[PD-dev] removing pd/bin/msvr*.dll from Pd/win

[Christof Ressi]

> I will try to find out if any of the old extended externals actually 
> needs these dlls. Probably msvcrt.dll comes from the Msys1 era.

Thanks for testing!

just to make sure: *all* Pd externals compiled with MinGW have a dependency on MSVCRT.DLL but they use only C functions and it doesn't have to be the version shipped with Pd. the version doesn't matter as long as they don't do stupid things like freeing memory or closing a file handle obtained from another module (which you should never do anyway, unless you're 100% sure everything was compiled with the very same compiler).

what you could check, though, is if plugins depend on a msvcr*.dll (e.g. msvcr90.dll) because this would mean they have been compiled with VS but haven't linked statically. you could also check if externals depend on any C++ symbols from MSVC runtime libraries.

Christof

> Gesendet: Dienstag, 22. Januar 2019 um 23:22 Uhr
> Von: "Lucas Cordiviola" <lucarda27 at hotmail.com>
> An: "Christof Ressi" <christof.ressi at gmx.at>, pd-dev <pd-dev at lists.iem.at>
> Betreff: Re: [PD-dev] removing pd/bin/msvr*.dll from Pd/win
>
> I also agree.
> 
> I will try to find out if any of the old extended externals actually 
> needs these dlls. Probably msvcrt.dll comes from the Msys1 era.
> 
> I'll check ASAP with the list of old externals (attached).
> 
> Mensaje telepatico asistido por maquinas.
> 
> On 1/22/2019 6:51 PM, Christof Ressi wrote:
> > I agree and I've already suggested this: https://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-dev/2018-09/021721.html
> >
> > BTW, I got linker errors because of msvcrt.dll when I compiled Dan's pdfontloader. this left me scratching my head for quite a while. removing the DLL solved the problem.
> > https://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-dev/2018-09/021709.html
> >
> > Christof
> >
> >> Gesendet: Dienstag, 22. Januar 2019 um 22:16 Uhr
> >> Von: "IOhannes m zmölnig" <zmoelnig at iem.at>
> >> An: "PureData developer's list" <pd-dev at lists.iem.at>
> >> Betreff: [PD-dev] removing pd/bin/msvr*.dll from Pd/win
> >>
> >> hi,
> >>
> >> TL;DR: i'd like to suggest to remove the "msvcr90.dll" and " msvcrt.dll"
> >> files from the pd\bin\ folder of all (future) windows releases.
> >>
> >> rationale
> >> =========
> >>
> >> # usage by Pd
> >> first of all, these files are not used by Pd at all.
> >> they are only provided as a courtesy for externals that happen to
> >> require a dyamically linked libc implementation but fail to provide one
> >> themselves.
> >> most likely this is a leftover from the days, where any dynamic
> >> dependencies of an external would only be looked up in the Pd\bin\
> >> folder (and not in the folder of the external itself), making it
> >> impossible to ship externals in a self-contained folder.
> >> luckily, these days are gone.
> >>
> >> # incompatibility
> >> for whatever reasons (personally i blame redmont, but i might be
> >> biased), "msvcrt.dll" is not a well defined library. especially it does
> >> not guarantee any binary compatibility.
> >> in practice, the "msvcrt.dll" as shipped with Pd is *incompatible* with
> >> msvcrt.dll as used by mingw when compiling. (it might also be
> >> incompatible with a file of the same name shipped with the latest
> >> release of MS Visual Studio, but i haven't checked).
> >>
> >> that means: the provided msvcrt.dll simply will not work with any
> >> mingw-compiled external.
> >> if the
> >>
> >> # compiling
> >> i noticed that i cannot compile/link externals for windows/32bit using
> >> mingw, if their build-system uses autotools/libtool.
> >>
> >> the linking stage fails in catastrophic ways, only because the linker
> >> picks up the
> >>
> >> here's an example log-file of such a failed build:
> >>    https://git.iem.at/pd/Gem/-/jobs/3230
> >>
> >> <techdetails>
> >> it took me a while to figure out what went wrong, because pd-lib-builder
> >> based externals compile just fine.
> >> it turned out, that the difference was that pd-lib-builder would link
> >> against "${PDPATH}\bin\pd.dll" (that is: it uses the full path as the
> >> library file to link against) whereas libtool based builds would link
> >> against "pd.dll" and add "${PDPATH\bin\" to the library search path (the
> >> actual linker flags being "-L${PDPATH}\bin\ -l:pd.dll").
> >> since explicit library search paths take precedence over built-ins,
> >> adding "-L${PDPATH}\bin\" would make the linker find the "msvcrt.dll"
> >> file in ${PDPATH}\bin\, which happens to be incompatible with mingw, and
> >> thus an error is raised.
> >> </techdetails>
> >>
> >> the *only* way i found to fix the linker flag, is by removing the
> >> "msvcrt.dll" file from ${PDPATH}\bin\ before starting the build-process.
> >> in practice i also removed the "msvcr90.dll" file.
> >>
> >> incidentally, there are no problem with the w64 version of Pd, as this
> >> ships 32bit versions of "msvcr*.dll", which will be ignored by the
> >> compiler/linker/runtimelinker, because of a non-matching architecture.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> # conclusion
> >> afaics, there are currently **no** benefits in shipping the msvcr*.dll
> >> files.
> >> however, they do create a number of issues.
> >> (and in the case of Pd/W64 they are of the wrong architecture anyhow)
> >>
> >> i don't see a reason to keep them.
> >>
> >> fgmdsar
> >> IOhannes
> >>
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> >>
> >
> >
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