hi, to inform you i've created a mailing list for pf http://zwizwa.fartit.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pf-list this is where i'm going to dump most of my pf and not pd/pdp/pidip related gibberish which will hopefully lead to a decent manual some day. it's for all ages. one big dev/user/lurker orgy. cheers tom