[PD] Pd-list Digest, Vol 143, Issue 77
Gervais Harry
g.a.harry at gmx.com
Tue Feb 14 08:27:49 CET 2017
password
-----Original Message-----
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Sent: 2/13/2017 21:49
To: "pd-list at lists.iem.at" <pd-list at lists.iem.at>
Subject: Pd-list Digest, Vol 143, Issue 77
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Today's Topics:
1. DejaVu Font: Shipping & using on W32 (Lucas Cordiviola)
2. [PD-announce] [OT] digital subtractive synthesis (cyrille henry)
3. Re: DejaVu Font: Shipping & using on W32 (Dan Wilcox)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Mon, 13 Feb 2017 17:43:33 +0000
From: Lucas Cordiviola <lucarda27 at hotmail.com>
To: Dan Wilcox <danomatika at gmail.com>, Miller Puckette <msp at ucsd.edu>
Cc: Pd-List <pd-list at lists.iem.at>
Subject: [PD] DejaVu Font: Shipping & using on W32
Message-ID:
<BL2PR01MB339BA41D49E95CBE07F7A66A6590 at BL2PR01MB339.prod.exchangelabs.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"
More:
For this test i used “twapi-bin-4.1.27.zip ” and extracted it to pd\lib.
Mensaje telepatico asistido por maquinas.
________________________________
From: Pd-list <pd-list-bounces at lists.iem.at> on behalf of Lucas Cordiviola <lucarda27 at hotmail.com>
Sent: Monday, February 13, 2017 4:40 PM
To: Dan Wilcox; Miller Puckette
Cc: Pd-List
Subject: Re: [PD] cross platforms issues with displaying fonts in vanilla but not in Purr Data
Ok,
Following Dan`s suggestion to ship & use a font without installing it, I came to a very straight-forward method for w32.
Tested & working.
It uses a Tcl Windows API extension. (600KB)
twapi web:
http://twapi.sourceforge.net/v4.1/installation.html
twapi package:
https://sourceforge.net/projects/twapi/files/Current%20Releases/Tcl%20Windows%20API/twapi-4.1.27/
added lines on "pd-gui.tcl" @line 24:
# adding dejavu fonts on mswindows
package require twapi
twapi::AddFontResourceEx DejaVuSansMono.ttf
twapi::AddFontResourceEx DejaVuSansMono-Bold.ttf
0000000
Don't know how to exclude this "package require" for the other OSs.
The .ttf were placed on pd/bin for simplicity.
Mensaje telepatico asistido por maquinas.
________________________________
From: Dan Wilcox <danomatika at gmail.com>
Sent: Monday, February 13, 2017 5:06 AM
To: Lucas Cordiviola
Cc: Jonathan Wilkes; Alexandre Torres Porres; Pd-List; Miller Puckette
Subject: Re: [PD] cross platforms issues with displaying fonts in vanilla but not in Purr Data
On Feb 12, 2017, at 6:49 PM, Lucas Cordiviola <lucarda27 at hotmail.com<mailto:lucarda27 at hotmail.com>> wrote:
>Another issue is that, for many, the rendering of a bolded DVSM will simply look *ulgy* to those used to a normal-weight Monaco, especially if they never used an earlier version of Pd or Pd on Linux.
IMO the default cross platform font should NOT be Bold. As Dan said OSX users will most likely find it ugly, and it was not bold in Pd-extended nor is in Purr-Data.
I tested with bold as that is the default font weight for vanilla on Linux AFAICT.
>>How difficult is to deploy DejaVu on Mac?
>Typically, add a key to the app bundle Info.plist and include the font in the app bundle's Resource folder. This means the font does not have to be installed system- or user- wide but only used by the app itself. This assumes Tk’s handling of app bundles picks up on registered fonts from the plist (it should).
>As for Windows, it looks like it’s possible to load a font that comes with the app (the Windows API alls this a:
https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/ms533820(v=vs.85).aspx
http://code.activestate.com/lists/tcl-core/8158/#sthash.qJEhQALT.dpuf
@Dan:
The Tcl thing is just for Windows?
Yes as it’s using the Window’s API.
Or Cross-platform?
No. See above.
I know the Mac solution. Deja Vu is usually installed on Linux systems and, if not, can be an install requirement by whatever package manager is being used. There is no need to distribute and install a copy of the font on Linux.
--------
Dan Wilcox
@danomatika<http://twitter.com/danomatika>
danomatika.com<http://danomatika.com>
robotcowboy.com<http://robotcowboy.com>
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Message: 2
Date: Mon, 13 Feb 2017 20:11:48 +0100
From: cyrille henry <ch at chnry.net>
To: pd-announce at lists.iem.at
Subject: [PD] [PD-announce] [OT] digital subtractive synthesis
Message-ID: <33a2e1f8-06a1-443e-30e9-cfcb40cf8dd3 at chnry.net>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"; Format="flowed"
hello,
OK, the aim of this mail is to announce my new hardware synthesizer :
http://nozoid.com/ocs-2
I already talked a bit about it on this list, but I did build a bunch of them and they are now for sale!
But since we are on the pd list, let me talk about pd, synthesis and things I learned while building an high quality, analogue style, digital synthesizer.
Here are 3 facts:
1) I often heard that pd sound badly
2) every user of the OCS-2 synth love its sound
3) I developed (and distribute) the equations use in this synth in pd before porting them to a hardware, so you can have the same sound in pd than in my synth.
So, according to fact 3, why do we have fact 1?
- Equations are not the only factor that "create" a sound. The way you control this equations is also very important. (see the "zipper" noise if you don't control the gain of an oscillator at audio rate).
In pd, the data clock is by default SR/64, I.E less than 1KHz. The "line" object usually output a value at 50Hz.
For my synth, data are computed at about 10HKz.
This make a difference :
LFO shapes are closer to the desired shape, and contain less aliasing artifact
fast fader movement are more accurate
...
Fortunately, this can be fixed in pd : [line] can output value at faster frequency, and data rate can be increase by reducing audio block size. Moreover, this can be done only where it's important, and you can keep default value where speed did not matter.
- The precision of the control is also very important :
in pd, fader precision are limited by screen resolution, and fader usually goes from 0 to 127. Shift clicking to increase resolution did not help if you want to move fast.
from 20Hz to 20KHz, there is about 127 note, so don't expect micro-tonal resolution...
A standard analogue system can easily have a S/N ration of 70dB, I.E a 12 bit resolution : more than 4K value from min to max
It is also what the OCS fader provide.
Unfortunately, it's not easy to have good/accurate control in pd. But that's not really a pd limitation...
- The SR of the audio synthesis can also be important : the higher the SR, the more audio aliasing you can remove.
And you don't need a 192K SR on your sound card, you can just oversample the part that need it in your patch, filter, and go back to a lower SR.
But, better than trying to remove aliasing, it's better not to create it...
- After few thread about band limited oscillator, I still see some people using the [phasor~] as an audio oscillator. No offenses, but let me be clear : [phasor~] is a very useful object, but it's not an audio oscillator. Use one of the BL oscillator abstraction if you are looking for a sawtooth signal. Using phasor~ as an audio oscillator only to hurt ears.
So, if you know what you are doing and take few precaution, you should be able to make your patch to sound nice...
Now that i tricked you to read this mail,
please, go to
http://nozoid.com
and buy hundreds of synths to make me rich, or just dozen so that i can pay my bill (it cost a lot to build hardware).
Well just sharing the website to your musician friend will help me.
thanks and cheers,
Cyrille
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------------------------------
Message: 3
Date: Mon, 13 Feb 2017 13:48:36 -0700
From: Dan Wilcox <danomatika at gmail.com>
To: Lucas Cordiviola <lucarda27 at hotmail.com>
Cc: Miller Puckette <msp at ucsd.edu>, Pd-List <pd-list at lists.iem.at>
Subject: Re: [PD] DejaVu Font: Shipping & using on W32
Message-ID: <162065CF-6CBC-4093-9E47-EA5B44344E97 at gmail.com>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
Cool, good to know that in theory it works. I also found a related solution which uses a different extension do the same thing: http://wiki.tcl.tk/22262 <http://wiki.tcl.tk/22262>
However, I’d say that requiring a tcl/tk extension may not be the best overall solution since historically Pd has avoided requiring anything beyond the base tcl/tk.
A possible best approach is take the example C code for the forum post and make a *tiny* custom extension that is built only on Windows and loaded by the tk gui in order to load the private font. I don’t think we can simply add the font loading code to the core itself since it’s a separate process from the gui.
In any case, this is something I can look into after I put together a triple boot machine to test some things on different platforms, including the vanilla autotools build on win.
> On Feb 13, 2017, at 10:43 AM, Lucas Cordiviola <lucarda27 at hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> Following Dan`s suggestion to ship & use a font without installing it, I came to a very straight-forward method for w32.
>
> Tested & working.
>
> It uses a Tcl Windows API extension. (600KB)
>
> twapi web:
> http://twapi.sourceforge.net/v4.1/installation.html <http://twapi.sourceforge.net/v4.1/installation.html>
>
> twapi package:
> https://sourceforge.net/projects/twapi/files/Current%20Releases/Tcl%20Windows%20API/twapi-4.1.27/ <https://sourceforge.net/projects/twapi/files/Current%20Releases/Tcl%20Windows%20API/twapi-4.1.27/>
>
> added lines on "pd-gui.tcl" @line 24:
>
> # adding dejavu fonts on mswindows
> package require twapi
> twapi::AddFontResourceEx DejaVuSansMono.ttf
> twapi::AddFontResourceEx DejaVuSansMono-Bold.ttf
>
> 0000000
>
> Don't know how to exclude this "package require" for the other OSs.
> The .ttf were placed on pd/bin for simplicity.
--------
Dan Wilcox
@danomatika <http://twitter.com/danomatika>
danomatika.com <http://danomatika.com/>
robotcowboy.com <http://robotcowboy.com/>
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