<html><head><meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html charset=windows-1252"></head><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space;">I’m frankly not sure what’s in the contract as that’s between the author and Packt, but I’ll ask her if there was anything in there about the contributions. The way we [or at least I] found out about this policy was an email that was sent before the book’s release. A cursory Googling actually returns some info from their website [1]. Based on the information that Antonio pasted in (and the reply from whence it came in G+), it <i>seems</i> like the terms around this are privileged information. The email was clear, however, that if you sent them the appropriate information that they would send royalties. I’ve put in an email to the author of the jME book as well as one of the other project stewards to help clarify, will let you all know what I hear back.<div><br></div><div>I will say though, that Packt reached out to us via the contact link on the jME website to mention their royalties, which in my mind is bounds better than a silent policy that you have to stumble upon and beg for. Just some food for thought.<br><div><br></div><div>[1] <a href="http://www.packtpub.com/article/packt_open_source_royalties">http://www.packtpub.com/article/packt_open_source_royalties</a><br>
<br><div><div>On Nov 19, 2013, at 2:11 PM, Julian Brooks <<a href="mailto:jbeezez@gmail.com">jbeezez@gmail.com</a>> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite"><div dir="ltr"><div><div><div>Ok - aaargh - I've not been accurate or explicit, and again - sorry.<br><br></div>Antonio - I get you're the reviewer (didn't at first), took me a while but I'm on it now <br>(and btw in academia most reviews, peer or otherwise, are in my experience strictly for kudos so getting something is better than bugger all - if it materialises of course).<br>
<br></div>The question was aimed at Skye (should have stated that directly).<br><br>I'm curious about these things as I've never come across this in practice before and would like to see how it's formalised, that's all.<br>
<br></div><div>Regards,<br><br>Julian<br></div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On 19 November 2013 18:44, Antonio Roberts <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:antonio@hellocatfood.com" target="_blank">antonio@hellocatfood.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div class="im">Addressing me on this? I didn't have a contract as I was just a tech reviewer. Bryan Chung <a href="http://www.magicandlove.com/" target="_blank">http://www.magicandlove.com/</a> is the author and the one I presume had a contract<br>
<br></div><div class="im">
On 19/11/13 18:35, Julian Brooks wrote:<br>
</div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div class="im">
Out of curiosity (and of course if there's anything sensitive in there<br>
then of course don't bother, but, I'd be really curious to see how the<br>
FLOSS contribution is worded in your contract? (I have an academic<br>
interest in these things)<br>
<br>
Regards,<br>
<br>
Julian<br>
<br>
<br>
On 19 November 2013 16:15, Skye Book <<a href="mailto:skye.book@gmail.com" target="_blank">skye.book@gmail.com</a><br></div><div class="im">
<mailto:<a href="mailto:skye.book@gmail.com" target="_blank">skye.book@gmail.com</a>>> wrote:<br>
<br>
Nice to hear there’s a PD book :)<br>
<br>
On Nov 19, 2013, at 11:03 AM, Antonio Roberts<br></div><div><div class="h5">
<<a href="mailto:antonio@hellocatfood.com" target="_blank">antonio@hellocatfood.com</a> <mailto:<a href="mailto:antonio@hellocatfood.com" target="_blank">antonio@hellocatfood.<u></u>com</a>>> wrote:<br>
<br>
>> Really sorry for my laziness. I just opened it and saw your name!!¬!<br>
>> Listen, we're really grateful for your support. There aren't enough<br>
>> books about Pure Data programming out there, and I'm sure my<br>
students<br>
>> will find this really helpful.<br>
> That's why I agreed to do it. I think there's plenty of resources<br>
out there for PD music/audio programming but none dedicated to just<br>
visuals. The book was a bit too basic for my needs, but it would've<br>
been invaluable to me three years ago!<br>
><br>
> Also, no need to thank me, I didn't write it! Regardless, I'm<br>
glad that you/your students will find it useful. I'm glad the book<br>
now exists, I just wish Packt were clearer on the whole royalties<br>
situation.<br>
><br>
>> Once again, I think the person you need to talk to is Hans<br>
>> Cristoph-Steiner, but I am sure he'll read this thread.<br>
> Hopefully he will. Packt do a lot of books about open source<br>
software so I'll be interested in hearing if those projects get<br>
royalties/support as well.<br>
<br>
We’ve had some dealings with Packt for the jMonkeyEngine Beginners<br>
Guide<br>
[<a href="http://www.packtpub.com/jmonkeyengine-3-0-with-java-programming-beginners-guide/book" target="_blank">http://www.packtpub.com/<u></u>jmonkeyengine-3-0-with-java-<u></u>programming-beginners-guide/<u></u>book</a>]<br>
and have heard similar from them on contributing some royalties back<br>
to FOSS. The offer seemed quite real, though I don’t know anything<br>
in terms of sales numbers or if we’ve had any money find its way<br>
back to the project. I’d be happy to throw the question to the<br>
author though..<br>
<br>
We don’t have any sort of entity set up around jME so there was some<br>
discussion a while back about where that money should funnel as it<br>
would ultimately go towards hosting costs.<br>
<br>
><br>
>> Nice to meet you Antonio, even if it was slightly cack-handed<br>
from my<br>
>> end ;-)<br>
> No harm done ;-) Out of interest, where do you teach?<br>
><br>
> Antonio<br>
><br>
> On Tue 19 Nov 2013 15:40:35 GMT, Ed Kelly wrote:<br>
>> Oh Man!<br>
>><br>
>> Really sorry for my laziness. I just opened it and saw your name!!¬!<br>
>> Listen, we're really grateful for your support. There aren't enough<br>
>> books about Pure Data programming out there, and I'm sure my<br>
students<br>
>> will find this really helpful.<br>
>><br>
>> Once again, I think the person you need to talk to is Hans<br>
>> Cristoph-Steiner, but I am sure he'll read this thread.<br>
>><br>
>> Nice to meet you Antonio, even if it was slightly cack-handed<br>
from my<br>
>> end ;-)<br>
>><br>
>> Ed<br>
>><br>
>> Ninja Jamm - a revolutionary new music remix app from Ninja Tune and<br>
>> Seeper, for iPhone and iPad<br>
>> <a href="http://www.ninjajamm.com/" target="_blank">http://www.ninjajamm.com/</a><br>
>><br>
>><br>
>> Gemnotes-0.2: Live music notation for Pure Data, now with dynamics!<br>
>> <a href="http://sharktracks.co.uk/" target="_blank">http://sharktracks.co.uk/</a><br>
>><br>
>><br>
>> On Tuesday, 19 November 2013, 15:15, Antonio Roberts<br></div></div><div><div class="h5">
>> <<a href="mailto:antonio@hellocatfood.com" target="_blank">antonio@hellocatfood.com</a> <mailto:<a href="mailto:antonio@hellocatfood.com" target="_blank">antonio@hellocatfood.<u></u>com</a>>> wrote:<br>
>><br>
>><br>
>> > I have the book "Multimedia Programming in Pure Data" in front<br>
>> of me, published by Packt, by Brian WC Chung. No mention of<br>
>> Antonio Roberts!<br>
>> I'm one of the tech reviewers ;-)<br>
>><br>
>> > Well in that case I apologise. Sorry Antonio, I didn't realise<br>
>> you'd<br>
>> > already published a book with them (blushing).<br>
>> I didn't publish the book, just did a tech review of it. As I<br>
briefly<br>
>> said in a comment in the G+ thread, it wasn't a bad<br>
experience but<br>
>> not<br>
>> a great one either. I considered it a good way to give back<br>
to the<br>
>> community (yes, I know you have to buy the book) and get my<br>
name "out<br>
>> there", but now that I've done it once I won't be doing it<br>
again and<br>
>> definitely not for them ;-)<br>
>><br>
>> (on a separate note I'm also thinking about reviving the Pure<br>
Data<br>
>> Documentation Project)<br>
>><br>
>> To me it seems like Packt are a legitimate business but aer<br>
telling a<br>
>> few porkies with regards to royalties<br>
>><br>
>> On Tue 19 Nov 2013 14:24:23 GMT, Julian Brooks wrote:<br>
>> > Hey Ed (& Antonio),<br>
>> ><br>
>> > Well in that case I apologise. Sorry Antonio, I didn't realise<br>
>> you'd<br>
>> > already published a book with them (blushing).<br>
>> ><br>
>> > My first comment was more from a reading of the original<br>
link that<br>
>> > Antonio forwarded. And from that, Packt look well suss.<br>
>> ><br>
>> > There's certainly no shortage of dodgy publishers about<br>
(nor record<br>
>> > labels for that matter) - guess it depends on the deal you can<br>
>> wangle.<br>
>> ><br>
>> ><br>
>> > On 19 November 2013 14:00, Ed Kelly <<a href="mailto:morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk" target="_blank">morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk</a><br>
<mailto:<a href="mailto:morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk" target="_blank">morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk</a><u></u>><br>
>> <mailto:<a href="mailto:morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk" target="_blank">morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk</a> <mailto:<a href="mailto:morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk" target="_blank">morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk</a><u></u>>><br>
>> > <mailto:<a href="mailto:morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk" target="_blank">morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk</a><br>
<mailto:<a href="mailto:morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk" target="_blank">morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk</a><u></u>> <mailto:<a href="mailto:morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk" target="_blank">morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk</a><br>
<mailto:<a href="mailto:morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk" target="_blank">morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk</a><u></u>>>>><br>
>> wrote:<br>
>> ><br>
>> > PS Antonio, nice favicon :)<br>
>> ><br>
>> > Ninja Jamm - a revolutionary new music remix app from<br>
Ninja Tune<br>
>> > and Seeper, for iPhone and iPad<br>
>> > <a href="http://www.ninjajamm.com/" target="_blank">http://www.ninjajamm.com/</a><br>
>> ><br>
>> ><br>
>> > Gemnotes-0.2: Live music notation for Pure Data, now with<br>
>> dynamics!<br>
>> > <a href="http://sharktracks.co.uk/" target="_blank">http://sharktracks.co.uk/</a><br>
>> ><br>
>> ><br>
>> > On , Ed Kelly <<a href="mailto:morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk" target="_blank">morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk</a><br>
<mailto:<a href="mailto:morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk" target="_blank">morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk</a><u></u>><br>
>> <mailto:<a href="mailto:morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk" target="_blank">morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk</a> <mailto:<a href="mailto:morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk" target="_blank">morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk</a><u></u>>><br>
>> > <mailto:<a href="mailto:morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk" target="_blank">morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk</a><br>
<mailto:<a href="mailto:morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk" target="_blank">morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk</a><u></u>><br>
>> <mailto:<a href="mailto:morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk" target="_blank">morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk</a><br>
<mailto:<a href="mailto:morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk" target="_blank">morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk</a><u></u>>>>> wrote:<br>
>> ><br>
>> > Damn - they changed Yahoo mail recently and I can't<br>
seem to<br>
>> > find it. However, <a href="http://www.hellocatfood.com/" target="_blank">www.hellocatfood.com</a><br>
<<a href="http://www.hellocatfood.com/" target="_blank">http://www.hellocatfood.com</a>><br>
>> > <<a href="http://www.hellocatfood.com/" target="_blank">http://www.hellocatfood.com</a><br>
>> <<a href="http://www.hellocatfood.com/" target="_blank">http://www.hellocatfood.com/</a>><u></u>> does indeed seem to be genuine,<br>
>> > and Antonio does indeed seem to be a performer with<br>
>> multimedia<br>
>> > performer using Pure Data.<br>
>> ><br>
>> > This doesn't look like a hack, but "free money"<br>
should always<br>
>> > be treated with suspicion I'm sure.<br>
>> ><br>
>> > Probably the best way forward is for one of us to get in<br>
>> touch<br>
>> > with Packt publishing and request clarification.<br>
>> ><br>
>> > Cheers,<br>
>> > Ed<br>
>> ><br>
>> > Ninja Jamm - a revolutionary new music remix app<br>
from Ninja<br>
>> > Tune and Seeper, for iPhone and iPad<br>
>> > <a href="http://www.ninjajamm.com/" target="_blank">http://www.ninjajamm.com/</a><br>
>> ><br>
>> ><br>
>> > Gemnotes-0.2: Live music notation for Pure Data, now<br>
with<br>
>> > dynamics!<br>
>> > <a href="http://sharktracks.co.uk/" target="_blank">http://sharktracks.co.uk/</a><br>
>> ><br>
>> ><br>
>> > On , Ed Kelly <<a href="mailto:morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk" target="_blank">morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk</a><br>
<mailto:<a href="mailto:morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk" target="_blank">morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk</a><u></u>><br>
>> <mailto:<a href="mailto:morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk" target="_blank">morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk</a> <mailto:<a href="mailto:morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk" target="_blank">morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk</a><u></u>>><br>
>> > <mailto:<a href="mailto:morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk" target="_blank">morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk</a><br>
<mailto:<a href="mailto:morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk" target="_blank">morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk</a><u></u>><br>
>> <mailto:<a href="mailto:morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk" target="_blank">morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk</a><br>
<mailto:<a href="mailto:morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk" target="_blank">morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk</a><u></u>>>>> wrote:<br>
>> ><br>
>> > Hmm. I couldn't get the post Antonio was<br>
referring to in<br>
>> > his email. This could be a very sophisticated<br>
form of<br>
>> > phishing I suppose. Apologies for my naivety!<br>
>> ><br>
>> > I have the book "Multimedia Programming in Pure<br>
Data" in<br>
>> > front of me, published by Packt, by Brian WC<br>
Chung. No<br>
>> > mention of Antonio Roberts!<br>
>> ><br>
>> > I'll just take a look at the header for the email and get<br>
>> > back to you. Let's not take too much time in<br>
dealing with<br>
>> > this.<br>
>> ><br>
>> > Ed<br>
>> > Ninja Jamm - a revolutionary new music remix app<br>
from<br>
>> > Ninja Tune and Seeper, for iPhone and iPad<br>
>> > <a href="http://www.ninjajamm.com/" target="_blank">http://www.ninjajamm.com/</a><br>
>> ><br>
>> ><br>
>> > Gemnotes-0.2: Live music notation for Pure Data,<br>
now with<br>
>> > dynamics!<br>
>> > <a href="http://sharktracks.co.uk/" target="_blank">http://sharktracks.co.uk/</a><br>
>> ><br>
>> ><br>
>> > On Tuesday, 19 November 2013, 13:41, Julian Brooks<br>
>> > <<a href="mailto:jbeezez@gmail.com" target="_blank">jbeezez@gmail.com</a> <mailto:<a href="mailto:jbeezez@gmail.com" target="_blank">jbeezez@gmail.com</a>><br>
<mailto:<a href="mailto:jbeezez@gmail.com" target="_blank">jbeezez@gmail.com</a> <mailto:<a href="mailto:jbeezez@gmail.com" target="_blank">jbeezez@gmail.com</a>>><br>
>> <mailto:<a href="mailto:jbeezez@gmail.com" target="_blank">jbeezez@gmail.com</a> <mailto:<a href="mailto:jbeezez@gmail.com" target="_blank">jbeezez@gmail.com</a>><br>
<mailto:<a href="mailto:jbeezez@gmail.com" target="_blank">jbeezez@gmail.com</a> <mailto:<a href="mailto:jbeezez@gmail.com" target="_blank">jbeezez@gmail.com</a>>>>> wrote:<br>
>> ><br>
>> > Is this some kind of so-dry-I-don't-get-it<br>
humour<br>
>> 'cos<br>
>> > they look well suss<br>
>> ><br>
>> > J<br>
>> ><br>
>> ><br>
>> > On 19 November 2013 13:21, Ed Kelly<br>
>> > <<a href="mailto:morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk" target="_blank">morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk</a><br>
<mailto:<a href="mailto:morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk" target="_blank">morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk</a><u></u>><br>
>> <mailto:<a href="mailto:morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk" target="_blank">morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk</a> <mailto:<a href="mailto:morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk" target="_blank">morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk</a><u></u>>><br>
>> > <mailto:<a href="mailto:morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk" target="_blank">morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk</a><br>
<mailto:<a href="mailto:morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk" target="_blank">morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk</a><u></u>><br>
>> <mailto:<a href="mailto:morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk" target="_blank">morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk</a><br>
<mailto:<a href="mailto:morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk" target="_blank">morph_2016@yahoo.co.uk</a><u></u>>>>> wrote:<br>
>> ><br>
>> > Wow!<br>
>> ><br>
>> > Is the Pd foundation up and running? I<br>
haven't<br>
>> > followed the news (if there is any)<br>
regarding<br>
>> this.<br>
>> ><br>
>> > Perhaps this is within your scope Hans?<br>
>> ><br>
>> > Ed<br>
>> ><br>
>> > Ninja Jamm - a revolutionary new music<br>
remix app<br>
>> > from Ninja Tune and Seeper, for iPhone<br>
and iPad<br>
>> > <a href="http://www.ninjajamm.com/" target="_blank">http://www.ninjajamm.com/</a><br>
>> ><br>
>> ><br>
>> > Gemnotes-0.2: Live music notation for<br>
Pure Data,<br>
>> > now with dynamics!<br>
>> > <a href="http://sharktracks.co.uk/" target="_blank">http://sharktracks.co.uk/</a><br>
>> ><br>
>> ><br>
>> > On Monday, 18 November 2013, 19:53, Antonio<br>
>> > Roberts <<a href="mailto:antonio@hellocatfood.com" target="_blank">antonio@hellocatfood.com</a><br>
<mailto:<a href="mailto:antonio@hellocatfood.com" target="_blank">antonio@hellocatfood.<u></u>com</a>><br>
>> <mailto:<a href="mailto:antonio@hellocatfood.com" target="_blank">antonio@hellocatfood.<u></u>com</a><br>
<mailto:<a href="mailto:antonio@hellocatfood.com" target="_blank">antonio@hellocatfood.<u></u>com</a>>><br>
>> > <mailto:<a href="mailto:antonio@hellocatfood.com" target="_blank">antonio@hellocatfood.<u></u>com</a><br>
<mailto:<a href="mailto:antonio@hellocatfood.com" target="_blank">antonio@hellocatfood.<u></u>com</a>><br>
>> <mailto:<a href="mailto:antonio@hellocatfood.com" target="_blank">antonio@hellocatfood.<u></u>com</a><br>
<mailto:<a href="mailto:antonio@hellocatfood.com" target="_blank">antonio@hellocatfood.<u></u>com</a>>>>> wrote:<br>
>> ><br>
>> > A representative of Packt Publishing<br>
recently<br>
>> > put out a call to<br>
>> > developers of open source software<br>
packages<br>
>> > that are covered in their<br>
>> > books to get in contact regarding<br>
royalties.<br>
>> > They claim that they give<br>
>> > money to the authors _and_ the<br>
project that<br>
>> > the book is based upon.<br>
>> > Text below:<br>
>> ><br>
>> > "I'm sorry that we haven't yet been<br>
able to<br>
>> > make this clear. I will<br>
>> > have this looked in to and revised for<br>
>> clarity.<br>
>> > But, to confirm, authors receive<br>
royalties on<br>
>> > sales of their books but<br>
>> > we also give a royalty, where the<br>
book is<br>
>> > based on an Open Source<br>
>> > software or system, to the Project.<br>
>> > I'm not at liberty to disclose the<br>
names of<br>
>> > projects that have<br>
>> > received this royalty, only that<br>
cumulatively<br>
>> > we have given out a<br>
>> > large sum of money to them.<br>
>> > Please also treat this as a call out<br>
to any<br>
>> > Open Source project that<br>
>> > we have published on to get in touch<br>
with me<br>
>> > should they not be<br>
>> > receiving their royalties, we can<br>
only send<br>
>> > them to you if we have<br>
>> > your details :) "<br>
>> ><br>
>> > Full thread here:<br>
>> > <a href="https://plus.google.com/113862800338869870683/posts/PDVcovR7Sir" target="_blank">https://plus.google.com/<u></u>113862800338869870683/posts/<u></u>PDVcovR7Sir</a><br>
>> ><br>
>><br>
<<a href="https://plus.google.com/113862800338869870683/posts/PDVcovR7Sir" target="_blank">https://plus.google.com/<u></u>113862800338869870683/posts/<u></u>PDVcovR7Sir</a>>See<br>
>> > last comment from Jonathan Titmus<br>
>> ><br>
>> > --<br>
>> > ============================<br>
>> > <a href="mailto:antonio@hellocatfood.com" target="_blank">antonio@hellocatfood.com</a> <mailto:<a href="mailto:antonio@hellocatfood.com" target="_blank">antonio@hellocatfood.<u></u>com</a>><br>
<mailto:<a href="mailto:antonio@hellocatfood.com" target="_blank">antonio@hellocatfood.<u></u>com</a> <mailto:<a href="mailto:antonio@hellocatfood.com" target="_blank">antonio@hellocatfood.<u></u>com</a>>><br>
>> > <mailto:<a href="mailto:antonio@hellocatfood.com" target="_blank">antonio@hellocatfood.<u></u>com</a><br>
<mailto:<a href="mailto:antonio@hellocatfood.com" target="_blank">antonio@hellocatfood.<u></u>com</a>><br>
>> <mailto:<a href="mailto:antonio@hellocatfood.com" target="_blank">antonio@hellocatfood.<u></u>com</a><br>
<mailto:<a href="mailto:antonio@hellocatfood.com" target="_blank">antonio@hellocatfood.<u></u>com</a>>>><br>
>> > <a href="http://www.hellocatfood.com/" target="_blank">http://www.hellocatfood.com</a> <<a href="http://www.hellocatfood.com/" target="_blank">http://www.hellocatfood.com/</a>><br>
>> > <<a href="http://www.hellocatfood.com/" target="_blank">http://www.hellocatfood.com/</a>><br>
>> > ============================<br>
>> ><br>
>> ><br>
>> ______________________________<u></u>_________________<br>
>> > Pd-ot mailing list<br>
>> > <a href="mailto:Pd-ot@iem.at" target="_blank">Pd-ot@iem.at</a> <mailto:<a href="mailto:Pd-ot@iem.at" target="_blank">Pd-ot@iem.at</a>> <mailto:<a href="mailto:Pd-ot@iem.at" target="_blank">Pd-ot@iem.at</a><br>
</div></div>
<mailto:<a href="mailto:Pd-ot@iem.at" target="_blank">Pd-ot@iem.at</a>>> <mailto:<a href="mailto:Pd-ot@iem.at" target="_blank">Pd-ot@iem.at</a> <mailto:<a href="mailto:Pd-ot@iem.at" target="_blank">Pd-ot@iem.at</a>><br>
>> <mailto:<a href="mailto:Pd-ot@iem.at" target="_blank">Pd-ot@iem.at</a> <mailto:<a href="mailto:Pd-ot@iem.at" target="_blank">Pd-ot@iem.at</a>>>><div class="im"><br>
>> > <a href="http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-ot" target="_blank">http://lists.puredata.info/<u></u>listinfo/pd-ot</a><br>
>> ><br>
>> ><br>
>> ><br>
>> ><br>
______________________________<u></u>_________________<br>
>> > Pd-ot mailing list<br>
>> > <a href="mailto:Pd-ot@iem.at" target="_blank">Pd-ot@iem.at</a> <mailto:<a href="mailto:Pd-ot@iem.at" target="_blank">Pd-ot@iem.at</a>> <mailto:<a href="mailto:Pd-ot@iem.at" target="_blank">Pd-ot@iem.at</a><br>
</div>
<mailto:<a href="mailto:Pd-ot@iem.at" target="_blank">Pd-ot@iem.at</a>>> <mailto:<a href="mailto:Pd-ot@iem.at" target="_blank">Pd-ot@iem.at</a> <mailto:<a href="mailto:Pd-ot@iem.at" target="_blank">Pd-ot@iem.at</a>><br>
>> <mailto:<a href="mailto:Pd-ot@iem.at" target="_blank">Pd-ot@iem.at</a> <mailto:<a href="mailto:Pd-ot@iem.at" target="_blank">Pd-ot@iem.at</a>>>><div class="im"><br>
>> > <a href="http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-ot" target="_blank">http://lists.puredata.info/<u></u>listinfo/pd-ot</a><br>
>> ><br>
>> ><br>
>> ><br>
>> ><br>
>> ><br>
>> ><br>
>> ><br>
>> ><br>
>> ><br>
>><br>
>><br>
><br>
> ______________________________<u></u>_________________<br>
> Pd-ot mailing list<br>
> <a href="mailto:Pd-ot@iem.at" target="_blank">Pd-ot@iem.at</a> <mailto:<a href="mailto:Pd-ot@iem.at" target="_blank">Pd-ot@iem.at</a>><br>
> <a href="http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-ot" target="_blank">http://lists.puredata.info/<u></u>listinfo/pd-ot</a><br>
<br>
<br>
______________________________<u></u>_________________<br>
Pd-ot mailing list<br>
<a href="mailto:Pd-ot@iem.at" target="_blank">Pd-ot@iem.at</a> <mailto:<a href="mailto:Pd-ot@iem.at" target="_blank">Pd-ot@iem.at</a>><br></div>
<a href="http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-ot" target="_blank">http://lists.puredata.info/<u></u>listinfo/pd-ot</a><br>
<br>
<br>
</blockquote>
</blockquote></div><br></div>
</blockquote></div><br></div></div></body></html>