<div dir="ltr">If you would like to test if $0 works inside messages as originally suggested by Alexandre, you can try pd-l2ork. This is what it has been using for quite some time now, although the use cases of $0 inside a message remain relatively sparse. Another consideration is that there is a bit of a CPU overhead in dynamically allowing $0 to be expanded.<div><br></div><div>Best,</div><div><br></div><div>Ico<br clear="all"><div><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_signature" data-smartmail="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><pre cols="72"><pre cols="72">-- <br>Ivica Ico Bukvic, D.M.A.<br>Director, Creativity + Innovation
Director, Human-Centered Design iPhD
Institute for Creativity, Arts, and Technology
</pre><pre cols="72">Virginia Tech<br>Creative Technologies in Music<br>School of Performing Arts – 0141<br>Blacksburg, VA 24061<br>(540) 231-6139<br><a href="mailto:ico@vt.edu" target="_blank">ico@vt.edu</a><br><br><a href="http://ci.icat.vt.edu" target="_blank">ci.icat.vt.edu</a><br><a href="http://l2ork.icat.vt.edu" target="_blank">l2ork.icat.vt.edu</a><br><a href="http://ico.bukvic.net" target="_blank">ico.bukvic.net<br></a></pre></pre></div></div></div></div></div></div><br></div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Thu, Dec 2, 2021 at 8:34 AM Christof Ressi <<a href="mailto:info@christofressi.com">info@christofressi.com</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div>
<p>I think you're extrapolating from your particular use case.</p>
<p>I would say most people use $0 for private variables/resources.
In this case the very point is that those are not accessible from
outside. If I do want to make things accessible from the outside,
I wouldn't use $0 in the first place...<br>
</p>
<div>On 02.12.2021 14:25, Antoine Rousseau
wrote:<br>
</div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
Without the "$$" syntax, I wouldn't see the problem...</blockquote>
<div>
<div dir="ltr">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>
<div dir="ltr"><br>
<div><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif">encouraging
the use of $0 in messages, without allowing to
easily substitute with [another way to identify
the abstraction] $1?..</font></div>
<div><font face="arial, helvetica, sans-serif"><br>
</font></div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<br>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">
<div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">Le jeu. 2 déc. 2021 à 13:18,
Christof Ressi <<a href="mailto:info@christofressi.com" target="_blank">info@christofressi.com</a>>
a écrit :<br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>So I think it's better to keep the $0/$n
symmetry.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div>I think having a "message" object is a better
idea [than $$'s one]<br>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>What I like with the $$ idea, is that it would
provide a simple way to merge creation arguments
with variable arguments, i.e compose a message with
both the abstraction arguments and the incoming
message elements.</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<p>I have to say I quite like the "$$" idea as well,
assuming that we can take the risk of breaking a few
patches (if any).</p>
<p>I don't think it's a good idea to add a new object just
for this functionality. For me this would create
unnecessary complexity (you have to learn yet another
object).<br>
</p>
<blockquote type="cite">
<div dir="ltr">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>I'm not sure either. To me, both $0 and $1 etc.
can be used to identify an instance of an
abstraction. <br>
</div>
<div>IMO $0 is the quick way, but has the limitation
to make it (nearly) impossible to access members
from the outside.</div>
<div>That's why it often happened to me to rename an
instance [myAbs] to e.g [myAbs myabs1], then to
replace $0 in [myAbs] with $1, so I can easily
access [myAbs]'s members from the parent - from
anywhere in fact (Actually, nowadays I tend to use
as few $0 as possible).<br>
</div>
<div>If we could use $0 in messages, then the last
operation would be more complicated (cause you
couldn't simply substitute $0 with e.g $1).</div>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<p>I agree that if we get the "$$" syntax, then it makes
more sense to use "$$0" for the $0 argument! Without the
"$$" syntax, I wouldn't see the problem...</p>
<p>One downside of using "$$0" is that it wouldn't be
compatible with Pd-L2Ork / PurrData.If they have already
diverged significantly, we probably don't have to care,
but otherwise...</p>
</div>
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