[PD] Cycle~ difference with Max5. Was: Update cyclone maintenance
Fred Jan Kraan
fjkraan at xs4all.nl
Mon Jun 8 20:27:06 CEST 2015
Hi Alexandre,
Since sending the patches, I looked in the code and found a problem that
need fixing too (the issue affects funbuff~, peek~ and poke~ too). The
offset argument indeed only works with the external buffer.
It seems to be working, apart from the offset. This needs some special
handling if you try to read past the external buffer size. This is
possible with small buffers or large offsets.
But back to the patches: There are three different situations:
- internal cosine table, no offset possible,
- external buffer without offset,
- external buffer with offset.
In all situations the phase can be controlled with the right inlet.
About the sample-offset, I have some problem understanding how it works,
and have to change it anyhow to fix the issue (garray_getarraywords
related on 64-bit systems). So I try to make it work as I understand it
should.
If you have Max, you might try to see what happens in these two situations:
- read from a buffer smaller than 512 bytes,
- read from a 512 byte buffer but with an offset.
Max probably fills the remainder with zeros, or wraps around. The
documentation
(https://docs.cycling74.com/max5/refpages/msp-ref/cycle~.html or
https://docs.cycling74.com/max7/maxobject/cycle~) doesn't say.
Greetings,
Fred Jan
> hi there, not sure what you meant, but your patches demonstrate how the
> offset argument is not working. It's clear to me they're not affecting
> the object at all in test 1, cause they should cancel out and they
> don't. And according to the help file of max, the offset argument only
> works if you give it a buffer name (so I understand it doesn't work for
> the internal cosine function). And it seems it's supposed to be an int
> value, meaning the sample/index offset in the table, but it doesn't seem
> to work as well with given table names.
>
> Are you with me?
>
> cheers
>
> 2015-06-08 5:10 GMT-03:00 Fred Jan Kraan <fjkraan at xs4all.nl
> <mailto:fjkraan at xs4all.nl>>:
>
> Hi Alexandre,
>
> >> The offset can be set as argument and it works
> >
> > I can't seem to make it work, how do you do it? can you send me a patch?
>
> Here two patches. cycle~-test1.pd demonstrates the phase control using
> the internal buffer. I do not quite understand if and how the offset
> relates to the phase, but mixing two signals with a variable phase
> displays addition and elimination. cycle~-test2.pd should demonstrate
> the same with an external buffer~, but not having that I used an array.
> This doesn't do what I expect. I will do some more investigation on what
> it does.
> >
> > It seems [cycle~] will only work with tables that are 512 in size. It
> > can be of any size in max now, but the help of Max 7 says: "This
> > wavetable may be of any size, _/*but historically was limited to 512
> > samples*/_." So maybe when [cyclone/cycle~] was made it was limited to
> > 512... anyway, this size limitation was something I also raised here.
>
> To keep maintenance to cyclone reasonable, I try to limit it to the
> functionality of Max 5. The documentation for Max 5 is conveniently
> online and I have a installation available for comparison. So Max 7
> functionality is out of scope for me.
> >
> > More details, in max you can set [cycle~] with other messages to control
> > the buffer size and offset, check attached image.
>
> The buffer_sizeinsamps and buffer_offset attributes appear to be newer
> than Max 5. The sample-offset argument should work however.
> >
> > cheers
> >
> Greetings,
>
> Fred Jan
> >
> >
> >
> > 2015-06-07 17:08 GMT-03:00 Fred Jan Kraan <fjkraan at xs4all.nl <mailto:fjkraan at xs4all.nl>
> > <mailto:fjkraan at xs4all.nl <mailto:fjkraan at xs4all.nl>>>:
> >
> > Hi Alexandre,
> >
> > I checked the cycle~ behaviour against the Max5 doc, and it appears to
> > work as described. Only clicking to view the current buffer contents is
> > not implemented (yet). The offset can be set as argument and it works.
> > The second inlet controls the phase, which amounts to more or less
> > the same.
> >
> > Can you indicate what the differences are?
> >
> > Greetings,
> >
> > Fred Jan
> >
> > On 2015-05-25 04:05 AM, Alexandre Torres Porres wrote:
> > > hi fred, how's it going? I was checking [cycle~] and it seems it's not
> > > behaving much closely like in max, have you checked that? I'm saying
> > > more about its behaviour as a wavetable, where it can offsett the
> > table
> > > and everything.
> > >
> > > I can't find that list of bugs you were working on, where is it?
> > How is
> > > it anyway?
> > >
> > > thanks
> > > cheers
> > >
> > > 2015-01-23 14:25 GMT-02:00 Fred Jan Kraan <fjkraan at xs4all.nl <mailto:fjkraan at xs4all.nl>
> > <mailto:fjkraan at xs4all.nl <mailto:fjkraan at xs4all.nl>>
> > > <mailto:fjkraan at xs4all.nl <mailto:fjkraan at xs4all.nl>
> <mailto:fjkraan at xs4all.nl <mailto:fjkraan at xs4all.nl>>>>:
> > >
> > > Hi All,
> > >
> > > At
> > http://fjkraan.home.xs4all.nl/digaud/puredata/cyclone/index.html
> > > a new set of revised help-patches for the cyclone library are
> > > available. Most previous remarks are applied.
> > >
> > > There are now previews of the Windows binaries and MacOSX. The
> > > latter is build on MacOSX 10.5 with XCode 3.14, so should have
> > > executables for PPC, i386 and i386_64. I confirmed the last
> > two are
> > > working (10.5 and 10.8).
> > >
> > > It remains in progress, in the task list are the fixed and
> > remaining
> > > issues.
> > >
> > > Fred Jan
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
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