[PD] Nettles. Was: Cyclone: List of Issues with existing objects by Alexandre Porres

Sat Feb 20 20:11:44 CET 2016

Is there actual Pd code for Max 6+ classes somewhere behind this 40+ message thread?
-Jonathan 

    On Saturday, February 20, 2016 12:57 PM, Matt Barber <brbrofsvl at gmail.com> wrote:

 +1 To Ivica's proposal and rationale. There are plenty of people willing to help with development and maintenance. If a Max 4.6 compatibility library is really necessary, perhaps that could be the fork with the new name.
On Sat, Feb 20, 2016 at 11:04 AM, Ivica Ico Bukvic <ico at vt.edu> wrote:

FWIW, Fred, if there is a way to convince you to allow for adding new objects, I would certainly like to second that. In the eyes of new pd users who are familiar with Max, Cyclone is not only a Max 4.6 compatibility library, it is first and foremost Max compatibility library and that would suggest newer objects should be in there. I imagine the only reason they simply weren't already added is likely due to lack of a developer and maintainer. The last thing pd community needs is yet another library that may end-up without a maintainer. The confusion one will have to deal with by creating cyclone/prepend vs. <some-other-lib>/pong is pointless at best. If maintaining library overhead is a concern, please note we've already done a fair amount of creating updated help files for the entire cyclone library in pd-l2ork, as well as fixing and upgrading a number of objects, all of which I've gladly shared with you and continue to contribute as much as you allow and my time permits. But please, let's not start yet another library. If anything, we should look into consolidating. Pd-L2Ork has already started doing this. e.g. one of the examples brought up regarding Eric Lyon's potpourri and cyclone's cartopol~ and poltocar~, in pd-l2ork, potpourri objects are not being built because they are not necessary. All this with the goal of eventually doing away with subfolders/declares/imports and other middleware and simply having all the best externals in one folder and getting rid of the rest (or perhaps adding them in the unsupported/legacy subfolder). In such an ecosystem PD META will take care of the attribution and bug reporting and we'll be all better for it, particularly in terms of encouraging new users to join the pd community.

On 2/17/2016 1:33 PM, Fred Jan Kraan wrote:

Hi Alexandre,

Howdy, if you understand only a part of it, I know that I know about
nothing.

But hey, as I understand it, there's quite some work to make it (loading
the weird name objects without [declare]) happen and you'd rather focus
on other fixes, cool.

Well, I'm just starting using github
https://github.com/porres/pd-cyclone
<https://l.facebook.com/l.php?u=https%3A%2F%2Fgithub.com%2Fporres%2Fpd-cyclone&h=FAQF6upTy> and
have mobilized others to collaborate with new objects for cyclone,
according to that list I shared these days.

You may have noticed a pull request already for [pong]. I'm working with
someone else and we should be having scale / scale~ / atodb / dbtoa /
atodb~ / dbtoa~ / trunc~ ready quite soon!

Yes, I noticed. I appreciate all you do for pd and cyclone in particular, but I cannot accept the request. Cyclone is one of the few libraries with a closed set of objects; only those part of Max/MSP, arbitrary set around version 4.6 or 5.

Cyclone is already quite big, with 150+ objects. This seems a good reason to be selective in which objects should be added. Just because objects are or should be in Max/MSP is not reason enough. If it exists in another library, it is unneeded IMHO.

I can bother myself to try and deal with the issues regarding these
objects, but I think a start could be to create new objects with the
unweird names, this is not in conflict with Max compatibility, as it
also loads these objects via the same way (again, they'd be:
/greaterthan~ / greaterthaneq~ / lessthan~ / lessthaneq~ / equals~ /
notequals~ / plusequals~ / rminus~ / rminus / rdiv~ /  rdiv / modulo~/).
It wouldn't get in conflict with current state of cyclone either and the
help files of these objects could refer to nettles and all. Cool? Later
on in the game I can try and figure out how to load them without declare.

Personally I have no issue with [declare] as it is vanilla. Or with the weird names; if you want un-weird names, abstractions (containing [declare] should work too?

cheers

cheers

Greetings,

Fred Jan

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