[PD] max for live

Luke Iannini lukexipd at gmail.com
Tue Jan 20 00:23:17 CET 2009

On Mon, Jan 19, 2009 at 2:49 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner <hans at eds.org> wrote:
> On Jan 19, 2009, at 9:21 AM, Damian Stewart wrote:
>> Daniel Almeida wrote:
>>> I dare say PD needs to ditch tcl/tk! SDL could be a good idea.
>>> Daniel
>> yeah that's what i said about two years ago...
>> the problem is, at the moment tcl/tk is embedded quite deeply into Pd
>> itself. this is a focus of the current pd-dev effort: trying to
>> clear this
>> up. tcl/tk in itself isn't _necessarily_ slow, it's just that the
>> way Pd is
>> using it is not at all optimised (for example, as Hans-Christoph and i
>> discovered once, when you click-drag to move an element in a graphical
>> table, not just the element you moved but _the entire table_ is
>> redrawn,
>> each time).
>> --
>> damian stewart | skype: damiansnz | damian at frey.co.nz
>> frey | live art with machines | http://www.frey.co.nz
> It's slight worse, even.  The entire table is deleted and re-created
> on each change, not even just redrawn.  That said, I am guessing the C+
> + code on the GPU (Live) will always be quite a bit faster than Tcl/Tk
> on the CPU.  One of the ways that Live is able to make things fast is
> by ignoring the native widgets on each platform and coding their own.
> Tcl/Tk is the best GUI toolkit I've seen for making native-feeling
> apps while writing cross-platform code.
> If Live is really just blasting bitmaps to the screen, that is
> something that Tcl/Tk can easily do.  But I am not sure that it would
> be the fastest way to implement GUI widgets.
> If someone wants to help this situation, I think the best thing to do
> would be to create some GUI objects using TkZinc.  Then we'll have Tcl/
> Tk on the GPU and that should make things quite a bit faster.
Wow, hadn't heard of TkZinc.  That looks incredible.  Another cloud
for my Pd heaven : ).  As I've been writing, I'd really love to create
GUIs entirely with Data Structures - I'm not sure how much of a
performance hit that causes but the opportunities for customization
are much richer when it's turtles all the way down (where turtles =
Pd).  Is TkZinc feasible for replacing the whole GUI?  It seems to
support all the platforms Pd does.


> .hc
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