<html><head></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; ">Well I think in a way being treated as not doing my part just for proposing that a basic course could be helpful is not motivating. <div>honestly I started looking for information on line and then I went to the meetings because I feel a bit confusing starting in that way<div>If one attend to the meetings you don“t have to convince nobody to use Pd, people are constantly looking for tools that can be useful for developing ideas, in my case I“m always curious about it. </div><div>Don“t carry all the weight by yourself there must be somebody able to teach beginners in a regular way (thats also means money for the rent, of course).</div><div><br></div><div>Best</div><div> </div><div>Roberto</div><div><br></div><div><br><div><div>El 18/09/2010, a las 15:55, Joćo Pais escribió:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite"><div><blockquote type="cite">I went to a couple of meetings but found them, as a beginner, not particularly motivating.<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">I think, if you got some experience with Pd, work best because they are more focused on showing what you've already done.<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">As a beginner, of course, you want to attend because you want to learn from the basics, the fundamentals, which is the reason why these meetings tend to become pseudo workshops, but from what I read in the forum, there is neither the desire nor the idea of doing it this way.<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">Anyhow, showcasing is also good, because you get the picture of the potential and amplitude of pd.<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">A good solution could be to provide a regularly basic course in Pd (every season, or something) in addition to specific workshops (I missed Servando“s one, pity!).<br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite"><br></blockquote><blockquote type="cite">This, I think, would be a healthy way to create a more participatory community.<br></blockquote><br>Hi Roberto (sorry, don't remember your face),<br><br>I'll tell things from my point of view, which is the other opposite: from being one of the more experienced people on those meetings, I don't find it very motivating to go to the reunions to speak all the time and be a patch fireman, and not getting much from it (apart from nice smiles) that I can use myself.<br><br>If you want a pd course thought by real people (you can get lots of materials online), we can organise a real workshop, where someone speaks, you pay and you go in. That isn't the point of these meetings, as I myself don't have the time or the wish to be preparing or providing for "regular basic courses" just like that (to put it bluntly, I must manage to pay my rent).<br><br>Also, I myself don't go to those meetings to evangelise or convince people to use Pd. If you want to use Pd, you need yourself to get into it, and be prepared to spend lots of time with it. That's how you stop being a "beginner" to be something else. And this leads into the other point, maybe you didn't use the resources of the meetings to its fullest yet. We always encourage people to sign up in the wiki (which you did), and also put in suggestions of themes they want to see handled, which I don't see any - so far only the "advanced people" put it their theme sugestions, so I think I (we)'ve done our part. So, I don't know what are the motivating points that you want to know. But since I'm not here to make sure you will use pd, you're that one who has to tell that (to me or anyone else). So, paraphrasing someone, don't ask yourself what these meetings can do for you, ask what you can do for these meetings. If you are interested in a specific point, tell the world what it is, and if someone there has experience with it, he might come forward and show his patches around, or whatever he wants to.<br><br>As I see it, healthy participation comes from both sides, don't expect people to cater for you if you don't do your part of the bargain - we're not providing a service, it's supposed to be a give and take situation. Or, if you don't have any themes for now, go there, sit down and program, until you find a problem. Then ask the guy on your side what does he know about it. If he doesn't know much, ask the guy in front, and so on.<br><br>And if this still isn't enough for you, then you might need a workshop with a tutor - that's what you won't get in these meetings, at least not from me (of course I don't speak for anyone else).<br><br>Joćo Pais<br></div></blockquote></div><br><div>
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"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 12px; "><div><font class="Apple-style-span" size="3"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 11px; ">+49 30 639 16015</span></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" size="3"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 11px; ">+49 176 967 64274</span></font></div></span></span></font></div><div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" size="2">Treptowerstr. 21, HH 4 Stock</font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" size="2">12059 Berlin</font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" size="2"><a href="http://www.robertoduarte.de">www.robertoduarte.de</a></font></div></div></div><div><br></div><div><div><br></div></div></div></div></div><div><br></div></span><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"></span><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></div></span></span>
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