<div dir="ltr">crazy day at the caffee again \<div><br></div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Sat, Sep 26, 2015 at 5:23 PM, <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:pd-list-request@lists.iem.at" target="_blank">pd-list-request@lists.iem.at</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">Send Pd-list mailing list submissions to<br>
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Today's Topics:<br>
<br>
1. Re: How does vline~ work under the hood? (Jonathan Wilkes)<br>
2. Re: How does vline~ work under the hood? (Matt Barber)<br>
3. Re: How does vline~ work under the hood? (Jonathan Wilkes)<br>
<br>
<br>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<br>
<br>
Message: 1<br>
Date: Sat, 26 Sep 2015 22:08:16 +0000 (UTC)<br>
From: Jonathan Wilkes <<a href="mailto:jancsika@yahoo.com">jancsika@yahoo.com</a>><br>
To: Frank Barknecht <<a href="mailto:fbar@footils.org">fbar@footils.org</a>>, "<a href="mailto:pd-list@lists.iem.at">pd-list@lists.iem.at</a>"<br>
<<a href="mailto:pd-list@lists.iem.at">pd-list@lists.iem.at</a>><br>
Subject: Re: [PD] How does vline~ work under the hood?<br>
Message-ID:<br>
<<a href="mailto:655463103.1338937.1443305296609.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com">655463103.1338937.1443305296609.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com</a>><br>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"<br>
<br>
Hi Frank,The [1, 0 50( message will almost always trigger differentoutput when fed to [line~] and [vline~]. The only exceptionis when the ramp ends exactly on a block boundary--otherwise [line~] will stretch the final part of the ramp tothe block boundary.<br>
<br>
In fact, I'm willing to bet that if visualized this [line~]quantization to new users at the outset they'd almostalways use [vline~]. After all, who wants imperfect lines? :)<br>
-Jonathan<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
On Saturday, September 26, 2015 12:57 PM, Frank Barknecht <<a href="mailto:fbar@footils.org">fbar@footils.org</a>> wrote:<br>
<br>
<br>
Hi,<br>
<br>
On Sat, Sep 26, 2015 at 11:24:40PM +0900, i go bananas wrote:<br>
> In that case, maybe an even simpler question:<br>
><br>
> What is the difference between sending a [1, 0 50( message to vline as<br>
> opposed to line ?<br>
<br>
There will only be a difference in how line~ and vline~ react to this message<br>
when the message was triggered by something with a "clock" inside. These kinds<br>
of messages are called clock-delayed messages.<br>
<br>
Clock-delayed messages originate in objects like [metro] or [delay] or [qlist].<br>
Messages that originate for example in mouse clicks are not clock-delayed (i.e.<br>
if you click a [bng] or move a slider).<br>
<br>
vline~ evaluates clock delayed message with high, sub-sample timing accuracy.<br>
line~ quantizes even clock delayed messages to block-boundaries or to 64<br>
samples, I'm not sure ATM which it is. But line~ quantizes.<br>
<br>
So depending on when the message was issued any by what, the ramp generators<br>
may act the same or different.<br>
<br>
Try delaying the message:<br>
<br>
[bang(<br>
|<br>
[delay 0.3]<br>
|<br>
[1. 0 50(<br>
|<br>
[line~ or vline~]<br>
|<br>
[print~]<br>
<br>
Ciao<br>
--<br>
Frank Barknecht _ ______footils.org__<br>
<br>
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Message: 2<br>
Date: Sat, 26 Sep 2015 19:45:51 -0400<br>
From: Matt Barber <<a href="mailto:brbrofsvl@gmail.com">brbrofsvl@gmail.com</a>><br>
To: Jonathan Wilkes <<a href="mailto:jancsika@yahoo.com">jancsika@yahoo.com</a>><br>
Cc: "<a href="mailto:pd-list@lists.iem.at">pd-list@lists.iem.at</a>" <<a href="mailto:pd-list@lists.iem.at">pd-list@lists.iem.at</a>><br>
Subject: Re: [PD] How does vline~ work under the hood?<br>
Message-ID:<br>
<<a href="mailto:CAOrke7Fa%2BxhYa5jzdg_-BHhQfKu-Q400w-%2BN1umFgW4e1mT%2Bnw@mail.gmail.com">CAOrke7Fa+xhYa5jzdg_-BHhQfKu-Q400w-+N1umFgW4e1mT+nw@mail.gmail.com</a>><br>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"<br>
<br>
Well, obviously it depends on what you want to use the lines for. If it's<br>
just to fade something in or out over 10-50 ms to avoid a discontinuity,<br>
it's not that big a deal. Moreover sometimes it's great to have the ends<br>
and beginnings of ramps happen at block boundaries; e.g. when [switch~]ing<br>
off a subpatch or abstraction in a synth bank at the end of a quick fade,<br>
it's nice to know that you can target things to boundaries without having<br>
to try too hard.<br>
<br>
On Sat, Sep 26, 2015 at 6:08 PM, Jonathan Wilkes via Pd-list <<br>
<a href="mailto:pd-list@lists.iem.at">pd-list@lists.iem.at</a>> wrote:<br>
<br>
> Hi Frank,<br>
> The [1, 0 50( message will almost always trigger different<br>
> output when fed to [line~] and [vline~]. The only exception<br>
> is when the ramp ends exactly on a block boundary--<br>
> otherwise [line~] will stretch the final part of the ramp to<br>
> the block boundary.<br>
><br>
> In fact, I'm willing to bet that if visualized this [line~]<br>
> quantization to new users at the outset they'd almost<br>
> always use [vline~]. After all, who wants imperfect lines? :)<br>
><br>
> -Jonathan<br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
><br>
> On Saturday, September 26, 2015 12:57 PM, Frank Barknecht <<br>
> <a href="mailto:fbar@footils.org">fbar@footils.org</a>> wrote:<br>
><br>
><br>
> Hi,<br>
><br>
> On Sat, Sep 26, 2015 at 11:24:40PM +0900, i go bananas wrote:<br>
> > In that case, maybe an even simpler question:<br>
> ><br>
> > What is the difference between sending a [1, 0 50( message to vline as<br>
> > opposed to line ?<br>
><br>
> There will only be a difference in how line~ and vline~ react to this<br>
> message<br>
> when the message was triggered by something with a "clock" inside. These<br>
> kinds<br>
> of messages are called clock-delayed messages.<br>
><br>
> Clock-delayed messages originate in objects like [metro] or [delay] or<br>
> [qlist].<br>
> Messages that originate for example in mouse clicks are not clock-delayed<br>
> (i.e.<br>
> if you click a [bng] or move a slider).<br>
><br>
> vline~ evaluates clock delayed message with high, sub-sample timing<br>
> accuracy.<br>
> line~ quantizes even clock delayed messages to block-boundaries or to 64<br>
> samples, I'm not sure ATM which it is. But line~ quantizes.<br>
><br>
> So depending on when the message was issued any by what, the ramp<br>
> generators<br>
> may act the same or different.<br>
><br>
> Try delaying the message:<br>
><br>
> [bang(<br>
> |<br>
> [delay 0.3]<br>
><br>
> |<br>
> [1. 0 50(<br>
><br>
> |<br>
> [line~ or vline~]<br>
> |<br>
> [print~]<br>
><br>
> Ciao<br>
> --<br>
> Frank Barknecht _ ______footils.org__<br>
><br>
> _______________________________________________<br>
> <a href="mailto:Pd-list@lists.iem.at">Pd-list@lists.iem.at</a> mailing list<br>
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><br>
><br>
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------------------------------<br>
<br>
Message: 3<br>
Date: Sun, 27 Sep 2015 00:23:28 +0000 (UTC)<br>
From: Jonathan Wilkes <<a href="mailto:jancsika@yahoo.com">jancsika@yahoo.com</a>><br>
To: Matt Barber <<a href="mailto:brbrofsvl@gmail.com">brbrofsvl@gmail.com</a>><br>
Cc: "<a href="mailto:pd-list@lists.iem.at">pd-list@lists.iem.at</a>" <<a href="mailto:pd-list@lists.iem.at">pd-list@lists.iem.at</a>><br>
Subject: Re: [PD] How does vline~ work under the hood?<br>
Message-ID:<br>
<<a href="mailto:626288233.1379665.1443313408523.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com">626288233.1379665.1443313408523.JavaMail.yahoo@mail.yahoo.com</a>><br>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"<br>
<br>
I tend to use [vline~] in those cases because-- to my ears-- it sounds warmer.<br>
<br>
(I so wanted to click send, but I have to come clean and say I'm just kidding.)<br>
-Jonathan<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
On Saturday, September 26, 2015 7:46 PM, Matt Barber <<a href="mailto:brbrofsvl@gmail.com">brbrofsvl@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
<br>
<br>
Well, obviously it depends on what you want to use the lines for. If it's just to fade something in or out over 10-50 ms to avoid a discontinuity, it's not that big a deal. Moreover sometimes it's great to have the ends and beginnings of ramps happen at block boundaries; e.g. when [switch~]ing off a subpatch or abstraction in a synth bank at the end of a quick fade, it's nice to know that you can target things to boundaries without having to try too hard.<br>
On Sat, Sep 26, 2015 at 6:08 PM, Jonathan Wilkes via Pd-list <<a href="mailto:pd-list@lists.iem.at">pd-list@lists.iem.at</a>> wrote:<br>
<br>
Hi Frank,The [1, 0 50( message will almost always trigger differentoutput when fed to [line~] and [vline~]. The only exceptionis when the ramp ends exactly on a block boundary--otherwise [line~] will stretch the final part of the ramp tothe block boundary.<br>
<br>
In fact, I'm willing to bet that if visualized this [line~]quantization to new users at the outset they'd almostalways use [vline~]. After all, who wants imperfect lines? :)<br>
-Jonathan<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
On Saturday, September 26, 2015 12:57 PM, Frank Barknecht <<a href="mailto:fbar@footils.org">fbar@footils.org</a>> wrote:<br>
<br>
<br>
Hi,<br>
<br>
On Sat, Sep 26, 2015 at 11:24:40PM +0900, i go bananas wrote:<br>
> In that case, maybe an even simpler question:<br>
><br>
> What is the difference between sending a [1, 0 50( message to vline as<br>
> opposed to line ?<br>
<br>
There will only be a difference in how line~ and vline~ react to this message<br>
when the message was triggered by something with a "clock" inside. These kinds<br>
of messages are called clock-delayed messages.<br>
<br>
Clock-delayed messages originate in objects like [metro] or [delay] or [qlist].<br>
Messages that originate for example in mouse clicks are not clock-delayed (i.e.<br>
if you click a [bng] or move a slider).<br>
<br>
vline~ evaluates clock delayed message with high, sub-sample timing accuracy.<br>
line~ quantizes even clock delayed messages to block-boundaries or to 64<br>
samples, I'm not sure ATM which it is. But line~ quantizes.<br>
<br>
So depending on when the message was issued any by what, the ramp generators<br>
may act the same or different.<br>
<br>
Try delaying the message:<br>
<br>
[bang(<br>
|<br>
[delay 0.3]<br>
|<br>
[1. 0 50(<br>
|<br>
[line~ or vline~]<br>
|<br>
[print~]<br>
<br>
Ciao<br>
--<br>
Frank Barknecht _ ______footils.org__<br>
<br>
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</blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><div><br></div>-- <br><div class="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr">john benson<br><br><br></div></div>
</div>