[PD] [OT] Re: about sexism is TERMINATE THREAD PLEASE

Chuckk Hubbard badmuthahubbard at gmail.com
Thu Oct 18 12:48:50 CEST 2007

I see you found the thread yourself, while I was running around trying to
find work instead of staying updated.

On 10/17/07, pueblo at mail.ljudmila.org <pueblo at mail.ljudmila.org> wrote:
> and about feminist jokes. well you know feminism is in total discredit, is
> not fashionable anymore but the conditions for women are not equal and we
> face feminicide (this is extermination of women)in various areas of the
> world. So I don't mind being sensitive to anything that is related to
> this.

I don't mind femin-, but any -ism tastes nasty to me.  "femin-ism" is,
lexicographically or whatever, one step from "sex-ism".  Equality is
equality, and doesn't need another name.  If a man is treated badly for his
gender, does he have less right to justice because he is a member of a group
less often treated badly?  Maybe not in theory, but in many people's
actions, yes.  I believe in equal rights, but I don't believe that is
accomplished by focusing on one group of people.

Oddly- not speaking of institutions- men are far more often victims of
violent crime than women, at least in my country (worldwide anyone know?).
"They" say a lot that women are most often victimized by people they know,
but leave out that this is still less often than men are victimized.
Occupational fatality, drug addiction, and suicide are traditionally higher
among men, and men have shorter lives worldwide as well.
It is very well-known that, in university, social studies subjects are
filled largely with women and technological and scientific subjects by men,
and that the latter are more well-paid positions.  BUT could this have
something to do with the fact that men are traditionally judged by women
according to their income?  I would far rather study art and history than
mathematics (in fact I did, I have a music degree and make $0 from it, and
often feel ignored on lists like this for my lack of computer science

It's true I know almost nothing about society in any place but North America
and Europe, but I'm really not trying to belittle the ill treatment of
women; I know forced prostitution, for example, still occurs in many places,
probably more often with women/girls.  But I don't believe humans are
anything but animals, and I think, all things considered, they have done
pretty well over the last few hundred years.

I didn't start this thread on sexism because I didn't have any particular
> complaint against this list although I can remember some situations
> outside the list:
> - once a pd friend said to me that still no women wrote an external, ah
> yes I would like to program a external I said. He said oh well Yves can do
> that  you don't have to do that.

I think many people would say the exact same thing to me.

> it would be better IMHO to discuss things and not avoid it but yes that
> would take time, to look into what we really mean by sexism and ask around
> why women (hey but not only women) don't participate in this spaces.

I wasn't aware that women didn't participate.  My few exchanges with Patrice
convinced me she knows far more than I about computers and especially Pd,
but for a year or two I had no idea what her sex was.  As they say in regard
to the internet, I still don't REALLY know.

BTW, I did remove a number of your comments in replying; I don't mean to
erase them, I just had no response.


-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.puredata.info/pipermail/pd-list/attachments/20071018/da3daf4a/attachment.htm>

More information about the Pd-list mailing list