[PD] GUI toolkits and custom GUIs WAS: Integra Live 1.5 released

Leandro da Mota Damasceno lemota at gmail.com
Tue Jan 22 00:08:39 CET 2013


how would that work, martin?


On Mon, Jan 21, 2013 at 8:35 PM, Martin Peach <martin.peach at sympatico.ca>wrote:

> Wouldn't it be a good idea to settle on a graphics metalanguage rather
> than translating tcl code to qt or whatever?
>
> Martin
>
>
>
> On 2013-01-21 15:11, Leandro da Mota Damasceno wrote:
>
>> so let's see...Who´s working with what so far?
>>
>>   I´d love to join a team and start learning how to code with one of the
>> toolkits.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Mon, Jan 21, 2013 at 6:03 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner <hans at at.or.at
>> <mailto:hans at at.or.at>> wrote:
>>
>>
>>     So all those interested in a new GUI should start working on it,
>>     there is lots
>>     of interest.  Then we can incrementally change pd itself as there is
>>     a need.
>>
>>     .hc
>>
>>     On 01/21/2013 02:48 PM, Leandro da Mota Damasceno wrote:
>>      > You're right. Damn, you're always right :)
>>      >
>>      > So, just to know where we are right now... What have been
>> tested/done
>>      > regarding the GUIs toolkits so far? I think we should at least
>>     have this
>>      > set and go on from there...
>>      >
>>      >
>>      > On Mon, Jan 21, 2013 at 5:31 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner
>>     <hans at at.or.at <mailto:hans at at.or.at>>wrote:
>>
>>      >
>>      >>
>>      >> I think this is the general idea of what everyone wants to
>>     support.  But
>>      >> the
>>      >> way is actually takes shape is going to depend on whoever
>>     actually does the
>>      >> work. A great example of this is the PDDP (Pure Data Documentation
>>      >> Project).
>>      >> We had lots of design meetings and then no one implemented the
>>     ideas.  Then
>>      >> Jonathan picked up from that what was interesting to him and
>>     made the whole
>>      >> meta help system, the search plugin, etc.
>>      >>
>>      >> The lesson there for me is that big design discussions only work
>>     if the
>>      >> people
>>      >> involved them are willing to do the work to implement them.
>>       Instead, I
>>      >> think
>>      >> for a more decentralized community like this one, we only should
>>     nail down
>>      >> the
>>      >> key parts that everyone must use, then leave other decisions to
>>     those who
>>      >> are
>>      >> implementing those parts.
>>      >>
>>      >> So that means I'm happy to help people write there own GUI, and
>> I'll
>>      >> definitely be involved in the work of making it possible with Pd.
>>      >>
>>      >> .hc
>>      >>
>>      >> On 01/21/2013 01:05 PM, Leandro da Mota Damasceno wrote:
>>      >>> That sounded like a Lego approach. :)
>>      >>>
>>      >>> So the way I see it the GUI development should be in the most
>>     seemless
>>      >> way
>>      >>> for the user, right?
>>      >>>
>>      >>> And we also have the problem between people who prefer a
>>     simple, leaner
>>      >> GUI
>>      >>> approach (the classic PD, for instance) against people who
>>     prefer a more
>>      >>> sofisticated, and sexy GUI. And I believe both groups would
>>     also like
>>      >> some
>>      >>> more knobs and stuff...
>>      >>>
>>      >>> so basically, we should at least have two options of gui: simple
>>      >> (classic)
>>      >>> or sophisticated (sexy). But it would be cool to make it open
>>     enough to
>>      >>> anyone develop their own or come up with new and customized
>>     ones. that
>>      >>> would make PD way cooler than Max/MSP or anything else. So for
>>     that to
>>      >> work
>>      >>> (and now I must admit I really don't know the architecture
>>     behind this
>>      >> part
>>      >>> of PD, so maybe it is already this way), the comunication
>>     between the GUI
>>      >>> and the rest of PD should be kept simple, fast and modulated,
>>     working
>>      >> with
>>      >>> the leanest possible API. I also think this is a good approach
>>      >> considering
>>      >>> that most of these toolkits will stop getting support way before
>> PD
>>      >> ceases
>>      >>> to exist. I have also thought about the possibility of skins,
>>     but then
>>      >>> loading a bunch of bitmaps would not help in terms of
>>     performance...
>>      >>>
>>      >>>
>>      >>> At the same time we pick a toolkit and focus on that one first.
>>     So we
>>      >>> should think of at least two teems, right? One at the GUI end
>>     and the
>>      >> other
>>      >>> at the core PD end...
>>      >>>
>>      >>> What do you guys think?
>>      >>>
>>      >>>
>>      >>> On Mon, Jan 21, 2013 at 2:02 PM, Hans-Christoph Steiner
>>     <hans at at.or.at <mailto:hans at at.or.at>
>>
>>      >>> wrote:
>>      >>>
>>      >>>> On 01/21/2013 12:54 AM, Jonathan Wilkes wrote:
>>      >>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>      >>>>>
>>      >>>>>> From: Billy Stiltner <billy.stiltner at gmail.com
>>     <mailto:billy.stiltner at gmail.**com <billy.stiltner at gmail.com>>>
>>      >>>>>> To: IOhannes zmölnig <zmoelnig at iem.at <mailto:zmoelnig at iem.at
>> >>
>>      >>>>>> Cc: pd-list at iem.at <mailto:pd-list at iem.at>
>>
>>      >>>>>> Sent: Sunday, January 20, 2013 10:04 PM
>>      >>>>>> Subject: Re: [PD] GUI toolkits and custom GUIs WAS: Integra
>>     Live 1.5
>>      >>>> released
>>      >>>>>>
>>      >>>>>> haha , last month i tried to install juce to see about making
>> an
>>      >>>>>> alternate graphics front end to my patches. there  was some
>>     weirdness
>>      >>>>>> in the way you compile it then run the introjucer or somethin
>> to
>>      >>>>>> update it then after the update something didn't quite work
>>     right.
>>      >>>>>> then there are all the old projects that use the old
>>     steinberg vst sdk
>>      >>>>>> which you cant get from steinberg anymore so all that is
>>     just awful. i
>>      >>>>>> think that there should be a really nice updated version of
>> juce
>>      >>>>>> either available now or in the near future.  its a tossup
>>     between
>>      >>>>>> fltk, qt , opengl ,juce, and processing.  i just want to be
>>     able to
>>      >>>>>> add my waveform data filenames to the presets with a
>>     fileopen dialog
>>      >>>>>> without using an external, string parsing like .scl files
>>     that have
>>      >>>>>> 100.00 or 3/2, and polyphonic patchcords would be nice.
>>      >>>>>
>>      >>>>> What about the -guicmd "cmd..." flag?  Could one write a
>>     pd-gui.html
>>      >>>>> that lives at localhost:1234, and have it talk to pd at its
>>     port on
>>      >>>> localhost?
>>      >>>>>
>>      >>>>> Then you could just write the interface with html5 canvas, svg,
>>      >>>>> javascript, or whatever.
>>      >>>>>
>>      >>>>> -Jonathan
>>      >>>>
>>      >>>>
>>      >>>> That sounds feasible to me.
>>      >>>>
>>      >>>> .hc
>>      >>>>
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>>      >>>
>>      >>
>>      >
>>
>>
>>
>>
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>
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