[PD] MIDI / STATUS_BYTE / noteOn - noteOff mesage

Tue Oct 4 07:02:56 CEST 2022

But Yes, MPE abstractions for ELSE would sure be welcome :)

On Tue, 4 Oct 2022, 06:59 Simon Iten, <itensimon at gmail.com> wrote:

> Yes but RolI seaboard and linnstrument have polyphonic aftertouch, in fact
> they even have three expressive parameters per note. Pressure, X and Y
> axis. Since there is only one message per note available (polyphonic
> aftertouch) in standard MIDI, MPE was born to allow for polyphonic
> Pitchbend for example (each note potentially in different directions and at
> a different level)
>
> there is not really anything to implement MPE wise, it is still standard
> MIDI messages, general modulation takes places on channel 1 and per note
> modulation is done with CC messages that are sent on Channel 2-16, in
> accordance to each new note that is played, that also gets a channel from 2
> to 16 assigned in a round robin fashion (or other logic of you prefer).
>
> And yes, that means your limited to 15 voices.
>
> So some route objects should work wonders :)
>
> On Tue, 4 Oct 2022, 01:54 Alexandre Torres Porres, <porres at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> I was talking more about polyphonic aftertouch than rel velocity.
>>
>> btw, Pd still needs implementations for MPE right?
>>
>> Em seg., 3 de out. de 2022 às 01:42, Simon Iten <itensimon at gmail.com>
>> escreveu:
>>
>>> Roli seaboard, linnstrument. Don't know if those have noteoff velocity,
>>> but they sure have MPE
>>>
>>> On Mon, 3 Oct 2022, 00:39 Alexandre Torres Porres, <porres at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Em dom., 2 de out. de 2022 às 16:56, Simon Iten <itensimon at gmail.com>
>>>> escreveu:
>>>>
>>>>> there are “plenty” of polyphonic aftertouch controllers on the market,
>>>>> some of the newer MPE hardware controllers use CC messages for this though.
>>>>> (https://www.midi.org/midi-articles/midi-polyphonic-expression-mpe).
>>>>> some of them also have release velocity.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> examples of such controllers please?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> there are also quite some softsynths that handle release velocity (
>>>>> https://vital.audio  for a free example), so i would not exactly say
>>>>> this is that rare. and also it will get more common again i guess.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 1 Oct 2022, at 15:36, Alexandre Torres Porres <porres at gmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Cool, but not a 'classic keyboard' controller. I don't know any modern
>>>>> one with release velocity, and also with polyphonic aftertouch (at least a
>>>>> decent/proper one that is not a pad and actually uses pressure after you
>>>>> press the note).
>>>>> cheers
>>>>>
>>>>> Em sex., 30 de set. de 2022 às 17:09, Peter Brinkmann <
>>>>> peter.brinkmann at googlemail.com> escreveu:
>>>>>
>>>>>> There's a new controller that uses Note Off velocity in an
>>>>>> interesting way --- the Artinoise re.corder
>>>>>> <https://www.recorderinstruments.com/en/> sends Note Off with
>>>>>> nonzero velocity between slurred notes.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Fri, Sep 30, 2022 at 9:30 AM Alexandre Torres Porres <
>>>>>> porres at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hi, the ELSE library has [else/note.in] and [else/note.out] which
>>>>>>> can handle proper note off messages. There's an object in cyclone (and also
>>>>>>> in MAX, of course) that can do that too, called [cyclone/xnotein] and
>>>>>>> [cyclone/xnoteout].
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The use case of this is very rare as modern controllers don't really
>>>>>>> send note off messages anymore. I bought an old controller from the 80s
>>>>>>> that can do this, cause I'm a nerd and gear slut.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Note Off messages start with channel messages from 128 to 143 (128
>>>>>>> being channel 1 up to 143 being channel 16) as Dan's test patch points out.
>>>>>>> You can use raw midi input from vanilla to listen to this and get the next
>>>>>>> two values which are MIDI note and release velocity.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I would also like this to be available in vanilla, but, hey, well,
>>>>>>> there are the mentioned externals already and this is quite rare as I
>>>>>>> pointed out. If you need to do it as a pure vanilla application for
>>>>>>> whatever reason, you can create such abstraction with [midiin].
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> cheers
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Em qui., 29 de set. de 2022 às 19:19, Dan Wilcox <
>>>>>>> danomatika at gmail.com> escreveu:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Pd treats noteoff as a noteon with 0 velocity, hence the
>>>>>>>> [stripnote] object, etc.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> If you want to explicitly handle noteoff, you can look at the midi
>>>>>>>> tester patch for working with raw bytes...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> 1. Help -> Browser...
>>>>>>>> 2. Pure Data / 7.stuff / tools / miditester.pd
>>>>>>>> 3. receive [pd channel messages]
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Sep 27, 2022, at 9:56 PM, pd-list-request at lists.iem.at wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Message: 2
>>>>>>>> Date: Tue, 27 Sep 2022 17:42:15 +0200
>>>>>>>> From: Lorenzo Sutton <lorenzofsutton at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>> To: pd-list at lists.iem.at
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [PD] MIDI / STATUS_BYTE / noteOn - noteOff mesage
>>>>>>>> Message-ID: <b3832427-9b6d-ea0e-3d34-82245176e5ba at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 26/09/2022 20:43, Maurin Donneaud wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Dear List
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Looking at the MIDI 1.0 documentation :
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> https://www.midi.org/specifications-old/item/table-2-expanded-messages-list-status-bytes
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I notice that the MIDI NOTES are transmitted over three bytes
>>>>>>>> ??? byte 1 -> STATUS_BYTE [chan & function]
>>>>>>>> ??? byte 2 -> DATA_BYTE [note] (0-127)
>>>>>>>> ??? byte 3 -> DATA_BYTE [velocity] (0-127)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I'm wandering if Pd have a simple object to extract the noteOn /
>>>>>>>> noteOff
>>>>>>>> message from the STATUS_BYTE.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I think you should be able with [midiin].
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Note that as per MIDI spec, 'note off' can be either an explicit
>>>>>>>> 'note
>>>>>>>> off' message also containing a 'release velocity' value or (more
>>>>>>>> common)
>>>>>>>> a note on with velocity equal to zero (for example this is how Pd
>>>>>>>> does a
>>>>>>>> note on/off if you use the [makenote] object.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Lorenzo
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --------
>>>>>>>> Dan Wilcox
>>>>>>>> @danomatika <http://twitter.com/danomatika>
>>>>>>>> danomatika.com
>>>>>>>> robotcowboy.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>
>>>>>
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