<html>
<head>
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=UTF-8">
</head>
<body>
<p>I completely agree with Roman here.</p>
<p>The space character in a list box has a different function than
in a symbol box.</p>
<p>In a symbol box it will always be part of the symbol. Also, it
can be typed as is. I really don't see a need to display the
escape character here. On the contrary, I often use symbol boxes
to display strings, and I find this behavior quite irritating.</p>
<p>In a list box, a space is used to seperate atoms. If you want to
embed a space in one of the symbol atoms, you explicitly have to
type "\ ". Unsurprisingly, the escape character is also displayed.
The same thing applies to message boxes. There is a semantic
difference between an ordinary space and an escaped space.<br>
</p>
<p>I think we could apply a simple rule: display what the user has
typed.</p>
<p>Christof<br>
</p>
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">On 18.11.2021 18:33, Roman Haefeli
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite"
cite="mid:18521319840c420f5f87e7f8cb53e0d1a409cc90.camel@gmail.com">
<pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">On Thu, 2021-11-18 at 12:26 -0300, Alexandre Torres Porres wrote:
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">I remember that discussion (I can try and find it) and I remember
people agreed symbol box should hide "\".
I guess I can agree to that. In my idea, we know what's coming out of
a symbol box, it's a symbol, so if you have a symbol with a space,
then we know that the space is 'escaped' (that is, we're not
splitting this into two atoms).
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">
Yeah, it definitely should keep the symbol intact. But that to make
sure is an issue of the FUDI encoding. I don't type backslash escapes
and I also do not want them to be displayed. The backslashes are not
part of the payload, unless I type them explicitly.
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">But I think print should keep it, in the same way we also need to
keep it for message boxes.
Outside the context of a symbol box, it is important to differentiate
if we have, for instance, a list where one of the items contains an
escaped space.
like, the message:
| list one\ item two <
has two atoms "one item" and "two", and print should be able to tell
us that.
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">
Yeah, that's the FUDI encoding of a list containing two symbols.
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">Now, I don't know about the new list box. What if we want to create a
list with an escaped space? It seems like a special and
different case/context of a symbol box.
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">
Yeah, obviously list boxes are for lists and symbol boxes for symbols.
I think for list boxes to be effective they need to show the FUDI
encoded value, which means displaying the escaping character.
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap=""> By the way, I've been testing it and it seems we can do this by
putting the escaped character ourselves. That seems correct. But it
would be different than the symbol box and maybe I guess it shouldn't
be too problematic that the symbol box also shows escaped characters.
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">
Yes, it is, imho, it is dead-ugly and confuses the distinction between
payload and encoding. I'm pretty happy that Python doesn't only print
"b'Z\xc3\xbcrich'" when I intend to print "Zürich".
</pre>
<blockquote type="cite">
<pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">They're not that common and we can document why this happens when it
happens.
</pre>
</blockquote>
<pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">
That would be confusing things even more.
Roman
</pre>
<br>
<fieldset class="mimeAttachmentHeader"></fieldset>
<pre class="moz-quote-pre" wrap="">_______________________________________________
<a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" href="mailto:Pd-list@lists.iem.at">Pd-list@lists.iem.at</a> mailing list
UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" href="https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list">https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list</a>
</pre>
</blockquote>
</body>
</html>