[PD] wireless audio from Pd to PA system (katja)
Phil Stone
pkstone at ucdavis.edu
Fri Mar 1 21:34:18 CET 2013
These Line 6 units are well respected in the electric bass world,
especially considering their moderate price. I think bass players
appreciate tight timing, and the low lag may be one reason these units
are popular. Also, they have proven to be rugged enough to be
"road-worthy". They can also model the hi-frequency lossiness of cords,
though that seems of dubious value in your case.
Phil
On 3/1/13 12:24 PM, katja wrote:
> Apparently, Line 6 managed to build a digital 2.4 GHz wireless with <4
> ms latency, the Relay G30, G50 etc . They do not write it in the
> specs, but most users don't notice latency and when they do, their
> support is speaking of latency as low as that:
>
> http://line6.com/support/thread/33898
>
> This weekend I will do some WiFi experiments and see how fast it can
> go locally, using mrpeach udp and tcp classes. If it works, one could
> use a wireless router which has no other task than routing Pd audio,
> and the computer at the receiving end could be a cheap headless board
> with no other task than receiving Pd audio and converting it to
> analog. Together the receiving device could be the size of a
> weight-watcher's lunch box, while at the transmitter side the
> computer's built-in stuff is used. Maybe I'm a bit naive here, anyway
> I'll report results from experiments.
>
> Katja
>
>
> On Fri, Mar 1, 2013 at 2:14 PM, richard duckworth
> <richduckworth at yahoo.com <mailto:richduckworth at yahoo.com>> wrote:
>
> OMG - that's really high! Maybe Tranz have a belt holder solution
> - they do look kind of bulky though! Maybe worth dropping them a
> line, see if they'll help the Pd community
>
> Rich Duckworth
> Lecturer in Music Technology
> Department of Music
> House 5
> Trinity College
> Dublin 2
> Ireland
> Tel 353 1 896 1500
>
> "Digital?
> Is that the thing where they take a good old sine wave and they
> chop it up into little bits?" --- Rupert Neve
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> *From:* katja <katjavetter at gmail.com <mailto:katjavetter at gmail.com>>
> *To:* Antoine Villeret <antoine.villeret at gmail.com
> <mailto:antoine.villeret at gmail.com>>
> *Cc:* richard duckworth <richduckworth at yahoo.com
> <mailto:richduckworth at yahoo.com>>; "pd-list at iem.at
> <mailto:pd-list at iem.at>" <pd-list at iem.at <mailto:pd-list at iem.at>>
> *Sent:* Friday, 1 March 2013, 13:12
> *Subject:* Re: [PD] wireless audio from Pd to PA system (katja)
>
> Found more info about TI's PurePath wireless. Latency of wireless
> transmission is 768 samples minimum. Added to this must be the
> latencies of ad/da conversion.
>
> http://e2e.ti.com/support/low_power_rf/f/382/t/110331.aspx
>
> Forget about it, this concept is only useful for home entertainment.
>
> Katja
>
>
> On Fri, Mar 1, 2013 at 1:19 PM, katja <katjavetter at gmail.com
> <mailto:katjavetter at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> Thanks everyone for your answers.
>
> The case is unconventional because a stereo line signal must
> be sent from the computer. Professional wireless systems
> assume mic or instrument. Consumer systems do transmit stereo
> signal, but without bothering too much about latency.
>
> Frankly, I did not expect the difficulty to find a good
> solution. Initially I wanted the wearable computer for a music
> video which is to be recorded live with sounds from natural
> objects. I bought the FM transmitter so my cameraman will be
> able to hear the music while he's filming. For this purpose it
> is ideal. Then I thought it would be good to use the computer
> in it's wearable mode for public performance. I figured that
> one of the many wireless solutions would suit the purpose, but
> didn't reckon with the unusual requirements.
>
> Further searching brought me to a new technology 'PurePath'
> from Texas Instruments. It has a range comparable with WiFi
> (30m), while it seems to work with paired devices as in
> Bluetooth. I haven't seen consumer products with this
> technology, but development kits are available. A rather
> convincing demo is here:
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0YsnZQUfVGs
>
> If this system can work with low latency it could be perfect
> for wireless Pd.
>
> Katja
>
>
>
>
> On Fri, Mar 1, 2013 at 11:41 AM, Antoine Villeret
> <antoine.villeret at gmail.com
> <mailto:antoine.villeret at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
> hello,
>
> those are good for what they have been designed for and it
> depends on what you mean by "exellent sound quality"
>
> I've made few tests on those few years ago and the
> bandwidth could be good enough to transmit guitar/bass
> signal but nothing else for me
>
> +
> a
>
>
> --
> do it yourself
> http://antoine.villeret.free.fr
> <http://antoine.villeret.free.fr/>
>
>
> 2013/2/28 richard duckworth <richduckworth at yahoo.com
> <mailto:richduckworth at yahoo.com>>
>
> Hi Katja
> one of these would do it - check with Thomann tech
> support for gain issues (these are Instrument Level
> input) They should be fine however as active guitar
> pickups (like heavy style EMG pickups) output quite
> high levels. These type of wireless systems tend to be
> very rugged, have excellent sound quality and long
> battery life - and you'll want these things.
>
> http://www.thomann.de/ie/cat.html?gf=wireless_for_guitar_bass&oa=pra
>
>
> Rich Duckworth
> Lecturer in Music Technology
> Department of Music
> House 5
> Trinity College
> Dublin 2
> Ireland
> Tel 353 1 896 1500
>
> "Digital?
> Is that the thing where they take a good old sine wave
> and they chop it up into little bits?" --- Rupert Neve
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Thu, 28 Feb 2013 11:53:43 +0100
> From: katja <katjavetter at gmail.com
> <mailto:katjavetter at gmail.com>>
> Subject: [PD] wireless audio from Pd to PA system
> To: pd-list <pd-list at iem.at <mailto:pd-list at iem.at>>
> Message-ID:
> <CAFY0eapPSKfw+gVaxuTr7exHqLiG+pTdu8Rk6SNTraLiys2Msg at mail.gmail.com
> <mailto:pTdu8Rk6SNTraLiys2Msg at mail.gmail.com>>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> For a wearable live performance computer, I am looking
> into the
> options of sending wireless audio from Pd to a PA
> sound system and
> other listeners.
>
> In a first experiment I've tried a Linex FM
> transmitter. Audio quality
> is good enough, and FM transmitters do not introduce
> latency. This
> option is cheap and flexible, as the signal can be
> received by simple
> radio's, which are even built into cell phones and
> media players. I
> would need to boost the transmission a bit to make it
> more reliable.
> This will of course make the equipment illegal. Even
> then, the risk
> that someone else is transmitting a stronger signal on
> the channel can
> not be excluded.
>
> Another option could be to send audio over Wifi. This
> would require
> WLAN to be available, and one extra computer (with
> audio interface) as
> a receiver. To avoid extra latency the audio should be
> sent
> uncompressed, like [udpsend~] / [udpreceive~] can do
> it. This has the
> risk of packet loss and serious dropouts.
>
> I've been searching for 2.4 GHz wireless music
> receivers and found
> things like this:
> http://www.sitecom.com/en/wireless-music-streamer/wl-061/p/203.
> They
> seem to act like external soundcards for your
> computer. In Linux
> though I've never managed to properly connect multiple
> soundcards with
> Pd (in OSX it's easy using the Aggregate Device Editor
> from Audio MIDI
> Setup). Also I guess these devices introduce huge
> latency. With audio
> over bluetooth headsets I've experienced latencies up
> to a second.
>
> Does anyone use a satisfactory method in practice, to
> send audio from
> Pd without wires?
>
> Thanks,
> Katja
>
>
>
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