[PD] Pd-berlin meeting on tuesday || 28 || 28 || 28 || not on 21..

[João Pais]

> I went to a couple of meetings but found them, as a beginner, not  
> particularly motivating.
> I think, if you got some experience with Pd, work best because they are  
> more focused on showing what you've already done.
>
> As a beginner, of course, you want to attend because you want to learn  
> from the basics, the fundamentals, which is the reason why these  
> meetings tend to become pseudo workshops, but from what I read in the  
> forum, there is neither the desire nor the idea of doing it this way.
> Anyhow, showcasing is also good, because you get the picture of the  
> potential and amplitude of pd.
>
> A good solution could be to provide a regularly basic course in Pd  
> (every season, or something) in addition to specific workshops (I missed  
> Servando´s one, pity!).
>
> This, I think, would be a healthy way to create a more participatory  
> community.

Hi Roberto (sorry, don't remember your face),

I'll tell things from my point of view, which is the other opposite: from  
being one of the more experienced people on those meetings, I don't find  
it very motivating to go to the reunions to speak all the time and be a  
patch fireman, and not getting much from it (apart from nice smiles) that  
I can use myself.

If you want a pd course thought by real people (you can get lots of  
materials online), we can organise a real workshop, where someone speaks,  
you pay and you go in. That isn't the point of these meetings, as I myself  
don't have the time or the wish to be preparing or providing for "regular  
basic courses" just like that (to put it bluntly, I must manage to pay my  
rent).

Also, I myself don't go to those meetings to evangelise or convince people  
to use Pd. If you want to use Pd, you need yourself to get into it, and be  
prepared to spend lots of time with it. That's how you stop being a  
"beginner" to be something else. And this leads into the other point,  
maybe you didn't use the resources of the meetings to its fullest yet. We  
always encourage people to sign up in the wiki (which you did), and also  
put in suggestions of themes they want to see handled, which I don't see  
any - so far only the "advanced people" put it their theme sugestions, so  
I think I (we)'ve done our part. So, I don't know what are the motivating  
points that you want to know. But since I'm not here to make sure you will  
use pd, you're that one who has to tell that (to me or anyone else). So,  
paraphrasing someone, don't ask yourself what these meetings can do for  
you, ask what you can do for these meetings. If you are interested in a  
specific point, tell the world what it is, and if someone there has  
experience with it, he might come forward and show his patches around, or  
whatever he wants to.

As I see it, healthy participation comes from both sides, don't expect  
people to cater for you if you don't do your part of the bargain - we're  
not providing a service, it's supposed to be a give and take situation.  
Or, if you don't have any themes for now, go there, sit down and program,  
until you find a problem. Then ask the guy on your side what does he know  
about it. If he doesn't know much, ask the guy in front, and so on.

And if this still isn't enough for you, then you might need a workshop  
with a tutor - that's what you won't get in these meetings, at least not  
 from me (of course I don't speak for anyone else).

João Pais