[PD] elitism, software and academia (was GEM FTGL Sadness)

[Jamie Bullock]

Hi Jared,

On Fri, 2007-06-08 at 18:39 +0100, jared wrote:
 
> 
> >I don't know what your academic experience is, but there is a lot of
> 
> >evidence to suggest the opposite of what you are saying. 
>
> Then I attended an institution whose policies are different than the
> others.
> 

That's really my point: you can't really generalise about academia
because it comprises of an international group of (often unrelated)
people and organisations. Some of these share common traits, others
don't.
 
> 
> > I think academia needs to recognize that there are many composers
> who 
> 
> > use computers as a means to an end;
>
> >I find this patronising, almost offensive.
>
> Why so overly sensitive? This wasn't an attack on anyone.  It is an
> opinion, not an accusation.  Did you not see the smiley faces?
> Smile :-) 
> 

Sorry about that, but it was the generalisation that I didn't like. I
would have thought it was a perfectly fair comment if you had put 'I
think certain academic institutions need to recognise...'
 
> 
> I won't name anyone.  One example: I had 'programming' classes where I
> had to create compositions with Max/MSP and Csound.  Instead of using
> shared patches/orch files we had to build and use extremely basic
> instruments; rarely anything more than an oscillator, filter and an
> LFO. So, instead of being encouraged to use shared instruments which
> would result in having a composition with some 'character', I have a
> couple semesters’ worth of compositions full of bloops, beeps and
> sirens.  No offense to bloops, beeps and siren lovers :-) I just don't
> find it aesthetically interesting. I would have loved if we had fewer
> assignments so we could have the time to build our own more
> interesting sound generators to include in our compositions.  Or, we
> should have been allowed to pick and choose between the plethoras of
> shared instruments.  

It sounds like that course wasn't for you :-/

> 
> >Even if you do, you shouldn't make
> 
> >generalisations about an entire community based on a few personal
> 
> >examples. 
> 
> So if someone finds, what they believe to be, something missing from a
> system, they shouldn't speak about it?  That's rather dangerous
> censorship, I believe.

That's not what I'm saying at all. The thing is that you haven't found
something missing from a system, you've found something missing from a
specific institution within a system. I am therefore suggesting that you
restrict your comments to that specific case (albeit anonymously) unless
you can be sure that they really do apply to the entire system. 

> 
> >Where is this rigid line? Do you have any evidence for it? As far as
> I
> 
> >can tell there exists a continuum like this:
> 
> 
> >   composer <-> composer/programmer <-> programmer
> 
>  
> 
> Do you see that slash that you've put between composer and programmer?
> That's the rigid line.  Do you notice how the composer and programmer
> on opposite sides of the spectrum?  That's the rigid line. 

The slash is intended to indicate someone who is a composer and a
programmer. Perhaps I should have indicated the continuum on some sort
of 4-dimensional hyperplane ;-)


> Therein lays the rigidity.  Who forms this 'demand'?  Is this the
> demand because these are the only two options available?  I believe
> that today's generation of music students would be more interested in
> grey, not black and white.  

I would imagine that some of them are interested in grey, some of them
are interested in black and some of them are interested in white, and
some of them are interested in black, white and grey...

>  
> 
> >.....as well as music technology courses that contain
> 
> no programming elements at all....>
> 
>  
> 
> Please let me know of such courses.  I'm not being facetious...this is
> the type of program that I am interested in. 

Are you looking for a course largely oriented towards enabling you to
author your own artistic outputs (e.g. pieces of music/sound art), or a
sound recording/production course, or a bit of both?

I only really know about UK Universities, but I will try to help if I
can.

> 
> >Bidule (http://www.plogue.com/) if they are on Mac OS, Audiomulch
> 
> >(http://www.audiomulch.com/) if they are on Windows.
>
> I'm glad you mentioned those programs...I wonder why aren't they more
> utilized throughout academia?  I would have loved to be able to use
> Bidule and Audiomulch for my compositions.
> 

Yes, the irony of this debate is that I actually agree with your point
that there is a need for (preferably FLOSS) tools that provide an
easier, more accessible, more user-friendly, more immediate route into
composition and performance with technology than some of the Music N
derivatives (Pd, Max/MSP, Csound SuperCollider etc). You might be
interested in a project I'm currently involved in to start addressing
some these problems (www.integralive.org). 

best,

Jamie