pd-render object WAS: Re: [PD] xp4pd - extreme programming over the network

Hans-Christoph Steiner hans at eds.org
Thu Dec 18 21:34:37 CET 2003

On Thursday, Dec 18, 2003, at 03:08 Europe/Brussels, Frank Barknecht  

> Hallo,
> guenter geiger hat gesagt: // guenter geiger wrote:
>> On Wed, 17 Dec 2003, guenter geiger wrote:
>>>> Ok, that sounds like a very cool idea, I am all for making as much  
>>>> of
>>>> Pd be 'Pure Data' as possible.  By making more of the GUI in the  
>>>> realm
>>>> of Pd messages, then it would allow [widget]-like functionality with
>>>> native Pd msgs, while being GUI toolkit agnostic.  But that is also
>>>> probably not a holiday task.
>>> yes, thats exactly what xgui already does, its just a question of
>>> implementing this idea efficiently.
>>> nothing new ..
>> ah, yes, and of course the template stuff does the same thing
>> ..
> Which is, what I would like to mention, too. The template stuff is
> quite cool, unfourtunatly it is really hard to understand deeply and
> doesn't cope well with Graph-on-parent patches in my (small)
> experience.
> But: It is independent of the toolkit, Pd uses. It's a whole new
> syntax, that seems quite flexible.
> If it only would find more users, so the rough edges can be found and
> smoothed out...
> I don't think, something so tied to a toolkit as toxy is the way to go
> in the long run.

Guenter's pd-render idea opens whole new doors and is of course  
ultimately the way to go, but it'll be a while before we get there.   
Mostly I was responding to calls to port Pd to something different,  
like wxWindows, which without pd-render would be a lot of work for  
little gain.

toxy demonstrates what could be possible in a generic way with  
pd-render, but is working now, and there is a lot to be said for that.

I have begun to think about the Pd structure as similar to TCP/IP: keep  
everything as general as possible and make the intelligence at the  
ends.  If everything in Pd communicates using Pd messages, it makes the  
whole system generic and open to uses that where totally unanticipated  
by its creators.  This will ultimately lead to the greatest innovation.



                     There is no way to peace, peace is the way.
										-A.J. Muste

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