wrote: > this was the old way to do (but still working fine). > i think it can be faster to render in a framebuffer, and use this > framebuffer as a texture to draw in a 2nd framebuffer. > and drawing back to the 1st. > etc. > there are also some example in the glsl section. > jack also send a simple exemple somwhere recently. > > ++ > c > > Derek Holzer a ?crit : >> Thanks much! [pix_snap2tex] is exactly the starting point I needed. >> >> D. >> >> cyrille henry wrote: >>> look at gem exemple 07.feedback in 07.texture directory >>> and also at "self similar" performance by Ben bogart (2004) : >>> http://www.ekran.org/ben/wp/?page_id=101 >>> >>> ++ >>> c >>> >>> Derek Holzer a ?crit : >>>> The other night I watched a very nice lecture from Paul Prudence >>>> (dataisnature.com). He uses VVVV to make audio-responsive video >>>> feedback, where a single shape (a square) is recursively displayed, >>>> causing very complex structures to arise. The relevant parts of the >>>> lecture are here: >>>> >>>> http://www.vimeo.com/2930699 >>>> http://www.vimeo.com/3003040 >>>> >>>> although I would encourage people to go through the whole thing (11 >>>> parts on Vimeo) if they have time + interest. >>>> >>>> I'd at a loss to think of how something similar, i.e. the recursive >>>> feedback, could be done in GEM or PDP. Any suggestions? >>>> >>>> best! >>>> Derek >>>> >>> >> > -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 69: "Feed the recording back out of the medium" From derek at umatic.nl Tue Mar 31 17:35:07 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 17:35:07 +0200 Subject: [PD] recursive video feedback in GEM or PDP? In-Reply-To: <49D236FF.5060706@umatic.nl> References: <49D22A7E.4030901@umatic.nl> <49D22E67.4040703@la-kitchen.fr> <49D233B8.5080307@umatic.nl> <49D23626.6020703@la-kitchen.fr> <49D236FF.5060706@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <49D2382B.4060102@umatic.nl> Second question: would I gain anything by bridging between GEM and PDP for something like this? Or would the [gem2pdp] and [pdp2gem] use more resources than I would gain from using PDP in this situation? D. Derek Holzer wrote: > which objects could be used to make this framebuffer? > d. > > cyrille henry wrote: >> this was the old way to do (but still working fine). >> i think it can be faster to render in a framebuffer, and use this >> framebuffer as a texture to draw in a 2nd framebuffer. >> and drawing back to the 1st. >> etc. >> there are also some example in the glsl section. >> jack also send a simple exemple somwhere recently. >> >> ++ >> c >> >> Derek Holzer a ?crit : >>> Thanks much! [pix_snap2tex] is exactly the starting point I needed. >>> >>> D. >>> >>> cyrille henry wrote: >>>> look at gem exemple 07.feedback in 07.texture directory >>>> and also at "self similar" performance by Ben bogart (2004) : >>>> http://www.ekran.org/ben/wp/?page_id=101 >>>> >>>> ++ >>>> c >>>> >>>> Derek Holzer a ?crit : >>>>> The other night I watched a very nice lecture from Paul Prudence >>>>> (dataisnature.com). He uses VVVV to make audio-responsive video >>>>> feedback, where a single shape (a square) is recursively displayed, >>>>> causing very complex structures to arise. The relevant parts of the >>>>> lecture are here: >>>>> >>>>> http://www.vimeo.com/2930699 >>>>> http://www.vimeo.com/3003040 >>>>> >>>>> although I would encourage people to go through the whole thing (11 >>>>> parts on Vimeo) if they have time + interest. >>>>> >>>>> I'd at a loss to think of how something similar, i.e. the recursive >>>>> feedback, could be done in GEM or PDP. Any suggestions? >>>>> >>>>> best! >>>>> Derek >>>>> >>>> >>> >> > -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 53: "Do something boring" From cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr Tue Mar 31 17:37:59 2009 From: cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr (cyrille henry) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 17:37:59 +0200 Subject: [PD] recursive video feedback in GEM or PDP? In-Reply-To: <49D236FF.5060706@umatic.nl> References: <49D22A7E.4030901@umatic.nl> <49D22E67.4040703@la-kitchen.fr> <49D233B8.5080307@umatic.nl> <49D23626.6020703@la-kitchen.fr> <49D236FF.5060706@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <49D238D7.1010301@la-kitchen.fr> Derek Holzer a ?crit : > which objects could be used to make this framebuffer? gemframebuffer. here is the patch jack send recently on the list. cyrille > d. > > cyrille henry wrote: >> this was the old way to do (but still working fine). >> i think it can be faster to render in a framebuffer, and use this >> framebuffer as a texture to draw in a 2nd framebuffer. >> and drawing back to the 1st. >> etc. >> there are also some example in the glsl section. >> jack also send a simple exemple somwhere recently. >> >> ++ >> c >> >> Derek Holzer a ?crit : >>> Thanks much! [pix_snap2tex] is exactly the starting point I needed. >>> >>> D. >>> >>> cyrille henry wrote: >>>> look at gem exemple 07.feedback in 07.texture directory >>>> and also at "self similar" performance by Ben bogart (2004) : >>>> http://www.ekran.org/ben/wp/?page_id=101 >>>> >>>> ++ >>>> c >>>> >>>> Derek Holzer a ?crit : >>>>> The other night I watched a very nice lecture from Paul Prudence >>>>> (dataisnature.com). He uses VVVV to make audio-responsive video >>>>> feedback, where a single shape (a square) is recursively displayed, >>>>> causing very complex structures to arise. The relevant parts of the >>>>> lecture are here: >>>>> >>>>> http://www.vimeo.com/2930699 >>>>> http://www.vimeo.com/3003040 >>>>> >>>>> although I would encourage people to go through the whole thing (11 >>>>> parts on Vimeo) if they have time + interest. >>>>> >>>>> I'd at a loss to think of how something similar, i.e. the recursive >>>>> feedback, could be done in GEM or PDP. Any suggestions? >>>>> >>>>> best! >>>>> Derek >>>>> >>>> >>> >> > -------------- next part -------------- An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: feedbackFB.pd URL: From derek at umatic.nl Tue Mar 31 17:51:35 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 17:51:35 +0200 Subject: [PD] recursive video feedback in GEM or PDP? In-Reply-To: <49D238D7.1010301@la-kitchen.fr> References: <49D22A7E.4030901@umatic.nl> <49D22E67.4040703@la-kitchen.fr> <49D233B8.5080307@umatic.nl> <49D23626.6020703@la-kitchen.fr> <49D236FF.5060706@umatic.nl> <49D238D7.1010301@la-kitchen.fr> Message-ID: <49D23C07.6040306@umatic.nl> Thanks. I know that it is inherent in the system, but is there a way to control the "fuzziness" of each iteration, so that the image loses its alpha value but retains the sharpness of it's outlines? D. cyrille henry wrote: > > > Derek Holzer a ?crit : >> which objects could be used to make this framebuffer? > gemframebuffer. > > here is the patch jack send recently on the list. > cyrille > >> d. >> >> cyrille henry wrote: >>> this was the old way to do (but still working fine). >>> i think it can be faster to render in a framebuffer, and use this >>> framebuffer as a texture to draw in a 2nd framebuffer. >>> and drawing back to the 1st. >>> etc. >>> there are also some example in the glsl section. >>> jack also send a simple exemple somwhere recently. >>> >>> ++ >>> c >>> >>> Derek Holzer a ?crit : >>>> Thanks much! [pix_snap2tex] is exactly the starting point I needed. >>>> >>>> D. >>>> >>>> cyrille henry wrote: >>>>> look at gem exemple 07.feedback in 07.texture directory >>>>> and also at "self similar" performance by Ben bogart (2004) : >>>>> http://www.ekran.org/ben/wp/?page_id=101 >>>>> >>>>> ++ >>>>> c >>>>> >>>>> Derek Holzer a ?crit : >>>>>> The other night I watched a very nice lecture from Paul Prudence >>>>>> (dataisnature.com). He uses VVVV to make audio-responsive video >>>>>> feedback, where a single shape (a square) is recursively >>>>>> displayed, causing very complex structures to arise. The relevant >>>>>> parts of the lecture are here: >>>>>> >>>>>> http://www.vimeo.com/2930699 >>>>>> http://www.vimeo.com/3003040 >>>>>> >>>>>> although I would encourage people to go through the whole thing >>>>>> (11 parts on Vimeo) if they have time + interest. >>>>>> >>>>>> I'd at a loss to think of how something similar, i.e. the >>>>>> recursive feedback, could be done in GEM or PDP. Any suggestions? >>>>>> >>>>>> best! >>>>>> Derek >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>> >> -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 48: "Discover your formulas and abandon them" From hans at eds.org Tue Mar 31 17:59:59 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 11:59:59 -0400 Subject: [PD] pd book sprint In-Reply-To: <20090331083412.GA5393@footils.org> References: <49D0D533.1000802@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300735g182e469cn479fcc16767e36da@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DA79.7010205@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300750o7df7de1k2ebf911d6dfd0139@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DEF8.1080605@goto10.org> <161a0b1e0903300910y2e73a46chdc4121bf2c1aea56@mail.gmail.com> <49D0F261.9080709@goto10.org> <161a0b1e0903300938q6db1a6fah69d98e478afdaf50@mail.gmail.com> <49D10952.4050907@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903301118j6f3f7385obe4c2b8bffe08350@mail.gmail.com> <20090331083412.GA5393@footils.org> Message-ID: <8DD93808-F0DD-4834-93E6-FB7374FFC07F@eds.org> On Mar 31, 2009, at 4:34 AM, Frank Barknecht wrote: > Hallo, > Alexandre Porres hat gesagt: // Alexandre Porres wrote: > >> you know, yeah, but the thing is that phasor is not actually an >> oscilator at >> all !!! >> the name actually refers to phase, and not sawtooth. > > And a [triangle~] may be used as a ping-pong looping [phasor~]. > > The objects Pd provides are building blocks - they generally are > designed on a > level that allows and encourages multiple uses. A square wave going > from 0 to 1 > can be used as a logical signal that switches another signal on and > off. In > fact, a trivial square or saw without bandlimit should generally not > be used as > an "oscillator" in the analog synth sense - it should be bandlimited > first, and > while you do that you may as well make them have a DC of 0. > (Bandlimiting > triangle waves is not *that* urgent, as corners don't add so many > alias > components.) I think the key to this discussion of -1 to 1 vs 0 to 1 is what people are most likely going to use them for, and what makes the most sense in that context. Of course, ideally, it wouldn't create arbitrary restrictions either. For example, Cyrille and I make basically everything 0 to 1 in the mapping library since it makes things really easy to do without sacrificing much flexibility. If you start with, or end up with different ranges, you can do the scaling math at the input or output ends of the patch, and keep everything in between 0 to 1. I think the two ranges for this discussion separate signals versus controls. A sawtooth~ is a signal that is meant to be listened to, so it would good from -1 to 1. A phasor~ is the exact same shape as a sawtooth~, but it is meant to be a control, so it is 0 to 1. You could easily switch the two with some basic math, but most of the time, you'll want your controls to be 0 to 1 and your signals -1 to 1. A similar pair would be square~ (signal) and pwm~ (control). .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Terrorism is not an enemy. It cannot be defeated. It's a tactic. It's about as sensible to say we declare war on night attacks and expect we're going to win that war. We're not going to win the war on terrorism. - retired U.S. Army general, William Odom From hans at eds.org Tue Mar 31 18:08:03 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 12:08:03 -0400 Subject: [PD] recursive video feedback in GEM or PDP? In-Reply-To: <49D23C07.6040306@umatic.nl> References: <49D22A7E.4030901@umatic.nl> <49D22E67.4040703@la-kitchen.fr> <49D233B8.5080307@umatic.nl> <49D23626.6020703@la-kitchen.fr> <49D236FF.5060706@umatic.nl> <49D238D7.1010301@la-kitchen.fr> <49D23C07.6040306@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <108E9EC4-3108-4509-A45B-2648906650D9@eds.org> There is a nice one included in pdmtl called gems.win.feedback .hc On Mar 31, 2009, at 11:51 AM, Derek Holzer wrote: > Thanks. I know that it is inherent in the system, but is there a way > to control the "fuzziness" of each iteration, so that the image > loses its alpha value but retains the sharpness of it's outlines? > > D. > > cyrille henry wrote: >> Derek Holzer a ?crit : >>> which objects could be used to make this framebuffer? >> gemframebuffer. >> here is the patch jack send recently on the list. >> cyrille >>> d. >>> >>> cyrille henry wrote: >>>> this was the old way to do (but still working fine). >>>> i think it can be faster to render in a framebuffer, and use this >>>> framebuffer as a texture to draw in a 2nd framebuffer. >>>> and drawing back to the 1st. >>>> etc. >>>> there are also some example in the glsl section. >>>> jack also send a simple exemple somwhere recently. >>>> >>>> ++ >>>> c >>>> >>>> Derek Holzer a ?crit : >>>>> Thanks much! [pix_snap2tex] is exactly the starting point I >>>>> needed. >>>>> >>>>> D. >>>>> >>>>> cyrille henry wrote: >>>>>> look at gem exemple 07.feedback in 07.texture directory >>>>>> and also at "self similar" performance by Ben bogart (2004) : >>>>>> http://www.ekran.org/ben/wp/?page_id=101 >>>>>> >>>>>> ++ >>>>>> c >>>>>> >>>>>> Derek Holzer a ?crit : >>>>>>> The other night I watched a very nice lecture from Paul >>>>>>> Prudence (dataisnature.com). He uses VVVV to make audio- >>>>>>> responsive video feedback, where a single shape (a square) is >>>>>>> recursively displayed, causing very complex structures to >>>>>>> arise. The relevant parts of the lecture are here: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> http://www.vimeo.com/2930699 >>>>>>> http://www.vimeo.com/3003040 >>>>>>> >>>>>>> although I would encourage people to go through the whole >>>>>>> thing (11 parts on Vimeo) if they have time + interest. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I'd at a loss to think of how something similar, i.e. the >>>>>>> recursive feedback, could be done in GEM or PDP. Any >>>>>>> suggestions? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> best! >>>>>>> Derek >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>> >>> > > -- > ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista > ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 48: > "Discover your formulas and abandon them" > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- If nature has made any one thing less susceptible than all others of exclusive property, it is the action of the thinking power called an idea, which an individual may exclusively possess as long as he keeps it to himself; but the moment it is divulged, it forces itself into the possession of everyone, and the receiver cannot dispossess himself of it. - Thomas Jefferson From philip.g.potter at gmail.com Tue Mar 31 18:08:07 2009 From: philip.g.potter at gmail.com (Philip Potter) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 17:08:07 +0100 Subject: [PD] Pdpedia and random generation In-Reply-To: <52bc3f2b0903310827p32a785b5jcb95c5228198c180@mail.gmail.com> References: <161a0b1e0903310459v1fdd1635s416fe523946ec8ca@mail.gmail.com> <52bc3f2b0903310827p32a785b5jcb95c5228198c180@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <91dd35300903310908p549aa166y6b99569a4c92d277@mail.gmail.com> 2009/3/31 olsen wolf : > the server space & the maintenance is currently done by claudio the > sys-admin at the school here in z?rich where the wiki is hostet atm. > so far he's been trying to maintain it as much as possible - sometimes > certain request take more time - queuing up on other things that need > to be done. but so far ev'rything should be on the line. recently > php-admin was installed for user management &?should be up & > functional. the spam issue we've discussed on the list & i got the > consensus to clean up the mess by hand. I don't know what you mean by "clean it up by hand" but if you just mean users deleting spam edits then this is not sustainable. The spam edits are automated and so they will win any editwar. To combat spam, we need something systematic: block the spam IPs, use MediaWiki Spam Blacklist, or require users to create an account before they can edit. The first solution could be implemented by creating more wiki admins with the power to block IPs. Obviously said people would need to be active and trusted. The other options require changing the mediawiki settings which can presumably only be done by the site admin. > So if there's any lack regarding the hosting or enhancements please > let me know &?i'll forward it. -- "I have always wished for my computer to be as easy to use as my telephone; my wish has come true because I can no longer figure out how to use my telephone." --Bjarne Stroustrup From grh at mur.at Tue Mar 31 18:20:22 2009 From: grh at mur.at (Georg Holzmann) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 18:20:22 +0200 Subject: [PD] Pdpedia and random generation In-Reply-To: <91dd35300903310908p549aa166y6b99569a4c92d277@mail.gmail.com> References: <161a0b1e0903310459v1fdd1635s416fe523946ec8ca@mail.gmail.com> <52bc3f2b0903310827p32a785b5jcb95c5228198c180@mail.gmail.com> <91dd35300903310908p549aa166y6b99569a4c92d277@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49D242C6.2040001@mur.at> Hallo! > I don't know what you mean by "clean it up by hand" but if you just > mean users deleting spam edits then this is not sustainable. The spam > edits are automated and so they will win any editwar. To combat spam, +1 > we need something systematic: block the spam IPs, use MediaWiki Spam > Blacklist, or require users to create an account before they can edit. Yes, or use at least captchas (if we don't want to force people to make an account) ... LG Georg From tesintesbat at gmail.com Tue Mar 31 18:30:29 2009 From: tesintesbat at gmail.com (t'es in t'es bat) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 18:30:29 +0200 Subject: [PD] recursive video feedback in GEM or PDP? In-Reply-To: <108E9EC4-3108-4509-A45B-2648906650D9@eds.org> References: <49D22A7E.4030901@umatic.nl> <49D22E67.4040703@la-kitchen.fr> <49D233B8.5080307@umatic.nl> <49D23626.6020703@la-kitchen.fr> <49D236FF.5060706@umatic.nl> <49D238D7.1010301@la-kitchen.fr> <49D23C07.6040306@umatic.nl> <108E9EC4-3108-4509-A45B-2648906650D9@eds.org> Message-ID: <4e20b9ab0903310930y3b67a19fgb452ab514e496365@mail.gmail.com> hello, and so is there a way to work with pdp only to do this ??? thx david -- TNTB t'es in t'es bat 7 place Favier 13210 St Remy de Provence T/: 04 90 26 95 09 P/: 06 86 86 12 19 +++++++++++++++++++++ http://www.tntb.net =============== ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From derek at umatic.nl Tue Mar 31 18:35:34 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 18:35:34 +0200 Subject: [PD] recursive video feedback in GEM or PDP? In-Reply-To: <4e20b9ab0903310930y3b67a19fgb452ab514e496365@mail.gmail.com> References: <49D22A7E.4030901@umatic.nl> <49D22E67.4040703@la-kitchen.fr> <49D233B8.5080307@umatic.nl> <49D23626.6020703@la-kitchen.fr> <49D236FF.5060706@umatic.nl> <49D238D7.1010301@la-kitchen.fr> <49D23C07.6040306@umatic.nl> <108E9EC4-3108-4509-A45B-2648906650D9@eds.org> <4e20b9ab0903310930y3b67a19fgb452ab514e496365@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49D24656.3080402@umatic.nl> http://www.yourmachines.org/tutorials/pdvideolan.html t'es in t'es bat wrote: > hello, > and so is there a way to work with pdp only to do this ??? > thx > david > > -- > TNTB > t'es in t'es bat > 7 place Favier > 13210 St Remy de Provence > T/: 04 90 26 95 09 > P/: 06 86 86 12 19 > +++++++++++++++++++++ > http://www.tntb.net > =============== > ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 60: "Don't be afraid of things because they're easy to do" From chris at mccormick.cx Tue Mar 31 19:22:51 2009 From: chris at mccormick.cx (Chris McCormick) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 18:22:51 +0100 Subject: [PD] [OT] Re: DIY GSoC: getting those projects done In-Reply-To: References: <475768.89279.qm@web65603.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> <20090328093208.GA24532@mccormick.cx> Message-ID: <20090331172251.GB14157@mccormick.cx> On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 11:28:40AM -0400, Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > On Sat, 28 Mar 2009, Chris McCormick wrote: > >> When I was thinking about writing a general purpose dataflow programming >> language which addresses some of Pd's shortcomings, I did a lot of thinking >> about the hot and cold inlet paradigm. What I came up with was the following [snip] >> conditions are met: >> * Every cold inlet has been pinged (receives data) >> * Any hot inlet has been pinged (receives data) >> * Inlets cache their last received data if no new data arrives. >> In Pd, DSP inlets act like the 'cold' inlets above > > Well, perhaps you should rename 'neutral' inlets to 'cold' and find > another name for what you call 'cold'. Even then, DSP inlets still don't > work like your 'cold' inlets because of how they combine together a > fan-in (several wires to one inlet) and because of how they handle a > non-connected inlet. Ah yes. In this hypothetical dataflow language in my head, whenever you try and fan cables either in or out, the patcher would automatically turn the fan into a sort of 'bus' of connections like Pd's [t] object. In other words, in this language it would not be possible to fan connections. A default behaviour for incoming fans would be to sum inputs (like DSP fans do now), but this would be easily configurable to 'replace' instead of 'add' as current message in-fanning does. Hmm, maybe I haven't thought that through enough. >> I like the idea of this behaviour being defined by the class author, but >> (re)configurable by the user. > > Then this would need a special 'run' method to be defined in t_class, > preferably outside of the normal method-list. At first thought I think > I'm in favour of reconfigurable inlets, but I'd like to see a > proof-of-concept first. I don't think all the features I'd like in a general purpose dataflow language can even be added to Pd without serious mangling. For a start I'd like the basic data types that all modern languages support like associative arrays, strings, etc. Then I'd like the DSP stuff not to be a special case, but rather a library you can import. Next I would like it if the graphs were represented by a data structure that doesn't suck (e.g. an associative array not a textfile) so that it would be possible to pass the network definition (e.g. the patch) itself through another network to dynamically create and modify patches. This new representation of a patch should be serialisable as JSON or similar so that it's easy to modify by hand and to parse, and to save to disk, or send across a network. JSON would be nice as it's supported by web frameworks, whcih means you could do super-cool stuff like websites which read/write/modify/run patches in your browser, or build patches that use a website to share data between multiple connected clients. Netpd would be really nice in this new language. Lastly, it should feature multi-processing out of the box. Not asking for much, am I? :) I've thought many times about starting to code this language, and have actually hesitantly started a couple of times, but very quickly I realise what a massive undertaking it is and stop. I have too much other work. I guess it would be possible to build the kernel of the lgnaguage with no GUI quite easily, but the hard bit would be the 'batteries included'. Chris. ------------------- http://mccormick.cx From chris at mccormick.cx Tue Mar 31 19:33:53 2009 From: chris at mccormick.cx (Chris McCormick) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 18:33:53 +0100 Subject: [PD] [OT] Re: DIY GSoC: getting those projects done In-Reply-To: <49D10304.1010602@goto10.org> References: <475768.89279.qm@web65603.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> <20090328093208.GA24532@mccormick.cx> <49D10304.1010602@goto10.org> Message-ID: <20090331173353.GC14157@mccormick.cx> On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 06:36:04PM +0100, Claude Heiland-Allen wrote: > Mathieu Bouchard wrote: >> At first thought I think I'm in favour of reconfigurable inlets, but >> I'd like to see a proof-of-concept first. > > IIRC the [lexpr] pdlua example has reconfigurable hot/cold inlets, but > that's implemented "by hand". > > Not sure I like the idea of a "run" method, what if there's more than > one reasonable run action? In Pd terms that means a different action is taken depending on the input, such as float, list, specific symbol, right? So in this hypothetical language the run method could written to do something different depending on the datatype or content of the incoming data, just like it is in Pd. Or maybe I missed your exact meaning? Chris. ------------------- http://mccormick.cx From porres at gmail.com Tue Mar 31 19:42:00 2009 From: porres at gmail.com (Alexandre Porres) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 14:42:00 -0300 Subject: [PD] Pdpedia and random generation In-Reply-To: References: <161a0b1e0903310459v1fdd1635s416fe523946ec8ca@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <161a0b1e0903311042s2c801a2ay7cb4a882e969bc15@mail.gmail.com> so we need :someone" to manage the system, ok, but then I see that this problem is kinda well solved, right? But how do you all see the writting of articles? Is it growing out well? I believe "someone" could also direct how things are going, and that a main team could work on it by fomenting its development and all... right? [] On Tue, Mar 31, 2009 at 9:46 AM, marius schebella < marius.schebella at gmail.com> wrote: > the "someone" would be in charge of the server space and the > maintainance of the mediawiki (accounts, updates, spam, search > functionality, synchronization with other documentations). this could > also be done by several people, but usually the responsibility is with > one person. all the rest can easily be done by a group of admins or > even be totally open to the public. > > I guess the work that is missing at the moment is not so much about > writing all the articles. > marius. > > 2009/3/31 Alexandre Porres : > > Hi, welll, so "someone" needs to take over? > > I would definately be interested on this. I do, nevertheless, feel I bit > > clueless as I dont know the way to the source of all objects. And cant > > really be an expert on things other than audio/music. > > I also consider rather unfair to be the work of only one ho has taken > over. > > I do believe in forming a team, things like that. > > Anyway, with the convention this year and all, I hope to bring this issue > > into round tables and discussions, make some noise on the list to see if > a > > small group would move a bit their asses to launch this out. > > I could kinda take it over this way. I could definately make the > commitment. > > But I cant be the one and only. I am not even a Native Speaker/Writer of > > English. > > So please help me out here, I also need a partner to guide me and help me > > not getting so bit clueless. > > Cheers > > Alex > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > -- Alexandre Torres Porres cel. (11)8179-6226 Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From marius.schebella at gmail.com Tue Mar 31 20:10:21 2009 From: marius.schebella at gmail.com (marius schebella) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 20:10:21 +0200 Subject: [PD] recursive video feedback in GEM or PDP? In-Reply-To: <49D24656.3080402@umatic.nl> References: <49D22A7E.4030901@umatic.nl> <49D22E67.4040703@la-kitchen.fr> <49D233B8.5080307@umatic.nl> <49D23626.6020703@la-kitchen.fr> <49D236FF.5060706@umatic.nl> <49D238D7.1010301@la-kitchen.fr> <49D23C07.6040306@umatic.nl> <108E9EC4-3108-4509-A45B-2648906650D9@eds.org> <4e20b9ab0903310930y3b67a19fgb452ab514e496365@mail.gmail.com> <49D24656.3080402@umatic.nl> Message-ID: here's a feedback filter that uses gemframebuffer, you can throw it into your gem render chain. marius. 2009/3/31 Derek Holzer : > http://www.yourmachines.org/tutorials/pdvideolan.html > > > t'es in t'es bat wrote: >> >> hello, >> and so is there a way to work with pdp only to do this ??? >> thx >> david >> >> -- >> TNTB >> t'es in t'es bat >> 7 place Favier >> 13210 St Remy de Provence >> T/: 04 90 26 95 09 >> P/: 06 86 86 12 19 >> +++++++++++++++++++++ >> http://www.tntb.net >> =============== >> ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > > -- > ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: > http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 60: > "Don't be afraid of things because they're easy to do" > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: feedback_filterXYZ.zip Type: application/zip Size: 2317 bytes Desc: not available URL: From fbar at footils.org Tue Mar 31 21:32:05 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 21:32:05 +0200 Subject: [PD] pd book sprint In-Reply-To: <8DD93808-F0DD-4834-93E6-FB7374FFC07F@eds.org> References: <49D0DA79.7010205@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300750o7df7de1k2ebf911d6dfd0139@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DEF8.1080605@goto10.org> <161a0b1e0903300910y2e73a46chdc4121bf2c1aea56@mail.gmail.com> <49D0F261.9080709@goto10.org> <161a0b1e0903300938q6db1a6fah69d98e478afdaf50@mail.gmail.com> <49D10952.4050907@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903301118j6f3f7385obe4c2b8bffe08350@mail.gmail.com> <20090331083412.GA5393@footils.org> <8DD93808-F0DD-4834-93E6-FB7374FFC07F@eds.org> Message-ID: <20090331193205.GA6842@footils.org> Hallo, Hans-Christoph Steiner hat gesagt: // Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > I think the key to this discussion of -1 to 1 vs 0 to 1 is what people > are most likely going to use them for, and what makes the most sense in > that context. Of course, ideally, it wouldn't create arbitrary > restrictions either. For example, Cyrille and I make basically > everything 0 to 1 in the mapping library since it makes things really > easy to do without sacrificing much flexibility. I think, that's very sensible. > I think the two ranges for this discussion separate signals versus > controls. A sawtooth~ is a signal that is meant to be listened to, so > it would good from -1 to 1. A phasor~ is the exact same shape as a > sawtooth~, but it is meant to be a control, so it is 0 to 1. You could > easily switch the two with some basic math, but most of the time, you'll > want your controls to be 0 to 1 and your signals -1 to 1. A similar > pair would be square~ (signal) and pwm~ (control). I'm with you here except maybe at the object names, but these are just taste-related and maybe educational/language differences - I don't necessarly think of square~ as signal and pwm~ as control (The nusmusk-pwm~ is a "signal", too) I'd just like to add that converting a "control signal" like the phasor~ to a "synth oscillator" takes more than just moving its center to 0, especially bandlimiting. OTOH a bandlimited saw or square generally is useless for control operations because it "wiggles" too much at the jump points. Anyway I've now read the Pd-FLOSS manual page at http://en.flossmanuals.net/PureData/SquarewavesAndLogic and found, that it just tries to explain some general mechanisms to generate square-ish signals from a phasor~. As the basic techniques are the same for "synth oscillators" and "control signals", I think keeping it in a range from 0-1 is sensible. Ciao -- Frank From mjmogo at gmail.com Tue Mar 31 21:55:03 2009 From: mjmogo at gmail.com (Mike McGonagle) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 14:55:03 -0500 Subject: [PD] Chicago Patching Circle (Sunday, March 29th 5pm) In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <370dda580903311255x720c0f02u75726d3adb7b8004@mail.gmail.com> Yes, thanks for coming out. I especially liked the Arduino/Sensor demo. I will have to talk with you, Kyle, about how to build one and where you got the parts. And Ben, it would be great to see some of the stuff you are working on, hopefully your moving out of the neighborhood won't deter that... Of course, we could do this again somewhere else. But the idea of hold a small workshop on writing externals would be a great idea. I would be more than happy to share what info I have. An idea for the next meeting. Which bring me to the next question. When is the next meeting? Would you like to try this once a month? More, Less? Thanks again, I would like to see this happen more often. Mike On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 11:12 AM, Kyle Klipowicz wrote: > Yeah it was fun to share some meat-space with fellow geeks. > We'll have to plan another one soon, and try to promote it a bit more. > ~Kyle > > On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 10:18 AM, Ben Baker-Smith > wrote: >> >> Thanks to Mike for organizing the Chicago meeting yesterday, and to >> Kyle for also showing up. >> >> It was good to connect with some other PD users here, and totally >> interesting to see what you've been working on / have worked on. ?Even >> (or especially) when it was over my head. >> >> I'd like to do it again some time, assuming that you both haven't >> gotten completely jaded and stopped using PD completely ;) >> I'll be sure to bring some of my own material. >> >> -Ben > > > > -- > ----- > ------------ > ? ?---- ? ? ----- > ---- -------- - ------ > http://perhapsidid.wordpress.com > http://myspace.com/kyleklipowicz > -- Rodney Dangerfield - "I haven't spoken to my wife in years. I didn't want to interrupt her." From matju at artengine.ca Tue Mar 31 22:29:32 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 16:29:32 -0400 (EDT) Subject: [PD] pd book sprint In-Reply-To: <8DD93808-F0DD-4834-93E6-FB7374FFC07F@eds.org> References: <49D0D533.1000802@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300735g182e469cn479fcc16767e36da@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DA79.7010205@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903300750o7df7de1k2ebf911d6dfd0139@mail.gmail.com> <49D0DEF8.1080605@goto10.org> <161a0b1e0903300910y2e73a46chdc4121bf2c1aea56@mail.gmail.com> <49D0F261.9080709@goto10.org> <161a0b1e0903300938q6db1a6fah69d98e478afdaf50@mail.gmail.com> <49D10952.4050907@umatic.nl> <161a0b1e0903301118j6f3f7385obe4c2b8bffe08350@mail.gmail.com> <20090331083412.GA5393@footils.org> <8DD93808-F0DD-4834-93E6-FB7374FFC07F@eds.org> Message-ID: On Tue, 31 Mar 2009, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > I think the two ranges for this discussion separate signals versus controls. > A sawtooth~ is a signal that is meant to be listened to, so it would good > from -1 to 1. A phasor~ is the exact same shape as a sawtooth~, but it is > meant to be a control, so it is 0 to 1. You could easily switch the two with > some basic math, but most of the time, you'll want your controls to be 0 to 1 > and your signals -1 to 1. A similar pair would be square~ (signal) and pwm~ > (control). Those words could be chosen differently. In Pd, signal means both of those things, as it's a single type of wire and a single type of data; and about control... I used to often see the phrase "control object" to mean "message-system object"... but I don't recall whether that was in Pd or in jMax. In any case I think it would be better to say that the 0-to-1 signal is intended as a "multiplicator" or "envelope" whereas the -1-to-1 signal is intended as a... non-multiplicator... or non-envelope... you may have better ideas for names. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From bbakersmith at gmail.com Tue Mar 31 23:05:32 2009 From: bbakersmith at gmail.com (Ben Baker-Smith) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 16:05:32 -0500 Subject: [PD] Chicago Patching Circle (Sunday, March 29th 5pm) In-Reply-To: <370dda580903311255x720c0f02u75726d3adb7b8004@mail.gmail.com> References: <370dda580903311255x720c0f02u75726d3adb7b8004@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Once a month sounds reasonable to me. That feels like enough time for us each to make some progress between meetings. I'm open to whatever though. Definitely interested in a workshop on writing externals. It's an area that I know very little about and feel like an in-person discussion would be a good boost. And I don't mind a bit of traveling, just so long as I can get there by public transportation. -Ben On Tue, Mar 31, 2009 at 2:55 PM, Mike McGonagle wrote: > Yes, thanks for coming out. I especially liked the Arduino/Sensor > demo. I will have to talk with you, Kyle, about how to build one and > where you got the parts. > > And Ben, it would be great to see some of the stuff you are working > on, hopefully your moving out of the neighborhood won't deter that... > Of course, we could do this again somewhere else. > > But the idea of hold a small workshop on writing externals would be a > great idea. I would be more than happy to share what info I have. An > idea for the next meeting. > > Which bring me to the next question. When is the next meeting? Would > you like to try this once a month? More, Less? > > Thanks again, I would like to see this happen more often. > > Mike > > > On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 11:12 AM, Kyle Klipowicz wrote: >> Yeah it was fun to share some meat-space with fellow geeks. >> We'll have to plan another one soon, and try to promote it a bit more. >> ~Kyle >> >> On Mon, Mar 30, 2009 at 10:18 AM, Ben Baker-Smith >> wrote: >>> >>> Thanks to Mike for organizing the Chicago meeting yesterday, and to >>> Kyle for also showing up. >>> >>> It was good to connect with some other PD users here, and totally >>> interesting to see what you've been working on / have worked on. ?Even >>> (or especially) when it was over my head. >>> >>> I'd like to do it again some time, assuming that you both haven't >>> gotten completely jaded and stopped using PD completely ;) >>> I'll be sure to bring some of my own material. >>> >>> -Ben >> >> >> >> -- >> ----- >> ------------ >> ? ?---- ? ? ----- >> ---- -------- - ------ >> http://perhapsidid.wordpress.com >> http://myspace.com/kyleklipowicz >> > > > > -- > > Rodney Dangerfield ?- "I haven't spoken to my wife in years. I didn't > want to interrupt her." > From philip.g.potter at gmail.com Tue Mar 31 23:09:07 2009 From: philip.g.potter at gmail.com (Philip Potter) Date: Tue, 31 Mar 2009 22:09:07 +0100 Subject: [PD] Pdpedia and random generation In-Reply-To: <161a0b1e0903311042s2c801a2ay7cb4a882e969bc15@mail.gmail.com> References: <161a0b1e0903310459v1fdd1635s416fe523946ec8ca@mail.gmail.com> <161a0b1e0903311042s2c801a2ay7cb4a882e969bc15@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <91dd35300903311409r7608a1cbw9a0d66e8b1075cb3@mail.gmail.com> 2009/3/31 Alexandre Porres : > so we need :someone" to manage the system, ok, but then I see that this > problem is kinda well solved, right? > But how do you all see the writting of articles? Is it growing out well? I > believe "someone" could also direct how things are going, and that a main > team could work on it by fomenting its development and all... > right? Something like a WikiProject on wikipedia? It would be good to have standards on how articles should be formatted and what kind of information should be presented. I see there has been some effort to generate a standard layout for an article on an object, with inlets, outlets, arguments and messages as separate sections; but I can't find a good article to serve as an example for how all articles should look. The best I can find is: http://wiki.puredata.info/en/dac~ http://wiki.puredata.info/en/metro If more articles looked like this, I think pdpedia would be much more useful. Do we want pdpedia to just be a reference manual of objects, or do we also want to include design patterns such as the [pack 0 0 0 0 0]/[unpack 0 0 0 0 0] idiom mentioned elsethread, tutorials, good practices and suchlike? Philip From hans at eds.org Tue Mar 10 18:09:29 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 17:09:29 -0000 Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903091945n56a19a93tcfea7c6dc17dd6e7@mail.gmail.com> References: <1A6ACCDE-8D0F-4094-B979-16919791C754@eds.org> <161320dd0903091945n56a19a93tcfea7c6dc17dd6e7@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <58A25F57-1CBA-4BB8-BFC4-43012B0C3F0C@eds.org> On Mar 9, 2009, at 10:45 PM, hard off wrote: > a very simple solution would be to use a subpatch instead of an > abstraction in the help files. > > > [pd output~] Yeah, some of them have a subpatch. > this would also remedy the problem reported more often: "why > doesn't the output~ object work when i copy the help files to my > desktop?" Having a abstraction in "extra" would also solve this problem. I think that we can make [ezdac~] better by adding the db numbox and mute function from Miller's [output~], and the green/white toggle from [pddp/dsp]. .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Programs should be written for people to read, and only incidentally for machines to execute. - from Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs From hans at eds.org Tue Mar 10 18:12:49 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 17:12:49 -0000 Subject: [PD] Pd on MIPS In-Reply-To: <49B66BE3.2040707@yahoo.it> References: <49B66BE3.2040707@yahoo.it> Message-ID: Do you mean ARM? Or really MIPS? There are packages for ARM embedded linux machines as part of the pd-anywhere project: http://sf.net/projects/pd-anywhere .hc On Mar 10, 2009, at 9:32 AM, mbutubuntu wrote: > hello everyone!! > I'm going to buy an embedded motherboard with a MIPS CPU, does someone > compiled and tested PureData on a similar architecture?? > > thanks > > Fabio Buda > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- There is no way to peace, peace is the way. -A.J. Muste From hans at eds.org Tue Mar 10 18:14:10 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 17:14:10 -0000 Subject: [PD] change for symbols In-Reply-To: <6D875E59-BE56-45FD-AFA4-25E782BFFDB1@rybn.org> References: <20090310070627.GB11213@fliwatut.scifi> <6D875E59-BE56-45FD-AFA4-25E782BFFDB1@rybn.org> Message-ID: <78663733-9446-442F-B4F0-29577BB9E72C@eds.org> Sounds handy, but it would be nice to have [change] directly support symbols... .hc On Mar 10, 2009, at 6:07 AM, Jack wrote: > Yep, simple and nice. > ++ > > Jack > > > Le 10 mars 09 ? 08:06, Frank Barknecht a ?crit : > >> Hallo, >> Max hat gesagt: // Max wrote: >> >>> is there something like [change] for symbols? >> >> [select] ? See attachment. >> >> Ciao >> -- >> Frank Barknecht Do You RjDj.me? _ >> ______footils.org__> change.pd>_______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/ >> listinfo/pd-list > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- All mankind is of one author, and is one volume; when one man dies, one chapter is not torn out of the book, but translated into a better language; and every chapter must be so translated.... -John Donne From timvets at gmail.com Tue Mar 10 19:10:30 2009 From: timvets at gmail.com (tim vets) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 18:10:30 -0000 Subject: [PD] change for symbols In-Reply-To: <78663733-9446-442F-B4F0-29577BB9E72C@eds.org> References: <20090310070627.GB11213@fliwatut.scifi> <6D875E59-BE56-45FD-AFA4-25E782BFFDB1@rybn.org> <78663733-9446-442F-B4F0-29577BB9E72C@eds.org> Message-ID: 2009/3/10 Hans-Christoph Steiner > > Sounds handy, but it would be nice to have [change] directly support > symbols... > > .hc > > > On Mar 10, 2009, at 6:07 AM, Jack wrote: > > Yep, simple and nice. >> ++ >> >> Jack >> >> >> Le 10 mars 09 ? 08:06, Frank Barknecht a ?crit : >> >> Hallo, >>> Max hat gesagt: // Max wrote: >>> >>> is there something like [change] for symbols? >>>> >>> >>> [select] ? See attachment. >>> >>> Ciao >>> -- Frank Barknecht Do You RjDj.me? _ >>> >> Hi, there's also [nchange] (maxlib) gr, Tim -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hans at eds.org Tue Mar 10 18:12:22 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 17:12:22 -0000 Subject: [PD] partconv optimization In-Reply-To: References: <47919.217.66.32.101.1236686308.squirrel@mail.musicologia.com> Message-ID: <9959A53F-1BFE-4AF2-9A43-E0FA8DEAD509@eds.org> I think the mac/fink builds of FFTW do use SSE2, since that is the minimum that a Mac/Intel has. I believe SSE2 is required to run Mac/ Intel. As for more optimizations, I would like to turn those on for the whole Pd-extended builds, but the strict-aliasing errors need to be fixed in order to do that. If you want to make this happen quicker, you could check the archives about the strict aliasing errors, and submit fixes to the patch tracker. .hc On Mar 10, 2009, at 8:36 AM, chris clepper wrote: > Ben tried to write an SSE version of the convolution routine, but > did not get a working one. As I recall the problem is that SSE > lacks a critical operation to make it efficient (or perhaps even > possible) to run as vector code. You can always just set the > compiler flags to the extreme levels and see if that helps. > > I wrote Altivec code for partconv~ a few years ago, and built a PPC > version with an optimized FFTW, but I don't know if that is what is > included with pd-extended or not. I guess if you can load it on > Intel machines it is running a more generic version. FFTW needs to > have at least an architecture, or ideally a CPU, specific build to > run well. > > > > On Tue, Mar 10, 2009 at 7:58 AM, Gregorio G. Karman > wrote: > hello, > > I would appreciate knowing if the build of partconv~ v0.2 included in > 0.40.3-extended-macosx104 is currently taking advantage of sse > optimization? > > thanks > > Gregorio > -- > Gregorio Garc?a Karman > Runzstra?e 71. > 79102 Freiburg - Germany > home: 0049 (0)761 2852 808 > office: 0049 (0)761 3808 276 > handy: 0049 (0)1515 3292 098 > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Man has survived hitherto because he was too ignorant to know how to realize his wishes. Now that he can realize them, he must either change them, or perish. -William Carlos Williams -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From adrian.goya at gmail.com Tue Mar 10 19:46:46 2009 From: adrian.goya at gmail.com (adrian goya) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 18:46:46 -0000 Subject: [PD] [GEM] pix_video, firewire, and linux ? Message-ID: <2b3b19680903101148p67a90a3cl9d27348fe2f347da@mail.gmail.com> Hello to all. I'm having problems trying to connect a unibrain's fire-i firewire board camera in GEM. When I send a [driver 1( message and then [device /dev/video1394/0( to pix_video i get : initializing: Inappropriate ioctl for device If I send [driver 0( message I get get capabilities: Inappropriate ioctl for device The camera works under coriander no problem. I use it with openFrameworks also. It doesn't work with dvgrab. http://www.unibrain.com/Products/Vision ? e_i_BC.htm A sony minidv firewire camera does work with pix_video however. Since my Debian system is a mess I downloaded pure:dyne's leek and potato to test the camera and had the same results. The miso version gave the same results. Does anyone have any idea how to fix this? I've searched the mail archives and every resource I could think of. I'm new to linux so maybe I'm missing some basic stuff. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Debian lenny/sid. Kernel 2.6.24 thankyou. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From stffn at dibidut.dk Tue Mar 10 19:47:57 2009 From: stffn at dibidut.dk (Steffen Juul) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 18:47:57 -0000 Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: <58A25F57-1CBA-4BB8-BFC4-43012B0C3F0C@eds.org> References: <1A6ACCDE-8D0F-4094-B979-16919791C754@eds.org> <161320dd0903091945n56a19a93tcfea7c6dc17dd6e7@mail.gmail.com> <58A25F57-1CBA-4BB8-BFC4-43012B0C3F0C@eds.org> Message-ID: <966A603E-9392-40E3-BE65-E29731616CE0@dibidut.dk> On 10/03/2009, at 18.11, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > (...) and the green/white toggle from [pddp/dsp]. I quite strongly think [cvn]'s tricks should be avoided in help patches, especially those default for vanilla objects. Reason being it took me quite some time before i got heads and tails of it. Before that, it was a total mystery. Such mysteries are bad for learning since it may well obstruct learning of basic things. There is enough syntax to get into when starting to learn Pd. From florian.m at coolux-us.com Tue Mar 10 21:15:12 2009 From: florian.m at coolux-us.com (florian mosleh) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 20:15:12 -0000 Subject: [PD] sprintf and netsend for comma delimited UDP data Message-ID: <49B6BCBC.3040101@coolux-us.com> Hello, I already posted this to the forum, so I hope it's no foible to post it here as well... I am building a connector for PD to communicate with an external application running on another system. I am using netsend to craft UDP packets that the remote application can parse for actions. The payload is supposed to look sort of like this: (STRING,STRING,INTEGER,INTEGER,STRING,INTEGER) Initially I was unable to get commas into the netsend stream because PD uses commas as in internal delimiter. I was able to circumvent this by using the cyclone external's 'sprintf' function. Like this: |44| | |send (STRING%cSTRING%cINTEGER%cINTEGER%cSTRING%cINTEGER) | | |netsend| this almost works, except that pd inserts whitespace characters after the commas, which the remote application doesn't understand. I noticed that 'print' actually puts a space before and after the commas, whereas netsend (or sprintf) only puts one after the commas. Does anyone know how to circumvent this behavior? Or, perhaps a simpler way to achieve what I am trying to do? Thank you. Florian -- :[ flo ]: There is something you must understand about the Soviet system. They have the ability to concentrate all their efforts on a given design, and develop all components simulateously, but sometimes without proper testing. Then they end up with a technological disaster like the Tu-144. In a technology race at the time, that aircraft was two months ahead of the Concorde. Four Tu-144s were built; two have crashed, and two are in museums. The Concorde has been flying safely for over 10 years. -- Victor Belenko, MiG-25 fighter pilot who defected in 1976 "Defense Electronics", Vol 20, No. 6, pg. 100 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hans at eds.org Tue Mar 10 23:24:57 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 22:24:57 -0000 Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: <966A603E-9392-40E3-BE65-E29731616CE0@dibidut.dk> References: <1A6ACCDE-8D0F-4094-B979-16919791C754@eds.org> <161320dd0903091945n56a19a93tcfea7c6dc17dd6e7@mail.gmail.com> <58A25F57-1CBA-4BB8-BFC4-43012B0C3F0C@eds.org> <966A603E-9392-40E3-BE65-E29731616CE0@dibidut.dk> Message-ID: <6AA70944-BE2B-4084-8C81-A934E53C1369@eds.org> On Mar 10, 2009, at 2:50 PM, Steffen Juul wrote: > > On 10/03/2009, at 18.11, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > >> (...) and the green/white toggle from [pddp/dsp]. > > > I quite strongly think [cvn]'s tricks should be avoided in help > patches, especially those default for vanilla objects. > > Reason being it took me quite some time before i got heads and tails > of it. Before that, it was a total mystery. Such mysteries are bad > for learning since it may well obstruct learning of basic things. > There is enough syntax to get into when starting to learn Pd. I agree that the patch should be conceptually simple, but usability is also a concern. Many newbies are hung up because they can't get the example patches to do anything. A lot of the time, that's because they haven't turned up the audio. If it is encapsulated in an object, then the complexity is hidden until you want to see it. Same idea with a osc~. The osc~ C code is far more complex. .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- kill your television From mbutubuntu at yahoo.it Tue Mar 10 19:35:26 2009 From: mbutubuntu at yahoo.it (mbutubuntu) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 18:35:26 -0000 Subject: [PD] Pd on MIPS In-Reply-To: References: <49B66BE3.2040707@yahoo.it> Message-ID: <49B6B29E.2040107@yahoo.it> I mean really MIPS, but does pd-anywhere support all pd externals??? If I need zexy may I be able to compile it and will zexy run on pd-anywhere??? Thanks Fabio Buda Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > Do you mean ARM? Or really MIPS? There are packages for ARM embedded > linux machines as part of the pd-anywhere project: > > http://sf.net/projects/pd-anywhere > > .hc > > On Mar 10, 2009, at 9:32 AM, mbutubuntu wrote: > >> hello everyone!! >> I'm going to buy an embedded motherboard with a MIPS CPU, does someone >> compiled and tested PureData on a similar architecture?? >> >> thanks >> >> Fabio Buda >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > There is no way to peace, peace is the way. -A.J. Muste > > > From maredmo at gmail.com Wed Mar 11 00:54:13 2009 From: maredmo at gmail.com (Mario Mora) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 23:54:13 -0000 Subject: [PD] [GEM] pix_video, firewire, and linux ? In-Reply-To: <2b3b19680903101148p67a90a3cl9d27348fe2f347da@mail.gmail.com> References: <2b3b19680903101148p67a90a3cl9d27348fe2f347da@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: pure:dyne never has worked with firewire for me, but i have used dyne:bolic with firewire with great results, but i have tested only audio, dyne:bolic has GEM and i have used flawessly but not tried capturing video by firewire yet. Maybe you can try using dyne:bolic and using the "modules" of pure:dyne for puredata and GEM so you can get a newer version than dyne:bolic has inside, that's the way i have used pd+gem in dybe:bolic with no problems so far 2009/3/10 adrian goya > Hello to all. > > I'm having problems trying to connect a unibrain's fire-i firewire board > camera in GEM. When I send a [driver 1( message and then [device > /dev/video1394/0( to pix_video i get : > > initializing: Inappropriate ioctl for device > > If I send [driver 0( message I get > > get capabilities: Inappropriate ioctl for device > > The camera works under coriander no problem. I use it with openFrameworks > also. It doesn't work with dvgrab. http://www.unibrain.com/Products/Vision > ? e_i_BC.htm > > A sony minidv firewire camera does work with pix_video however. > > Since my Debian system is a mess I downloaded pure:dyne's leek and potato > to test the camera and had the same results. The miso version gave the same > results. > > Does anyone have any idea how to fix this? I've searched the mail archives > and every resource I could think of. I'm new to linux so maybe I'm missing > some basic stuff. Any help would be greatly appreciated. > > Debian lenny/sid. Kernel 2.6.24 > > thankyou. > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 11 01:09:19 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 00:09:19 -0000 Subject: [PD] FFT and curve3d? Message-ID: Anyone know of a patch that maps an FFT over time to something like a curve3d in Gem? I remember a while back people posted something like that, but I can't find it. .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- All mankind is of one author, and is one volume; when one man dies, one chapter is not torn out of the book, but translated into a better language; and every chapter must be so translated.... -John Donne From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 11 01:14:49 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 00:14:49 -0000 Subject: [PD] xbee reading for Pd Message-ID: <8AB5CA65-97C8-492A-9670-E2FE63F1535F@eds.org> In case anyone wants to read data from an xbee in Pd, here's a pd that does it, converted from a Max patch: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: xbee_io_reader.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 15977 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- "[W]e have invented the technology to eliminate scarcity, but we are deliberately throwing it away to benefit those who profit from scarcity." -John Gilmore From claudiusmaximus at goto10.org Wed Mar 11 01:35:31 2009 From: claudiusmaximus at goto10.org (Claude Heiland-Allen) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 00:35:31 -0000 Subject: [PD] FFT and curve3d? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49B707D8.2010609@goto10.org> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > Anyone know of a patch that maps an FFT over time to something like a > curve3d in Gem? I remember a while back people posted something like > that, but I can't find it. > > .hc I just knocked the attached together, doesn't use curve3d though.. Claude -- http://claudiusmaximus.goto10.org -------------- next part -------------- An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: fft-curve-gem.pd URL: From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 11 04:42:45 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 03:42:45 -0000 Subject: [PD] FFT and curve3d? In-Reply-To: <49B707D8.2010609@goto10.org> References: <49B707D8.2010609@goto10.org> Message-ID: That's quite nice, you are quite the Gem master. I was thinking of a 3D view that incorporates time. That's where the curve3d comes in. .hc On Mar 10, 2009, at 8:37 PM, Claude Heiland-Allen wrote: > Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >> Anyone know of a patch that maps an FFT over time to something like >> a curve3d in Gem? I remember a while back people posted something >> like that, but I can't find it. >> .hc > > I just knocked the attached together, doesn't use curve3d though.. > > Claude > -- > http://claudiusmaximus.goto10.org > #N canvas 0 0 450 405 10; > #X obj 20 14 adc~; > #X obj 12 108 table \$0-window 1024; > #N canvas 0 0 450 300 \$0-make-window 0; > #X obj 31 18 loadbang; > #X obj 10 19 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 > -1; > #X obj 31 50 f 1024; > #X obj 31 80 until; > #X obj 30 104 f 0; > #X obj 77 101 + 1; > #X obj 77 121 mod 1024; > #X obj 30 156 / 512; > #X obj 30 177 * 3.14159; > #X obj 30 209 cos; > #X obj 30 230 * -0.5; > #X obj 30 256 + 0.5; > #X obj 29 279 tabwrite \$0-window; > #X obj 31 135 t f f; > #X connect 0 0 2 0; > #X connect 1 0 2 0; > #X connect 2 0 3 0; > #X connect 3 0 4 0; > #X connect 4 0 5 0; > #X connect 4 0 13 0; > #X connect 5 0 6 0; > #X connect 6 0 4 1; > #X connect 7 0 8 0; > #X connect 8 0 9 0; > #X connect 9 0 10 0; > #X connect 10 0 11 0; > #X connect 11 0 12 0; > #X connect 13 0 7 0; > #X connect 13 1 12 1; > #X restore 13 80 pd \$0-make-window; > #N canvas 0 238 450 300 \$0-fft-analysis 0; > #X obj 18 18 inlet~; > #X obj 86 121 block~ 1024 4 1; > #X obj 18 67 rfft~; > #X obj 18 98 *~; > #X obj 18 42 *~; > #X obj 45 98 *~; > #X obj 18 124 +~; > #X obj 17 177 sqrt~; > #X obj 65 43 tabreceive~ \$0-window; > #X obj 17 209 tabsend~ \$0-fft; > #X obj 18 151 /~ 1024; > #X connect 0 0 4 0; > #X connect 2 0 3 0; > #X connect 2 0 3 1; > #X connect 2 1 5 0; > #X connect 2 1 5 1; > #X connect 3 0 6 0; > #X connect 4 0 2 0; > #X connect 5 0 6 1; > #X connect 6 0 10 0; > #X connect 7 0 9 0; > #X connect 8 0 4 1; > #X connect 10 0 7 0; > #X restore 27 47 pd \$0-fft-analysis; > #X obj 12 128 table \$0-fft 256; > #X obj 26 234 gemwin; > #X obj 26 189 tgl 15 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1 1 > 1; > #X msg 52 191 create; > #X msg 55 211 destroy; > #X obj 192 27 gemhead; > #X obj 193 61 t a a a; > #X obj 182 90 GEMglEnd; > #X obj 238 89 GEMglBegin; > #X obj 295 62 GLdefine GL_LINES; > #X obj 295 32 loadbang; > #X obj 274 33 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 > -1; > #X obj 211 230 gemlist; > #X obj 212 144 f 256; > #X obj 211 170 until; > #X obj 210 194 t b b; > #X obj 295 192 + 1; > #X obj 212 118 t b b a; > #X obj 278 168 f 0; > #X obj 264 191 f; > #X obj 212 269 GEMglVertex2f; > #X obj 297 242 tabread \$0-fft; > #X obj 212 309 GEMglVertex2f; > #X obj 297 282 * -1; > #X obj 265 217 / 32; > #X obj 263 242 - 4; > #X connect 0 0 3 0; > #X connect 0 1 3 0; > #X connect 6 0 5 0; > #X connect 7 0 5 0; > #X connect 8 0 5 0; > #X connect 9 0 10 0; > #X connect 10 0 11 0; > #X connect 10 1 21 0; > #X connect 10 2 12 0; > #X connect 13 0 12 1; > #X connect 14 0 13 0; > #X connect 15 0 13 0; > #X connect 16 0 24 0; > #X connect 17 0 18 0; > #X connect 18 0 19 0; > #X connect 19 0 16 0; > #X connect 19 1 23 0; > #X connect 20 0 23 1; > #X connect 21 0 17 0; > #X connect 21 1 22 0; > #X connect 21 2 16 1; > #X connect 22 0 23 1; > #X connect 23 0 20 0; > #X connect 23 0 25 0; > #X connect 23 0 28 0; > #X connect 24 0 26 0; > #X connect 25 0 24 2; > #X connect 25 0 27 0; > #X connect 27 0 26 2; > #X connect 28 0 29 0; > #X connect 29 0 24 1; > #X connect 29 0 26 1; ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Programs should be written for people to read, and only incidentally for machines to execute. - from Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs From errordeveloper at gmail.com Wed Mar 11 07:31:19 2009 From: errordeveloper at gmail.com (errordeveloper at gmail.com) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 06:31:19 -0000 Subject: [PD] pdtoblender In-Reply-To: <487F1E51.5010608@mamalala.org> References: <487F1E51.5010608@mamalala.org> Message-ID: <20090311063232.GA19266@00110101.errordevlopment.0> hi me too .. i just started to study blender .. to get to interact with pd is a brilliant idea - i was thinking of 3d visual interfaces to some syhnths would be great! did you make any progerss with pd+blender since that post? i'm quite keen on python ..but seems like it's not very pyhtonie stuff that ..)))) cheers, please keep in touch! -- ilya .d On Thu, Jul 17, 2008 at 12:26:25PM +0200, patrice colet wrote: > Hi, > > I started to learn to use Blender for controlling it with puredata with OSC > protocol, > > I would have been glad to use gamelogic sockets instead but it's poorly > documented and OSC seems more useful in huge project implementations > > Welcome to any kind of comment > > instructions are into blend file > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From jaime.oliver2 at gmail.com Wed Mar 11 07:06:17 2009 From: jaime.oliver2 at gmail.com (Jaime Oliver) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 06:06:17 -0000 Subject: [PD] [GEM] pix_video, firewire, and linux ? In-Reply-To: References: <2b3b19680903101148p67a90a3cl9d27348fe2f347da@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <616283880903102308k1bdd6eb9k8391f897cf3eab52@mail.gmail.com> have you tried coriander? I know it is the way to make firewire cameras work in linux using libdc, but had no luck interfacing with gem. it is something I've putting off for a while, J On Tue, Mar 10, 2009 at 4:56 PM, Mario Mora wrote: > pure:dyne never has worked with firewire for me, but i have used dyne:bolic > with firewire with great results, but i have tested only audio, dyne:bolic > has GEM and i have used flawessly but not tried capturing video by firewire > yet. > Maybe you can try using dyne:bolic and using the "modules" of pure:dyne for > puredata and GEM so you can get a newer version than dyne:bolic has inside, > that's the way i have used pd+gem in dybe:bolic with no problems so far > > > 2009/3/10 adrian goya >> >> Hello to all. >> >> I'm having problems trying to connect a unibrain's fire-i firewire board >> camera in GEM. When I send a? ?[driver 1(? ? message and then? ?[device >> /dev/video1394/0(? ?to pix_video i get : >> >> initializing: Inappropriate ioctl for device >> >> If I send [driver 0(? ?message I get >> >> get capabilities: Inappropriate ioctl for device >> >> The camera works under coriander no problem. I use it with openFrameworks >> also. It doesn't work with dvgrab.? http://www.unibrain.com/Products/Vision >> ? e_i_BC.htm >> >> A sony minidv firewire camera does work with pix_video however. >> >> Since my Debian system is a mess I downloaded pure:dyne's leek and potato >> to test the camera and had the same results. The miso version gave the same >> results. >> >> Does anyone have any idea how to fix this? I've searched the mail archives >> and every resource I could think of. I'm new to linux so maybe I'm missing >> some basic stuff. Any help would be greatly appreciated. >> >> Debian lenny/sid. Kernel 2.6.24 >> >> thankyou. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > -- Jaime E Oliver LR joliverl at ucsd.edu www.realidadvisual.org/jaimeoliver www-crca.ucsd.edu/ www.realidadvisual.org 858 202 1522 9168 Regents Rd. Apt. G La Jolla, CA 92037 USA From stffn at dibidut.dk Wed Mar 11 08:45:43 2009 From: stffn at dibidut.dk (Steffen Juul) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 07:45:43 -0000 Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: <6AA70944-BE2B-4084-8C81-A934E53C1369@eds.org> References: <1A6ACCDE-8D0F-4094-B979-16919791C754@eds.org> <161320dd0903091945n56a19a93tcfea7c6dc17dd6e7@mail.gmail.com> <58A25F57-1CBA-4BB8-BFC4-43012B0C3F0C@eds.org> <966A603E-9392-40E3-BE65-E29731616CE0@dibidut.dk> <6AA70944-BE2B-4084-8C81-A934E53C1369@eds.org> Message-ID: <1FEFF775-4272-4562-8568-1EA0BBBD84AC@dibidut.dk> On 10/03/2009, at 23.27, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > (snip) Many newbies are hung up because they can't get the example > patches to do anything. A lot of the time, that's because they > haven't turned up the audio. So to be precis and to check if i understand you correct: It's the word "dB" that is confusing? - While maybe the word "Vol" or "Volume" might clear it. > If it is encapsulated in an object, then the complexity is hidden > until you want to see it. Same idea with a osc~. The osc~ C code > is far more complex. I don't think that's a fair analogy. I think it's quite clear, and i think most folk will have something like the same feeling, that what is "beneath" osc~ and other things you can type into a object-box such that an object is instantiated is by the syntax in a class of "hidden until I want to see it". Abstractions generate another class and so does subpatches. The to later are maybe in the same class to some. Then comes GOBified abstractions. Then GOBified abstactions that use [cvn] tricks to make a "funky" interface. The syntax of the last is way different from the first and different from the rest too in the way that the syntax is a "graphical design matter". GOP asb inherent syntax from the Pd it passes though, some i don't think that is conceptually that hard. Is this all blahblabbarbar? I agree it's getting hairy. From marius.schebella at gmail.com Wed Mar 11 09:25:39 2009 From: marius.schebella at gmail.com (marius schebella) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 08:25:39 -0000 Subject: [PD] FFT and curve3d? In-Reply-To: References: <49B707D8.2010609@goto10.org> Message-ID: <49B77609.50809@gmail.com> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > That's quite nice, you are quite the Gem master. I was thinking of a 3D > view that incorporates time. That's where the curve3d comes in. a quick hack here is to add some feedback (see attached). but I guess you want something more like this http://www.wakayama-u.ac.jp/~kawahara/PSSws/ (grab the videos) marius. > > .hc > > On Mar 10, 2009, at 8:37 PM, Claude Heiland-Allen wrote: > >> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >>> Anyone know of a patch that maps an FFT over time to something like a >>> curve3d in Gem? I remember a while back people posted something like >>> that, but I can't find it. >>> .hc >> >> I just knocked the attached together, doesn't use curve3d though.. >> >> Claude >> -- >> http://claudiusmaximus.goto10.org >> #N canvas 0 0 450 405 10; >> #X obj 20 14 adc~; >> #X obj 12 108 table \$0-window 1024; >> #N canvas 0 0 450 300 \$0-make-window 0; >> #X obj 31 18 loadbang; >> #X obj 10 19 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 >> -1; >> #X obj 31 50 f 1024; >> #X obj 31 80 until; >> #X obj 30 104 f 0; >> #X obj 77 101 + 1; >> #X obj 77 121 mod 1024; >> #X obj 30 156 / 512; >> #X obj 30 177 * 3.14159; >> #X obj 30 209 cos; >> #X obj 30 230 * -0.5; >> #X obj 30 256 + 0.5; >> #X obj 29 279 tabwrite \$0-window; >> #X obj 31 135 t f f; >> #X connect 0 0 2 0; >> #X connect 1 0 2 0; >> #X connect 2 0 3 0; >> #X connect 3 0 4 0; >> #X connect 4 0 5 0; >> #X connect 4 0 13 0; >> #X connect 5 0 6 0; >> #X connect 6 0 4 1; >> #X connect 7 0 8 0; >> #X connect 8 0 9 0; >> #X connect 9 0 10 0; >> #X connect 10 0 11 0; >> #X connect 11 0 12 0; >> #X connect 13 0 7 0; >> #X connect 13 1 12 1; >> #X restore 13 80 pd \$0-make-window; >> #N canvas 0 238 450 300 \$0-fft-analysis 0; >> #X obj 18 18 inlet~; >> #X obj 86 121 block~ 1024 4 1; >> #X obj 18 67 rfft~; >> #X obj 18 98 *~; >> #X obj 18 42 *~; >> #X obj 45 98 *~; >> #X obj 18 124 +~; >> #X obj 17 177 sqrt~; >> #X obj 65 43 tabreceive~ \$0-window; >> #X obj 17 209 tabsend~ \$0-fft; >> #X obj 18 151 /~ 1024; >> #X connect 0 0 4 0; >> #X connect 2 0 3 0; >> #X connect 2 0 3 1; >> #X connect 2 1 5 0; >> #X connect 2 1 5 1; >> #X connect 3 0 6 0; >> #X connect 4 0 2 0; >> #X connect 5 0 6 1; >> #X connect 6 0 10 0; >> #X connect 7 0 9 0; >> #X connect 8 0 4 1; >> #X connect 10 0 7 0; >> #X restore 27 47 pd \$0-fft-analysis; >> #X obj 12 128 table \$0-fft 256; >> #X obj 26 234 gemwin; >> #X obj 26 189 tgl 15 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1 1 >> 1; >> #X msg 52 191 create; >> #X msg 55 211 destroy; >> #X obj 192 27 gemhead; >> #X obj 193 61 t a a a; >> #X obj 182 90 GEMglEnd; >> #X obj 238 89 GEMglBegin; >> #X obj 295 62 GLdefine GL_LINES; >> #X obj 295 32 loadbang; >> #X obj 274 33 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 >> -1; >> #X obj 211 230 gemlist; >> #X obj 212 144 f 256; >> #X obj 211 170 until; >> #X obj 210 194 t b b; >> #X obj 295 192 + 1; >> #X obj 212 118 t b b a; >> #X obj 278 168 f 0; >> #X obj 264 191 f; >> #X obj 212 269 GEMglVertex2f; >> #X obj 297 242 tabread \$0-fft; >> #X obj 212 309 GEMglVertex2f; >> #X obj 297 282 * -1; >> #X obj 265 217 / 32; >> #X obj 263 242 - 4; >> #X connect 0 0 3 0; >> #X connect 0 1 3 0; >> #X connect 6 0 5 0; >> #X connect 7 0 5 0; >> #X connect 8 0 5 0; >> #X connect 9 0 10 0; >> #X connect 10 0 11 0; >> #X connect 10 1 21 0; >> #X connect 10 2 12 0; >> #X connect 13 0 12 1; >> #X connect 14 0 13 0; >> #X connect 15 0 13 0; >> #X connect 16 0 24 0; >> #X connect 17 0 18 0; >> #X connect 18 0 19 0; >> #X connect 19 0 16 0; >> #X connect 19 1 23 0; >> #X connect 20 0 23 1; >> #X connect 21 0 17 0; >> #X connect 21 1 22 0; >> #X connect 21 2 16 1; >> #X connect 22 0 23 1; >> #X connect 23 0 20 0; >> #X connect 23 0 25 0; >> #X connect 23 0 28 0; >> #X connect 24 0 26 0; >> #X connect 25 0 24 2; >> #X connect 25 0 27 0; >> #X connect 27 0 26 2; >> #X connect 28 0 29 0; >> #X connect 29 0 24 1; >> #X connect 29 0 26 1; > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > Programs should be written for people to read, and only incidentally for > machines to execute. > - from Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: fft-curve-gem.pd.zip Type: application/zip Size: 1963 bytes Desc: not available URL: From zmoelnig at iem.at Wed Mar 11 09:26:42 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 08:26:42 -0000 Subject: [PD] FFT and curve3d? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49B7764D.30809@iem.at> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > Anyone know of a patch that maps an FFT over time to something like a > curve3d in Gem? I remember a while back people posted something like > that, but I can't find it. [pix_sig2pix~] was originally created by gg to create waterfall diagrams in combination with [imageVert]. [pix_sig2pix~] has changed a bit since then which requires to use heavy overlapping in order to produce waterfall diagrams. iirc there was a thread about this a couple of years ago. fgas,drt IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From zmoelnig at iem.at Wed Mar 11 09:39:50 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 08:39:50 -0000 Subject: [PD] default [output~] in Pd-extended In-Reply-To: <966A603E-9392-40E3-BE65-E29731616CE0@dibidut.dk> References: <1A6ACCDE-8D0F-4094-B979-16919791C754@eds.org> <161320dd0903091945n56a19a93tcfea7c6dc17dd6e7@mail.gmail.com> <58A25F57-1CBA-4BB8-BFC4-43012B0C3F0C@eds.org> <966A603E-9392-40E3-BE65-E29731616CE0@dibidut.dk> Message-ID: <49B7795C.3010507@iem.at> Steffen Juul wrote: > > On 10/03/2009, at 18.11, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > >> (...) and the green/white toggle from [pddp/dsp]. > > > I quite strongly think [cvn]'s tricks should be avoided in help patches, > especially those default for vanilla objects. what are "[cnv]'s tricks"? setting their colour? i wouldn't call it a trick, as it is one of the few things you can actually do with a cnv. (a trick would probably be to set the send/receive labels at runtime; which really makes patches rather unreadably; another trick would be to move objects around to make GOPs be polymorphic; i agree that simple every-day objects should probably avoid such things; i still don't see any trick in setting the colour of a canvas or the value of a numberbox) > > Reason being it took me quite some time before i got heads and tails of > it. Before that, it was a total mystery. Such mysteries are bad for > learning since it may well obstruct learning of basic things. There is > enough syntax to get into when starting to learn Pd. but myteries unveiled are good for learning. so it boils down to in-line documentation of the mysteries used. fgmasdr IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From zmoelnig at iem.at Wed Mar 11 09:52:22 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 08:52:22 -0000 Subject: [PD] [GEM] pix_video, firewire, and linux ? In-Reply-To: <616283880903102308k1bdd6eb9k8391f897cf3eab52@mail.gmail.com> References: <2b3b19680903101148p67a90a3cl9d27348fe2f347da@mail.gmail.com> <616283880903102308k1bdd6eb9k8391f897cf3eab52@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49B77C50.2080104@iem.at> Jaime Oliver wrote: > have you tried coriander? > I know it is the way to make firewire cameras work in linux using > libdc, but had no luck interfacing with gem. it is something I've > putting off for a while, it seems like i don't have any device that properly works with coriander. however, from what i read, coriander can create a videoloopback device which can then be used by Gem as an ordinary "v4l" device. have you tried that? if it doesn't work, how does it fail? fgmadr IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr Wed Mar 11 09:55:40 2009 From: cyrille.henry at la-kitchen.fr (cyrille henry) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 08:55:40 -0000 Subject: [PD] FFT and curve3d? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49B77D13.8050609@la-kitchen.fr> curve3d will be to slow. here is mine, made with openGL primitive. like Claude one, but with a log for the frequency + a time filter for the curve to be better. i think the best would be to add some feedback effect to create a kind of 3d effect. c Hans-Christoph Steiner a ?crit : > > Anyone know of a patch that maps an FFT over time to something like a > curve3d in Gem? I remember a while back people posted something like > that, but I can't find it. > > .hc > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > All mankind is of one author, and is one volume; when one man dies, one > chapter is not torn out of the book, but translated into a better > language; and every chapter must be so translated.... -John Donne > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -------------- next part -------------- An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: gem_spectrum.pd URL: From jaime.oliver2 at gmail.com Wed Mar 11 10:00:15 2009 From: jaime.oliver2 at gmail.com (Jaime Oliver) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 09:00:15 -0000 Subject: [PD] [GEM] pix_video, firewire, and linux ? In-Reply-To: <49B77C50.2080104@iem.at> References: <2b3b19680903101148p67a90a3cl9d27348fe2f347da@mail.gmail.com> <616283880903102308k1bdd6eb9k8391f897cf3eab52@mail.gmail.com> <49B77C50.2080104@iem.at> Message-ID: <616283880903110202m69c93189g629c27dcbfeb30db@mail.gmail.com> Well, I'll send the details as soon as i get a hand of the computer where i use it. >From what I remember, I expected to find the device in /video0 and when I sent pix_video the dev /video0 I did't get an error message, but I did't get an image either. When I try /video1 however i get device doesn't exist or similar message. I should get back to you with more precise errors soon. J On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 1:54 AM, IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: > Jaime Oliver wrote: >> >> have you tried coriander? >> I know it is the way to make firewire cameras work in linux using >> libdc, but had no luck interfacing with gem. it is something I've >> putting off for a while, > > it seems like i don't have any device that properly works with coriander. > however, from what i read, coriander can create a videoloopback device which > can then be used by Gem as an ordinary "v4l" device. > > have you tried that? > if it doesn't work, how does it fail? > > fgmadr > IOhannes > -- Jaime E Oliver LR joliverl at ucsd.edu www.realidadvisual.org/jaimeoliver www-crca.ucsd.edu/ www.realidadvisual.org 858 202 1522 9168 Regents Rd. Apt. G La Jolla, CA 92037 USA From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 11 15:33:57 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 14:33:57 -0000 Subject: [PD] xbee reading for Pd In-Reply-To: <351100D2-7BCB-4958-954D-48DAC96AA45F@cs.tcd.ie> References: <8AB5CA65-97C8-492A-9670-E2FE63F1535F@eds.org> <351100D2-7BCB-4958-954D-48DAC96AA45F@cs.tcd.ie> Message-ID: Hey, If you are using xbees with arduinos, then you want this, then you can just use the Pduino [arduino] object to get the data from it. http://michaelclemow.com/?p=296 That patch was for getting data straight from the xbee without an arduino. I've never used an xbee, I was just helping some people get it working with Pd, so I can't really give any advice on how to use them. .hc On Mar 11, 2009, at 6:21 AM, nicholas ward wrote: > Hi Hans, > Excellent timing. I was just about to order some xbee shields for > arduinos. I was wondering what xbee hardware you went for? I know > very little about xbee but need to set up a network of 8 agents and > thought this could be the way to go. > If you had anymore details that would be great. > All the best > Nick > > > On 11 Mar 2009, at 00:17, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > >> >> In case anyone wants to read data from an xbee in Pd, here's a pd >> that does it, converted from a Max patch: >> >> >> >> .hc >> >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> "[W]e have invented the technology to eliminate scarcity, but we >> are deliberately throwing it away to benefit those who profit from >> scarcity." -John Gilmore >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > Nicholas Ward, Ph.D Student > Sonic Arts Research Centre > Queens University Belfast > Northern Ireland > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- All mankind is of one author, and is one volume; when one man dies, one chapter is not torn out of the book, but translated into a better language; and every chapter must be so translated.... -John Donne -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 11 15:47:19 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 14:47:19 -0000 Subject: [PD] FFT and curve3d? In-Reply-To: <49B77D13.8050609@la-kitchen.fr> References: <49B77D13.8050609@la-kitchen.fr> Message-ID: I was thinking more about the look of it, rather than the speed of it. Any of you mind if I turn these into Gem examples and commit them? .hc On Mar 11, 2009, at 4:57 AM, cyrille henry wrote: > curve3d will be to slow. > > here is mine, made with openGL primitive. > like Claude one, but with a log for the frequency + a time filter > for the curve to be better. > > i think the best would be to add some feedback effect to create a > kind of 3d effect. > > c > > > Hans-Christoph Steiner a ?crit : >> Anyone know of a patch that maps an FFT over time to something like >> a curve3d in Gem? I remember a while back people posted something >> like that, but I can't find it. >> .hc >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- All >> mankind is of one author, and is one volume; when one man dies, >> one chapter is not torn out of the book, but translated into a >> better language; and every chapter must be so translated.... -John >> Donne >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > #N canvas 830 500 450 300 10; > #N canvas 607 37 645 663 osc~ 0; > #X obj 12 133 pack~; > #X obj 14 7 inlet~; > #X text 269 6 change block size; > #X msg 77 379 0; > #X obj 47 403 f; > #X obj 63 428 + 1; > #X obj 17 379 t a b; > #X obj 16 245 gemhead; > #X text 72 7 audio input; > #X obj 13 29 rfft~; > #X obj 13 51 *~; > #X obj 53 53 *~; > #X obj 173 6 block~ 4096 4; > #X obj 12 75 /~ 4096; > #X obj 12 95 log~; > #X obj 12 114 *~ 0.05; > #X obj 12 152 list prepend 0; > #X obj 12 173 s \$0-fft; > #X obj 172 26 table \$0-fft 2048; > #X obj 172 46 table \$0-fft-lop 2048; > #X obj 401 13 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 > -1; > #X obj 401 31 t b b; > #X obj 400 71 until; > #X msg 401 52 2048; > #X msg 443 74 0; > #X obj 400 96 f; > #X obj 415 119 + 1; > #X obj 400 163 tabread \$0-fft; > #X obj 494 163 tabread \$0-fft-lop; > #X obj 400 213 +; > #X obj 400 256 tabwrite \$0-fft-lop; > #X obj 400 138 t f f f; > #X obj 424 7 bang~; > #X obj 400 235 / 8; > #X obj 495 187 * 7; > #X obj 77 494 tabread \$0-fft-lop; > #X obj 30 589 loadbang; > #X obj 47 451 t f f; > #X obj 98 591 l; > #X obj 22 224 tgl 15 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1 0 > 1; > #X obj 97 560 t l b; > #X obj 18 659 curve 2; > #X obj 46 519 pack f f f; > #X floatatom 36 296 5 0 0 0 - - -; > #X floatatom 78 297 5 0 0 0 - - -; > #X obj 17 334 t a b; > #X floatatom 72 250 5 0 0 0 - - -; > #X floatatom 114 251 5 0 0 0 - - -; > #X obj 17 358 repeat 2048; > #X obj 14 277 translateXYZ -4 0 0; > #X obj 47 471 log; > #X obj 17 314 scaleXYZ 1.04 6 0; > #X msg 30 611 res 2; > #X connect 0 0 16 0; > #X connect 1 0 9 0; > #X connect 3 0 4 0; > #X connect 4 0 5 0; > #X connect 4 0 37 0; > #X connect 5 0 4 1; > #X connect 6 0 41 0; > #X connect 6 1 4 0; > #X connect 7 0 49 0; > #X connect 9 0 10 0; > #X connect 9 0 10 1; > #X connect 9 1 11 0; > #X connect 9 1 11 1; > #X connect 10 0 13 0; > #X connect 11 0 13 0; > #X connect 13 0 14 0; > #X connect 14 0 15 0; > #X connect 15 0 0 0; > #X connect 16 0 17 0; > #X connect 20 0 21 0; > #X connect 21 0 23 0; > #X connect 21 1 24 0; > #X connect 22 0 25 0; > #X connect 23 0 22 0; > #X connect 24 0 25 1; > #X connect 25 0 26 0; > #X connect 25 0 31 0; > #X connect 26 0 25 1; > #X connect 27 0 29 0; > #X connect 28 0 34 0; > #X connect 29 0 33 0; > #X connect 31 0 27 0; > #X connect 31 1 28 0; > #X connect 31 2 30 1; > #X connect 32 0 21 0; > #X connect 33 0 30 0; > #X connect 34 0 29 1; > #X connect 35 0 42 1; > #X connect 36 0 52 0; > #X connect 37 0 50 0; > #X connect 37 1 35 0; > #X connect 38 0 41 2; > #X connect 39 0 7 0; > #X connect 40 0 38 1; > #X connect 40 1 38 0; > #X connect 42 0 40 0; > #X connect 42 0 41 1; > #X connect 43 0 51 1; > #X connect 44 0 51 2; > #X connect 45 0 48 0; > #X connect 45 1 3 0; > #X connect 46 0 49 1; > #X connect 47 0 49 2; > #X connect 48 0 6 0; > #X connect 49 0 51 0; > #X connect 50 0 42 0; > #X connect 51 0 45 0; > #X connect 52 0 41 0; > #X restore 138 152 pd osc~; > #X msg 301 135 reset \, create \, 1; > #X msg 307 157 0 \, destroy; > #X floatatom 137 50 5 0 0 0 - - -; > #X obj 301 179 gemwin 60; > #X msg 299 97 \; pd dsp 1 \;; > #X obj 153 120 osc~ 333; > #X obj 137 98 osc~ 3333; > #X obj 137 73 mtof; > #X floatatom 177 79 9 0 0 0 - - -; > #X obj 77 102 adc~; > #X connect 1 0 4 0; > #X connect 2 0 4 0; > #X connect 3 0 8 0; > #X connect 8 0 7 0; > #X connect 8 0 9 0; > #X connect 10 0 0 0; > #X connect 10 1 0 0; ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- There is no way to peace, peace is the way. -A.J. Muste From zmoelnig at iem.at Wed Mar 11 16:08:12 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 15:08:12 -0000 Subject: [PD] dynamic creation arguments for route In-Reply-To: <80ace1a10903110745y5b412b21nad266e33850132f0@mail.gmail.com> References: <80ace1a10903110745y5b412b21nad266e33850132f0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49B7D464.50709@iem.at> Rory Walsh wrote: > Is is possible to dynamically alter the creation arguments for a route > object? no. (i general it is not possible to dynamically alter the creation arguments of any object :-)) > I'm currently building a patch that receives OSC messages > which I want to parse using route. Each relevant message I would like > to grab starts with a unique integer ID. I would like to pass this > unique ID to my route object each time the ID changes so that I can > retrieve the data which follows it. Any ideas? you can build abstractions that behave almost like settable routes. you can also desing your application differently. mfgasdr IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: froute.pd URL: -------------- next part -------------- An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: sroute.pd URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From martin.peach at sympatico.ca Tue Mar 10 23:55:55 2009 From: martin.peach at sympatico.ca (Martin Peach) Date: Tue, 10 Mar 2009 22:55:55 -0000 Subject: [PD] sprintf and netsend for comma delimited UDP data In-Reply-To: <49B6BCBC.3040101@coolux-us.com> References: <49B6BCBC.3040101@coolux-us.com> Message-ID: florian mosleh wrote: > Hello, > > I already posted this to the forum, so I hope it's no foible to post > it here as well... > > I am building a connector for PD to communicate with an external > application running on another system. I am using netsend to craft UDP > packets that the remote application can parse for actions. The payload > is supposed to look sort of like this: > (STRING,STRING,INTEGER,INTEGER,STRING,INTEGER) > > Initially I was unable to get commas into the netsend stream because PD > uses commas as in internal delimiter. I was able to circumvent this by > using the cyclone external's 'sprintf' function. Like this: > > |44| > | > |send (STRING%cSTRING%cINTEGER%cINTEGER%cSTRING%cINTEGER) | > | > |netsend| > > this almost works, except that pd inserts whitespace characters after > the commas, which the remote application doesn't understand. > > I noticed that 'print' actually puts a space before and after the > commas, whereas netsend (or sprintf) only puts one after the commas. > > Does anyone know how to circumvent this behavior? Or, perhaps a simpler > way to achieve what I am trying to do? > If you're using pd-extended you could use [any2string] to convert to lists of (ASCII) floats and [udpsend] to send the list of floats. Also the [str] object might work as a way to convert symbols into lists of ASCII characters. Martin From zmoelnig at iem.at Wed Mar 11 09:22:35 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 08:22:35 -0000 Subject: [PD] Pd on MIPS In-Reply-To: <49B6B29E.2040107@yahoo.it> References: <49B66BE3.2040707@yahoo.it> <49B6B29E.2040107@yahoo.it> Message-ID: <49B77556.7010001@iem.at> mbutubuntu wrote: > I mean really MIPS, but does pd-anywhere support all pd externals??? If > I need zexy may I be able to compile it and will zexy run on pd-anywhere??? > i'm pretty sure it won't (esp. the signal objects). however, it would be nice to have zexy support PDa; so if somebody feels like doing it, i will happily integrate it. fgamr IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From martin.peach at sympatico.ca Wed Mar 11 16:08:24 2009 From: martin.peach at sympatico.ca (Martin Peach) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 15:08:24 -0000 Subject: [PD] dynamic creation arguments for route In-Reply-To: <80ace1a10903110745y5b412b21nad266e33850132f0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Rory Walsh wrote: >Is is possible to dynamically alter the creation arguments for a route >object? I'm currently building a patch that receives OSC messages >which I want to parse using route. Each relevant message I would like >to grab starts with a unique integer ID. I would like to pass this >unique ID to my route object each time the ID changes so that I can >retrieve the data which follows it. Any ideas? > [mrpeach/routeOSC] can do that. Martin From mbutubuntu at yahoo.it Wed Mar 11 16:38:54 2009 From: mbutubuntu at yahoo.it (mbutubuntu) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 15:38:54 -0000 Subject: [PD] Pd on MIPS In-Reply-To: <49B77556.7010001@iem.at> References: <49B66BE3.2040707@yahoo.it> <49B6B29E.2040107@yahoo.it> <49B77556.7010001@iem.at> Message-ID: <49B7DB79.8050409@yahoo.it> IOhannes, the MIPS doesn't have an FPU but the linux kernel will emulate it... I think Pd should works also with ~ objects... doesn't it? IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: > mbutubuntu wrote: >> I mean really MIPS, but does pd-anywhere support all pd externals??? >> If I need zexy may I be able to compile it and will zexy run on >> pd-anywhere??? >> > > i'm pretty sure it won't (esp. the signal objects). > however, it would be nice to have zexy support PDa; so if somebody > feels like doing it, i will happily integrate it. > > fgamr > IOhannes From bbakersmith at gmail.com Wed Mar 11 16:56:43 2009 From: bbakersmith at gmail.com (Ben Baker-Smith) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 15:56:43 -0000 Subject: [PD] GEM on Linux netbook Message-ID: I currently use a Macbook (OS 10.5) for all my PD patching. However, as I am primarily focused on using GEM for live video performance alongside musical groups, I am thinking about getting a second laptop for performances (to keep my Macbook safe). I'm thinking of getting an Acer Aspire One netbook running linux. I'd like to know the pros and cons of this. -Will swapping patches between Mac OS and Linux be a problem (I'm guessing no, but I figured I'd ask)? -I've heard of some problems with VGA out on Linux laptops, is this going to be an issue? -Does the netbook have enough processing power for general GEM applications? I'm usually not dealing with video files, but rather particle generation, shape manipulation, GIF texturing, and audio-response. On my Macbook (2.0 GHz intel processor) the CPU meter always shows below 50% usage (of course, that's not to say that it doesn't freeze up and boot me out sometimes). -Are there any other issues that you think of given this scenario? and if so, what other affordable/really-cheap laptops are there out there that I can run linux on? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From adrian.goya at gmail.com Wed Mar 11 17:43:02 2009 From: adrian.goya at gmail.com (adrian goya) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 16:43:02 -0000 Subject: [PD] [GEM] pix_video, firewire, and linux ? In-Reply-To: <616283880903110202m69c93189g629c27dcbfeb30db@mail.gmail.com> References: <2b3b19680903101148p67a90a3cl9d27348fe2f347da@mail.gmail.com> <616283880903102308k1bdd6eb9k8391f897cf3eab52@mail.gmail.com> <49B77C50.2080104@iem.at> <616283880903110202m69c93189g629c27dcbfeb30db@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <2b3b19680903110945i920caaemc1a4eb01d21b904d@mail.gmail.com> The coriander approach sounds like a great idea, this camera works no problem under it and you get total control over its functions. It would be out of my league to try to make that work myself, but I can help with testing if that's of any use. adrian. On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 3:02 AM, Jaime Oliver wrote: > Well, I'll send the details as soon as i get a hand of the computer > where i use it. > > From what I remember, I expected to find the device in /video0 and > when I sent pix_video the dev /video0 I did't get an error message, > but I did't get an image either. When I try /video1 however i get > device doesn't exist or similar message. > > I should get back to you with more precise errors soon. > > J > > On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 1:54 AM, IOhannes m zmoelnig > wrote: > > Jaime Oliver wrote: > >> > >> have you tried coriander? > >> I know it is the way to make firewire cameras work in linux using > >> libdc, but had no luck interfacing with gem. it is something I've > >> putting off for a while, > > > > it seems like i don't have any device that properly works with coriander. > > however, from what i read, coriander can create a videoloopback device > which > > can then be used by Gem as an ordinary "v4l" device. > > > > have you tried that? > > if it doesn't work, how does it fail? > > > > fgmadr > > IOhannes > > > > > > -- > Jaime E Oliver LR > > joliverl at ucsd.edu > www.realidadvisual.org/jaimeoliver > www-crca.ucsd.edu/ > www.realidadvisual.org > > 858 202 1522 > 9168 Regents Rd. Apt. G > La Jolla, CA 92037 > USA > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 11 17:44:37 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 16:44:37 -0000 Subject: [PD] Pd on MIPS In-Reply-To: <49B7DB79.8050409@yahoo.it> References: <49B66BE3.2040707@yahoo.it> <49B6B29E.2040107@yahoo.it> <49B77556.7010001@iem.at> <49B7DB79.8050409@yahoo.it> Message-ID: <4C67DB97-ABA7-4F32-A3D6-9DBCBCB31E83@eds.org> What kind of MIPS is this? Like an old SGI? If so, that should run Linux and Pd with no special tricks. .hc On Mar 11, 2009, at 11:40 AM, mbutubuntu wrote: > IOhannes, the MIPS doesn't have an FPU but the linux kernel will > emulate it... I think Pd should works also with ~ objects... doesn't > it? > > IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: >> mbutubuntu wrote: >>> I mean really MIPS, but does pd-anywhere support all pd >>> externals??? If I need zexy may I be able to compile it and will >>> zexy run on pd-anywhere??? >>> >> >> i'm pretty sure it won't (esp. the signal objects). >> however, it would be nice to have zexy support PDa; so if somebody >> feels like doing it, i will happily integrate it. >> >> fgamr >> IOhannes > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Looking at things from a more basic level, you can come up with a more direct solution... It may sound small in theory, but it in practice, it can change entire economies. - Amy Smith From jaime.oliver2 at gmail.com Wed Mar 11 17:46:00 2009 From: jaime.oliver2 at gmail.com (Jaime Oliver) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 16:46:00 -0000 Subject: [PD] [GEM] pix_video, firewire, and linux ? In-Reply-To: <2b3b19680903110945i920caaemc1a4eb01d21b904d@mail.gmail.com> References: <2b3b19680903101148p67a90a3cl9d27348fe2f347da@mail.gmail.com> <616283880903102308k1bdd6eb9k8391f897cf3eab52@mail.gmail.com> <49B77C50.2080104@iem.at> <616283880903110202m69c93189g629c27dcbfeb30db@mail.gmail.com> <2b3b19680903110945i920caaemc1a4eb01d21b904d@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <616283880903110948g6d8f9862id476b6559d9a3a64@mail.gmail.com> do you have coriander working? from what i remember it wasn't that hard to compile or get the libraries. On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 9:45 AM, adrian goya wrote: > The coriander approach sounds like a great idea, this camera works no > problem under it and you get total control over its functions. > It would be out of? my league to try to make that work myself, but I can > help with testing if that's of any use. > > adrian. > > On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 3:02 AM, Jaime Oliver > wrote: >> >> Well, I'll send the details as soon as i get a hand of the computer >> where i use it. >> >> From what I remember, I expected to find the device in /video0 and >> when I sent pix_video the dev /video0 I did't get an error message, >> but I did't get an image either. When I try /video1 however i get >> device doesn't exist or similar message. >> >> I should get back to you with more precise errors soon. >> >> J >> >> On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 1:54 AM, IOhannes m zmoelnig >> wrote: >> > Jaime Oliver wrote: >> >> >> >> have you tried coriander? >> >> I know it is the way to make firewire cameras work in linux using >> >> libdc, but had no luck interfacing with gem. it is something I've >> >> putting off for a while, >> > >> > it seems like i don't have any device that properly works with >> > coriander. >> > however, from what i read, coriander can create a videoloopback device >> > which >> > can then be used by Gem as an ordinary "v4l" device. >> > >> > have you tried that? >> > if it doesn't work, how does it fail? >> > >> > fgmadr >> > IOhannes >> > >> >> >> >> -- >> Jaime E Oliver LR >> >> joliverl at ucsd.edu >> www.realidadvisual.org/jaimeoliver >> www-crca.ucsd.edu/ >> www.realidadvisual.org >> >> 858 202 1522 >> 9168 Regents Rd. Apt. G >> La Jolla, CA 92037 >> USA >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > -- Jaime E Oliver LR joliverl at ucsd.edu www.realidadvisual.org/jaimeoliver www-crca.ucsd.edu/ www.realidadvisual.org 858 202 1522 9168 Regents Rd. Apt. G La Jolla, CA 92037 USA From zmoelnig at iem.at Wed Mar 11 17:53:17 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 16:53:17 -0000 Subject: [PD] Pd on MIPS In-Reply-To: <49B7DB79.8050409@yahoo.it> References: <49B66BE3.2040707@yahoo.it> <49B6B29E.2040107@yahoo.it> <49B77556.7010001@iem.at> <49B7DB79.8050409@yahoo.it> Message-ID: <49B7ED07.7080906@iem.at> mbutubuntu wrote: > IOhannes, the MIPS doesn't have an FPU but the linux kernel will emulate > it... I think Pd should works also with ~ objects... doesn't it? yes of course; and there is no reason why zexy should not work with that. however for PDanywhere (which i know that you are not using), zexy would have to be adapted, and i would like to have these changes (preferably without too much work) fgamsdr IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From adrian.goya at gmail.com Wed Mar 11 17:59:21 2009 From: adrian.goya at gmail.com (adrian goya) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 16:59:21 -0000 Subject: [PD] [GEM] pix_video, firewire, and linux ? In-Reply-To: <616283880903110948g6d8f9862id476b6559d9a3a64@mail.gmail.com> References: <2b3b19680903101148p67a90a3cl9d27348fe2f347da@mail.gmail.com> <616283880903102308k1bdd6eb9k8391f897cf3eab52@mail.gmail.com> <49B77C50.2080104@iem.at> <616283880903110202m69c93189g629c27dcbfeb30db@mail.gmail.com> <2b3b19680903110945i920caaemc1a4eb01d21b904d@mail.gmail.com> <616283880903110948g6d8f9862id476b6559d9a3a64@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <2b3b19680903111001j130b40f4k613d28f350c8d1c3@mail.gmail.com> I have coriander in the debian machine, I configured that computer about 8 months ago, left it in an expo and only got it back this week, so details about how I got it working are gone from my memory. However, in pure:dyne's leek&potato livecd a basic apt-get install coriander will get it working. On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 10:48 AM, Jaime Oliver wrote: > do you have coriander working? > from what i remember it wasn't that hard to compile or get the libraries. > > On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 9:45 AM, adrian goya > wrote: > > The coriander approach sounds like a great idea, this camera works no > > problem under it and you get total control over its functions. > > It would be out of my league to try to make that work myself, but I can > > help with testing if that's of any use. > > > > adrian. > > > > On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 3:02 AM, Jaime Oliver > > wrote: > >> > >> Well, I'll send the details as soon as i get a hand of the computer > >> where i use it. > >> > >> From what I remember, I expected to find the device in /video0 and > >> when I sent pix_video the dev /video0 I did't get an error message, > >> but I did't get an image either. When I try /video1 however i get > >> device doesn't exist or similar message. > >> > >> I should get back to you with more precise errors soon. > >> > >> J > >> > >> On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 1:54 AM, IOhannes m zmoelnig > >> wrote: > >> > Jaime Oliver wrote: > >> >> > >> >> have you tried coriander? > >> >> I know it is the way to make firewire cameras work in linux using > >> >> libdc, but had no luck interfacing with gem. it is something I've > >> >> putting off for a while, > >> > > >> > it seems like i don't have any device that properly works with > >> > coriander. > >> > however, from what i read, coriander can create a videoloopback device > >> > which > >> > can then be used by Gem as an ordinary "v4l" device. > >> > > >> > have you tried that? > >> > if it doesn't work, how does it fail? > >> > > >> > fgmadr > >> > IOhannes > >> > > >> > >> > >> > >> -- > >> Jaime E Oliver LR > >> > >> joliverl at ucsd.edu > >> www.realidadvisual.org/jaimeoliver > >> www-crca.ucsd.edu/ > >> www.realidadvisual.org > >> > >> 858 202 1522 > >> 9168 Regents Rd. Apt. G > >> La Jolla, CA 92037 > >> USA > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > > > > -- > Jaime E Oliver LR > > joliverl at ucsd.edu > www.realidadvisual.org/jaimeoliver > www-crca.ucsd.edu/ > www.realidadvisual.org > > 858 202 1522 > 9168 Regents Rd. Apt. G > La Jolla, CA 92037 > USA > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From derek at umatic.nl Wed Mar 11 18:53:04 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 17:53:04 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching Message-ID: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> Would like to show some examples of dynamic and self-modifying Pd patches during a workshop here in Berlin. I know there are some in the archives (and maybe on people's HDs) somewhere, but damned if I can find them. Links to previkous posts or new examples welcome! best! Derek -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 163: "Turn it upside down" From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 11 19:46:13 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 18:46:13 -0000 Subject: [PD] [PD-announce] Hack Yer iPod! in Liverpool, March 12th thru 17th Message-ID: <7F2A6B66-FF7F-4DCE-87DF-FCCAC9D9AF1F@eds.org> Hey, come join me in Liverpool at FACT and hack your iPod! It starts tomorrow, its pretty last minute, we have dates, but the times aren't ironed out yet. Where: http://fact.co.uk/ in Liverpool, England When: March 12th thru 17th (check the website for times) Have an iPod you want to repurpose into a hackable music machine? Install iPodLinux and make music with Pd! Want to play Doom on your iPod Video? Come install Rockbox! Did your trusty iPod?s battery finally die, or disk give in? Come and break open your iPod, either the software, the hardware or both. Give it new life and new purpose. Also, we have on hand our stash of old iPods for harvesting parts, and the newfound skills for frankensteining dead iPods into living ones. Join Hans-Christoph Steiner and Chris ?the Widget? DiMauro with your own iPod, or try your hand to see if you can create a living one from our pile. This workshop is a place to get exposed to the possibilities. We?ve been hacking on some iPods to see what?s possible. Lots of this software is kind of raw, but you can do lots of fun stuff now. We are just getting started, we are having fun exploring the options. Now we want to help you do the same. Check out our web page to see if your devices are supported: http://dev.eyebeam.org/projects/reware/wiki/FactWorkshop .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Access to computers should be unlimited and total. - the hacker ethic _______________________________________________ Pd-announce mailing list Pd-announce at iem.at http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-announce From algoritmia at labormedia.cl Wed Mar 11 20:02:22 2009 From: algoritmia at labormedia.cl (Correa Diego) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 19:02:22 -0000 Subject: [PD] [PD-announce] Hack Yer iPod! in Liverpool, March 12th thru 17th In-Reply-To: <7F2A6B66-FF7F-4DCE-87DF-FCCAC9D9AF1F@eds.org> References: <7F2A6B66-FF7F-4DCE-87DF-FCCAC9D9AF1F@eds.org> Message-ID: <6c92874b0903111204w731de382n49babc184b795860@mail.gmail.com> Pens? que le pod?a interesar a tu gente. saludos, Diego 2009/3/11 Hans-Christoph Steiner > > Hey, come join me in Liverpool at FACT and hack your iPod! It starts > tomorrow, its pretty last minute, we have dates, but the times aren't ironed > out yet. > > Where: http://fact.co.uk/ in Liverpool, England > When: March 12th thru 17th (check the website for times) > > Have an iPod you want to repurpose into a hackable music machine? Install > iPodLinux and make music with Pd! Want to play Doom on your iPod Video? Come > install Rockbox! Did your trusty iPod?s battery finally die, or disk give > in? Come and break open your iPod, either the software, the hardware or > both. Give it new life and new purpose. Also, we have on hand our stash of > old iPods for harvesting parts, and the newfound skills for frankensteining > dead iPods into living ones. Join Hans-Christoph Steiner and Chris ?the > Widget? DiMauro with your own iPod, or try your hand to see if you can > create a living one from our pile. > > This workshop is a place to get exposed to the possibilities. We?ve been > hacking on some iPods to see what?s possible. Lots of this software is kind > of raw, but you can do lots of fun stuff now. We are just getting started, > we are having fun exploring the options. Now we want to help you do the > same. > > Check out our web page to see if your devices are supported: > http://dev.eyebeam.org/projects/reware/wiki/FactWorkshop > > .hc > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Access to computers should be unlimited and total. - the hacker ethic > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-announce mailing list > Pd-announce at iem.at > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-announce > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From arifd86 at gmail.com Wed Mar 11 20:17:24 2009 From: arifd86 at gmail.com (Arif Driessen) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 19:17:24 -0000 Subject: [PD] [PD-announce] Hack Yer iPod! in Liverpool, March 12th thru 17th In-Reply-To: <7F2A6B66-FF7F-4DCE-87DF-FCCAC9D9AF1F@eds.org> References: <7F2A6B66-FF7F-4DCE-87DF-FCCAC9D9AF1F@eds.org> Message-ID: Oh Hans! Why weren't we told sooner!! Train tickets will be ?80 by now. In slightly more positive news, I noticed 'Arduino Hackday' on the 23rd of May! On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 6:47 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > Hey, come join me in Liverpool at FACT and hack your iPod! It starts > tomorrow, its pretty last minute, we have dates, but the times aren't ironed > out yet. > > Where: http://fact.co.uk/ in Liverpool, England > When: March 12th thru 17th (check the website for times) > > Have an iPod you want to repurpose into a hackable music machine? Install > iPodLinux and make music with Pd! Want to play Doom on your iPod Video? Come > install Rockbox! Did your trusty iPod?s battery finally die, or disk give > in? Come and break open your iPod, either the software, the hardware or > both. Give it new life and new purpose. Also, we have on hand our stash of > old iPods for harvesting parts, and the newfound skills for frankensteining > dead iPods into living ones. Join Hans-Christoph Steiner and Chris ?the > Widget? DiMauro with your own iPod, or try your hand to see if you can > create a living one from our pile. > > This workshop is a place to get exposed to the possibilities. We?ve been > hacking on some iPods to see what?s possible. Lots of this software is kind > of raw, but you can do lots of fun stuff now. We are just getting started, > we are having fun exploring the options. Now we want to help you do the > same. > > Check out our web page to see if your devices are supported: > http://dev.eyebeam.org/projects/reware/wiki/FactWorkshop > > .hc > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Access to computers should be unlimited and total. - the hacker ethic > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-announce mailing list > Pd-announce at iem.at > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-announce > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ Pd-announce mailing list Pd-announce at iem.at http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-announce From algoritmia at labormedia.cl Wed Mar 11 20:02:44 2009 From: algoritmia at labormedia.cl (Correa Diego) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 19:02:44 -0000 Subject: [PD] [PD-announce] Hack Yer iPod! in Liverpool, March 12th thru 17th In-Reply-To: <7F2A6B66-FF7F-4DCE-87DF-FCCAC9D9AF1F@eds.org> References: <7F2A6B66-FF7F-4DCE-87DF-FCCAC9D9AF1F@eds.org> Message-ID: <6c92874b0903111204l770ef292j30d11511ce24bca@mail.gmail.com> Pens? que le pod?a interesar a tu gente. saludos, Diego 2009/3/11 Hans-Christoph Steiner > > Hey, come join me in Liverpool at FACT and hack your iPod! It starts > tomorrow, its pretty last minute, we have dates, but the times aren't ironed > out yet. > > Where: http://fact.co.uk/ in Liverpool, England > When: March 12th thru 17th (check the website for times) > > Have an iPod you want to repurpose into a hackable music machine? Install > iPodLinux and make music with Pd! Want to play Doom on your iPod Video? Come > install Rockbox! Did your trusty iPod?s battery finally die, or disk give > in? Come and break open your iPod, either the software, the hardware or > both. Give it new life and new purpose. Also, we have on hand our stash of > old iPods for harvesting parts, and the newfound skills for frankensteining > dead iPods into living ones. Join Hans-Christoph Steiner and Chris ?the > Widget? DiMauro with your own iPod, or try your hand to see if you can > create a living one from our pile. > > This workshop is a place to get exposed to the possibilities. We?ve been > hacking on some iPods to see what?s possible. Lots of this software is kind > of raw, but you can do lots of fun stuff now. We are just getting started, > we are having fun exploring the options. Now we want to help you do the > same. > > Check out our web page to see if your devices are supported: > http://dev.eyebeam.org/projects/reware/wiki/FactWorkshop > > .hc > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Access to computers should be unlimited and total. - the hacker ethic > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-announce mailing list > Pd-announce at iem.at > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-announce > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pkstone at ucdavis.edu Wed Mar 11 20:25:21 2009 From: pkstone at ucdavis.edu (Phil Stone) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 19:25:21 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> Hi Derek, Maybe a very simple example would be good. I have an Ozone MIDI-controller, and it has eight knobs, which send out continuous controller data on 8 different MIDI CC numbers. Now, [ctlin] (MIDI control input) doesn't have settable arguments -- only creation args., so I racked my brains trying to figure out how to make an object that would take a knob number argument, 1-8, convert that number to the corresponding controller number, and watch that controller number with [ctlin]. (Admittedly, it would have been easy to create [Ozknob1]...[Ozknob8] objects, but this reeked of kludge to my sensibilities; neither did I consider it elegant to use a [ctlin] for each knob that watched *all* controller data, then [route]d the data from the desired control number -- I wanted the pre-filtering to be done by [ctlin], if possible). The more generalized problem is this: take a creation argument of an abstraction, *do something with it*, then get it into the creation argument of a contained abstraction. Nothing I tried worked, until I took the attached dynamic approach. Phil Stone www.pkstonemusic.com Derek Holzer wrote: > Would like to show some examples of dynamic and self-modifying Pd > patches during a workshop here in Berlin. I know there are some in the > archives (and maybe on people's HDs) somewhere, but damned if I can > find them. Links to previkous posts or new examples welcome! > > best! > Derek > -------------- next part -------------- An embedded and charset-unspecified text was scrubbed... Name: OzKnob.pd URL: From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 11 21:01:09 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 20:01:09 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> Message-ID: polypoly and nqpoly4 are good examples. nqpoly4 is in Pd-extended, you can get polypoly here: http://itp.nyu.edu/dataflow/uploads/polypoly.zip .hc On Mar 11, 2009, at 3:27 PM, Phil Stone wrote: > Hi Derek, > > Maybe a very simple example would be good. I have an Ozone MIDI- > controller, and it has eight knobs, which send out continuous > controller data on 8 different MIDI CC numbers. Now, [ctlin] (MIDI > control input) doesn't have settable arguments -- only creation > args., so I racked my brains trying to figure out how to make an > object that would take a knob number argument, 1-8, convert that > number to the corresponding controller number, and watch that > controller number with [ctlin]. > > (Admittedly, it would have been easy to create [Ozknob1]...[Ozknob8] > objects, but this reeked of kludge to my sensibilities; neither did > I consider it elegant to use a [ctlin] for each knob that watched > *all* controller data, then [route]d the data from the desired > control number -- I wanted the pre-filtering to be done by [ctlin], > if possible). > > The more generalized problem is this: take a creation argument of an > abstraction, *do something with it*, then get it into the creation > argument of a contained abstraction. > > Nothing I tried worked, until I took the attached dynamic approach. > > > Phil Stone > www.pkstonemusic.com > > > > Derek Holzer wrote: >> Would like to show some examples of dynamic and self-modifying Pd >> patches during a workshop here in Berlin. I know there are some in >> the archives (and maybe on people's HDs) somewhere, but damned if I >> can find them. Links to previkous posts or new examples welcome! >> >> best! >> Derek >> > > #N canvas 676 96 394 341 10; > #X obj 8 105 21; > #X obj 34 105 22; > #X obj 60 105 23; > #X obj 86 105 24; > #X obj 112 105 25; > #X obj 138 105 26; > #X obj 164 105 27; > #X obj 189 105 28; > #X obj 37 74 select 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8; > #X obj 37 51 f \$1; > #X obj 37 6 loadbang; > #X obj 103 304 outlet; > #X text 8 149 Ozone mapping; > #X msg 237 93 2; > #X text 267 91 channel; > #X obj 37 28 t b b; > #X obj 102 158 pack f f; > #X text 110 16 Use: [OzKnob n] where n is the knob #; > #N canvas 0 22 210 111 \$0-oz_ctrlknob 0; > #X obj 28 72 outlet; > #X restore 103 272 pd \$0-oz_ctrlknob; > #X obj 102 218 s pd-\$0-oz_ctrlknob; > #X msg 102 187 obj 10 10 ctlin \$1 \$2 \, connect 1 0 0 0; > #X connect 0 0 16 0; > #X connect 1 0 16 0; > #X connect 2 0 16 0; > #X connect 3 0 16 0; > #X connect 4 0 16 0; > #X connect 5 0 16 0; > #X connect 6 0 16 0; > #X connect 7 0 16 0; > #X connect 8 0 0 0; > #X connect 8 1 1 0; > #X connect 8 2 2 0; > #X connect 8 3 3 0; > #X connect 8 4 4 0; > #X connect 8 5 5 0; > #X connect 8 6 6 0; > #X connect 8 7 7 0; > #X connect 9 0 8 0; > #X connect 10 0 15 0; > #X connect 13 0 16 1; > #X connect 15 0 9 0; > #X connect 15 1 13 0; > #X connect 16 0 20 0; > #X connect 18 0 11 0; > #X connect 20 0 19 0; > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- You can't steal a gift. Bird gave the world his music, and if you can hear it, you can have it. - Dizzy Gillespie From fbar at footils.org Wed Mar 11 21:21:47 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 20:21:47 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> Message-ID: <20090311202608.GB4913@footils.org> Hallo, Hans-Christoph Steiner hat gesagt: // Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > polypoly and nqpoly4 are good examples. nqpoly4 is in Pd-extended, you > can get polypoly here: > > http://itp.nyu.edu/dataflow/uploads/polypoly.zip Isn't polypoly also in pd-extended? Anyway the reference location is the pd subversion in: /trunk/abstractions/footils/foo/ Ciao -- Frank From lukexipd at gmail.com Wed Mar 11 23:19:35 2009 From: lukexipd at gmail.com (Luke Iannini) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 22:19:35 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <7aaf8bb90903111521r6308fe84y76951a48b0f8594b@mail.gmail.com> On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 10:55 AM, Derek Holzer wrote: > Would like to show some examples of dynamic and self-modifying Pd patches > during a workshop here in Berlin. I know there are some in the archives (and > maybe on people's HDs) somewhere, but damned if I can find them. Links to > previkous posts or new examples welcome! Here are a few I've done: [hotpack] (in sfruit/ in pd-extended) dynamically builds a [pack] object along with enough [t b a] objects to make every inlet hot. [deeprouteOSC] (ditto) creates a chain of [routeOSC] objects so you can route something like /synth/filter/cutoff instead of making 3 objects. [troute] (ditto) is a settable [route] object, where you can pass a list to its rightmost inlet to change what its routing. [nsend/nreceive] (in nsend/ in pd-extended) gangs sends together, for when you want to send the output of a multi-output object elsewhere (e.g. [nsend 3 $0.notein] creates an nsend with 3 inlets, and [nreceive 3 $0.notein] creates a corresponding nreceive). [hotpack] and [deeprouteOSC] are probably the best balance of complexity vs. utility. Best Luke > > best! > Derek > > -- > ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: > http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 163: > "Turn it upside down" > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 11 20:59:57 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 19:59:57 -0000 Subject: [PD] [PD-announce] Hack Yer iPod! in Liverpool, March 12th thru 17th In-Reply-To: References: <7F2A6B66-FF7F-4DCE-87DF-FCCAC9D9AF1F@eds.org> Message-ID: <33B17D80-F77E-4E6C-9935-250F790A4EB7@eds.org> Sorry, its been a little chaotic on my end these past weeks. Maybe they have last minute specials on trains, or rideshares with people with cards. .hc On Mar 11, 2009, at 3:19 PM, Arif Driessen wrote: > Oh Hans! Why weren't we told sooner!! > > Train tickets will be ?80 by now. > > In slightly more positive news, I noticed 'Arduino Hackday' on the > 23rd of May! > > On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 6:47 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner > wrote: > > Hey, come join me in Liverpool at FACT and hack your iPod! It > starts tomorrow, its pretty last minute, we have dates, but the > times aren't ironed out yet. > > Where: http://fact.co.uk/ in Liverpool, England > When: March 12th thru 17th (check the website for times) > > Have an iPod you want to repurpose into a hackable music machine? > Install iPodLinux and make music with Pd! Want to play Doom on your > iPod Video? Come install Rockbox! Did your trusty iPod?s battery > finally die, or disk give in? Come and break open your iPod, either > the software, the hardware or both. Give it new life and new > purpose. Also, we have on hand our stash of old iPods for harvesting > parts, and the newfound skills for frankensteining dead iPods into > living ones. Join Hans-Christoph Steiner and Chris ?the Widget? > DiMauro with your own iPod, or try your hand to see if you can > create a living one from our pile. > > This workshop is a place to get exposed to the possibilities. We?ve > been hacking on some iPods to see what?s possible. Lots of this > software is kind of raw, but you can do lots of fun stuff now. We > are just getting started, we are having fun exploring the options. > Now we want to help you do the same. > > Check out our web page to see if your devices are supported: > http://dev.eyebeam.org/projects/reware/wiki/FactWorkshop > > .hc > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Access to computers should be unlimited and total. - the hacker ethic > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-announce mailing list > Pd-announce at iem.at > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-announce > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-announce mailing list > Pd-announce at iem.at > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-announce > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- As we enjoy great advantages from inventions of others, we should be glad of an opportunity to serve others by any invention of ours; and this we should do freely and generously. - Benjamin Franklin -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From potaxpotax at gmail.com Thu Mar 12 01:41:26 2009 From: potaxpotax at gmail.com (potax flan) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 00:41:26 -0000 Subject: [PD] *weird* characters Message-ID: hi using [textfile], i want to concatenate long strings of *unusual* characters (like the "triangle" or Delta character you get by pressing ALT, caps, d). maybe there is an alternative to [textfile]? Is there a way to handle these characters in pd (have them in a message, then add them to textfile would be wonderful)? if i press ALT caps d while editing a message i get an error rectangle ? is it because the font in pd cant deal with the ? sign? can i use ascii codes for this? key gives me 8710 for delta, any way i can use that? thanks -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From matju at artengine.ca Thu Mar 12 01:37:08 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 00:37:08 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <7aaf8bb90903111521r6308fe84y76951a48b0f8594b@mail.gmail.com> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <7aaf8bb90903111521r6308fe84y76951a48b0f8594b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 10:55 AM, Derek Holzer wrote: > Would like to show some examples of dynamic and self-modifying Pd patches > during a workshop here in Berlin. I know there are some in the archives (and > maybe on people's HDs) somewhere, but damned if I can find them. Links to > previous posts or new examples welcome! [#in] and [#out] in GridFlow >= 0.9.2. But make sure to pick the latest, as 0.9.2 was quite buggy. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From jack at rybn.org Thu Mar 12 01:58:34 2009 From: jack at rybn.org (Jack) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 00:58:34 -0000 Subject: [PD] [PD-announce] Exhibition in IMAL (Bruxelles/Brussels) Message-ID: Hello list, Our next exhibition at Imal (Bruxelles/Brussels). If you are interested by the subject, you are welcome (and all is made with Pd/GEM). ++ Jack [Fran?ais / English ] Stock Overflow : Recontextualising the Crisis 12 - 31 / 03/ 2009 Exposition & Conf?rences / Exhibition & Conferences Vernissage ce Jeudi 12 ? 18h00 avec conf?rences de Geert Lovink et Florian Schneider d?s 19h00 Opening on Thursday 12, 18:00 with Geert Lovink and Florian Schneider's lectures at 19:00 Stock Overflow est une op?ration propos?e par RYBN pour recontextualiser la crise et les strat?gies politiques et m?diatiques qui l'accompagnent, autour des th?mes de la catastrophe, de l'instabilit? structurelle et des mythologies des march?s. Stock Overflow is an operation proposed by RYBN to recontextualize the crisis, its mediatic and politic strategies, on the topics of disaster, structural instability and financial markets mythologies. WITH / AVEC RYBN, Geert Lovink (net activist and theoretician), Florian Schneider (writer, filmmaker, net activist), Brian Holmes (art critic), Late S. Horace Lawson-Hetchely (information systems consulting), Soci?t? R?aliste (artists), Bertrand Charles (journalist specialized in business intelligence). *EXHIBITION* / *EXPOSITION* ANTIDATAMINING, RYBN 2006-2009 http://www.antidatamining.net Antidatamining est une s?rie de repr?sentations visuelles des donn?es financi?res qui transitent sur internet. L'?conomie contemporaine y est incarn?e par ses principaux acteurs - entreprises, place boursi?res, banques et fonds d'investissement, grands groupes - et par leurs interactions : liens capitalistiques entre les acteurs ?conomiques, d?ploiements g?ographiques, articulation autour des places de march?s. Au-del? de la crise actuelle, de sa m?diatisation et des leviers politiques qu'elle g?n?re, Antidatamining est un dispositif de veille permanente qui tente de mettre en ?vidence la structure de l'?conomie mondiale, envisag?e comme un syst?me dynamique complexe. Antidatamining is a series of visualizations of financial data extracted from the web. Economy is represented by its main agents - companies, groups and holdings, stock exchanges, banks and investment funds - and their interactions : capital relationships, geographic deployments, structuralization on market places. Beyond the current crisis, its mediatic and polictic levers, Antidatamining is a permanent monitoring device, which aims to highlight the structure of the contemporary economy, seen as a complex dynamic system. *CONFERENCES* GEERT LOVINK & FLORIAN SCHNEIDER Net activism and tactical medias / M?dias tactiques et net-activisme Thursday 12 march - 19h / jeudi 12 mars - 19:00 (in english) RYBN & HORACE LATE LAWSON Financial Information systems / Syst?mes d'informations financiers Friday 20 march - 20h / vendredi 20 mars - 20:00 BRIAN HOLMES Ecological domination of financial capitalism / Domination ?cologique du capitalisme financier Wednesday 25 march - 19h / mercredi 25 mars - 19:00 SOCIETE REALISTE & BERTRAND CHARLES Economics subversion / D?tournement ?conomique Friday 27 march - 20h / vendredi 27 mars - 20:00 **** conferences streaming on **** * http://giss.tv:8000/iMAL_live.ogg * http://giss.tv/interface/?mp=iMAL_live.ogg *INFO* Opening Hours: Wednesday -> Sunday 14:00 - 19:00 Heures d'ouverture: Mercredi -> Dimanche 14:00 - 19:0 Vernissage Expo: jeudi 12 mars - 18:00 / Exhibition Opening: Thursday 12 march - 18:00 FEES/TARIFS : EXHIBITION/EXPOSITION 3?, CONFERENCES free/gratuit Avec le soutien de / With the support of : iMAL, Cimatics and Predict-market.biz leader in the field of financial prediction analysis. More on/ Plus d'infos sur: http://www.imal.org/StockOverflow -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- _______________________________________________ Pd-announce mailing list Pd-announce at iem.at http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-announce From koray.tahiroglu at tkk.fi Thu Mar 12 08:12:09 2009 From: koray.tahiroglu at tkk.fi (Koray Tahiroglu) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 07:12:09 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <19940_1236798424_ZZ0KGC000FCVRPH6.00_mailman.21.1236798143.705.pd-list@iem.at> References: <19940_1236798424_ZZ0KGC000FCVRPH6.00_mailman.21.1236798143.705.pd-list@iem.at> Message-ID: <0E6AD449-648F-4D50-A807-1C5DB27C5D31@tkk.fi> Hello Derek, enclosed there is OSC multicast dynamic patching example I did during eNTERFACE 07 workshop for our bio-music performance, if you find it useful, you can show it during your workshop. Koray, On Mar 11, 2009, at 9:02 PM, pd-list-request at iem.at wrote: > Message: 3 > Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 18:55:21 +0100 > From: Derek Holzer > Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching > To: pd-list at iem.at > Message-ID: <49B7FB09.4060704 at umatic.nl> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > > Would like to show some examples of dynamic and self-modifying Pd > patches during a workshop here in Berlin. I know there are some in the > archives (and maybe on people's HDs) somewhere, but damned if I can > find > them. Links to previkous posts or new examples welcome! > > best! > Derek > > -- > ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: > http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 163: > "Turn it upside down" ------------------------------------- M.Koray Tahiroglu Acoustics Lab / TKK http://www.acoustics.hut.fi/~ktahirog/ tel: +358 45 233 6272 -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: OSC_multicast.zip Type: application/zip Size: 3662 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From abonnements at revolwear.com Thu Mar 12 08:59:03 2009 From: abonnements at revolwear.com (Max) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 07:59:03 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> Message-ID: <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> the midi controller example is a good one i believe. here is what i did a while ago http://www.netpd.org/Midilearn Am 12.03.2009 um 03:27 schrieb Phil Stone: > Hi Derek, > > Maybe a very simple example would be good. I have an Ozone MIDI- > controller, and it has eight knobs, which send out continuous > controller data on 8 different MIDI CC numbers. Now, [ctlin] (MIDI > control input) doesn't have settable arguments -- only creation > args., so I racked my brains trying to figure out how to make an > object that would take a knob number argument, 1-8, convert that > number to the corresponding controller number, and watch that > controller number with [ctlin]. > > (Admittedly, it would have been easy to create [Ozknob1]...[Ozknob8] > objects, but this reeked of kludge to my sensibilities; neither did > I consider it elegant to use a [ctlin] for each knob that watched > *all* controller data, then [route]d the data from the desired > control number -- I wanted the pre-filtering to be done by [ctlin], > if possible). > > The more generalized problem is this: take a creation argument of an > abstraction, *do something with it*, then get it into the creation > argument of a contained abstraction. > > Nothing I tried worked, until I took the attached dynamic approach. > > > Phil Stone > www.pkstonemusic.com > > > > Derek Holzer wrote: >> Would like to show some examples of dynamic and self-modifying Pd >> patches during a workshop here in Berlin. I know there are some in >> the archives (and maybe on people's HDs) somewhere, but damned if I >> can find them. Links to previkous posts or new examples welcome! >> >> best! >> Derek >> > > #N canvas 676 96 394 341 10; > #X obj 8 105 21; > #X obj 34 105 22; > #X obj 60 105 23; > #X obj 86 105 24; > #X obj 112 105 25; > #X obj 138 105 26; > #X obj 164 105 27; > #X obj 189 105 28; > #X obj 37 74 select 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8; > #X obj 37 51 f \$1; > #X obj 37 6 loadbang; > #X obj 103 304 outlet; > #X text 8 149 Ozone mapping; > #X msg 237 93 2; > #X text 267 91 channel; > #X obj 37 28 t b b; > #X obj 102 158 pack f f; > #X text 110 16 Use: [OzKnob n] where n is the knob #; > #N canvas 0 22 210 111 \$0-oz_ctrlknob 0; > #X obj 28 72 outlet; > #X restore 103 272 pd \$0-oz_ctrlknob; > #X obj 102 218 s pd-\$0-oz_ctrlknob; > #X msg 102 187 obj 10 10 ctlin \$1 \$2 \, connect 1 0 0 0; > #X connect 0 0 16 0; > #X connect 1 0 16 0; > #X connect 2 0 16 0; > #X connect 3 0 16 0; > #X connect 4 0 16 0; > #X connect 5 0 16 0; > #X connect 6 0 16 0; > #X connect 7 0 16 0; > #X connect 8 0 0 0; > #X connect 8 1 1 0; > #X connect 8 2 2 0; > #X connect 8 3 3 0; > #X connect 8 4 4 0; > #X connect 8 5 5 0; > #X connect 8 6 6 0; > #X connect 8 7 7 0; > #X connect 9 0 8 0; > #X connect 10 0 15 0; > #X connect 13 0 16 1; > #X connect 15 0 9 0; > #X connect 15 1 13 0; > #X connect 16 0 20 0; > #X connect 18 0 11 0; > #X connect 20 0 19 0; > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: PGP.sig Type: application/pgp-signature Size: 194 bytes Desc: Signierter Teil der Nachricht URL: From zmoelnig at iem.at Thu Mar 12 10:02:37 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 09:02:37 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> Derek Holzer wrote: > Hi all and thanks for chiming in on this thread. There was once, long > ago, a simple mixer which dynamically created the busses and channels. > If anyone can remember that one, it must have been 5 years ago, and was > the first dynamic patch I had ever seen. could be my "abcde(fg)", the great "ambisonics-based coding and decoding environment (for graz)". you can get it here: http://iem.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/iem/spatialization/abcde/ however, my experiences with abcde were the main reason i s did not touch self-modifying patches for years and years. the lesson i learned was: never do self-modification in patches that other people will ever have to regularily use. (the original phrase would have been "never do self-modification in patches that other people will ever have to maintain"; however, this might give the impression that chances are low that somebody else will really have to "maintain" a patch); in practice you pass maintainership to somebody as soon as you give them your patch: they will eventually start to modify it. having said that, self-modification might work resasonably well with _small_ "atomic" abstractions e.g. implementing a settable [route] via self-modification might be fine, but don't try to do so with core-components of a big application. > > Also fun, non-utilitarian ones, like once someone sent some kind of > "card" to the list which just made a huge self-generating GUI art-mess > on the screen. I wish I could remember who wrote it. Lastly, IOhannes > showed a very nice self-modifying patch at Piksel last December using > iemguts. i'll see what i still have on my disk. being a live-coding session i had not prepared so much "patch" in advance which i could share now... vhmysdrt IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From hard.off at gmail.com Thu Mar 12 10:03:29 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 09:03:29 -0000 Subject: [PD] how to freeze pd Message-ID: <161320dd0903120205o3f206dc0i39061b7c837790b7@mail.gmail.com> * create a subpatch * create an object box in the subpatch, but don't type anything inside the box * go back to the parent patch and convert the subpatch into another object (i tried to make it a [send]) * enjoy pd freeze -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From derek at umatic.nl Thu Mar 12 10:03:42 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 09:03:42 -0000 Subject: [PD] Pd-Extended 0.40.3 + Jack OSX Message-ID: <49B8D079.7010706@umatic.nl> This combination crashes immediately, reproducible every time. I've tried standard the Sourceforge version and also the latest nightly build (Jan 2009). D. -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 142: "Shut the door and listen from outside" From derek at umatic.nl Thu Mar 12 10:13:09 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 09:13:09 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> Message-ID: <49B8D2AC.9030806@umatic.nl> Thx IOhannes, IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: > Derek Holzer wrote: >> Hi all and thanks for chiming in on this thread. There was once, long >> ago, a simple mixer which dynamically created the busses and channels. >> If anyone can remember that one, it must have been 5 years ago, and >> was the first dynamic patch I had ever seen. > > could be my "abcde(fg)", the great "ambisonics-based coding and decoding > environment (for graz)". > you can get it here: > http://iem.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/iem/spatialization/abcde/ It was something less complex than this I think. Just a mixer with dynamic creation of channels. It was very green, IIRC ;-) D. -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 185: "Which parts can be grouped?" From zmoelnig at iem.at Thu Mar 12 10:27:57 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 09:27:57 -0000 Subject: [PD] how to freeze pd In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903120205o3f206dc0i39061b7c837790b7@mail.gmail.com> References: <161320dd0903120205o3f206dc0i39061b7c837790b7@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49B8D626.7020604@iem.at> hard off wrote: > * create a subpatch > * create an object box in the subpatch, but don't type anything inside the > box > * go back to the parent patch and convert the subpatch into another object > (i tried to make it a [send]) > * enjoy pd freeze isn't this that old and already fixed bug reported in: https://sourceforge.net/tracker2/?func=detail&aid=1191610&group_id=55736&atid=478070 please update your Pd. fmgasdr IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From derek at umatic.nl Thu Mar 12 10:32:58 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 09:32:58 -0000 Subject: [PD] Pd-Extended 0.40.3 + Jack OSX In-Reply-To: <49B8D079.7010706@umatic.nl> References: <49B8D079.7010706@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <49B8D753.9020309@umatic.nl> Situation improves when using latest Pd-Extended 0.41 nightly build + latest JackOSX package. D. Derek Holzer wrote: > This combination crashes immediately, reproducible every time. I've > tried standard the Sourceforge version and also the latest nightly build > (Jan 2009). > > D. > -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 68: "Faced with a choice, do both" From jmmmpais at googlemail.com Thu Mar 12 11:07:37 2009 From: jmmmpais at googlemail.com (=?iso-8859-15?Q?Jo=E3o_Pais?=) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 10:07:37 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> Message-ID: small stuff in the /jmmmp folder (if you have a night build from the last weeks), but more using data structures and namecanvasdialog. maybe not really total dynamic - sliders - pdcolors - there's a color matrix for data-s > Would like to show some examples of dynamic and self-modifying Pd > patches during a workshop here in Berlin. I know there are some in the > archives (and maybe on people's HDs) somewhere, but damned if I can find > them. Links to previkous posts or new examples welcome! > > best! > Derek > -- Friedenstr. 58 10249 Berlin (Deutschland) Tel +49 30 42020091 | Mob +49 162 6843570 jmmmpais at googlemail.com | skype: jmmmpjmmmp From smills at rootsix.net Thu Mar 12 11:40:36 2009 From: smills at rootsix.net (Si Mills) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 10:40:36 -0000 Subject: [PD] Pd-Extended 0.40.3 + Jack OSX In-Reply-To: <49B8D753.9020309@umatic.nl> References: <49B8D079.7010706@umatic.nl> <49B8D753.9020309@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <5A3E11CB-7A3D-47DA-BB82-2D42643ECC56@rootsix.net> Have you noticed when turning off audio that cpu jumps up in the Jack cpu meter? Switch back on reduces it... weird On 12 Mar 2009, at 09:35, Derek Holzer wrote: > Situation improves when using latest Pd-Extended 0.41 nightly build > + latest JackOSX package. > > D. > > Derek Holzer wrote: >> This combination crashes immediately, reproducible every time. I've >> tried standard the Sourceforge version and also the latest nightly >> build (Jan 2009). >> D. > > -- > ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: > http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 68: > "Faced with a choice, do both" > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From crinimal at gmx.net Thu Mar 12 11:51:34 2009 From: crinimal at gmx.net (Martin Schied) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 10:51:34 -0000 Subject: [PD] how to freeze pd In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903120205o3f206dc0i39061b7c837790b7@mail.gmail.com> References: <161320dd0903120205o3f206dc0i39061b7c837790b7@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49B8E998.30001@gmx.net> same here. Pd version 0.41-4extended-20090301 compiled 09:29:58 Mar 1 2009 cheers, Martin hard off schrieb: > * create a subpatch > * create an object box in the subpatch, but don't type anything inside > the box > * go back to the parent patch and convert the subpatch into another > object (i tried to make it a [send]) > * enjoy pd freeze > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > From dmotd at gmx.net Thu Mar 12 10:52:27 2009 From: dmotd at gmx.net (dmotd) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 09:52:27 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B8D2AC.9030806@umatic.nl> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> <49B8D2AC.9030806@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <200903121939.13238.dmotd@gmx.net> hey derek.. i've done some hunting on your behalf, and i think i've found what you are referring to.. a patch created by leonard swiezinski in 2002: http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/2002-03/004940.html alas, the link is a 404.. and mr. swiezinski has been inactive for several years. although he does still own the parent site floppy35.de.. markmail.com is useful ;) ciao, dmotd ps.. i have numerous experiments in dyn-pd on old hard-disk-drives.. wouldn't be too difficult to dig through, but i am sure you will find plenty of examples.. On Thursday 12 March 2009 19:15:24 Derek Holzer wrote: > Thx IOhannes, > > IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: > > Derek Holzer wrote: > >> Hi all and thanks for chiming in on this thread. There was once, long > >> ago, a simple mixer which dynamically created the busses and channels. > >> If anyone can remember that one, it must have been 5 years ago, and > >> was the first dynamic patch I had ever seen. > > > > could be my "abcde(fg)", the great "ambisonics-based coding and decoding > > environment (for graz)". > > you can get it here: > > http://iem.svn.sourceforge.net/viewvc/iem/spatialization/abcde/ > > It was something less complex than this I think. Just a mixer with > dynamic creation of channels. It was very green, IIRC ;-) > > D. From zmoelnig at iem.at Thu Mar 12 13:59:10 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 12:59:10 -0000 Subject: [PD] PdCon09: TeX paper templates Message-ID: <49B907A4.8060902@iem.at> hi, sorry for OTism does anybody have a LaTeX version of the paper-templates for the PdConvention09? i just cannot write a paper in an office app. mfg,asdr IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From jbturgid at hotmail.com Thu Mar 12 13:34:01 2009 From: jbturgid at hotmail.com (Andrew Faraday) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 12:34:01 -0000 Subject: [PD] Gem to screensaver Message-ID: Hey guysPossibly a noob question but is it possible to package a generative gem patch as a screensaver? How would I go about this?God BlessAndrew Faraday _________________________________________________________________ Free photo editing software from Windows Live?. Try it now! http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665240/direct/01/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From david.doukhan at gmail.com Thu Mar 12 15:05:52 2009 From: david.doukhan at gmail.com (David Doukhan) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 14:05:52 -0000 Subject: [PD] PdCon09: TeX paper templates In-Reply-To: <49B907A4.8060902@iem.at> References: <49B907A4.8060902@iem.at> Message-ID: Neither do I... If anyone got such template, I would be intersted in obtaining it... Before the deadline... 2009/3/12 IOhannes m zmoelnig : > hi, sorry for OTism > > does anybody have a LaTeX version of the paper-templates for the > PdConvention09? > > i just cannot write a paper in an office app. > > > mfg,asdr > IOhannes > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > -- David Doukhan From crislists at gmail.com Thu Mar 12 16:04:25 2009 From: crislists at gmail.com (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?cristiano_figueir=F3?=) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 15:04:25 -0000 Subject: [PD] PdCon09: TeX paper templates In-Reply-To: References: <49B907A4.8060902@iem.at> Message-ID: <728d2a350903120806r4439cbc9sb5868f0b87420ae2@mail.gmail.com> Hi, we're working on a latex template to Pd Con 09. I'm not a very latex person so i'm asking help to others to improve this. Would be nice if any of you could help on this :) I think that this model could be good (with all images and .sty in one package) : http://www.sbc.org.br/index.php?language=1&content=downloads&id=286 The work should be to adapt this .tex to our office templates: http://porres.googlepages.com/Paper.zip Cheers. Cristiano -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From moocow at ling.uni-potsdam.de Thu Mar 12 14:33:16 2009 From: moocow at ling.uni-potsdam.de (Bryan Jurish) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 13:33:16 -0000 Subject: [PD] PdCon09: TeX paper templates In-Reply-To: <49B907A4.8060902@iem.at> References: <49B907A4.8060902@iem.at> Message-ID: <49B90A91.6030203@ling.uni-potsdam.de> On 2009-03-12 14:01:24, IOhannes m zmoelnig appears to have written: > i just cannot write a paper in an office app. amen! -- Bryan Jurish "There is *always* one more bug." jurish at ling.uni-potsdam.de -Lubarsky's Law of Cybernetic Entomology From enrique at netpd.org Thu Mar 12 17:00:55 2009 From: enrique at netpd.org (Enrique Erne) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 16:00:55 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <49B93236.9000400@netpd.org> Hi Derek i made a mixer for netpd once, that dynamically creates channels and fx-bus. it uses the whole netpd framework, statesaving etc. http://www.netpd.org/Mx if you have already a netpd synth it's quite easy to plugin to the mx, something like that: [osc~] |\ [i2mx~ $0 yourInstrumentName] but: it only works with netpd :) but2: there seems to be a problem with pd-0.42, that i will fix soon. eni Derek Holzer wrote: > Hi all and thanks for chiming in on this thread. There was once, long > ago, a simple mixer which dynamically created the busses and channels. > If anyone can remember that one, it must have been 5 years ago, and was > the first dynamic patch I had ever seen. > > Also fun, non-utilitarian ones, like once someone sent some kind of > "card" to the list which just made a huge self-generating GUI art-mess > on the screen. I wish I could remember who wrote it. Lastly, IOhannes > showed a very nice self-modifying patch at Piksel last December using > iemguts. > > best! > Derek > From puredata at 11h11.com Thu Mar 12 17:03:02 2009 From: puredata at 11h11.com (patrick) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 16:03:02 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <49B92255.6020900@11h11.com> hi, just updated the video showing voice patching in pure data. i am now using dyn~ (thank you thomas grill for your externals). http://www.vimeo.com/2814913 lower your volume when you hear "send, 1, 400". pat From pkstone at ucdavis.edu Thu Mar 12 17:22:35 2009 From: pkstone at ucdavis.edu (Phil Stone) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 16:22:35 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> Message-ID: <49B931F5.80107@ucdavis.edu> Good point; I assume you're going to emphasize the pitfalls of dynamic patching while you're at it, Derek? I have a habit of opening up patches to see how they work, and if I can't read them because they're too messy, I'll move stuff around. This is fine, unless it's a dynamic patch and I hit "ctrl-s" without thinking. D'oh! The initial state of a dynamic patch is critical to its correct function, and one has to think very carefully before saving changes. I think I'm going to develop the habit of putting a large warning comment on any self-modifying patch. Phil IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: > however, my experiences with abcde were the main reason i s did not > touch self-modifying patches for years and years. > the lesson i learned was: never do self-modification in patches that > other people will ever have to regularily use. > (the original phrase would have been "never do self-modification in > patches that other people will ever have to maintain"; however, this > might give the impression that chances are low that somebody else will > really have to "maintain" a patch); in practice you pass > maintainership to somebody as soon as you give them your patch: they > will eventually start to modify it. From zmoelnig at iem.at Thu Mar 12 17:33:31 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 16:33:31 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B931F5.80107@ucdavis.edu> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> <49B931F5.80107@ucdavis.edu> Message-ID: <49B939E4.8040904@iem.at> Phil Stone wrote: > Good point; I assume you're going to emphasize the pitfalls of dynamic > patching while you're at it, Derek? I have a habit of opening up > patches to see how they work, and if I can't read them because they're > too messy, I'll move stuff around. This is fine, unless it's a dynamic > patch and I hit "ctrl-s" without thinking. D'oh! The initial state of > a dynamic patch is critical to its correct function, and one has to > think very carefully before saving changes. I think I'm going to > develop the habit of putting a large warning comment on any > self-modifying patch. > i did that, to no avail :-) f gamsdr IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From fbar at footils.org Thu Mar 12 17:38:49 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 16:38:49 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B931F5.80107@ucdavis.edu> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> <49B931F5.80107@ucdavis.edu> Message-ID: <20090312164311.GF8088@footils.org> Hallo, Phil Stone hat gesagt: // Phil Stone wrote: > Good point; I assume you're going to emphasize the pitfalls of dynamic > patching while you're at it, Derek? I have a habit of opening up > patches to see how they work, and if I can't read them because they're > too messy, I'll move stuff around. This is fine, unless it's a dynamic > patch and I hit "ctrl-s" without thinking. D'oh! The initial state of > a dynamic patch is critical to its correct function, and one has to > think very carefully before saving changes. I think I'm going to > develop the habit of putting a large warning comment on any > self-modifying patch. With certain clean patching habits it's not that bad. For example the original nqpoly4 was rather messy because it did the dynamic patching in the abstraction itself, used namcanvas for it and thus relied on a certain initial state. What I changed was to remove namcanvas, do the dynamic patching inside of a subpatch and started with clearing that patch from a loadbang. A loadbanged [; pd-subpatch clear( IMO is mandatory for dynamic patching in abstractions. Even if it's saved with old content that will be removed on the next load. Another use for dynamic patching is automatically creating parts of static patches. For example my piece "Frost" on the GOSUB10 netlabel release uses 60 resonant bandpass filters driven by noise bursts. Of course I didn't patch all of these manually and changed their arguments, instead I used dynamic patching to generate the filter bank once, which then was saved into a static patch. In that use case, one should not use a loadbang'd clear of course. ;) To add another example: I use dynamic patching in the list-abs-intro.pd patch to generate a list of all list-abs in the [list]-abs collection. Ciao -- Frank From hans at eds.org Thu Mar 12 17:58:25 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 16:58:25 -0000 Subject: [PD] GSoC App is in! Message-ID: <46AE7B39-DC4E-421D-A0F6-CC19B5149B4A@eds.org> http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/GSoCOrganizationApp2009 So the GSoC app is in! That is everything on the above page was submitted. Please continue to work on the project ideas page, that part hasn't been submitted yet. .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- "It is convenient to imagine a power beyond us because that means we don't have to examine our own lives.", from "The Idols of Environmentalism", by Curtis White From fbar at footils.org Thu Mar 12 18:08:42 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 17:08:42 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B93FAC.9010506@ucdavis.edu> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> <49B931F5.80107@ucdavis.edu> <20090312164311.GF8088@footils.org> <49B93FAC.9010506@ucdavis.edu> Message-ID: <20090312171302.GA8499@footils.org> Hallo, Phil Stone hat gesagt: // Phil Stone wrote: > I may not be thinking this through correctly, but how do you handle > broken connections with inlets/outlets in the cleared subpatch? I.e., > the containing patch will lose its patch connections to the > inlets/outlets of the subpatch if the sbupatch is cleared. Just don't use any inlets and outlets! ;) I use [r $0-inlet] and [s $0-outlet] in the subpatch instead. See polypoly for an example of this "fake xlet" approach. Ciao -- Frnak From pkstone at ucdavis.edu Thu Mar 12 17:58:18 2009 From: pkstone at ucdavis.edu (Phil Stone) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 16:58:18 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <20090312164311.GF8088@footils.org> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> <49B931F5.80107@ucdavis.edu> <20090312164311.GF8088@footils.org> Message-ID: <49B93FAC.9010506@ucdavis.edu> I may not be thinking this through correctly, but how do you handle broken connections with inlets/outlets in the cleared subpatch? I.e., the containing patch will lose its patch connections to the inlets/outlets of the subpatch if the sbupatch is cleared. Phil > With certain clean patching habits it's not that bad. For example the original > nqpoly4 was rather messy because it did the dynamic patching in the abstraction > itself, used namcanvas for it and thus relied on a certain initial state. > > What I changed was to remove namcanvas, do the dynamic patching inside of a > subpatch and started with clearing that patch from a loadbang. > > A loadbanged [; pd-subpatch clear( IMO is mandatory for dynamic patching in > abstractions. Even if it's saved with old content that will be removed on the > next load. > > Another use for dynamic patching is automatically creating parts of static > patches. For example my piece "Frost" on the GOSUB10 netlabel release uses 60 > resonant bandpass filters driven by noise bursts. Of course I didn't patch all > of these manually and changed their arguments, instead I used dynamic patching > to generate the filter bank once, which then was saved into a static patch. > > In that use case, one should not use a loadbang'd clear of course. ;) > > To add another example: I use dynamic patching in the list-abs-intro.pd patch > to generate a list of all list-abs in the [list]-abs collection. > > Ciao > From reduzierer at yahoo.de Thu Mar 12 20:06:17 2009 From: reduzierer at yahoo.de (Roman Haefeli) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 19:06:17 -0000 Subject: [PD] FFT and curve3d? In-Reply-To: <49B707D8.2010609@goto10.org> References: <49B707D8.2010609@goto10.org> Message-ID: <1236884906.7769.5.camel@yoyo2> On Wed, 2009-03-11 at 00:37 +0000, Claude Heiland-Allen wrote: > Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > > > Anyone know of a patch that maps an FFT over time to something like a > > curve3d in Gem? I remember a while back people posted something like > > that, but I can't find it. > > > > .hc > > I just knocked the attached together, doesn't use curve3d thogh.. > beautiful! this is the kind of stuff, that triggers me to want to explore (in my perspective) undiscovered fields, such as (in this case) the gemGL* classes. very illustrative. roman ___________________________________________________________ Telefonate ohne weitere Kosten vom PC zum PC: http://messenger.yahoo.de From porres at gmail.com Thu Mar 12 20:48:44 2009 From: porres at gmail.com (Alexandre Porres) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 19:48:44 -0000 Subject: [PD] PdCon09: TeX paper templates In-Reply-To: <49B907A4.8060902@iem.at> References: <49B907A4.8060902@iem.at> Message-ID: <161a0b1e0903121250s40135c6by81af6aac76daff80@mail.gmail.com> Dear Folks, please forgive us for ignoring the important scientific standard provided by the LaTex formatt. since we only have a few days left. My idea is to go directly to http://www.acm.org/sigs/publications/proceedings-templates and get the templates from there. One might notice that the original templates were from them, as acknowledged on our Template. So it is the same thing. It should be fine. I dont work with LaTex, so it might take me too long to make the proper changes (Cris, from the committe is also overbooked). Maybe someone out there would help out. But no need to worry much... because the papers are not supposed to be "camera ready" versions at this point. Let us just peer-review the work. Thanks, and sorry for the inconvenience. Alex On Thu, Mar 12, 2009 at 10:01 AM, IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: > hi, sorry for OTism > > does anybody have a LaTeX version of the paper-templates for the > PdConvention09? > > i just cannot write a paper in an office app. > > > mfg,asdr > IOhannes > -- Alexandre Torres Porres cel. (11)8179-6226 Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From oded at ccrma.Stanford.EDU Thu Mar 12 23:01:05 2009 From: oded at ccrma.Stanford.EDU (Oded Ben-Tal) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 22:01:05 -0000 Subject: [PD] adaptive amplification? Message-ID: hello, I need to mic a player who will play either tiny, soft sounds (extended technique playing) or normal musical sounds soft-to-load. I want to mix the instrument sound with pd generated material BUT I want to amplify the soft sounds while only mixing a little bit of the normal sounds. Is there some clever way of making pd 'identify' the incoming sound and boost the signal when the input is the soft ones only? thanks Oded ___________________________________________________ Oded Ben-Tal http://ccrma.stanford.edu/~oded oded at ccrma.stanford.edu From lukexipd at gmail.com Fri Mar 13 00:19:07 2009 From: lukexipd at gmail.com (Luke Iannini) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 23:19:07 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> <49B931F5.80107@ucdavis.edu> <20090312164311.GF8088@footils.org> Message-ID: <7aaf8bb90903121621o6547cfa4l72c207b864af6beb@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, Mar 12, 2009 at 12:03 PM, Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > On Thu, 12 Mar 2009, Frank Barknecht wrote: > >> A loadbanged [; pd-subpatch clear( IMO is mandatory for dynamic patching >> in >> abstractions. Even if it's saved with old content that will be removed on >> the >> next load. > > It's not sufficient because you could be getting error messages from > dynamically patched abstractions, or other strange behaviour. For example, > if I make an [#out window], or an [#out] to which I send "open window", then > on next load of any [#out] you will see a window open, and on any [#out > window] you will see a window open, close, and open again. In other > circumstances, I could get a "no such directory" error everytime I load, > because I saved [#out] while it was writing a movie, and the directory has > been renamed or removed or it's just a different machine... Yes, the better solution methinks would be a vanilla* "savebang" to clear out the dynamic subpatch just before save. But I suppose that requires acknowledging dynamic patching. lxi *the [tot]-based method just does not work reliably > > ?_ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... > | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > From hans at eds.org Fri Mar 13 00:40:26 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 23:40:26 -0000 Subject: [PD] PdCon09: TeX paper templates In-Reply-To: <161a0b1e0903121250s40135c6by81af6aac76daff80@mail.gmail.com> References: <49B907A4.8060902@iem.at> <161a0b1e0903121250s40135c6by81af6aac76daff80@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Yeah, just use the ACM templates, they are good. I use the NIME ones, which are slightly modified ACM ones: http://nime.org/2002/submissions.html .hc On Mar 12, 2009, at 7:50 PM, Alexandre Porres wrote: > Dear Folks, please forgive us for ignoring the important scientific > standard provided by the LaTex formatt. > > since we only have a few days left. My idea is to go directly to > > http://www.acm.org/sigs/publications/proceedings-templates > > and get the templates from there. > > One might notice that the original templates were from them, as > acknowledged on our Template. So it is the same thing. It should be > fine. > > I dont work with LaTex, so it might take me too long to make the > proper changes (Cris, from the committe is also overbooked). > > Maybe someone out there would help out. But no need to worry much... > because the papers are not supposed to be "camera ready" versions > at this point. Let us just peer-review the work. > > Thanks, and sorry for the inconvenience. > Alex > > > > On Thu, Mar 12, 2009 at 10:01 AM, IOhannes m zmoelnig > wrote: > hi, sorry for OTism > > does anybody have a LaTeX version of the paper-templates for the > PdConvention09? > > i just cannot write a paper in an office app. > > > mfg,asdr > IOhannes > > > > -- > Alexandre Torres Porres > cel. (11)8179-6226 > Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home > http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Access to computers should be unlimited and total. - the hacker ethic -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From porres at gmail.com Fri Mar 13 00:43:41 2009 From: porres at gmail.com (Alexandre Porres) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 23:43:41 -0000 Subject: [PD] PdCon09: TeX paper templates In-Reply-To: References: <49B907A4.8060902@iem.at> <161a0b1e0903121250s40135c6by81af6aac76daff80@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <161a0b1e0903121645u21b328f7m3ffc4f81de20a50e@mail.gmail.com> exactly, In fact I got to this template because it was the one I used when I wrote a Paper to NIME Ooops, you caught me :) busted... But David did work on a version for us, I cant even see it, but I am uploading them to our website. I have it attached here. Hope it helps... Sorry again for the inconvenience... cheers Alex On Thu, Mar 12, 2009 at 8:37 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > Yeah, just use the ACM templates, they are good. I use the NIME ones, > which are slightly modified ACM ones: > > http://nime.org/2002/submissions.html > > .hc > > On Mar 12, 2009, at 7:50 PM, Alexandre Porres wrote: > > Dear Folks, please forgive us for ignoring the important scientific > standard provided by the LaTex formatt. > since we only have a few days left. My idea is to go directly to > > http://www.acm.org/sigs/publications/proceedings-templates > > and get the templates from there. > > One might notice that the original templates were from them, as > acknowledged on our Template. So it is the same thing. It should be fine. > > I dont work with LaTex, so it might take me too long to make the proper > changes (Cris, from the committe is also overbooked). > > Maybe someone out there would help out. But no need to worry much... > because the papers are not supposed to be "camera ready" versions at this > point. Let us just peer-review the work. > > Thanks, and sorry for the inconvenience. > Alex > > > > On Thu, Mar 12, 2009 at 10:01 AM, IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: > >> hi, sorry for OTism >> >> does anybody have a LaTeX version of the paper-templates for the >> PdConvention09? >> >> i just cannot write a paper in an office app. >> >> >> mfg,asdr >> IOhannes >> > > > > -- > Alexandre Torres Porres > cel. (11)8179-6226 > Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home > http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Access to computers should be unlimited and total. - the hacker ethic > > > -- Alexandre Torres Porres cel. (11)8179-6226 Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: pdcon09.zip Type: application/zip Size: 254931 bytes Desc: not available URL: From hans at eds.org Fri Mar 13 01:05:13 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 00:05:13 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <672DFB8C-A319-4ECA-A2E5-9DFBD7F86CF8@eds.org> Perhaps you are thinking of parazit and pure. parazit is an object included in Pd-extended. And you can get Gerard Van Dongen's pure here: http://itp.nyu.edu/dataflow/uploads/tgb-pure.tar.gz .hc On Mar 12, 2009, at 8:47 AM, Derek Holzer wrote: > Hi all and thanks for chiming in on this thread. There was once, > long ago, a simple mixer which dynamically created the busses and > channels. If anyone can remember that one, it must have been 5 years > ago, and was the first dynamic patch I had ever seen. > > Also fun, non-utilitarian ones, like once someone sent some kind of > "card" to the list which just made a huge self-generating GUI art- > mess on the screen. I wish I could remember who wrote it. Lastly, > IOhannes showed a very nice self-modifying patch at Piksel last > December using iemguts. > > best! > Derek > > -- > ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista > ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 130: > "Question the heroic" > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Computer science is no more related to the computer than astronomy is related to the telescope. -Edsger Dykstra From jmmmpais at googlemail.com Fri Mar 13 01:15:59 2009 From: jmmmpais at googlemail.com (=?iso-8859-15?Q?Jo=E3o_Pais?=) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 00:15:59 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> Message-ID: ah, forgot, a very simple one: dacm~, also in /jmmmp (in a recent night build) > Would like to show some examples of dynamic and self-modifying Pd > patches during a workshop here in Berlin. I know there are some in the > archives (and maybe on people's HDs) somewhere, but damned if I can find > them. Links to previkous posts or new examples welcome! > > best! > Derek > -- Friedenstr. 58 10249 Berlin (Deutschland) Tel +49 30 42020091 | Mob +49 162 6843570 jmmmpais at googlemail.com | skype: jmmmpjmmmp From hard.off at gmail.com Fri Mar 13 04:17:59 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 03:17:59 -0000 Subject: [PD] adaptive amplification? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <161320dd0903122020g55c89a70r4f5462499040cbb0@mail.gmail.com> a compressor? there's a good one in the net-pd library. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From dmotd at gmx.net Fri Mar 13 04:41:49 2009 From: dmotd at gmx.net (dmotd) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 03:41:49 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <200903131322.22125.dmotd@gmx.net> hey derek.. attached is the dynamic GOP abstraction [mtx_tog], used as an extension to iemmatrix lib. it's a viewer/editor for simple binary matrices. it may be useful in your presentation as it uses [namecanvas] to edit the top level GOP. the actual code should be fairly readable and straight forward, although the logic is a little complex. i have attached the help file and a little example that generates a 16x4 step sequencer. obviously it requires the iemmatrix library to function (although it should still render the grid without). i haven't relied on this too heavily in the past so it may be buggy.. as with all dynamic patching (especially GOP/namecanvas) use with caution! cheers, dmotd On Thursday 12 March 2009 03:55:21 Derek Holzer wrote: > Would like to show some examples of dynamic and self-modifying Pd > patches during a workshop here in Berlin. I know there are some in the > archives (and maybe on people's HDs) somewhere, but damned if I can find > them. Links to previkous posts or new examples welcome! > > best! > Derek -------------- next part -------------- #N canvas 99 276 450 300 10; #X floatatom 241 79 4 0 0 0 - - -; #X msg 242 98 column \$1; #X msg 66 82 matrix 2 2 1 1 1 1; #X obj 149 241 unpack 0 0 0 0; #X obj 150 265 tgl 15 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1 0 1; #X obj 173 267 tgl 15 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1 0 1; #X obj 205 268 tgl 15 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1 0 1; #X obj 241 266 tgl 15 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1 0 1; #X obj 64 210 route matrix; #X floatatom 241 35 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 64 133 mtx_tog 4 16; #N canvas 0 0 450 300 count[16] 0; #X obj 77 129 metro 100; #X obj 78 161 f; #X obj 111 158 + 1; #X obj 139 174 >= 16; #X msg 140 214 0; #X obj 140 194 sel 1; #X obj 176 98 inlet; #X obj 92 35 inlet; #X obj 94 61 moses 0; #X msg 101 84 1; #X floatatom 149 14 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X msg 93 104 0; #X obj 71 200 outlet; #X connect 0 0 1 0; #X connect 1 0 2 0; #X connect 2 0 1 1; #X connect 2 0 3 0; #X connect 2 0 12 0; #X connect 3 0 5 0; #X connect 4 0 1 1; #X connect 5 0 4 0; #X connect 6 0 3 1; #X connect 7 0 8 0; #X connect 8 0 11 0; #X connect 8 1 9 0; #X connect 8 1 0 1; #X connect 9 0 0 0; #X connect 10 0 8 0; #X connect 11 0 0 0; #X restore 240 56 pd count[16]; #X text 282 34 <- step (msec); #X connect 0 0 1 0; #X connect 1 0 10 0; #X connect 2 0 10 0; #X connect 3 0 4 0; #X connect 3 1 5 0; #X connect 3 2 6 0; #X connect 3 3 7 0; #X connect 8 1 3 0; #X connect 9 0 11 0; #X connect 10 0 8 0; #X connect 11 0 0 0; -------------- next part -------------- #N canvas 129 0 450 326 10; #X obj 324 251 mtx_print; #X obj 324 229 matrix; #X obj 45 110 mtx_eye 8; #X obj 46 89 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1; #X obj 323 207 spigot; #X obj 374 188 tgl 15 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1 0 1; #X msg 244 48 print 1; #X msg 256 67 print 0; #X text 263 86 print (including \$0 arg); #X text 34 283 warning! can choke pd when building larger matrices ; #X text 33 9 [mtx_tog] is a binary viewer/editor abs for iemmatrix ; #X text 292 299 (c) 2006 dmotd; #X obj 244 177 mtx_tog 2 2; #X obj 241 105 mtx_tog 4 4; #X obj 46 138 mtx_tog 8 8; #X obj 246 220 mtx_tog 3 1; #X obj 212 176 mtx_tog 3 1; #X text 65 28 usage: [mtx_tog m n]; #X text 65 46 where m = rows; #X text 79 65 and n = columns; #X connect 1 0 0 0; #X connect 2 0 14 0; #X connect 3 0 2 0; #X connect 4 0 1 0; #X connect 5 0 4 1; #X connect 6 0 13 0; #X connect 7 0 13 0; #X connect 12 0 4 0; #X connect 12 0 15 0; #X connect 13 0 12 0; #X connect 13 0 16 0; -------------- next part -------------- #N canvas 100 82 373 383 10; #N canvas 317 180 450 300 \$0-subpatch 0; #X obj 0 0 tgl 15 0 1011_1_1_send 1011_1_1_receive empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1 0 1; #X coords 0 -1 1 1 15 15 2 0 0; #X restore 0 50 pd \$0-subpatch; #N canvas 167 102 450 300 edit_mtx 0; #X obj 41 46 r \$0-matrix; #X obj 72 236 outlet; #X obj 286 174 spigot; #X obj 322 128 tgl 15 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1 0 1; #X obj 320 99 inlet; #X obj 166 24 inlet; #X obj 178 115 mtx_check; #N canvas 67 97 523 386 mtx_set 0; #N canvas 18 295 450 300 doit 0; #X obj 88 62 until; #X obj 88 90 f; #X obj 119 92 + 1; #X obj 163 92 sel 0; #X obj 117 119 mod 5; #X obj 90 32 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1; #N canvas 161 343 450 300 count 0; #X obj 85 15 inlet; #X obj 219 108 f; #X obj 276 104 + 1; #X msg 194 75 bang; #X floatatom 277 138 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X msg 263 77 0; #X obj 212 181 select 1; #X obj 230 147 < 5; #X obj 278 4 inlet; #X obj 299 43 int; #X obj 197 242 outlet; #X obj 300 263 outlet; #X obj 211 208 del 10; #X obj 269 207 del 11; #X connect 0 0 3 0; #X connect 1 0 2 0; #X connect 2 0 1 1; #X connect 2 0 4 0; #X connect 2 0 7 0; #X connect 2 0 10 0; #X connect 3 0 1 0; #X connect 5 0 1 1; #X connect 6 0 12 0; #X connect 6 1 13 0; #X connect 7 0 6 0; #X connect 8 0 9 0; #X connect 9 0 7 1; #X connect 12 0 1 0; #X connect 13 0 5 0; #X connect 13 0 11 0; #X restore 159 -23 pd count; #X obj 157 -47 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1; #X floatatom 203 -53 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 215 14 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1; #X floatatom 158 5 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 194 141 pack; #X obj 150 29 t b f; #X floatatom 108 -26 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 43 -68 inlet; #X obj 127 -71 inlet; #X obj 211 -76 inlet; #X obj 246 185 outlet; #X obj 229 -33 max 1; #X obj 63 -23 max 1; #X obj 362 190 outlet; #X connect 0 0 1 0; #X connect 1 0 2 0; #X connect 2 0 4 0; #X connect 2 0 11 0; #X connect 3 0 0 1; #X connect 4 0 1 1; #X connect 4 0 3 0; #X connect 5 0 0 0; #X connect 6 0 10 0; #X connect 6 0 12 0; #X connect 6 1 9 0; #X connect 7 0 6 0; #X connect 8 0 18 0; #X connect 9 0 20 0; #X connect 11 0 17 0; #X connect 12 0 5 0; #X connect 12 1 11 1; #X connect 13 0 4 1; #X connect 14 0 7 0; #X connect 15 0 19 0; #X connect 16 0 8 0; #X connect 18 0 6 1; #X connect 19 0 13 0; #X restore 165 98 pd doit; #X floatatom 195 78 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X floatatom 245 79 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 80 38 inlet; #X obj 77 171 matrix; #X obj 167 246 pack 0 0 0 0; #X obj 140 211 route matrix; #X obj 77 228 \$0; #X obj 204 179 unpack; #X obj 172 124 t a a; #X obj 78 199 t b a; #X msg 145 73 bang; #X obj 220 -24 loadbang; #X obj 220 0 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1; #X obj 222 24 t b b; #X obj 52 313 outlet; #X obj 119 274 t a b; #X obj 46 105 t a a; #X obj 240 49 \$2; #X obj 268 50 \$1; #X msg 112 145 element \$2 \$1; #X msg 164 284 \; \$1_\$2_\$3_receive set \$4; #X connect 0 0 9 0; #X connect 1 0 0 1; #X connect 2 0 0 2; #X connect 3 0 17 0; #X connect 4 0 10 0; #X connect 5 0 21 0; #X connect 6 0 16 0; #X connect 6 1 5 3; #X connect 7 0 5 0; #X connect 8 0 5 1; #X connect 8 1 5 2; #X connect 9 0 20 0; #X connect 9 1 8 0; #X connect 10 0 7 0; #X connect 10 1 6 0; #X connect 11 0 0 0; #X connect 12 0 13 0; #X connect 13 0 14 0; #X connect 14 0 18 0; #X connect 14 1 19 0; #X connect 16 1 11 0; #X connect 17 0 15 0; #X connect 17 1 4 0; #X connect 18 0 1 0; #X connect 19 0 2 0; #X connect 20 0 4 0; #X restore 174 158 pd mtx_set; #X obj 48 128 t b a; #X obj 177 46 route matrix; #X obj 177 65 list prepend matrix; #X obj 178 85 list trim; #X obj 283 204 mtx_print mtx_tog[\$0]; #X obj 78 193 matrix \$1 \$2; #X obj 176 137 mtx_resize \$1 \$2; #X msg 43 69 element \$2 \$3 \$1; #X connect 0 0 15 0; #X connect 2 0 12 0; #X connect 3 0 2 1; #X connect 4 0 3 0; #X connect 5 0 9 0; #X connect 6 0 14 0; #X connect 7 0 13 0; #X connect 8 0 13 0; #X connect 8 1 13 0; #X connect 9 0 10 0; #X connect 9 1 13 0; #X connect 10 0 11 0; #X connect 11 0 6 0; #X connect 13 0 1 0; #X connect 13 0 2 0; #X connect 14 0 7 0; #X connect 15 0 8 0; #X restore 15 -10 pd edit_mtx; #N canvas 295 414 450 300 build 0; #N canvas 76 2 1055 684 make 0; #X msg 233 368 clear; #N canvas 52 319 450 300 doit 0; #X obj 88 62 until; #X obj 88 90 f; #X obj 119 92 + 1; #X obj 163 92 sel 0; #X obj 117 119 mod 5; #X obj 90 32 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1; #N canvas 161 343 450 300 count 0; #X obj 85 15 inlet; #X obj 219 108 f; #X obj 276 104 + 1; #X msg 194 75 bang; #X floatatom 277 138 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X msg 263 77 0; #X obj 212 181 select 1; #X obj 269 207 del 51; #X obj 211 208 del 50; #X obj 230 147 < 5; #X obj 278 4 inlet; #X obj 299 43 int; #X obj 197 242 outlet; #X obj 300 263 outlet; #X connect 0 0 3 0; #X connect 1 0 2 0; #X connect 2 0 1 1; #X connect 2 0 4 0; #X connect 2 0 9 0; #X connect 2 0 12 0; #X connect 3 0 1 0; #X connect 5 0 1 1; #X connect 6 0 8 0; #X connect 6 1 7 0; #X connect 7 0 5 0; #X connect 7 0 13 0; #X connect 8 0 1 0; #X connect 9 0 6 0; #X connect 10 0 11 0; #X connect 11 0 9 1; #X restore 159 -23 pd count; #X obj 157 -47 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1; #X floatatom 203 -53 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 215 14 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1; #X floatatom 158 5 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 194 141 pack; #X obj 150 29 t b f; #X floatatom 108 -26 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 43 -68 inlet; #X obj 127 -71 inlet; #X obj 211 -76 inlet; #X obj 246 185 outlet; #X obj 229 -33 max 1; #X obj 63 -23 max 1; #X connect 0 0 1 0; #X connect 1 0 2 0; #X connect 2 0 4 0; #X connect 2 0 11 0; #X connect 3 0 0 1; #X connect 4 0 1 1; #X connect 4 0 3 0; #X connect 5 0 0 0; #X connect 6 0 10 0; #X connect 6 0 12 0; #X connect 6 1 9 0; #X connect 7 0 6 0; #X connect 8 0 18 0; #X connect 11 0 17 0; #X connect 12 0 5 0; #X connect 12 1 11 1; #X connect 13 0 4 1; #X connect 14 0 7 0; #X connect 15 0 19 0; #X connect 16 0 8 0; #X connect 18 0 6 1; #X connect 19 0 13 0; #X restore 35 191 pd doit; #X floatatom 81 170 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X floatatom 137 168 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 191 515 pack; #X msg 190 571 donecanvasdialog 1 -1 2 0 -1 1 1 \$1 \$2 0 0; #X obj 35 311 expr ($f1 - 1) * 15 \; ($f2 - 1) * 15 \; $f1 \; $f2 \; (($f1 - 1) * 15) + 15 \; (($f2 - 1) * 15) + 15 \;; #X msg 240 517 15 15; #X obj 25 50 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1; #X obj 37 25 inlet; #X obj 86 652 s pd-\$0-subpatch; #X obj 74 147 inlet; #X obj 133 144 inlet; #X msg 523 403 clear; #X obj 698 642 s pd-\$0-pool; #X obj 35 407 pack 0 0 0 0 0; #X obj 654 176 \$0; #X obj 121 69 t b b b b; #X obj 585 208 pack 0 0 0; #X obj 842 347 pack 0 0 0 0 0; #X obj 843 269 expr $f1 * 130 \; ($f2 * 40) -40 \; $f3 \; $f1 \; $f2 ; #X obj 631 349 pack 0 0 0 0; #X obj 591 235 t a a; #X obj 631 449 f; #X obj 629 424 t b a; #X obj 681 450 + 2; #X msg 725 580 connect \$1 0 \$2 0; #X obj 686 480 expr $f1 - 1 \; $f1; #X obj 689 523 pack; #X msg 676 425 0; #X obj 693 549 t a a; #X msg 726 605 connect \$2 0 0 0; #X msg 485 477 obj 0 100 s \$1-matrix; #X obj 485 448 \$0; #X obj 622 271 expr $f1 * 130 \; ($f2 * 40) - 20 \; $f1 \; $f2; #X obj 247 310 \$0; #X obj 190 543 t a a; #X msg 223 597 donecanvasdialog 1 -1 2 0 -1 1 1 \$1 \$2 0 50; #X obj 222 624 s \$0-mtx_tog; #X msg 629 373 obj \$1 \$2 pack 0 \$4 \$3; #X msg 36 440 obj \$1 \$2 tgl 15 0 \$5_\$3_\$4_send \$5_\$3_\$4_receive empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1 0; #X msg 842 373 obj \$1 \$2 r \$3_\$4_\$5_send; #X connect 0 0 10 0; #X connect 1 0 6 0; #X connect 1 0 18 0; #X connect 4 0 36 0; #X connect 5 0 10 0; #X connect 6 0 15 0; #X connect 6 1 15 1; #X connect 6 2 15 2; #X connect 6 3 15 3; #X connect 6 4 4 0; #X connect 6 5 4 1; #X connect 7 0 36 0; #X connect 9 0 8 0; #X connect 9 0 17 0; #X connect 11 0 2 0; #X connect 11 0 1 1; #X connect 12 0 3 0; #X connect 12 0 1 2; #X connect 13 0 14 0; #X connect 15 0 40 0; #X connect 16 0 18 2; #X connect 17 0 1 0; #X connect 17 1 7 0; #X connect 17 1 33 0; #X connect 17 2 0 0; #X connect 17 2 13 0; #X connect 17 3 16 0; #X connect 17 3 29 0; #X connect 17 3 35 0; #X connect 18 0 22 0; #X connect 19 0 41 0; #X connect 20 0 19 0; #X connect 20 1 19 1; #X connect 20 2 19 2; #X connect 20 3 19 3; #X connect 20 4 19 4; #X connect 21 0 39 0; #X connect 22 0 34 0; #X connect 22 1 20 0; #X connect 23 0 25 0; #X connect 24 0 23 0; #X connect 24 1 14 0; #X connect 25 0 23 1; #X connect 25 0 27 0; #X connect 26 0 14 0; #X connect 27 0 28 0; #X connect 27 1 28 1; #X connect 28 0 30 0; #X connect 29 0 23 1; #X connect 30 0 31 0; #X connect 30 1 26 0; #X connect 31 0 14 0; #X connect 32 0 14 0; #X connect 33 0 32 0; #X connect 34 0 21 0; #X connect 34 1 21 1; #X connect 34 2 21 2; #X connect 34 3 21 3; #X connect 35 0 15 4; #X connect 36 0 5 0; #X connect 36 1 37 0; #X connect 37 0 38 0; #X connect 39 0 24 0; #X connect 40 0 10 0; #X connect 41 0 14 0; #X restore 65 217 pd make; #X obj 66 150 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1; #X obj 105 90 loadbang; #X obj 107 138 t b b b; #X obj 105 114 bng 15 250 50 0 empty empty empty 17 7 0 10 -262144 -1 -1; #X floatatom 157 188 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X floatatom 199 188 5 0 0 0 - - -; #X obj 125 163 \$2; #X obj 157 165 \$1; #X connect 1 0 0 0; #X connect 2 0 4 0; #X connect 3 0 1 0; #X connect 3 1 7 0; #X connect 3 2 8 0; #X connect 4 0 3 0; #X connect 5 0 0 1; #X connect 6 0 0 2; #X connect 7 0 0 1; #X connect 8 0 0 2; #X restore 117 -50 pd build; #N canvas 498 146 450 300 \$0-pool 0; #X obj 0 100 s 1011-matrix; #X obj 130 0 r 1011_1_1_send; #X obj 130 20 pack 0 1 1; #X connect 1 0 2 0; #X connect 2 0 0 0; #X restore 117 -30 pd \$0-pool; #X obj 15 10 outlet; #X obj 15 -70 inlet; #X obj 15 -50 route print; #X obj 117 -70 namecanvas \$0-mtx_tog; #N canvas 405 428 450 300 notes 0; #X text 55 25 [mtx_tog] binary editor/viewer for iemmatrix; #X text 107 49 usage: [mtx_tog m n]; #X text 157 70 where m = rows; #X text 171 89 and n = columns; #X text 276 253 (c) 2006 dmotd; #X text 56 121 the dynamic part has a metro to build the rows; #X text 56 136 and an until to build the columns..; #X text 55 155 this limit assures that pd doesn't die on building; #X text 57 171 but does make generating the content a little slow. ; #X text 57 239 toggles [pd \$0-subpatch]; #X text 31 127; #X text 57 255 receivers [pd \$0-pool]; #X text 55 189 (this limit could be removed in the future?); #X text 55 219 dynamic holders:; #X restore 117 -10 pd notes; #X connect 1 0 4 0; #X connect 5 0 6 0; #X connect 6 0 1 1; #X connect 6 1 1 0; #X coords 0 -1 1 1 15 15 2 0 50; From hans at eds.org Fri Mar 13 00:53:58 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 23:53:58 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <20090311202608.GB4913@footils.org> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <20090311202608.GB4913@footils.org> Message-ID: <24CE09CB-B1BA-4356-B61F-E6D7C53754E8@eds.org> On Mar 11, 2009, at 8:26 PM, Frank Barknecht wrote: > Hallo, > Hans-Christoph Steiner hat gesagt: // Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > >> polypoly and nqpoly4 are good examples. nqpoly4 is in Pd-extended, >> you >> can get polypoly here: >> >> http://itp.nyu.edu/dataflow/uploads/polypoly.zip > > Isn't polypoly also in pd-extended? Anyway the reference location is > the pd > subversion in: /trunk/abstractions/footils/foo/ polypoly is not included in Pd-extended. Newbies find downloading from svn daunting so I provided the zip. It would be even better if there was an official release. .hc > > > Ciao > -- > Frank > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Programs should be written for people to read, and only incidentally for machines to execute. - from Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs From derek at umatic.nl Fri Mar 13 07:45:39 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 06:45:39 -0000 Subject: [PD] adaptive amplification? In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903122020g55c89a70r4f5462499040cbb0@mail.gmail.com> References: <161320dd0903122020g55c89a70r4f5462499040cbb0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49BA018F.2050409@umatic.nl> Or [limiter], which has a compressor mode as well. Part of IEM libs I think. D. hard off wrote: > a compressor? > > there's a good one in the net-pd library. -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 21: "Be less critical" From fbar at footils.org Fri Mar 13 08:05:23 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 07:05:23 -0000 Subject: [PD] adaptive amplification? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20090313070945.GA10976@footils.org> Hallo, Oded Ben-Tal hat gesagt: // Oded Ben-Tal wrote: > I need to mic a player who will play either tiny, soft sounds (extended > technique playing) or normal musical sounds soft-to-load. I want to mix > the instrument sound with pd generated material BUT I want to amplify the > soft sounds while only mixing a little bit of the normal sounds. > Is there some clever way of making pd 'identify' the incoming sound and > boost the signal when the input is the soft ones only? You need a compressor with a so called side-chain. The RjDj library has two: e_compress.pd and e_dynproc.pd at: http://trac.rjdj.me/browser/trunk/rjlib/rj/ (e_dynproc can also be used as a noisegate, which is an kind of inverse compressor) Feed the signal to control into the left and the controlling signal into the middle inlet~. Ciao -- Frank From derek at umatic.nl Fri Mar 13 07:51:42 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 06:51:42 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <672DFB8C-A319-4ECA-A2E5-9DFBD7F86CF8@eds.org> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> <672DFB8C-A319-4ECA-A2E5-9DFBD7F86CF8@eds.org> Message-ID: <49BA0305.6080106@umatic.nl> Yeah, parazit was one of them! Thx! D. Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > Perhaps you are thinking of parazit and pure. parazit is an object > included in Pd-extended. And you can get Gerard Van Dongen's pure here: > > http://itp.nyu.edu/dataflow/uploads/tgb-pure.tar.gz > > .hc > > On Mar 12, 2009, at 8:47 AM, Derek Holzer wrote: > >> Hi all and thanks for chiming in on this thread. There was once, long >> ago, a simple mixer which dynamically created the busses and channels. >> If anyone can remember that one, it must have been 5 years ago, and >> was the first dynamic patch I had ever seen. >> >> Also fun, non-utilitarian ones, like once someone sent some kind of >> "card" to the list which just made a huge self-generating GUI art-mess >> on the screen. I wish I could remember who wrote it. Lastly, IOhannes >> showed a very nice self-modifying patch at Piksel last December using >> iemguts. >> >> best! >> Derek >> >> -- >> ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: >> http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: >> ---Oblique Strategy # 130: >> "Question the heroic" >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > Computer science is no more related to the computer than astronomy is > related to the telescope. -Edsger Dykstra > > > -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 63: "Don't break the silence" From nicolas_montgermont at yahoo.fr Fri Mar 13 12:19:52 2009 From: nicolas_montgermont at yahoo.fr (Nicolas Montgermont) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 11:19:52 -0000 Subject: [PD] visible bang without output Message-ID: <49BA4363.4080106@yahoo.fr> Hi list, Is there a simple solution to have the GUI bang visually shows a bang but without output? As the others GUI object do with the set message. [set bang( outputs a bang. Thanks, Nicolas -- http://nim.on.free.fr From hans.roels at versateladsl.be Fri Mar 13 11:04:44 2009 From: hans.roels at versateladsl.be (Hans Roels) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 10:04:44 -0000 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> <49B24BE4.5060702@netpd.org> <1236437479.8049.39.camel@yoyo2> <2AE574D7-078C-47BC-A548-41CC05E77BC8@eds.org> Message-ID: In fact I'm working on a very similar project (called 'abunch') since a year, I hope to release it in one of the following weeks. Everything is in pd vanilla. I tried to make it as user friendly as possible, I've been testing and using it a lot in my lessons. It contains a lot of the units that you mentioned... Hans R At 16:53 12/03/2009, Kyle Klipowicz wrote: >How about this project: > >Beginners Building Blocks. > >Right now, If I want to even make a simple sine oscillator synth >with an ADSR envelope on it, it's not very easy to do out of the >box. What if there were some entry-level abstractions in a very >OBVIOUS location that people could instantly piece together some >classic Unit Generators. Important for these would be the ability to >copy/paste items from a main page of abstractions. Also, they should >have a simple GUI interface, and possibly be set up automatically to use SSAD. > >I'm thinking stuff like: > >-basic envelope generators >-basic oscillators (bandlimited ones would be nice): sine, square, >triangle, sawtooth >-basic i/o that is more intuitive to newbies >-basic sample players (one shot, looping, pitch shifting, >multi-sample a la fluidsynth) >-basic MIDI controller mapping tools (so people could just twist a >knob to assign a parameter) >-basic step, piano roll, &c sequencers >-basic pitch/rhythm analysis (wrappers for sigmund~, fiddle~, and bonk~) >-basic modular counters >-an extensive collection of examples using these objects, >documenting parameters, as well as ways to connect and/or modify and >save new versions of objects using SSAD >-video stuff would also be great, something akin to a freshened up PixelTango. > >Anyway, I just thought these things would be really nice to have in >an accessible place in Pd-extended. Because right now whenever I >just want to make something very simple, i end up having to click a >mouse about 200 times which is annoying and makes me worried about RTS! > >Pd and Pd-extended are so difficult to navigate for newbies. There >need to be more "pick up and go" audio tools. I'm thinking of how >Reaktor and Max/MSP are so easy to dive into. Pd is a lot like a >cold cold ocean whereas the other two are nice warm swimming pools. >Pd is deeper and more exciting by far, but you can get swept away in >an undertow never to return! > >This project could be accomplished by merging elements from NetPd, >Pdmtl, and various slick patches made by the resident list geniuses. >(Another thing about NetPd if Roman and Eni are listening: can you >make a tar.gz or zip download of ALL current NetPd patches? I hate >having to download 30+ items one at a time. RTS fears again!) > >So there's my way more than 2 cents. Take what you will from it. > >~Kyle > > >On Sun, Mar 8, 2009 at 2:53 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner ><hans at eds.org> wrote: >On Mar 7, 2009, at 9:51 AM, Roman Haefeli wrote: > > On Sat, 2009-03-07 at 11:26 +0100, Enrique Erne wrote: > >> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > >>> The Google Summer of Code > ((http://code.google.com/soc/) application > >>> is due very soon, March 9th, and we need mentors! At this point, > >>> you > >>> just need to put down your name. Then once the projects are in, > >>> we'll > >>> choose projects and who will mentor them. > >> > >>> Every pd developer who wants to support the project but is not > >>> student > >>> anymore is invited to join as mentor, since the number of sponsored > >>> projects by google depends on the number of mentors and students. > >> > >> Andy, Claude, Frank, Marius, Mathieu, Roman where are you guys? > >> > >> add your names, hurry! :) > > > > yo, i am happy to add my name, but i guess it only makes sense for > > me to > > take a mentorship of a project, that is about patching and not c > > coding. > > from what i have seen, there is only one project - undead - which > > seems > > to be about patching. derek holzer is already proposed as a mentor. > > does > > it make sense to propose more then one mentor for a project? >You could also create a new project based on something like creating >libraries out of all that useful code in netpd. Basically, think of >something that you would like implemented in Pd that you could mentor. >.hc > > > > > > > roman > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > Telefonate ohne weitere Kosten vom PC zum PC: http:// > > messenger.yahoo.de > > >---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >If nature has made any one thing less susceptible than all others of >exclusive property, it is the action of the thinking power called an >idea, which an individual may exclusively possess as long as he keeps >it to himself; but the moment it is divulged, it forces itself into >the possession of everyone, and the receiver cannot dispossess himself >of it. - Thomas Jefferson > > >_______________________________________________ >Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > >-- >----- >------------ > ---- ----- >---- -------- - ------ >http://perhapsidid.wordpress.com >http://myspace.com/kyleklipowicz >_______________________________________________ >Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hans at eds.org Fri Mar 13 16:09:56 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 15:09:56 -0000 Subject: [PD] [PD-announce] Hack Yer iPod! in Liverpool, March 12th thru 17th In-Reply-To: References: <7F2A6B66-FF7F-4DCE-87DF-FCCAC9D9AF1F@eds.org> Message-ID: So I'll be here everyday thru the 18th, more or less from 11am til 6pm, and maybe longer. There are workshop times, but I'll be here hacking away the whole time if you want to join in or visit. Here's the workshop schedule: http://climateforchange.fact.co.uk/calendar .hc On Mar 11, 2009, at 7:19 PM, Arif Driessen wrote: > Oh Hans! Why weren't we told sooner!! > > Train tickets will be ?80 by now. > > In slightly more positive news, I noticed 'Arduino Hackday' on the > 23rd of May! > > On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 6:47 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner > wrote: > > Hey, come join me in Liverpool at FACT and hack your iPod! It > starts tomorrow, its pretty last minute, we have dates, but the > times aren't ironed out yet. > > Where: http://fact.co.uk/ in Liverpool, England > When: March 12th thru 17th (check the website for times) > > Have an iPod you want to repurpose into a hackable music machine? > Install iPodLinux and make music with Pd! Want to play Doom on your > iPod Video? Come install Rockbox! Did your trusty iPod?s battery > finally die, or disk give in? Come and break open your iPod, either > the software, the hardware or both. Give it new life and new > purpose. Also, we have on hand our stash of old iPods for harvesting > parts, and the newfound skills for frankensteining dead iPods into > living ones. Join Hans-Christoph Steiner and Chris ?the Widget? > DiMauro with your own iPod, or try your hand to see if you can > create a living one from our pile. > > This workshop is a place to get exposed to the possibilities. We?ve > been hacking on some iPods to see what?s possible. Lots of this > software is kind of raw, but you can do lots of fun stuff now. We > are just getting started, we are having fun exploring the options. > Now we want to help you do the same. > > Check out our web page to see if your devices are supported: > http://dev.eyebeam.org/projects/reware/wiki/FactWorkshop > > .hc > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Access to computers should be unlimited and total. - the hacker ethic > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-announce mailing list > Pd-announce at iem.at > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-announce > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-announce mailing list > Pd-announce at iem.at > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-announce > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- "[T]he greatest purveyor of violence in the world today [is] my own government." - Martin Luther King, Jr. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hans at eds.org Fri Mar 13 16:16:29 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 15:16:29 -0000 Subject: [PD] *weird* characters In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <6D5283F9-FE25-4D36-B8B2-B59F98D6BD11@eds.org> Sounds like you should start being an alpha tester for pd-devel. moocow is working on getting full UTF-8 support. But otherwise I think you are stuck with latin1, and maybe some others if you are lucky. .hc On Mar 12, 2009, at 12:43 AM, potax flan wrote: > hi > using [textfile], i want to concatenate long strings of *unusual* > characters (like the "triangle" or Delta character you get by > pressing ALT, caps, d). maybe there is an alternative to [textfile]? > Is there a way to handle these characters in pd (have them in a > message, then add them to textfile would be wonderful)? if i press > ALT caps d while editing a message i get an error rectangle ? is it > because the font in pd cant deal with the ? sign? can i use ascii > codes for this? key gives me 8710 for delta, any way i can use that? > thanks > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- All information should be free. - the hacker ethic From nicolas_montgermont at yahoo.fr Fri Mar 13 17:54:04 2009 From: nicolas_montgermont at yahoo.fr (Nicolas Montgermont) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 16:54:04 -0000 Subject: [PD] visible bang without output In-Reply-To: References: <49BA4363.4080106@yahoo.fr> Message-ID: <49BA91B4.2060302@yahoo.fr> h?h?, Clever. i don't have the reflex to make mini-GOP. Thanks, n Le 13/03/09 16:10, Hans-Christoph Steiner a ?crit : > > Make a GOP that uses the set message to control a spigot. > > .hc > > On Mar 13, 2009, at 11:28 AM, Nicolas Montgermont wrote: > >> Hi list, >> >> Is there a simple solution to have the GUI bang visually shows a bang >> but without output? >> As the others GUI object do with the set message. >> [set bang( outputs a bang. >> >> Thanks, >> >> Nicolas >> -- >> http://nim.on.free.fr >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > You can't steal a gift. Bird gave the world his music, and if you can > hear it, you can have it. - Dizzy Gillespie > > > > -- http://nim.on.free.fr From enrique at netpd.org Fri Mar 13 18:10:17 2009 From: enrique at netpd.org (Enrique Erne) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 17:10:17 -0000 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> <49B24BE4.5060702@netpd.org> <1236437479.8049.39.camel@yoyo2> <2AE574D7-078C-47BC-A548-41CC05E77BC8@eds.org> Message-ID: <49BA93FC.7020209@netpd.org> hi Kyle i love the idea of a Classic Unit Library (CUL?) BBB - Beginners Building Blocks WSP - (Where to Start with Pd) WSP - warm swimming pool :) for me the first step would be to write some specs: - coding style guide (who did it? luke?), license, naming convention, howto contribute and also analyze existing libs: pdmtl, rjlib maybe you could even just build on them? i'd like to see the WSP Lib: - bsd - flat - super simple black&white interfaces - as pure as possible - a minimum of possible dependencies - not gopish ? - howto contribute? - with self explaining naming? i'm just about to upload my zipped netpd directory. http://netpd.org/eni/downloads/?C=M;O=D (8.9MB because there are some samples) eni Kyle Klipowicz wrote: > How about this project: > Beginners Building Blocks. > > Right now, If I want to even make a simple sine oscillator synth with an > ADSR envelope on it, it's not very easy to do out of the box. What if there > were some entry-level abstractions in a very OBVIOUS location that people > could instantly piece together some classic Unit Generators. Important for > these would be the ability to copy/paste items from a main page of > abstractions. Also, they should have a simple GUI interface, and possibly be > set up automatically to use SSAD. > > I'm thinking stuff like: > > -basic envelope generators > -basic oscillators (bandlimited ones would be nice): sine, square, triangle, > sawtooth > -basic i/o that is more intuitive to newbies > -basic sample players (one shot, looping, pitch shifting, multi-sample a la > fluidsynth) > -basic MIDI controller mapping tools (so people could just twist a knob to > assign a parameter) > -basic step, piano roll, &c sequencers > -basic pitch/rhythm analysis (wrappers for sigmund~, fiddle~, and bonk~) > -basic modular counters > -an extensive collection of examples using these objects, documenting > parameters, as well as ways to connect and/or modify and save new versions > of objects using SSAD > -video stuff would also be great, something akin to a freshened up > PixelTango. > > Anyway, I just thought these things would be really nice to have in an > accessible place in Pd-extended. Because right now whenever I just want to > make something very simple, i end up having to click a mouse about 200 times > which is annoying and makes me worried about RTS! > > Pd and Pd-extended are so difficult to navigate for newbies. There need to > be more "pick up and go" audio tools. I'm thinking of how Reaktor and > Max/MSP are so easy to dive into. Pd is a lot like a cold cold ocean whereas > the other two are nice warm swimming pools. Pd is deeper and more exciting > by far, but you can get swept away in an undertow never to return! > > This project could be accomplished by merging elements from NetPd, Pdmtl, > and various slick patches made by the resident list geniuses. (Another thing > about NetPd if Roman and Eni are listening: can you make a tar.gz or zip > download of ALL current NetPd patches? I hate having to download 30+ items > one at a time. RTS fears again!) > > So there's my way more than 2 cents. Take what you will from it. > > ~Kyle > > > On Sun, Mar 8, 2009 at 2:53 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > >> On Mar 7, 2009, at 9:51 AM, Roman Haefeli wrote: >> >>> On Sat, 2009-03-07 at 11:26 +0100, Enrique Erne wrote: >>>> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >>>>> The Google Summer of Code ((http://code.google.com/soc/) application >>>>> is due very soon, March 9th, and we need mentors! At this point, >>>>> you >>>>> just need to put down your name. Then once the projects are in, >>>>> we'll >>>>> choose projects and who will mentor them. >>>>> Every pd developer who wants to support the project but is not >>>>> student >>>>> anymore is invited to join as mentor, since the number of sponsored >>>>> projects by google depends on the number of mentors and students. >>>> Andy, Claude, Frank, Marius, Mathieu, Roman where are you guys? >>>> >>>> add your names, hurry! :) >>> yo, i am happy to add my name, but i guess it only makes sense for >>> me to >>> take a mentorship of a project, that is about patching and not c >>> coding. >>> from what i have seen, there is only one project - undead - which >>> seems >>> to be about patching. derek holzer is already proposed as a mentor. >>> does >>> it make sense to propose more then one mentor for a project? >> You could also create a new project based on something like creating >> libraries out of all that useful code in netpd. Basically, think of >> something that you would like implemented in Pd that you could mentor. >> >> .hc >> >> >>> >>> roman >>> >>> >>> >>> ___________________________________________________________ >>> Telefonate ohne weitere Kosten vom PC zum PC: http:// >>> messenger.yahoo.de >> >> >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> If nature has made any one thing less susceptible than all others of >> exclusive property, it is the action of the thinking power called an >> idea, which an individual may exclusively possess as long as he keeps >> it to himself; but the moment it is divulged, it forces itself into >> the possession of everyone, and the receiver cannot dispossess himself >> of it. - Thomas Jefferson >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From kyleklip at gmail.com Fri Mar 13 18:35:06 2009 From: kyleklip at gmail.com (Kyle Klipowicz) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 17:35:06 -0000 Subject: [PD] EzPd (Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline!) Message-ID: Thanks everyone for your replies and suggestions! It's good to know I'm not alone in my frustrations. I would really love to work on this project, since it would make it easier for me to teach K-8 students about acoustics and math using Pd if there were more LEGO-like primitives to snap together easily. If we can get something like this up as a candidate for GSoC, some wonderful things could arise from it. Most definitely, the names should be very easy to understand. That is part of my frustration right now with Pd-extended. There is a wealth of stuff, but it's all named oddly by different people and is difficult to explore in a meaningful way. Part of me thinks that Pd-extended needs to cut the fat a little bit...maybe a Pd-intended version? Only including an organized catalog of well-named, glue-able parts that all play nice together? ~Kyle On Fri, Mar 13, 2009 at 12:12 PM, Enrique Erne wrote: > hi Kyle > > i love the idea of a Classic Unit Library (CUL?) > BBB - Beginners Building Blocks > WSP - (Where to Start with Pd) > WSP - warm swimming pool :) > > for me the first step would be to write some specs: > - coding style guide (who did it? luke?), license, naming convention, howto > contribute > and also analyze existing libs: pdmtl, rjlib maybe you could even just > build on them? > > i'd like to see the WSP Lib: > - bsd > - flat > - super simple black&white interfaces > - as pure as possible > - a minimum of possible dependencies > - not gopish ? > - howto contribute? > - with self explaining naming? > > > i'm just about to upload my zipped netpd directory. > http://netpd.org/eni/downloads/?C=M;O=D > (8.9MB because there are some samples) > > eni > > > > > > Kyle Klipowicz wrote: > >> How about this project: >> Beginners Building Blocks. >> >> Right now, If I want to even make a simple sine oscillator synth with an >> ADSR envelope on it, it's not very easy to do out of the box. What if >> there >> were some entry-level abstractions in a very OBVIOUS location that people >> could instantly piece together some classic Unit Generators. Important for >> these would be the ability to copy/paste items from a main page of >> abstractions. Also, they should have a simple GUI interface, and possibly >> be >> set up automatically to use SSAD. >> >> I'm thinking stuff like: >> >> -basic envelope generators >> -basic oscillators (bandlimited ones would be nice): sine, square, >> triangle, >> sawtooth >> -basic i/o that is more intuitive to newbies >> -basic sample players (one shot, looping, pitch shifting, multi-sample a >> la >> fluidsynth) >> -basic MIDI controller mapping tools (so people could just twist a knob to >> assign a parameter) >> -basic step, piano roll, &c sequencers >> -basic pitch/rhythm analysis (wrappers for sigmund~, fiddle~, and bonk~) >> -basic modular counters >> -an extensive collection of examples using these objects, documenting >> parameters, as well as ways to connect and/or modify and save new versions >> of objects using SSAD >> -video stuff would also be great, something akin to a freshened up >> PixelTango. >> >> Anyway, I just thought these things would be really nice to have in an >> accessible place in Pd-extended. Because right now whenever I just want to >> make something very simple, i end up having to click a mouse about 200 >> times >> which is annoying and makes me worried about RTS! >> >> Pd and Pd-extended are so difficult to navigate for newbies. There need to >> be more "pick up and go" audio tools. I'm thinking of how Reaktor and >> Max/MSP are so easy to dive into. Pd is a lot like a cold cold ocean >> whereas >> the other two are nice warm swimming pools. Pd is deeper and more exciting >> by far, but you can get swept away in an undertow never to return! >> >> This project could be accomplished by merging elements from NetPd, Pdmtl, >> and various slick patches made by the resident list geniuses. (Another >> thing >> about NetPd if Roman and Eni are listening: can you make a tar.gz or zip >> download of ALL current NetPd patches? I hate having to download 30+ items >> one at a time. RTS fears again!) >> >> So there's my way more than 2 cents. Take what you will from it. >> >> ~Kyle >> >> >> On Sun, Mar 8, 2009 at 2:53 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner >> wrote: >> >> On Mar 7, 2009, at 9:51 AM, Roman Haefeli wrote: >>> >>> On Sat, 2009-03-07 at 11:26 +0100, Enrique Erne wrote: >>>> >>>>> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> The Google Summer of Code ((http://code.google.com/soc/) application >>>>>> is due very soon, March 9th, and we need mentors! At this point, >>>>>> you >>>>>> just need to put down your name. Then once the projects are in, >>>>>> we'll >>>>>> choose projects and who will mentor them. >>>>>> Every pd developer who wants to support the project but is not >>>>>> student >>>>>> anymore is invited to join as mentor, since the number of sponsored >>>>>> projects by google depends on the number of mentors and students. >>>>>> >>>>> Andy, Claude, Frank, Marius, Mathieu, Roman where are you guys? >>>>> >>>>> add your names, hurry! :) >>>>> >>>> yo, i am happy to add my name, but i guess it only makes sense for >>>> me to >>>> take a mentorship of a project, that is about patching and not c >>>> coding. >>>> from what i have seen, there is only one project - undead - which >>>> seems >>>> to be about patching. derek holzer is already proposed as a mentor. >>>> does >>>> it make sense to propose more then one mentor for a project? >>>> >>> You could also create a new project based on something like creating >>> libraries out of all that useful code in netpd. Basically, think of >>> something that you would like implemented in Pd that you could mentor. >>> >>> .hc >>> >>> >>> >>>> roman >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> ___________________________________________________________ >>>> Telefonate ohne weitere Kosten vom PC zum PC: http:// >>>> messenger.yahoo.de >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> >>> If nature has made any one thing less susceptible than all others of >>> exclusive property, it is the action of the thinking power called an >>> idea, which an individual may exclusively possess as long as he keeps >>> it to himself; but the moment it is divulged, it forces itself into >>> the possession of everyone, and the receiver cannot dispossess himself >>> of it. - Thomas Jefferson >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >>> >>> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> > > -- ----- ------------ ---- ----- ---- -------- - ------ http://perhapsidid.wordpress.com http://myspace.com/kyleklipowicz -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hard.off at gmail.com Fri Mar 13 18:57:06 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 17:57:06 -0000 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <49BA93FC.7020209@netpd.org> References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> <49B24BE4.5060702@netpd.org> <1236437479.8049.39.camel@yoyo2> <2AE574D7-078C-47BC-A548-41CC05E77BC8@eds.org> <49BA93FC.7020209@netpd.org> Message-ID: <161320dd0903131059v731a00bk567dde6454a9e8f4@mail.gmail.com> i think this idea of making a unified library of patches is fantastic. but i don't think it should be a project given to a student with little experience in pd. i'd be more than happy to help out. what would be the best way to set up communications between us, if we take this on? that would be the first step i guess. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From matju at artengine.ca Fri Mar 13 19:06:04 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 18:06:04 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> Message-ID: On Thu, 12 Mar 2009, IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: > however, my experiences with abcde were the main reason i s did not > touch self-modifying patches for years and years. the lesson i learned > was: never do self-modification in patches that other people will ever > have to regularily use. (the original phrase would have been "never do > self-modification in patches that other people will ever have to > maintain"; however, this might give the impression that chances are low > that somebody else will really have to "maintain" a patch); in practice > you pass maintainership to somebody as soon as you give them your patch: > they will eventually start to modify it. Because self-modifying patches are more tricky and complicated than most other things, it's especially important to aggressively abstract them. If you can, you abstract them in a way that each self-modifying abstraction represents an elementary pattern that no-one will want to modify, because it's too basic and fundamental, and so there's nothing that one could possibly want to customise about them. Therefore all the aspects that make sense to customise will be in abstractions that themselves are not self-modifying, because they use elementary self-modifying abstractions instead. But that's not always easy to do or feasible. This concept can also be useful with lots more things than just self-modifying patches, but it's with self-modifying patches that there is the most payoff. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From fbar at footils.org Fri Mar 13 19:11:46 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 18:11:46 -0000 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> <49B24BE4.5060702@netpd.org> <1236437479.8049.39.camel@yoyo2> <2AE574D7-078C-47BC-A548-41CC05E77BC8@eds.org> Message-ID: <20090313181553.GA20042@fliwatut.scifi> Hallo, Kyle Klipowicz hat gesagt: // Kyle Klipowicz wrote: > How about this project: > Beginners Building Blocks. A lot of the goals you describe overlap with goals of the RjDj library, that the RjDj team (like Gunter Geiger, Amaury Hazan, Paul Brossier, myself and others) is working on. It's generally sssad-enabled and pure vanilla (even omitting expr). Some parts are specific to the targetted platform (mobile devices like iPod Touch and iPhone), so e.g. the touch screen interfacing is useless outside of that. Ciao -- Frank Barknecht Do You RjDj.me? _ ______footils.org__ From matju at artengine.ca Fri Mar 13 18:55:16 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 17:55:16 -0000 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <49BA93FC.7020209@netpd.org> References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> <49B24BE4.5060702@netpd.org> <1236437479.8049.39.camel@yoyo2> <2AE574D7-078C-47BC-A548-41CC05E77BC8@eds.org> <49BA93FC.7020209@netpd.org> Message-ID: On Fri, 13 Mar 2009, Enrique Erne wrote: > - with self explaining naming? The problem with that is that long names still don't say how it works, and as people learn how it works, they don't need long names anymore, and it gets in the way a bit. What you need is not long names, it's a system so that mouseover would show the descriptions that you'd otherwise look up in help-intro.pd, and that are often missing for externals. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From jancsika at yahoo.com Fri Mar 13 23:26:39 2009 From: jancsika at yahoo.com (Jonathan Wilkes) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 22:26:39 -0000 Subject: [PD] visible bang without output In-Reply-To: <49BA91B4.2060302@yahoo.fr> Message-ID: <830653.4928.qm@web65607.mail.ac4.yahoo.com> Or you can just make your own bng, and add whatever features you want. -Jonathan --- On Fri, 3/13/09, Nicolas Montgermont wrote: > From: Nicolas Montgermont > Subject: Re: [PD] visible bang without output > To: "Hans-Christoph Steiner" > Cc: "pd" > Date: Friday, March 13, 2009, 6:02 PM > h?h?, > > Clever. i don't have the reflex to make mini-GOP. > Thanks, > > n > > Le 13/03/09 16:10, Hans-Christoph Steiner a ?crit : > > > > Make a GOP that uses the set message to control a > spigot. > > > > .hc > > > > On Mar 13, 2009, at 11:28 AM, Nicolas Montgermont > wrote: > > > >> Hi list, > >> > >> Is there a simple solution to have the GUI bang > visually shows a bang but without output? > >> As the others GUI object do with the set message. > >> [set bang( outputs a bang. > >> > >> Thanks, > >> > >> Nicolas > >> -- http://nim.on.free.fr > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > You can't steal a gift. Bird gave the world his > music, and if you can hear it, you can have it. - Dizzy > Gillespie > > > > > > > > > > -- http://nim.on.free.fr > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: ds-bng.pd Type: application/puredata Size: 4455 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: ds-bng2.pd Type: application/puredata Size: 4457 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: ds-bng-help.pd Type: application/puredata Size: 1046 bytes Desc: not available URL: From enrique at netpd.org Sat Mar 14 00:00:25 2009 From: enrique at netpd.org (Enrique Erne) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 23:00:25 -0000 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> <49B24BE4.5060702@netpd.org> <1236437479.8049.39.camel@yoyo2> <2AE574D7-078C-47BC-A548-41CC05E77BC8@eds.org> <49BA93FC.7020209@netpd.org> Message-ID: <49BAE60A.4030005@netpd.org> Mathieu Bouchard wrote: > On Fri, 13 Mar 2009, Enrique Erne wrote: > >> - with self explaining naming? > > The problem with that is that long names still don't say how it works, > and as people learn how it works, they don't need long names anymore, > and it gets in the way a bit. What you need is not long names, it's a > system so that mouseover would show the descriptions that you'd > otherwise look up in help-intro.pd, and that are often missing for > externals. wasn't that tooltip feature implement in desiredata? maybe one could port this as a own GSoC project to puredata. i don't think names have to be fully self explaining, but at least that you get the clue of what the abstraction might do. rjlib and pdmtl seems pretty nice. From matju at artengine.ca Fri Mar 13 20:57:00 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 19:57:00 -0000 Subject: [PD] httpget: fun with tcpclient and pdstring In-Reply-To: References: <3930C1D8-5F05-4631-8A2B-CB88BA812969@eds.org> Message-ID: On Thu, 5 Mar 2009, Martin Peach wrote: > Mathieu Bouchard wrote: >> By floats, you mean a single float representing a single character? > Yes single character, any unicode character will fit in a float. Well, my question was not about whether they'd fit or not in a single float, but rather whether you were talking about supporting sequences of float messages as being a string. I just wanted to make clear that i believe that a message sequence "72,101,108,108,111" should be converted to a single list message "72 101 108 108 111" to make things easier. But now that I think of it, a float only represents a code-point. In most of the usage of unicode, a code-point = a character, but I've already encountered cases where I typed a character in two parts that are registered as one code-point each. I thought I never would. >> But now, La Question Qui Tue: if you do a [string append] on two strings of >> different format, what should be the format of the output? > The first argument of the object would be the name of a table, with a [set( > message to change it. Well, my goal was to come up with an idea of a [string append] that isn't array-centric, for example, or at least, doesn't look like it when you try to use it with something else than arrays. But if the $1 of [string append] means an array name when it's a symbol, then it can't mean a symbol whose letters would be turned into list elements or array elements, for example. >> Actually, there's another killer question: if you do a [string append] >> on two arrays, and that it is agreed that the output should go in an >> array, in which array does the output go? > If it's like a [strcat] it goes into the table named by its first argument, > or the most recent [set( message. Seems good. > I think instead of using zero to terminate the string the destination > table should be resized to the length of the resulting string. Ideally, yeah, many programming languages don't use zero-termination, including a bunch that used to use zero-termination and went away from it. (Those languages that used to still store it as a hidden element in the array, but that's an optimisation trick for interfacing with C, and it doesn't apply if your array is made of floats and not of bytes.) It would be a lot better if arrays could be resized in more flexible ways. That way, you could gradually add elements to it without fearing of hitting a mountain of redundant reallocations, that is, one per character added in a long sequence of strcats of single chars. For example, I made an implementation of t_binbuf in which "size" is distinguished from "capacity", and the difference between the two is some padding for future use. The capacity grows by bigger amounts than the size, so that the capacity doesn't have to grow as often. Many programming languages have arrays that work like this. Several of those also have an index for padding at the beginning so that you can gradually chop off elements at the beginning without having to copy the table a bunch of times. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From shima at pspunch.com Sat Mar 14 06:08:07 2009 From: shima at pspunch.com (PSPunch) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 05:08:07 -0000 Subject: [PD] Gem to screensaver In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <49BB3C26.9070401@pspunch.com> > Hey guys > > Possibly a noob question but is it possible to package a generative gem > patch as a screensaver? How would I go about this? Attached files contain what may be a working solution under Windows. Quick starter: (Assuming you have Pd installed under 'c:\Program Files\pd\) 1. Store the following 3 files under 'c:\' 1) pd_scr.pd 2) pd_scr_helper.pd 3) pd_scr.bat 2. Set the attached file 'pd_scr.scr' as your screen saver. etc. 'pd_scr.scr' is a simple program that launches 'c:\pd_src.bat' pd_scr_edit.bat starts up with the -noloadbang option added for ease of editing. -- David Shimamoto -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: pd_scr.zip Type: application/x-zip-compressed Size: 6925 bytes Desc: not available URL: From mis at artengine.ca Sat Mar 14 04:14:25 2009 From: mis at artengine.ca (Michal Seta) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 03:14:25 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> Message-ID: See also [panN~] in xjimmies for an example of simple dynamically built abstraction that adapts to the number of channels you need for panning. ./MiS From czhenry at gmail.com Sat Mar 14 15:03:05 2009 From: czhenry at gmail.com (Charles Henry) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 14:03:05 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <7aaf8bb90903121621o6547cfa4l72c207b864af6beb@mail.gmail.com> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> <49B931F5.80107@ucdavis.edu> <20090312164311.GF8088@footils.org> <7aaf8bb90903121621o6547cfa4l72c207b864af6beb@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <518fe7b20903140705x49f7a617paf0796850407e057@mail.gmail.com> On Thu, Mar 12, 2009 at 6:21 PM, Luke Iannini wrote: > Yes, the better solution methinks would be a vanilla* "savebang" to > clear out the dynamic subpatch just before save. ?But I suppose that > requires acknowledging dynamic patching. > > lxi > > *the [tot]-based method just does not work reliably To mention programming languages, here (I wouldn't propose to open this can of worms, but to look at the options for a more complete programming style in Pd) I think this makes sense from a programming languages point of view. If you're creating a dynamic-based abstraction, it should be analogous to writing a class. There is a way to write the code for a "new" or "create" routine in your class via [loadbang], so you need a way to code a "free" or "delete" routine as well. A selective-save feature would be a more pragmatic approach for Pd users. I think of data-structures in C, where you add a pointer in your struct. You can later dynamically allocate memory for an array and set the pointer, but the structure itself does not include the dynamically created array. However, I think that coding a new method would be expensive and problematic. What set of operations is necessary to be able to create dynamic patching capability? Do you think there's a top-down design based approach to outline the necessary principles for it? Chuck From jmmmpais at googlemail.com Sat Mar 14 16:33:06 2009 From: jmmmpais at googlemail.com (=?iso-8859-15?Q?Jo=E3o_Pais?=) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 15:33:06 -0000 Subject: [PD] dyn~ and writesf~? Message-ID: Hi, I was trying to use a writesf~ inside a dyn~ (xp). The audio files get generated, but with no audio inside. Does anyone used this combination sucessfully so far? (XP here) All the connections were in place, of course. I haven't any example patch here, but maybe can send it later. Best, Jo?o Pais -- Friedenstr. 58 10249 Berlin (Deutschland) Tel +49 30 42020091 | Mob +49 162 6843570 jmmmpais at googlemail.com | skype: jmmmpjmmmp From achim.bornhoeft at googlemail.com Sat Mar 14 17:11:24 2009 From: achim.bornhoeft at googlemail.com (Achim Bornhoeft) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 16:11:24 -0000 Subject: [PD] 8ch diffusion Message-ID: Can anybody help me to extend this patch from 4ch to 8ch? (I found it somewhere...) Or is there an even easier (better) way to do the same. I already tried [vbap] but the objects [define_loudspeaker] and [matrix~] are not recognized by my PD-Extended 40.3 on Max OS 10.5. (see other attachment). Many thanks in advance for your help, Achim Achim Bornhoeft Neckarhalde 38, D-72070 Tuebingen tel/fax +49 (0)7071 942745 mobil +49 (0)179 6936930 skype:achim.bornhoeft?call www.bornhoeft.org -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: 4ch-grid.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 2519 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: vbap-test.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 1293 bytes Desc: not available URL: From matju at artengine.ca Sat Mar 14 17:31:09 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 16:31:09 -0000 Subject: [PD] 8ch diffusion In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Sat, 14 Mar 2009, Achim Bornhoeft wrote: > Can anybody help me to extend this patch from 4ch to 8ch? Well, I don't really have any experience with spatialisation, but if you're trying to make a rectangular-prism structure from a rectangle structure, you will need to add a 3rd [expr], add a new [inlet] and [/ 200], add four more [t f b] 50 [line~] [outlet~], and quadruple the number of [*]. The latter is because now each corner is made by multiplying two things together, and what you want is probably multiplying three things together, so you need 2 [*] per channel. Look at the pattern of wires, how it tries all four combinations of going through [expr] and not going through it, and how the number of combinations grows to 8 when adding a third inlet, and that to multiply the third inlet (or its [expr] counterpart) you need the extra [*] for each. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From matju at artengine.ca Sat Mar 14 17:40:40 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 16:40:40 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49BBCBB8.1050809@iem.at> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> <49B931F5.80107@ucdavis.edu> <20090312164311.GF8088@footils.org> <7aaf8bb90903121621o6547cfa4l72c207b864af6beb@mail.gmail.com> <518fe7b20903140705x49f7a617paf0796850407e057@mail.gmail.com> <49BBCBB8.1050809@iem.at> Message-ID: On Sat, 14 Mar 2009, IOhannes m zm?lnig wrote: > where did you get that impression from? [loadbang] does _not_ work as a > constructor (it's too late). that's why i had written [initbang], which > unfortunately never made it into Pd. >> so you need a way to code a "free" or "delete" routine as well. > that's why i had written [closebang], which (surprise!) never made it > into Pd either Well, you could start a fund for this feature on paypal, the Miller-SourceForge Bug Ticket Denial-of-Service Attack Fund (MSFBTDoSAF). Because if someone doesn't understand, then maybe the message has to be repeated. kidding, of course. _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From zmoelnig at iem.at Sat Mar 14 16:20:16 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?IOhannes_m_zm=F6lnig?=) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 15:20:16 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <518fe7b20903140705x49f7a617paf0796850407e057@mail.gmail.com> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> <49B931F5.80107@ucdavis.edu> <20090312164311.GF8088@footils.org> <7aaf8bb90903121621o6547cfa4l72c207b864af6beb@mail.gmail.com> <518fe7b20903140705x49f7a617paf0796850407e057@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49BBCBB8.1050809@iem.at> Charles Henry wrote: > > There is a way to write the code for a "new" or "create" routine in > your class via [loadbang], where did you get that impression from? [loadbang] does _not_ work as a constructor (it's too late). that's why i had written [initbang], which unfortunately never made it into Pd. > so you need a way to code a "free" or > "delete" routine as well. that's why i had written [closebang], which (surprise!) never made it into Pd either mfga.s IOhannes From errordeveloper at gmail.com Sat Mar 14 21:04:24 2009 From: errordeveloper at gmail.com (errordeveloper at gmail.com) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 20:04:24 -0000 Subject: [PD] GEM on Linux netbook In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20090314200625.GA7254@00110101.errordevlopment.0> On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 10:58:54AM -0500, Ben Baker-Smith wrote: > I currently use a Macbook (OS 10.5) for all my PD patching. However, as I > am primarily focused on using GEM for live video performance alongside > musical groups, I am thinking about getting a second laptop for performances > (to keep my Macbook safe). > > I'm thinking of getting an Acer Aspire One netbook running linux. > better install a popular distro instead of the Linpus thing which acer ships ;) > I'd like to know the pros and cons of this. > > -Will swapping patches between Mac OS and Linux be a problem (I'm guessing > no, but I figured I'd ask)? > > -I've heard of some problems with VGA out on Linux laptops, is this going to > be an issue? what is that about? > > -Does the netbook have enough processing power for general GEM > applications? I'm usually not dealing with video files, but rather particle > generation, shape manipulation, GIF texturing, and audio-response. On my > Macbook (2.0 GHz intel processor) the CPU meter always shows below 50% usage > (of course, that's not to say that it doesn't freeze up and boot me out > sometimes). none of them "netbooks" will cope with that stuff! why did you think of a such low-end machine for such a task?!? > > -Are there any other issues that you think of given this scenario? and if > so, what other affordable/really-cheap laptops are there out there that I > can run linux on? > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From gr at grrrr.org Sat Mar 14 23:14:50 2009 From: gr at grrrr.org (Thomas Grill) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 22:14:50 -0000 Subject: [PD] dyn~ and writesf~? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Hi, an example patch would be helpful - i have not encountered any problems so far. gr~~~ 2009/3/14 Jo?o Pais : > Hi, > > I was trying to use a writesf~ inside a dyn~ (xp). The audio files get > generated, but with no audio inside. Does anyone used this combination > sucessfully so far? (XP here) > All the connections were in place, of course. > > I haven't any example patch here, but maybe can send it later. > > Best, > > Jo?o Pais > > -- > Friedenstr. 58 > 10249 Berlin (Deutschland) > Tel +49 30 42020091 | Mob +49 162 6843570 > jmmmpais at googlemail.com | skype: jmmmpjmmmp > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -- Thomas Grill http://grrrr.org From jmmmpais at googlemail.com Sun Mar 15 03:44:15 2009 From: jmmmpais at googlemail.com (=?iso-8859-15?Q?Jo=E3o_Pais?=) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 02:44:15 -0000 Subject: [PD] dyn~ and writesf~? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: here it is. it needs my abstraction rec-name. in case you don't have pd-ext, I send it with this. just to repeat, output of this patch is an empty audio file - the duration is right. > Hi, an example patch would be helpful - i have not encountered any > problems so far. > gr~~~ > > 2009/3/14 Jo?o Pais : >> Hi, >> >> I was trying to use a writesf~ inside a dyn~ (xp). The audio files get >> generated, but with no audio inside. Does anyone used this combination >> sucessfully so far? (XP here) >> All the connections were in place, of course. >> >> I haven't any example patch here, but maybe can send it later. >> >> Best, >> >> Jo?o Pais >> >> -- >> Friedenstr. 58 >> 10249 Berlin (Deutschland) >> Tel +49 30 42020091 | Mob +49 162 6843570 >> jmmmpais at googlemail.com | skype: jmmmpjmmmp >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> > > > -- Friedenstr. 58 10249 Berlin (Deutschland) Tel +49 30 42020091 | Mob +49 162 6843570 jmmmpais at googlemail.com | skype: jmmmpjmmmp -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: aufnahme~-dyn.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 1019 bytes Desc: not available URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: rec-name.pd Type: application/octet-stream Size: 3481 bytes Desc: not available URL: From danomatika at gmail.com Sun Mar 15 04:26:20 2009 From: danomatika at gmail.com (danomatika) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 03:26:20 -0000 Subject: [PD] Unified Library was Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! Message-ID: <1237087717.7695.8.camel@danoT500> Count me in ... I think we just need to make a wiki page and all agree on patching conventions as well as who can/should do what ... oh and mailing lists? My patches are focused on allowing me to playback midi files to run a drum machine, live effects for guitar and vocals, generative or sequenced analog style bass/lead synths, and easy mixing/bussing etc. I do not have a dsp/digital approach to Pd, but I'm sure there's plenty who do ... this could be a good collaborative project for sure. i think this idea of making a unified library of patches is fantastic. but i don't think it should be a project given to a student with little experience in pd. i'd be more than happy to help out. what would be the best way to set up communications between us, if we take this on? that would be the first step i guess. --- Dan Wilcox danomatika.com robotcowboy.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From kyleklip at gmail.com Sun Mar 15 05:03:23 2009 From: kyleklip at gmail.com (Kyle Klipowicz) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 04:03:23 -0000 Subject: [PD] Unified Library was Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <1237087717.7695.8.camel@danoT500> References: <1237087717.7695.8.camel@danoT500> Message-ID: Maybe take a vote and see what convention is most popular: pdmtl, s-abstractions, rjlib, netpd, or others I am not remembering. Then, figure out which items from other libraries should be ported first to this convention. Next, give this library a special status within Pd-extended so that people know they can go to it very easily, rather than getting mired down in the list of funny names that is currently the examples folder. A wiki is a good idea for the API f'sho. I am thinking pdmtl right now, but have not looked at s-abs or rjlib very closely. Netpd is very nice too, just needs to be categorized like pdmtl. ~Kyle On Sat, Mar 14, 2009 at 10:28 PM, danomatika wrote: > Count me in ... I think we just need to make a wiki page and all agree on > patching conventions as well as who can/should do what ... oh and mailing > lists? > > My patches are focused on allowing me to playback midi files to run a drum > machine, live effects for guitar and vocals, generative or sequenced analog > style bass/lead synths, and easy mixing/bussing etc. I do not have a > dsp/digital approach to Pd, but I'm sure there's plenty who do ... this > could be a good collaborative project for sure. > > i think this idea of making a unified library of patches is fantastic. > but > i don't think it should be a project given to a student with little > experience in pd. > > i'd be more than happy to help out. > > what would be the best way to set up communications between us, if we take > this on? that would be the first step i guess. > > --- > Dan Wilcox > danomatika.com > robotcowboy.com > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > -- ----- ------------ ---- ----- ---- -------- - ------ http://perhapsidid.wordpress.com http://myspace.com/kyleklipowicz -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hard.off at gmail.com Sun Mar 15 07:32:06 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 06:32:06 -0000 Subject: [PD] read sysex files (hex) Message-ID: <161320dd0903142334m2c11d345j8ce900c2f3bdf8db@mail.gmail.com> is there a way to read .syx files in pd? these are in raw hex format. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hard.off at gmail.com Sun Mar 15 08:41:39 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 07:41:39 -0000 Subject: [PD] change samplerate locally Message-ID: <161320dd0903150044o40e499aexd3701171746e3d5b@mail.gmail.com> to re-create the sound of a dx7 i need to change samplerate from my default (44.1khz) to 28khz. globally changing pd's samplerate to 28khz has the intended effect, but i want to be able to run other patches at 44.1khz while running my dx7 at 28khz. i naively tried adding this construct to the output, but the sound is completely wrong: (if it doesn't show, the phasor~ is connected to the right inlet of the [samplehold~]) [inlet~] [phasor~ 28000] | | [samplehold~] | [outlet~] i thought about it for a bit, and i understand why that doesn't work, but i can't think of another solution. is there some way i can 'mimic' 28khz samplerate while running pd at 44.1? or even better, is there some way to locally set the samplerate for a patch? i tried messing round with [block~] but i can't make it do what i need. also, i need to mimic a 12bit DAC~ too. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hard.off at gmail.com Sun Mar 15 09:26:41 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 08:26:41 -0000 Subject: [PD] change samplerate locally In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903150044o40e499aexd3701171746e3d5b@mail.gmail.com> References: <161320dd0903150044o40e499aexd3701171746e3d5b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <161320dd0903150129t293812c0tada3ce93352830b5@mail.gmail.com> so, i thought about this more, and realized that 28hz is quite close to being 2/3 of 44.1 so, it MIGHT be enough to do the following: for every 3 samples, output the first sample, the second sample, and then instead of playing the 3rd sample, repeat the second sample. so, if my block looks like: 0.597, 0.604, 0.628, 0.651.. then the output block would be 0.597, 0.604, 0.604, 0.651 ... i still have no idea how i would do that. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From fbar at footils.org Sun Mar 15 10:46:03 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 09:46:03 -0000 Subject: [PD] 8ch diffusion In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <20090315095019.GB18220@fliwatut.scifi> Hallo, Achim Bornhoeft hat gesagt: // Achim Bornhoeft wrote: > Can anybody help me to extend this patch from 4ch to 8ch? (I found it > somewhere...) Or is there an even easier (better) way to do the same. I > already tried [vbap] but the objects [define_loudspeaker] and [matrix~] > are not recognized by my PD-Extended 40.3 on Max OS 10.5. (see other > attachment). Attached is a cosine-panner that I built to pan sounds accross a 12x5 speaker matrix [1] (with help by Peter Plessas, thanks again!). If you want to pan to that many outputs, I highly recommend to use the iemmatrix objects, they make things much easier. Never use [matrix~] that object is nameclash-polluted, use [mtx_mul~] instead, an example is in the cospan help file. Anway you can pan with just [*~] as well using [cospan], it's just a lot more patching work, more error prone and slower. The basic idea is to create as many [cospan ] objects as you need. Say you want to pan over 4 channels left to right, you create these: [cospan 0 4] [cospan 1 4] [cospan 2 4] [cospan 3 4] and send each of them a position in degrees from 0-360. The left outlet of cospan will output the raw amplitudes of the respective channel, the right one will output messages for [mtx_mul~]. Now if you want two-dimennsional panning, you duplicate the setup for each the vertical or y-axis. See cospan16to9.pd for how I did it for the speaker wall (which is called "16:9" although it only has 12x5 speakers.) HOTH [1] this one: http://footils.org/cms/weblog/2008/jul/28/schusslig-17-beta/ Ciao -- Frank Barknecht Do You RjDj.me? _ ______footils.org__ -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... 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In-Reply-To: References: <1237087717.7695.8.camel@danoT500> Message-ID: <11627B2D-E126-4977-9981-6F46C275CE9A@eds.org> There are lots of great ideas in all of those libraries, and I think Pd would be really well served having a big grand unified collection of libraries. But I think that we don't really know well enough how to do the whole thing right. So we really should think of this as some stepping stones. That is why I have been advocating for people to take on specific libraries first, like a filter lib, or a midi lib, or a mapping lib, etc. Then in thru that process we can both figure out how to build the whole grand unified scheme, and build up the chunks while we are at it. .hc On Mar 15, 2009, at 4:05 AM, Kyle Klipowicz wrote: > Maybe take a vote and see what convention is most popular: pdmtl, s- > abstractions, rjlib, netpd, or others I am not remembering. > > Then, figure out which items from other libraries should be ported > first to this convention. > > Next, give this library a special status within Pd-extended so that > people know they can go to it very easily, rather than getting mired > down in the list of funny names that is currently the examples folder. > > A wiki is a good idea for the API f'sho. I am thinking pdmtl right > now, but have not looked at s-abs or rjlib very closely. Netpd is > very nice too, just needs to be categorized like pdmtl. > > ~Kyle > > On Sat, Mar 14, 2009 at 10:28 PM, danomatika > wrote: > Count me in ... I think we just need to make a wiki page and all > agree on patching conventions as well as who can/should do what ... > oh and mailing lists? > > My patches are focused on allowing me to playback midi files to run > a drum machine, live effects for guitar and vocals, generative or > sequenced analog style bass/lead synths, and easy mixing/bussing > etc. I do not have a dsp/digital approach to Pd, but I'm sure > there's plenty who do ... this could be a good collaborative project > for sure. > > i think this idea of making a unified library of patches is > fantastic. but > i don't think it should be a project given to a student with little > experience in pd. > > i'd be more than happy to help out. > > what would be the best way to set up communications between us, if > we take > this on? that would be the first step i guess. > --- > Dan Wilcox > danomatika.com > robotcowboy.com > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > -- > ----- > ------------ > ---- ----- > ---- -------- - ------ > http://perhapsidid.wordpress.com > http://myspace.com/kyleklipowicz > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Computer science is no more related to the computer than astronomy is related to the telescope. -Edsger Dykstra -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From achim.bornhoeft at googlemail.com Sun Mar 15 16:34:18 2009 From: achim.bornhoeft at googlemail.com (Achim Bornhoeft) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 15:34:18 -0000 Subject: [PD] 8ch diffusion In-Reply-To: <20090315095019.GB18220@fliwatut.scifi> References: <20090315095019.GB18220@fliwatut.scifi> Message-ID: Hello Frank, thank you very much for your patches. I'll have a look at it very soon. Because of [mtx_mul~] I would like to add iemmatrix to my path list. How can I set a new search path for a library when the folder is inside the PD package (because I can't open the PD Contents from the window that opens.) Thanks for help. Achim Am 15.03.2009 um 10:50 schrieb Frank Barknecht: > Hallo, > Achim Bornhoeft hat gesagt: // Achim Bornhoeft wrote: > >> Can anybody help me to extend this patch from 4ch to 8ch? (I found it >> somewhere...) Or is there an even easier (better) way to do the >> same. I >> already tried [vbap] but the objects [define_loudspeaker] and >> [matrix~] >> are not recognized by my PD-Extended 40.3 on Max OS 10.5. (see other >> attachment). > > Attached is a cosine-panner that I built to pan sounds accross a 12x5 > speaker matrix [1] (with help by Peter Plessas, thanks again!). If you > want to pan to that many outputs, I highly recommend to use the > iemmatrix objects, they make things much easier. Never use [matrix~] > that object is nameclash-polluted, use [mtx_mul~] instead, an example > is in the cospan help file. > > Anway you can pan with just [*~] as well using [cospan], it's just a > lot more patching work, more error prone and slower. > > The basic idea is to create as many [cospan ] > objects as you need. Say you want to pan over 4 channels left to > right, you create these: > > [cospan 0 4] > [cospan 1 4] > [cospan 2 4] > [cospan 3 4] > > and send each of them a position in degrees from 0-360. The left > outlet of cospan will output the raw amplitudes of the respective > channel, the right one will output messages for [mtx_mul~]. > > Now if you want two-dimennsional panning, you duplicate the setup for > each the vertical or y-axis. See cospan16to9.pd for how I did it for > the speaker wall (which is called "16:9" although it only has 12x5 > speakers.) > > HOTH > > [1] this one: http://footils.org/cms/weblog/2008/jul/28/schusslig-17-beta/ > > Ciao > -- > Frank Barknecht Do You RjDj.me? _ > ______footils.org__ > help > .pd > > > < > cospan > .pd > > > < > cospan12 > ~ > .pd > > > < > cospan16to9 > ~.pd>_______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list Achim Bornhoeft Neckarhalde 38, D-72070 Tuebingen tel/fax +49 (0)7071 942745 mobil +49 (0)179 6936930 skype:achim.bornhoeft?call www.bornhoeft.org From danomatika at gmail.com Sun Mar 15 17:11:19 2009 From: danomatika at gmail.com (danomatika) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 16:11:19 -0000 Subject: [PD] The PdCon09 webpage is down ... am I too late? Message-ID: <1237133614.11190.0.camel@danoT500> Does the PdCon 09 page work for anyone? Naturally, I forgot to apply and realized it is due today and now the page is down ... :( --- Dan Wilcox danomatika.com robotcowboy.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From gr at grrrr.org Sun Mar 15 17:23:06 2009 From: gr at grrrr.org (Thomas Grill) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 16:23:06 -0000 Subject: [PD] dyn~ and writesf~? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: Thanks - i can reproduce the problem... the solution will take a bit, though. please stand by, gr~~~ Am 15.03.2009 um 03:46 schrieb Jo?o Pais: > here it is. it needs my abstraction rec-name. in case you don't have > pd-ext, I send it with this. > > just to repeat, output of this patch is an empty audio file - the > duration is right. > > >> Hi, an example patch would be helpful - i have not encountered any >> problems so far. >> gr~~~ >> >> 2009/3/14 Jo?o Pais : >>> Hi, >>> >>> I was trying to use a writesf~ inside a dyn~ (xp). The audio files >>> get >>> generated, but with no audio inside. Does anyone used this >>> combination >>> sucessfully so far? (XP here) >>> All the connections were in place, of course. >>> >>> I haven't any example patch here, but maybe can send it later. >>> >>> Best, >>> >>> Jo?o Pais >>> >>> -- >>> Friedenstr. 58 >>> 10249 Berlin (Deutschland) >>> Tel +49 30 42020091 | Mob +49 162 6843570 >>> jmmmpais at googlemail.com | skype: jmmmpjmmmp >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >>> >> >> >> > > > > -- > Friedenstr. 58 > 10249 Berlin (Deutschland) > Tel +49 30 42020091 | Mob +49 162 6843570 > jmmmpais at googlemail.com | skype: jmmmpjmmmp name.pd> From jmmmpais at googlemail.com Sun Mar 15 17:35:12 2009 From: jmmmpais at googlemail.com (=?iso-8859-15?Q?Jo=E3o_Pais?=) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 16:35:12 -0000 Subject: [PD] steep filter? Message-ID: Hi, does anyone has a good suggestion for a very steep filter? Preferably something that cuts through the frequencies without any rollof at all? (if possible) I've tried the iemlib hp10_** filters, also 2 in a row, but the result is still too gradual. Putting 16 lop~ in a row make makes roughly the same result. I wanted to avoid fft filters, because they might alter the original signal. Or is there any other option? (even if it has to be fft) cheers, Jo?o -- Friedenstr. 58 10249 Berlin (Deutschland) Tel +49 30 42020091 | Mob +49 162 6843570 jmmmpais at googlemail.com | skype: jmmmpjmmmp From martin.peach at sympatico.ca Sun Mar 15 17:35:28 2009 From: martin.peach at sympatico.ca (Martin Peach) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 16:35:28 -0000 Subject: [PD] change samplerate locally In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903150044o40e499aexd3701171746e3d5b@mail.gmail.com> References: <161320dd0903150044o40e499aexd3701171746e3d5b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: hard off wrote: > to re-create the sound of a dx7 i need to change samplerate from my > default (44.1khz) to 28khz. > globally changing pd's samplerate to 28khz has the intended effect, but > i want to be able to run other patches at 44.1khz while running my dx7 > at 28khz. > I think that the sound card decides what sample rates you can use, you probably can get 22.5 and 11.25 but not 28. A clean resampling usually would mean sampling at a common multiple of 28kHz and 44.1kHz and then downsampling again, not really feasible with Pd. > i naively tried adding this construct to the output, but the sound is > completely wrong: > (if it doesn't show, the phasor~ is connected to the right inlet of the > [samplehold~]) > > [inlet~] [phasor~ 28000] > | | > [samplehold~] > | > [outlet~] > > i thought about it for a bit, and i understand why that doesn't work, > but i can't think of another solution. > > is there some way i can 'mimic' 28khz samplerate while running pd at > 44.1? or even better, is there some way to locally set the samplerate > for a patch? i tried messing round with [block~] but i can't make it do > what i need. > Unless you're looking for aliasing artifacts, wouldn't it be easier to use a multi-pole low-pass filter at around 14kHz? > also, i need to mimic a 12bit DAC~ too. For that you could multiply the samples by 2048 (for bipolar signal) and then divide them modulo 2048, like this: [*~ 2048] | [expr~ $v1%2048] | [/~ 2048] | [dac~] Martin From hard.off at gmail.com Sun Mar 15 18:31:26 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 17:31:26 -0000 Subject: [PD] change samplerate locally In-Reply-To: References: <161320dd0903150044o40e499aexd3701171746e3d5b@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <161320dd0903151033j7d543672yfb3521e6b466789@mail.gmail.com> hi martin, thanks for taking the time to reply. i can set pd to whatever samplerate i want in media->audio settings. i just checked again going through a whole bunch of values between 22050 and 44100 and they all work. my problem is that the samplerate is global, and i need it only to be local. i think the 'solution' i suggested in my 2nd post is going to be the way to do it, but i just don't know how to do that. [*~ 2048] > | > [expr~ $v1%2048] > | > [/~ 2048] > thanks. that's what i had done originally, but i couldn't hear any effect. i guess if i really want 12-bit sound in pd, i'd have to use that construct after each and every calculation in the signal chain. seems a fair bit of overkill just to make the sound WORSE though! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hard.off at gmail.com Sun Mar 15 18:35:33 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 17:35:33 -0000 Subject: [PD] steep filter? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <161320dd0903151037u6caa3f54p3ac85c7f5546d303@mail.gmail.com> it's not possible to filter without ANY roll-off as far as i know. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From jmmmpais at googlemail.com Sun Mar 15 18:55:58 2009 From: jmmmpais at googlemail.com (=?iso-8859-15?Q?Jo=E3o_Pais?=) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 17:55:58 -0000 Subject: [PD] steep filter? In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903151037u6caa3f54p3ac85c7f5546d303@mail.gmail.com> References: <161320dd0903151037u6caa3f54p3ac85c7f5546d303@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: and close to that? just like the spectral trim in audition or something similar. > it's not possible to filter without ANY roll-off as far as i know. -- Friedenstr. 58 10249 Berlin (Deutschland) Tel +49 30 42020091 | Mob +49 162 6843570 jmmmpais at googlemail.com | skype: jmmmpjmmmp From hard.off at gmail.com Sun Mar 15 19:00:25 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 18:00:25 -0000 Subject: [PD] steep filter? In-Reply-To: References: <161320dd0903151037u6caa3f54p3ac85c7f5546d303@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <161320dd0903151102s1346f4d2kdfb0f94593ea8e28@mail.gmail.com> chebychev filters look good, elliptic ones look better: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Electronic_linear_filters.svg -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hard.off at gmail.com Sun Mar 15 19:24:19 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 18:24:19 -0000 Subject: [PD] change samplerate locally In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903151033j7d543672yfb3521e6b466789@mail.gmail.com> References: <161320dd0903150044o40e499aexd3701171746e3d5b@mail.gmail.com> <161320dd0903151033j7d543672yfb3521e6b466789@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <161320dd0903151126y2432df25s537be23a042564f4@mail.gmail.com> actually, i just checked and that method i suggested before doesn't work at all. it's the same as the [phasor~ 28000] - [samphold~] effect. martin, i missed this part of your mail before: >>Unless you're looking for aliasing artifacts, wouldn't it be easier to use a multi-pole low-pass filter at around 14kHz?<< i just tried that, and i guess what i need must be the aliasing artifacts. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From zmoelnig at iem.at Sun Mar 15 19:55:59 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (=?UTF-8?B?SU9oYW5uZXMgbSB6bcO2bG5pZw==?=) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 18:55:59 -0000 Subject: [PD] The PdCon09 webpage is down ... am I too late? In-Reply-To: <1237133614.11190.0.camel@danoT500> References: <1237133614.11190.0.camel@danoT500> Message-ID: <49BD4FC4.9070103@iem.at> danomatika wrote: > Does the PdCon 09 page work for anyone? > > Naturally, I forgot to apply and realized it is due today and now the > page is down ... :( try these instead: paper submit page: http://pdcon09.devolts.org/author/submit.php paper upload page (once you have submitted it): http://pdcon09.devolts.org/author/upload.php cheers fgmadsr IOhannes From mjmogo at gmail.com Sun Mar 15 20:01:51 2009 From: mjmogo at gmail.com (Mike McGonagle) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 19:01:51 -0000 Subject: [PD] Question on SSSAD and scalability Message-ID: <370dda580903151204v50ab9f58w30abeebe73fbe1cf@mail.gmail.com> Hello all, I was wondering about the scalability of SSSAD. While it is probably not an issue when only a small number of parameters are being used, what would happen when you are creating objects that, themselves, create many parameters? I was noticing that any time I make a change to any of the parameters under SSSAD control, a message gets sent to EVERY OTHER parameter, whether or not it is of the same key. Many of those messages get sent only to be rejected. I was wondering how it might effect things that instead of having the SSSAD bus at all, that a message point would be created for each parameter. We already know that a parameter has a specific unique key, so why not use that to send messages to to change the value of the parameter? It would reduce the number of messages being sent. So, basically, the two things that have changed here is that the SSSAD bus get eliminated, and is replaced by sending a message directly to the parameters key, and in the "loading" process, instead of sending the messages to SSSAD, you would use the first parameter in the saved data stream as the place to send the parameter. I tried to mock up what I am talking about, and have attached it to this email. As far as I can tell, this should be functional replacement for SSSAD, with the exception of having to send the message to the key, rather than SSSAD. Mike PS, if you find this useful, please don't start to use it, as I don't think we really need an alternative to SSSAD, I only make this proposal to see if it would be worthwhile to modify SSSAD. -- Douglas Adams - "I love deadlines. I like the whooshing sound they make as they fly by." -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: aspect_V0.0.zip Type: application/zip Size: 6246 bytes Desc: not available URL: From hans at eds.org Sun Mar 15 20:04:10 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 19:04:10 -0000 Subject: [PD] Pd book sprint in NYC/Berlin Message-ID: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> Hey all, Adam Hyde, Derek Holzer, me, and others are working to organize a Pd book sprint to continue work on the Pure Data book that was started before. It is looking like it will be in early April (soon!) and both in NYC and Berlin, connected via video streams. We are still working out the details, but I just wanted to get the word out now so that people can plan on it and come and participate in Berlin or NYC. One thing that could be very useful is advice on how to best stream this kind of thing. For example, should we use GISS? Ekiga? Skype? .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- 'You people have such restrictive dress for women,? she said, hobbling away in three inch heels and panty hose to finish out another pink- collar temp pool day. - ?Hijab Scene #2", by Mohja Kahf From martin.peach at sympatico.ca Sun Mar 15 19:30:44 2009 From: martin.peach at sympatico.ca (Martin Peach) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 18:30:44 -0000 Subject: [PD] change samplerate locally In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903151033j7d543672yfb3521e6b466789@mail.gmail.com> References: <161320dd0903150044o40e499aexd3701171746e3d5b@mail.gmail.com> <161320dd0903151033j7d543672yfb3521e6b466789@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: hard off wrote: > hi martin, thanks for taking the time to reply. > > i can set pd to whatever samplerate i want in media->audio settings. i > just checked again going through a whole bunch of values between 22050 > and 44100 and they all work. Yes you're right. I should have checked first ;) Maybe writing into a table at 44100 and using [tabread4~] with a signal that is quantized to the ratio of sample rates would work? > > my problem is that the samplerate is global, and i need it only to be > local. i think the 'solution' i suggested in my 2nd post is going to be > the way to do it, but i just don't know how to do that. > > > [*~ 2048] > | > [expr~ $v1%2048] > | > [/~ 2048] > > > thanks. that's what i had done originally, but i couldn't hear any > effect. i guess if i really want 12-bit sound in pd, i'd have to use > that construct after each and every calculation in the signal chain. > seems a fair bit of overkill just to make the sound WORSE though! > > Well 12-bit sound is pretty good, as good as audio cassette with no dolby. You should try replacing 2048 with 128 or less to hear true lo-fi. Martin From schafferdavid at hotmail.com Sun Mar 15 20:11:26 2009 From: schafferdavid at hotmail.com (David Schaffer) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 19:11:26 -0000 Subject: [PD] looking for state saving documentation... Message-ID: Hi everybody, I've been into pd for quite a while now and I feel like I'm slowly reaching musical maturity using this amazing environment, however, there's one big challenge I haven't faced yet: state saving and preset management. I heard about memento, semento, sssad but I'm having troubles knowing which one does what and how to use them. Does anyone know of some tutorial around that could help me? Thank you! David http://www.flickr.com/photos/schafferdavid/ http://audioblog.arteradio.com/David_Schaffer/ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From porres at gmail.com Sun Mar 15 20:28:54 2009 From: porres at gmail.com (Alexandre Porres) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 19:28:54 -0000 Subject: [PD] The PdCon09 webpage is down ... am I too late? Message-ID: <161a0b1e0903151231q158dda33t2bdebd9ba3a2787f@mail.gmail.com> the webpage is down, we are trying to get it up ASAP, a damn back up was schedulled for today... Anyway, you guys can still get the forms at http://porres.googlepages.com/Art.zip http://porres.googlepages.com/Workshop.zip http://porres.googlepages.com/Paper.zip then go to http://pdcon09.devolts.org/openconf.php click at Make a Submission, fill the form, get an ID then go to Upload File to send us the PDFs Sorry for the trouble. other extra files can be sent to pdcon09 at estudiolivre.orgOn Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 3:55 PM, wrote: > Send Pd-list mailing list submissions to > pd-list at iem.at > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > pd-list-request at iem.at > > You can reach the person managing the list at > pd-list-owner at iem.at > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Pd-list digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: Unified Library was Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th > deadline! (hard off) > 2. Re: change samplerate locally (hard off) > 3. Re: steep filter? (hard off) > 4. Re: steep filter? (Jo?o Pais) > 5. Re: steep filter? (hard off) > 6. Re: change samplerate locally (hard off) > 7. Re: change samplerate locally (Martin Peach) > 8. Re: The PdCon09 webpage is down ... am I too late? > (IOhannes m zm?lnig) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 02:00:26 +0900 > From: hard off > Subject: Re: [PD] Unified Library was Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March > 9th deadline! > To: Hans-Christoph Steiner > Cc: danomatika , "pd-list at iem.at" > , Kyle Klipowicz > Message-ID: > <161320dd0903151000n626f6134h19ea91c5757a76a0 at mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > >>But I think that we don't really know well enough how to do the whole > thing right<< > > > i have good experience in doing a library wrong. :) i can at least point > out the flaws in that so they don't get repeated. > > none of the libraries are very good general all-purpose toolkits though, in > my opinion. i guess that's mainly because none of them have really been > designed as general toolkits. there is heaps of good stuff in rjdj, but > it's all for the phone, which has no pd GUI component. netpd on the other > hand, everything has a gui, and it's all designed to work well as a part of > the netpd system. but it's a little bit tricky to then use the netpd > patches outside of netpd. not really spent too much time with pdmtl, but > that just seems like more of a collection of patches than an actual > library. > s-abstractions and the diy library i did both fall down a bit for me > because > they tie the functionality of the patches in too much with the gui and > state > saving. > > i think what hans is talking about and what we are discussing might be > completely different things though. i think hans is talking about a truly > unified library to join together all the different pieces in pd-extended > and > put them all together in a logical and user-friendly manner. which would > be > a pretty massive project, i admit. > > i think though, what we're talking about here is more just like a > collection > of tools to build synths, sequencers, effects, samplers, recorders, > soundfile players, etc etc etc. most of the libraries already mentioned > are > doing that. but the problem is that there are no unified conventions for > patching, naming, licencing, etc. and it would be nice to have all the > best > and most useful bits of each library in one place, all working together, > and > all very simply and easily ported into other pd projects. > > i think it's well within our reach to do that at the moment. > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: < > http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/attachments/20090316/7b3afd16/attachment-0001.htm > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 02:33:50 +0900 > From: hard off > Subject: Re: [PD] change samplerate locally > To: Martin Peach > Cc: Pd List > Message-ID: > <161320dd0903151033j7d543672yfb3521e6b466789 at mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > hi martin, thanks for taking the time to reply. > > i can set pd to whatever samplerate i want in media->audio settings. i > just > checked again going through a whole bunch of values between 22050 and 44100 > and they all work. > > my problem is that the samplerate is global, and i need it only to be > local. i think the 'solution' i suggested in my 2nd post is going to be > the > way to do it, but i just don't know how to do that. > > > [*~ 2048] > > | > > [expr~ $v1%2048] > > | > > [/~ 2048] > > > > thanks. that's what i had done originally, but i couldn't hear any effect. > i guess if i really want 12-bit sound in pd, i'd have to use that construct > after each and every calculation in the signal chain. seems a fair bit of > overkill just to make the sound WORSE though! > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: < > http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/attachments/20090316/af8b9f6f/attachment-0001.htm > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 02:37:58 +0900 > From: hard off > Subject: Re: [PD] steep filter? > To: Jo?o Pais > Cc: PD-List > Message-ID: > <161320dd0903151037u6caa3f54p3ac85c7f5546d303 at mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > it's not possible to filter without ANY roll-off as far as i know. > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: < > http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/attachments/20090316/7c76d73b/attachment-0001.htm > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 17:57:52 -0000 > From: Jo?o Pais > Subject: Re: [PD] steep filter? > To: "hard off" > Cc: PD-List > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; delsp=yes; > charset=iso-8859-15 > > and close to that? just like the spectral trim in audition or something > similar. > > > it's not possible to filter without ANY roll-off as far as i know. > > > > -- > Friedenstr. 58 > 10249 Berlin (Deutschland) > Tel +49 30 42020091 | Mob +49 162 6843570 > jmmmpais at googlemail.com | skype: jmmmpjmmmp > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 5 > Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 03:02:49 +0900 > From: hard off > Subject: Re: [PD] steep filter? > To: Jo?o Pais > Cc: PD-List > Message-ID: > <161320dd0903151102s1346f4d2kdfb0f94593ea8e28 at mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > chebychev filters look good, elliptic ones look better: > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Electronic_linear_filters.svg > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: < > http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/attachments/20090316/fd11e740/attachment-0001.htm > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 6 > Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 03:26:44 +0900 > From: hard off > Subject: Re: [PD] change samplerate locally > To: Martin Peach > Cc: Pd List > Message-ID: > <161320dd0903151126y2432df25s537be23a042564f4 at mail.gmail.com> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > actually, i just checked and that method i suggested before doesn't work at > all. it's the same as the [phasor~ 28000] - [samphold~] effect. > > > > martin, i missed this part of your mail before: > > >>Unless you're looking for aliasing artifacts, wouldn't it be easier to > use > a multi-pole low-pass filter at around 14kHz?<< > > i just tried that, and i guess what i need must be the aliasing artifacts. > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: < > http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/attachments/20090316/f4e6b417/attachment-0001.htm > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 7 > Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 14:31:51 -0400 > From: Martin Peach > Subject: Re: [PD] change samplerate locally > To: hard off > Cc: Pd List > Message-ID: > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > > hard off wrote: > > hi martin, thanks for taking the time to reply. > > > > i can set pd to whatever samplerate i want in media->audio settings. i > > just checked again going through a whole bunch of values between 22050 > > and 44100 and they all work. > > Yes you're right. I should have checked first ;) > Maybe writing into a table at 44100 and using [tabread4~] with a signal > that is quantized to the ratio of sample rates would work? > > > > > my problem is that the samplerate is global, and i need it only to be > > local. i think the 'solution' i suggested in my 2nd post is going to be > > the way to do it, but i just don't know how to do that. > > > > > > [*~ 2048] > > | > > [expr~ $v1%2048] > > | > > [/~ 2048] > > > > > > thanks. that's what i had done originally, but i couldn't hear any > > effect. i guess if i really want 12-bit sound in pd, i'd have to use > > that construct after each and every calculation in the signal chain. > > seems a fair bit of overkill just to make the sound WORSE though! > > > > > > Well 12-bit sound is pretty good, as good as audio cassette with no > dolby. You should try replacing 2048 with 128 or less to hear true lo-fi. > > Martin > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 8 > Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 19:58:12 +0100 > From: IOhannes m zm?lnig > Subject: Re: [PD] The PdCon09 webpage is down ... am I too late? > To: danomatika > Cc: "pd-list at iem.at" > Message-ID: <49BD4FC4.9070103 at iem.at> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 > > danomatika wrote: > > Does the PdCon 09 page work for anyone? > > > > Naturally, I forgot to apply and realized it is due today and now the > > page is down ... :( > > try these instead: > > paper submit page: > http://pdcon09.devolts.org/author/submit.php > > paper upload page (once you have submitted it): > http://pdcon09.devolts.org/author/upload.php > > > cheers > > fgmadsr > IOhannes > > > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list mailing list > Pd-list at iem.at > to manage your subscription (including un-subscription) see > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > End of Pd-list Digest, Vol 48, Issue 67 > *************************************** > -- Alexandre Torres Porres cel. (11)8179-6226 Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hans at eds.org Sun Mar 15 20:06:18 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 19:06:18 -0000 Subject: [PD] [PD-announce] Pd Instrument Building talk in Newcastle, March 19th Message-ID: <899F1B71-FCDC-422A-92EC-580D748252D0@eds.org> Hey all, I'll be giving a talk at the Culture Lab in Newcastle this week on Thursday. I'll mostly be talking about the ideas behind the mapping and hid libraries for Pd: http://www.ncl.ac.uk/culturelab/events/item/enabling-the-spirit-of-play-in-musical-instrument-building .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Programs should be written for people to read, and only incidentally for machines to execute. - from Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs _______________________________________________ Pd-announce mailing list Pd-announce at iem.at http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-announce From danomatika at gmail.com Sun Mar 15 20:46:05 2009 From: danomatika at gmail.com (danomatika) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 19:46:05 -0000 Subject: [PD] PD and cpu freq scaling in Linux Message-ID: <1237146509.16094.11.camel@danoT500> Howdy, I recently got a new Thinkpad T500 with a duo core 2.53Ghz processor running Ubuntu Intrepid and was a bit annoyed that I was getting far more audio DIO dropouts in PD than my previous single core Pentium M 2Ghz Thinkpad T42p. Last night I realized that the cpu frequency scaling was actually interfering and running both cores at 800Mhz while I had Jack and PD running in realtime mode! I had little to no dropouts on the T42p since the OnDemand scaling algorithm used by default only had one core to do the work and automatically bumped the cpu to max freq. With two cores it seems to think it can keep the freq lower and I get dropouts. For those of you who might have noticed the same problem ("WTF! How can my NEW FAST machine be running PD like crap!!??!"), you can set the cpu scaling manually. Once I set my machine to Performance it bumped the speed to max and PD runs smooth as silk. (I highly recommend this machine BTW, it is super quiet and super cool temperature wise. My previous Thinkpad feels like a hurricane toaster by comparison) In Gnome you can add the CPU Frequency Scaling Monitor applet or you can use the commandline. SUID root control of the applet is enabled in Intrepid, so you can skip the sudo dpkg-reconfigure gnome-applets step. Hope this helps. --- Dan Wilcox danomatika.com robotcowboy.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From fbar at footils.org Sun Mar 15 21:28:23 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 20:28:23 -0000 Subject: [PD] Question on SSSAD and scalability In-Reply-To: <370dda580903151204v50ab9f58w30abeebe73fbe1cf@mail.gmail.com> References: <370dda580903151204v50ab9f58w30abeebe73fbe1cf@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090315203240.GB1133@fliwatut.scifi> Hallo Mike, yeah, that's a fundamentally different approach: Basically in aspect, you create a lot of global senders and receivers, while in sssad there are only two of these. I think, limiting the amount of globals used in abstraction libraries is important to avoid pitfalls with nameclashes and to give the users of your libraries as much freedom in choosing names as possible. Globals in other programming languages often are avoided for similar reasons: They are too error prone. Now if you really worry about the load of having a lot of [route]-misses when sending message, I'd recommend to use the "local" senders in sssad, that are used when adding a second argument to a [sssad] object: [sssad key $0] will use a bus called [r $0-SSSAD] and [r $0-SSSAD_ADMIN] instead of the global ones. In RjDj's library we only use the local sssads. There is an additional object in each abstracition which connects the local busses to the global "SSSAD" and "SSSAD_ADMIN" bus: It's called [u_loader] in the RjDj library and has its own small number of global senders (RJ_SAVE, ...). By using local sssads you can build a chain of such objects pretty nicely. Ciao -- Frank Mike McGonagle hat gesagt: // Mike McGonagle wrote: > I was wondering about the scalability of SSSAD. While it is probably > not an issue when only a small number of parameters are being used, > what would happen when you are creating objects that, themselves, > create many parameters? > > I was noticing that any time I make a change to any of the parameters > under SSSAD control, a message gets sent to EVERY OTHER parameter, > whether or not it is of the same key. Many of those messages get sent > only to be rejected. > > I was wondering how it might effect things that instead of having the > SSSAD bus at all, that a message point would be created for each > parameter. We already know that a parameter has a specific unique key, > so why not use that to send messages to to change the value of the > parameter? It would reduce the number of messages being sent. > > So, basically, the two things that have changed here is that the SSSAD > bus get eliminated, and is replaced by sending a message directly to > the parameters key, and in the "loading" process, instead of sending > the messages to SSSAD, you would use the first parameter in the saved > data stream as the place to send the parameter. > > I tried to mock up what I am talking about, and have attached it to > this email. As far as I can tell, this should be functional > replacement for SSSAD, with the exception of having to send the > message to the key, rather than SSSAD. > > Mike > > PS, if you find this useful, please don't start to use it, as I don't > think we really need an alternative to SSSAD, I only make this > proposal to see if it would be worthwhile to modify SSSAD. > > -- > > Douglas Adams - "I love deadlines. I like the whooshing sound they > make as they fly by." > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list -- Frank Barknecht Do You RjDj.me? _ ______footils.org__ From fbar at footils.org Sun Mar 15 21:43:01 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 20:43:01 -0000 Subject: [PD] Unified Library was Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903151000n626f6134h19ea91c5757a76a0@mail.gmail.com> References: <1237087717.7695.8.camel@danoT500> <11627B2D-E126-4977-9981-6F46C275CE9A@eds.org> <161320dd0903151000n626f6134h19ea91c5757a76a0@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090315204722.GC1133@fliwatut.scifi> Hallo, hard off hat gesagt: // hard off wrote: > none of the libraries are very good general all-purpose toolkits though, in > my opinion. i guess that's mainly because none of them have really been > designed as general toolkits. there is heaps of good stuff in rjdj, but > it's all for the phone, which has no pd GUI component. Well, the RjDj patches (scenes) are written on a computer as well. The focus on GUI-less objects so far is by design: I believe, that we need to have basic building blocks *without* GUI first (maybe you remember the list thread about a dsp or "tilde" library? That had an influence on the RjDj design). Later we can decorate any abstraction with GUIs, provided the basic block offer a standardized communication interface. In RjDj the rightmost inlet in (most) abstractions is this interface: This inlet accepts tagged messages like "freq " or "delay " or "note ". RjDjlib includes a handful of custom GUI elements which just are GOP wrappers around sliders, numbers etc. that automatically create these messages. For example you can create a [g_hsl freq 0 22050] to get a slider GUI, that will have a range of 0...22050 and outputs messages like "freq " and can be set with "freq " messages to its inlet. The g_* abstractions in RjDj all can be chained: [g_hsl pitch 0 127] | [g_hsl vel 0 127] | [g_hradio octave 4] | [mycoolsynthesiszer] so GUIs can be built in a consistent way and they can even be reused in parts. Having the GUI separate from the DSP abstraction also makes polyphony easy: You can use just one GUI to control many voices in a synth. Ciao -- Frank Barknecht Do You RjDj.me? _ ______footils.org__ From morph_2016 at yahoo.co.uk Sun Mar 15 22:55:44 2009 From: morph_2016 at yahoo.co.uk (Ed Kelly) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 21:55:44 -0000 Subject: [PD] PDCon09 deadline - Sao Paulo? Message-ID: <612581.74364.qm@web26303.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Hi chaps, Sorry I've been away, but life happened! Please please tell me the deadline for the Sao Paulo convention is Brazil time - I'll be up until 3am GMT finishing this at least. Luv u all, Ed Lone Shark: Synchromatic: Out December 1st 2008 http://www.pyramidtransmissions.com/store Also available through the iTunes store From morph_2016 at yahoo.co.uk Sun Mar 15 22:58:24 2009 From: morph_2016 at yahoo.co.uk (Ed Kelly) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 21:58:24 -0000 Subject: [PD] Unified Library was Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! Message-ID: <614691.50386.qm@web26304.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Back again... I think those who are really interested in a library of objects, suitable for early users (I hate the term 'beginners') to explore acoustics, synthesis etc, will be interested in Metastudio 0.3, which will be released soon, with full help files for each object. I'll SVN it when I have a candidate for release. I am really close to completion, and it's nicely deep! I mean it has usability for the early user and deep structure for the more adventurous type. I'm putting together my workshop proposal/paper/gig now. I'll email once I've finished that with some working examples. Anything PD is just an abstraction. In theory, any group of abstractions can be built to teach or to play. The wonderful thing about PD is that teaching and playing are only a cut-and-paste away, or an abstraction call within a PD patch. Well...I got work to do. ED Lone Shark: Synchromatic: Out December 1st 2008 http://www.pyramidtransmissions.com/store Also available through the iTunes store --- On Sun, 15/3/09, Frank Barknecht wrote: > From: Frank Barknecht > Subject: Re: [PD] Unified Library was Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! > To: pd-list at iem.at, "Kyle Klipowicz" > Date: Sunday, 15 March, 2009, 8:47 PM > > -----Inline Attachment Follows----- > > Hallo, > hard off hat gesagt: // hard off wrote: > > > none of the libraries are very good general > all-purpose toolkits though, in > > my opinion.? i guess that's mainly because none > of them have really been > > designed as general toolkits.? there is heaps of > good stuff in rjdj, but > > it's all for the phone, which has no pd GUI component. > > > Well, the RjDj patches (scenes) are written on a computer > as well. > > The focus on GUI-less objects so far is by design: I > believe, that we > need to have basic building blocks *without* GUI first > (maybe you > remember the list thread about a dsp or "tilde" library? > That had an > influence on the RjDj design). Later we can decorate any > abstraction > with GUIs, provided the basic block offer a standardized > communication > interface. > > In RjDj the rightmost inlet in (most) abstractions is this > interface: > This inlet accepts tagged messages like "freq " > or "delay " > or "note ". RjDjlib includes a > handful of custom GUI > elements which just are GOP wrappers around sliders, > numbers etc. that > automatically create these messages. For example you can > create a > [g_hsl freq 0 22050] to get a slider GUI, that will have a > range of > 0...22050 and outputs messages like "freq " > and can be set with > "freq " messages to its inlet. > > The g_* abstractions in RjDj all can be chained: > > [g_hsl pitch 0 127] > | > [g_hsl vel 0 127] > | > [g_hradio octave 4] > | > [mycoolsynthesiszer] > > so GUIs can be built in a consistent way and they can even > be reused > in parts. > > Having the GUI separate from the DSP abstraction also makes > polyphony > easy: You can use just one GUI to control many voices in a > synth. > > Ciao > -- > Frank Barknecht? ? ? ? ? ? > Do You RjDj.me?? ? ? ? ? _ > ______footils.org__ > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at > mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > From marius.schebella at gmail.com Mon Mar 16 00:21:18 2009 From: marius.schebella at gmail.com (marius schebella) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 23:21:18 -0000 Subject: [PD] The PdCon09 webpage is UP In-Reply-To: <161a0b1e0903151616te0a4f36g8a069a3c8c2328d9@mail.gmail.com> References: <161a0b1e0903151616te0a4f36g8a069a3c8c2328d9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49BD8DFA.4030102@gmail.com> and the deadline is at midnight? marius. Alexandre Porres wrote: > http://convention.puredata.info > > is back on air > > hope you have seen it... > > cheers > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From porres at gmail.com Mon Mar 16 00:37:30 2009 From: porres at gmail.com (Alexandre Porres) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 23:37:30 -0000 Subject: [PD] The PdCon09 webpage is UP In-Reply-To: <49BD8DFA.4030102@gmail.com> References: <161a0b1e0903151616te0a4f36g8a069a3c8c2328d9@mail.gmail.com> <49BD8DFA.4030102@gmail.com> Message-ID: <161a0b1e0903151639i1f456a5cw23d14945a30de3c9@mail.gmail.com> oficial deadline is about 3:30h from now. midnight UTC-3 but we are being flexible and comprehensive as a lot of people are in trouble... thanks for the submitions :) On Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 8:23 PM, marius schebella < marius.schebella at gmail.com> wrote: > and the deadline is at midnight? > marius. > > Alexandre Porres wrote: > >> http://convention.puredata.info >> is back on air >> >> hope you have seen it... >> >> cheers >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >> > > -- Alexandre Torres Porres cel. (11)8179-6226 Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From porres at gmail.com Mon Mar 16 00:41:54 2009 From: porres at gmail.com (Alexandre Porres) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 23:41:54 -0000 Subject: [PD] The PdCon09 webpage is UP (use our submission system) Message-ID: <161a0b1e0903151644r4ee0d460rc6825528aef3be64@mail.gmail.com> It is up, but, all details are there... but for those who have read the page ( http://convention.puredata.info ) and are familiar with it.. just get the forms at http://porres.googlepages.com/Art.zip http://porres.googlepages.com/Workshop.zip http://porres.googlepages.com/Paper.zip then go to http://pdcon09.devolts.org/openconf.php click at Make a Submission, fill the form, get an ID then go to Upload File to send us the PDFs Sorry for the trouble. On Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 8:39 PM, Alexandre Porres wrote: > oficial deadline is about 3:30h from now. midnight UTC-3 > but we are being flexible and comprehensive as a lot of people are in > trouble... > > thanks for the submitions > > :) > > > On Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 8:23 PM, marius schebella < > marius.schebella at gmail.com> wrote: > >> and the deadline is at midnight? >> marius. >> >> Alexandre Porres wrote: >> >>> http://convention.puredata.info >>> is back on air >>> >>> hope you have seen it... >>> >>> cheers >>> >>> >>> ------------------------------------------------------------------------ >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Pd-list at iem.at mailing list >>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >>> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list >>> >> >> > > > -- > Alexandre Torres Porres > cel. (11)8179-6226 > Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home > http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres > > -- Alexandre Torres Porres cel. (11)8179-6226 Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From morph_2016 at yahoo.co.uk Mon Mar 16 00:56:42 2009 From: morph_2016 at yahoo.co.uk (Ed Kelly) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 23:56:42 -0000 Subject: [PD] The PdCon09 webpage is UP (use our submission system) Message-ID: <907502.38560.qm@web26308.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> i am one of those people who are in trouble! But...blessed chance, I am not alone! ed Lone Shark: Synchromatic: Out December 1st 2008 http://www.pyramidtransmissions.com/store Also available through the iTunes store --- On Sun, 15/3/09, Alexandre Porres wrote: > From: Alexandre Porres > Subject: Re: [PD] The PdCon09 webpage is UP (use our submission system) > To: "pd-list" > Date: Sunday, 15 March, 2009, 11:44 PM > It is up, but, all details > are there... but for those who have read the page ( http://convention.puredata.info > ) and are familiar with it.. just?get the forms > at > > http://porres.googlepages.com/Art.zip > http://porres.googlepages.com/Workshop.zip > > http://porres.googlepages.com/Paper.zip > > then go to > > http://pdcon09.devolts.org/openconf.php > > > click at Make a Submission, fill the form, get an ID > > then go to Upload File to send us the PDFs > > Sorry for the trouble. > > > On Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 8:39 PM, > Alexandre Porres > wrote: > > oficial > deadline is about 3:30h from now. midnight UTC-3 > but we are being flexible and comprehensive as a > lot of people are in trouble... > > thanks for the submitions > > :) > > On Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 8:23 PM, > marius schebella > wrote: > > > and the > deadline is at midnight? > > marius. > > > > Alexandre Porres wrote: > > > http://convention.puredata.info > > > is back on air > > > > hope you have seen it... > > > > cheers > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Pd-list at iem.at > mailing list > > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > > > > -- > Alexandre Torres Porres > cel. (11)8179-6226 > Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home > > http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres > > > > > > > > -- > Alexandre Torres Porres > cel. (11)8179-6226 > Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home > http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres > > > > > > -----Inline Attachment Follows----- > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at > mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > From santorcuato76 at gmail.com Mon Mar 16 01:40:00 2009 From: santorcuato76 at gmail.com (Jose Luis Santorcuato) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 00:40:00 -0000 Subject: [PD] from Chile greetings Message-ID: <4345df630903151742u1116bf73rd6f2d45fd65af847@mail.gmail.com> Hi my dear friends, this is my first contact with the community...well i like this sinergy... i try go to the convention. Please visit my blog... with love http://arselectronicachile.blogspot.com see you!!!! Jos? Luis -- http://arselectronicachile.blogspot.com/ www.myspace.com/santorcuato -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From amos.robinson at gmail.com Mon Mar 16 01:45:14 2009 From: amos.robinson at gmail.com (Amos Robinson) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 00:45:14 -0000 Subject: [PD] from Chile greetings In-Reply-To: <4345df630903151742u1116bf73rd6f2d45fd65af847@mail.gmail.com> References: <4345df630903151742u1116bf73rd6f2d45fd65af847@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: On a related note, greetings from Newcastle, Australia. I'm wondering whether there are any other people from Newcastle? On Mon, Mar 16, 2009 at 11:42 AM, Jose Luis Santorcuato wrote: > Hi my dear friends, this is my first contact with the community...well i > like this sinergy... i try go to the convention. > Please visit my blog... with love > > http://arselectronicachile.blogspot.com > > see you!!!! > > Jos? Luis > > -- > http://arselectronicachile.blogspot.com/ > www.myspace.com/santorcuato > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > From jmmmpais at googlemail.com Mon Mar 16 00:42:29 2009 From: jmmmpais at googlemail.com (=?iso-8859-15?Q?Jo=E3o_Pais?=) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 23:42:29 -0000 Subject: [PD] steep filter? In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903151102s1346f4d2kdfb0f94593ea8e28@mail.gmail.com> References: <161320dd0903151037u6caa3f54p3ac85c7f5546d303@mail.gmail.com> <161320dd0903151102s1346f4d2kdfb0f94593ea8e28@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: yes, I had seen that graphic as well. but trying out the highpass iemfilters with noise, turns out that 10 hip~s work better. I looked in my list of pd-ext objects, but found no elliptic filters. are there any, or any way of getting their coefficients to use with biquad~? > chebychev filters look good, elliptic ones look better: > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Electronic_linear_filters.svg -- Friedenstr. 58 10249 Berlin (Deutschland) Tel +49 30 42020091 | Mob +49 162 6843570 jmmmpais at googlemail.com | skype: jmmmpjmmmp From morph_2016 at yahoo.co.uk Mon Mar 16 01:57:19 2009 From: morph_2016 at yahoo.co.uk (Ed Kelly) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 00:57:19 -0000 Subject: [PD] from Chile greetings Message-ID: <254016.56845.qm@web26308.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> And... your timing is impeccable...sort of. Come to Sao Paulo in July. You won't regret it. The best art, by the best people, and in a very best place. Or stay home in CHile, brain your drain! aaa- deadline approacheth! Lone Shark: Synchromatic: Out December 1st 2008 http://www.pyramidtransmissions.com/store Also available through the iTunes store --- On Mon, 16/3/09, Amos Robinson wrote: > From: Amos Robinson > Subject: Re: [PD] from Chile greetings > To: > Cc: pd-list at iem.at > Date: Monday, 16 March, 2009, 12:47 AM > On a related note, greetings from > Newcastle, Australia. I'm wondering > whether there are any other people from Newcastle? > > On Mon, Mar 16, 2009 at 11:42 AM, Jose Luis Santorcuato > > wrote: > > Hi my dear friends, this is my first contact with the > community...well i > > like this sinergy... i try go to the convention. > > Please visit my blog... with love > > > > http://arselectronicachile.blogspot.com > > > > see you!!!! > > > > Jos? Luis > > > > -- > > http://arselectronicachile.blogspot.com/ > > www.myspace.com/santorcuato > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Pd-list at iem.at > mailing list > > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at > mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > From hans at eds.org Mon Mar 16 02:22:37 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 01:22:37 -0000 Subject: [PD] Pd book sprint in NYC/Berlin In-Reply-To: <49BDA282.9040607@gmail.com> References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <49BDA282.9040607@gmail.com> Message-ID: <2D6F62EB-0878-4205-A5EA-AB248E81A93E@eds.org> On Mar 16, 2009, at 12:51 AM, ydegoyon at gmail.com wrote: > ola, >> For example, should we use GISS? Ekiga? Skype? >> > the main difference between a video streaming solution > and a video conference solution ( ekiga, skype ) > is that anybody is able to see what's happening, > e.g. that's it's public > ( no need to authentify and join a conference room ).. > so it depends on what you want.. I think the other key difference is that ekiga/skype are tuned for low latency while streaming is usually tuned to have a big buffer so that the stream doesn't get interrupted. Any idea on the latency of GISS? When I was using Darwin Streaming Server, it usually had a buffer of 10 seconds, which makes live interaction impossible. I suppose we could have one computer streaming and the other doing video conferencing. .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- As we enjoy great advantages from inventions of others, we should be glad of an opportunity to serve others by any invention of ours; and this we should do freely and generously. - Benjamin Franklin From ydegoyon at gmail.com Mon Mar 16 03:10:30 2009 From: ydegoyon at gmail.com (ydegoyon at gmail.com) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 02:10:30 -0000 Subject: [PD] Pd book sprint in NYC/Berlin In-Reply-To: <2D6F62EB-0878-4205-A5EA-AB248E81A93E@eds.org> References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <49BDA282.9040607@gmail.com> <2D6F62EB-0878-4205-A5EA-AB248E81A93E@eds.org> Message-ID: <49BDB5A3.9090606@gmail.com> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > On Mar 16, 2009, at 12:51 AM, ydegoyon at gmail.com wrote: > >> ola, >>> For example, should we use GISS? Ekiga? Skype? >>> >> the main difference between a video streaming solution >> and a video conference solution ( ekiga, skype ) >> is that anybody is able to see what's happening, >> e.g. that's it's public >> ( no need to authentify and join a conference room ).. >> so it depends on what you want.. > > > I think the other key difference is that ekiga/skype are tuned for low > latency while streaming is usually tuned to have a big buffer so that > the stream doesn't get interrupted. the tipical question where there is no answer.. is there an answer to 'how much latency you get with pd compared to using analog sound effects ?' all depends on many parameters and all is setable also, even in the client that receives.. > > Any idea on the latency of GISS? When I was using Darwin Streaming > Server, it usually had a buffer of 10 seconds, nahh, surely less ( except maybe with dv ) xiaoo, sevy From mjmogo at gmail.com Mon Mar 16 03:12:31 2009 From: mjmogo at gmail.com (Mike McGonagle) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 02:12:31 -0000 Subject: [PD] Question on SSSAD and scalability In-Reply-To: <20090315203240.GB1133@fliwatut.scifi> References: <370dda580903151204v50ab9f58w30abeebe73fbe1cf@mail.gmail.com> <20090315203240.GB1133@fliwatut.scifi> Message-ID: <370dda580903151914l5b1b7a4ak3cefed4d7d09b0e5@mail.gmail.com> On Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 3:32 PM, Frank Barknecht wrote: > Hallo Mike, > > yeah, that's a fundamentally different approach: Basically in aspect, > you create a lot of global senders and receivers, while in sssad there > are only two of these. I think, limiting the amount of globals used in > abstraction libraries is important to avoid pitfalls with nameclashes > and to give the users of your libraries as much freedom in choosing > names as possible. Globals in other programming languages often are > avoided for similar reasons: They are too error prone. The context that I was actually thinking was in trying to do "live coding". Of all the times that I have been using SSSAD, my biggest complaint about it is that I would always need to resave, close, and reopen the file. It always seemed that the one instance of an SSSAD reference that I was deleting was the FIRST ONE. Of course, doing that was sure to make that parameters NOT SAVE, unless I reopened. > Now if you really worry about the load of having a lot of > [route]-misses when sending message, I'd recommend to use the "local" > senders in sssad, that are used when adding a second argument to a > [sssad] object: [sssad key $0] will use a bus called [r $0-SSSAD] and > [r $0-SSSAD_ADMIN] instead of the global ones. My whole point of bringing this up has more to do with how an "external" (yes, actual C code) might be able to implement the SSSAD protocol. I can think of MANY EXTERNALS that would benefit by doing this... At the same time, that might make it appear that SSSAD is an accepted standard in Pd. And Miller, himself has written on this very topic... So, what is the means of storing data... is there one? I'm curious, but how many "externals" do you have with RjDj? I can only assume that you can't do too much with it, other than the basic implementation of Pd. Mike -- Douglas Adams - "I love deadlines. I like the whooshing sound they make as they fly by." From hard.off at gmail.com Mon Mar 16 03:59:57 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 02:59:57 -0000 Subject: [PD] Unified Library was Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <614691.50386.qm@web26304.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> References: <614691.50386.qm@web26304.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <161320dd0903152002v4ad053f1r56f5b8edd369fcca@mail.gmail.com> yeah sorry frank, i should have explained more clearly. i also think that no GUI is the way to go for functional abstractions. that was the big flaw of the DIY library i did, that the function of the abstractions was tied in with the gui component. i did it that way because i didn't want to clutter the namespace with too many abstractions, and the thought of one abstraction for function, and then a different one for GUI was not appealing at the time. but now, i think that is the only way to go. like, as you said, for polyphony. and then also for the many many cases in which you'd want to build your own gui for custom control. i do think you guys have got a really really strong system there with rjlib. but i was just saying that without the gui stuff, it doesn't exactly fit into being that 'all purpose building blocks' library that we are discussing. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alex3lucas at googlemail.com Mon Mar 16 08:17:24 2009 From: alex3lucas at googlemail.com (Alex Lucas) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 07:17:24 -0000 Subject: [PD] Problems accessing Pdlist Archives Message-ID: <6b61086c0903160019n17d108b0gde7013ee3a69dd1a@mail.gmail.com> Hello everyone, Over the last couple of days I haven't been able to access the Pdlist Archives by following the link on this page http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list. Has anyone else had the same problem or dose anyone know of an alternative link? Thanks Alex -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From fbar at footils.org Mon Mar 16 08:52:20 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 07:52:20 -0000 Subject: [PD] Question on SSSAD and scalability In-Reply-To: <370dda580903151914l5b1b7a4ak3cefed4d7d09b0e5@mail.gmail.com> References: <370dda580903151204v50ab9f58w30abeebe73fbe1cf@mail.gmail.com> <20090315203240.GB1133@fliwatut.scifi> <370dda580903151914l5b1b7a4ak3cefed4d7d09b0e5@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090316075444.GA15510@footils.org> Hallo, Mike McGonagle hat gesagt: // Mike McGonagle wrote: > On Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 3:32 PM, Frank Barknecht wrote: > > The context that I was actually thinking was in trying to do "live > coding". Of all the times that I have been using SSSAD, my biggest > complaint about it is that I would always need to resave, close, and > reopen the file. It always seemed that the one instance of an SSSAD > reference that I was deleting was the FIRST ONE. Of course, doing that > was sure to make that parameters NOT SAVE, unless I reopened. A closebang would solve this. It will probably happen less often with local sssads. > > Now if you really worry about the load of having a lot of > > [route]-misses when sending message, I'd recommend to use the "local" > > senders in sssad, that are used when adding a second argument to a > > [sssad] object: [sssad key $0] will use a bus called [r $0-SSSAD] and > > [r $0-SSSAD_ADMIN] instead of the global ones. > > My whole point of bringing this up has more to do with how an > "external" (yes, actual C code) might be able to implement the SSSAD > protocol. I can think of MANY EXTERNALS that would benefit by doing > this... > > At the same time, that might make it appear that SSSAD is an accepted > standard in Pd. And Miller, himself has written on this very topic... > So, what is the means of storing data... is there one? Storing data is not in the realm of sssad - again this is by design and comes from my experience with RRADical/Memento where the storage was inside the saving system and tied to [pool]. SSSAD is intended to to just one thing but do that right: Its purpose is to eavesdrop on the messages that objects send to each other and distribute them to rsp. modify them from a central place. That's all. What comes after that central place is up to the end user. It would be easy to make an external that does the same. sssad is just a wrapper around [list], [route] [send] and [receive]. One "S" in its name stands for "simple". ;) > I'm curious, but how many "externals" do you have with RjDj? I can > only assume that you can't do too much with it, other than the basic > implementation of Pd. Hm, I don't understand this question? RjDj is pretty much pure Pd and has almost no externals at all - which doesn't mean that you can't do much with it: For audio work Pd is very powerful and no externals are (strictly) necessary. Ciao -- Frank From zmoelnig at iem.at Mon Mar 16 09:00:02 2009 From: zmoelnig at iem.at (IOhannes m zmoelnig) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 08:00:02 -0000 Subject: [PD] The PdCon09 webpage is down ... am I too late? In-Reply-To: <1237145750.15917.3.camel@danoT500> References: <1237133614.11190.0.camel@danoT500> <49BD4FC4.9070103@iem.at> <1237145750.15917.3.camel@danoT500> Message-ID: <49BE0795.2050309@iem.at> danomatika wrote: > On Sun, 2009-03-15 at 19:58 +0100, IOhannes m zm?lnig wrote: > >> paper submit page: >> http://pdcon09.devolts.org/author/submit.php >> >> paper upload page (once you have submitted it): >> http://pdcon09.devolts.org/author/upload.php > > Thanks IOhannes, but I'm looking for the performance application ... > you can (or "could", by now) submit performances, installations, workshops and papers with the above two links. fgmasdr mfasdf. IOhannes -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: smime.p7s Type: application/x-pkcs7-signature Size: 3636 bytes Desc: S/MIME Cryptographic Signature URL: From morph_2016 at yahoo.co.uk Mon Mar 16 08:35:47 2009 From: morph_2016 at yahoo.co.uk (Ed Kelly) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 07:35:47 -0000 Subject: [PD] The PdCon09 webpage is UP Message-ID: <222070.83944.qm@web26306.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> AAArgh Should I send the paper? Please be gentle with me! Ed Lone Shark: Synchromatic: Out December 1st 2008 http://www.pyramidtransmissions.com/store Also available through the iTunes store --- On Sun, 15/3/09, Alexandre Porres wrote: > From: Alexandre Porres > Subject: Re: [PD] The PdCon09 webpage is UP > To: "marius schebella" , "pd-list" > Date: Sunday, 15 March, 2009, 11:39 PM > oficial deadline is about 3:30h from > now. midnight UTC-3 > but we are being flexible and comprehensive as a > lot of people are in trouble... > thanks for the submitions > > :) > > On Sun, Mar 15, 2009 at 8:23 PM, > marius schebella > wrote: > > and the > deadline is at midnight? > > marius. > > > > Alexandre Porres wrote: > > > http://convention.puredata.info > > > is back on air > > > > hope you have seen it... > > > > cheers > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Pd-list at iem.at > mailing list > > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > > > > > > > -- > Alexandre Torres Porres > cel. (11)8179-6226 > Website: http://porres.googlepages.com/home > http://www.myspace.com/alexandretorresporres > > > > > > -----Inline Attachment Follows----- > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at > mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > From fbar at footils.org Mon Mar 16 09:28:32 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 08:28:32 -0000 Subject: [PD] Unified Library was Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <161320dd0903152002v4ad053f1r56f5b8edd369fcca@mail.gmail.com> References: <614691.50386.qm@web26304.mail.ukl.yahoo.com> <161320dd0903152002v4ad053f1r56f5b8edd369fcca@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090316083059.GC15510@footils.org> Hallo, hard off hat gesagt: // hard off wrote: > yeah sorry frank, i should have explained more clearly. > > i also think that no GUI is the way to go for functional abstractions. that > was the big flaw of the DIY library i did, that the function of the > abstractions was tied in with the gui component. i did it that way because > i didn't want to clutter the namespace with too many abstractions, and the > thought of one abstraction for function, and then a different one for GUI > was not appealing at the time. > > but now, i think that is the only way to go. like, as you said, for > polyphony. and then also for the many many cases in which you'd want to > build your own gui for custom control. Yeah, basically that was all I wanted to say as well. ;) > i do think you guys have got a really really strong system there with > rjlib. but i was just saying that without the gui stuff, it doesn't exactly > fit into being that 'all purpose building blocks' library that we are > discussing. Yes, that's true. rjlib has its focus on audio and control abstractions to be used on mobile devices with vanilla Pd. Some of this fits into a "all purpose" library, but a lot of it doesn't. Ciao -- Frank From derek at umatic.nl Mon Mar 16 09:39:21 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 08:39:21 -0000 Subject: [PD] Pd book sprint in NYC/Berlin In-Reply-To: <49BDB5A3.9090606@gmail.com> References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <49BDA282.9040607@gmail.com> <2D6F62EB-0878-4205-A5EA-AB248E81A93E@eds.org> <49BDB5A3.9090606@gmail.com> Message-ID: <49BE10BC.4010908@umatic.nl> My tendency is to keep everything as simple and low-tech as possible. Does video conferencing add anything substantial that IRC doesn't have already? Do we want to do interpretive dance for each other in order to write a FLOSS manual? Do we really need to look at another room full of people sitting behind laptops across the ocean somewhere? Does anybody ever actually watch these video streams from meetings like these? I could see some sense if there was some sort of presentation aspect, but these will be working sessions, i.e. very boring to look at . D. -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 15: "Ask your body" From jaime.oliver2 at gmail.com Mon Mar 16 09:47:26 2009 From: jaime.oliver2 at gmail.com (Jaime Oliver) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 08:47:26 -0000 Subject: [PD] The PdCon09 webpage is down ... am I too late? In-Reply-To: <49BE0795.2050309@iem.at> References: <1237133614.11190.0.camel@danoT500> <49BD4FC4.9070103@iem.at> <1237145750.15917.3.camel@danoT500> <49BE0795.2050309@iem.at> Message-ID: <616283880903160149i6d48d63br41d7f8bc5c8197ba@mail.gmail.com> hi everyone i have been trying for hours to upload the pdf form, but it doesn't work for me, should I just try to send it by e-mail? J On Mon, Mar 16, 2009 at 1:02 AM, IOhannes m zmoelnig wrote: > danomatika wrote: >> >> On Sun, 2009-03-15 at 19:58 +0100, IOhannes m zm?lnig wrote: >> >>> paper submit page: >>> http://pdcon09.devolts.org/author/submit.php >>> >>> paper upload page (once you have submitted it): >>> http://pdcon09.devolts.org/author/upload.php >> >> Thanks IOhannes, but I'm looking for the performance application ... >> > > you can (or "could", by now) submit performances, installations, workshops > and papers with the above two links. > > fgmasdr > mfasdf. > IOhannes > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > -- Jaime E Oliver LR joliverl at ucsd.edu www.realidadvisual.org/jaimeoliver www-crca.ucsd.edu/ www.realidadvisual.org 858 202 1522 9168 Regents Rd. Apt. G La Jolla, CA 92037 USA From grh at mur.at Mon Mar 16 09:51:55 2009 From: grh at mur.at (Georg Holzmann) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 08:51:55 -0000 Subject: [PD] Pd book sprint in NYC/Berlin In-Reply-To: <49BE10BC.4010908@umatic.nl> References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> <49BDA282.9040607@gmail.com> <2D6F62EB-0878-4205-A5EA-AB248E81A93E@eds.org> <49BDB5A3.9090606@gmail.com> <49BE10BC.4010908@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <49BE13B4.4030400@mur.at> Derek Holzer schrieb: > My tendency is to keep everything as simple and low-tech as possible. > Does video conferencing add anything substantial that IRC doesn't have > already? Do we want to do interpretive dance for each other in order to > write a FLOSS manual? Do we really need to look at another room full of > people sitting behind laptops across the ocean somewhere? Does anybody > ever actually watch these video streams from meetings like these? I > could see some sense if there was some sort of presentation aspect, but > these will be working sessions, i.e. very boring to look at . You are right. And if one really wants to speak/see each other, one can use ekiga, skype or whatever ... LG Georg From derek at umatic.nl Mon Mar 16 09:55:04 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 08:55:04 -0000 Subject: [PD] Problems accessing Pdlist Archives In-Reply-To: <6b61086c0903160019n17d108b0gde7013ee3a69dd1a@mail.gmail.com> References: <6b61086c0903160019n17d108b0gde7013ee3a69dd1a@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <49BE147A.4080709@umatic.nl> Hi Alex, I had the same problem yesterday. There are three alternates listed at: http://puredata.info/community/lists Gmane, Mail Archive and Markmail. One of those should work for you. best! Derek Alex Lucas wrote: > Hello everyone, > > Over the last couple of days I haven't been able to access the Pdlist > Archives by following the link on this page > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list. Has anyone else had the > same problem or dose anyone know of an alternative link? -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 173: "Voice your suspicions" From rorywalsh at ear.ie Wed Mar 11 15:43:34 2009 From: rorywalsh at ear.ie (Rory Walsh) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 14:43:34 -0000 Subject: [PD] dynamic creation arguments for route Message-ID: <80ace1a10903110745y5b412b21nad266e33850132f0@mail.gmail.com> Is is possible to dynamically alter the creation arguments for a route object? I'm currently building a patch that receives OSC messages which I want to parse using route. Each relevant message I would like to grab starts with a unique integer ID. I would like to pass this unique ID to my route object each time the ID changes so that I can retrieve the data which follows it. Any ideas? Rory. From hans at eds.org Wed Mar 11 16:10:43 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 15:10:43 -0000 Subject: [PD] last call for gsoc mentors Message-ID: <9DF373BD-36D1-42C8-AD98-0BA9158C3EA8@eds.org> Hey, I am going to submit the application today, it turns out it is due on the 13th, the app opened on the 9th. Everyone got their gmail accounts listed on the app? http://puredata.info/dev/summer-of-code/GSoCOrganizationApp2009 .hc ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- "[W]e have invented the technology to eliminate scarcity, but we are deliberately throwing it away to benefit those who profit from scarcity." -John Gilmore From cgclepper at gmail.com Wed Mar 11 17:47:13 2009 From: cgclepper at gmail.com (chris clepper) Date: Wed, 11 Mar 2009 16:47:13 -0000 Subject: [PD] GEM on Linux netbook In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: On Linux the Nvidia GPU is the way to go for GEM. You could probably get acceptable performance for basic GEM use from the Acer, but what takes most of the CPU to do with the Intel GMA processor barely taxes a modern GPU. For example, I have measured performance between a MacBook/Mac Mini and MacBook Pro where the Pro was 40x faster because of the GPU! There are netbooks with NV chips in them, but they cost a little more: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16834220385 cgc On Wed, Mar 11, 2009 at 11:58 AM, Ben Baker-Smith wrote: > I currently use a Macbook (OS 10.5) for all my PD patching. However, as I > am primarily focused on using GEM for live video performance alongside > musical groups, I am thinking about getting a second laptop for performances > (to keep my Macbook safe). > > I'm thinking of getting an Acer Aspire One netbook running linux. > > I'd like to know the pros and cons of this. > > -Will swapping patches between Mac OS and Linux be a problem (I'm guessing > no, but I figured I'd ask)? > > -I've heard of some problems with VGA out on Linux laptops, is this going > to be an issue? > > -Does the netbook have enough processing power for general GEM > applications? I'm usually not dealing with video files, but rather particle > generation, shape manipulation, GIF texturing, and audio-response. On my > Macbook (2.0 GHz intel processor) the CPU meter always shows below 50% usage > (of course, that's not to say that it doesn't freeze up and boot me out > sometimes). > > -Are there any other issues that you think of given this scenario? and if > so, what other affordable/really-cheap laptops are there out there that I > can run linux on? > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From derek at umatic.nl Thu Mar 12 09:45:13 2009 From: derek at umatic.nl (Derek Holzer) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 08:45:13 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> Message-ID: <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> Hi all and thanks for chiming in on this thread. There was once, long ago, a simple mixer which dynamically created the busses and channels. If anyone can remember that one, it must have been 5 years ago, and was the first dynamic patch I had ever seen. Also fun, non-utilitarian ones, like once someone sent some kind of "card" to the list which just made a huge self-generating GUI art-mess on the screen. I wish I could remember who wrote it. Lastly, IOhannes showed a very nice self-modifying patch at Piksel last December using iemguts. best! Derek -- ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: ---Oblique Strategy # 130: "Question the heroic" From matju at artengine.ca Thu Mar 12 20:01:21 2009 From: matju at artengine.ca (Mathieu Bouchard) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 19:01:21 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <20090312164311.GF8088@footils.org> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <49B8109C.6080608@ucdavis.edu> <7861F5D8-29C8-4DFD-B2B8-517A5F3BB497@revolwear.com> <49B8CC22.8050708@umatic.nl> <49B8D039.6010004@iem.at> <49B931F5.80107@ucdavis.edu> <20090312164311.GF8088@footils.org> Message-ID: On Thu, 12 Mar 2009, Frank Barknecht wrote: > A loadbanged [; pd-subpatch clear( IMO is mandatory for dynamic patching in > abstractions. Even if it's saved with old content that will be removed on the > next load. It's not sufficient because you could be getting error messages from dynamically patched abstractions, or other strange behaviour. For example, if I make an [#out window], or an [#out] to which I send "open window", then on next load of any [#out] you will see a window open, and on any [#out window] you will see a window open, close, and open again. In other circumstances, I could get a "no such directory" error everytime I load, because I saved [#out] while it was writing a movie, and the directory has been renamed or removed or it's just a different machine... _ _ __ ___ _____ ________ _____________ _____________________ ... | Mathieu Bouchard - t?l:+1.514.383.3801, Montr?al, Qu?bec From hans at eds.org Fri Mar 13 16:08:25 2009 From: hans at eds.org (Hans-Christoph Steiner) Date: Fri, 13 Mar 2009 15:08:25 -0000 Subject: [PD] visible bang without output In-Reply-To: <49BA4363.4080106@yahoo.fr> References: <49BA4363.4080106@yahoo.fr> Message-ID: Make a GOP that uses the set message to control a spigot. .hc On Mar 13, 2009, at 11:28 AM, Nicolas Montgermont wrote: > Hi list, > > Is there a simple solution to have the GUI bang visually shows a > bang but without output? > As the others GUI object do with the set message. > [set bang( outputs a bang. > > Thanks, > > Nicolas > -- > http://nim.on.free.fr > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- You can't steal a gift. Bird gave the world his music, and if you can hear it, you can have it. - Dizzy Gillespie From dmotd at gmx.net Sat Mar 14 18:15:19 2009 From: dmotd at gmx.net (dmotd) Date: Sat, 14 Mar 2009 17:15:19 -0000 Subject: [PD] self-modifying and dynamic patching In-Reply-To: <49BBCBB8.1050809@iem.at> References: <49B7FB09.4060704@umatic.nl> <518fe7b20903140705x49f7a617paf0796850407e057@mail.gmail.com> <49BBCBB8.1050809@iem.at> Message-ID: <200903150301.53050.dmotd@gmx.net> i received this rationale from miller not too long ago for the hesitation in including iohannes' methods: "Anyhow, I'm trying to think of a better mechanism for allowing abstractions to have variable numbers of inlets/outlets, so I'm hoping initbang won't be necessary in the long run. closebang, though, will probably be needed in some form or other." so it's obviously still a work in progress, regardless initbang/closebang are at least fairly consistent with constructor/destructor methods in other languages. we'll see where this goes. cheers, dmotd IOhannes m zm?lnig wrote: > Charles Henry wrote: > > There is a way to write the code for a "new" or "create" routine in > > your class via [loadbang], > > where did you get that impression from? > [loadbang] does _not_ work as a constructor (it's too late). > that's why i had written [initbang], which unfortunately never made it > into Pd. > > > so you need a way to code a "free" or > > "delete" routine as well. > > that's why i had written [closebang], which (surprise!) never made it > into Pd either > > > mfga.s > IOhannes > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list From purengo at gmail.com Sun Mar 15 16:06:34 2009 From: purengo at gmail.com (Nicanor Garcia) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 15:06:34 -0000 Subject: [PD] Pd-extended on AMD 64 Message-ID: <5f57e84f0903150808v565dfe7ctfc3bae5e4cc41fff@mail.gmail.com> Hello, I'm trying to install the published .deb package for amd64 but I'm havint trouble with the needed libs. I'm using a amd64 machine with Studio 64 as OS. When I try to install with dpkg it tells me that I need to have liblame0 installed, but liblame0 is incompatible with libquicktime1 which is also needed to install. I'm a bit novice in linux and I don't know what to do, can anyone help me with this?? Thank you very much. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From hard.off at gmail.com Sun Mar 15 17:58:03 2009 From: hard.off at gmail.com (hard off) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 16:58:03 -0000 Subject: [PD] Unified Library was Re: Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <11627B2D-E126-4977-9981-6F46C275CE9A@eds.org> References: <1237087717.7695.8.camel@danoT500> <11627B2D-E126-4977-9981-6F46C275CE9A@eds.org> Message-ID: <161320dd0903151000n626f6134h19ea91c5757a76a0@mail.gmail.com> >>But I think that we don't really know well enough how to do the whole thing right<< i have good experience in doing a library wrong. :) i can at least point out the flaws in that so they don't get repeated. none of the libraries are very good general all-purpose toolkits though, in my opinion. i guess that's mainly because none of them have really been designed as general toolkits. there is heaps of good stuff in rjdj, but it's all for the phone, which has no pd GUI component. netpd on the other hand, everything has a gui, and it's all designed to work well as a part of the netpd system. but it's a little bit tricky to then use the netpd patches outside of netpd. not really spent too much time with pdmtl, but that just seems like more of a collection of patches than an actual library. s-abstractions and the diy library i did both fall down a bit for me because they tie the functionality of the patches in too much with the gui and state saving. i think what hans is talking about and what we are discussing might be completely different things though. i think hans is talking about a truly unified library to join together all the different pieces in pd-extended and put them all together in a logical and user-friendly manner. which would be a pretty massive project, i admit. i think though, what we're talking about here is more just like a collection of tools to build synths, sequencers, effects, samplers, recorders, soundfile players, etc etc etc. most of the libraries already mentioned are doing that. but the problem is that there are no unified conventions for patching, naming, licencing, etc. and it would be nice to have all the best and most useful bits of each library in one place, all working together, and all very simply and easily ported into other pd projects. i think it's well within our reach to do that at the moment. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From danomatika at gmail.com Sun Mar 15 20:33:36 2009 From: danomatika at gmail.com (danomatika) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 19:33:36 -0000 Subject: [PD] The PdCon09 webpage is down ... am I too late? In-Reply-To: <49BD4FC4.9070103@iem.at> References: <1237133614.11190.0.camel@danoT500> <49BD4FC4.9070103@iem.at> Message-ID: <1237145750.15917.3.camel@danoT500> On Sun, 2009-03-15 at 19:58 +0100, IOhannes m zm?lnig wrote: > danomatika wrote: > > Does the PdCon 09 page work for anyone? > > > > Naturally, I forgot to apply and realized it is due today and now the > > page is down ... :( > > try these instead: > > paper submit page: > http://pdcon09.devolts.org/author/submit.php > > paper upload page (once you have submitted it): > http://pdcon09.devolts.org/author/upload.php Thanks IOhannes, but I'm looking for the performance application ... --- Dan Wilcox danomatika.com robotcowboy.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From porres at gmail.com Mon Mar 16 00:13:47 2009 From: porres at gmail.com (Alexandre Porres) Date: Sun, 15 Mar 2009 23:13:47 -0000 Subject: [PD] The PdCon09 webpage is UP Message-ID: <161a0b1e0903151616te0a4f36g8a069a3c8c2328d9@mail.gmail.com> http://convention.puredata.info is back on air hope you have seen it... cheers -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From fbar at footils.org Mon Mar 16 09:23:01 2009 From: fbar at footils.org (Frank Barknecht) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 08:23:01 -0000 Subject: [PD] steep filter? In-Reply-To: References: <161320dd0903151037u6caa3f54p3ac85c7f5546d303@mail.gmail.com> <161320dd0903151102s1346f4d2kdfb0f94593ea8e28@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <20090316082528.GB15510@footils.org> Hallo, Jo?o Pais hat gesagt: // Jo?o Pais wrote: > yes, I had seen that graphic as well. but trying out the highpass > iemfilters with noise, turns out that 10 hip~s work better. Hehe, I guess that's because you filter noise: It's harder to recognize the noise that the 10 hip stages added. :) > I looked in my list of pd-ext objects, but found no elliptic filters. are > there any, or any way of getting their coefficients to use with biquad~? Elliptic filters are rather hard to design, most of the time you will find Butterworth or Chebyshev designs in our little audio world. A biquad~ has only two poles and zeroes, so you would need to cascade several stages to get a really sharp filter. Ciao -- Frank From ydegoyon at gmail.com Mon Mar 16 01:48:54 2009 From: ydegoyon at gmail.com (ydegoyon at gmail.com) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 00:48:54 -0000 Subject: [PD] Pd book sprint in NYC/Berlin In-Reply-To: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> References: <7A824F08-8A15-492E-BECC-F9D6293E37E6@eds.org> Message-ID: <49BDA282.9040607@gmail.com> ola, > For example, should we use GISS? Ekiga? Skype? > the main difference between a video streaming solution and a video conference solution ( ekiga, skype ) is that anybody is able to see what's happening, e.g. that's it's public ( no need to authentify and join a conference room ).. so it depends on what you want.. xiaoo, sevy From kyleklip at gmail.com Thu Mar 12 16:51:38 2009 From: kyleklip at gmail.com (Kyle Klipowicz) Date: Thu, 12 Mar 2009 15:51:38 -0000 Subject: [PD] Call for GSoC mentors! March 9th deadline! In-Reply-To: <2AE574D7-078C-47BC-A548-41CC05E77BC8@eds.org> References: <60900A8A-BD72-4283-AF55-EA76821F3B5D@eds.org> <49B24BE4.5060702@netpd.org> <1236437479.8049.39.camel@yoyo2> <2AE574D7-078C-47BC-A548-41CC05E77BC8@eds.org> Message-ID: How about this project: Beginners Building Blocks. Right now, If I want to even make a simple sine oscillator synth with an ADSR envelope on it, it's not very easy to do out of the box. What if there were some entry-level abstractions in a very OBVIOUS location that people could instantly piece together some classic Unit Generators. Important for these would be the ability to copy/paste items from a main page of abstractions. Also, they should have a simple GUI interface, and possibly be set up automatically to use SSAD. I'm thinking stuff like: -basic envelope generators -basic oscillators (bandlimited ones would be nice): sine, square, triangle, sawtooth -basic i/o that is more intuitive to newbies -basic sample players (one shot, looping, pitch shifting, multi-sample a la fluidsynth) -basic MIDI controller mapping tools (so people could just twist a knob to assign a parameter) -basic step, piano roll, &c sequencers -basic pitch/rhythm analysis (wrappers for sigmund~, fiddle~, and bonk~) -basic modular counters -an extensive collection of examples using these objects, documenting parameters, as well as ways to connect and/or modify and save new versions of objects using SSAD -video stuff would also be great, something akin to a freshened up PixelTango. Anyway, I just thought these things would be really nice to have in an accessible place in Pd-extended. Because right now whenever I just want to make something very simple, i end up having to click a mouse about 200 times which is annoying and makes me worried about RTS! Pd and Pd-extended are so difficult to navigate for newbies. There need to be more "pick up and go" audio tools. I'm thinking of how Reaktor and Max/MSP are so easy to dive into. Pd is a lot like a cold cold ocean whereas the other two are nice warm swimming pools. Pd is deeper and more exciting by far, but you can get swept away in an undertow never to return! This project could be accomplished by merging elements from NetPd, Pdmtl, and various slick patches made by the resident list geniuses. (Another thing about NetPd if Roman and Eni are listening: can you make a tar.gz or zip download of ALL current NetPd patches? I hate having to download 30+ items one at a time. RTS fears again!) So there's my way more than 2 cents. Take what you will from it. ~Kyle On Sun, Mar 8, 2009 at 2:53 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > > On Mar 7, 2009, at 9:51 AM, Roman Haefeli wrote: > > > On Sat, 2009-03-07 at 11:26 +0100, Enrique Erne wrote: > >> Hans-Christoph Steiner wrote: > >>> The Google Summer of Code ((http://code.google.com/soc/) application > >>> is due very soon, March 9th, and we need mentors! At this point, > >>> you > >>> just need to put down your name. Then once the projects are in, > >>> we'll > >>> choose projects and who will mentor them. > >> > >>> Every pd developer who wants to support the project but is not > >>> student > >>> anymore is invited to join as mentor, since the number of sponsored > >>> projects by google depends on the number of mentors and students. > >> > >> Andy, Claude, Frank, Marius, Mathieu, Roman where are you guys? > >> > >> add your names, hurry! :) > > > > yo, i am happy to add my name, but i guess it only makes sense for > > me to > > take a mentorship of a project, that is about patching and not c > > coding. > > from what i have seen, there is only one project - undead - which > > seems > > to be about patching. derek holzer is already proposed as a mentor. > > does > > it make sense to propose more then one mentor for a project? > > You could also create a new project based on something like creating > libraries out of all that useful code in netpd. Basically, think of > something that you would like implemented in Pd that you could mentor. > > .hc > > > > > > > > roman > > > > > > > > ___________________________________________________________ > > Telefonate ohne weitere Kosten vom PC zum PC: http:// > > messenger.yahoo.de > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > If nature has made any one thing less susceptible than all others of > exclusive property, it is the action of the thinking power called an > idea, which an individual may exclusively possess as long as he keeps > it to himself; but the moment it is divulged, it forces itself into > the possession of everyone, and the receiver cannot dispossess himself > of it. - Thomas Jefferson > > > > _______________________________________________ > Pd-list at iem.at mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> > http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > -- ----- ------------ ---- ----- ---- -------- - ------ http://perhapsidid.wordpress.com http://myspace.com/kyleklipowicz -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From alex3lucas at googlemail.com Mon Mar 16 10:14:28 2009 From: alex3lucas at googlemail.com (Alex Lucas) Date: Mon, 16 Mar 2009 09:14:28 -0000 Subject: [PD] Problems accessing Pdlist Archives In-Reply-To: <49BE147A.4080709@umatic.nl> References: <6b61086c0903160019n17d108b0gde7013ee3a69dd1a@mail.gmail.com> <49BE147A.4080709@umatic.nl> Message-ID: <6b61086c0903160216m79ba0ecch27b317a42038faf7@mail.gmail.com> Hi Derek, Thanks for your help, I really like markmail! Thanks, Alex 2009/3/16 Derek Holzer > Hi Alex, > > I had the same problem yesterday. There are three alternates listed at: > > http://puredata.info/community/lists > > Gmane, Mail Archive and Markmail. One of those should work for you. > > best! > Derek > > > Alex Lucas wrote: > >> Hello everyone, >> >> Over the last couple of days I haven't been able to access the Pdlist >> Archives by following the link on this page >> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list. Has anyone else had the same >> problem or dose anyone know of an alternative link? >> > > > -- > ::: derek holzer ::: http://blog.myspace.com/macumbista ::: > http://www.vimeo.com/macumbista ::: > ---Oblique Strategy # 173: > "Voice your suspicions" > -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: