Apparently, Line 6 managed to build a digital 2.4 GHz wireless with <4 ms latency, the Relay G30, G50 etc . They do not write it in the specs, but most users don't notice latency and when they do, their support is speaking of latency as low as that:<br>
<br><a href="http://line6.com/support/thread/33898">http://line6.com/support/thread/33898</a><br><br>This weekend I will do some WiFi experiments and see how fast it can go locally, using mrpeach udp and tcp classes. If it works, one could use a wireless router which has no other task than routing Pd audio, and the computer at the receiving end could be a cheap headless board with no other task than receiving Pd audio and converting it to analog. Together the receiving device could be the size of a weight-watcher's lunch box, while at the transmitter side the computer's built-in stuff is used. Maybe I'm a bit naive here, anyway I'll report results from experiments.<br>
<br>Katja<br><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Fri, Mar 1, 2013 at 2:14 PM, richard duckworth <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:richduckworth@yahoo.com" target="_blank">richduckworth@yahoo.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div><div style="font-size:12pt;font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><div><span>OMG - that's really high! Maybe Tranz have a belt holder solution - they do look kind of bulky though! Maybe worth dropping them a line, see if they'll help the Pd community </span></div>
<div class="im"><div style="font-style:normal;font-size:16px;background-color:transparent;font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span><br></span></div><div></div><div> </div><div>Rich Duckworth<br>Lecturer in Music Technology<br>
Department of Music<br>House 5 <br>Trinity College <br>Dublin 2<br>Ireland<br>Tel 353 1 896 1500<br><br></div></div><div><div class="im">"Digital? <br>Is that the thing where they take a good old sine wave and they chop it up into little bits?" --- Rupert Neve<br>
</div><div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:12pt"><div class="hm HOEnZb"> </div><div style="font-family:'times new roman','new york',times,serif;font-size:12pt"><div class="hm HOEnZb">
<div dir="ltr"> <font face="Arial"> <hr size="1"> <b><span style="font-weight:bold">From:</span></b> katja <<a href="mailto:katjavetter@gmail.com" target="_blank">katjavetter@gmail.com</a>><br> <b><span style="font-weight:bold">To:</span></b> Antoine Villeret <<a href="mailto:antoine.villeret@gmail.com" target="_blank">antoine.villeret@gmail.com</a>> <br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">Cc:</span></b> richard duckworth <<a href="mailto:richduckworth@yahoo.com" target="_blank">richduckworth@yahoo.com</a>>; "<a href="mailto:pd-list@iem.at" target="_blank">pd-list@iem.at</a>" <<a href="mailto:pd-list@iem.at" target="_blank">pd-list@iem.at</a>> <br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">Sent:</span></b> Friday, 1 March 2013, 13:12<br> <b><span style="font-weight:bold">Subject:</span></b> Re: [PD] wireless audio from Pd to PA system (katja)<br> </font> </div></div><div><div class="h5">
<br><div>Found more info about TI's PurePath wireless. Latency of wireless transmission is 768 samples minimum. Added to this must be the latencies of ad/da conversion. <br><br><a rel="nofollow" href="http://e2e.ti.com/support/low_power_rf/f/382/t/110331.aspx" target="_blank">http://e2e.ti.com/support/low_power_rf/f/382/t/110331.aspx</a><br>
<br>Forget about it, this concept is only useful for home entertainment.<br><br>Katja<br><br><br><div>On Fri, Mar 1, 2013 at 1:19 PM, katja <span dir="ltr"><<a rel="nofollow" href="mailto:katjavetter@gmail.com" target="_blank">katjavetter@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">Thanks everyone for your answers. <br><br>The case is unconventional because a stereo line signal must be sent from the computer. Professional wireless systems assume mic or instrument. Consumer systems do transmit stereo signal, but without bothering too much about latency.<br>
<br>Frankly, I did not expect the difficulty to find a good solution. Initially I wanted the wearable computer for a music video which is to be recorded live with sounds from natural objects. I bought the FM transmitter so my cameraman will be able to hear the music while he's filming. For this purpose it is ideal. Then I thought it would be good to use the computer in it's wearable mode for public performance. I figured that one of the many wireless solutions would suit the purpose, but didn't reckon with the unusual requirements.<br>
<br>Further searching brought me to a new technology 'PurePath' from Texas Instruments. It has a range comparable with WiFi (30m), while it seems to work with paired devices as in Bluetooth. I haven't seen consumer products with this technology, but development kits are available. A rather convincing demo is here:<br>
<br><a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0YsnZQUfVGs" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0YsnZQUfVGs</a><br><br>If this system can work with low latency it could be perfect for wireless Pd.<span><font color="#888888"><br>
<br>Katja</font></span><div><div><br><br><br><br><div>
On Fri, Mar 1, 2013 at 11:41 AM, Antoine Villeret <span dir="ltr"><<a rel="nofollow" href="mailto:antoine.villeret@gmail.com" target="_blank">antoine.villeret@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr">hello, <div><br></div><div>those are good for what they have been designed for and it depends on what you mean by "exellent sound quality"</div><div><br></div><div>I've made few tests on those few years ago and the bandwidth could be good enough to transmit guitar/bass signal but nothing else for me</div>
<div><br></div><div>+</div><div>a</div><div><br></div></div><div><br clear="all"><div>--<br>do it yourself <br><a rel="nofollow" href="http://antoine.villeret.free.fr/" target="_blank">http://antoine.villeret.free.fr</a><br>
</div>
<br><br><div>2013/2/28 richard duckworth <span dir="ltr"><<a rel="nofollow" href="mailto:richduckworth@yahoo.com" target="_blank">richduckworth@yahoo.com</a>></span><br><blockquote style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div><div>
<div><div style="font-size:8pt;font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><div><span><font size="1">Hi Katja</font></span></div><div style="font-style:normal;font-size:10px;background-color:transparent;font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">
<span><font size="1">one of these would do it - check with Thomann tech support for gain issues (these are Instrument Level input) They should be fine however as active guitar pickups (like heavy style EMG pickups) output quite high levels. These type of wireless systems tend to be very rugged, have excellent sound quality and long battery life - and you'll want these things. </font></span></div>
<div style="font-style:normal;font-size:10px;background-color:transparent;font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span><font size="1"><br></font></span></div><div style="font-style:normal;font-size:10px;background-color:transparent;font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">
<span><font size="1"><a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.thomann.de/ie/cat.html?gf=wireless_for_guitar_bass&oa=pra" target="_blank">http://www.thomann.de/ie/cat.html?gf=wireless_for_guitar_bass&oa=pra</a></font></span></div>
<div style="font-style:normal;font-size:10px;background-color:transparent;font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">
<span><font size="1"><br></font></span></div><div style="font-style:normal;font-size:10px;background-color:transparent;font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span><font size="1"><br></font></span></div><div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:8pt">
</div><div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:8pt"> </div><div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:8pt">Rich Duckworth<br>Lecturer in Music Technology<br>Department of Music<br>House 5 <br>
Trinity College <br>Dublin 2<br>Ireland<br>Tel 353 1 896
1500<br><br></div><div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:8pt">"Digital? <br>Is that the thing where they take a good old sine wave and they chop it up into little bits?" --- Rupert Neve<br>
<div style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif;font-size:8pt"> <div style="font-size:12pt"> <div dir="ltr"> <font face="Arial"> <hr size="1"> </font></div>
<br><br><br>Message: 3<br>Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2013 11:53:43 +0100<br>From: katja <<a rel="nofollow" href="mailto:katjavetter@gmail.com" target="_blank">katjavetter@gmail.com</a>><br>Subject: [PD] wireless audio from Pd to PA system<br>
To: pd-list <<a rel="nofollow" href="mailto:pd-list@iem.at" target="_blank">pd-list@iem.at</a>><br>Message-ID:<br> <CAFY0eapPSKfw+gVaxuTr7exHqLiG+<a rel="nofollow" href="mailto:pTdu8Rk6SNTraLiys2Msg@mail.gmail.com" target="_blank">pTdu8Rk6SNTraLiys2Msg@mail.gmail.com</a>><br>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1<br><br>For a wearable live performance computer, I am looking into the<br>options of sending wireless audio from Pd to a PA sound system and<br>other listeners.<br><br>In a first experiment I've tried a Linex FM transmitter. Audio quality<br>
is good enough, and FM transmitters do not introduce latency. This<br>option is cheap and flexible, as the signal can be received by simple<br>radio's, which are even built into cell phones and media players. I<br>would need to boost the transmission a bit to make it more reliable.<br>
This will of course make the equipment illegal. Even then, the risk<br>that someone else is transmitting a stronger signal on the channel can<br>not be excluded.<br><br>Another option could be to send audio over Wifi. This would require<br>
WLAN to be available, and one extra computer (with
audio interface) as<br>a receiver. To avoid extra latency the audio should be sent<br>uncompressed, like [udpsend~] / [udpreceive~] can do it. This has the<br>risk of packet loss and serious dropouts.<br><br>I've been searching for 2.4 GHz wireless music receivers and found<br>
things like this:<br><a rel="nofollow" href="http://www.sitecom.com/en/wireless-music-streamer/wl-061/p/203" target="_blank">http://www.sitecom.com/en/wireless-music-streamer/wl-061/p/203</a>. They<br>seem to act like external soundcards for your computer. In Linux<br>
though I've never managed to properly connect multiple soundcards with<br>Pd (in OSX it's easy using the Aggregate Device Editor from Audio MIDI<br>Setup). Also I guess these devices introduce huge latency. With audio<br>
over bluetooth headsets I've experienced latencies up to a second.<br><br>Does anyone use a satisfactory method in practice, to send audio from<br>Pd without
wires?<br><br>Thanks,<br>Katja<br><br><br><br>------------------------------<br><br>_______________________________________________<br>Pd-list mailing list<br><a rel="nofollow" href="mailto:Pd-list@iem.at" target="_blank">Pd-list@iem.at</a><br>
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