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<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 06/03/2015 05:03 PM, IOhannes m
zmölnig wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote cite="mid:556F6B9F.9030401@iem.at" type="cite">
<pre wrap="">On 06/03/2015 09:40 PM, Pierre Massat wrote:
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre wrap="">Thank you both very much for the explanations. So if I got it right, the
loop in itself was behaving as expected, but what was being printed in the
console was not reflecting that. Instead print behaved like a list prepend.
That's good to know, I candidly thought that print objects were printing
out stuff in real time irrespective of what was going on in the rest of the
patch.
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre wrap="">
no.
everything was behaving as expected, and [print] was printing in "real
time" (whatever that means).
but time in Pd is a fickle thing, and while things can happen in
zero-time they also happen one after the other.
[print] immediately prints any data it receives, but your patch was made
in a way that would send the "last" message to [print] before it would
send the "first" message. hence the reversion.
to re-iterate: [trigger] would have made this more obvious.</pre>
</blockquote>
<br>
But the author of the patch was under the impression that the firing
order<br>
didn't matter. In cases like this [trigger] won't help-- the user
would still<br>
have the same 50% chance of making the connections in the wrong
order.<br>
<br>
If you meant that it would have made the error more obvious to
*you*, well...<br>
it's hard to beat the speed of proclaiming a rule without even
looking at the<br>
patch. If the author had slavishly employed [trigger] in place of
fan-outs with<br>
the same bad luck as their fanout ordering, then your proclamation
wouldn't<br>
have applied in this case. (And fanouts are more obvious than
[trigger] objects<br>
wired in the wrong order, and especially where recursion is
involved.)<br>
<br>
So I'd say use fanouts where ordering doesn't matter, but keep an
eye on them<br>
and make sure they _still_ don't matter when you need to debug.<br>
<br>
Otherwise you'd end up mindlessly inserting/removing a bunch of
[trigger]<br>
objects just for debugging stumps (like [print] and number box).
With<br>
GUI software like Pd Vanilla that doesn't have infinite undo your
hand will get tired<br>
and you'll have to rest. That probably eats at least much time as
you'd save<br>
avoiding potential fanout bugs.<br>
<br>
-Jonathan<br>
<br>
<blockquote cite="mid:556F6B9F.9030401@iem.at" type="cite">
<pre wrap="">
gfmsd
IOhannes
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