[PD] Apply missing

[Jonathan Wilkes]

----- Original Message -----
> From: Hans-Christoph Steiner <hans at at.or.at>
> To: Jonathan Wilkes <jancsika at yahoo.com>
> Cc: Max <abonnements at revolwear.com>; PD list <pd-list at iem.at>
> Sent: Friday, January 27, 2012 11:39 AM
> Subject: Re: [PD] Apply missing
> 
> 
> On Jan 27, 2012, at 11:26 AM, Jonathan Wilkes wrote:
> 
>>  ----- Original Message -----
>> 
>>>  From: Max <abonnements at revolwear.com>
>>>  To: Hans-Christoph Steiner <hans at at.or.at>
>>>  Cc: PD list <pd-list at iem.at>
>>>  Sent: Friday, January 27, 2012 10:02 AM
>>>  Subject: Re: [PD] Apply missing
>>> 
>>>  Am 27.01.2012 um 02:50 schrieb Hans-Christoph Steiner:
>>>>  On Wed, 2012-01-25 at 22:51 +0100, Max wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>  i noticed that in the current autobuilds of Pd-extended the 
> property 
>>>  dialogs for the gui-objects are missing the Apply-Button. Is that a bug 
> or a 
>>>  feature?
>>>>>  IMHO this is a bug - if you want to adjust for instance a 
> canvas to be 
>>>  the same size as another object of unknown size you can do that with a 
> few 
>>>  clicks and the help of the Apply button. If you have to click OK and 
> then go to 
>>>  context menu->Properties, set the size, OK repeately to do that 
> it's 
>>>  simply annoying.
>>>>> 
>>>>  That seems like a good enough reason, I brought back the Apply 
> button to
>>>>  the iemgui Properties panel on Mac OS X.  It was originally moved 
> since
>>>>  the whole "OK, Apply, Cancel" is very Windows-like, but 
> there 
>>>  isn't an
>>>>  easy way to make to work better, so the Apply button is back.  
> IMHO,
>>>>  when you change the setting, it should take effect immediately.
>>> 
>>>  great. i agree that ideally i'd like to be able to see that change 
> happen 
>>>  immediately. even better: when grabbing the bottom-right corner i'd 
> have an 
>>>  anchor to scale the object (see Max/MSP for that)…
>> 
>>  Also see: pd-l2ork
> 
> I think you are referring to Ico trying to make the iemguis resizable live with 
> a handle.

Yep.  All the iemguis are resizable with a little anchor that appears when the object 
is selected.  Very handy.

> I should finally get to releasing something useful form the tkwidgets 
> lib, since that also includes resizing with a handle.

Right, I remember that when I tried them.  To make them useful is difficult, though, 
because iemguis have (rightly) set a precedent that gui objects can integrate 
naturally into a normal object chain.  For example, it's not uncommon to find a [tgl] 
deep inside a subpatch somewhere and my friend running pd -nogui can still 
run my program.  Or the user having a little UI subpatch that pops up or gets 
hidden as needed-- if you depend on the actual tk widget to exist in order for its 
properties to get set, then the user will get an error if for example they try to 
change its size or placement when it's not vis'd.  So I guess on the one hand it's 
nice to separate gui from pd, but on the other you don't want to force the user 
to care about implementation details like, "when a subpatch closes and no one 
can see its contents, does it _really_ have a slider inside there?"  If the answer is 
yes for pd-ish methods and no for tk/gui-related methods, things start to get 
tricky.

-Jonathan

> 
> .hc
> 
> 
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
>                             kill your television
>