[PD] [PD-announce] deken v0.3.0: new fileformat for library packages

Thu Mar 8 18:27:25 CET 2018

>
> - set installation path (suggesting Pd's default search paths, and
> offering to create those that are missing)
>

I wouldn't know if, officially, there are such things as "Pd's default
search paths". But then it's clear you mean "standard paths", instead of
"default search paths", right? Then again, this raises a few issues.
Cause, well,
under a recent discussion, it was considered that only the "extra" folder
was supposed to be the standard folder, so there are not supposed to be
other "standard paths". In other words, it ain't *plural*, just a
singular *standard
path* option, and one that comes always with Pd and doesn't need to be
created.

So yeah, what had the need to be created was one folder like that weird and
hidden mac folder (~/Library/Pd)... but access to it would still be
difficult (as it is invisible). Hence, we have a new folder now
(~/Documents/Pd) but that is not a "standard path", just a "regular" path.
And I see now "deken" is offering me to create such folders like
~/Library/Pd, after a long discussion that led to the idea we shouldn't use
them no more. See this: https://github.com/pure-data/pure-data/pull/139

I know I keep bringing this up here and there, but I think it's a very
important detail that can cause many confusions and there is still a lot of
inconclusiveness out there, and we're not doing much about it and letting
the confusion grow. Now, I was also one of the people who was requesting
such a feature several times in Deken, it's all I ever wanted, but the game
has really changed because of such recent discussions.

So now we can finally easily create this folder, but it is still invisible
and inaccessible to newbies, so not much advantage there. Cause if you need
to know how to navigate to that folder, you also know how to create it. So
this partially fixes the issue. What was needed there was create it and
easily navigate to it, but instead, it was just easier to go to a new
folder instead, like ~/Documents/Pd - as we did!

So we have this new standard now that was designed exactly to fix this
issue. So this new feature is pointless now, as a new solution (using
~/Documents/Pd) was made, so it is trying to fix an issue (but not in fully
fixing it) that has already been fixed and has been in use since 0.48-0!
But more importantly, this extra folder has been explicitly declared as a
non intentional extra "standard path". See how much confusion this promotes?

So, given all that, I'm even suggesting a Pull Request to clear this up for
good, it's here: https://github.com/pure-data/pure-data/pull/183

See also: https://github.com/pure-data/pure-data/issues/184 which discusses
the behaviour of [declare] and how we could just use "-path" and forget
about "-stdpath"

And leaving "~/Library/Pd" aside, the other extra standard path option here
on the mac: "/Library/Pd" doesn't even get created with the new deken
plugin, I figure because it may require admin powers, so it doesn't really
help either.

Now, I don't know how the plugin works, but I may assume it gets these
paths from Pd, so maybe if my Pull Request gets accepted, no change needs
to be made in the Deken plugin and it'll just stop showing them...

Anyway, what I see from this update with this issue is that we have added
more unnecessary complexity. Things were cleaner and simpler before. But
well, I don't consider this a "deken" issue, but a deeper Pd issue that is
popping up in deken and other different places.

That is to say that I'm really happy with the new improvements in deken,
congratulations, it is quite exciting!

cheers

2018-03-08 13:09 GMT-03:00 IOhannes m zmoelnig <zmoelnig at iem.at>:

> we are proud to announce a major overhaul of the deken fileformat.
>
> TL;DR to download new deken packages, you will need at least version
> v0.3.0 of the deken-plugin (Pd-0.48-1 includes deken-v0.2.4).
> When searching externals with an old (incompatible) version of the
> plugin, you will always find a suggestion to install the new plugin with
> something like:
>
> > deken-plugin/0.3.0
> >  (Deken externals downloader - REQUIRED FOR NEW PACKAGES)
>
> once you have installed the new version (and/or Pd includes a compatible
> version), the nagging will stop :-)
>
>
> # fileformat
>
> the new fileformat fixes a number of issues we had with the existing one.
> things that are better:
> - cool filename extension '.dek'
> - consistent archival options for all platforms (ZIP!)
> - proper detection of the version string for all libraries (even if the
> library has a weird name like "a-v12"
> - support for double-precision externals (once Pd supports that!)
> - extensible
>
>
> # Pd-integration
> the updated "deken-plugin" has a number of nifty features, you don't
> want to miss:
> - support for the new fileformat
> - support for the old (legacy) fileformat
> - (optionally) uninstall libraries before re-installing them
> - (optionally) show a README that is included in the package on
> successful installation
> - set installation path (suggesting Pd's default search paths, and
> offering to create those that are missing)
> - (optionally) hides the search-results for incompatible platforms
> - (optionally) overrides the "compatible" Pd-architecture
> - nice preferences
> - bugfixes
> - much more
>
>
> # Developer tools
> if you are a developer of libraries, we have also updated our 'deken'
> cmdline tool.
> things you always wanted to have and which are now free:
> - support for the new fileformat (default)
> - support for the old (legacy) fileformat
> - better detection of binary architectures
> - better detection of included sources
> - (experimental) support for double-precision externals
> - pre-compiled & self-contained Windows binaries
> - bugfixes
> - much more
>
>
> if you want to know more, see
> - http://puredata.info/downloads/deken/releases/0.3.0/
> - https://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-dev/2018-02/021513.html
> - https://github.com/pure-data/deken/issues/161
>
>
> i have submitted also submitted a Pull-Request to include the new
> deken-plugin into Pd proper:
> - https://github.com/pure-data/pure-data/pull/320
>
> and another Pull-Request for Pd that is required to make the
> double-precision detection work:
> - https://github.com/pure-data/pure-data/pull/300
>
>
> happy patching.
> fgm,asdr
> IOhannes
>
>
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