[PD] file format for GEM

Stephan Elliot Perez dreamoftheshoreofanotherworld at gmail.com
Wed Mar 6 19:09:33 CET 2013 

Hi,
            I am working on a computer with two 2,66 GHz Dual-Core Intel
Xeon processors (so, slightly weaker than the other) and when I play the
800x450 videos in 1920 x 1080 format, I again have the problem that, while
the CPU usage is fine, PD itself slows down considerably. The cues are
executed too late and the video is of course slower.
             Does anyone know what causes this problem specifically and
what can be done about it?

Many thanks,
Stephan

On Mon, Mar 4, 2013 at 7:31 PM, Stephan Elliot Perez <
dreamoftheshoreofanotherworld at gmail.com> wrote:

> Well, I do not know why, but if I use auto for everything (instead of line
> objects into the right inlet of pix_film), it does fine with one or two
> videos, but, when a third one is activated, it skyrockets to over 100.
>
> And this is using 800x450 videos. With this format, I had no such CPU
> problems using line objects.
>
> -Stephan
>
>
> On Mon, Mar 4, 2013 at 6:01 PM, chris clepper <cgclepper at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Use the 'rate $1' message to change the playback speed.
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Mar 4, 2013 at 11:31 AM, Stephan Elliot Perez <
>> dreamoftheshoreofanotherworld at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I am using pix_film to play back the files, do I need to use another
>>> object? I ask because when I send the messages auto -1, 1 or 2 into the
>>> first inlet, the playback is always the same (1), and if I send auto .5, it
>>> turns off (as with 0).
>>>
>>>
>>> On Sun, Mar 3, 2013 at 8:45 PM, chris clepper <cgclepper at gmail.com>wrote:
>>>
>>>> A laptop drive will probably not play more than two HD ProRes files at
>>>> once.  An external Firewire or USB drive might help if half the clips are
>>>> on it and the other half on the internal.
>>>>
>>>> Auto can play at any speed forward or backward: try 'rate -1' or 'rate
>>>> 1.5'  etc.  That sets the Quicktime clock for playback to that rate.  It's
>>>> more efficient to let QT do the tasking internally.
>>>>
>>>> You can select the starting frame of playback using the frame number
>>>> into the second inlet.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, Mar 3, 2013 at 2:34 PM, Stephan Elliot Perez <
>>>> dreamoftheshoreofanotherworld at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I am not using the auto message because I often want to play the files
>>>>> backwards or only play a certain part of them. Unless there is a variant of
>>>>> auto for this?
>>>>>
>>>>> When I use the patch for a performance it will be on a laptop, which I
>>>>> am not certain will have multiple hard drives. Would a solid state drive
>>>>> definitely fix my problem? Otherwise, I suppose I will be stuck with a
>>>>> lower resolution for the videos.
>>>>>
>>>>> -Stephan
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sun, Mar 3, 2013 at 7:22 PM, chris clepper <cgclepper at gmail.com>wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Are you using 'auto 1' to play the files?  That uses Quicktime to
>>>>>> determine the current position which is more efficient than sending a frame
>>>>>> number.  You may also want to try 'frame 60' into the gemwin with the auto
>>>>>> message for smoother looking output.  That basically syncs the render
>>>>>> output with the screen and 'auto 1' only loads a new frame at the rate of
>>>>>> the file.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Those CPU figures seem about right.  The ProRes HQ files are probably
>>>>>> much larger on disk than the AIC files, so the extra CPU time might be
>>>>>> waiting for the disk.  That might also be why the AIC files spike at
>>>>>> certain points because the drive is working more.  Disk speed is an
>>>>>> important factor here: I would spread the files over multiple drives if
>>>>>> possible. Obviously, SSD is a good option too.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Chris
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sun, Mar 3, 2013 at 1:05 PM, Stephan Elliot Perez <
>>>>>> dreamoftheshoreofanotherworld at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> So, I added the -nomidi -noaudio and -nrt commands as instructed by
>>>>>>> Mr. Clepper. This seems to help stop lag in Pure Data itself (so cues are
>>>>>>> executed punctually) when using HD-files.
>>>>>>>        However, I then converted my files to 1920 x 1080 at 100%
>>>>>>> using the prores 422 (HQ) codec. The CPU load still climbs to into the 80s
>>>>>>> and 90s (even over 100 once) with two videos and into the 120s-160s with
>>>>>>> three.
>>>>>>>        Oddly, with the Intermediary Codec, the load is sometimes
>>>>>>> much lower (in the 50s for two files) but sharply climbs at other moments
>>>>>>> (higher than with the pro-res codecs).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -Stephan
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Sun, Mar 3, 2013 at 10:10 AM, Peter Venus <news at petervenus.de>wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hello!
>>>>>>>> i did not know, that you wanted  to playback HD-material.
>>>>>>>> with HD material, i notice problems as well, also with the mjpeg
>>>>>>>> codec.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> anyone having experience with fullHD and other codecs?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> under OSX i found, that apples ProRes 422 codec works best for that
>>>>>>>> matter. The only thing being, that its comes with final cut.
>>>>>>>> right now, i am running a show, where i use mjpeg in 720p
>>>>>>>> resolution with no problems for simultaneous playback of 3 videos.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> cheers, peter
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Am 01.03.13 21:39, schrieb Stephan Elliot Perez:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> So, I reduced the resolution of the files from 1920 x 1080 to 800
>>>>>>>>> x 450
>>>>>>>>> with the Apple Photo -Jpeg codec and now I have no lag.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The loss in quality is of course noticable, but tolerable...
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Thanks again for you help,
>>>>>>>>> Stephan
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Feb 28, 2013 at 9:13 AM, <news at petervenus.de> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>  Hello!
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> what video codec are you using?
>>>>>>>>>> in my experience, a big issue when playing back video with gem,
>>>>>>>>>> comes from the codecs and container, resulting in extreme
>>>>>>>>>> differences in
>>>>>>>>>> cpu-load.
>>>>>>>>>> i found, that mov-container work way better than avi-container,
>>>>>>>>>> even though
>>>>>>>>>> the same codec is used and packed in the container.
>>>>>>>>>> try  converting your videos to a motion-jpeg codec packed in a
>>>>>>>>>> quicktime-mov.
>>>>>>>>>> you could use mpeg-streamclip [1] for that purpose on win /mac
>>>>>>>>>> machines or
>>>>>>>>>> ffmpeg on linux.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> [1] http://www.squared5.com/  free tool for video conversion
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> regards, peter
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>   *Gesendet:* Mittwoch, 27. Februar 2013 um 23:55 Uhr
>>>>>>>>>> *Von:* "Stephan Elliot Perez" <dreamoftheshoreofanotherworld**
>>>>>>>>>> @gmail.com <dreamoftheshoreofanotherworld at gmail.com>>
>>>>>>>>>> *An:* "Cyrille Henry" <ch at chnry.net>
>>>>>>>>>> *Cc:* pd-list at iem.at
>>>>>>>>>> *Betreff:* Re: [PD] file format for GEM
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>   A more urgent problem: Although the CPU usage stays under 100
>>>>>>>>>> (peak is
>>>>>>>>>> around 84 with three videos overlapping), there is a substantial
>>>>>>>>>> amount of
>>>>>>>>>> lag. If I turn off video processing, a command that should be
>>>>>>>>>> executed
>>>>>>>>>> after 30 seconds via the cue list is executed punctually. If I
>>>>>>>>>> turn it on,
>>>>>>>>>> the command is 11 seconds late.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I can attach the patch if you like, but I probably will not be
>>>>>>>>>> able to
>>>>>>>>>> send the video clips as one attachment.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Best regards,
>>>>>>>>>> Stephan
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, Feb 27, 2013 at 8:19 PM, Stephan Elliot Perez <
>>>>>>>>>> dreamoftheshoreofanotherworld@**gmail.com<dreamoftheshoreofanotherworld at gmail.com>>
>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>  What is a shader, and how do I use it?
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On Wed, Feb 27, 2013 at 7:25 PM, Cyrille Henry <ch at chnry.net>
>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Le 27/02/2013 19:17, Stephan Elliot Perez a écrit :
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>   Thanks, it works now. For some reason, turning "auto" on and
>>>>>>>>>>>> off (with
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> pix_film) causes the video to lag temporarily, but I do not
>>>>>>>>>>>>> have this
>>>>>>>>>>>>> problem if I use line-objects to go through the frames. The
>>>>>>>>>>>>> cpu-usage goes
>>>>>>>>>>>>> above 100 if I have more than two videos playing at once, but
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I suppose I
>>>>>>>>>>>>> don't need more than two for this project...
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Also, what can I do if I want an additive blend instead of a
>>>>>>>>>>>>> normal
>>>>>>>>>>>>> cross-blend?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> i would use a shader for this.
>>>>>>>>>>>> it offer great flexibility, even if it's a bit harder to begin
>>>>>>>>>>>> with.
>>>>>>>>>>>> but that's the way openGL wants you to do now.
>>>>>>>>>>>> cheers
>>>>>>>>>>>> c
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, Feb 26, 2013 at 10:16 PM, Cyrille Henry <ch at chnry.net<mailto:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> ch at chnry.net>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>      hello,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>      Gem is mostly design to work on the GPU, and not on the
>>>>>>>>>>>>> CPU.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>      GPU have hundreds of core, they are faster than CPU for
>>>>>>>>>>>>> image
>>>>>>>>>>>>> manipulations.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>      pix_add come from the 20th century and should now be
>>>>>>>>>>>>> avoid since it
>>>>>>>>>>>>> use cpu not gpu ;-)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>      in order to make a fade transition between 2 videos, you
>>>>>>>>>>>>> can use
>>>>>>>>>>>>> transparency on one video.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>      add a [alpha] object after Gemhead, and send number
>>>>>>>>>>>>> between 0 and 1
>>>>>>>>>>>>> in the last inlet of the colorRGB object to make the video
>>>>>>>>>>>>> appear /
>>>>>>>>>>>>> disapear.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>      cheers
>>>>>>>>>>>>>      c
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>      Le 26/02/2013 21:33, Stephan Elliot Perez a écrit :
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>          Hello,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>                   So, looking at the help file for [pd~], it
>>>>>>>>>>>>> seems to be
>>>>>>>>>>>>> primarily for audio. How can I use multiple cores to work
>>>>>>>>>>>>> purely with GEM?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>                    I am trying to have a simple transition
>>>>>>>>>>>>> between video
>>>>>>>>>>>>> clips, but if I have two instances of pix_film and then
>>>>>>>>>>>>> connect them to
>>>>>>>>>>>>> pix_add, the CPU-ussage skyrockets well above 100... is there
>>>>>>>>>>>>> a more
>>>>>>>>>>>>> efficient object for blending two video clips?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>          Best regards,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>          Stephan
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>          On Sun, Feb 3, 2013 at 10:54 PM, Thomas Mayer <
>>>>>>>>>>>>> thomas at residuum.org <mailto:thomas at residuum.org> <mailto:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> thomas at residuum.org <mailto:thomas at residuum.org>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>               Hi,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>               On 03.02.2013 22:48, Stephan Elliot Perez wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>                > I am talking about PD's CPU meter. I don't
>>>>>>>>>>>>> have the
>>>>>>>>>>>>> impression that PD
>>>>>>>>>>>>>                > takes full advantage of 2 quad-core
>>>>>>>>>>>>> processors. When
>>>>>>>>>>>>> processing audio,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>                > anything over 100 in PD's meter will lead to
>>>>>>>>>>>>> glitched
>>>>>>>>>>>>> audio. I am just
>>>>>>>>>>>>>                > wondering if it will be much more when I load
>>>>>>>>>>>>> other
>>>>>>>>>>>>> videos and transition
>>>>>>>>>>>>>                > between them.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>               Pd will only use one core, and one core for the
>>>>>>>>>>>>> GUI. There
>>>>>>>>>>>>> are ways to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>               distribute the load over several cores, e.g.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> [pd~] or use
>>>>>>>>>>>>> several
>>>>>>>>>>>>>               instances of Pd that communicate with each
>>>>>>>>>>>>> others:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>          http://www.mail-archive.com/__**
>>>>>>>>>>>>> **pd-list at iem.at/msg33319.html<http://www.mail-archive.com/__**pd-list@iem.at/msg33319.html>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> **<http://www.mail-archive.com/_**
>>>>>>>>>>>>> _pd-list at iem.at/msg33319.html<http://www.mail-archive.com/__pd-list@iem.at/msg33319.html>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> >**<
>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.mail-archive.com/****pd-list@iem.at/msg33319.html<http://www.mail-archive.com/**pd-list@iem.at/msg33319.html>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> <h**ttp://www.mail-archive.com/pd-**list@iem.at/msg33319.html<http://www.mail-archive.com/pd-list@iem.at/msg33319.html>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>               Hth,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>               Thomas
>>>>>>>>>>>>>               --
>>>>>>>>>>>>>               "Spielen Sie Strip Schnipp-Schnapp?" (Adam
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Weishaupt to
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Johann
>>>>>>>>>>>>>               Wolfgang von Goethe in: Robert Shea & Robert A.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Wilson,
>>>>>>>>>>>>> The Golden
>>>>>>>>>>>>>               Apple)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>          http://www.residuum.org/
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>               ______________________________**
>>>>>>>>>>>>> **___________________
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>          ______________________________****___________________
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>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
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