[PD] Abstraction [define]

[Cesare Marilungo]

I don't want to sound pretentious. But i think that there's an easy 
answer: save *everything* as a default behavior. I should load a patch 
and have the very same situation I had when I saved it.

It's true that we all use Pd in different ways and to accomplish various 
things. But it would be the most intuitive implementation to consider a 
patch in this way. I already use Pd like this, toggling the 'init' 
property for every slider and such. If I need to save the state of an 
abstraction I make a GOP that expose all the parameters I need so 
they're saved in the state they were when in the patch where I'm using 
them. If I want to reset something when the patch is loaded I use the 
loadbang.

An abstraction is a patch and so it should have its entire state stored 
when I save it. When I use a patch as an abstraction from another patch, 
saving the latter should save the state of the abstraction as it is.

To cut a long story short, I'm hearing the output of a patch now and I 
like what I hear. I hit ctrl-s, close Pd. When I reopen the patch I 
should hear the very same output. For backwards compatibility we can 
make a toggle in the settings for this new behavior and maybe separate 
the implementation from the state in the patch file format.

Maybe there are some drawbacks in this approach that I haven't 
considered. Let's discuss it.

c.

Miller Puckette wrote:
> Exactly.  If I could answer those questions I'd code it up right now...
>
> cheers
> Miller
>
> On Sun, Dec 17, 2006 at 01:21:29AM +0100, Frank Barknecht wrote:
>   
>> Hallo,
>> Mathieu Bouchard hat gesagt: // Mathieu Bouchard wrote:
>>
>>     
>>> On Fri, 15 Dec 2006, Frank Barknecht wrote:
>>>
>>>       
>>>> A further step would be some easy way to read and write the state of 
>>>> objects without having to watch their communication through senders and 
>>>> receivers, but that's the hard part, because it touches philosophical 
>>>> questions like: What actually is a state? ;)
>>>>         
>>> There's nothing funny or joke-like in that. I ask you: what is a state?
>>>       
>> What I think is funny about this question is that often it seems
>> people would think the answer is obvious, while I agree with you that
>> it's not obvious at all!
>>
>>     
>>> I'd say, a state is whatever you may want to save. Is that a good 
>>> definition?
>>>       
>> This would be my basic definition as well. Even this has some direct
>> consequences: What I want to save is different from what you want to
>> save. What I want to save also somehow defines what I don't want to
>> save. So the next questions are: How to tell Pd what should be saved and
>> what not? Or: Can Pd make educated guesses about what should and
>> shouldn't be saved? Should Pd guess at all?
>>
>> Ciao
>> -- 
>>  Frank Barknecht                 _ ______footils.org_ __goto10.org__
>>
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