Yes, agrees Julien, it´s a position against free softwares. Probably a political position. (unconcious or not)<br><br>anyway - (and I know it was 7 years ago)<br><br>copypaste from BEK site what Derek and Sara brought up at BEK back in 2005 at the Pd workshop:<br>
<br>***************************<br><br>Workshop details:<br><br>Day one<br><br>1) Introduction: Why PD & Why Free + Open Source Software?<br><br>Our decision to use Pure Data has been motivated by several factors. First and foremost is the need for a modular environment where audio and video processing is possible without the intrusion of negative elements such as a predetermined Graphical User Environment, cross-platform issues and restrictive licenses. We will discuss these issues, and why it is more important than ever that artists take Free + Open Source Software seriously as tools for creative expression.<br>
<br>********************** end copypaste<br><br>Maybe these issues are even more than ever ever important now 7 years later?<br><br>Maybe someone from BEK should speak up and clearify a little around their politics on software uses? Maybe it´s not here in this thread "the revolution" starts but I think it is always necessary to go to the source of the problem and really try to find out what is going on. Not a very very big deal maybe, but clearly this keeps us many on the Pd list a bit emotional about the blogpost call they did put up. (and obviously some people already have had some exchanges with the call makers in Milan already, so maybe that is already "researched" well enough). It´s not about the conflictual situation, it is more about the understanding, as I see it. If they prefer at BEK or other institutions to NOT work with open softwares, then it is really well to just know that. As I see it.<div>
<br></div><div><br></div><div>I don´t know any sociologists working on these issues. Google gives me the name of Yewin Lin as someone in this field. Here is a pdf adressing some of the issues <a href="http://www.ylin.org/sociology_FLOSS.pdf">http://www.ylin.org/sociology_FLOSS.pdf</a></div>
<div>, and here is the website of her:
<a href="http://www.ylin.org/">http://www.ylin.org/</a> </div><div><br></div><div>Surely this must be a rather big field - also with a lot of different perspectives on it - so would be cool if there is some more pointers someone has about these things.<br>
<div><br></div><div>All the best,<br>/Björn Eriksson<br><br><br>On Wed, Jan 4, 2012 at 9:56 PM, APO33 <<a href="mailto:info@apo33.org">info@apo33.org</a>> wrote:<br>><br>> The important point here, it's that it doesn't cost anything to put pd or supercollider on your mac or pc. you download it, install it and use it! here we go.<br>
> so why those places (institutions, festival...etc), people... decided to refuse art project that use free software (free and libre) or create facilities, studios...space for artists, musicians, students...etc that don't include those softwares? (specially in the case of BEK, there are 100% aware of the existence of those software as piksel & bek was one entity before).<br>
> it sound like a position against free software (more or less clear depend the people/institutions...).<br>><br>> Obviously there is different vision of the world, I dunno about revolution (not sure about that one either as sevy said) but it looks like that there is people out there that are pissed off of the free software (specially the freshly floss art community - around 5 to 8 years more or less) community excluding the artists and programmers from the proprietary software community (is there such community?) from their institutions(?), festivals, conferences...etc.<br>
><br>> It could looks like a vendetta (unconscious?) related to some frustration of not being part of the BUZZ ;-) (trying to make a bigger one by refusing free software)...<br>><br>> Interesting threat indeed, many of you had heard already some max/msp users complaining of not being able to come and present their things in some of the festival/symposium/gig/conference...etc out there that promote free software...(strongly recommended?)<br>
><br>> Do you know any sociologist working on some of those issues? sound like a very rich subject!!<br>><br>> cheers<br>><br>> Julien<br>><br>>> Hello, interesting thread indeed...<br>>><br>
>> 2012/1/4 Mathieu Bouchard <<a href="mailto:matju@artengine.ca">matju@artengine.ca</a>><br>>><br>>>> Le 2012-01-03 ā 21:47:00, Pagano, Patrick a écrit :<br>>>><br>>>><br>>>> Here is btw another call about a Pd workshop BEK held back in 2005.<br>
>>>><br>>>>> <a href="http://www.bek.no/projects/35-**visiblesoundaudibleimage?**locale=en">http://www.bek.no/projects/35-**visiblesoundaudibleimage?**locale=en</a><<a href="http://www.bek.no/projects/35-visiblesoundaudibleimage?locale=en">http://www.bek.no/projects/35-visiblesoundaudibleimage?locale=en</a>>but that was 7 years ago...<br>
>>>><br>>>><br>>>> So, why don't you give more recent examples, to show some kind of<br>>>> continuity ? I know that in seven years, there can be a lot of change of<br>>>> personnel (and thus mentality) in an art centre... I mean, from my own<br>
>>> personal experience (5200 km away from BEK).<br>>>><br>>><br>>> The reason I put this was just because I wanted to see if they had anything<br>>> about Pure Data at all in BEK so I put<br>
>> "Pure Data" in the search window on the main page at <a href="http://bek.no">bek.no</a> and that was<br>>> one of few entry that showed up in the search result. I didn´t spend much<br>>> time on that - antd didnt compare with other things thay might have done<br>
>> with open source resources. Also agrees and knows institutions and arts<br>>> center changes with the staff involved.<br>>><br>>> Found this about the equipment/softwares in some studio of theirs - and<br>
>> really they don´t seem to have Pd or other open source resources there:<br>>> <a href="http://bek.no/pages/fascilities?locale=en">http://bek.no/pages/fascilities?locale=en</a><br>>><br>>> Here is what they state under "sound" and "other":<br>
>><br>>> *Sound*<br>>><br>>> Ableton Live<br>>> Amadeus<br>>> Cubase<br>>> Logic Pro<br>>> Max4Live<br>>> Soundbooth<br>>> Wave Editor<br>>> Wavelab *Other*<br>
>><br>>> Photoshop CS5<br>>> Illustrator CS5<br>>> Indesign CS5<br>>> Compressor<br>>> iShowU HD Pro<br>>> Max Msp Jitter<br>>><br>>><br>>> Also, preferably, something with more hours... that's 25 hours, probably<br>
>>><br>>>> minus food time, let's say 20 hours. That's better than most workshops, but<br>>>> there have been significantly longer ones.<br>>>><br>>>><br>>>> In a way it would be cool to just send back this e-mail exchanges to the<br>
>>>><br>>>>> call-makers? - so they see how stupid this call is - and anti-productive.<br>>>>><br>>>><br>>>> Is it stupid or is it just a generous rebate plan from two software<br>
>>> companies ? Just an honest question, no insinuations.<br>>>><br>>>><br>>>><br>>> Well, I think so called marketing from software companies could maybe be<br>>> that aggresive (that they can have some specific deals with<br>
>> people/institutions receiving generous discounts)... I don´t know about how<br>>> the discussion goes. It would be an interesting topic to lift up. Are there<br>>> huge rebate plans for instituions / schools / - and how are (generally) the<br>
>> conditions to receive these?<br>>><br>>> Here in Sweden I know that Steinberg has rather hefty rebates of up to 50%<br>>> for students and academic institutions, but they don´t state any exclusive<br>
>> conditions for the academic institutions. I think Digidesign (Avid) has<br>>> about the same deals. Institutions & associations that are not academic<br>>> might be another thing with... (just raising perspectives, know nothing<br>
>> about this really)<br>>><br>>><br>>> All the best,<br>>> Björn Eriksson<br>>><br>><br>><br>><br>> --<br>> APO33<br>> space of research and experimentation<br>> <a href="http://www.apo33.org">http://www.apo33.org</a><br>
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