<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html charset=us-ascii"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;" class="">You misunderstand me.<div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">I'm not against something that #1 works and is #2 maintainable. I'm not sure that this fix is either yet. You can, of course, do some testing and prove that it meets #1 and #2. I naturally do *not* speak for Miller who largely ends up responsible for many of these things, but I'm really just trying to be similarly skeptical towards solutions that involve adding all sorts of *this* and *that*.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">#1 Works:</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">TWAPI is a precompiled TCL/TK library for the Windows API, does the binary you've included work for *all* versions of Windows versions that Pd users are likely to have (or at least most)? The catch should handle most problems but if *lots* of people are using Windows 7 and this doesn't actually work on Windows 7 but works for *you* on say Windows 10, then maybe it's not a real fix yet? I know the windows api has been historically stable but I don't know about C libs & TCL libs complied against it.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">#2 Maintainable:</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">How often does TWAPI change? Is it stable? Who will keep track of updating the binary copy in the Pd repo?</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">(#3) Also, I'm against requiring an entire single-platform library for essentially 2 loading calls. This is really one of my more main reasons to be skeptical as, once again, we can write our *own* tiny C TCL binding library just for Pd which loads the fonts and is only built & loaded on Windows. I've found documentation and sample code on doing this, I just have not been able to find the time to get to it yet. I feel this approach would be more maintainable and understandable in the longer run even if it's not a 10 minute solution.</div><div class=""><br class=""></div><div class="">We have been moving in steps: getting Pd to build in autotools on Windows leads directly to building a tiny font loading library. :) Step by step...<br class=""><div><br class=""><blockquote type="cite" class=""><div class="">On Dec 7, 2017, at 6:40 PM, Lucas Cordiviola <<a href="mailto:lucarda27@hotmail.com" class="">lucarda27@hotmail.com</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><div class="">
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=Windows-1252" class="">
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<blockquote type="cite" class="">Note: DejaVu Sans Mono is the default font but it's not currently shipped with or loaded by Pd on Windows yet. There is some extra work needed for this</blockquote><div class=""><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><p class="">I got work on this, see:</p><p class=""><a moz-do-not-send="true" href="http://lucarda.com.ar/x/dejavu/readme.html" class="">http://lucarda.com.ar/x/dejavu/readme.html</a>
<br class="">
</p><p class="">@Dan</p><p class="">Do I make a PR and we forget about it?</p><p class="">Is not a big deal and you always opposed it. I think an other method will be always postponed and will make it by 0.57-9test3.</p><p class="">: -)</p><p class=""><br class="">
</p><p class="">--<br class="">
</p>
<pre class="moz-signature" cols="72">Mensaje telepatico asistido por maquinas.</pre>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 12/7/2017 10:40 AM, Dan Wilcox wrote:<br class="">
</div>
<blockquote type="cite" cite="mid:0C56F5EF-10E7-402F-A2FD-932FB3F22A73@gmail.com" class="">
<div class="">Yes, the sizes are a little smaller/tighter and come from Pd-extended. Things work best with DejaVu Sans Mono so rendering should be the same using the same font. For more info, see: <a href="https://github.com/pure-data/pure-data/pull/159" class="" moz-do-not-send="true">https://github.com/pure-data/pure-data/pull/159</a></div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">If everyone ends up hating this, we could just go back to Courier on all platforms. At least then we wouldn't have to ship a font....</div>
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
Note: DejaVu Sans Mono is the default font but it's not currently shipped with or loaded by Pd on Windows yet. There is some extra work needed for this and it seemed important to fix the sizing issues on macOS first. I wrote up some info about the fonts in <a href="https://github.com/pure-data/pure-data/blob/master/font/README.txt" class="" moz-do-not-send="true">https://github.com/pure-data/pure-data/blob/master/font/README.txt</a>
<div class="">
<div class=""><br class="">
</div>
<div class="">Also, zooming now works for all guis, the inlets & outlets are the same height, lots of little drawing bugs were fixed (VU scale not completly hidden), etc etc etc.<br class="">
<div class=""><br class="">
<div class="">
<blockquote type="cite" class="">
<div class="">On Dec 5, 2017, at 7:35 PM, <a href="mailto:pd-list-request@lists.iem.at" class="" moz-do-not-send="true">
pd-list-request@lists.iem.at</a> wrote:</div>
<br class="Apple-interchange-newline">
<div class=""><span style="font-family: Monaco;
font-size: 12px; font-style: normal;
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal;
letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start;
text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space:
normal; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none;
display: inline !important;" class="">Date:
Tue, 5 Dec 2017 18:14:59 +0000</span><br style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
<span style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none;
display: inline !important;" class="">From:
Lucas Cordiviola <</span><a href="mailto:lucarda27@hotmail.com" style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows:
auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust:
auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="" moz-do-not-send="true">lucarda27@hotmail.com</a><span style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none;
display: inline !important;" class="">></span><br style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
<span style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none;
display: inline !important;" class="">To:
"</span><a href="mailto:pd-list@lists.iem.at" style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows:
auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust:
auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="" moz-do-not-send="true">pd-list@lists.iem.at</a><span style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none;
display: inline !important;" class="">"
<</span><a href="mailto:pd-list@lists.iem.at" style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows:
auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust:
auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="" moz-do-not-send="true">pd-list@lists.iem.at</a><span style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none;
display: inline !important;" class="">>,
Christof Ressi</span><br style="font-family: Monaco;
font-size: 12px; font-style: normal;
font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal;
letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start;
text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space:
normal; word-spacing: 0px;
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<span class="Apple-tab-span" style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: pre; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"></span><span style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none;
display: inline !important;" class=""><</span><a href="mailto:christof.ressi@gmx.at" style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows:
auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust:
auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="" moz-do-not-send="true">christof.ressi@gmx.at</a><span style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none;
display: inline !important;" class="">></span><br style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
<span style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none;
display: inline !important;" class="">Subject:
Re: [PD] Fw: Re: [PD-announce] Pd 0.48-1 test version</span><br style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
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font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
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<span class="Apple-tab-span" style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: pre; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"></span><span style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none;
display: inline !important;" class="">released</span><br style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
<span style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none;
display: inline !important;" class="">Message-ID:</span><br style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
<span class="Apple-tab-span" style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: pre; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"></span><span style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none;
display: inline !important;" class=""><</span><a href="mailto:BLUPR01MB552BC5EB5950BA429B62D5FA63D0@BLUPR01MB552.prod.exchangelabs.com" style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows:
auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust:
auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="" moz-do-not-send="true">BLUPR01MB552BC5EB5950BA429B62D5FA63D0@BLUPR01MB552.prod.exchangelabs.com</a><span style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none;
display: inline !important;" class="">></span><br style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
<span class="Apple-tab-span" style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: pre; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;"></span><br style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
<span style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none;
display: inline !important;" class="">Content-Type:
text/plain; charset="utf-8"</span><br style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
<br style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
<span style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none;
display: inline !important;" class="">Hi
Christof,</span><br style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
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<br style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
<span style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none;
display: inline !important;" class="">Yes
this changes were totally intentional, and are for good IMO, now patches render the same on all platforms!.</span><br style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
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<br style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
<span style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none;
display: inline !important;" class="">They
were well tested, see:<span class="Apple-converted-space"> </span></span><a href="https://github.com/pure-data/pure-data/pull/227" style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
orphans: auto; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px;
text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows:
auto; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-size-adjust:
auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="" moz-do-not-send="true">https://github.com/pure-data/pure-data/pull/227</a><br style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
<br style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
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<br style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
<span style="font-family: Monaco; font-size: 12px;
font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal;
font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal;
text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform:
none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px;
-webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; float: none;
display: inline !important;" class="">:
- )</span></div>
</blockquote>
</div>
<br class="">
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<div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
--------</div>
<div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
Dan Wilcox</div>
<div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
<a href="http://twitter.com/danomatika" class="" moz-do-not-send="true">@danomatika</a></div>
<div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
<a href="http://danomatika.com/" class="" moz-do-not-send="true">danomatika.com</a></div>
<div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
<a href="http://robotcowboy.com/" class="" moz-do-not-send="true">robotcowboy.com</a></div>
<div style="font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant-caps: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; text-align: start; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px;" class="">
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